Author Topic: Official Serious Debate: When was the last time the team was this depressing?  (Read 63649 times)

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dcm1602

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When’s the next time we’re competitive? 2020? 2021?

The AFC is bad enough that if we have a middle of the pack OL we could be competitive next year.

I mean the freaking Bills are one of the better afc teams. That's freaking insane

Pope

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Realistically speaking when this Black Plague of injury leaves, going into next year we are looking at:

QB: Good with potential to be great
RB: Great but need OL help
WR: Decent but in need of a true #1
TE: Solid
OL: Terrible, need to allocate a lot of our draft and free agency to upgrade

DL: Solid, scheme dependent. Elite run Defense
LB: Good to great if everyones back (need edge rusher)
CB: Biggest need defensively. Similar to OL
Safety: Great

If Douglas finds a way to patch the biggest needs, especially at OL I think the team is a playoff contender. Would be nice if Maccagnan left us with some parting gifts from the draft with guys like Fatukasi, Austin, and Edoga, etc

dcm1602

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Realistically speaking when this Black Plague of injury leaves, going into next year we are looking at:

QB: Good with potential to be great
RB: Great but need OL help
WR: Decent but in need of a true #1
TE: Solid
OL: Terrible, need to allocate a lot of our draft and free agency to upgrade

DL: Solid, scheme dependent. Elite run Defense
LB: Good to great if everyones back (need edge rusher)
CB: Biggest need defensively. Similar to OL
Safety: Great

If Douglas finds a way to patch the biggest needs, especially at OL I think the team is a playoff contender. Would be nice if Maccagnan left us with some parting gifts from the draft with guys like Fatukasi, Austin, and Edoga, etc

I'm not calling running back great while we are 31st in rushing yards and 31st in YPC

AlioTheFool

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I don't see how they're competitive next year. It's going to take at least 2 drafts to bring in enough OL to revamp the line. Then they've also got to address at least one corner position in the draft rather than just free agency. Maybe they can get an EDGE in FA, but they really need to try hitting in the draft there as well.

And that's ignoring they may need to replace Enunwa and Anderson. And Bell will be significantly older at that point too.

2021 is the earliest I see this team start to be competitive. And 2022 is more likely for the next playoff appearance.
Teams that draft well do so no matter where they pick. Teams that draft poorly do so no matter where they pick I want my team to win games and draft well

Pope

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Official Serious Debate: When was the last time the team was this depressing?
« Reply #64 on: November 13, 2019, 01:41:50 PM »
I'm not calling running back great while we are 31st in rushing yards and 31st in YPC
I certainly wouldn’t call LeVeon Bell average. Our rushing stats are terrible because there is absolutely nowhere to run. Whether you blame that on scheme or injury or talent or whatever. I’m simply grading each unit on talent.

Saquon is a tremendous player but I’m not writing him off as dogshit because he had 1 rushing yard against a 1-7 Jets team

dcm1602

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I don't see how they're competitive next year. It's going to take at least 2 drafts to bring in enough OL to revamp the line. Then they've also got to address at least one corner position in the draft rather than just free agency. Maybe they can get an EDGE in FA, but they really need to try hitting in the draft there as well.

And that's ignoring they may need to replace Enunwa and Anderson. And Bell will be significantly older at that point too.

2021 is the earliest I see this team start to be competitive. And 2022 is more likely for the next playoff appearance.

With free agency and the draft the OL could be significantly better in a year. Surely it can't become great, but to go from historically bad to below average is an insane improvement

dcm1602

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I certainly wouldn’t call LeVeon Bell average. Our rushing stats are terrible because there is absolutely nowhere to run. Whether you blame that on scheme or injury or talent or whatever. I’m simply grading each unit on talent.

Saquon is a tremendous player but I’m not writing him off as dogshit because he had 1 rushing yard against a 1-7 Jets team

We've only seen Bell be elite with a good OL, and elite QB + top wideouts around him.

I'm not saying he's bad as he's an excellent blocker and leader. But he's never proven himself great on a garbage team

Between a year out of the league and not having stacked opportunities it's possible he's not great. He sure hasn't looked it this season
« Last Edit: November 13, 2019, 01:47:00 PM by dcm1602 »

Pope

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We've only seen Bell be elite with a good OL, and elite QB + top wideouts around him.

I'm not saying he's bad as he's an excellent blocker and leader. But he's never proven himself great on a garbage team
Fair enough.. I’m comfortable keeping him as a top 10 RB based off his history and the glimpses this year. He’s made plays out of absolutely nothing to work with in the backfield. Statistically he’s been terrible but he has passed the eye test easily

AlioTheFool

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With free agency and the draft the OL could be significantly better in a year. Surely it can't become great, but to go from historically bad to below average is an insane improvement

Good offensive linemen almost never hit the market. FA is not where you build your OL.
Teams that draft well do so no matter where they pick. Teams that draft poorly do so no matter where they pick I want my team to win games and draft well

dcm1602

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Good offensive linemen almost never hit the market. FA is not where you build your OL.

Can build and use bandaids.

And an OL doesn't need to be a "good" lineman to be a huge improvement for the team

Italian Seafood

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Fair enough.. I’m comfortable keeping him as a top 10 RB based off his history and the glimpses this year. He’s made plays out of absolutely nothing to work with in the backfield. Statistically he’s been terrible but he has passed the eye test easily

Agreed, it's why you have to watch the games and not just stats. Bell can be great if we fix the line, and a big help to Darnold. Give him something.
So it turns out, Italian Seafood was right an everyone can go freak themselves.

AlioTheFool

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Can build and use bandaids.

And an OL doesn't need to be a "good" lineman to be a huge improvement for the team


Bandaids don't make playoff offensive lines. My definition of "competitive" is making the playoffs. This team won't make the playoffs until they revamp the OL, get at least one very good corner, and get someone who can actually hit the opposing QB.
Teams that draft well do so no matter where they pick. Teams that draft poorly do so no matter where they pick I want my team to win games and draft well

dcm1602

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Bandaids don't make playoff offensive lines. My definition of "competitive" is making the playoffs. This team won't make the playoffs until they revamp the OL, get at least one very good corner, and get someone who can actually hit the opposing QB.

Have you looked at the state of the AFC?

There's basically 3 powerhouses. One has a QB who could die of old age at any moment, one has an electric star QB who will eventually have his explosive ability sapped by injuries, one has no defense.

Then there's the Bills Browns Texans and former shell of the Steelers.

The talent of the AFC has really fallen, outside of the Bengals, Dolphins, and maybe Broncos I genuinely think any other afc team could be competitive with the playoffs next year. If Brady dies retires or has his arm sapped then any of those teams could be legit SB contenders.

The AFC is really lacking powerhouse teams

mj2sexay

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They have 70 million dollars and some draft flexibility given the extra picks from the Leo trade and the likelyhood we'll be picking in the top 10, if not top 5.

They can fix the o-line in an off-season. It might take a little while for said o-line to gel with the new blood, sure.

With the obvious exception of Darnold, no ones development is more important to this team over the next half a season than Edoga for the very reason that it'll be a lot easier to replace one tackle as opposed to two.

If Edoga shows well at right tackle to end the year, I wouldn't be opposed to signing a veteran LT (Costanzo, Bulaga) in order to gain a little certainty at the position and free the team up to actually take a skill position player like a Jerry Jeudy in the 1st round. As of right now though, the way this team is presently constituted, Jeudy is a luxury we just can't afford.

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Bandaids don't make playoff offensive lines.

Sure they do. 32 year old Alan Faneca and 32 year old Damien Woody weren't brought in to be long term starters, they were brought in as short term talent to get us into the playoffs and help develop our young OL talent in Brick and Mangold. If we go and draft say Andrew Thomas and Trey Smith, it makes a whole heap of sense to get a couple of vets like Trent Williams or Mike Iupati if they decide to test the market - they've both probably got a 3 year contract left in them.
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