Author Topic: The Curious Case of Adam Gase  (Read 316412 times)

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Derek Smalls

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2280 on: April 28, 2020, 03:58:30 PM »
As a head coach, he's 30-35 and has never had an offense ranked higher than 24th overall. What's worse his offense has declined in overall ranking YoY.

What part of that makes you think that he can coach?
I would argue that he had no better than 30-34 talent in his career. He's also 20-17 when he has his starting quarterback (and it's not like Ryan Tannehill and 22-year old Sam Darnold are any better than mediocre QBs).

I'm not sold on Gase. I'm not sold that he's a good coach. But I'm judging him mostly on what he's done with the Jets. Year 1 was mediocre. Hopefully, year 2 is better. If not, we'll hire someone else.

Johnny English

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2281 on: April 28, 2020, 04:51:17 PM »
The most rational sequence of events is...

1. Adam Gase got Maccagnan fired.
2. The Jets hired Joe Douglas because he was the best candidate, and because he had a good working relationship with Gase, who was largely in charge at that point.
3. Joe Douglas and Adam Gase are now working together to build the best Jets roster possible. If that fails, then Gase will be the first fall guy since Douglas has a longer leash.

The idea that Douglas doesn't have faith in Gase isn't rational, so please explain it to me. Because that either means:
- He took the job last year, knowing he was stuck with a coach he didn't like
- He took the job last year with trust in Gase, then lost faith in Gase over 8 months, but didn't have enough clout to get him fired.

Neither of those make that much sense. Douglas had all the leverage in April.
- Why would he take a job with a coach he hated?
- Why would he take a job where the ownership would ignore his recommendation to fire a coach?
- Why would he stick with a coach he doesn't believe in?
At least one of those has to be true for your implication to be right.

Here's how I see it (and it's only one possibility, I obviously have no more insight into what's actually going on than anyone else here):

Gase successfully manoeuvres Maccagnan out for whatever reason - thinks he's excrement at his job, thinks he doesn't have his (Gase's) back, hates his stupid coffee breath - and recognises he needs a friendly in the role. Knows Douglas from the one year they worked together at the Bears and obviously he's a well thought of exec who is on plenty of teams' radar as an up and coming GM, so makes sense for both Gase and the Jets.

Douglas gets the call, can see that the Jets are - despite our well deserved reputation - in a good position to build long term success, with a highly thought of young franchise QB as well as some other good or great players on the roster, and room for manouevrability on the roster. Also, he's the preferred pick of the head coach so it's not a case of being inserted in above or alongside someone who doesn't really want him, so it's a welcoming environment. You never know when opportunity is going to come knocking next and this one on many levels isn't bad at all, and has the added bonus of the kids not having to change schools.

All of this is, I think, fairly uncontroversial.

Here's where my line of thinking and yours may differ. For one year, 2015, Douglas and Gase worked in the same organisation, Douglas as the Director of College Scouting under Ryan Pace and Gase as the OC under John Fox. Now for all I know they got together at 5 o'clock every day in Gase's office and drank beer, bonded and agreed over manly hugs to see out their golden years together sitting on a dock with fishing rods, but what definitely didn't happen is that Douglas got to watch first hand what a great head coach Gase is.

Fast forward back to about this time last year and Douglas is taking over as GM for us. We have been in recent years a graveyard of ambition for NFL GMs; our last three have all been rookies at the position, and none of the three have been given another opportunity since being fired by the Jets. Douglas is not a stupid man and he has been around a few teams and a lot of smart execs, so he knows that tying his fortunes to that of a head coach any more than is necessary for the role is a good way to pooch your career. Having watched his performance last year as head coach it seems clear that Gase is not universally popular, outside the building or inside it, so what's the logical move for the GM at this point? Give yourself options.

Joe Douglas is not Adam Gase's GM, he's the New York Jets' GM. After the disaster that was last season, some of which was on Gase and some of which was not, you have to be as open as possible to whatever comes next. If the Jets stink again next year, players hate him because he's publicly shaming them in the stadium corridors and calling plays seemingly designed to make them fail, fans hate him because we're 4-12 and Sam's looking like he might bust, and ownership hates him for all of the above, he has to not only not be seen as Gase's guy but he also has to be able to adjust the roster to suit whoever comes in next. And of course, if the team comes storming out of the blocks and goes 13-3 and players pledge the rest of their careers to Adam Gase and I buy a jersey with his name on the back to prove how very wrong I was, he still has the ability to keep those players.

So my very long winded explanation is to say that no, I don't think Douglas hates Gase. If he did he wouldn't have come here to start with. I do think that based upon what he saw first hand he probably has misgivings about his ability to do the job, like most of us do, and wants to ensure that if we cut ties with Gase at the end of this season he isn't seen as part of that mess. He doesn't have the power to fire Gase and nor would he probably wish to given Gase's role in bringing him here - it probably suits him fine that he's a voice in Johnson's decision, not the hatchet man himself. No one wants the reputation of being duplicitous, but in the end he's got to look out for himself and that's what I think he's done with this roster.
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loyaljetsfan

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2282 on: April 28, 2020, 05:51:35 PM »
I would argue that he had no better than 30-34 talent in his career. He's also 20-17 when he has his starting quarterback (and it's not like Ryan Tannehill and 22-year old Sam Darnold are any better than mediocre QBs).

I'm not sold on Gase. I'm not sold that he's a good coach. But I'm judging him mostly on what he's done with the Jets. Year 1 was mediocre. Hopefully, year 2 is better. If not, we'll hire someone else.

I mean Tannehill had an amazing season with TN after he took over for Mariota and was one win away from the SuperBowl. 

But ok, let's agree to can his bug eyed derriere when he fails our team this season

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2283 on: April 28, 2020, 06:28:39 PM »
I mean Tannehill had an amazing season with TN after he took over for Mariota and was one win away from the SuperBowl. 

But ok, let's agree to can his bug eyed derriere when he fails our team this season

Tennessee was successful because of Derrick Henry and their defense.

Tannehill was a game manager for them.

He had better statistical seasons under Gase.
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loyaljetsfan

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2284 on: April 28, 2020, 07:14:50 PM »
Tennessee was successful because of Derrick Henry and their defense.

Tannehill was a game manager for them.

He had better statistical seasons under Gase.

His stats say otherwise:

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/T/TannRy00.htm


Derek Smalls

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2285 on: April 28, 2020, 07:31:54 PM »
I mean Tannehill had an amazing season with TN after he took over for Mariota and was one win away from the SuperBowl. 

But ok, let's agree to can his bug eyed derriere when he fails our team this season
Statistically, Tannehill was fantastic in the regular season. Definitely won't argue against that. He had a historically great season....in 10 starts.

Personally, I think it was a little fluky, and I think the Titans agreed, since as soon as they got to the playoffs, they turned him into Mark Sanchez and never let him throw.

loyaljetsfan

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2286 on: April 28, 2020, 07:45:34 PM »
Statistically, Tannehill was fantastic in the regular season. Definitely won't argue against that. He had a historically great season....in 10 starts.

Personally, I think it was a little fluky, and I think the Titans agreed, since as soon as they got to the playoffs, they turned him into Mark Sanchez and never let him throw.

If the Titans thought his season was a fluke, they would not have given him a $118M contract

MexJetinBcn

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2287 on: April 28, 2020, 09:40:36 PM »
Wtf... where did this Douglas hates Gase come from? By all accounts, they’re really close. They worked together before the draft and they are not just friends but are on the same line philosophically speaking. Of course, if the ship sinks, Douglas will do what he has to do, but until that point, Gase is his coach.

And sorry but last season was not a disaster. It was a standard shitty season for the Jets. We sucked in one side of the field, were good in the other and ended 7-9, as most of us expected despite not having our starting QB for three games. Our coach sucks, but given the circumstances the record and season were just mediocre, not epically bad.

We can always suck more of course, hopefully it doesn’t happen next season. There is a chance we do but we might as well be better too. At this point none of us can know for certain.

Johnny English

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2288 on: April 28, 2020, 10:32:58 PM »


Wtf... where did this Douglas hates Gase come from?

Derek Smalls' imagination. I don't believe that anyone else has suggested that.
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Derek Smalls

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2289 on: April 28, 2020, 10:35:38 PM »
Wtf... where did this Douglas hates Gase come from?

The idea that Douglas doesn't believe in Gase was floated by Johnny English.

You're assuming that Douglas has belief in Gase. The fact that his FAs are almost all one year deals if we want them to be rather suggests that he's not currently building a long term roster in Adam Gase's image.

CatoTheElder

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2290 on: April 29, 2020, 07:02:06 AM »
The point being that it was no one with a credible connection to the team.
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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2291 on: April 29, 2020, 07:22:35 AM »
Whether Douglas believes in Gase is irrelevant as he's clearly going to be his HC this year.

The only question that matters is will Douglas believe in Gase in January/February, as whatever opinion he has of him now will surely either improve or worsen by then

MBGreen

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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2292 on: April 29, 2020, 08:11:57 AM »
I don't believe in Gase...and that's really all that matters.
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Re: The Curious Case of Adam Gase - freaking Fired
« Reply #2294 on: April 29, 2020, 03:35:26 PM »
Not sure what’s worse the Gase argument or the Rex argument

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