U.S. Politics

[dcm1602]

I don't think that's true. I disagree to some extent with Badger and mj on a pretty hefty portion of their positions, but I always listen to both of them and I think I've probably adjusted my views on multiple things in both of their directions at various points in their past.

If you've decided that the problem with discussing politics with people is that it's pointless because they don't listen to you and don't get any smarter, then maybe you're the problem. I'm more interested in educating me than I am in educating others.

Sure but is it unreasonable to say that you're a fairly reasonable person? And are things you shift your ideology on things you're passionate on and have strong positions on, or jsut things you have an opinion on and nothing else?

I believe there was a big study done years ago on vaccination hesitancy (before Covid-19). And the researchers found that talking about bird watching was just as likely to change someone's opinions on vaccines as was statistics and data. (however they did find that showing them pictures of kids dying or suffering from diseases preventable by vaccines did help)

[bojanglesman]

If you've decided that the problem with discussing politics with people is that it's pointless because they don't listen to you and don't get any smarter, then maybe you're the problem. I'm more interested in educating me than I am in educating others.

It very much depends on the people you are talking to.  If you think it's not pointless to talk to some people, I'd like to introduce you to the internet, specifically Twitter.  Honestly, I'm just talking about politics on the internet in general.

[Johnny English]

Sure but is it unreasonable to say that you're a fairly reasonable person? And are things you shift your ideology on things you're passionate on and have strong positions on, or jsut things you have an opinion on and nothing else?

I believe there was a big study done years ago on vaccination hesitancy (before Covid-19). And the researchers found that talking about bird watching was just as likely to change someone's opinions on vaccines as was statistics and data. (however they did find that showing them pictures of kids dying or suffering from diseases preventable by vaccines did help)

Depends what you mean by "reasonable", I'm definitely politically more moderate than either of them on most things (by moderate I'm talking in the Overton sense, not the dictionary definition) but that doesn't mean that some views held by people who we would categorise as being at the further reaches of the spectrum can't be reasonable.

There are views I hold more strongly, either because I feel very confident in my knowledge of why I hold them or simply because of innate "rightness". There are policies and views about which I have a general feeling but would like to understand more perspectives, in order to further inform my own position. But even on those things about which I'm pretty sure I'm right I'll listen to those I disagree with, because even if my position is one of wanting to persuade them of why they're wrong I have to first understand why they think the way they do.

[delavan]

I don't think that's true. I disagree to some extent with Badger and mj on a pretty hefty portion of their positions, but I always listen to both of them and I think I've probably adjusted my views on multiple things in both of their directions at various points in their past.

If you've decided that the problem with discussing politics with people is that it's pointless because they don't listen to you and don't get any smarter, then maybe you're the problem. I'm more interested in educating me than I am in educating others.

re: the in bold above 

Not trying to be a provocative jerk JE but you really think so?

[Johnny English]

re: the in bold above 

Not trying to be a provocative jerk JE but you really think so?

LOL yes. And Badger fairly significantly with both my views and actions.

[dcm1602]

re: the in bold above 

Not trying to be a provocative jerk JE but you really think so?

I disagree with both significantly but I'd definitely say there's a difference between the two.

I think there's a generational difference. JE tends to have more of an older person's liberal viewpoint  and Badger more like these younger ones

[Johnny English]

I disagree with both significantly but I'd definitely say there's a difference between the two.

I think there's a generational difference. JE tends to have more of an older person's liberal viewpoint  and Badger more like these younger ones

I'd say that's fair-ish. I'd like to make the world a little nicer for the generations coming behind me, as long as it doesn't cost me too much. Badger wants to burn down the whole shitpile that we've made for them.

[MBGreen]

I disagree with both significantly but I'd definitely say there's a difference between the two.

I think there's a generational difference. JE tends to have more of an older person's liberal viewpoint  and Badger more like these younger ones

JE is the Clark Griswold of JO.

[dcm1602]

JE is the Clark Griswold of JO.

He does seem like he would appreciate a good country squire

[delavan]

^^^
honest question...honest answers.  thx

He does seem like he would appreciate a good country squire

Watching Obama return to the WH today I truly felt sorry for Joe as he at one point was being flat out ignored by all who flocked around and fussed over 'BMOC' OB.....there he was, the current president of the united states, slowly, sadly shuffling off to the side...by himself.  'Twas not a good look Kammy & co.

truly kinda sad  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGRxVITBGOA  ...the champions of compassions--haha...

[Badger]

and on the flip side, Colorado has passed legislation allowing abortions at any stage of pregnancy.

Extremist lunacy everywhere.

No, because nobody gets an abortion at 39 weeks for lols. Not even close to equivalent.

[Badger]

For the record, there are ZERO states in the union that have majority support for total abortion bans. Our sad attempt at pretending to be a functional democracy continues to become less believable.

[ons]

On a somewhat unrelated note, totally honest question here for everyone.  Do you ever get to a point where it's difficult to balance "being informed" and so pissed off that it's better to just not read about politics anymore?

Yes, and I think IDing that in yourself is really important. I try to stay tapped into local excrement as much as possible, but I will often sit out even reading about a lot of national political excrement. Too much to lose in terms of my well-being, and so little to gain. That being said talking about politics on the internet is largely where I started in terms of developing a coherent political ideology, and I think it can be a genuinely good place to develop more nuance(depending on where you go, how open you are to information, etc etc.) But there are too many infuriating things that are happening that I can't realistically influence it doesn't make sense for me to contribute to the continuous outrage machine that is modern political news.

[bojanglesman]

Yes, and I think IDing that in yourself is really important. I try to stay tapped into local excrement as much as possible, but I will often sit out even reading about a lot of national political excrement. Too much to lose in terms of my well-being, and so little to gain. That being said talking about politics on the internet is largely where I started in terms of developing a coherent political ideology, and I think it can be a genuinely good place to develop more nuance(depending on where you go, how open you are to information, etc etc.) But there are too many infuriating things that are happening that I can't realistically influence it doesn't make sense for me to contribute to the continuous outrage machine that is modern political news.

That was worded much better than what I said. 

[ons]

No, because nobody gets an abortion at 39 weeks for lols. Not even close to equivalent.

Something like 99% of abortions happen before 21 weeks, and over 90% in the first 13 weeks. The majority of those happening outside of the 21 weeks are on the earlier side rather than the later side. If someone is getting an abortion after those 21 weeks, something has either gone really wrong in the pregnancy, they didn't have a realistic opportunity for an abortion before that time, or due to shitty health infrastructure and knowledge, they didn't know that they were pregnant. Of course, my extreme opinion is that the government doesn't have the obligation to 'protect' a fetus over a person's bodily autonomy at any stage of pregnancy, but I'd be willing to compromise and settle for funding strong enough preventative reproductive health care options and early abortions to really target cutting out those 21+ week abortions