Author Topic: U.S. Politics  (Read 646145 times)

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Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6600 on: October 10, 2021, 10:48:56 AM »
Opponents of the bill could not have possibly received more favorable media coverage than they have so far

https://twitter.com/CBSNewsPress/status/1447209082818121734?t=_Okr5Pp8MWD9jFaXGiipug&s=19

Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6601 on: October 10, 2021, 11:00:03 PM »

dcm1602

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6602 on: October 10, 2021, 11:40:07 PM »
Opponents of the bill could not have possibly received more favorable media coverage than they have so far

https://twitter.com/CBSNewsPress/status/1447209082818121734?t=_Okr5Pp8MWD9jFaXGiipug&s=19

Are you saying that most Americans don't understand the majority of what's in that 2,465 page bill and the media hasn't adequately been explaining what's on all 2,465 pages?

Say it ain't so!

Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6603 on: October 11, 2021, 08:48:38 AM »
Are you saying that most Americans don't understand the majority of what's in that 2,465 page bill and the media hasn't adequately been explaining what's on all 2,465 pages?

Say it ain't so!
I'm saying the media has almost exclusively reported on the bill's cost instead of anything it would do, to the delight of bad faith actors and the ignorant.

delavan

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6604 on: October 11, 2021, 03:31:15 PM »
Opponents of the bill could not have possibly received more favorable media coverage than they have so far

https://twitter.com/CBSNewsPress/status/1447209082818121734?t=_Okr5Pp8MWD9jFaXGiipug&s=19
I'm saying the media has almost exclusively reported on the bill's cost instead of anything it would do, to the delight of bad faith actors
and the ignorant.

With all due respect Badger those two posts read like a peevish oversimplification based on the nagging suspicion that Manchin and Sinema are going to foul up the works by not towing the line.  Myself, I've no problem with the bill however I do acknowledge why some of the "ignorant" (as a matter of conscience) would balk at the prospect of paying for the millions of abortions of others (the Hyde provision question). 

As for the "cost/what's in it?" question, I'm aware of the main provisions, i.e. free community college (2 yr), extended family/medical leave, expanded Medicare, childcare & universal pre-k), extended tax credits, climate change provisions/incentives, etc., and I really found out basically by "looking and listening" to various sources (both for and against). 

As for Manchin himself who's been described in some quarters here as a 'sociopath'  : )  I can only comment on Kyrstin herself:

 (would - both 'then' and 'now')

 
 

Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6605 on: October 11, 2021, 03:37:22 PM »
Considering the US federal government can pay for anything money can buy, it does leave only two possibilities for opposing the bill for its price tag: lying or ignorance.

delavan

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6606 on: October 11, 2021, 04:33:03 PM »
Considering the US federal government can pay for anything money can buy, it does leave only two possibilities for opposing the bill for its price tag: lying or ignorance.


Fair point.   Or, there are those who are paranoid about the down-the-road impacts of the bill and who view the US federal gov't as an extension of their wallet, i.e. "why should I have to pay for dem freeloadahs."   Me, I think for people no matter what their circumstances are to be without e.g. any access to healthcare borders on unconscionable but at the same time there are some misplaced "rugged individualists" who don't get the big picture. 

Johnny English

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6607 on: October 11, 2021, 05:04:59 PM »
towing the line

Toeing. As in the start of a race.
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delavan

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6608 on: October 11, 2021, 05:27:22 PM »
But of course, thx.

dcm1602

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6609 on: October 11, 2021, 08:30:36 PM »
Considering the US federal government can pay for anything money can buy, it does leave only two possibilities for opposing the bill for its price tag: lying or ignorance.


Except you're leaving out the most important part about the government having infinite free money.

Is it devalues all other money, increasing inflation. Even by people who put out this line of thinking that the government can buy anything they want.

It literally saps away peoples live savings (many of whom are broke to begin with)

And the rich will have the better strategies to mitigate this as they're more capable of having money in stocks and businesses (they also have more money to be negatively impacted by inflation)

But this line of thinking that the government can and should buy everything ever to make the whole world rainbows and unicorns is completely delusional

Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6610 on: October 11, 2021, 08:50:18 PM »
Except you're leaving out the most important part about the government having infinite free money.

Is it devalues all other money, increasing inflation. Even by people who put out this line of thinking that the government can buy anything they want.

It literally saps away peoples live savings (many of whom are broke to begin with)

And the rich will have the better strategies to mitigate this as they're more capable of having money in stocks and businesses (they also have more money to be negatively impacted by inflation)

But this line of thinking that the government can and should buy everything ever to make the whole world rainbows and unicorns is completely delusional

1. Deficit spending doesn't inherently cause inflation

2. Tax the rich more if you actually care about them having an unfair advantage

3. The government should help make people's lives less miserable, the fact that you and others think that's a unicorn says more about you than anything else
« Last Edit: October 11, 2021, 08:52:11 PM by Badger »

dcm1602

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6611 on: October 11, 2021, 10:32:14 PM »
1. Deficit spending doesn't inherently cause inflation

2. Tax the rich more if you actually care about them having an unfair advantage

3. The government should help make people's lives less miserable, the fact that you and others think that's a unicorn says more about you than anything else


Yes we fundamentally disagree.

I believe the individual is responsible for bettering their lives, you believe it's the governments responsiblity.

It is what it is, but you do often presume that your way is the only way.

I will gladly acknowledge that there's benefits to both.

And despite me thinking it's the individuals job to take care of themselves I know in reality it's an ideal mix of both that would benefit people the most.

This multi trillion dollar thing is full of way too much bullshit.

You want to make everyone's lives better? Scrap this giant freaking retarded bill and reform health care. I'd support Universal Healthcare before supporting this garbage

Badger

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Johnny English

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #6613 on: October 14, 2021, 02:04:59 PM »
https://twitter.com/AndrewYang/status/1448685895511588866?t=ss47R0z0Kj88qZkyPPTJ2g&s=19

That sounds like quite a excrement car. I don't think he's very good at this whole politics thing.
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delavan

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