Author Topic: U.S. Politics  (Read 644770 times)

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Fenwyr

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2925 on: November 24, 2017, 01:31:33 PM »
It wasn't actually aimed at anyone specifically on here, although people who vote Republican despite their vote "not mattering" are every bit as culpable for the decisions made by the government they voted for as those in blue states.
I honestly don't think any self proclaimed republican on this board identifies with the party as it is now.

Their goals are so obviously self serving and evil.  How could they align with this?

Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2926 on: November 24, 2017, 09:42:46 PM »
I honestly don't think any self proclaimed republican on this board identifies with the party as it is now.

Their goals are so obviously self serving and evil.  How could they align with this?

"I want to pay less in taxes and the other stuff just isn't important to me."

I can respect, on some level, an admission of the above. I can't respect the mental gymnastics required to defend the bullshit.

Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2927 on: November 24, 2017, 09:55:20 PM »
It wasn't actually aimed at anyone specifically on here, although people who vote Republican despite their vote "not mattering" are every bit as culpable for the decisions made by the government they voted for as those in blue states.

This is why I couldn't vote for Clinton, and obviously my vote wouldn't make a difference in NY but I'd still be cosigning her administration and its actions if i had. If I lived in a swing state I'd likely have voted for her out of pure self-interest, as the POTUS has more of an effect on my life than any of you, but I wouldn't be bending over backwards to defend why we're invading Iran or whatever shenanigans we'd be up to under her.

Fenwyr

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2928 on: November 24, 2017, 11:04:06 PM »
This is why I couldn't vote for Clinton, and obviously my vote wouldn't make a difference in NY but I'd still be cosigning her administration and its actions if i had. If I lived in a swing state I'd likely have voted for her out of pure self-interest, as the POTUS has more of an effect on my life than any of you, but I wouldn't be bending over backwards to defend why we're invading Iran or whatever shenanigans we'd be up to under her.
I wouldn't have expected campaign finance reform, but invading Iran is a stretch.

She would have been handcuffed by a republican congress, so she wouldn't have been able to do much, but she wouldn't be rolling all the good things Obama did.

On the bright side, her losing created the tipping point we see now.  2018 and 2020 are going to be bloodbaths for republicans,

Badger

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Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2930 on: November 26, 2017, 09:06:49 AM »
The Atlantic shits on the New York Times for their Nazi next door article.

https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/11/a-nazi-cooks-pasta/546737/

Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2931 on: November 27, 2017, 02:26:31 PM »
I found some amazing wordplay worthy of sg3 but I'm not gonna post it until I know he's alive and well.

Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2932 on: December 03, 2017, 09:46:13 PM »
I found some amazing wordplay worthy of sg3 but I'm not gonna post it until I know he's alive and well.

Since sg3 is back

"Republican tax reform? More like tax DEFORM."

Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2933 on: December 03, 2017, 09:46:44 PM »
"The Tax Policy Center estimated that about 80 percent of the benefit of the tax plan will go to the top 1 percent, who will enjoy the following elements of the tax cut:

A full $1.5 trillion alone is going to slash the corporate tax rate. CEOs have said repeatedly they plan to pocket that money rather than invest it or give workers higher wages.

The alternative minimum tax, paid almost exclusively by the rich, is also eliminated. That’s a $700 billion giveaway.

Another $150 billion goes to repealing the estate tax, which currently exempts the first $11 million of the deceased’s estate, so nobody even remotely middle class pays it. The repeal benefits so few people you can practically list them out.

More than $200 billion in cuts goes to a provision that allows a greater deduction for dividends on foreign earnings. That’s not for you.

Roughly $600 billion goes to reducing taxes on “pass-throughs” and other businesses not set up as corporations, which law firms, lobby shops, and doctors’ offices often benefit from. Poor and middle-class people do not tend to set themselves up as pass-throughs.

Under current law, many tax credits phase out at low-income thresholds. The GOP plan changes that by raising the threshold so richer people can also claim the credit. That provision alone is, by definition, a $200 billion tax cut for the wealthy.

Individual and family tax rates are cut by about $1 trillion, and some regular people will indeed see some of that money as a tax cut — but not much. As the New York Times noted, by 2027, people making between $40,000 and $50,000 would see a combined increase of $5.3 billion in taxes. Where would that money go? Folks earning more than $1 million would see their taxes collectively cut by $5.8 billion a year.

The list above brings the total well close to $5 trillion in tax cuts almost exclusively for the wealthy. The last major element of the bill, the doubling of the standard deduction, would benefit a broader range of people, but it comes at the expense of states, cities, and towns."

Johnny English

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2934 on: December 03, 2017, 11:47:09 PM »
Yeah but you see, it's all about the American Dream. Because next year I'll be one of them. So I'm going to vote for it now so I get to enjoy it then.
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bojanglesman

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2935 on: December 04, 2017, 05:57:25 AM »
Yeah but you see, it's all about the American Dream. Because next year I'll be one of them. So I'm going to vote for it now so I get to enjoy it then.
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bojanglesman

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2936 on: December 04, 2017, 06:11:01 AM »
I agree that this tax cut is really more beneficial to the wealthy than its made out to be. I don't think anyone should be pretending this is helpful to the poor.  The narrative is that it helps the working middle class taxpayers.  I think the term "middle class" has been stretched to include people that are wealthy.

I don't know if this law will still be around as it currently is in 2027.  I'm sure parties will have flipped power at least once so who knows what this thing will look like then.  Even if by some miracle the GOP retains power, they will probably modify it somehow before then.

The important factors are, as Badger mentioned, do the businesses and wealthy people that do benefit from this sit on the money or do something with it. How far down the road do you consider money to be reinvested in the economy? Barring them putting the money under the mattress, what will the wealthy do with it that won't ultimately end up helping someone somewhere?

The GOP says the economy will grow enough to offset this deficit. I think it will grow to offset some, but not all.  Republican leaning economists say the US can return to 3-4% GDP again. Democratic economists say its virtually impossible to do any better than 2% with the way things are these days. Who knows.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2017, 07:05:20 AM by bojanglesman »

Badger

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2937 on: December 04, 2017, 07:26:51 AM »


Republican leaning economists say the US can return to 3-4% GDP again. Democratic economists say its virtually impossible to do any better than 2% with the way things are these days. Who knows.

Relevant

https://theintercept.com/2017/12/01/gops-list-of-economists-backing-tax-cut-includes-ghosts-office-assistants-ex-felons-and-a-sprinkling-of-real-economists/

Johnny English

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2938 on: December 04, 2017, 07:31:48 AM »
The important factors are, as Badger mentioned, do the businesses and wealthy people that do benefit from this sit on the money or do something with it. How far down the road do you consider money to be reinvested in the economy? Barring them putting the money under the mattress, what will the wealthy do with it that won't ultimately end up helping someone somewhere?

Corporate profits are at record levels and have been for a few years. If they want to reinvest and grow there's nothing stopping them doing that already.
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Fenwyr

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Re: U.S. Politics
« Reply #2939 on: December 04, 2017, 09:35:54 AM »
Corporate profits are at record levels and have been for a few years. If they want to reinvest and grow there's nothing stopping them doing that already.
This.  And also, as per the usual, the money will be stashed in offshore accounts.

Also, if they think the money is going trickle down anyway (it will not), then why not just cut out the middle man?  The answer to that is clear (see above).

As wages and job growth stay stagnant, while the price of everything goes up, the vast majority of the population's buying power goes down.  Less buying leads to less corporate profits, job loss, lower wages, and fewer benefits.  This will lead to the next recession.

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