U.S. Politics

[dcm1602]

My older kids both go to Boston University. BU's curriculum demands that unless you go in specifically pre-med or engineering (and a couple of others), you enter as a student of the College of General Studies. For the first 2 years you don't declare a major or take the coursework--you focus on a well-rounded education that exposes you to a broad base of disciplines while you figure out what you want to do with your life.

My understanding is that it's becoming a standard in a lot of places today. It only makes sense. Like you said, a 17-18 year old doesn't generally know what they want to do with their lives.

I have a specific problem with student loans. It's not that they should be forgiven--they should be interest free. I understand banks wouldn't want to take the risk (and would have no incentive to) so let the federal government give out interest-free loans. And the student shouldn't need to begin payments until 6 years after the loan amount was taken (so 2 years after graduation to begin paying back freshman year). The idea that interest is accruing before a student even takes his first class is ridiculous.

I can agree with your concept, but not the execution.

I'm perfectly ok with removing the profiteering from student loans. I'd prefer the government to get involved with as little as possible, but I understand that student loans are indeed a financial problem.

As long as it was done in a deficit neutral manner I could get on board.  Interest free loans we would lose money on. You have to factor in inflation  (which means were losing money off the bat)  plus the fact that we would likely need to borrow money from other countries (thus paying interest) (or under the unlikely scenario we ever have a surplus we would generate a return on that money one way or another) you would also need to factor in people going delinquent on their loans or declaring bankruptcy and what not.

As long as this was all taken into taken into consideration and factored in to make it deficit neutral I'd be 100% on board. This means you couldn't have 0% interest but the number would be much smaller than they're paying now (as nobody is profiting off of it).  How long people paid it off over and when the payments kicked in is irrelevant to me,  as it would be deficit neutral. So if someone didn't want to start payments until 6 years after they graduate, they'd be paying substantially higher interest rates.

[dcm1602]

Forgiveness for service works too.

I've mentioned in another thread about how the army has a famous anesthesia program. They pay for the entire schooling, and in return you need to do anesthesia for them for a significantly discounted rate.

Something like that is fair, and presumably cost neutral. Not to mention  it encourages people to do something that benefits society.

[insanity]

My older kids both go to Boston University. BU's curriculum demands that unless you go in specifically pre-med or engineering (and a couple of others), you enter as a student of the College of General Studies. For the first 2 years you don't declare a major or take the coursework--you focus on a well-rounded education that exposes you to a broad base of disciplines while you figure out what you want to do with your life.

My understanding is that it's becoming a standard in a lot of places today. It only makes sense. Like you said, a 17-18 year old doesn't generally know what they want to do with their lives.

I have a specific problem with student loans. It's not that they should be forgiven--they should be interest free. I understand banks wouldn't want to take the risk (and would have no incentive to) so let the federal government give out interest-free loans. And the student shouldn't need to begin payments until 6 years after the loan amount was taken (so 2 years after graduation to begin paying back freshman year). The idea that interest is accruing before a student even takes his first class is ridiculous.

Although what pope is saying is a good idea the excrement BU and other schools are pulling is crap.  They arent stopping you from declaring a major so you can explore what you want to do they are stopping you so they can get more of your money.

Yes kids should stop hopping on the college train so early to figure out what they actually want to do in life, but they shouldnt be required to take biology, physics, and calculus if you want to be a creative director for an advertising agency.  Its a shame and a waste of thousands of dollars.

[AlioTheFool]

Although what pope is saying is a good idea the excrement BU and other schools are pulling is crap.  They arent stopping you from declaring a major so you can explore what you want to do they are stopping you so they can get more of your money.

Yes kids should stop hopping on the college train so early to figure out what they actually want to do in life, but they shouldnt be required to take biology, physics, and calculus if you want to be a creative director for an advertising agency.  Its a shame and a waste of thousands of dollars.

If you already know what you want to do, the option is there to apply to the program you'd like (ex. the School of Engineering). The College of General Studies is simply a place for students to take all of the required "liberal arts" courses while learning about different fields of dedicated study until they determine their chosen major, rather than at the same time.

If your argument is that students shouldn't take a breadth of courses outside of their major, and should instead take only courses directly related to their major, then we're in direct disagreement. Broad studies are important for the brain; that's been established through centuries of science. Students exposed to broad studies become better thinkers/problem solvers.

I took a specialized program in college and even I had to take 3 semesters of math, accounting, writing, history, etc. I've long regretted not putting in more effort in my accounting coursework. You don't realize how important your non-major work is until you actually need it.


EDIT: Also, just because you want to be the creative director of an ad agency doesn't mean you will be. It would be a lot more disingenuous for a school to prepare you for a pigeonholed position and leave you completely unprepared to do anything else when it doesn't work out.

[Johnny English]

EDIT: Also, just because you want to be the creative director of an ad agency doesn't mean you will be. It would be a lot more disingenuous for a school to prepare you for a pigeonholed position and leave you completely unprepared to do anything else when it doesn't work out.

No no no, this is the 21st century and YOU CAN BE ANYTHING YOU WANT TO BE IF YOU JUST WANT IT ENOUGH AND WORK HARD ENOUGH TO GET IT.

One of the most damaging pieces of propaganda peddled in years, IMO. There's nothing wrong with pursuing your dreams, but you can't do so to the exclusion of reality. I could have spent my entire existence since birth wanting to be an NBA power forward but no amount of wanting and working would make me a foot taller.

[AlioTheFool]

No no no, this is the 21st century and YOU CAN BE ANYTHING YOU WANT TO BE IF YOU JUST WANT IT ENOUGH AND WORK HARD ENOUGH TO GET IT.

One of the most damaging pieces of propaganda peddled in years, IMO. There's nothing wrong with pursuing your dreams, but you can't do so to the exclusion of reality. I could have spent my entire existence since birth wanting to be an NBA power forward but no amount of wanting and working would make me a foot taller.

While your example is hyperbole, I completely agree with the sentiment.

When I went back to college to pursue my dream of programming for a living my intention was to build video games. Yet I'm about to have my 14th anniversary as a database admin at a real estate corporation.

[dcm1602]

I think the problem with taking general courses is a lot of them are excrement nonsense that nobody gives a freak about.

I agree there's some benefit in being well rounded, but when nobody takes it seriously or cares it's just a waste of time and money

[AlioTheFool]

I think the problem with taking general courses is a lot of them are excrement nonsense that nobody gives a freak about.

I agree there's some benefit in being well rounded, but when nobody takes it seriously or cares it's just a waste of time and money

The problem there lies with the student, not the coursework.

As I said, I really wish I'd have spent more effort in my accounting classes. I laughed right in my professor's face when he said someday I'd need what he was trying to teach. It turns out I need it quite often at work.

Beyond that, studies have shown that the sheer exposure to other disciplines makes you a better problem solver. Whether you realize it or not, you're being prepared to look at problems from different angles than you would with a more narrow educational view.

[Johnny English]

prepared to look at problems from different angles than you would with a more narrow educational view.

You do realise who you're talking to here, right?

[Badger]

No no no, this is the 21st century and YOU CAN BE ANYTHING YOU WANT TO BE IF YOU JUST WANT IT ENOUGH AND WORK HARD ENOUGH TO GET IT.

One of the most damaging pieces of propaganda peddled in years, IMO. There's nothing wrong with pursuing your dreams, but you can't do so to the exclusion of reality. I could have spent my entire existence since birth wanting to be an NBA power forward but no amount of wanting and working would make me a foot taller.

But even at 6'2" you'd be pretty small for a forward.

[SixFeetDeep]

Hahahahahah

[dcm1602]

You do realise who you're talking to here, right?

All the time and money I spent on college I think I know a thing or two about being educated from all different angles and views

[Miamipuck]

But even at 6'2" you'd be pretty small for a forward.

Hahaha

[Ignatius J Reilly]

All the time and money I spent on college I think I know a thing or two about being educated from all different angles and views

I think you know a thing or two about getting railed from all different angles and views.  Not so sure about the educated part.

[dcm1602]

I think you know a thing or two about getting railed from all different angles and views.  Not so sure about the educated part.

Let's keep what you me and Heismanberg do on the weekend private.

Thanks