Post by: Laxin on September 10, 2017, 03:18:11 PM
Browns: 0-3
49ers: 0-3
Chargers: 0-3
Colts: 1-2
Jets: 1-2
Bears: 1-2
Bills: 2-1
Jaguars: 2-1
Post by: Johnny English on September 10, 2017, 03:18:47 PM
I'll try and update this weekly. Hopefully there's a QB at the end of this excrement season.
Jets: 0-1
Browns: 0-1
Bears: 0-1
Bills: 1-0
Jaguars: 1-0
Patriots: 0-1
Rams: TBD
49ers: TBD
FYP
Post by: Heismanberg on September 10, 2017, 03:21:39 PM
Post by: d sw0rdz on September 10, 2017, 03:22:19 PM
FYP
brady falls off this year, pats end up with a better draft pick than us, draft sam darnold
Post by: Laxin on September 10, 2017, 03:32:47 PM
Bears obviously won't draft a QB, so I don't care about them.
I only care because they'd be a good target for a team (Bills?) to trade up with
Post by: bojanglesman on September 10, 2017, 03:37:26 PM
Post by: Johnny English on September 10, 2017, 03:40:53 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 10, 2017, 03:52:52 PM
Post by: Laxin on September 10, 2017, 04:43:45 PM
You might actually have to add the Colts to this list. Dear freak they look bad.
Damn. You're right... Colts looking horrible right now
Post by: Tommy on September 10, 2017, 05:36:01 PM
You might actually have to add the Colts to this list. Dear freak they look bad.
Which is ironic since they were the last team to tank for the top QB prospect.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 10, 2017, 06:21:49 PM
Which is ironic since they were the last team to tank for the top QB prospect.
I guess so if you don't factor in that he's hurt and can't play
Post by: reuben on September 10, 2017, 06:56:44 PM
Which is ironic since they were the last team to tank for the top QB prospect.
Any team that ruins a sure-fire prospect the way the Colts have ruined Luck should have their tank card revoked. No more first overalls, ever.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 10, 2017, 07:48:36 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on September 11, 2017, 11:42:49 AM
This actually would be a good year for the Colts to tank, too. They could trade down from a top-2 pick, pick up a bunch of picks, and finally build a roster around Luck.
Or draft a QB, trade Luck for picks, and build a strong contender in a few years.
Post by: Laxin on September 11, 2017, 12:36:27 PM
Jets @ Raiders
Browns @ Ravens
Bears @ Bucs
Jags vs Titans
Bills @ Panthers
Colts vs Cardinals
49ers @ Seahawks
Rams vs Redskins
Not sure I see a win in there...
Post by: Johnny English on September 11, 2017, 12:43:01 PM
Week 2 schedule for excrement teams:
Jets @ Raiders
Browns @ Ravens
Bears @ Bucs
Jags vs Titans
Bills @ Panthers
Colts vs Cardinals
49ers @ Seahawks
Rams vs Redskins
Not sure I see a win in there...
If you can't see the Browns beating the Ravens then you didn't watch any AFCN football yesterday. The Jags at home to Tennessee could easily go either way on yesterday's showing as well.
Post by: IATA on September 11, 2017, 12:46:48 PM
Post by: Laxin on September 11, 2017, 01:04:40 PM
If you can't see the Browns beating the Ravens then you didn't watch any AFCN football yesterday. The Jags at home to Tennessee could easily go either way on yesterday's showing as well.
I didn't watch any AFCN games... but I'd agree that those two are the two that I'd pick for potential wins.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 11, 2017, 03:15:18 PM
Post by: sg3 on September 11, 2017, 03:38:25 PM
Week 2 schedule for excrement teams:You forgot
Jets @ Raiders
Browns @ Ravens
Bears @ Bucs
Jags vs Titans
Bills @ Panthers
Colts vs Cardinals
49ers @ Seahawks
Rams vs Redskins
Not sure I see a win in there...
Patriots at SAINTS
Go Saints
Rip Brady's head off
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
Post by: Badger on September 11, 2017, 03:57:25 PM
Week 2 schedule for excrement teams:Jags and Rams could win.
Jets @ Raiders
Browns @ Ravens
Bears @ Bucs
Jags vs Titans
Bills @ Panthers
Colts vs Cardinals
49ers @ Seahawks
Rams vs Redskins
Not sure I see a win in there...
Post by: Heismanberg on September 11, 2017, 04:30:49 PM
Their running game might be the league's worst without DJ.
Post by: Badger on September 11, 2017, 04:58:16 PM
Cardinals are a team to watch here too...We should see if they want a completely washed up RB.
Their running game might be the league's worst without DJ.
Post by: Johnny English on September 11, 2017, 05:05:47 PM
We should see if they want a completely washed up RB.
To go with their completely washed up QB?
Post by: Laxin on September 17, 2017, 01:36:06 PM
Post by: Andrew Ryan on September 17, 2017, 03:05:10 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on September 17, 2017, 03:06:45 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 17, 2017, 03:09:28 PM
Colts-Cardinals going to overtime as Dawson misses the game-winner.
Post by: Laxin on September 17, 2017, 06:38:11 PM
Post by: Laxin on September 17, 2017, 07:38:42 PM
Rams @ 49ers
Jags vs Ravens
Browns @ Colts
Jets vs Dolphins
Bills vs Broncos
Bears vs Steelers
Bills and Bears will definitely take L's. Maybe the 49ers or Jags can manage a win.
Jay Ajayi will run all over us.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 17, 2017, 07:46:35 PM
Week 3:Cutler will pick us apart too. Jarvis Landry will get 100 yards.
Rams @ 49ers
Jags vs Ravens
Browns @ Colts
Jets vs Dolphins
Bills vs Broncos
Bears vs Steelers
Bills and Bears will definitely take L's. Maybe the 49ers or Jags can manage a win.
Jay Ajayi will run all over us.
Post by: Johnny English on September 17, 2017, 09:13:20 PM
Week 3:
Rams @ 49ers
Jags vs Ravens
Browns @ Colts
Jets vs Dolphins
Bills vs Broncos
Bears vs Steelers
Bills and Bears will definitely take L's. Maybe the 49ers or Jags can manage a win.
Jay Ajayi will run all over us.
The Rams are looking a little better, I would be surprised if they lost to the Niners.
I'm not concerned about the Bills. They're already effectively two games ahead of us.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 18, 2017, 11:47:42 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 18, 2017, 11:55:40 AM
Browns make me nervous. It's hard to out-Clevelend Cleveland.Browns aren't that terrible. Good chance they'll be favored in each of the next 3 weeks (at IND, vs CIN, vs NYJ).
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 18, 2017, 12:00:06 PM
One sleeper could be Chicago. They have a really tough schedule coming up. It could spiral out of control before they get their easiest games.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 18, 2017, 12:02:19 PM
Browns, Colts, Jets and 49ers all have winnable games next 3 weeks. That will largely determine the No. 1 pick.
One sleeper could be Chicago. They have a really tough schedule coming up. It could spiral out of control before they get their easiest games.
Sanchez will save us.
Post by: Laxin on September 18, 2017, 12:19:02 PM
Browns, Colts, Jets and 49ers all have winnable games next 3 weeks. That will largely determine the No. 1 pick.
One sleeper could be Chicago. They have a really tough schedule coming up. It could spiral out of control before they get their easiest games.
Yup. I think the 2 games vs the Jags and Browns are going to determine if the Jets get a top 2 pick.
After week 5, there's maybe 1 more winnable game on the schedule for the Jets.
If Duff is really dedicated to the tank, play McCown next week, if we lose, move to Hack for the Jags and Browns games. After that throw in Petty.
Post by: AlioTheFool on September 18, 2017, 12:20:55 PM
Yup. I think the 2 games vs the Jags and Browns are going to determine if the Jets get a top 2 pick.
After week 5, there's maybe 1 more winnable game on the schedule for the Jets.
If Duff is really dedicated to the tank, play McCown next week, if we lose, move to Hack for the Jags and Browns games. After that throw in Petty.
Petty should play before Hackenberg.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 18, 2017, 12:22:11 PM
Post by: Laxin on September 18, 2017, 01:02:35 PM
Petty should play before Hackenberg.
I agree based on merit... but concerning the tank, Hackenberg probably gives us the best chance to lose vs the Jags and Browns.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 18, 2017, 01:45:10 PM
I agree based on merit... but concerning the tank, Hackenberg probably gives us the best chance to lose vs the Jags and Browns.
Exactly. Down is up, out is in. Hackenberg is our formula for getting a top pick.
A friend, Jet fan, thinks Darnold would stay in college instead of come to the Jets. Any truth to that?
Post by: bojanglesman on September 18, 2017, 02:01:43 PM
Exactly. Down is up, out is in. Hackenberg is our formula for getting a top pick.If he plays well and is on track to be the number 1 overall pick, he'd be the dumbest man in America to stay in school unless he's one of those people who want to finish school for the academic part. Inherently the team picking #1 sucks. Waiting another year is almost all downside. Could get hurt, could play poorly, could risk all that and still get drafted by the Jets in 2019.
A friend, Jet fan, thinks Darnold would stay in college instead of come to the Jets. Any truth to that?
Post by: bojanglesman on September 18, 2017, 02:02:08 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on September 18, 2017, 02:06:37 PM
Double post.
1 from you is more than enough excrement for this forum.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 18, 2017, 02:48:29 PM
1 from you is more than enough excrement for this forum.Eat a dick, comb your mustache, and try on shoes.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 18, 2017, 03:06:31 PM
If he plays well and is on track to be the number 1 overall pick, he'd be the dumbest man in America to stay in school unless he's one of those people who want to finish school for the academic part. Inherently the team picking #1 sucks. Waiting another year is almost all downside. Could get hurt, could play poorly, could risk all that and still get drafted by the Jets in 2019.
I get all that, he heard or read somewhere that Darnold has said he doesn't want to come here. I've not seen that here or anywhere else, so I'm hoping he's mistaken. He listens to a lot of sports radio, which could be the problem.
Post by: Miamipuck on September 18, 2017, 03:10:08 PM
Eat a dick, comb your mustache, and try on shoes.
1. Jump on a plate.
2. Nah I just trimmed it.
3. Wearing sneakers.
Post by: Miamipuck on September 18, 2017, 03:14:33 PM
I get all that, he heard or read somewhere that Darnold has said he doesn't want to come here. I've not seen that here or anywhere else, so I'm hoping he's mistaken. He listens to a lot of sports radio, which could be the problem.
Schefter reported that he would stay in school, he mentioned the Jets with a #1 pick and playing in Florham Park. The Jets weren't specifically mentioned by a player the report it was Schefter being a huge queynte and just guessing....you know the usual Jets bashing.
If Darnold doesn't want to play for the Jets that would be a first. Peyton not picking the Jets was because of Parcells ego not the Jets specifically.
Basically, if Darnold doesn't want to play in New York, than he's a giant freaking moron and I hope he ruins his shoulder the first game of his pro career.
Post by: Johnny English on September 18, 2017, 03:41:26 PM
On the same topic, did anyone else see Manish's latest missive? Even by his desperately low standards, the quality of writing here is astonishingly bad.
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/jets/49ers-steal-usc-qb-sam-darnold-jets-2018-draft-article-1.3503404
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 18, 2017, 03:57:20 PM
This is why I just watch the games now and don't get wrapped up in this excrement.
Post by: Miamipuck on September 18, 2017, 04:58:32 PM
Schefter's stuff came on top of an interview Darnold did a few weeks back where he refused to be drawn on whether he intended to declare in 2018, so of course the talking heads turned it into "DARNOLD WILL STAY IN SCHOOL TO AVOID BEING DRAFTED BY THE JETS".
On the same topic, did anyone else see Manish's latest missive? Even by his desperately low standards, the quality of writing here is astonishingly bad.
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/jets/49ers-steal-usc-qb-sam-darnold-jets-2018-draft-article-1.3503404
Holy cow that might possibly be the single worst written article I have ever read in a major paper. That was even worse than the tripe Serbe writes.
Post by: Badger on September 19, 2017, 07:31:56 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on September 19, 2017, 09:01:58 PM
https://www.ganggreennation.com/2017/9/19/16334904/espn-gives-the-jets-a-40-chance-of-getting-top-overall-pick-in-2018-nfl-draft
While having a 40% chance of getting the 1st overall pick is exceptional (all things considering), their point that the chances are 60% that the Jets wont get the first overall pick is depressing.
The thought of the Jets getting a QB with the potential to be a franchise QB is what makes this season bearable
Post by: bojanglesman on September 19, 2017, 09:32:00 PM
The Jets will find 4 wins and it won't be enough for number 1 overall.
Post by: d sw0rdz on September 20, 2017, 12:33:12 AM
There is a zero percent chance the Jets finish with the worst record this year. Can't hang your hat on the tank. This team is trying and the offense, by some miracle, isn't historically bad. I just don't think the defense can continue being gashed by the run this bad, especially seeing that we faces 2 of the best RBs in the league in 2 weeks.
The Jets will find 4 wins and it won't be enough for number 1 overall.
we have some extra ammunition to move up if it came down to this
i don't know how the value pans out, but a top 2-4 pick and 2 2nd rounders could be enough to move up to the top spot in theory, if there is a guy we really want
i just don't see us making a move like that with all the holes we have on the team
Post by: Fenwyr on September 20, 2017, 12:43:44 AM
I'm not in his head, but that seems like an attractive option for him.
Post by: ScotlandJet on September 20, 2017, 04:11:47 AM
There is a zero percent chance the Jets finish with the worst record this year. Can't hang your hat on the tank. This team is trying and the offense, by some miracle, isn't historically bad. I just don't think the defense can continue being gashed by the run this bad, especially seeing that we faces 2 of the best RBs in the league in 2 weeks.
The Jets will find 4 wins and it won't be enough for number 1 overall.
Oh god this is depressing. The Jets being the Jets this is a very likely outcome.
Post by: ukilledkenny on September 20, 2017, 04:45:56 AM
There is a zero percent chance the Jets finish with the worst record this year. Can't hang your hat on the tank. This team is trying and the offense, by some miracle, isn't historically bad. I just don't think the defense can continue being gashed by the run this bad, especially seeing that we faces 2 of the best RBs in the league in 2 weeks.
The Jets will find 4 wins and it won't be enough for number 1 overall.
They just need one game where the wheels fall off to break their spirit. It's coming. Remember, despite trying and not being as bad we thought they still never really had a shot in either.game so.far.
Post by: Laxin on September 20, 2017, 07:03:22 AM
2018 1st, 2nd
2019 1st, 3rd
The most recent trade to the 1st overall pick was the Rams and Titans in 2016.
Rams gave up:
2016 1st (15), 2nd, 2nd, 3rd
2017, 1st, 3rd
Rams received:
2016 1st (1), 4th, 6th
Tbh, I'd definitely do that for Darnold... I think he'll be the next top 3-4 QB a la Peyton, Brady, Rodgers, Brees. We'd still have a complete draft this year too.
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 07:30:51 AM
I have a hypothetical for you guys- lets say the Jets finish 4-12 with the 4th pick, the Bears land the 1st overall pick and a clearly looking to move down. What would you give up to move up to that pick?
2018 1st, 2nd
2019 1st, 3rd
The most recent trade to the 1st overall pick was the Rams and Titans in 2016.
Rams gave up:
2016 1st (15), 2nd, 2nd, 3rd
2017, 1st, 3rd
Rams received:
2016 1st (1), 4th, 6th
Tbh, I'd definitely do that for Darnold... I think he'll be the next top 3-4 QB a la Peyton, Brady, Rodgers, Brees. We'd still have a complete draft this year too.
The Bills and the Browns each have 2 first round picks in next years' draft. Let's hope we don't have to trade up, because there's a solid chance we'll be outbid.
Post by: Laxin on September 20, 2017, 07:43:28 AM
The Bills and the Browns each have 2 first round picks in next years' draft. Let's hope we don't have to trade up, because there's a solid chance we'll be outbid.
I forgot about Cleveland having two 1st... how do they always have so many damn picks.
Maybe Cleveland gets the 2nd pick and is happy with Rosen?
But yeah, the best chance the Jets have at getting Darnold (or Rosen) is securing that 1st or 2nd pick themselves. Next 3 weeks will be huge.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 20, 2017, 07:47:38 AM
The Bills and the Browns each have 2 first round picks in next years' draft. Let's hope we don't have to trade up, because there's a solid chance we'll be outbid.
This is the problem with hoping for the tank this year (or any year). Unless there are 2-3 elite QB prospects, the Jets HAVE to finish dead last. Otherwise they will likely be outbid for the number one spot. Right now it's Darnold and then a dropoff. If he even comes out. Don't know what Rosen is yet.
I just don't think the Jets are the worst team this year.
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 08:51:28 AM
This is the problem with hoping for the tank this year (or any year). Unless there are 2-3 elite QB prospects, the Jets HAVE to finish dead last. Otherwise they will likely be outbid for the number one spot. Right now it's Darnold and then a dropoff. If he even comes out. Don't know what Rosen is yet.
I just don't think the Jets are the worst team this year.
Our tank is clearly dependent on how long McCown lasts before getting injured (and he will...he's pushing 40). I'm surprised he's lasted this long behind our oline.
I think the Jets are in the bottom 3 for shittiest teams in the league.
EDIT: Also...our sched is ridiculous. Playing the NFC south this year will help the tank.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 20, 2017, 09:01:26 AM
Our tank is clearly dependent on how long McCown lasts before getting injured (and he will...he's pushing 40). I'm surprised he's lasted this long behind our oline.
I think the Jets are in the bottom 3 for shittiest teams in the league.
EDIT: Also...our sched is ridiculous. Playing the NFC south this year will help the tank.
We have a stretch of 3 games that are all winnable coming up. Of course, all losable too. After that, it's a beast with the exception of Miami and Buffalo again.
I think we aren't in the discussion for # 1 overall unless the Jets win at most 2 games. As tough as the schedule is, there are about 5 winnable games left. And there's always the possibility of sneaking a win against a team like the Chargers.
I'm just going to keep pulling for the Jets to keep fighting and showing signs of improvement, regardless of the score or number of wins. I really don't want to see a team with 3-4 wins that is mailing it in at the end of the season. Hoping for the perfect scenario to get Darnold is a pipe dream.
Post by: sg3 on September 20, 2017, 09:23:35 AM
2. We won't get the #1
3. There are at least 2, prolly 3 better QBs than the next Mark Sanchez from USC
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 09:31:24 AM
1. We don't need the #1
2. We won't get the #1
3. There are at least 2, prolly 3 better QBs than the next Mark Sanchez from USC
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
thanks for your uninformed opinion.
Post by: Heismanberg on September 20, 2017, 09:34:59 AM
3. There are at least 2, prolly 3 better QBs than the next Mark Sanchez from USC
Name them then. Willing to bet that you can't.
Post by: Johnny English on September 20, 2017, 09:54:10 AM
We have a stretch of 3 games that are all winnable coming up.
I'm curious what you've seen in the first two weeks that makes you think that this team is capable of winning an NFL game.
Post by: Heismanberg on September 20, 2017, 09:57:13 AM
I'm curious what you've seen in the first two weeks that makes you think that this team is capable of winning an NFL game.
Blake Bortles can certainly lose a game for Jacksonville. Cleveland's QB situation is murky as well.
Those are the only two games that I see us potentially winning and even those will be tough ones for us.
Post by: Johnny English on September 20, 2017, 10:01:37 AM
Blake Bortles can certainly lose a game for Jacksonville. Cleveland's QB situation is murky as well.
Those are the only two games that I see us potentially winning and even those will be tough ones for us.
Sure, but both of those teams have good defenses that will cause our line real problems. So far we have all been pleasantly surprised that the Jets' offense isn't quite as bad as we expected or feared it was going to be, but at the same time it has only produced anything for short periods of the first two games and shown an inability to respond to defensive adjustments.
NFL history will tell us that the chances are pretty good of us running into a team at some point in the season who has a really bad day all around and makes a couple of critically timed errors that we manage to capitalise on, but I can't look at any of the games on our schedule and tell you that I think we have a chance of winning them without a huge amount of help from the opposition. The idea of winning three on the bounce is comical.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 20, 2017, 10:02:50 AM
I'm curious what you've seen in the first two weeks that makes you think that this team is capable of winning an NFL game.
The offense looked competent against a good defense last week. As bad as the run defense is, at least it was against elite running backs with very good offensive lines. Special teams has been pretty good minus Kalif Raymond, who is out on his derriere now.
By winnable, I mean that we have a decent chance. Not that we are favored. Particularly against the Jags and Browns. Us playing the Falcons or Pats is not winnable. I'm certainly not saying we have a good chance to win all 3. Both have shittier QB situations that ours right now. You never know what you are going to get with Cutler. He might excrement the bed or pick us apart.
I'm not pretending the Jets are an average team. But Cleveland and the Jags are not good at all.
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 10:41:09 AM
The offense looked competent against a good defense last week. As bad as the run defense is, at least it was against elite running backs with very good offensive lines. Special teams has been pretty good minus Kalif Raymond, who is out on his derriere now.
By winnable, I mean that we have a decent chance. Not that we are favored. Particularly against the Jags and Browns. Us playing the Falcons or Pats is not winnable. I'm certainly not saying we have a good chance to win all 3. Both have shittier QB situations that ours right now. You never know what you are going to get with Cutler. He might excrement the bed or pick us apart.
I'm not pretending the Jets are an average team. But Cleveland and the Jags are not good at all.
the Jags ran Fournette thru a formidable Texans D on the road. They're not gonna win a superbowl this year, but the Jags are in better shape than us.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 20, 2017, 10:57:55 AM
the Jags ran Fournette thru a formidable Texans D on the road. They're not gonna win a superbowl this year, but the Jags are in better shape than us.
The Jets held Lynch in check this past week. He didn't beat them, the other RBs did. Fournette can be stopped. Or not, we'll see.
Overall, yeah they are a better team. QB has a way of freaking things up for the whole team though.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 20, 2017, 11:23:32 AM
Post by: ScotlandJet on September 20, 2017, 12:05:15 PM
I'm curious what you've seen in the first two weeks that makes you think that this team is capable of winning an NFL game.I'm hanging my hat on this; I can't see anything to even be remotely confident about a win.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 20, 2017, 12:19:20 PM
I really don't want the Jets to have the ignominy of going 0-16. Ideally, we go 1-15 and get the No. 1 pick.
Would you rather go 0-16 and get the No. 1 pick or 1-15 and get the No. 2 pick?
Post by: Johnny English on September 20, 2017, 12:19:44 PM
Just because teams are better than us doesn't mean we can't beat them. The Jets can absolutely beat the Browns, Jaguars, Bills, and Dolphins. They will be underdogs in all of those games, but that doesn't mean they can't pull out a win or two. Even against one of the tougher opponents we'll face, it's not impossible. There have been bigger upsets.
I don't think that what you're talking about is the Jets beating anyone though; what we're all effectively relying on is that an opposing team fucks up enough that we are able to take advantage of it. I don't think that this team has the talent or maybe the coaching to be able to beat any current NFL team through superior talent or planning; we're entirely dependent upon someone else's failure to execute, because we're not good enough to cause that failure ourselves.
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 12:27:47 PM
Just because teams are better than us doesn't mean we can't beat them. The Jets can absolutely beat the Browns, Jaguars, Bills, and Dolphins. They will be underdogs in all of those games, but that doesn't mean they can't pull out a win or two. Even against one of the tougher opponents we'll face, it's not impossible. There have been bigger upsets.
lol
Todd Bowles says hi.
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 12:28:44 PM
I'm curious what others think about this...
I really don't want the Jets to have the ignominy of going 0-16. Ideally, we go 1-15 and get the No. 1 pick.
Would you rather go 0-16 and get the No. 1 pick or 1-15 and get the No. 2 pick?
I want the #1 pick. This season needs to ripped off like a bandaid. Just get us thru it.
Post by: Laxin on September 20, 2017, 12:28:58 PM
I'm curious what others think about this...
I really don't want the Jets to have the ignominy of going 0-16. Ideally, we go 1-15 and get the No. 1 pick.
Would you rather go 0-16 and get the No. 1 pick or 1-15 and get the No. 2 pick?
0-16
Darnold is worth it. And if he doesn't come out, the drop off from Rosen to the next QB is pretty big right now.
I think Darnold gives us the best chance of winning a SB in the next decade+. I don't care if we go 0-16, give me the best chance to win a SB.
Post by: Johnny English on September 20, 2017, 12:32:00 PM
I'm curious what others think about this...
I really don't want the Jets to have the ignominy of going 0-16. Ideally, we go 1-15 and get the No. 1 pick.
Would you rather go 0-16 and get the No. 1 pick or 1-15 and get the No. 2 pick?
0-16 or 1-15 makes no difference to me. I want the #1 pick. People laughed at Detroit for going 0-16 but they're not laughing at them now because they turned it into a QB who I hate, but seems to be widely respected across the league. Let's be honest, people laugh at the Jets now. We're the little brother. We're the comical side of the Patriots' rivalry. We're the buttfumble team. You think people won't laugh at us for going 1-15?
Give me the #1 pick. I don't care how we get there.
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 12:36:11 PM
0-16 or 1-15 makes no difference to me. I want the #1 pick. People laughed at Detroit for going 0-16 but they're not laughing at them now because they turned it into a QB who I hate, but seems to be widely respected across the league. Let's be honest, people laugh at the Jets now. We're the little brother. We're the comical side of the Patriots' rivalry. We're the buttfumble team. You think people won't laugh at us for going 1-15?
Give me the #1 pick. I don't care how we get there.
I'm with you on this (although, I don't give a excrement about Stafford either way).
I'm going to take it a step further. I want the #1 pick with a better coach. Todd Ballz isn't the guy to lead this team, and i'll even go as far as to say I'm unsure if the Duff should be retained either.
Post by: d sw0rdz on September 20, 2017, 12:41:41 PM
I'm curious what others think about this...
I really don't want the Jets to have the ignominy of going 0-16. Ideally, we go 1-15 and get the No. 1 pick.
Would you rather go 0-16 and get the No. 1 pick or 1-15 and get the No. 2 pick?
definitely 0-16 if it turns into a substantial player for us in the future. nobody will remember the 0-16 that it took to get there
Post by: d sw0rdz on September 20, 2017, 12:43:24 PM
0-16 or 1-15 makes no difference to me. I want the #1 pick. People laughed at Detroit for going 0-16 but they're not laughing at them now because they turned it into a QB who I hate, but seems to be widely respected across the league. Let's be honest, people laugh at the Jets now. We're the little brother. We're the comical side of the Patriots' rivalry. We're the buttfumble team. You think people won't laugh at us for going 1-15?
Give me the #1 pick. I don't care how we get there.
i hate you JE. we're not the buttfumble team
(tbh do any of you still get excrement from friends/colleagues who are fans of other teams about the buttfumble? i still do, not as much but it still happens)
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 12:44:10 PM
i hate you JE. we're not the buttfumble team
(tbh do any of you still get excrement from friends/colleagues who are fans of other teams about the buttfumble? i still do, not as much but it still happens)
I don't...but I don't live in NY. It's great.
Post by: Johnny English on September 20, 2017, 12:49:54 PM
I'm with you on this (although, I don't give a excrement about Stafford either way).
I'm going to take it a step further. I want the #1 pick with a better coach. Todd Ballz isn't the guy to lead this team, and i'll even go as far as to say I'm unsure if the Duff should be retained either.
I'm not convinced at all by Bowles and I won't be too upset if he goes at the end of the season. I'd give Maccagnan the chance to hire his own guy though, unless we could actually get a premier HC who wanted roster control. That list probably starts and stops at Harbaugh though, which is a pipe dream that stands almost zero chance of happening.
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 12:53:38 PM
I'm not convinced at all by Bowles and I won't be too upset if he goes at the end of the season. I'd give Maccagnan the chance to hire his own guy though, unless we could actually get a premier HC who wanted roster control. That list probably starts and stops at Harbaugh though, which is a pipe dream that stands almost zero chance of happening.
I figured Duff would get a pass for this season basically for the reason you mentioned, so he could hire his own guy. But if Woody isn't involved with the evaluations after the season, Duff could get the axe too. Chris may want to hire his own guy.
Post by: Johnny English on September 20, 2017, 12:56:34 PM
I figured Duff would get a pass for this season basically for the reason you mentioned, so he could hire his own guy. But if Woody isn't involved with the evaluations after the season, Duff could get the axe too. Chris may want to hire his own guy.
Possibly, but given Maccagnan has built this roster, knows what he saw in those players and knows their strengths and weaknesses, I think it makes a lot of sense for him to hire the coach best suited to get the best out of them.
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 12:58:48 PM
Possibly, but given Maccagnan has built this roster, knows what he saw in those players and knows their strengths and weaknesses, I think it makes a lot of sense for him to hire the coach best suited to get the best out of them.
it's going to be interesting to see how this unfolds. Especially if we're 2 or 3 months in without a win.
Just out of curiosity, when is Duff's contract up?
Post by: bojanglesman on September 20, 2017, 01:07:00 PM
it's going to be interesting to see how this unfolds. Especially if we're 2 or 3 months in without a win.
Just out of curiosity, when is Duff's contract up?
Whenever he gets fired.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 20, 2017, 01:07:23 PM
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 01:10:43 PM
Awful early to be talking about firing people. A lot can change in a few months.
It's never too early.
In fact...we're a season too late on the HC.
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 01:12:39 PM
Whenever he gets fired.
the billboard should be going up soon.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 20, 2017, 01:27:38 PM
the billboard should be going up soon.The last billboard worked out great.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 20, 2017, 01:39:01 PM
Post by: Johnny English on September 20, 2017, 01:53:22 PM
I don't see the point in going full rebuild and keeping around the old staff (or part of the old staff). That's where we fucked up with Tannenbaum/Rex and Rex/Idzik. I actually like Duff and Bowles, I really do, but they haven't shown me anything that would make me say they should keep their jobs. Only valid reason to keep them I can think of is if there isn't anyone better available to bring in.
I think Maccagnan has done a good job in FA, and as I said in an earlier post I'm not convinced that the players he has drafted have been bad choices, I just think they might have been badly coached.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 20, 2017, 01:57:48 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on September 20, 2017, 02:04:38 PM
I'm curious what you've seen in the first two weeks that makes you think that this team is capable of winning an NFL game.
Seacaucus.
Post by: Miamipuck on September 20, 2017, 02:07:25 PM
I'm hanging my hat on this; I can't see anything to even be remotely confident about a win.
Yeah your going to hang onto that premise like it's a giant black roster, like the light in the loafers Scottish fairy you are.
Post by: Miamipuck on September 20, 2017, 02:11:15 PM
0-16 or 1-15 makes no difference to me. I want the #1 pick. People laughed at Detroit for going 0-16 but they're not laughing at them now because they turned it into a QB who I hate, but seems to be widely respected across the league. Let's be honest, people laugh at the Jets now. We're the little brother. We're the comical side of the Patriots' rivalry. We're the buttfumble team. You think people won't laugh at us for going 1-15?
Give me the #1 pick. I don't care how we get there.
Stafford would be the best QB the Jets have had since Namath and quite honestly he's a 2nd tier QB at best, he's not elite. I hope if Darnold comes out, he has more potential than that.
Post by: Badger on September 20, 2017, 03:23:06 PM
I don't live in NY. It's great.
Lying.
Post by: AlioTheFool on September 20, 2017, 06:42:33 PM
I can't see how Bowles survives this. Even if he doesn't deserve it (though I think he does) if this team wins less than 4 games he's gone. My stance on Maccagnan is: he should probably be allowed to hire his own HC before getting fired, but I don't feel he's the guy I'd trust with a #1 pick. Though if Darnold declares, it's a no brainer, and maybe he should be allowed to stay.
Post by: d sw0rdz on September 20, 2017, 06:52:56 PM
If my only choices are 1-15 or 0-16, my pick would be zero wins. I want to win every game, but if you guarantee me this team can't win more than one, then I'd rather assure the #1 pick with no wins. If they can win one and still get the top pick, I'll take that option though.
I can't see how Bowles survives this. Even if he doesn't deserve it (though I think he does) if this team wins less than 4 games he's gone. My stance on Maccagnan is: he should probably be allowed to hire his own HC before getting fired, but I don't feel he's the guy I'd trust with a #1 pick. Though if Darnold declares, it's a no brainer, and maybe he should be allowed to stay.
the 'lay of the blame' for what will undoubtedly be the failure of this year is a tricky situation. on the one hand you can argue that bowles hasn't done/shown much in his time here as a coach. for whatever reasons, however, he was highly thought of by those who know him and have worked with him before he came here.
on the other hand, you can make a very strong argument that, irrespective of bowles' inadequacies as a coach, he is just working with a excrement roster, one put together by duff.
i'm not sure of what the best way of going about this is, but do feel that somebody is going to have to pay for this season, and like you feel that it will be bowles that is likelier to pay. i just don't understand the message we'd be sending by the firing, though. say he wins 0-2 games, and gets fired...what were we expecting from him? we are all expecting that amount of wins based on talent alone from this team anyways. would a great coach/perfect coaching take this team to 4-6 wins? is that what we want from bowles to justify him being able to stay, and why anything less, even though it is what we expect from the team, is reason enough to axe him
Post by: Libero_2 on September 20, 2017, 06:55:23 PM
If my only choices are 1-15 or 0-16, my pick would be zero wins. I want to win every game, but if you guarantee me this team can't win more than one, then I'd rather assure the #1 pick with no wins. If they can win one and still get the top pick, I'll take that option though.
I can't see how Bowles survives this. Even if he doesn't deserve it (though I think he does) if this team wins less than 4 games he's gone. My stance on Maccagnan is: he should probably be allowed to hire his own HC before getting fired, but I don't feel he's the guy I'd trust with a #1 pick. Though if Darnold declares, it's a no brainer, and maybe he should be allowed to stay.
Sure that's a no brainier. But does he have the chops to build an offense with playmakers around Darnold with the rest of the draft? Hell if we get the #1, I wouldn't be upset at all to use every pick we have left on offense to rebuild the OL and playmakers. I'd be fine with a excrement defense if we could build a young offense around "our guy"
Name the offensive player Duff has drafted in 3 years that has you truly intrigued? Maybe Ardarius Stewart?
Post by: AlioTheFool on September 20, 2017, 07:12:27 PM
the 'lay of the blame' for what will undoubtedly be the failure of this year is a tricky situation. on the one hand you can argue that bowles hasn't done/shown much in his time here as a coach. for whatever reasons, however, he was highly thought of by those who know him and have worked with him before he came here.
on the other hand, you can make a very strong argument that, irrespective of bowles' inadequacies as a coach, he is just working with a excrement roster, one put together by duff.
i'm not sure of what the best way of going about this is, but do feel that somebody is going to have to pay for this season, and like you feel that it will be bowles that is likelier to pay. i just don't understand the message we'd be sending by the firing, though. say he wins 0-2 games, and gets fired...what were we expecting from him? we are all expecting that amount of wins based on talent alone from this team anyways. would a great coach/perfect coaching take this team to 4-6 wins? is that what we want from bowles to justify him being able to stay, and why anything less, even though it is what we expect from the team, is reason enough to axe him
Bowles is a poor in-game coach. He came highly touted, but as a defensive coordinator. Some guys are great coordinators but aren't cut out to run the whole operation.
The key is how the team comes along over the course of the year. Right now, his defense looks very lackluster. That's his unit, which apart from the safeties and Williams doesn't look like much.
Maccagnan certainly holds his share of blame for packing 10 pounds of excrement into a 5lb bag on this roster, but Bowles isn't doing anything to help his own case.
Sure that's a no brainier. But does he have the chops to build an offense with playmakers around Darnold with the rest of the draft? Hell if we get the #1, I wouldn't be upset at all to use every pick we have left on offense to rebuild the OL and playmakers. I'd be fine with a excrement defense if we could build a young offense around "our guy"
Name the offensive player Duff has drafted in 3 years that has you truly intrigued? Maybe Ardarius Stewart?
I've been advocating for years to use at least the first 3 picks, preferably more, on offense. I don't give a damn about drafting yet another "potential shut down corner", I want guys who can make plays with the ball in their hands.
Like you said, maybe Stewart is intriguing, and I'm still holding out hope that one of the QBs progresses, but otherwise he has yet to show me he can find playmakers.
Post by: MBGreen on September 20, 2017, 07:55:16 PM
no...you're lying.
Lying.
Post by: Laxin on September 20, 2017, 08:16:05 PM
I've been advocating for years to use at least the first 3 picks, preferably more, on offense. I don't give a damn about drafting yet another "potential shut down corner", I want guys who can make plays with the ball in their hands.
Like you said, maybe Stewart is intriguing, and I'm still holding out hope that one of the QBs progresses, but otherwise he has yet to show me he can find playmakers.
Im with you 100% on drafting for offense, and wishing that was the case for what seems like an eternity.
I think its early to tell whether or not Duff can identify playmakers, or offensive talent in general. If stewart can be a #2 or dynamic #3, along with Shell as a long term answer at RT, I think that's a decent resume to start. Devin Smith and Hackenberg seem like busts so far. Smith may mostly be due to injury, which in many cases is entirely unpredictable.
This is going to be a huge offseason for whoever is GM. They are going to be expected to find a franchise QB, and surround them with talent (WR, OL, RB). Luckily, this draft has a ton of good RB options, and is relatively deep at OL.
Post by: Johnny English on September 20, 2017, 10:00:00 PM
I don't give a damn about drafting yet another "potential shut down corner", I want guys who can make plays with the ball in their hands.
This is an impressively short sentence in which to contradict yourself.
Post by: Fenwyr on September 21, 2017, 10:12:50 AM
I have a hypothetical for you guys- lets say the Jets finish 4-12 with the 4th pick, the Bears land the 1st overall pick and a clearly looking to move down. What would you give up to move up to that pick?We'll be finishing with the 4th pick at worst. The 4th pick in rounds 1, 2, 3 would get it done.
2018 1st, 2nd
2019 1st, 3rd
The most recent trade to the 1st overall pick was the Rams and Titans in 2016.
Rams gave up:
2016 1st (15), 2nd, 2nd, 3rd
2017, 1st, 3rd
Rams received:
2016 1st (1), 4th, 6th
Tbh, I'd definitely do that for Darnold... I think he'll be the next top 3-4 QB a la Peyton, Brady, Rodgers, Brees. We'd still have a complete draft this year too.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 21, 2017, 10:17:37 AM
We'll be finishing with the 4th pick at worst. The 4th pick in rounds 1, 2, 3 would get it done.You think the 1st, 2nd and 3rd-round picks would be enough to move from 4 to 1? Recent history says that's not close to enough.
Post by: MBGreen on September 21, 2017, 10:33:07 AM
You think the 1st, 2nd and 3rd-round picks would be enough to move from 4 to 1? Recent history says that's not close to enough.
I mentioned it earlier in the thread. With teams like the Browns/Bills sporting 2 first round picks this year....Fenwyr's suggestion won't even make it to the bargaining table.
Post by: Fenwyr on September 21, 2017, 10:35:07 AM
You think the 1st, 2nd and 3rd-round picks would be enough to move from 4 to 1? Recent history says that's not close to enough.Laxin just quoted history. Moving down to 15 requires alot more encouragement than moving down to 4.
To be honest, it's all hypothetical, and it all depends on who is in front of us.
The only way we are stuck at 4 is if our OL and D improve drastically over the course of the season, which I think they will. If they don't, we'll have the first pick anyway.
Post by: AlioTheFool on September 21, 2017, 11:32:36 AM
This is an impressively short sentence in which to contradict yourself.
Haha, you're right.
And yet it's still somewhat valid. When was the last time the Jets drafted a corner who made plays with the ball in his hands? When was the last time the Jets even signed one? Revis and Cromartie?
Jokes aside, I assume you still understood the actual point. This team keeps drafting defenders and completely ignoring the offense until Saturday afternoon. It's infuriating that in a pass-driven league, this team constantly ignores the most important positions dedicated to that facet of the game.
Post by: Miamipuck on September 21, 2017, 12:58:53 PM
Haha, you're right.
And yet it's still somewhat valid. When was the last time the Jets drafted a corner who made plays with the ball in his hands? When was the last time the Jets even signed one? Revis and Cromartie?
Jokes aside, I assume you still understood the actual point. This team keeps drafting defenders and completely ignoring the offense until Saturday afternoon. It's infuriating that in a pass-driven league, this team constantly ignores the most important positions dedicated to that facet of the game.
Never assume anything with that English runt.
Post by: sg3 on September 21, 2017, 01:48:43 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 21, 2017, 02:00:04 PM
Deleted
Delete your account.
Post by: Laxin on September 28, 2017, 05:07:28 PM
Browns vs Bengals
49ers @ Cardinals
Chargers vs Eagles
Colts @ Seahawks
Jets vs Jags
Bears @ Packers
Bills @ Falcons
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 28, 2017, 06:39:19 PM
Post by: MexJetinBcn on September 29, 2017, 06:34:46 AM
Browns and 9ers def have a shot this week
Actually we might be the ones with the best shot this week... :-\
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 29, 2017, 08:34:04 AM
Actually we might be the ones with the best shot this week... :-\Browns-Bengals is guaranteed a win from someone. Still rooting for Cleveland there, but Cincinnati is a mess.
Post by: Fenwyr on September 29, 2017, 10:13:20 AM
Browns and 9ers def have a shot this weekBrowns maybe, but Cincy needs the win big time.
49ers don't have a chance against the Cards.
Post by: Fenwyr on September 29, 2017, 10:15:21 AM
Actually we might be the ones with the best shot this week... :-\Pretty much. It's amazing how many shitty teams there are this year.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 29, 2017, 10:17:42 AM
Browns maybe, but Cincy needs the win big time.
49ers don't have a chance against the Cards.
9ers looked good against the Rams, zona hasn’t impressed me from what I’ve seen. Although I would be shocked if Andre Ellington doesn’t go off this game
Post by: steves850 on September 29, 2017, 10:47:37 AM
49ers don't have a chance against the Cards.
This is a coinflip game. 9ers look like they're approving and the Cards look shaky as freak. Would you honestly be shocked if the 49ers win?
Post by: Fenwyr on September 30, 2017, 06:51:06 PM
This is a coinflip game. 9ers look like they're approving and the Cards look shaky as freak. Would you honestly be shocked if the 49ers win?On paper the Cards are a much better team. They are at home. But nothing would shock me.
Post by: Fenwyr on September 30, 2017, 06:53:11 PM
Post by: sg3 on September 30, 2017, 06:55:59 PM
By the way, freak tanking. I finally got to see a full game of Darnold, and he sucked balls.Agree
Looked more like the second coming of Mark Sanchez, not Peyton Manning with a number of throws into coverage
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
Post by: bojanglesman on September 30, 2017, 07:07:58 PM
Post by: Laxin on September 30, 2017, 08:00:15 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on September 30, 2017, 08:10:15 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on September 30, 2017, 09:33:50 PM
"I watched Sam Darnold one time when both of his starting tackles were out. He sucks!"
Funny they missed the bowl game last year, a game where he consistently (yes way more than 1 throw) made throws 75% of NFL QB's couldn't make in their dreams.
Post by: MBGreen on September 30, 2017, 09:42:27 PM
"I watched Sam Darnold one time when both of his starting tackles were out. He sucks!"the sg3 report
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 01, 2017, 08:21:44 AM
Post by: MexJetinBcn on October 01, 2017, 03:54:36 PM
Post by: sg3 on October 01, 2017, 04:03:14 PM
the sg3 report
Please get off my case
Thank you
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
Post by: MBGreen on October 01, 2017, 04:06:36 PM
A funny from M***n B******eI wasn't being funny...just agreeing with the fact you have zero idea of what your talking about.
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
you should probably get a clue before commenting on a college player you've never seen play.
Post by: Fenwyr on October 01, 2017, 04:15:33 PM
Ryan Leaf.
I will watch more, and give him a chance, but damn that was bad.
Post by: MBGreen on October 01, 2017, 04:18:14 PM
I don't care if he had a pop warner OL. His decisions were consistantly terrible.lol...id hate to see what you "not giving someone a chance" looks like.
Ryan Leaf.
I will watch more, and give him a chance, but damn that was bad.
Ryan Leaf....gtfo
Post by: Heismanberg on October 01, 2017, 04:37:34 PM
Ryan Leaf
freak off
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 01, 2017, 04:52:51 PM
I don't care if he had a pop warner OL. His decisions were consistantly terrible.
Ryan Leaf.
I will watch more, and give him a chance, but damn that was bad.
I...what?
Post by: sg3 on October 01, 2017, 04:53:07 PM
I wasn't being funny...just agreeing with the fact you have zero idea of what your talking about.Seen him about 6 times. I'd list him 3rd or 4th on the QB 2018 list.
you should probably get a clue before commenting on a college player you've never seen play.
Of course, I can't compete with the Holy Trinity of draft experts
Kiper
You and
McShay
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
Post by: MBGreen on October 01, 2017, 04:57:29 PM
Seen him about 6 times. I'd list him 3rd or 4th on the QB 2018 list.
Of course, I can't compete with the Holy Trinity of draft experts
Kiper
You and
McShay
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
good....then kindly stfu.
Post by: Badger on October 01, 2017, 09:34:19 PM
I...what?
Sheldon Richardson
Post by: sg3 on October 02, 2017, 05:00:42 AM
Right after you do the same
good....then kindly stfu.
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
Post by: Miamipuck on October 02, 2017, 09:12:47 AM
Right after you do the same
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
So you both are going to yapping at each other like 2 chihuahuas in a woman's purse........ freaking wonderful.
Post by: ScotlandJet on October 02, 2017, 09:20:48 AM
So you both are going to yapping at each other like 2 chihuahuas in a woman's purse........ freaking wonderful.
Oh Yes! The Jets become relevant for a weekend and suddenly our resident village idiot discovers his mojo.
Post by: MBGreen on October 02, 2017, 09:40:47 AM
Right after you do the same
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
You're already on thin ice. I'd suggest taking a different attitude.
Post by: sg3 on October 02, 2017, 10:23:40 AM
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 02, 2017, 10:26:12 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 02, 2017, 10:49:49 AM
Win games.
Post by: sg3 on October 02, 2017, 12:45:27 PM
So if there was a tank in progress I'd embrace it instead of being miserable with a terrible season, but if we're going to be competitive and win games, good, f*ck it. And f*ck New England too, while we're at it.Amen
Lets Go Jets
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
Post by: Badger on October 02, 2017, 01:36:05 PM
Oh Yes! The Jets become relevant for a weekend and suddenly our resident village idiot discovers his mojo.Which village idiot?
Post by: MBGreen on October 02, 2017, 01:49:17 PM
Which village idiot?
Todd Bowles
Post by: bojanglesman on October 02, 2017, 03:18:17 PM
Todd Bowels
Fyp
Post by: Badger on October 02, 2017, 04:19:36 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on October 02, 2017, 04:58:28 PM
Todd BowleosBreakfast of champions!
Post by: Coach K on October 03, 2017, 12:13:33 PM
like i said in the other thread though, this does look like a team that has fully bought into Bowles and thats the first step to actually building something sustainable.
Post by: d sw0rdz on October 03, 2017, 02:42:00 PM
guys, let me know if there is no longer a shot at the tank so that i can stop watching weekly darnold, rosen, jackson clips
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 03, 2017, 03:30:29 PM
i was post a 30-hour shift on sunday, sat down on my couch to watch the game, and remember watching about 5 minutes before i apparently dozed off. i then woke up and found that it was 9 PM, and was still in the sitting position on my couch, but apparently we won
guys, let me know if there is no longer a shot at the tank so that i can stop watching weekly darnold, rosen, jackson clips
If we beat Cleveland I'd think it's a safe bet we're not getting the top pick.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on October 03, 2017, 05:30:01 PM
i was post a 30-hour shift on sunday, sat down on my couch to watch the game, and remember watching about 5 minutes before i apparently dozed off. i then woke up and found that it was 9 PM, and was still in the sitting position on my couch, but apparently we won
guys, let me know if there is no longer a shot at the tank so that i can stop watching weekly darnold, rosen, jackson clips
It's extremely likely that we will go for a QB regardless of where we pick. This is, apparently, a very good crop of QB's and we don't have anyone there who seems to be a long-term starter. This year 3 QB's went in the first round and Kizer who was the first pick in the second. We might not get the top talent but we will get one of the 4-5 that'll go in the first round next year.
Post by: Badger on October 03, 2017, 05:34:42 PM
It's extremely likely that we will go for a QB regardless of where we pick. This is, apparently, a very good crop of QB's and we don't have anyone there who seems to be a long-term starter. This year 3 QB's went in the first round and Kizer who was the first pick in the second. We might not get the top talent but we will get one of the 4-5 that'll go in the first round next year.
TL;DR Stop watching Darnold but watch the other guys.
Post by: Tommy on October 03, 2017, 07:43:26 PM
If we beat Cleveland I'd think it's a safe bet we're not getting the top pick.
Are you torn about this, or do you not care about getting the top pick? Figure you'd be conflicted.
Post by: Laxin on October 03, 2017, 07:46:09 PM
i was post a 30-hour shift on sunday, sat down on my couch to watch the game, and remember watching about 5 minutes before i apparently dozed off. i then woke up and found that it was 9 PM, and was still in the sitting position on my couch, but apparently we won
guys, let me know if there is no longer a shot at the tank so that i can stop watching weekly darnold, rosen, jackson clips
I'd say Mayfield, Jackson, Rudolph and Allen are the most realistic options right now.
Post by: d sw0rdz on October 03, 2017, 09:23:53 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 03, 2017, 09:34:51 PM
Are you torn about this, or do you not care about getting the top pick? Figure you'd be conflicted.
I am a little. Seemed like a year to take our cap hits, play the young guys and end up high in the draft to get a top QB while Brady is at the end of his run. Not my usual approach but why the f*ck not? It worked in the 90s, along with canning Kotite for Parcells.
But if we're going to be competitive and win some games that's fine too, f*ck the draft, worry about it when we get there. I'm sure as sh*t not going to sit here and root for us to lose to these teams I hate, which is all of them. If we did I'd look for the silver lining but f*ck that. So yes, I'm conflicted a little.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 04, 2017, 09:12:48 AM
Or better yet, win this year, pick a dynamic non-QB playmaker, and maybe draft a QB in 2019.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 04, 2017, 09:17:52 AM
I still don't understand why the Jets can't win this year, get a lower draft pick, and still find someone who is the future of the position.
Or better yet, win this year, pick a dynamic non-QB playmaker, and maybe draft a QB in 2019.
So you basically want it all?
Hahahah good luck with that, you do realize it's the Jets and you're a Jets fan.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 04, 2017, 09:32:29 AM
So you basically want it all?
Hahahah good luck with that, you do realize it's the Jets and you're a Jets fan.
Hahaha, my wife reminds me all the time.
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 04, 2017, 10:45:45 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on October 04, 2017, 10:54:48 AM
While it's been a pleasant surprise and the Jets have been playing hard, I don't have any illusions that this team will have a lot of wins. I don't think the Jets will finish at the bottom, but let's not get out of hand here.
Post by: Laxin on October 04, 2017, 11:16:26 AM
I still don't understand why the Jets can't win this year, get a lower draft pick, and still find someone who is the future of the position.
The Jets have been trying to do this for over 4 decades... and have failed miserably. I don't know why now would be any different. They tried this with Hackenberg, and even with Petty to some extent. It's going to take pure dumb luck for them to hit on a QB outside of the top half of the first round.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 04, 2017, 11:17:30 AM
The Jets have been trying to do this for over 4 decades... and have failed miserably. I don't know why now would be any different. They tried this with Hackenberg, and even with Petty to some extent. It's going to take pure dumb luck for them to hit on a QB outside of the top half of the first round.
We also traded up for Sanchez not too long ago.
Nothing is guaranteed.
Post by: Laxin on October 04, 2017, 11:35:30 AM
We also traded up for Sanchez not too long ago.
Nothing is guaranteed.
I agree, but id say they have a higher chance of success with a higher rated prospect.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 04, 2017, 11:46:28 AM
Let's slow our roll on the winning thing. We won 2 games in a row. Barely.
While it's been a pleasant surprise and the Jets have been playing hard, I don't have any illusions that this team will have a lot of wins. I don't think the Jets will finish at the bottom, but let's not get out of hand here.
Just to be clear, I'm not saying the Jets will win a lot of games, I just don't see what the problem is if they do. So what, they'll have a lower draft pick? You still have to make good picks wherever your spot lands.
We also traded up for Sanchez not too long ago.
Nothing is guaranteed.
Good point.
How many QBs are taken at the top of the draft and never pan out? Teams either draft well (and get a little lucky) or they don't. And then they still need a good coaching staff to coax out that talent. These things are far more important than picking first.
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 04, 2017, 12:15:23 PM
The Jets have been trying to do this for over 4 decades... and have failed miserably. I don't know why now would be any different. They tried this with Hackenberg, and even with Petty to some extent. It's going to take pure dumb luck for them to hit on a QB outside of the top half of the first round.
Duff hasn't been doing this for four decades. Petty and Hackenberg are his picks, jury is still out on both, but obviously he's aware he needs a QB.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 22, 2017, 09:37:32 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 22, 2017, 10:59:56 PM
It's back on...sadly SF and CLE may both go 0-16
Who are we tanking for, exactly?
Chukwuma Okorofor might be the best option for this team if we end up in the Top 5.
Post by: Laxin on October 23, 2017, 08:55:22 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 23, 2017, 09:03:01 AM
Post by: MBGreen on October 23, 2017, 09:11:00 AM
If anything positive comes of it, it'll be Bowles getting fired.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 23, 2017, 09:13:16 AM
The tank is over. The 3rd win killed the tank. And the Jets are going to win a couple more games this season. If they don't, I'll take the high draft pick, but unless the team can't mentally recover from Sunday, they'll find a way to get to 5-6 wins.
Pretty much
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 23, 2017, 11:30:04 AM
On the bright side, we do have some good young players and another draft will hopefully add to that depth of young talent. Re-watching the game last night, emotions aside and knowing the ending, there are positives here, both in how the team comes out to play and the players on the field. The last two weeks have been tough losses, both winnable games. You just have to move on to the next one at this point.
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 30, 2017, 12:15:07 PM
Just
End
The
Season
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 30, 2017, 12:39:09 PM
Post by: MBGreen on October 30, 2017, 04:32:57 PM
Beat the Billswe're not.
according to mexjetinbcn, shady McCoy has more talent than the jets entire offense.
Post by: Laxin on October 30, 2017, 05:14:32 PM
we're not.
according to mexjetinbcn, shady McCoy has more talent than the jets entire offense.
I mean, its kind of true...
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 31, 2017, 11:44:19 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 31, 2017, 11:50:47 AM
Post by: Johnny English on November 02, 2017, 10:57:50 PM
Post by: MoreCharacters on November 02, 2017, 11:37:54 PM
optimism hooray!
Post by: Fenwyr on November 03, 2017, 09:18:15 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2017, 09:19:03 AM
Post by: MBGreen on November 03, 2017, 09:25:57 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 03, 2017, 09:42:48 AM
Forget the tank. Somehow this team will not be picking in the top 5.
I don't think the Jets could be top 5 now if they tried to tank. Well, maybe if they tried.
Post by: Fenwyr on November 03, 2017, 09:45:35 AM
we've upgraded from severe tank mode into mediocrity tank modeYeah, we suck at tanking too.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2017, 10:01:00 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on November 03, 2017, 10:04:38 AM
The guys that we got rid of have done absolutely nothing for their new teams. The guys that we brought in to play those positions are playing out of their minds.
Demario Davis for David Harris
Morris Claiborne for Darrelle Revis
Jamal Adams/Marcus Maye for Marcus Gilchrist/Calvin Pryor
Josh McCown for Ryan Fitzpatrick
Kelvin Beachum for Ryan Clady
Jermaine Kearse for Brandon Marshall
Jeremy Kerley for Eric Decker
Kony Ealy for Sheldon Richardson
This is mind-blowing with each passing week.
The only position where we're noticeable worse is center and Nick Mangold appears to be done with football, so I'm not sure if that was ever going to be fixed in 2017.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 03, 2017, 10:20:10 AM
The guys that we got rid of have done absolutely nothing for their new teams.
(http://reho.st/cdn2.screenjunkies.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Al-bundy-ed-oneill-animated-gif-23.gif)
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2017, 10:22:37 AM
Looking at that comparison list, wow!
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 03, 2017, 11:59:39 AM
I never believed in "the tank" either. Why would a team ever intentionally lose? These are professionals in a what-have-you-done-for-me-lately profession.
Looking at that comparison list, wow!
I never thought they were going to intentionally lose, I thought it might come with cleaning out veterans and getting our cap hits out of the way all in one shot. So if that was the case I was ready to roll with it, but happy it's not the case. The best part is it looks like Duff knows what he's doing, which is encouraging.
I'm thinking this thread is good luck more than spelling the teams wrong.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 03, 2017, 12:20:16 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 03, 2017, 12:22:53 PM
Y’all don’t wanna tank no more? 3 game losing streak coming right up
Pretty much. We'll zig zag our way to 8-8, get the 16th pick, draft some guy nobody has ever heard of and hope it works out.
Wash, rinse, repeat.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2017, 02:18:28 PM
I never thought they were going to intentionally lose, I thought it might come with cleaning out veterans and getting our cap hits out of the way all in one shot. So if that was the case I was ready to roll with it, but happy it's not the case. The best part is it looks like Duff knows what he's doing, which is encouraging.
I'm thinking this thread is good luck more than spelling the teams wrong.
To me, that's the key. The question I had coming into the year was "Regardless of the final results, will it look like Maccagnan has a talent for picking the right players?" Right now, it looks like the answer is yes.
So the question now becomes: "Is Bowles the right guy to mold that talent and lead a champion?"
Post by: bojanglesman on November 03, 2017, 02:22:15 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 03, 2017, 02:24:37 PM
To me, that's the key. The question I had coming into the year was "Regardless of the final results, will it look like Maccagnan has a talent for picking the right players?" Right now, it looks like the answer is yes.
So the question now becomes: "Is Bowles the right guy to mold that talent and lead a champion?"
Bowles has proven he needs the offense to be left in capable hands. Thankfully, he found Morton. On the flipside, he's still owed a punch in the face for hiring Chan Gailey.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 03, 2017, 02:25:50 PM
Bowles has proven he needs the offense to be left in capable hands. Thankfully, he found Morton. On the flipside, he's still owed a punch in the face for hiring Chan Gailey.
I wonder if that was also to have a former head coach around to help him learn the ropes.
Post by: MBGreen on November 03, 2017, 02:31:05 PM
I wonder if that was also to have a former head coach around to help him learn the ropes.
he was an interim HC with the Phins for 3 games.
I'm not sure why he hired Gailey. It certainly couldn't be for his shitty offensive playbook.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 03, 2017, 02:48:13 PM
he was an interim HC with the Phins for 3 games.
I'm not sure why he hired Gailey. It certainly couldn't be for his shitty offensive playbook.
It gave us the inside track to get Fitzpatrick.
Last night there were guys in Jets and Bills Fitzpatrick jerseys next to each other.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2017, 02:56:14 PM
Anyone who complained about our team getting rid of all their talent this off-season should bow down before the Duff. Spring cleaning if I ever saw it.
Right here. So far, it looks like I was completely wrong. And I'm happy to say that.
I wonder if that was also to have a former head coach around to help him learn the ropes.
Weren't they also friends, so it was kind of a favor? Also, wasn't Gailey supposed to be grooming his successor? I seem to recall those things, but I can never be sure of my memory.
Post by: MBGreen on November 03, 2017, 02:58:36 PM
Right here. So far, it looks like I was completely wrong. And I'm happy to say that.
Weren't they also friends, so it was kind of a favor? Also, wasn't Gailey supposed to be grooming his successor? I seem to recall those things, but I can never be sure of my memory.
he took the same approach with Kacy Rodgers.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2017, 03:00:04 PM
he took the same approach with Kacy Rodgers.
But I think Rodgers was partially also because with Rodgers he could continue to run his own defense.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 03, 2017, 10:18:57 PM
Post by: Badger on November 12, 2017, 10:09:37 PM
Post by: ons on November 12, 2017, 11:23:48 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 12, 2017, 11:39:18 PM
Really hoping the Seahawks collapse down the stretch and we get another decent second rounder. Remaining schedule: Falcons, @49s, Eagles, @Jax, Rams, @Dallas and Cardinals.
are we getting any compensatory picks this year? I would think losing Decker/Marshall would drum something up.
Post by: ons on November 12, 2017, 11:44:00 PM
are we getting any compensatory picks this year? I would think losing Decker/Marshall would drum something up.
Pretty sure we released every FA we lost - no expiring contracts means no compensatory picks.
Post by: MBGreen on November 12, 2017, 11:46:22 PM
Pretty sure we released every FA we lost - no expiring contracts means no compensatory picks.
well...that sucks the hind tit.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 13, 2017, 08:07:27 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 13, 2017, 08:12:24 AM
ESPN's FPI still projects the Jets to get the No. 5 pick.
Give me Saquon Barkley or give me death
Post by: MBGreen on November 13, 2017, 08:16:04 AM
Give me Saquon Barkley or give me deathin b4 insanity finds some ridiculous chart saying what a dumb move that is.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 13, 2017, 08:28:54 AM
Need the Bengals, Broncos, Chargers, Bucs, Texans, and Bears to win in order for us to move up.
Need the Cardinals, Raiders, Ravens, Redskins to win in order for them to stay behind us.
Post by: insanity on November 13, 2017, 08:43:54 AM
in b4 insanity finds some ridiculous chart saying what a dumb move that is.
It is dumb.
Give me a stud LT over a blue chip runningback 7 days a week. If Saquon Barkley's the BPA by far and you can't trade out, fine, so be it.
But, I'm taking D'brickshaw Ferguson over Reggie Bush.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 13, 2017, 09:19:12 AM
If you took the mystery out of it and just compared elite RB vs. elite O tackle, I'll take the tackle. But you can't do that so there's no point.
Because I am a draft expert and shouldn't be questioned, there's only one philosophy if there is a player that is clearly the best player on the board:
1. Draft the best player if it's a position where you aren't set.
2. If the best player is at a position where you are set, try trading back if reasonable.
3. If trading back isn't reasonable, take the next best player at a position where there is need.
Duff didn't follow this advice with Leonard Williams. Who knows how it would have worked out if he'd have taken someone else and kept Sheldon happy at DE. I do think he tried his derriere off to trade back. May have ended up better or worse, who knows. But since I'm the expert, I'm right.
Post by: ScotlandJet on November 13, 2017, 11:05:37 AM
Jets currently sit at 11.
Need the Bengals, Broncos, Chargers, Bucs, Texans, and Bears to win in order for us to move up.
Need the Cardinals, Raiders, Ravens, Redskins to win in order for them to stay behind us.
I don't see us winning another game so we should fine to get a nice pick- it just won't be fine enough to snag a franchise QB. My ulcer is bubbling at the prospect of the Giants getting Darnold. This scenario is so NY Jets.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 13, 2017, 11:11:55 AM
A rookie QB will get killed behind that garbage.
Post by: Laxin on November 13, 2017, 11:16:50 AM
It is dumb.
Give me a stud LT over a blue chip runningback 7 days a week. If Saquon Barkley's the BPA by far and you can't trade out, fine, so be it.
But, I'm taking D'brickshaw Ferguson over Reggie Bush.
Nice cherry picking comparison. Im going to take a probowl LT over a underachieving RB. No excrement.
I'm going to take Adrian Peterson over Luke Joeckel.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 13, 2017, 11:30:01 AM
We need Mike McGlinchey or Chukwuma Okorofor. Our OL is the biggest problem for this team right now.
A rookie QB will get killed behind that garbage.
I’m interpreting this as saying we will draft a QB with one of our 2nds or 3rd rounder?
If Indy is sticking with Luck, and they pass on McGlinchey, their entire front office should be drug out into the street and shot.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 13, 2017, 11:32:20 AM
Nice cherry picking comparison. Im going to take a probowl LT over a underachieving RB. No excrement.
I'm going to take Adrian Peterson over Luke Joeckel.
I’ll take Todd Gurley over Ereck Flowers!!1!
Post by: insanity on November 13, 2017, 11:38:00 AM
Nice cherry picking comparison. Im going to take a probowl LT over a underachieving RB. No excrement.
I'm going to take Adrian Peterson over Luke Joeckel.
I'm not cherrypicking, I'm trying to make the conversation relatable. And, I think you mean take Adrian Peterson over Joe Thomas. In which case, I'd take Joe Thomas given the opportunity.
Just in case you want to go further than 2006 and 2007.
2008 - Even with the shortened career I'm still taking Jake Long over Darren McFadden. You can swap in Ryan Clady or Brandon Albert there too if you'd like
2009 - I'm still taking Jason Smith over Knowshon Moreno. Not much of a difference there. Although in hindsight Andre Smith would have been the better pick
2010 - I'm taking Trent Williams over CJ Spiller
The OT isn't always the best player, but the position is more impactful even if the result is an average player. I would think the decline in our offensive lines production post D'brick would show that.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 13, 2017, 11:44:16 AM
My ulcer is bubbling at the prospect of the Giants getting Darnold.
Sure it's not because of whiskey for breakfast?
Post by: Miamipuck on November 13, 2017, 12:26:03 PM
My ulcer is bubbling
Good I hope it hurts.
Post by: ScotlandJet on November 13, 2017, 01:12:01 PM
Good I hope it hurts.
Oh you are so mean.
I can only hope your bruised anus takes longer to heal
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 13, 2017, 01:27:48 PM
I'd much rather take a shot with Baker Mayfield or Mike McGlinchey at 5 than take Saquon Barkley at 5. Our running backs would look a lot better if our OL didn't suck.
Post by: Johnny English on November 13, 2017, 01:33:00 PM
Saquon Barkley would be an extremely foolish pick considering what the Jets need. The Jets keep drafting players at positions that aren't necessarily the most important (safety, 3-4 DL).
I'd much rather take a shot with Baker Mayfield or Mike McGlinchey at 5 than take Saquon Barkley at 5. Our running backs would look a lot better if our OL didn't suck.
I don't disagree with your preference in this year's draft but I do disagree with you on the importance of the safety position, especially given our current coaching team and defensive style. The safeties we have play a huge part in how we bring pressure - Adams in particular blitzes regularly and he's a critical component of our run defense.
Post by: ScotlandJet on November 13, 2017, 01:36:51 PM
Sure it's not because of whiskey for breakfast?Did you watch the game? which self respecting Jet fan didn't reach for the Scotch to numb the pain
Post by: bojanglesman on November 13, 2017, 03:06:59 PM
Of course a trade or cut could happen but good tackles don't usually come about that way.
Post by: Johnny English on November 13, 2017, 03:23:29 PM
I took a quick peek at free agent tackles for 2018. Better draft one fellas. Unless you want Unibrow Giacomini back.
Of course a trade or cut could happen but good tackles don't usually come about that way.
I have mentioned previously, either on here or in separate conversations, that I would very much like to see us return the favour to our neighbours and make Weston Richburg a big offer in FA. He's a smart player who's just coming into his prime now - put him between Winters and Carpenter and you'd have the interior nicely sewn up. I firmly believe that Johnson is a huge part of our OL problems this year, because everything starts there. Fix the center, and we're well on our way to fixing the line.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 13, 2017, 03:24:12 PM
Saquon Barkley would be an extremely foolish pick considering what the Jets need.
Lock it in
Post by: bojanglesman on November 13, 2017, 03:37:11 PM
I have mentioned previously, either on here or in separate conversations, that I would very much like to see us return the favour to our neighbours and make Weston Richburg a big offer in FA. He's a smart player who's just coming into his prime now - put him between Winters and Carpenter and you'd have the interior nicely sewn up. I firmly believe that Johnson is a huge part of our OL problems this year, because everything starts there. Fix the center, and we're well on our way to fixing the line.Fair enough.
Post by: Badger on November 13, 2017, 06:39:22 PM
Saquon Barkley would be an extremely foolish pick considering what the Jets need. The Jets keep drafting players at positions that aren't necessarily the most important (safety, 3-4 DL).
I'd much rather take a shot with Baker Mayfield or Mike McGlinchey at 5 than take Saquon Barkley at 5. Our running backs would look a lot better if our OL didn't suck.
If we take Barkley at 5 in a hypothetical draft I'm assuming we landed Cousins or another legitimate starting QB before the draft.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 13, 2017, 08:51:06 PM
If we take Barkley at 5 in a hypothetical draft I'm assuming we landed Cousins or another legitimate starting QB before the draft.I still wouldn't like taking a RB high at that point, but it would be more defensible.
Don't get me wrong, I love Saquon Barkley as an RB prospect. But RB is more of a luxury position in today's NFL. Barkley has a chance to be an elite RB, and I think he's a great prospect, but I have a tough time getting on board with an RB that high, especially when we need an OL and a pass rush so badly, even before we entertain QB.
Post by: Laxin on November 13, 2017, 09:03:50 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 13, 2017, 09:23:55 PM
Barkley/Jackson 2018
Cum everywhere
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 13, 2017, 09:38:41 PM
Barkley/Jackson 2018If you could guarantee me Jackson in the 2nd round (or with a trade-up in late 1), I'd be on board with Barkley.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 26, 2017, 03:47:09 PM
I think the highest we'll ever get is the 6th pick again. The bottom five teams are just so much worse than everyone else. Maybe Chicago will put a couple wins out of their derriere. Indianapolis too.
Post by: Badger on November 26, 2017, 06:24:13 PM
Post by: casman02 on November 26, 2017, 06:56:30 PM
As of right now, we have the 7th pick in the draft, but that will probably reshuffle a bit when the later games are over.
I think the highest we'll ever get is the 6th pick again. The bottom five teams are just so much worse than everyone else. Maybe Chicago will put a couple wins out of their derriere. Indianapolis too.
I could see us at 4 with Chicago, Denver and Indy pulling of some late season upsets, but the top 3 are not going to budge from their spots
Post by: Johnny English on November 26, 2017, 07:14:01 PM
I could see us at 4 with Chicago, Denver and Indy pulling of some late season upsets, but the top 3 are not going to budge from their spots
You're probably right, but both the Giants and the Niners have at least a couple of winnable games on their remaining schedule. I don't think they will, nor do I think we'll lose out, but it's not inconceivable.
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 26, 2017, 08:09:21 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on November 26, 2017, 08:47:49 PM
We are still sitting at #7.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 26, 2017, 09:03:30 PM
Well played, McCown.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 26, 2017, 10:19:16 PM
McCown has struck a perfect balance of keeping us out of the running for the playoffs and a top pick, while not being able to see our young QBs.I can't believe he's still standing.
Well played, McCown.
Post by: MBGreen on November 27, 2017, 09:13:01 AM
I can't believe he's still standing.
this
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 04, 2017, 12:56:51 PM
#FuckTheTank
Post by: MBGreen on December 04, 2017, 12:58:45 PM
Crazy that this team has looked pretty good at times and we still hold the 7th overall pick. Head and shoulders above our teams performance last season, and we picked 6th.
#FuckTheTank
I think we're in the 11th slot now.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 04, 2017, 01:46:50 PM
Crazy that this team has looked pretty good at times and we still hold the 7th overall pick. Head and shoulders above our teams performance last season, and we picked 6th.
#FuckTheTank
Yup.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 04, 2017, 02:18:55 PM
I think we're in the 11th slot now.
You’re right, pick #10. Perfect spot for Mayfield/Jackson or to move up into the top 5 if Darnold/Rosen slips.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 04, 2017, 02:39:56 PM
Post by: Johnny English on December 04, 2017, 02:57:46 PM
ESPN just projects the Jets to get the 7th pick based on how good we are and our remaining schedule.
ESPN also projected us to go 0-16 on the season based on how good they thought we were.
I think we win two of our remaining games (Denver and New England) to finish 7-9, and that ain't getting us the 7th pick. In the last three years the highest pick that 7-9 has got you is 10th, and as low as 16th.
Post by: MBGreen on December 04, 2017, 03:07:54 PM
ESPN also projected us to go 0-16 on the season based on how good they thought we were.
I think we win two of our remaining games (Denver and New England) to finish 7-9, and that ain't getting us the 7th pick. In the last three years the highest pick that 7-9 has got you is 10th, and as low as 16th.
I don't think we're beating New England....and the Jets play on the road in Denver. We're not very good on the road (hai Tampa Bay).
Post by: Johnny English on December 04, 2017, 03:11:38 PM
I don't think we're beating New England....and the Jets play on the road in Denver. We're not very good on the road (hai Tampa Bay).
New England will have their seeding locked up by then and you must have not watched the donkeys recently, they are absolutely freaking atrocious.
In fact freak you, we're winning the last four and getting a wildcard spot.
Post by: MBGreen on December 04, 2017, 03:12:29 PM
New England will have their seeding locked up by then and you must have not watched the donkeys recently, they are absolutely freaking atrocious.
In fact freak you, we're winning the last four and getting a wildcard spot.
lol
Post by: bojanglesman on December 05, 2017, 08:57:25 AM
Their defense is classic bend-but-don't-break. Near bottom of the league in yards allowed, top 10 in points allowed. They seem to get those turnovers and hold teams to field goals after long drives. Points are all that matter.
We can beat Denver. excrement QB, excrement offense. Which means we'll give up 30 points.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 05, 2017, 08:58:54 AM
Post by: Laxin on December 11, 2017, 08:02:22 AM
Assuming we finish 5-11, I'd say we likely end up 7th or 8th, with an outside chance of the 5th or 6th pick.
Trade options could be available with the Colts, Browns (via Texans) and 49ers. Maybe you trade 1st, 2nd and 3rd for the 3rd or 4th overall and are able to grab Mayfield.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 11, 2017, 08:04:12 AM
Post by: MBGreen on December 11, 2017, 08:25:03 AM
Not against moving up if we're that close.
agreed.
If one of the QBs is your guy and you think he's franchise quality....you go get him. Price is no object.
Post by: MBGreen on December 11, 2017, 08:25:34 AM
New England will have their seeding locked up by then and you must have not watched the donkeys recently, they are absolutely freaking atrocious.
In fact freak you, we're winning the last four and getting a wildcard spot.
quoted for hilarity.
Post by: Laxin on December 14, 2017, 11:38:45 PM
Post by: Laxin on December 15, 2017, 07:02:33 AM
Week 15
Washington win vs Arizona
Week 16
Denver win vs Washington
Chicago win vs Cleveland
Week 17
Houston win vs Indianapolis
There's no way we hop the Browns, Giants, 49ers or the Colts, and I don't think we'll be able to hop the Bucs, Bengals or Texans unless there is a decent upset. We are probably looking at 8 or 9 if we lose out.
Current standings and SOS:
1. Cleveland (0-13) .529
2. New York Giants (2-11) .514
3. Indianapolis (3-10) .490
4. San Francisco (3-10) .519
5. Denver (4-9) .486
6. Cleveland - from Houston (4-9) .510
7. Chicago (4-9) .553
8. Tampa Bay (4-9) .558
9. Cincinnati (5-8) .476
10. New York Jets (5-8) .524
11. Washington (5-8) .524
12. Arizona (6-7) .481
Post by: insanity on December 15, 2017, 05:31:22 PM
You’re right, pick #10. Perfect spot for Mayfield/Jackson or to move up into the top 5 if Darnold/Rosen slips.
What position is Lamar Jackson going to play if we draft him in the top 5, Ford?
It ain't freaking quarterback
Post by: Heismanberg on December 15, 2017, 06:20:41 PM
What position is Lamar Jackson going to play if we draft him in the top 5, Ford?
It ain't freaking quarterback
Why not?
Post by: MBGreen on December 15, 2017, 06:27:03 PM
Why not?his charts never lie
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 22, 2017, 12:37:54 PM
New York Post (https://nypost.com/2017/12/20/two-giants-on-qb-future-stick-with-webb-pass-on-the-draft/)
I say they should listen to their players, just like they listened to their fans after Eli was benched.
Post by: MBGreen on December 22, 2017, 01:13:30 PM
Giants players say don't draft a QB, play Davis Webb when Eli is done.
New York Post (https://nypost.com/2017/12/20/two-giants-on-qb-future-stick-with-webb-pass-on-the-draft/)
I say they should listen to their players, just like they listened to their fans after Eli was benched.
If the Giants passed on Rosen/Darnold in favor of starting Davis Webb next year....the schadenfreude would be off the charts amazing.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 22, 2017, 03:22:50 PM
What position is Lamar Jackson going to play if we draft him in the top 5, Ford?
It ain't freaking quarterback
1) I said trade up for Rosen/Darnold, not Jackson
2) Ford?
3) dafuq you talking about?
Post by: insanity on December 22, 2017, 03:29:06 PM
Why not?
Because he's not a top tier qb in this draft... It sounds like he might not even get a chance to play qb at all.
Post by: insanity on December 22, 2017, 03:30:35 PM
1) I said trade up for Rosen/Darnold, not Jackson
2) Ford?
3) dafuq you talking about?
Meant top 10. Jackson ain't going top 10.
Tried writing Gord and it autocorrected
Post by: Laxin on December 22, 2017, 04:25:03 PM
Because he's not a top tier qb in this draft... It sounds like he might not even get a chance to play qb at all.
Says who?
Post by: insanity on December 22, 2017, 04:48:07 PM
Says who?
Mcshay and kiper had their first draft discussion of the year and said coaches don't view him as a qb.
Most articles have Jackson ranked 5 or later at qb.
Post by: Laxin on December 22, 2017, 10:12:23 PM
Mcshay and kiper had their first draft discussion of the year and said coaches don't view him as a qb.
Most articles have Jackson ranked 5 or later at qb.
Yeah McShay had Allen at the 5th pick. Why can Allen play QB and Jackson can't? Jackson is a more polished passer with just as much talent who has actually put tape together that warrants a 1st round pick. Allen not so much.
The narrative has changed with Jackson since the beginning of the season. He has progressed every year as a passer and has convinced a lot of people who thought he couldnt play QB in the NFL otherwise.
Post by: MBGreen on December 22, 2017, 10:27:24 PM
profit.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 22, 2017, 11:09:03 PM
take OL in the first round and Jackson in the 2nd...then Billy Price with our other 2nd rounder.
profit.
Billy Price is probably going in the first round.
Post by: MBGreen on December 22, 2017, 11:09:57 PM
Billy Price is probably going in the first round.I don't like that
Post by: Heismanberg on December 22, 2017, 11:13:05 PM
I don't like that
If we beat San Diego and finish with six wins, we might be in the perfect spot to draft Price. Right in the middle of the first round.
Post by: MBGreen on December 23, 2017, 06:53:53 AM
If we beat San Diego and finish with six wins, we might be in the perfect spot to draft Price. Right in the middle of the first round.I think we may have to resurrect the JO 3 round mock draft next month
Post by: bojanglesman on December 23, 2017, 07:08:09 AM
take OL in the first round and Jackson in the 2nd...then Billy Price with our other 2nd rounder. Trade Bowles to Cardinals for another 2nd, draft a coach.
profit.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 24, 2017, 11:09:47 AM
Or win, whatever, but a loss will do.
#FireEveryone
Post by: bojanglesman on December 24, 2017, 11:18:33 AM
Just lose, Baby.I can't pull for the Jets to lose, but I'll be less upset if it happens. I refuse to give a excrement about any ramifications of them losing to the Pats. I don't care if we lose every draft pick, beat those fuckers.
Or win, whatever, but a loss will do.
#FireEveryone
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 24, 2017, 11:39:30 AM
I can't pull for the Jets to lose, but I'll be less upset if it happens. I refuse to give a excrement about any ramifications of them losing to the Pats. I don't care if we lose every draft pick, beat those fuckers.
Same here, to be truthful.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 24, 2017, 05:27:29 PM
Post by: Fenwyr on December 24, 2017, 06:17:58 PM
Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 24, 2017, 06:42:28 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 24, 2017, 08:08:11 PM
1. Browns
2. Giants
3. Colts
4. Texans
5. Bucs
6. Broncos
7. 49ers
8. Jets
Post by: bojanglesman on December 24, 2017, 08:38:16 PM
#NFLDraftorder following 4PM games (no trades)Browns get the Texans pick at 4.
1. Browns
2. Giants
3. Colts
4. Texans
5. Bucs
6. Broncos
7. 49ers
8. Jets
Post by: Heismanberg on December 24, 2017, 08:45:34 PM
Corner and pass rusher
Post by: bojanglesman on December 24, 2017, 09:01:05 PM
Unless we can somehow luck into the 6th pick, the value in this draft from 8-10 is on the defensive side of the football.From my quick math, assuming the Texans lose tomorrow, I think the absolute best the Jets could finish is 5th if the Broncos, Bucs, and 49ers all win and we lose. Technically it could be 4th if the Texans win both of their final 2 games.
Corner and pass rusher
Realistically, assuming the Jets lose, it'll probably be 6 or 7. One of those teams ahead of us will probably win. 49ers are the best bet.
Post by: MBGreen on December 24, 2017, 09:32:20 PM
Unless we can somehow luck into the 6th pick, the value in this draft from 8-10 is on the defensive side of the football.we could trade up
Corner and pass rusher
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 25, 2017, 12:01:06 AM
Unless we can somehow luck into the 6th pick, the value in this draft from 8-10 is on the defensive side of the football.
Corner and pass rusher
So you're saying I should drink heavily on draft weekend and stay away from keyboards?
Post by: Heismanberg on December 25, 2017, 12:34:11 AM
So you're saying I should drink heavily on draft weekend and stay away from keyboards?
Your opinion might be different after free agency. If we sign a quarterback and upgrade the offensive line , then cornerback, running back, and pass rusher are still big needs for this team.
I know that we've drafted a ton of defensive players in the first round, but I'm looking at it like this:
Maccagnan has drafted star caliber players in the first round for us. They all happen to be defensive players. He's 3 for 3 there.
In the second round, he's 1 for 3. Both of his strikes are offensive players (Hack and Devin Smith).
I've said it before and I'll say it again. I trust him to draft defensive talent early. I'd rather him spend our free agency money on proven offensive talent.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 25, 2017, 01:14:15 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 25, 2017, 02:54:41 AM
Your opinion might be different after free agency. If we sign a quarterback and upgrade the offensive line , then cornerback, running back, and pass rusher are still big needs for this team.
I know that we've drafted a ton of defensive players in the first round, but I'm looking at it like this:
Maccagnan has drafted star caliber players in the first round for us. They all happen to be defensive players. He's 3 for 3 there.
In the second round, he's 1 for 3. Both of his strikes are offensive players (Hack and Devin Smith).
I've said it before and I'll say it again. I trust him to draft defensive talent early. I'd rather him spend our free agency money on proven offensive talent.
Yeah, free agency could change everything but the number one priority this offseason has to be offense. Free agency or draft, it absolutely needs to be addressed early and often.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 25, 2017, 06:37:13 AM
Your opinion might be different after free agency. If we sign a quarterback and upgrade the offensive line , then cornerback, running back, and pass rusher are still big needs for this team.
I know that we've drafted a ton of defensive players in the first round, but I'm looking at it like this:
Maccagnan has drafted star caliber players in the first round for us. They all happen to be defensive players. He's 3 for 3 there.
In the second round, he's 1 for 3. Both of his strikes are offensive players (Hack and Devin Smith).
I've said it before and I'll say it again. I trust him to draft defensive talent early. I'd rather him spend our free agency money on proven offensive talent.
To be open and fair, Williams and Adams were absolute no brainer picks and easily the best on the board. Yes Mac deserves credit for pulling the trigger, but it was the right move without question. And looking back at the 2016 class, not one offensive player taken in round 1 after Darron Lee has been strong. We also desperately needed LB help that year.
Mac has done a great job taking those three guys, cornerstones of the defensive future. But I don't think that means he can't draft offensive talent early.
If we are all being honest about it, the Hack pick is a different animal than Devin Smith. Hack is a QB and if you think he might be able to be 'the guy' you have to take him earlier and we all knew Hack had every tool imaginable and made some throws you just look at and say, only a handful of guys can make those throws on the planet. But everything else was broken and appears to be unfixable 2 years later.
Devin Smith is a guy that I believe even you labeled as the top deep threat in the draft. He was kind of starting to figure it out, and just kept being broken. Sometimes injuries happen and the guy never recovers.
Do those two different situations mean Duff shouldn't be trusted to draft offense early? I have no idea. But I don't know that the two offensive guys he has drafted are enough reason to believe he can't get a hit.
That said if you are right and the talent is on defense, and we are sitting between 8-10 and can't get up for a QB than I want an absolutely dominant pass rusher.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 25, 2017, 07:23:27 AM
Post by: sg3 on December 25, 2017, 07:25:20 AM
#NFLDraftorder following 4PM games (no trades)
1. Browns
2. Giants
3. Colts
4. Browns
5. Bucs
6. Broncos
7. 49ers
8. Jets
Browns, Midgets and Broncos ahead of us will go QB. Colts will gamble on Luck returning to health and pass on QB
My hope is that Darnold and the other eligibles declare and Mayfield is sitting there like a ripe plum for Macc and the Jets to pick at 8.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 25, 2017, 08:19:08 AM
To be open and fair, Williams and Adams were absolute no brainer picks and easily the best on the board. Yes Mac deserves credit for pulling the trigger, but it was the right move without question.
Maccagnan could have easily taken Kevin White instead of Williams in 2015. A lot of people wanted him too. He drafted a player at a position where we were loaded. It was a bolder move than he gets credit for. Look at our dominant defensive line now...
Watson and Mahomes were passed over in 2017 for Adams. Passing on a quarterback was another risk for him.
Were they really no brainers? He's sticking to his guns and drafting from his board.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 25, 2017, 08:26:53 AM
Devin Smith is a guy that I believe even you labeled as the top deep threat in the draft. He was kind of starting to figure it out, and just kept being broken. Sometimes injuries happen and the guy never recovers.
Do those two different situations mean Duff shouldn't be trusted to draft offense early? I have no idea. But I don't know that the two offensive guys he has drafted are enough reason to believe he can't get a hit.
The best offensive player he's drafted is a sixth round running back that is a role player at best. Brandon Shell is the other one.
Charone Peake
Chad Hansen
ArDarius Stewart
Jarvis Harrison
Bryce Petty
Jordan Leggett
He absolutely gets credit for signing Robby Anderson as an undrafted free agent, but look at the rest.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 25, 2017, 08:29:14 AM
Why RB? Powell and McGuire look good enough to me unless we could get some superstar back. We need a line first.
Bilal Powell will be 30 next season. Elijah Maguire is fine, but he is not a between the tackles back.
This team absolutely needs help on the offensive line, but we also need a power back.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 25, 2017, 11:04:20 AM
Post by: Libero_2 on December 25, 2017, 03:21:44 PM
Maccagnan could have easily taken Kevin White instead of Williams in 2015. A lot of people wanted him too. He drafted a player at a position where we were loaded. It was a bolder move than he gets credit for. Look at our dominant defensive line now...
Watson and Mahomes were passed over in 2017 for Adams. Passing on a quarterback was another risk for him.
Were they really no brainers? He's sticking to his guns and drafting from his board.
True. But that's what a good GM does, builds the board (properly) and sticks to it. He did the right thing in both cases as both kids were better players than the others on the board. I don't think Adams will ever be a guy we wished we passed over, unless Mahommes becomes the second coming of Rodgers, but I get your point.
He has drafted terrible offensive football players to date. But if you don't trust him to get guys on that side of the ball, should you really trust him to be your GM?
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 25, 2017, 03:25:35 PM
True. But that's what a good GM does, builds the board (properly) and sticks to it. He did the right thing in both cases as both kids were better players than the others on the board. I don't think Adams will ever be a guy we wished we passed over, unless Mahommes becomes the second coming of Rodgers, but I get your point.That was the point I made in the post game thread. I don't trust him to draft a quarterback. It's not that Petty and Hack are busts, it's the mold of QB that he likes that worries me. Maybe we'll sign a vet QB and hope for the best.
He has drafted terrible offensive football players to date. But if you don't trust him to get guys on that side of the ball, should you really trust him to be your GM?
Post by: Fenwyr on December 25, 2017, 04:40:53 PM
I do not like Hack. I hated the pick. I would just love to be proven wrong.
Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 26, 2017, 02:11:08 PM
Hack looked better than Petty warming up when he hurt his hand.
At least we have new footage of Hack in a Jets jersey throwing a football. It will have to do for another year.
Post by: insanity on December 26, 2017, 03:37:56 PM
At least we have new footage of Hack in a Jets jersey throwing a football. It will have to do for another year.
The only thing I can think of is maybe they don't have the plays in their playbook and they dont have time to install something so different mid season when you don't really get any padded practices.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 26, 2017, 06:06:59 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on December 26, 2017, 06:47:54 PM
7th pick right now. What are our chances at 4/5?
I thought we couldn't get to 5, and only had an outside shot at 6.
Post by: Johnny English on December 26, 2017, 07:23:39 PM
I thought we couldn't get to 5, and only had an outside shot at 6.
I think you're right. We would need to lose to the Patriots and the Bears beat the Vikings to get to 6, and I don't think we can overtake the Buccaneers or Texans even if we lose and they win because we'd have the same record and they will still have inferior conference records.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 26, 2017, 08:00:19 PM
We can get to to 5 at best.
Strength of schedule is the first tie breaker if records are identical. Assuming we lose, we could pass Denver if they win based on record alone. We can pass Tampa if they win because they have a stronger strength of schedule than us. Can't pass the Texans since they lost last night. They have a weaker strength of schedule. Already ahead of Bears. Not sure how SOS will shake out if 49ers lose.
Post by: Johnny English on December 26, 2017, 08:09:54 PM
http://www.tankathon.com/nfl
We can get to to 5 at best.
Strength of schedule is the first tie breaker if records are identical. Assuming we lose, we could pass Denver if they win based on record alone. We can pass Tampa if they win because they have a stronger strength of schedule than us.
I thought division and then conference records were the first tiebreaker, or is that just for playoffs? Seems perverse they'd use different tiebreakers depending on whether you're considering postseason or draft.
NFL.com has us currently below Denver and Chicago in league standings, but ahead of the Niners.
https://www.nfl.com/standings/league/2017/REG
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2017, 08:14:41 PM
I thought division and then conference records were the first tiebreaker, or is that just for playoffs? Seems perverse they'd use different tiebreakers depending on whether you're considering postseason or draft.Why should division and conference records matter for the draft? If the Jets end up with the same record as the 49ers, it shouldn't matter if the Jets are 5-6 in the AFC and the 49ers are 2-9 in the NFC. It's an entirely different entity.
NFL.com has us currently below Denver and Chicago in league standings, but ahead of the Niners.
https://www.nfl.com/standings/league/2017/REG
Post by: Johnny English on December 26, 2017, 08:24:43 PM
Why should division and conference records matter for the draft? If the Jets end up with the same record as the 49ers, it shouldn't matter if the Jets are 5-6 in the AFC and the 49ers are 2-9 in the NFC. It's an entirely different entity.
I guess, although if you lose in the NFL wildcard game you'll pick ahead of a team that loses in the AFC Divisional round regardless of the respective strength of your conference so it's not like conference strength isn't a factor in draft position.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 26, 2017, 08:27:18 PM
Post by: Johnny English on December 26, 2017, 08:35:47 PM
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Football_League_Draft#Rules_for_determining_draft_order
freak off with your facts and excrement. Also, I don't think that there's a sensible argument that SOS isn't at least partly biased on conference given the way schedules are built.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2017, 08:41:44 PM
freak off with your facts and excrement. Also, I don't think that there's a sensible argument that SOS isn't at least partly biased on conference given the way schedules are built.It's a little biased, but I think it makes more sense than doing another method.
The goal is to find the worst teams. So you want the teams with the worst records first, and if there's a tie, you want the team that did worse against the easier schedule.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 26, 2017, 08:55:21 PM
freak off with your facts and excrement. Also, I don't think that there's a sensible argument that SOS isn't at least partly biased on conference given the way schedules are built.I didn't spend any time thinking about the validity of it.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2017, 01:16:22 AM
It sounds like Kansas City may do the same against Denver.
Post by: Fenwyr on December 27, 2017, 02:09:38 AM
In typical Jets fashion, we'll beat the Patriots by 3.
Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2017, 02:10:50 AM
In typical Jets fashion, we'll beat the Patriots by 3.
That would be fine with me. We're out of the running for the top quarterbacks already anyway.
Beat the Patriots*
Post by: Laxin on December 27, 2017, 07:11:13 AM
That could open up a bidding war for the 2nd pick, and maybe the Jets make a competitive offer.
Outside of that, hope for the Broncos, 49ers and Bucs to win. The Bucs winning is probably not likely though.
On a side note, head-to-head should be the first tie breaker over SOS. That's kind of bullshit imo.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 27, 2017, 07:19:35 AM
On a side note, head-to-head should be the first tie breaker over SOS. That's kind of bullshit imo.
The issue there is, say you have 3 teams with the same record. Say they all played each other some time in the year. Team A beat Team B. Team B beat Team C. Team C beat Team A. What do you do then?
Or what if Team A beat B, but C didn't play either of them. Where do you put C if head to head is the first tie breaker?
I can see it if you only have 2 teams with the same record and they played each other. That makes sense.
Post by: Laxin on December 27, 2017, 07:38:27 AM
The issue there is, say you have 3 teams with the same record. Say they all played each other some time in the year. Team A beat Team B. Team B beat Team C. Team C beat Team A. What do you do then?
Or what if Team A beat B, but C didn't play either of them. Where do you put C if head to head is the first tie breaker?
I can see it if you only have 2 teams with the same record and they played each other. That makes sense.
Yeah I didn't think about that. Just frustrating seeing a team (like the Broncos) that killed the Jets potentially pick ahead of us because of an easier schedule.
Post by: MBGreen on December 27, 2017, 07:45:21 AM
That would be fine with me. We're out of the running for the top quarterbacks already anyway.not necessarily...if the Colts can nab the 2nd pick overall, we may have a trade partner.
Beat the Patriots*
EDIT: nvm..laxin beat me to it
Post by: bojanglesman on December 27, 2017, 08:25:49 AM
Post by: MBGreen on December 27, 2017, 08:38:43 AM
I guess we still need to see if Darnold and Rosen both declare. I can't imagine either would go back to school knowing they are virtually guaranteed to be top 3 picks and their draft status wouldn't improve more than 1-2 spota at most with injury or shitty play as a risk to drop them.Darnold better declare.....his draft eligibility and his love for the Jets
Post by: Johnny English on December 27, 2017, 08:48:44 AM
I guess we still need to see if Darnold and Rosen both declare. I can't imagine either would go back to school knowing they are virtually guaranteed to be top 3 picks and their draft status wouldn't improve more than 1-2 spota at most with injury or shitty play as a risk to drop them.
Rosen would be an idiot not to declare, regardless of whether he thinks he's going to end up in Cleveland or not. One more bang to the head playing as a senior and he's going to go from being a concensus top 3 pick to a huge question mark over whether he's draftable at all.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 27, 2017, 08:55:00 AM
Rosen would be an idiot not to declare, regardless of whether he thinks he's going to end up in Cleveland or not. One more bang to the head playing as a senior and he's going to go from being a concensus top 3 pick to a huge question mark over whether he's draftable at all.I have to wonder if it affects anything with him this year. It'll be fun to look back at our thoughts now when the draft rolls around. After the draft analysts are done overanalyzing Rosen and his medical/attitude issues, he may drop a round this year.
Post by: Laxin on December 27, 2017, 09:06:41 AM
I have to wonder if it affects anything with him this year. It'll be fun to look back at our thoughts now when the draft rolls around. After the draft analysts are done overanalyzing Rosen and his medical/attitude issues, he may drop a round this year.
Its funny that Rosen will be given a pass on his medical issues, yet Lamar Jackson hasn't been injured at all (from my knowledge at least) but he'll have constant questions about his frame and style of play and how it'll lead to injury.
Post by: Fenwyr on December 27, 2017, 09:22:09 AM
Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
Post by: Laxin on December 27, 2017, 10:15:52 AM
I just cant imagine having to look at Rosen for 10 years. He looks like a Manning fucked a toucan.
Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
I'd look at Sloth from the Goonies for 10 years if he was a franchise QB.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 27, 2017, 10:55:56 AM
Post by: Johnny English on December 27, 2017, 11:13:12 AM
I'll just say it for the last time this season. freak the tank. Win. Especially against those fucks from Foxboro.
The Steelers are at home to Cleveland on Sunday. If we can find a way to beat the Patriots then their road to the Super Bowl goes through Heinz Field, and I don't think that they can pull it off there again. They have serious defensive problems.
I would be willing to accept defeat on Sunday if we also manage to give Brady a season / career ending injury. That would feel very much like a victory.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 27, 2017, 11:22:59 AM
The Steelers are at home to Cleveland on Sunday. If we can find a way to beat the Patriots then their road to the Super Bowl goes through Heinz Field, and I don't think that they can pull it off there again. They have serious defensive problems.
I would be willing to accept defeat on Sunday if we also manage to give Brady a season / career ending injury. That would feel very much like a victory.
I don't root for injury, but I wouldn't be the least bit upset if it happened to him.
Post by: sg3 on December 27, 2017, 02:35:00 PM
The Steelers are at home to Cleveland on Sunday. If we can find a way to beat the Patriots then their road to the Super Bowl goes through Heinz Field, and I don't think that they can pull it off there again. They have serious defensive problems.Lord Hear our Prayer. Amen
I would be willing to accept defeat on Sunday if we also manage to give Brady a season / career ending injury. That would feel very much like a victory.
Post by: Johnny English on December 27, 2017, 02:35:54 PM
Lord Hear our Prayer. Amen
Save your breath. If there is a god then he sure as freak ain't a Jets fan.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 27, 2017, 02:40:52 PM
Save your breath. If there is a god then he sure as freak ain't a Jets fan.
Maybe he's a Song of Ice and Fire fan and wants to supply GRRM with ample angst.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 27, 2017, 05:26:33 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 27, 2017, 05:29:49 PM
Post by: MBGreen on December 27, 2017, 06:18:40 PM
It sounds like Paxton Lynch is starting too though.we need him to win
Post by: Laxin on December 28, 2017, 09:22:34 AM
Assuming the Jets lose, best case scenario for the tank: Giants win, Colts lose, Broncos win, 49ers win.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 28, 2017, 09:26:13 AM
It sounds like LA is resting a lot of their starters including Goff, Gurley and Donald.We can pass the Bucs if they win too, but they aren't going to beat the Saints.
Assuming the Jets lose, best case scenario for the tank: Giants win, Colts lose, Broncos win, 49ers win.
Realistically we are probably going to end up with the 6th pick and the Giants will end up with the 2nd.
Funny how we keep getting the 6th pick specifically. 3 of the past 4 years potentially.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 28, 2017, 09:37:38 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 28, 2017, 09:48:58 AM
What if the Browns sign Cousins? Then trade away the 1st pick for an derriere load of picks to someone like the Bills. Now the Browns have a QB and still plenty of cash and 3-4 first round picks and 100 others. With the right GM, that team could be dangerous.
Post by: Johnny English on December 28, 2017, 10:00:15 AM
Funny how we keep getting the 6th pick specifically. 3 of the past 4 years potentially.
Both previous times we have picked up a falling star who wasn't expected to get there, so I'm good with that happening again. Sign Cousins in FA and then draft Arden Key at 6.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 28, 2017, 10:08:47 AM
Both previous times we have picked up a falling star who wasn't expected to get there, so I'm good with that happening again. Sign Cousins in FA and then draft Arden Key at 6.Yep.
Post by: Fenwyr on December 28, 2017, 01:28:06 PM
Both previous times we have picked up a falling star who wasn't expected to get there, so I'm good with that happening again. Sign Cousins in FA and then draft Arden Key at 6.I don't watch much college football, so I had to look him up.
If we sign Cousins, I would prefer a LT there, but if sign Cousins and a LT, sure.
Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
Post by: MBGreen on December 29, 2017, 12:36:16 PM
Andrew Luck: 'I don't think I need another surgery'
I hope that's true, because that will make the Colts a viable trade-up target for the Jets next April.
Post by: Laxin on December 31, 2017, 04:52:37 PM
Post by: Johnny English on December 31, 2017, 05:39:08 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 05:41:05 PM
I've lost track of what we're hoping for.49ers to win
Bucs to win
Broncos to win
Other than that, Seattle to lose or Atlanta win to bump up 2nd round pick we got from Seattle.
Also a QB
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 05:59:08 PM
Given up on the Broncos.
Post by: Laxin on December 31, 2017, 06:06:16 PM
49ers to win
Bucs to win
Broncos to win
Other than that, Seattle to lose or Atlanta win to bump up 2nd round pick we got from Seattle.
Also a QB
Broncos have just about wrapped up an L. 49ers will get the win, and Bucs still have a chance.
Locked into the 7th spot, with the possibility of the 6th pick if the Bucs win.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 06:14:34 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 06:17:47 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 06:20:26 PM
Post by: Laxin on December 31, 2017, 06:21:53 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 06:22:42 PM
Bucs need to go from the 5 to field goal rangeAt least it's just a fg. Then again, who is their kicker, Miamipuck?
Post by: Laxin on December 31, 2017, 06:31:20 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 06:31:24 PM
Post by: MBGreen on December 31, 2017, 06:31:39 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 06:32:53 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 06:36:03 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 06:36:54 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 06:38:41 PM
Home: Pats, Bills, Dolphins, Vikings, Packers, Texans, Colts, Broncos
Away: Pats, Bills, Dolphins, Lions, Bears, Titans, Jaguars, Browns
#nyj
Post by: MBGreen on December 31, 2017, 06:39:34 PM
Jets 2018 opponents are set:freak...i wish the Vikings game was a road game
Home: Pats, Bills, Dolphins, Vikings, Packers, Texans, Colts, Broncos
Away: Pats, Bills, Dolphins, Lions, Bears, Titans, Jaguars, Browns
#nyj
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 06:41:19 PM
Nvmd too late.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 31, 2017, 06:48:20 PM
Post by: MBGreen on December 31, 2017, 06:49:16 PM
Denver was the bigger one because they are probably going to take a QB. So that Broncos loss could cost us someone like Mayfield. So get ready for Josh Allen rumors.I'm not ruling out a trade up
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 07:03:20 PM
1 Browns
2 Giants
3 Colts
4 Browns
5 Broncos
6 Jets
7 Bucs
8 Bears
9/10 49ers/Raiders (tie)
11 Dolphins
12 Bengals
13/14 Redskins/Packers (tie)
15 Cardinals
16 Ravens
17 Chargers
18 Seahawks
19/20 Cowboys/Lions (tie)
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 31, 2017, 07:05:32 PM
And we take our annual trip to Cleveland again.
Post by: MBGreen on December 31, 2017, 07:07:21 PM
Post by: reuben on December 31, 2017, 07:14:12 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 07:18:00 PM
We need to get in front of either the Giants or the Broncos. Fortunately, the Browns have been our best trade partners for years and they own both slots.We will have to give away 900 years of picks to get to #1.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 31, 2017, 07:30:43 PM
At least the jets off-season should be a fun one. plenty of cap space, high draft pick....this better be the year we improve the offense.
We've had some of our greatest moments in March.
Post by: MBGreen on December 31, 2017, 07:31:11 PM
We will have to give away 900 years of picks to get to #1.we're gonna do it for Josh Allen
#prepareyourbum
Post by: MBGreen on December 31, 2017, 07:31:56 PM
We've had some of our greatest moments in March.only when your favorite accountant was running the show
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 31, 2017, 07:34:33 PM
only when your favorite accountant was running the show
He was Mr March. And Jewish, which makes him a quality accountant by default.
Post by: casman02 on December 31, 2017, 07:47:47 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 09:03:36 PM
Post by: MBGreen on December 31, 2017, 09:09:54 PM
3 teams in front of us will be looking for a QB. I don't see trading up as an option.
things can change alot between now and April. One of those teams (or us for that matter) could look to Free Agency for a QB too.
Rosen and Darnold still haven't declared for the draft yet either.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 31, 2017, 09:12:56 PM
3 teams in front of us will be looking for a QB. I don't see trading up as an option.
Aren't there 4 or 5 viable QBs?
Post by: MBGreen on December 31, 2017, 09:13:52 PM
Aren't there 4 or 5 viable QBs?
Rosen, Darnold, Allen, Jackson and Mayfield could all have 1st round grades.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 09:20:21 PM
Post by: Fenwyr on December 31, 2017, 09:30:53 PM
We will have to give away 900 years of picks to get to #1.Won't take much to get their 4th if our guy is there.
Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
Post by: bojanglesman on December 31, 2017, 09:54:58 PM
Won't take much to get their 4th if our guy is there.I do this excrement every year way too soon. No point in guessing.
Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 31, 2017, 09:58:04 PM
I do this excrement every year way too soon. No point in guessing.
This is why I stop posting in the off season. It's enough to make you crazy, like in The Shining.
Post by: MBGreen on December 31, 2017, 10:01:28 PM
This is why I stop posting in the off season. It's enough to make you crazy, like in The Shining.
are you going into hibernation soon?
Post by: Badger on December 31, 2017, 10:37:07 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 31, 2017, 11:21:28 PM
are you going into hibernation soon?
Probably. The less Jets stuff there is to talk about, I kind of drift out of here.
Post by: MBGreen on December 31, 2017, 11:23:46 PM
Probably. The less Jets stuff there is to talk about, I kind of drift out of here.
lots to talk about in one of the most important offseasons we'll have in a long time.
Post by: insanity on January 01, 2018, 12:52:33 AM
A team that doesn't need a quarterback at #2 and the Jets at #5.
Post by: Italian Seafood on January 01, 2018, 07:20:01 AM
lots to talk about in one of the most important offseasons we'll have in a long time.
True. When something happens I'll be here, I just can't take months of the same speculation and nothing happens. We're not in the coaching transactions this year, so we're looking at March when the next interesting thing happens.
Post by: Laxin on January 01, 2018, 08:42:47 AM
It's crazy how much the Texans winning would have changed things.
A team that doesn't need a quarterback at #2 and the Jets at #5.
Yeah that one really hurt. freaking TJ Yates
Post by: Italian Seafood on January 01, 2018, 08:55:41 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on April 27, 2018, 01:27:32 PM
Post by: Badger on April 27, 2018, 01:31:52 PM
Post by: Badger on April 27, 2018, 01:34:16 PM
Bowles has proven he needs the offense to be left in capable hands. Thankfully, he found Morton.
Post by: Italian Seafood on April 27, 2018, 02:03:24 PM
Browns make me nervous. It's hard to out-Clevelend Cleveland.
Some facts stand up over the ages.
Post by: MBGreen on April 27, 2018, 04:51:47 PM
Tank is back on.
Post by: bojanglesman on April 27, 2018, 05:01:15 PM
The Jets cut JoJo Natson.
Tank is back on.
(http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/I-dont-believe-you.gif)
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 13, 2018, 08:31:26 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 13, 2018, 08:32:17 PM
Quote
So, wrapping it all together, Jets look to be in very good tank shape.
Their 16-game SOS is currently the easiest among the <3 wins club by a wide margin, great for potential tiebreakers.
Their *remaining* SOS is harder than all but OAK, looking good for Ls to stack/pass teams
-Nania
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 18, 2018, 09:10:21 PM
Jets vs Patriots
49ers (2-8) at Bucs (3-7)
Raiders (2-8) at Ravens (5-5)
Cardinals (2-8) at Chargers (7-3)
Post by: insanity on November 19, 2018, 06:59:16 AM
Next week:
Jets vs Patriots
49ers (2-8) at Bucs (3-7)
Raiders (2-8) at Ravens (5-5)
Cardinals (2-8) at Chargers (7-3)
While I want to root for the 49ers. I can't see there being anyway we finish the season 0-6
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 19, 2018, 08:21:54 AM
While I want to root for the 49ers. I can't see there being anyway we finish the season 0-6
Did you see the Buffalo game? That was supposed to be the one the PR dept used for highlights all offseason to show how good we are, after a lot of people forgot how bad we are.
Post by: MBGreen on November 19, 2018, 08:36:59 AM
While I want to root for the 49ers. I can't see there being anyway we finish the season 0-6
Matt Barkley torched us at home. 0-6 is certainly on the table.
Post by: Koz on November 19, 2018, 08:40:02 AM
Post by: MBGreen on November 19, 2018, 08:50:12 AM
Why the hell am I going to the Pats game? If my boys weren't so excited I'd easily pass, even with suite tickets.
You cited "free food" when i asked you this a few weeks ago.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 19, 2018, 09:10:28 AM
Why the hell am I going to the Pats game? If my boys weren't so excited I'd easily pass, even with suite tickets.
Praying for a Jamal Adams killshot on Bardy on every defensive snap is about I’ll ive got
Post by: mj2sexay on November 19, 2018, 09:12:37 AM
Praying for a Jamal Adams killshot on Bardy on every defensive snap is about I’ll ive got
He's done soon enough anyway.
Post by: insanity on November 19, 2018, 09:20:58 AM
Did you see the Buffalo game? That was supposed to be the one the PR dept used for highlights all offseason to show how good we are, after a lot of people forgot how bad we are.I know, but football will happen and we'll end up beating the patriots in Foxboro.
Also Barkley ain't going to beat us twice
Post by: Heismanberg on November 19, 2018, 09:25:46 AM
Why the hell am I going to the Pats game? If my boys weren't so excited I'd easily pass, even with suite tickets.
Their excitement will quickly turn to tears
Post by: IATA on November 19, 2018, 09:57:43 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 19, 2018, 09:59:55 AM
He's done soon enough anyway.This has been said for about 10 years now it seems. I'm not convinced he won't play till he's 50 unless someone hits him hard enough on the field to injure him.
Post by: MBGreen on November 19, 2018, 10:24:11 AM
Also Barkley ain't going to beat us twice
Josh Allen will probably play when we're up in Buffalo.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 19, 2018, 10:58:34 AM
This has been said for about 10 years now it seems. I'm not convinced he won't play till he's 50 unless someone hits him hard enough on the field to injure him.
We brought him in by knocking out Bledsoe, only right if we finish him.
15 yards and an ejection? Yeah, we're 3-7, bring it.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 19, 2018, 11:29:32 AM
Why the hell am I going to the Pats game? If my boys weren't so excited I'd easily pass, even with suite tickets.
Pats are only -7.5...which seems really low. I'd at least make some money while you're there so you can actually enjoy the blowout
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 19, 2018, 11:46:55 AM
Pats are only -7.5...which seems really low. I'd at least make some money while you're there so you can actually enjoy the blowout
Division game, we usually play them tight at home. We'll lose, make no mistake, but it could be closer than the Buffalo game.
Post by: mj2sexay on November 19, 2018, 12:59:55 PM
Pats are only -7.5...which seems really low. I'd at least make some money while you're there so you can actually enjoy the blowout
Lol, I know at least one team I'll be including in my mega-money teaser.
The other play is to just parlay the Pats w/the spread but buy back a point.
EDIT: Pats are a 9.5 point fav on my service. I still like them on a teaser. Honestly, I still like them straight up. Off a loss coming off a bye? Belicheck doesn't need more than 2 days to prepare for this shitsquad, nevermind two weeks.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 23, 2018, 12:20:02 PM
Quote
Most estimated cap space in 2019
1. Colts- $118.5M
2. Jets- $95.6M
3. Browns- $84.9M
4. Bills- $84.2M
5. Raiders- $73.1M
6. Texans- $68.4M
7. 49ers- $67.0M
8. Cardinals- $63.3M
9. Seahawks- $54.7M
10. Bengals- $54.1M
Post by: Johnny English on November 23, 2018, 12:24:48 PM
Post by: insanity on November 25, 2018, 09:15:14 PM
After the cardinals, 49ers, and raiders performances I don't think there is any chance we get a higher pick than #4
Post by: mj2sexay on November 26, 2018, 12:32:50 AM
Was a mediocre day for the tank.
After the cardinals, 49ers, and raiders performances I don't think there is any chance we get a higher pick than #4
Given all three teams respective schedules as well, its looking very likely they all lose out.
Post by: ScotlandJet on November 26, 2018, 03:04:07 AM
Given all three teams respective schedules as well, its looking very likely they all lose out.
I think the Raiders might spring another win so there is that. We are not winning another game.
Post by: insanity on November 26, 2018, 06:49:46 AM
I think the Raiders might spring another win so there is that. We are not winning another game.
Bills, Packers, and titans are all going to be close
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 26, 2018, 08:05:55 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 26, 2018, 01:14:22 PM
Quote
Rich Cimini
Verified account
@RichCimini (https://twitter.com/RichCimini/status/1067041945543942144)
Jets still holding the No. 4 draft pick. They have a 6.9% chance of getting the No. 1 pick and a 79.5% chance of getting a top-5 pick, per ESPN analytics. #Jets
8:06 AM - 26 Nov 2018
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2018, 01:27:15 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 26, 2018, 01:33:09 PM
^ I don't see us climbing into the top 3, even if we lose out.
Think negative man, we can do it.
Post by: Johnny English on November 26, 2018, 01:33:47 PM
49ers have the Seahawks twice, Broncos, Bears and Rams. They also could very easily lose out.
Giants have the Bears, Titans, Colts, Cowboys and Redskins. I think they'll probably pick up one or two wins from that.
Jags have the Colts, Titans, Redskins, Dolphins and Texans. I think they'll get two more wins.
We have the Titans, Bills, Texans, Packers and Patriots. I'm going to guess at two more wins, although it wouldn't be a huge shock to get none.
Top 3 is possible and if we lose out I think we'll definitely be in it.
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2018, 01:43:18 PM
Think negative man, we can do it.
you don't make alot of friends when you're being realistic.
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2018, 01:46:40 PM
Raiders have the Chiefs twice, the Steelers, the Broncos and the Bengals on the road. I can easily see them not winning another one.
49ers have the Seahawks twice, Broncos, Bears and Rams. They also could very easily lose out.
Giants have the Bears, Titans, Colts, Cowboys and Redskins. I think they'll probably pick up one or two wins from that.
Jags have the Colts, Titans, Redskins, Dolphins and Texans. I think they'll get two more wins.
We have the Titans, Bills, Texans, Packers and Patriots. I'm going to guess at two more wins, although it wouldn't be a huge shock to get none.
Top 3 is possible and if we lose out I think we'll definitely be in it.
You didn't mention the Cards, who i believe are in 3rd right now.
I'm only concerned with the Raiders, Niners and Cards. I don't see those teams winning another game either. Although, i think the Raiders could beat the Bengals...but i'm convinced they're tanking on purpose. They're loading up for the eventual move to Vegas.
Post by: Johnny English on November 26, 2018, 01:50:35 PM
You didn't mention the Cards, who i believe are in 3rd right now.
I'm only concerned with the Raiders, Niners and Cards. I don't see those teams winning another game either. Although, i think the Raiders could beat the Bengals...but i'm convinced they're tanking on purpose. They're loading up for the eventual move to Vegas.
You're right, I missed the Cards. They have the Packers, Lions, Falcons, Rams and Seahawks; they've been better since they ditched McCoy and I think they'll win one, perhaps two.
Post by: Pope on November 26, 2018, 01:52:21 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2018, 01:54:03 PM
You're right, I missed the Cards. They have the Packers, Lions, Falcons, Rams and Seahawks; they've been better since they ditched McCoy and I think they'll win one, perhaps two.
i think they're 2-9...they may be competitive with the Lions, but the rest of their sched is hot napalm. They'll finish ahead of us in the draft order i'm sure.
We're probably gonna be 4th, which i'm fine with. That's a legit shot at Jonah Williams.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 26, 2018, 01:54:17 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2018, 01:58:30 PM
I don't see what game we're winning, unless Green Bay is a complete wheels off mess by the time they get here, I don't see a win in any of our remaining games. We can barely score a touchdown and we can't stop the run for more than a few plays.
Our D won't stop Aaron Rodgers
Post by: Johnny English on November 26, 2018, 01:59:44 PM
i think they're 2-9...they may be competitive with the Lions, but the rest of their sched is hot napalm. They'll finish ahead of us in the draft order i'm sure.
We're probably gonna be 4th, which i'm fine with. That's a legit shot at Jonah Williams.
"Hot napalm"? The Packers and Falcons have been excrement this season, and Seattle have been hit and miss. The only properly good team on their schedule is LA.
I'm not saying they're going to win all or even any of those games, but I think they've got a reasonable chance of picking up at least a couple of wins.
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2018, 02:07:44 PM
"Hot napalm"? The Packers and Falcons have been excrement this season, and Seattle have been hit and miss. The only properly good team on their schedule is LA.
I'm not saying they're going to win all or even any of those games, but I think they've got a reasonable chance of picking up at least a couple of wins.
I watched the Cards play yesterday against the Chargers. I'll be floored if they win another game down the stretch.
David Johnson is being wasted in that scheme.
Seattle has won their last 2 against Carolina and Green Bay and they've only lost 1 game to a team with a losing record (Den in week 1)...they play Arizona in Seattle later in the year, they're not losing to the Cards at home.
The Cards have 2 home games left (one is against the Lions, which i've already mentioned they'll have a chance against), but the other is against the Rams. Unless the Rams are resting their starters for that game, they're not winning that either.
The Cards also have a single road win, and that's against the Niners.
I'm not sure where you're getting this "reasonable" chance idea that they're going to win some games.
Post by: Johnny English on November 26, 2018, 02:13:47 PM
I watched the Cards play yesterday against the Chargers. I'll be floored if they win another game down the stretch.
David Johnson is being wasted in that scheme.
Seattle has won their last 2 against Carolina and Green Bay and they've only lost 1 game to a team with a losing record (Den in week 1)...they play Arizona in Seattle later in the year, they're not losing to the Cards at home.
The Cards have 2 home games left (one is against the Lions, which i've already mentioned they'll have a chance against), but the other is against the Rams. Unless the Rams are resting their starters for that game, they're not winning that either.
The Cards also have a single road win, and that's against the Niners.
I'm not sure where you're getting this "reasonable" chance idea that they're going to win some games.
They started OK yesterday, then the Chargers put their foot on the gas and took them apart. That's a damn good team though. I'm not saying that the Cards will get any more wins, they might well not. I just don't think they're as bad as they were the first half of the season.
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2018, 02:15:20 PM
They started OK yesterday, then the Chargers put their foot on the gas and took them apart. That's a damn good team though. I'm not saying that the Cards will get any more wins, they might well not. I just don't think they're as bad as they were the first half of the season.
they're 2-9. are you serious?
Post by: Johnny English on November 26, 2018, 02:17:05 PM
they're 2-9. are you serious?
About what? What did you find so outrageous about that post?
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2018, 02:19:17 PM
About what? What did you find so outrageous about that post?
you said you don't think they're as bad. But...they are.
EDIT: Apparently the Cards cut their starting RT and one of their starting Safeties after their blowout loss yesterday. Good thing they're starting to show some life.
Post by: Johnny English on November 26, 2018, 02:46:48 PM
you said you don't think they're as bad. But...they are.
I'm guessing you didn't see them with Sam Bradford playing under Mike McCoy. Improved =/= good, but they've got a bit of talent there still on both sides of the ball.
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2018, 02:59:32 PM
I'm guessing you didn't see them with Sam Bradford playing under Mike McCoy. Improved =/= good, but they've got a bit of talent there still on both sides of the ball.
David Johnson, Patrick Peterson and Christian Kirk (freak Josh Rosen) are the only players worth keeping on that roster.
Steve Wilks turned that team into a dumpster fire.
Post by: Johnny English on November 26, 2018, 03:06:17 PM
David Johnson, Patrick Peterson and Christian Kirk (freak Josh Rosen) are the only players worth keeping on that roster.
Oday Aboushi says freak you.
In all seriousness, there's more talent than you're giving them credit for - Fitz and Iupati aren't long term players obviously, but they're still great vets. Chandler Jones is a very good player, and Amerson and Bucannon are both solid.
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2018, 03:08:20 PM
Oday Aboushi says freak you.
In all seriousness, there's more talent than you're giving them credit for - Fitz and Iupati aren't long term players obviously, but they're still great vets. Chandler Jones is a very good player, and Amerson and Bucannon are both solid.
lol Aboushi
I left Fitz and Iupati out because of age. Amerson is meh, Bucannon doesn't fit Wilks' scheme...which is probably why he was shopped at the deadline.
I agree about Chandler Jones. He's a stud.
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2018, 03:11:04 PM
Post by: Badger on December 02, 2018, 06:19:15 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2018, 06:24:19 PM
#LeftTackle
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 02, 2018, 06:25:38 PM
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2018, 06:28:10 PM
Jets lose, Cardinals win, and MBGreen looks like an idiot. Only 1 of those 3 things was surprising, but all 3 are positives for the #tank.
I'll take looking like a moron if that means we jump the Cards in the draft order.
#YourWelcome
Post by: Heismanberg on December 02, 2018, 06:31:03 PM
Good day for this.
#LeftTackle
There isn’t a left tackle worth a top three pick
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2018, 06:31:35 PM
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2018, 06:31:46 PM
There isn’t a left tackle worth a top three pick
that top 3 pick should attract some decent coaching candidates.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 02, 2018, 06:32:37 PM
that top 3 pick should attract some decent coaching candidates.
And maybe some quality trade offers
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 02, 2018, 06:33:08 PM
that top 3 pick should attract some decent coaching candidates.
And hopefully some teams desperate to move up for a quarterback.
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2018, 06:33:48 PM
And maybe some quality trade offers
maybe Jimmy Harbaugh could be enticed
#CrazyJim
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2018, 06:34:00 PM
And maybe some quality trade offers
Was thinking the same, we don't need a QB now.
Post by: Jumbo on December 02, 2018, 06:35:14 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2018, 06:36:30 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 02, 2018, 06:51:02 PM
No one's gonna give up a ransom for any QBs in this class most likely
Maybe for a pass rusher though
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2018, 06:58:39 PM
Post by: Johnny English on December 03, 2018, 09:43:05 AM
I'm not saying they're going to win all or even any of those games, but I think they've got a reasonable chance of picking up at least a couple of wins.
I watched the Cards play yesterday against the Chargers. I'll be floored if they win another game down the stretch.
I'm not sure where you're getting this "reasonable" chance idea that they're going to win some games.
I just don't think they're as bad as they were the first half of the season.
they're 2-9. are you serious?
Yo what up MB?
Post by: Johnny English on December 03, 2018, 09:44:25 AM
Or we get a pass rusher and finish off Brady. Would only be right.
I'm bored of this dream. It's never going to happen. No one hits Brady and hasn't for years - he reads pressure and avoids it too well, either by throwing the ball away or by turtling. He's going out on his own terms and we're going to have to accept it.
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2018, 09:45:01 AM
Yo what up MB?
what's up?
Post by: Johnny English on December 03, 2018, 09:46:24 AM
what's up?
Just wondered how you're feeling about the Cards today and how well you think your comments on them a few days ago have aged. Are you in fact "floored"?
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2018, 09:48:09 AM
Just wondered how you're feeling about the Cards today and how well you think your comments on them a few days ago have aged. Are you in fact "floored"?
I'm feeling pretty good. I still think the Cards stink (they're 3-9 after all). They gutted out an impressive win yesterday though, kudos to them.....it helps our draft, so i have no issue being wrong in this case.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 03, 2018, 11:28:54 AM
Quote
The Jets’ chances of getting the No. 1 pick jumped from 7 percent to 18 percent with the loss, per ESPN analytics. Currently have the third pick.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 03, 2018, 11:29:12 AM
Quote
The 49ers play the Rams week 17. Likely Rams bench all starters.
The Raiders play Chiefs week 17.
Chiefs keep winning, same will happen.
Post by: insanity on December 03, 2018, 11:53:40 AM
Good thing to look at but i think they will be fighting for home field advantage or a bye.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 03, 2018, 01:18:01 PM
Good thing to look at but i think they will be fighting for home field advantage or a bye.
I don’t think so.
They have a lead on the Saints now that they’ve lost to Dallas.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 03, 2018, 04:28:07 PM
Good thing to look at but i think they will be fighting for home field advantage or a bye.
I think it's much more likely that the rams bench still blows the doors off of SF.
Post by: insanity on December 03, 2018, 08:05:12 PM
I don’t think so.The chiefs will be though
They have a lead on the Saints now that they’ve lost to Dallas.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 09, 2018, 06:05:20 PM
San Francisco is close to beating Denver and Oakland has a chance against Pittsburgh with Roethlisberger knocked out of the game.
Falcons vs. Cardinals next week is a big one.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 09, 2018, 06:34:14 PM
Today's win really hasn't impacted our draft position too much.
San Francisco is close to beating Denver and Oakland has a chance against Pittsburgh with Roethlisberger knocked out of the game.
Falcons vs. Cardinals next week is a big one.
The flip side to that is had they lost theyd be in the #1 spot.
Post by: insanity on December 09, 2018, 08:07:41 PM
The flip side to that is had they lost theyd be in the #1 spot.And now we have the 5th pick in the draft instead. Yayyyyy
Post by: mj2sexay on December 09, 2018, 08:10:59 PM
And now we have the 5th pick in the draft instead. Yayyyyy
Very costly win. No Bosa for us.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 09, 2018, 08:21:18 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 09, 2018, 09:01:17 PM
Darnold game winning drive on the road with no talent around him and an incompetent coaching staff handcuffing him > losing
This
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 09, 2018, 09:05:49 PM
Darnold game winning drive on the road with no talent around him and an incompetent coaching staff handcuffing him > losing
Agreed. I'd rather watch them wins than watch them draft higher.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 09, 2018, 09:09:38 PM
We’ll be in a better position to land a WR or an OT now.
Post by: Johnny English on December 09, 2018, 09:49:59 PM
Bosa really isn’t that much better than Polite, Allen, and Ferrell.
We’ll be in a better position to land a WR or an OT now.
Won't some of this depend on coaching changes? A new offensive scheme might pivot to a man blocking scheme that better suits our personnel (although an elite tackle would obviously still be an upgrade). Equally, isn't Ferrell more of a 4-3 end? If our new DC favours a 3 man front we'll be fitting square pegs into round holes again.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 10, 2018, 08:13:17 AM
Post by: Gorilla on December 10, 2018, 10:51:36 AM
Bosa really isn’t that much better than Polite, Allen, and Ferrell.
We’ll be in a better position to land a WR or an OT now.
Tank is a consolation prize. freak losing. We'll be drafting high regardless.
I'm pretty much on board with these takes.
There's 3 games to go, so anything can still happen....a loss yesterday wouldn't have guaranteed anything as far as draft slot.
I'll take J.Allen/Polite/Jonah Williams and a positive, confidence-boosted Darnold over Bosa (who still is not the undeniable lock for #1 anyway).
We're going to have a high pick no matter what (we're not winning 4 games in a row). The only time I'd root for a tank over anything else is when there's a QB need and a Luck/ Darnold-level prospect in the draft. Hopefully we end up with the #6 again, as that will guarantee that Bosa magically falls to our pick. The NFL Gods like freaking with us.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 10, 2018, 12:44:16 PM
Darnold game winning drive on the road with no talent around him and an incompetent coaching staff handcuffing him > losing
Anyone whose opinion varies from this can freak right off.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 10, 2018, 12:49:47 PM
Darnold hit that pass to Anderson down the sideline where the defender couldn't get it, then stuck his neck out for the goal line on 3rd down. McGuire moved the pile on 3rd and 1 when he looked stopped, then found a hole and got the end zone on 4th and goal with the game in the balance. That's what you want your young players to do.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 10, 2018, 03:35:44 PM
Won't some of this depend on coaching changes? A new offensive scheme might pivot to a man blocking scheme that better suits our personnel (although an elite tackle would obviously still be an upgrade). Equally, isn't Ferrell more of a 4-3 end? If our new DC favours a 3 man front we'll be fitting square pegs into round holes again.
Both of our tackles should be upgraded regardless of scheme. On their best performances we're still dealing with middle of the road talents.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 14, 2018, 10:14:29 AM
OAK vs CIN
SF vs SEA
Post by: bojanglesman on December 15, 2018, 06:47:20 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 15, 2018, 07:03:32 PM
OTC: By the end of the day tomorrow the #Jets will now be up to at least the 4th pick in the draft.
If we get a top 3 pick and Darnold continues to progress, it will be a very fun offseason
Post by: Jumbo on December 15, 2018, 07:05:33 PM
If we get a top 3 pick and Darnold continues to progress, it will be a very fun offseason
Trade down for extra picks babbie
Post by: d sw0rdz on December 15, 2018, 07:30:19 PM
Trade down for extra picks babbie
we're going to be at a very good spot, will be interesting to see what happens with the draft selections. can either pick up a very good player there or trade down for a coveted spot and stockpile more picks. we should probably hold on to the pick for as long as possible unless we're blown away by a very good trade down the way we did with the colts
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2018, 09:11:56 AM
Would also like to secure a good spot by the end of next week, so Darnold can take us down the field and beat the Patriots in Foxboro guilt free. Maybe cost them a bye while giving them a look at the future.
Post by: Johnny English on December 16, 2018, 09:35:01 AM
Would like an elite LT to unexpectedly declare for the draft.
Would also like to secure a good spot by the end of next week, so Darnold can take us down the field and beat the Patriots in Foxboro guilt free. Maybe cost them a bye while giving them a look at the future.
Losing to the Texans yesterday and then beating the Patriots in Foxborough could really put a hole in their postseason plans; Houston have Philly on the road and Jacksonville at home to finish the season, whereas New England have Pittsburgh on the road and the Bills and Jets at home. It's quite possible that Houston win out, which leaves the Patriots needing to do the same to secure the bye.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 16, 2018, 09:42:39 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 16, 2018, 11:28:13 AM
I don't care if we end up picking 500th, beat the Pats.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 16, 2018, 04:48:18 PM
1. 49ers
2. Cardinals
3. Raiders
4. Jets
5. Jaguars
6. Falcons
7. Lions
8. Giants
9. Bucs
10. Bills
11. Packers
12. Panthers
13. Eagles
14. Bengals
15. Broncos
16. Browns
17. Dolphins
18. Redskins
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2018, 06:24:12 PM
Post by: guinness77 on December 16, 2018, 06:28:13 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 16, 2018, 06:28:29 PM
Post by: Jumbo on December 16, 2018, 06:29:35 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 16, 2018, 06:30:25 PM
If the Cardinals and Raiders both manage to get another win and we lose out, do we get the #1 pick?Yes
Post by: MBGreen on December 16, 2018, 06:32:01 PM
That moved us to the 3rd pick.Let’s gooo
Post by: bojanglesman on December 16, 2018, 06:34:03 PM
Let’s goooTodd's got this.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 16, 2018, 06:43:20 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 16, 2018, 06:44:55 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 16, 2018, 06:46:00 PM
Quote
#Jets most realistic path to the #1 overall pick is:
- Lose out (GB, NE)
- KC rests starters week 17 vs. OAK (or OAK upsets DEN this weekend)
- SEA rests starters because they are locked into #5 seed in week 17 vs. ARZ, ARZ wins (other game is Rams this weekend)
Post by: MBGreen on December 16, 2018, 06:49:35 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 16, 2018, 06:51:57 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 16, 2018, 06:52:41 PM
Too bad we don’t have a 2nd rounder. If we end up with the first overall pick...the first pick on the 2nd day is usually quite sought after for trades.Maybe we can hedge our bets and trade Leo to Oakland for their 2nd.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2018, 07:11:27 PM
Darnold plays great. Jets lose. 49ers win. Great weekend for the Jets.
Patriots and Dolphins lose.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2018, 07:12:24 PM
Todd's got this.
He might stay. #InToddWeTrust
Post by: bojanglesman on December 16, 2018, 07:33:54 PM
He might stay. #InToddWeTrust"Winnipeg poopchute murders New Yorker with earring. News at 11."
Post by: MBGreen on December 16, 2018, 07:45:27 PM
He might stay. #InToddWeTrustThe knicks might make the playoffs too
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2018, 07:53:32 PM
"Winnipeg poopchute murders New Yorker with earring. News at 11."
Wore the earring to the game last night. Good times.
Post by: Jumbo on December 23, 2018, 03:55:29 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 23, 2018, 04:50:23 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 23, 2018, 07:51:09 PM
Go Cardinals and Raiders
And seahawks
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 23, 2018, 08:20:06 PM
And seahawks
If the Seahawks win, do we move back in front of the Niners?
Post by: dcm1602 on December 24, 2018, 08:00:42 AM
Draft ranges (earliest-latest a team could pick)
1. AZ (1st-4th)
2. OAK (1st-9th)
3. SF (1st-5th)
4. NYJ (1st-5th)
5. DET (2nd-10th)
6. TB (4th-10th)
7. NYG (4th-10th)
8. BUF (4th-10th)
9. JAX (4th-11th)
10. ATL (5th-16th)
11. CAR (6th-16th)
12. CIN (9th-16th)
Post by: bojanglesman on December 24, 2018, 08:15:07 AM
For the Jets to get to number 1 they need to lose and
Arizona to beat Seattle
Raiders to beat the Broncos or the Chiefs
SF to beat Rams or Jets to win the SOS mentioned above.
The worst the Jets should be is fifth if they were to win and lose a tiebreaker to the Lions. I didnt run the tiebreakers in that scenario but Id think there is probably a better chance that the Jets would win a tiebreaker there than with the 49ers
Post by: Libero_2 on December 24, 2018, 08:52:02 PM
OTC:
For the Jets to get to number 1 they need to lose and
Arizona to beat Seattle
Raiders to beat the Broncos or the Chiefs
SF to beat Rams or Jets to win the SOS mentioned above.
The worst the Jets should be is fifth if they were to win and lose a tiebreaker to the Lions. I didnt run the tiebreakers in that scenario but Id think there is probably a better chance that the Jets would win a tiebreaker there than with the 49ers
With Oakland up 17 at the half on Denver (who looks lifeless right now)
Assuming they carry this out to a win, if my math is correct, the lowest we finish with a loss next week is 3, and a top 2 pick is seriously in play.
A top 2 pick would be pure gold. If #1 goes QB we get the best player in the draft in Bosa and if Bosa goes #1 chances are we can market that pick for a deal similar to what we have Indy last year for Sam. I think we would all trade down, remain in the top 10 and snag 3+ second rounders, where we still might have a real shot at Allen, the top OT or the top playmaker.
We really need Oakland to close this out and Rosen to play the game of his life this upcoming weekend
Post by: bojanglesman on December 24, 2018, 10:44:20 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 24, 2018, 11:42:57 PM
A lot of dust still has to settle, but we'll either end up with Josh Allen, the top tackle prospect, or more draft picks.
Post by: insanity on December 25, 2018, 10:27:00 AM
NYG over DAL
TB over ATL
BAL over CLE
LAC over DEN
Good thing is the top 3 games are all home games
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 25, 2018, 11:17:35 AM
We're in position to have an incredibly valuable trade chip.Top 2 pick would mean either Bosa or the most valuable trade chip in the draft for teams needing QBs.
A lot of dust still has to settle, but we'll either end up with Josh Allen, the top tackle prospect, or more draft picks.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 25, 2018, 11:21:50 AM
I can't believe how freaking badly that win over the bills boned us, we'd have an extremely high shot at having the #1 pick without it
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 25, 2018, 11:32:36 AM
Did any of those statistics websites crunch the numbers on us getting a top 2 pick?
I can't believe how freaking badly that win over the bills boned us, we'd have an extremely high shot at having the #1 pick without it
We've won one game in ten weeks, enjoy it.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 25, 2018, 11:36:12 AM
We've won one game in ten weeks, enjoy it.
Which could be the difference from winning the draft lottery, and getting a potentially very good player.
There's a 1.7% chance the Jets get the #1 pick
Basically we have to cross our fingers to land the 2 spot is best case scenario
Assuming the Jets and 49ers lose to the patriots and Rams, will we win the SOS tiebreaker?
Our SOS is. 002 off from the 49ers and the Rams would be 13-3 and the patriots 11-5
Not sure how much of a difference this game makes
Post by: dcm1602 on December 25, 2018, 11:43:07 AM
To get #1 is all of that and Arizona winning
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 25, 2018, 11:54:20 AM
Post by: dcm1602 on December 25, 2018, 11:58:02 AM
We have a franchise quarterback, $100 million in cap space, and what's looking like a top-3 pick in the draft. Anyone who can still find something to complain about deserves to be sterilized quickly.
I imagine having a top 3 pick gives us a lot to complain about.
Especially the man responsible for us picking there
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 25, 2018, 12:08:53 PM
I imagine having a top 3 pick gives us a lot to complain about.
Especially the man responsible for us picking there
You mean Sam Darnold? We weren't winning another game until he came back.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 25, 2018, 12:40:38 PM
You mean Sam Darnold? We weren't winning another game until he came back.
No... I was referring to our HC being a steaming pile of excrement
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 25, 2018, 12:57:41 PM
No... I was referring to our HC being a steaming pile of excrement
He's going to be fired in six days.
Post by: MBGreen on December 25, 2018, 01:02:24 PM
He's going to be fired in six days.Not fast enough
Post by: reuben on December 25, 2018, 01:12:24 PM
Not fast enough
Smart move would have been to give Brant Boyer a six week audition for HC by canning Bowles at the BYE but freak it, whatever.
Post by: MBGreen on December 25, 2018, 01:19:28 PM
Smart move would have been to give Brant Boyer a six week audition for HC by canning Bowles at the BYE but freak it, whatever.The jets have done one “smart move” in the last decade...drafting Darnold.
Expecting a 2nd smart move may have been overzealous.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2018, 02:23:49 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 26, 2018, 08:55:45 AM
The jets have done one “smart move” in the last decade...drafting Darnold.
Expecting a 2nd smart move may have been overzealous.
So we finally agree on the Revis trade and Rex.
Post by: MBGreen on December 26, 2018, 10:10:22 AM
So we finally agree on the Revis trade and Rex.Nope
Post by: dcm1602 on December 26, 2018, 10:18:49 AM
We need 3 of the 4 to happen.
NYG over DAL
TB over ATL
BAL over CLE
LAC over DEN
Good thing is the top 3 games are all home games
Looking at these games
Dallas should be resting their starters as they're locked into the 4 seed no?
Baltimore has a must win game to make the playoffs
And the chargers are playing for the difference of a first round bye vs wildcard spot.
The Atlanta Tampa game is my biggest concern
Post by: insanity on December 26, 2018, 10:44:12 AM
Looking at these gamesTampa is home so we got that going for us
Dallas should be resting their starters as they're locked into the 4 seed no?
Baltimore has a must win game to make the playoffs
And the chargers are playing for the difference of a first round bye vs wildcard spot.
The Atlanta Tampa game is my biggest concern
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 26, 2018, 07:22:15 PM
Post by: MBGreen on December 26, 2018, 07:29:39 PM
Losing Brant Boyer in the coaching change is going to suck.Sometimes you have to crack a few eggs to make dat omelette
Post by: bojanglesman on December 26, 2018, 08:37:03 PM
Post by: reuben on December 26, 2018, 08:37:04 PM
Losing Brant Boyer in the coaching change is going to suck.
Mike Westhoff survived multiple purges.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 26, 2018, 09:42:22 PM
Mike Westhoff survived multiple purges.
I don't think we can assume that to be the norm.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 27, 2018, 08:20:20 AM
Tampa is home so we got that going for us
Ryan Griffin - QB - Buccaneers
Coach Dirk Koetter wouldn't rule out giving Ryan Griffin some snaps at quarterback Week 17 against the Falcons.
Koetter said it on Christmas Eve and reiterated it Wednesday. "The guy's been here for three years," Koetter said. "He's worked his tail off. We just would like to see Ryan Griffin get a chance to get into a game if the opportunity presents itself." Griffin has been talked up by this coaching staff but has never appeared in a regular season game. With Jameis Winston's future also up in the air in Tampa Bay, it sounds like Griffin could get some run just to get a glance at him. That threat of playing time for Griffin takes Winston off the board in DFS cash games
Post by: insanity on December 27, 2018, 09:09:54 AM
Mike Westhoff survived multiple purges.
Yeah I don't see why the special teams coach would be released unless he didn't get along with the head coach
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 27, 2018, 01:01:23 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 27, 2018, 01:58:31 PM
Post by: Johnny English on December 27, 2018, 02:14:40 PM
Anyone know if Boyer is even under contract after this year? He might choose to hit the road.
Do position coaches and co-ordinators generally have limited term contracts?
Anyway, regardless of contract Boyer was brought in three years ago by Bowles. Boyer might prefer to follow Bowles to wherever he goes.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 27, 2018, 02:15:13 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on December 27, 2018, 05:23:08 PM
Do position coaches and co-ordinators generally have limited term contracts?
Anyway, regardless of contract Boyer was brought in three years ago by Bowles. Boyer might prefer to follow Bowles to wherever he goes.
Wouldn't that only be pertinent if Bowles is a HC?
Which is possible but fairly unlikely. Can't imagine a special team's coach desiring to follow a DC to another team.
That said I think it's fairly likely that a new HC brings in his own guy
Post by: Johnny English on December 27, 2018, 05:24:16 PM
Wouldn't that only be pertinent if Bowles is a HC?Yes, but I really wouldn't be surprised if he gets the Arizona job.
Which is possible but fairly unlikely. Can't imagine a special team's coach desiring to follow a DC to another team.
That said I think it's fairly likely that a new HC brings in his own guy
Post by: Libero_2 on December 27, 2018, 08:02:02 PM
Yes, but I really wouldn't be surprised if he gets the Arizona job.
If he goes there we should call and see what he wants for David Johnson. Not like Bowles recognizes offensive talent or cares to utilize it
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2018, 08:52:46 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 27, 2018, 08:59:31 PM
Josh Rosen would go from being abysmal to one of the worst first round QBs ever if Todd Bowles took over in Arizona...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181228/35309e720daf6bf6f7984ba1b02ff384.jpg)
Post by: bojanglesman on December 29, 2018, 08:46:27 AM
Jets' current position
The Jets are currently slated to pick third in the 2019 NFL Draft. They're tied with two other teams at 4-11 -- the 49ers and Raiders. They all trail the 3-12 Cardinals. The 49ers own the tiebreaker with the weakest strength of schedule, so they'd pick second if the season ended today. The Jets rank second in that category, which puts them third, ahead of the Raiders.
Current top 10
10. Falcons (6-9)
9. Jaguars (5-10)
7. Bills (5-10, tied with Giants on SOS)
7. Giants (5-10, tied with Bills on SOS)
6. Buccaneers (5-10)
5. Lions (5-10)
4. Raiders (4-11)
3. Jets (4-11)
2. 49ers (4-11)
1. Cardinals (3-12)
No. 1 pick scenarios
There are two possible scenarios that could land the Jets the No. 1 pick. One is relatively simple and only requires a little bit of outside help. The other would require a lot of help -- from five other teams.
1) Lose, plus two wins
If the Jets lose, but both the Cardinals and 49ers win, then the Jets will leapfrog their way to the top of the pack.
At that point, both the Jets and Cardinals would be tied at 4-12 -- but the Jets currently have a .506 strength of schedule, while the Cardinals' sits at .525. It's very unlikely that those numbers could change enough during Week 17 to flip and give Arizona the tiebreaker.
And if the 49ers win, then the Jets don't have to worry about a tiebreaker battle with them, as they'd move to five wins and fall down the pecking order.
2) Lose, plus some extra help
This scenario still starts with a Jets loss and a Cardinals win -- if Arizona doesn't win this week, they're locked in at No. 1 as the only three-win team.
But if the Jets get that help, but don't get the same cooperation from the 49ers, there's still a path to the No. 1 pick.
In this scenario, the Jets need three of the following four teams to win: Giants, Buccaneers, Ravens and Chargers.
If that happens, it would help tip the strength-of-schedule tiebreaker in the Jets' favor. They currently trail the 49ers in that category; the Jets have a .506 SOS, while the 49ers have a .504 mark.
The Raiders, who also have four wins, sit at .546, so neither the Jets nor 49ers have to worry about Oakland in a tiebreaker.
No. 2 pick scenarios
If the Jets aren't quite lucky enough to get all of that help, they can still move up to the No. 2 spot. There are three scenarios in which the Jets will pick second -- some of which require more aide than others.
1) Lose, plus a little help
This is definitely the simplest scenario: Jets lose, Cardinals lose, 49ers win.
The Cardinals lock up No. 1 with the loss, as we've already discussed. But the 49ers clear out of the four-win tie by beating the Rams. That leaves the Jets as the four-win team with the worst SOS, giving them the No. 2 spot.
NFL playoff picture: Week 17 scenarios | Vikings or Eagles? Colts or Titans? 1st-round byes to Chiefs, Chargers, Patriots, Texans, Rams or Bears?
2) Lose, plus some extra help
Again, it starts with a Jets loss and a Cardinals loss. But this time, the 49ers lose, too. Then it comes down to strength of schedule again, just like in the above scenario for the No. 1 pick.
Once again, a win from three of the four -- Giants, Bucs, Ravens and Chargers -- would give the Jets the tie-breaking edge, this time for the No. 2 spot.
3) Lose, plus some bad luck
Here's where things get a bit more complicated.
Say the Jets lose, the Cardinals win and the 49ers lose. Now they all have four wins.
Before we said that in this scenario, the Jets need three of those four teams -- Giants, Bucs, Ravens and Chargers -- to win in order to get the No. 1 pick.
But the Jets could still get the No. 2 pick if those three wins don't pull through. In that case, they would need three of those four teams to NOT win (so, lose or tie), in order for the cards to fall correctly and secure the second spot.
Kind of a weird inverse scenario, but hey, it's possible.
How far could they slide?
Say the Jets win on Sunday -- how much damage could they do to their draft stock?
If all of the other five-win teams lose during Week 17, then it would come down to strength of schedule. Right now, the Jets rank second among that pack -- which includes the Lions, Buccaneers, Giants, Bills and Jaguars -- in strength of schedule.
So, odds are the would only fall back to No. 5, behind the four-win Raiders (assuming, for the sake of this worst-case scenario, that they lose) and the five-win Lions.
The Bucs are the next closest in SOS at .521, leaving the Jets a decent cushion between No. 5 and No. 6.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 29, 2018, 08:56:45 AM
My prediction is that we lose this week and end up 3rd. I think that between the Giants, Ravens, Bucs, and Chargers, it'll be tough for 3 of the 4 to win. Even though Arizona and the 49ers are playing teams that have already clinched playoff spots, they are still playing for seed, so they won't likely take the week off. I don't think wither team is good enough to win playing against the Seahawks/Rams without help via resting starters. You never know though. If the Cards and 49ers are truly trying to win, it's hard to beat a team that will take huge risks with nothing to lose. Fake punts, going for it on 4th a lot, going for 2 at the end of games. excrement happens. Of course, the Cards might just stare at that #1 slot and just put forth a moderate effort.
If we were playing any other team besides the Pats this week, I wouldn't get too upset if we lost, but I'd be very happy to deny those fuckers their usual first week playoff bye and force them to play someone like the Colts or Ravens that no one wants to play. Well worth dropping to 5 in the draft.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 29, 2018, 09:02:53 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 29, 2018, 09:14:03 AM
We don't need the Niners to win to leap them.I know, but I don't think between the Giants, Bucs, Ravens, and Chargers that 3 of them will win, and it's unlikely the Cardinals win. Not saying it is highly unlikely, just less likely. The Chargers would be a safe bet to win. I think the Ravens will win at home, but Cleveland won't be easy to beat. If we only needed 2 of them, I'd say it's very likely. Can't rely on the Bucs or Giants to win no matter who they play.
Anything is possible though. It'll be a fun Sunday. This is our Super Bowl this year I guess.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 30, 2018, 08:50:18 AM
I think the Chargers should win, the Broncos looked dead against the Raiders last week and the Chargers are legitimately good and could end up with the #1 overall slot with a win and the right losses. The Giants are at home against a team resting most of their starters. Who knows what the Bucs do against Atlanta. The Ravens game may be the tough one to pick. They are playing well and are at home, but the Browns are hot lately too. Hopefully Mayfield proves that he was playing well against poor competition and flops against a real defense. It'll be fun to watch. I think there's a good shot at us finishing with the 2nd overall pick. I think it's too much to expect the Cards to win. They suck and I think the Rams' backups' wives could beat them.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 30, 2018, 03:15:02 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 30, 2018, 03:17:10 PM
Looks like the Jets need the 49ers or Cards to win to move up from 3.
Dang but I rooted for the patriots to assblast the Jets 38-3. Are you telling me that didn’t help?
Post by: bojanglesman on December 30, 2018, 03:19:13 PM
Dang but I rooted for the patriots to assblast the Jets 38-3. Are you telling me that didn’t help?I wanted the Jets to win today. Now that we didn't, nothing wrong with pulling for the right scenario.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 30, 2018, 03:22:03 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 30, 2018, 03:25:52 PM
Falcons cost themselves about 7 draft pick slots with their win, just to freak the Jets over.Man, that would suck as a fan, but at least they won.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 30, 2018, 03:26:30 PM
1. Arizona and San Francisco win
2. Either an Arizona win or a San Francisco win
Post by: dcm1602 on December 30, 2018, 03:51:47 PM
Post by: Gorilla on December 30, 2018, 04:13:03 PM
Can't freaking believe giants and Tampa both excrement the bed late in the 4th
Lol, can't you, though?
Eli on last drive: "Extra chromosome, activate!!"
Post by: Badger on December 30, 2018, 04:40:29 PM
Mike Westhoff survived multiple purges.
I don't think we can assume that to be the norm.I think everyone was just too scared to fire him.
Post by: reuben on December 30, 2018, 04:41:10 PM
Can't freaking believe giants and Tampa both excrement the bed late in the 4th(http://notsportscenter.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Jameis-Winston-crab-legs-face.jpg)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwO9s4RCEAA5dG5.png)
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 30, 2018, 04:43:12 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 30, 2018, 06:13:32 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 30, 2018, 06:19:35 PM
Post by: casman02 on December 30, 2018, 06:25:08 PM
Post by: casman02 on December 30, 2018, 06:29:25 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 30, 2018, 06:47:00 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on December 30, 2018, 06:52:16 PM
Gotta imagine Zona takes Bosa and San Fran won’t be in the market for a DL, they are probably just as frustrated as us there isn’t an offensive player even near the top of the board.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 30, 2018, 06:53:53 PM
Post by: Johnny English on December 30, 2018, 06:57:13 PM
Wonder what pick Duff will luck into at the 3 spot this year? 3 of the past 4 1st rounders had Duff getting a player that shouldn't have been there.
I know I shouldn't do this, but I'm really leery of Jonah Williams. The only Alabama OL I can think of who is currently doing a good job in the NFL is Ryan Kelly.
I think the only player who could be available at #3 that you would say "wow, he shouldn't have been available there" is Bosa, and there's no way he's getting past Arizona and the Niners.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 30, 2018, 07:08:06 PM
I know I shouldn't do this, but I'm really leery of Jonah Williams. The only Alabama OL I can think of who is currently doing a good job in the NFL is Ryan Kelly.
I think the only player who could be available at #3 that you would say "wow, he shouldn't have been available there" is Bosa, and there's no way he's getting past Arizona and the Niners.
The only way that happens (Bosa sitting there at 3) is if Zona trades out for a QB needy team, and SF forces an offensive player. And the chances of that is absolutely nil.
Duff needs to be working the phones and shopping that #3 for all it’s worth. He needs to start the rumor mill on Haskins being a generational talent in the making and that teams are contemplating how high they will have to trade up to get him
Post by: Jumbo on December 30, 2018, 08:22:24 PM
The only players I'd really be okay with at #3 at this juncture are Bosa/Allen, otherwise I would heavily heavily prefer a trade down
Post by: MBGreen on December 30, 2018, 08:30:16 PM
None of the OTs are worth #3. Don't reach for it.
The only players I'd really be okay with at #3 at this juncture are Bosa/Allen, otherwise I would heavily heavily prefer a trade down
If the trade-down option is there, I think you take it regardless.
I don’t see Bosa making it to 3.
Post by: Johnny English on December 30, 2018, 08:30:23 PM
None of the OTs are worth #3. Don't reach for it.
The only players I'd really be okay with at #3 at this juncture are Bosa/Allen, otherwise I would heavily heavily prefer a trade down
What do you do if Bosa and Allen go 1/2 and no one's interested in trading up?
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 30, 2018, 08:34:48 PM
What do you do if Bosa and Allen go 1/2 and no one's interested in trading up?
Duff will draft DT lol
Post by: MBGreen on December 30, 2018, 08:36:22 PM
Duff will draft DT lolJE purposely doesn’t watch the nfl draft, I’m not sure why he asked the question in the first place.
Post by: Johnny English on December 30, 2018, 08:41:02 PM
JE purposely doesn’t watch the nfl draft, I’m not sure why he asked the question in the first place.
I usually watch the first round if I'm about, then I rely on you to tell me which players I've never heard of we collect in subsequent days.
Post by: MBGreen on December 30, 2018, 08:42:31 PM
I usually watch the first round if I'm about, then I rely on you to tell me which players I've never heard of we collect in subsequent days.Yes I’m aware
Post by: Johnny English on December 30, 2018, 08:43:18 PM
Yes I’m aware
You're doing god's work, son.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 30, 2018, 08:45:00 PM
But im even pessimistic on that scenario
Post by: Johnny English on December 30, 2018, 08:47:47 PM
Im hoping with the weakness of the QB class that the Giants and Jaguars desperately duke it out to trade up to #3 to overdraft a QB.
But im even pessimistic on that scenario
The Giants won't ever trade with the Jets. I was told.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 30, 2018, 08:57:16 PM
The Giants won't ever trade with the Jets. I was told.
If they part with Eli, theyre not taking trading with the Jets off the table.
Of course if they part with Eli, they probably wont have to worry about the Jaguars trading up for a QB
Post by: Jumbo on December 30, 2018, 09:15:22 PM
What do you do if Bosa and Allen go 1/2 and no one's interested in trading up?
Take Williams/Oliver, possibly Jawaan Taylor depending on how he tests. But I wouldn't like it.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 30, 2018, 09:30:23 PM
The Giants won't ever trade with the Jets. I was told.
Jets and Giants have never made a trade
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 03, 2019, 03:38:14 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 03, 2019, 03:39:29 PM
We still only have the 3rd overall pick, freak this dumbass team
there's plenty of time to sink lower into oblivion.
Post by: Badger on November 03, 2019, 03:40:21 PM
We still only have the 3rd overall pick, freak this dumbass teamHow is that possible?
Post by: dcm1602 on November 03, 2019, 03:41:38 PM
Long as we land in the top 3, we should (ideally) be able to either take any non QB in the draft or trade down to a team desperate for a QB.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 03, 2019, 03:42:07 PM
How is that possible?
Bengals: 0-8
Redskins: 1-8
Jets: 1-7
Post by: dcm1602 on November 03, 2019, 03:43:00 PM
How is that possible?
Strength of schedule I imagine, ours has been pretty tough.
But it's completely irrelevant since we play the Dolphins, Bengals, redskins Giants.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 03, 2019, 03:43:55 PM
Fortunately we don't need a QB, so picking #1 isn't a need.
Long as we land in the top 3, we should (ideally) be able to either take any non QB in the draft or trade down to a team desperate for a QB.
Or we finish with the 3rd pick, Cinci takes a QB and the Redskins take Chase Young or our QB trade down haul. Or that.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 03, 2019, 03:44:32 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 03, 2019, 03:52:20 PM
How is that possible?
Jason OTC has it like this:
“ Current #NFL draft order (sorted by wins and full season SOS) post 1PM slate on 11/3
1. Bengals
2. Jets
3. Dolphins
4. Redskins
5. Falcons
6. Giants
7. Browns
8. Broncos
9. Bucs
10. Raiders
11. Chargers
12. Bears
13. Lions
14. Cardinals
15. Jaguars”
Using this logic:
“ They are using win% which really doesnt make sense to use for bad teams since most weeks bad teams continue to lose. the minute the Jets and Miami catch up they would pass the Redskins. Thats why I never sort that way mid season”
Post by: MBGreen on November 03, 2019, 04:00:56 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on November 03, 2019, 04:07:33 PM
Maybe Flores will get fired for screwing up their tank.
Does the trade deadline only apply to players?
Maybe we could get a 2nd for Gase
Post by: bojanglesman on November 03, 2019, 04:10:44 PM
Does the trade deadline only apply to players?2nd what? Chance to kill ourselves?
Maybe we could get a 2nd for Gase
Post by: dcm1602 on November 03, 2019, 06:48:06 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 03, 2019, 06:54:52 PM
Douglas dropped the ball in a major way by not trading Bell and Anderson. This teams tanking and hopefully firing it's coach so getting a 3rd 4th and 12 ish million in cap savings for those two would have been huge for a fully rebuilding team. Might have even made the difference between us having a top 2 pick and a top 5 or 6 pickWe'll have another shot to trade for picks come draft time.
Post by: dcm1602 on November 03, 2019, 06:58:05 PM
We'll have another shot to trade for picks come draft time.
Robbie is a free agent, and Bell is now completely untradeable (his salary being low this year was the only thing that made him tradeable)
We missed out on desperately needed assets for no freaking reason.
We need starters and depth at almost every single position, we could have gotten 3 key players, instead of fairly worthless rentals during a dumpster fire
Post by: IATA on November 03, 2019, 08:19:34 PM
sooner we fire gase the better
Post by: Badger on November 03, 2019, 10:23:10 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on November 04, 2019, 04:22:22 AM
I prefer we keep every single above average offensive talent we have around Darnold.
Especially since it’s looking more and more like Gase will get fired before the season ends. If that ends up happening any talent might actually get utilized
Post by: dcm1602 on November 04, 2019, 05:43:25 AM
Especially since it’s looking more and more like Gase will get fired before the season ends. If that ends up happening any talent might actually get utilized
Not sure where that's being reported.
Most beat writers are still saying Gase probably won't get fired after the season, but "wouldn't be surprised" if he is
Regardless, the OL isn't going to get magically fixed by a mid-season coaching change
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 04, 2019, 07:19:24 AM
I prefer we keep every single above average offensive talent we have around Darnold.
So there's Bell....and....that's it?
Post by: Badger on November 04, 2019, 07:41:17 AM
So there's Bell....and....that's it?Robby's OK.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 04, 2019, 10:37:18 AM
Of course, by that time, Sam Darnold might be a shellshocked wreck and we'll need to draft a QB with it. Because Jets.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 04, 2019, 11:22:33 AM
Post by: mj2sexay on November 04, 2019, 11:27:38 AM
Darnold will be fine if he stays healthy and just keep playing. We can't block, Exhibit A is having Bell and he can't go anywhere. Get a dominant LT at the top of the draft, start there.
Better minds than me will be able to answer this question, but let the great debate of the off-season commence:
Do we stay put for an Andrew Thomas or take advantage of the deep tackle class and move down if the opportunity presents itself?
I'd love to have Jerry Jeudy. This team is just not in a position to take a wide receiver with their first rounder given how pathetically thin they are on offensive line, corner and with this non-existent pass rush.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 04, 2019, 12:04:34 PM
Post by: Gorilla on November 04, 2019, 03:21:15 PM
What’s crazy is that I can’t talk myself out of taking Chase Young. I always preach the importance of building our OL for Sam and I know that we need a franchise LT more than anything else by far... but if Chase Young grades out like I think he will and is actually sitting there for us to take... I would have a hard time passing on him.
I'm of the same thinking right now.
If AThomas and Young are both there for the Jets, I'm kind of 50/50, despite the incredible need for O-line help. Young is super-special.
It depends on what other picks Douglas has hopefully accumulated. I might be completely off, but it seems more likely to find solid LT/other O-line help on day 2 than it would to find an EDGE player remotely close to the caliber of Young. Young is thus far a better prospect than Nick Bosa or Myles Garrett, for sure. Either player fills an insane, long-time need for this excrement-carnival of a team.
Post by: Badger on November 04, 2019, 05:40:14 PM
I'm of the same thinking right now.Both fill a need but only one of them helps Darnold. Totally respect what a good prospect Young seems to be but I think it's warranted to make minor sacrifices in other areas of the team for Darnold's sake.
If AThomas and Young are both there for the Jets, I'm kind of 50/50, despite the incredible need for O-line help. Young is super-special.
It depends on what other picks Douglas has hopefully accumulated. I might be completely off, but it seems more likely to find solid LT/other O-line help on day 2 than it would to find an EDGE player remotely close to the caliber of Young. Young is thus far a better prospect than Nick Bosa or Myles Garrett, for sure. Either player fills an insane, long-time need for this excrement-carnival of a team.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 04, 2019, 05:42:15 PM
Both fill a need but only one of them helps Darnold. Totally respect what a good prospect Young seems to be but I think it's warranted to make minor sacrifices in other areas of the team for Darnold's sake.
My thoughts too. We finally got a QB, let's try to help him out.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 04, 2019, 06:18:12 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 04, 2019, 06:21:44 PM
If you think Young is a generational talent and Thomas is merely a very good prospect, you take Young.
Yes, helping Darnold is our first priority, but we still have too many holes to prioritize which needs are more important than others.
This assumes we will have addressed OL at least somewhat in free agency. We will know that entering the draft.
Post by: Jumbo on November 04, 2019, 06:28:25 PM
The OL needs 5 new starters. Even if Andrew Thomas is the next Joe Thomas, that would still leave the rest of the line incredibly weak if no one else is added. The team needs to be more holistic with its team building in general.
I am in the "don't take another interior DL even if they're Aaron Donald" camp though
Post by: Pope on November 04, 2019, 07:21:36 PM
We wonder why our offense is excrement and that’s the primary reason. Chase Young could be a bust or become another malcontent and demand a trade out of this team and then what?
Post by: Libero_2 on November 04, 2019, 07:39:28 PM
If they are similar caliber prospects, take Thomas.
If you think Young is a generational talent and Thomas is merely a very good prospect, you take Young.
Yes, helping Darnold is our first priority, but we still have too many holes to prioritize which needs are more important than others.
This assumes we will have addressed OL at least somewhat in free agency. We will know that entering the draft.
This is true. I would also add if the grade difference between Thomas and The next OT (Iowa guy Wirths?) are similar then a trade down is absolutely in the cards
Post by: Johnny English on November 04, 2019, 07:40:23 PM
Both fill a need but only one of them helps Darnold. Totally respect what a good prospect Young seems to be but I think it's warranted to make minor sacrifices in other areas of the team for Darnold's sake.
I think there's also an element of considering who takes Young if we don't. If he's going to Miami next then it's perhaps something worth being aware of versus going to some scrub NFC team.
Post by: dcm1602 on November 04, 2019, 07:59:44 PM
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 04, 2019, 08:02:49 PM
I think there's also an element of considering who takes Young if we don't. If he's going to Miami next then it's perhaps something worth being aware of versus going to some scrub NFC team.
I don't see any way they're not taking a QB with their 1st. Especially now that the Steelers turned out not to be so shitty after all.
Post by: d sw0rdz on November 04, 2019, 08:12:10 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on November 04, 2019, 08:18:12 PM
I don't see any way they're not taking a QB with their 1st. Especially now that the Steelers turned out not to be so shitty after all.
I mean it does depend on when Miami picks.
If for some odd reason they end up winning 3 games (beating us twice and another team) they could end up missing the early QB prospects
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 04, 2019, 08:31:00 PM
I mean it does depend on when Miami picks.
If for some odd reason they end up winning 3 games (beating us twice and another team) they could end up missing the early QB prospects
In that case, they'll probably miss Young too.
Post by: mj2sexay on November 04, 2019, 08:56:58 PM
I'm all about building that wall for Sam, but you don't pass on generational talent because of need.
I guess the question I had about either taking Thomas or moving down operating from the assumption that we were picking third and one of Burrows/Tua being gone. Do we take the top tackle prospect or given the depth at the position in this draft, move down?
I'm not going to presume to know more about the incoming class as opposed to others on here so it'll be interesting to see as the season progresses whether he continues to separate or whether its worth it to take the bounty and draft the best tackle available further down the board.
Washington's a dysfunctional excrement heap, but they're not going to actually let Scherff walk, are they?
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 04, 2019, 09:08:29 PM
If we draft young we could always draft a LT with the 1st rounder we get for Adams
I would hope that we draft young as opposed to drafting old players like Shepherd
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 05, 2019, 12:07:36 PM
If Young falls to us, he has to be the pick. He's that good and a good pass rusher is almost impossible to find if not at the top of the draft.
I'm all about building that wall for Sam, but you don't pass on generational talent because of need.
If that's the case I'd be ok with it, but to me the can't miss OT is such a glaring need right now. If one is sitting there it's so hard to pass up.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 05, 2019, 12:28:27 PM
If any other team takes Young, he will pan out to be Aaron Donald-esque
Post by: Badger on November 10, 2019, 08:04:53 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 10, 2019, 11:57:20 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 10, 2019, 11:59:41 PM
I hope we lose out and get Gase fired. I then hope we use our picks to fill actual holes on the team instead of BPA and drafting more DLine in the first round to trade away or cut in 2-4 years.The problem with that is it is hard to envision a scenario where we lose out that doesn't involve Darnold either regressing or getting hurt.
Post by: Badger on November 19, 2019, 11:10:20 AM
Post by: mj2sexay on November 19, 2019, 11:17:12 AM
https://twitter.com/DraftCampbell/status/1196831495614324741?s=19
I'd so much rather see this team win enough to get to 7-9 or 8-8 then get the high draft pick at this point given how deep the tackle class is.
Stability, culture and ensuring the upward trajectory of Sam is more important.
They're going to get run off the field by Baltimore, but these other games are all winnable and a good opportunity to continue to evaluate the current roster and coaching staff.
Post by: Badger on November 19, 2019, 11:28:10 AM
I'd so much rather see this team win enough to get to 7-9 or 8-8 then get the high draft pick at this point given how deep the tackle class is.100% agree.
Stability, culture and ensuring the upward trajectory of Sam is more important.
They're going to get run off the field by Baltimore, but these other games are all winnable and a good opportunity to continue to evaluate the current roster and coaching staff.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 19, 2019, 11:30:50 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 19, 2019, 12:20:47 PM
I just want Darnold to play well. Don't care about record.
I honestly care about both.
I want the Jets to win because Darnold plays well. I'd much rather be proven completely wrong about Adam Gase than lose games. I can't stand losing.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 19, 2019, 01:09:39 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 19, 2019, 01:28:45 PM
When you look at how the draft turns out every year it's silly to think people want to lose just for that. The one year we were clearly tanking to try and get Darnold or one of the QBs is kind of the exception, but I've had enough of that excrement.
A team that needs a QB generally drafts pretty high. At least high enough to make a move up when needed--like the Jets did when they got Darnold.
There isn't any other position worth the draft position you'd "gain" by tanking. Badger said it best years ago, and that's why it has lived in my sig ever since.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 19, 2019, 01:33:08 PM
A team that needs a QB generally drafts pretty high. At least high enough to make a move up when needed--like the Jets did when they got Darnold.
There isn't any other position worth the draft position you'd "gain" by tanking. Badger said it best years ago, and that's why it has lived in my sig ever since.
Exactly. Nothing against Quinnen Williams but last year wasn't worth sitting through just so we could draft him.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 19, 2019, 01:34:29 PM
When you look at how the draft turns out every year it's silly to think people want to lose just for that. The one year we were clearly tanking to try and get Darnold or one of the QBs is kind of the exception, but I've had enough of that excrement.My thoughts regarding tanking:
- If we don't have a quarterback, I'm fine rooting for losses (or at least not rooting hard for wins). In that case, a win really could screw our future up.
- Since we (hopefully) have a quarterback, I want him to win games and go into next season confident, even if it costs us a few draft picks.
- One other caveat: since we still have only 7 losses, it's still mathematically possible to win out to get to 9-7. Granted, we would probably win zero tiebreakers, but as long as there is still a path to 9-7, I can't root against the Jets, regardless of how impossible the math is to get in the playoffs.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 19, 2019, 01:40:56 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on November 24, 2019, 03:29:19 PM
Post by: Badger on November 24, 2019, 03:39:57 PM
We now have the 10th overall pick in the 2020 NFL Draft.TGG probably on suicide watch
Post by: Heismanberg on November 24, 2019, 03:42:39 PM
TGG probably on suicide watch
MBGreen is on suicide watch
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 24, 2019, 03:42:59 PM
We now have the 10th overall pick in the 2020 NFL Draft.
You love to see it
Post by: Heismanberg on November 24, 2019, 05:26:58 PM
We're playing the best football we've played in years right now.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on November 24, 2019, 05:31:27 PM
Post by: Badger on November 24, 2019, 07:01:31 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 25, 2019, 10:48:21 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191125/b4f2d61443b4bb13cad04e0a46b0917e.jpg)
LOL perfect.
Time to get off that highway.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 25, 2019, 11:48:07 AM
LOL perfect.It's New Jersey. There's a jughandle turn that leaves you sitting at mediocrity.
Time to get off that highway.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 25, 2019, 11:52:40 AM
It's New Jersey. There's a jughandle turn that leaves you sitting at mediocrity.
Not if you know how to drive. Left lane is for people going through, keep right for ALL TURNS. How hard is that?
Post by: Badger on December 01, 2019, 09:54:01 PM
This is why tanking is a waste of time.
I think the Luck retirement put this to bed. Don't see how anyone can value draft priority over wins on the field.
Of course I'm still interested in tracking where we pick since we're not playoff bound, but I'll never be able to root for us to lose.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 01, 2019, 10:01:50 PM
Quoting IS from the other thread,
I think the Luck retirement put this to bed. Don't see how anyone can value draft priority over wins on the field.
Of course I'm still interested in tracking where we pick since we're not playoff bound, but I'll never be able to root for us to lose.
What about loses making the difference between Gase being here 2 years vs 3? Do you think thats worth valuing over wins on the field?
Post by: Badger on December 01, 2019, 10:11:13 PM
What about loses making the difference between Gase being here 2 years vs 3? Do you think thats worth valuing over wins on the field?Totally unquantifiable. There's not some magic W-L number that gets Gase out of here sooner nor is there one that makes him safe. As far as the next game is concerned, I always want a W.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 01, 2019, 10:14:16 PM
Totally unquantifiable. There's not some magic W-L number that gets Gase out of here sooner nor is there one that makes him safe. As far as the next game is concerned, I always want a W.
There's not a magic number as to how many builds team morale or gets you the player you want in the draft either
Post by: Badger on December 01, 2019, 10:17:55 PM
There's not a magic number as to how many builds team morale or gets you the player you want in the draft eitherWs build more than Ls and you have no idea who we'll draft and if they'll be good or not.
Post by: Pope on December 01, 2019, 11:14:24 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 02, 2019, 12:30:45 AM
The only thing our draft picks seem to help us with is getting us into a better position to draft their replacement two years later.
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2019, 08:44:00 AM
Looking at the rest of our schedule, i think there's a very good chance we climb into the top 6.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 02, 2019, 11:20:30 AM
Besides, this team is terrible at drafting.
Rather than root for losses, I'll just root for Gase to get hit by a bus.
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2019, 11:33:47 AM
I'm with Badger. I always want to win. Days like yesterday, no matter who it results in come April, aren't worth it.I think Joe Douglas will end the poor drafting trend
Besides, this team is terrible at drafting.
Rather than root for losses, I'll just root for Gase to get hit by a bus.
I also think we’re going 1-3 down the stretch if Gase gets his head out of his derriere for the Phins game.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 02, 2019, 11:35:38 AM
I think Joe Douglas will end the poor drafting trend
I also think we’re going 1-3 down the stretch if Gase gets his head out of his derriere for the Phins game.
I would absolutely LOVE to spoil Pittsburghs playoff hopes.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2019, 11:41:30 AM
I would absolutely LOVE to spoil Pittsburghs playoff hopes.
We've been good at home against teams with large, annoying fan bases. Dallas, Giants, Raiders so far, Pittsburgh and Miami fit that bill.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 02, 2019, 11:50:21 AM
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2019, 12:12:36 PM
I would absolutely LOVE to spoil Pittsburghs playoff hopes.Unfortunately, Pittsburgh knows how to win with their 3rd string QB, and minus their WR1 and HB1.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2019, 12:33:32 PM
Unfortunately, Pittsburgh knows how to win with their 3rd string QB, and minus their WR1 and HB1.
Because they have a system in place because they don't change coaches with their underwear. Just a thought.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 02, 2019, 12:38:11 PM
Because they have a system in place because they don't change coaches with their underwear. Just a thought.
They also don't have 4 practice squad players starting on their offensive line
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2019, 12:43:20 PM
Because they have a system in place because they don't change coaches with their underwear. Just a thought.
That system has won a super bowl and countless division titles.
Gase knew how to carry Peyton's bags for one season and has done nothing since.
How about we try this? Let's bring in someone who knows how to win, instead of a walking excuse machine.
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2019, 12:44:10 PM
They also don't have 4 practice squad players starting on their offensive line
Yes, every other team in the league has probowl caliber olines. We've established this argument already. ::)
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2019, 12:57:37 PM
That system has won a super bowl and countless division titles.
Gase knew how to carry Peyton's bags for one season and has done nothing since.
How about we try this? Let's bring in someone who knows how to win, instead of a walking excuse machine.
Last time we did that we fired them too, because ownership listens to fans like you and Puck.
#FireMBGreen
#FirePuck
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2019, 01:06:11 PM
Last time we did that we fired them too, because ownership listens to fans like you and Puck.
#FireMBGreen
#FirePuck
Puck and I are smarter than ownership.
The only regrettable firing in my opinion was Eric Mangini.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 02, 2019, 01:28:44 PM
Because they have a system in place because they don't change coaches with their underwear. Just a thought.
You know what else Pittsburgh has?
A head coach who makes halftime adjustments.
Quote from: Dianna @diannaESPN
Spoke to Steeler players about Mike Tomlin. Players on defense pointed to the adjustments made at half. They said he “straight up went high school football coach and drew up how they were going to defend Cleveland “ since they Browns showing a different look. “He saved the game”
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2019, 01:29:48 PM
You know what else Pittsburgh has?
A head coach who makes halftime adjustments.
And they have a HC that addresses the entire team, not just the QB.
Post by: Badger on December 02, 2019, 01:33:05 PM
They also don't have 4 practice squad players starting on their offensive lineThey have a guy we passed on, David DeCastro.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 02, 2019, 01:34:31 PM
And they have a HC that addresses the entire team, not just the QB.
AdAm GaSe wAs bRoUgHt iN tO tEaCh DaRnOlD!
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2019, 02:15:19 PM
They have a guy we passed on, David DeCastro.
Yeah but, Rex promised Coples.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 02, 2019, 04:23:04 PM
The biggest reason to tank is for a QB, and we have one.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 02, 2019, 06:19:11 PM
Puck and I are smarter than ownership.Seafood thinks Red and Tann y should have gotten a lifetime achievement award and be given the keys to the castle in perpetuity. Which if the most insane thing I ever heard. They both had a limited shelf life and went past it, plus they weren't that good.
The only regrettable firing in my opinion was Eric Mangini.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2019, 07:25:02 PM
Seafood thinks Red and Tann y should have gotten a lifetime achievement award and be given the keys to the castle in perpetuity. Which if the most insane thing I ever heard. They both had a limited shelf life and went past it, plus they weren't that good.
Straw man argument, but firing both was a mistake. How've we done since?
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2019, 07:40:20 PM
Straw man argument, but firing both was a mistake. How've we done since?
The definition of insanity
Post by: mj2sexay on December 02, 2019, 07:44:26 PM
If they weren't ready to say goodbye to Rex, they shouldn't have fired a guy who knew how to work with him as opposed to bringing in someone who literally made it his business to undermine his coach every chance he got.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 02, 2019, 07:57:56 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2019, 08:03:06 PM
Tanny let Rex freak up the roster and ignore the offense. They both should have been gone.
They are gone, how's it working out compared to consecutive AFC Championship Games?
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 02, 2019, 08:30:22 PM
They are gone, how's it working out compared to consecutive AFC Championship Games?
About as good as it was with them for the two seasons they were with the team after consecutive AFCC games.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2019, 08:59:43 PM
About as good as it was with them for the two seasons they were with the team after consecutive AFCC games.
Actually it's not but you guys got what you asked for. Kudos.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 02, 2019, 09:01:59 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on December 02, 2019, 09:03:49 PM
Actually it's not but you guys got what you asked for. Kudos.
Straw man argument, but firing both was a mistake. How've we done since?
Strawman? Tell how saying they were past their shelf life and weren't that good is a strawman. Better yet, do you know what a strawman is?
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2019, 09:08:38 PM
I loved Rex, but he ran his course.According to IS, we fired Bill Walsh.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2019, 09:10:05 PM
Strawman? Tell how saying they were past their shelf life and weren't that good is a strawman. Better yet, do you know what a strawman is?
This:
Seafood thinks Red and Tann y should have gotten a lifetime achievement award and be given the keys to the castle in perpetuity.
Never said that. I just think they earned enough credit to not be fired after a season where they lost Revis and Holmes in September. Best player on each side of the ball.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2019, 09:12:19 PM
According to IS, we fired Bill Walsh.
More nonsense. Congrats guys, you end up getting everything you want. Everyone was fired, Revis was traded, it's all worked out so well. They should really keep listening to you guys, it's gold.
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2019, 10:11:09 PM
More nonsense. Congrats guys, you end up getting everything you want. Everyone was fired, Revis was traded, it's all worked out so well. They should really keep listening to you guys, it's gold.Your world must be filled with candy canes and gumdrops
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 03, 2019, 02:14:42 AM
Both had early success, then as their rosters fell apart, their tenures fell apart. Dolphins cut bait after 3 seasons with Gase. Jets held on to Rex. Obviously, Rex had more success, but both are the only coaches for their respective franchises to have any success in the last decade plus.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 03, 2019, 06:08:07 AM
Looking back on the Revis trade, we never really got anything lasting out of that one. Probably could have just paid him and been no worse off, rather than trading him and letting our last HOF calibur draft pick go to the Patriots to win a ring.
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 08:55:26 AM
They are gone, how's it working out compared to consecutive AFC Championship Games?
It's almost like the last 4 years of Rex's tenure where he destroyed the roster never existed in your mind. Must be nice.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 03, 2019, 10:40:42 AM
I'm saying that the decision to only fire Tanny and keep Rex was idiotic. Either you keep them both and let them continue to build the team in their image or you go all the way and bring in an entirely new regime. Idzik was an absolute disaster who couldn't evaluate talent, so who knows how much difference it would've made. But if he had brought his own coach (and leaned on said coach to evaluate talent in a similar dynamic as Mangini and Tanny or Rex and Tanny), OR if Rex had management that wasn't working to undermine him with every step he took, those two options were certainly better than the alternative that we got.
And if you're going to give Rex flack for 2012, he deserves credit for taking a 2013 team that had no business winning 6 games and getting them to 8-8.
The team was falling apart around Rex. He needed to go.
Looking back on the Revis trade, we never really got anything lasting out of that one. Probably could have just paid him and been no worse off, rather than trading him and letting our last HOF calibur draft pick go to the Patriots to win a ring.
We didn't get anything out of the Revis trade because we had a bean counter making the choices. Sheldon turned out to be what he was. Hindsight as always is 20/20 but the organization put themselves in a position to use one of those two picks on an all world receiver (Nuk Hopkins) and instead passed on him twice. All for shopping out a player they could've had back the next year anyway.
I'll always maintain the mistake wasn't trading Revis, it was not moving heaven and earth to bring him back the following season.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 03, 2019, 10:43:13 AM
It's almost like the last 4 years of Rex's tenure where he destroyed the roster never existed in your mind. Must be nice.
Rex wasn't the GM. Firing Tannenbaum after 2012 was the mistake that we never recovered from. Stable franchises can deal with a bad year or two after making a run with veterans, that's where we were. Once you have guys who can work together and win, the best bet is to stick with them because when you replace them you have a good chance of getting an Idzik and/or a Bowles, or a Kotite.
Tannenbaum drafted more impact players in his first two years than we've drafted since. Once Rex got here we went to the Championship the first two years and were 8-5 late in 2011. So after 2012 we were looking at a bad year plus 3 games, given the track record there was no reason to fire Tannenbaum. Rex then managed to somehow go 8-8 with Geno Smith and an Idzik roster in 2013.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 03, 2019, 10:46:47 AM
We didn't get anything out of the Revis trade because we had a bean counter making the choices. Sheldon turned out to be what he was. Hindsight as always is 20/20 but the organization put themselves in a position to use one of those two picks on an all world receiver (Nuk Hopkins) and instead passed on him twice. All for shopping out a player they could've had back the next year anyway.
I'll always maintain the mistake wasn't trading Revis, it was not moving heaven and earth to bring him back the following season.
I said it at the time, you never get back anything close when you trade a player like Revis. He was under contract for $6 million and couldn't hold out (Tannenbaum did that), we could have kept him and paid him the next off season. It would certainly have helped Rex and if nothing else would have kept him off of New England.
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 10:55:43 AM
Rex wasn't the GM. Firing Tannenbaum after 2012 was the mistake that we never recovered from. Stable franchises can deal with a bad year or two after making a run with veterans, that's where we were. Once you have guys who can work together and win, the best bet is to stick with them because when you replace them you have a good chance of getting an Idzik and/or a Bowles, or a Kotite.
Tannenbaum drafted more impact players in his first two years than we've drafted since. Once Rex got here we went to the Championship the first two years and were 8-5 late in 2011. So after 2012 we were looking at a bad year plus 3 games, given the track record there was no reason to fire Tannenbaum. Rex then managed to somehow go 8-8 with Geno Smith and an Idzik roster in 2013.
Jesus Christ. If you don't think Rex had a hand in the roster decisions, then Puck has a beautiful shiny bridge to sell you.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 03, 2019, 10:58:20 AM
Jesus Christ. If you don't think Rex had a hand in the roster decisions, then Puck has a beautiful shiny bridge to sell you.
He had some input but he wasn't the GM. You just don't like him so you want to blame Idzik's nonsense on him, and credit Mangini for Rex's success when both coaches had the same GM. Mangini had Pennington and Favre as his QBs, Rex won more with Sanchez.
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 11:05:15 AM
He had some input but he wasn't the GM. You just don't like him so you want to blame Idzik's nonsense on him, and credit Mangini for Rex's success when both coaches had the same GM. Mangini had Pennington and Favre as his QBs, Rex won more with Sanchez.
He had a lot of input. Mangini did too.
Maybe you can see the difference in roster quality now, but i doubt it. That's obviously above your pay grade.
Also, Rex won games with Sanchez because of the top 3 oline Mangini built with Tanny.
Mangini's major mistake was pounding the table for Gholston. I guess Rex gets a pass for pounding the table for guys like Coples and Kyle Wilson....and virtually ignoring the offense during his entire tenure here.
Remember when he traded Cotch for his boi Mason. Rex was a genius.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on December 03, 2019, 11:13:55 AM
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 11:18:40 AM
For all the Rex hate...Gase won't come anywhere close to the success he had.
Rex inherited a solid roster...as soon as he was tasked with maintaining that roster, he was exposed.
Gase inherited a bag of excrement with a franchise QB, and made it worse.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 03, 2019, 11:19:03 AM
Mangini's major mistake was pounding the table for Gholston. I guess Rex gets a pass for pounding the table for guys like Coples and Kyle Wilson....and virtually ignoring the offense during his entire tenure here.
Remember when he traded Cotch for his boi Mason. Rex was a genius.
I'm with you in being pro-Mangini, but as bad as demanding Gholston was, he also shipped out a borderline hall of fame middle linebacker for pennies on the dollar because of his precious system. I don't know the input he had in drafting Dustin Keller but that wasn't a great decision either.
And from a purely coaching point of view, Rex had the same talent and manufactured much more of a pass rush.
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 11:21:26 AM
I'm with you in being pro-Mangini, but as bad as demanding Gholston was, he also shipped out a borderline hall of fame middle linebacker for pennies on the dollar because of his precious system. I don't know the input he had in drafting Dustin Keller but that wasn't a great decision either.
And from a purely coaching point of view, Rex had the same talent and manufactured much more of a pass rush.
he basically replaced Vilma with David Harris...which i was fine with.
of course Rex manufactured a pass rush, it's all he knows how to do. I still miss big Kris Jenkins.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 03, 2019, 11:31:05 AM
he basically replaced Vilma with David Harris...which i was fine with.
of course Rex manufactured a pass rush, it's all he knows how to do. I still miss big Kris Jenkins.
Could you imagine how good that defense would've been in Rex's second year if he didn't get hurt against Baltimore?
I love Hitman, but we gave away Vilma.
Post by: Johnny English on December 03, 2019, 11:39:14 AM
I'm with you in being pro-Mangini, but as bad as demanding Gholston was, he also shipped out a borderline hall of fame middle linebacker for pennies on the dollar because of his precious system. I don't know the input he had in drafting Dustin Keller but that wasn't a great decision either.Gholston was OSU's all time single season sack leader, a record that only fell this year to sone scrub called Chase Young. I don't think anyone sensibly thought at the time that his NFL floor was below passably productive, there's a lot of revision goes on with Gholston IMO.
And from a purely coaching point of view, Rex had the same talent and manufactured much more of a pass rush.
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 11:39:45 AM
Could you imagine how good that defense would've been in Rex's second year if he didn't get hurt against Baltimore?
I love Hitman, but we gave away Vilma.
the pick we got from Vilma turned into Dwight Lowery...and someone else that i can't recall.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 03, 2019, 11:43:43 AM
He had a lot of input. Mangini did too.
Maybe you can see the difference in roster quality now, but i doubt it. That's obviously above your pay grade.
Also, Rex won games with Sanchez because of the top 3 oline Mangini built with Tanny.
Mangini's major mistake was pounding the table for Gholston. I guess Rex gets a pass for pounding the table for guys like Coples and Kyle Wilson....and virtually ignoring the offense during his entire tenure here.
Remember when he traded Cotch for his boi Mason. Rex was a genius.
Rex inherited the offensive line, that's it. Favre "retired" and we drafted Sanchez, Tannenbaum's move, you're saying a QB doesn't matter?
The rest of the skill players were also brought in under Rex, except for Keller. They drafted Greene, traded for Edwards early in 2009, traded for Holmes and LT the next off season. That's ignoring the offense?
He also brought in Jenkins, then Bart Scott, Leonhard, and a D lineman (name escapes me) from Baltimore to help put his defense in, got Cromartie the next year. It's not the same roster. I have nothing against Mangini but let's not rewrite history.
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 11:59:56 AM
Rex inherited the offensive line, that's it. Favre "retired" and we drafted Sanchez, Tannenbaum's move, you're saying a QB doesn't matter?
The rest of the skill players were also brought in under Rex, except for Keller. They drafted Greene, traded for Edwards early in 2009, traded for Holmes and LT the next off season. That's ignoring the offense?
He also brought in Jenkins, then Bart Scott, Leonhard, and a D lineman (name escapes me) from Baltimore to help put his defense in, got Cromartie the next year. It's not the same roster. I have nothing against Mangini but let's not rewrite history.
I should've clarified...he ignored the offense at the draft. But he wasn't the only one...Bowles did too.
Yes, Rex inherited the oline...and as you can see from recent events over the last few months, that's pretty freaking important. Then he ignored the oline and the rest of the offense, which eventually killed Sanchez.
You can't ground and pound by drafting DL every year in the first round. Mangold and Brick were gonna get old at some point.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 03, 2019, 12:14:26 PM
I should've clarified...he ignored the offense at the draft. But he wasn't the only one...Bowles did too.
Yes, Rex inherited the oline...and as you can see from recent events over the last few months, that's pretty freaking important. Then he ignored the oline and the rest of the offense, which eventually killed Sanchez.
You can't ground and pound by drafting DL every year in the first round. Mangold and Brick were gonna get old at some point.
Tannenbaum knew enough to begin his tenure by drafting Brick and Mangold, they didn't keep him long enough to have to worry about replacing them. Rex pushed more for veterans because he knows the NFL more than college, which is where the guys I mentioned came from. O line wasn't our problem when those guys were here.
I also think you're glossing over 4 road playoff wins with a rookie and then second year QB who couldn't even start anywhere else in his career, including over Manning, Brady and Rivers. Give him Favre or a healthy Pennington either of those years and we probably win the Super Bowl.
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 01:18:41 PM
Tannenbaum knew enough to begin his tenure by drafting Brick and Mangold, they didn't keep him long enough to have to worry about replacing them. Rex pushed more for veterans because he knows the NFL more than college, which is where the guys I mentioned came from. O line wasn't our problem when those guys were here.
I also think you're glossing over 4 road playoff wins with a rookie and then second year QB who couldn't even start anywhere else in his career, including over Manning, Brady and Rivers. Give him Favre or a healthy Pennington either of those years and we probably win the Super Bowl.
Fine...but what about the last 4 years of his tenure?
You keep focusing on the AFCCG years.
What you fail to understand is (and i mentioned this in a previous post) that once Rex was given the task of maintaining and building the roster, he failed miserably. He's part of the reason why we're in the shape we're in.
Furthermore, in case you still weren't convinced, he did the same thing to Buffalo.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 03, 2019, 01:37:31 PM
Rex was a great defensive coach and motivator of players. But he had no interest in the operation of the offensive side of the ball and didn't have someone capable of running it autonomously.
Mangini was a good coach who cared about all phases but had the personality of a Sunday-school-teaching nun.
Post by: Rosetta Stoned on December 03, 2019, 02:22:49 PM
The reason this is in shambles is three regimes hitting and missing in the draft. Sure, Tannenbaum had some hits, but he was trading picks away like candy. That's no way to build a team, especially when the conversion rate of those picks was what it was.
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 02:28:11 PM
What the freak is this sudden glamouring over Mangini now? You know what Sunday's game reminded me of with Cinci constantly converting on 3rd down and Dalton picking a part the defense's soft zone, the classic Mangini rush 3, drop 8 in coverage. Somehow Rex's back-to-back AFCCGs are nothing to scoff at, but Mangini's tenure here with 1 wildcard berth and two seasons of shitting the bed is proving he was a genius. He didn't do jack excrement in Cleveland either.
The reason this is in shambles is three regimes hitting and missing in the draft. Sure, Tannenbaum had some hits, but he was trading picks away like candy. That's no way to build a team, especially when the conversion rate of those picks was what it was.
Mangini built 2 solid olines...one here, and the other was in Cleveland. He knew the value of building from the trenches outward.
I remember the rush 3 drop 8 package. I thought that was Bombastic Bob Sutton's doing.
Post by: Rosetta Stoned on December 03, 2019, 02:37:07 PM
He knew the value of building from the trenches outward.
That Pete Kendall fiasco sure made that clear.
I remember the rush 3 drop 8 package. I thought that was Bombastic Bob Sutton's doing.
That was his forte in Cleveland also and IIRC Sutton wasn't there.
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 02:38:02 PM
That was his forte in Cleveland also and IIRC Sutton wasn't there.
I'll take your word for it...i didn't watch any Browns games when he was coaching in Cle.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 03, 2019, 02:39:21 PM
Fine...but what about the last 4 years of his tenure?
You keep focusing on the AFCCG years.
What you fail to understand is (and i mentioned this in a previous post) that once Rex was given the task of maintaining and building the roster, he failed miserably. He's part of the reason why we're in the shape we're in.
Furthermore, in case you still weren't convinced, he did the same thing to Buffalo.
You're still acting like Rex was the GM, he wasn't. Which brings me to why I focus on the early part of his tenure, because again I think the beginning of our long descent was firing Tannenbaum after 2012. We went from 8-5 in December 2011, to losing Holmes and Revis in September 2012, to firing Tannenbaum off one losing season after 5 of 6 non-losing seasons, the only bad one being 2007 when Pennington was hurt. That's not what good franchises do. You were just wondering why Pittsburgh can lose players and still win games, because they have a system in place, get guys who can play that system and stay that way.
Rex was in Buffalo for two years, kept us out of the playoffs the first year and didn't even finish the second year. Not much different than Mangini's tenure in Cleveland. The bigger body of work is what happened here. Once Idzik got here it was downhill fast, you think Rex wanted to trade Revis? The key to the whole defense he played here?
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 02:41:58 PM
You're still acting like Rex was the GM, he wasn't.
You're not listening. Rex's fingerprints were all over the roster and the draft.
I didn't bother with the rest of your post. That first sentence said it all.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 03, 2019, 02:42:58 PM
You're not listening. Rex's fingerprints were all over the roster and the draft.
I didn't bother with the rest of your post. That first sentence said it all.
Ignorance is bliss. If you read more you would know more.
Post by: MBGreen on December 03, 2019, 02:46:18 PM
Ignorance is bliss. If you read more you would know more.
I do enjoy fiction.
But i'm here for the facts, which you refuse to accept and proven you can't provide.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 03, 2019, 03:03:27 PM
I do enjoy fiction.
But i'm here for the facts, which you refuse to accept and proven you can't provide.
You didn't read my post so you don't know, as usual.
Post by: Pope on December 03, 2019, 03:16:27 PM
What the freak is this sudden glamouring over Mangini now? You know what Sunday's game reminded me of with Cinci constantly converting on 3rd down and Dalton picking a part the defense's soft zone, the classic Mangini rush 3, drop 8 in coverage. Somehow Rex's back-to-back AFCCGs are nothing to scoff at, but Mangini's tenure here with 1 wildcard berth and two seasons of shitting the bed is proving he was a genius. He didn't do jack excrement in Cleveland either.Thank you. You can nitpick everything else but the foundation of our problems is the inability to draft
The reason this is in shambles is three regimes hitting and missing in the draft. Sure, Tannenbaum had some hits, but he was trading picks away like candy. That's no way to build a team, especially when the conversion rate of those picks was what it was.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 03, 2019, 03:21:29 PM
Thank you. You can nitpick everything else but the foundation of our problems is the inability to draft
We have to go back as far as early Tannenbaum, when Mangini was coach, for the last productive drafts. 2006 was Brick, Mangold, Leon Washington, Brad Smith, 2007 was Harris and Revis. For whatever reason we started making moves like Favre and Tebow, no idea, maybe Woody trying to compete with the Giants' Super Bowls. This decade with Idzik and Macc we're lucky if we get one good guy at the top of the first round, and even then they don't last long.
Post by: Pope on December 03, 2019, 03:23:59 PM
We have to go back as far as early Tannenbaum, when Mangini was coach, for the last productive drafts. 2006 was Brick, Mangold, Leon Washington, Brad Smith, 2007 was Harris and Revis. For whatever reason we started making moves like Favre and Tebow, no idea, maybe Woody trying to compete with the Giants' Super Bowls. This decade with Idzik and Macc we're lucky if we get one good guy at the top of the first round, and even then they don't last long.How many legitimately good players have we drafted in the last dozen years? Maybe 10 total? I don’t care who the coach is.. kind of difficult to compete with rosters composed of overpriced free agents and practice squad scraps
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 03, 2019, 03:38:14 PM
Thank you. You can nitpick everything else but the foundation of our problems is the inability to draft
For all the disagreement we all have around here, this is the only thing I think we all universally agree on.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 03, 2019, 03:46:52 PM
For all the disagreement we all have around here, this is the only thing I think we all universally agree on.Yep. That's been the biggest issue with this team for years.
Post by: Badger on December 04, 2019, 06:26:11 AM
Fine...but what about the last 4 years of his tenure?
Not good, but better than what we've had since then.
I understood the firing of Rex after 2014 but I always maintained that we could do worse than him and we certainly have.
Post by: MBGreen on December 04, 2019, 08:06:27 AM
Not good, but better than what we've had since then.
I understood the firing of Rex after 2014 but I always maintained that we could do worse than him and we certainly have.
I agree with you.
Which leads us to the root of this problem....the ownership. Sometimes i wonder if the Johnsons even watch the games.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 04, 2019, 10:56:56 AM
I agree with you.
Which leads us to the root of this problem....the ownership. Sometimes i wonder if the Johnsons even watch the games.
I think they absolutely watch the games. I work with a guy who thinks they purposely sabotage the team so they don't need to pay contracts. I tell him that's a load of nonsense.
The problem is these owners don't understand the game of football. Combine that with the fact that neither of them had to "work" to get to where they are today either. Football's a complicated sport, and managing an organization--of any type, sports or otherwise--is hard. They just don't have the skills to do it.
That's why it was "smart" when they hired Casserley/Wolf to help in their search. Obviously, that didn't work out well, but it was smart to look at bringing in someone with more knowledge to help.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 04, 2019, 11:17:18 AM
I think they absolutely watch the games. I work with a guy who thinks they purposely sabotage the team so they don't need to pay contracts. I tell him that's a load of nonsense.
The problem is these owners don't understand the game of football. Combine that with the fact that neither of them had to "work" to get to where they are today either. Football's a complicated sport, and managing an organization--of any type, sports or otherwise--is hard. They just don't have the skills to do it.
That's why it was "smart" when they hired Casserley/Wolf to help in their search. Obviously, that didn't work out well, but it was smart to look at bringing in someone with more knowledge to help.
I'm all about soliciting and acting on the advice of Ron Wolf his record speaks for itself.
There isn't a dumber sack of excrement in football than Charlie Casserly. He road the coattails of Bobby Beathard and Joe Gibbs to any success he had before completely ruining those teams. His time with the Texans and draft record there is the stuff of nightmares. Why we even gave him the time of day, or didn't see how transparent him trying to get his friend a gig was is a huge criticism I have of the Johnson's.
For whatever reason despite how bare he left this cupboard, Mac gets such a pass from this fanbase. Gase running him out of town is the best thing he's done so far imho.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 04, 2019, 11:46:12 AM
For whatever reason despite how bare he left this cupboard, Mac gets such a pass from this fanbase. Gase running him out of town is the best thing he's done so far imho.
Agreed. As bad as his drafting turned out to be, he was adamant about getting us a franchise QB and he eventually did, so he's a rung above the Idzik level in our history.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 04, 2019, 11:55:04 AM
Agreed. As bad as his drafting turned out to be, he was adamant about getting us a franchise QB and he eventually did, so he's a rung above the Idzik level in our history.
Recognizing that this all comes with the caveat that hindsight is 20-20.
As much as we all recognize how good Jamal Adams is-he was taken by a franchise who was perpetually searching for a quarterback ahead of Watson and Mahomes.
I mean, what would you rather have? Jamal and Sam or either of those two quarterbacks and Quentin Nelson? I'm all-in on Sam, I think he's going to be an elite quarterback and he doesn't have a Tyreek Hill/Travis Kelce or Nuk Hopkins/Will Fuller cache of weapons like those two have (nor does he have the protection Mahomes gets). But I'd think it'd be foolish to say he's on either of their level yet.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 04, 2019, 11:55:19 AM
I'm all about soliciting and acting on the advice of Ron Wolf his record speaks for itself.
There isn't a dumber sack of excrement in football than Charlie Casserly. He road the coattails of Bobby Beathard and Joe Gibbs to any success he had before completely ruining those teams. His time with the Texans and draft record there is the stuff of nightmares. Why we even gave him the time of day, or didn't see how transparent him trying to get his friend a gig was is a huge criticism I have of the Johnson's.
For whatever reason despite how bare he left this cupboard, Mac gets such a pass from this fanbase. Gase running him out of town is the best thing he's done so far imho.
Maybe Maccaganan wasn't a great choice. We really don't know because a large number of his picks were seemingly to help Bowles' system. Just because Gase got him fired doesn't justify anything.
Bowles was the second-choice for the Jets. Quinn was #1 but rather than wait until the Seahawks' season ended, they chose to just hire Bowles and not "miss out" if Quinn later rejected them.
I'm not excusing Maccagnan. Apart from SFD, I was the loudest and earliest voice to fire him. But part of the problem was bad coaching.
As for Casserley, I'm not a fan either. Still, he's more football-knowledgeable than Chris and Woody put together. And he and Wolf came highly recommended by the league itself, so I don't think it's fair to blame the Johnsons on that one.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 04, 2019, 12:08:11 PM
Recognizing that this all comes with the caveat that hindsight is 20-20.
As much as we all recognize how good Jamal Adams is-he was taken by a franchise who was perpetually searching for a quarterback ahead of Watson and Mahomes.
I mean, what would you rather have? Jamal and Sam or either of those two quarterbacks and Quentin Nelson? I'm all-in on Sam, I think he's going to be an elite quarterback and he doesn't have a Tyreek Hill/Travis Kelce or Nuk Hopkins/Will Fuller cache of weapons like those two have (nor does he have the protection Mahomes gets). But I'd think it'd be foolish to say he's on either of their level yet.
I think about that too, we could have also had Lamar Jackson if I'm not mistaken. Based on what I've seen, I think Darnold can have as good a career over the long haul as any of them if we put a team around him.
It's one reason I'm not a big fan of putting him in a third offense in three years. I'd love to see him at least get a chance to run the same thing two years in a row. It would be great if he could come out in Week 1 the way he looked at the end of last year and the way he's looked recently. That's not necessarily an endorsement of Gase, before the natives come after me with torches, but I think the jury on Gase is still out enough that I'd like to see this happen. I don't think there's enough bad to justify blowing it all up again right now, having a new GM with his first off season should be enough for now and go from there.
Post by: MBGreen on December 04, 2019, 12:16:14 PM
I think they absolutely watch the games. I work with a guy who thinks they purposely sabotage the team so they don't need to pay contracts. I tell him that's a load of nonsense.
The problem is these owners don't understand the game of football. Combine that with the fact that neither of them had to "work" to get to where they are today either. Football's a complicated sport, and managing an organization--of any type, sports or otherwise--is hard. They just don't have the skills to do it.
That's why it was "smart" when they hired Casserley/Wolf to help in their search. Obviously, that didn't work out well, but it was smart to look at bringing in someone with more knowledge to help.
They wouldn't need to bring in consultants if they would just remove themselves from the equation. Restore order, and have the HC report directly to the GM and so forth.
Let the GM hire the HC.
We keep hiring the wrong coaches because those two morons are making the decisions.
Post by: insanity on December 04, 2019, 01:25:01 PM
They wouldn't need to bring in consultants if they would just remove themselves from the equation. Restore order, and have the HC report directly to the GM and so forth.
Let the GM hire the HC.
We keep hiring the wrong coaches because those two morons are making the decisions.
Who would hire the GM?
Also, you wanted idzik and mcagnan to hire coaches?
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 04, 2019, 01:30:02 PM
Who would hire the GM?
Also, you wanted idzik and mcagnan to hire coaches?
Idzik would have hired Lou Holtz back.
Post by: MBGreen on December 04, 2019, 02:35:48 PM
Who would hire the GM?
Also, you wanted idzik and mcagnan to hire coaches?
Ownership can hire the GM....
and yes, the GM should hire the coach. Obviously Idzik and Duff shouldn't be making any decisions, but that's how hindsight works.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 04, 2019, 03:09:44 PM
They wouldn't need to bring in consultants if they would just remove themselves from the equation. Restore order, and have the HC report directly to the GM and so forth.
Let the GM hire the HC.
We keep hiring the wrong coaches because those two morons are making the decisions.
Who would hire the GM?
Also, you wanted idzik and mcagnan to hire coaches?
Ownership can hire the GM....
and yes, the GM should hire the coach. Obviously Idzik and Duff shouldn't be making any decisions, but that's how hindsight works.
But ownership did hire GMs. Like Terry Bradway, and Mike Tannenbaum, and John Idzik. They got help hiring Maccagnan because they realized they weren't succeeding before that.
They basically lucked into Douglas and Gase's machinations are why he was hired. And still, we have zero basis for believing it was a good hire yet. So far, he's given us Ryan Kalil and Demaryius Thomas. He's not exactly lighting the world on fire. I'll give him credit for extending Griffin though. We just need to wait and see with him first.
Post by: Johnny English on December 04, 2019, 04:10:56 PM
So far, he's given us Ryan Kalil and Demaryius Thomas.
Also Alex Lewis, Braxton Berrios and Sam Ficken.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 04, 2019, 04:20:43 PM
Having said that, I find his ask of Zach Martin for Adams to be very encouraging because it indicates that he knows exactly where the biggest identifiable need is on the team, and that he also has a commitment to building the offense from the trenches out. He didn't ask for Gallup-plus, or anything like that. Perhaps I'm reading too much into it as maybe he just asked for something he knew he wouldn't get as he didn't have interest in moving Jamal.
I can't remember a time where we've picked in the top 10 and virtually all of us are clamoring for the best offensive lineman on the board. Even the year we took D Brick, back in TGG land there was considerable debate over whether they should go D Brick, one of the available quarterbacks, or Williams, (remember we all thought it was predestined that Bush was going first overall).
Granted the year they took Coples there was a very vocal (and correct) contingent in wanting DeCastro, but that wasn't a top 10 pick.
Post by: Johnny English on December 04, 2019, 04:54:03 PM
It's virtuously impossible to judge Douglas at this point. The moves he made were all after the fact in terms of the period in which teams build for the year.
Of course you're right, I wasn't saying that he'd fucked up - I like Thomas and getting another vet offensive player for Sam made a heap of sense, the rest were scrapheap pickups to fill roster holes. His pedigree is good and his background as a lineman makes me hope that he'll be a true believer in building from the trenches (although frankly I think he's got the easiest GM job in the league right now given my wife could probably identify the biggest problems on the roster, and she knows the square root of freak all about football).
But if he takes a receiver in the first round I will soil my pants in outrage, drive down to Florham Park and sling the crusty mess at his office window.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 04, 2019, 05:34:39 PM
Thomas loves Gase and vice versa. Douglas went out and got his HC a player that he wanted.
Douglas' two best moves here:
Ryan Griffin
Cutting Jachai Polite and keeping Kyle Phillips instead
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 04, 2019, 06:10:51 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 05, 2019, 11:16:21 AM
I completely forgot that Jachai Polite existed.
It's so great that the hurdle that Douglas has to clear to be a better GM than his predecessor is his 3rd round pick has to make it to week 1.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 05, 2019, 11:55:06 AM
It's so great that the hurdle that Douglas has to clear to be a better GM than his predecessor is his 3rd round pick has to make it to week 1.
He has to make this a team Darnold wants to stay on by the time his rookie contract is up. That means giving him a line and letting him be in the same offense more than one year in a row. He has one weapon in Bell that we should keep, and hope Herndon comes back anywhere close to what he was. Do that and a lot of guys can produce at WR.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 05, 2019, 03:33:52 PM
But if he takes a receiver in the first round I will soil my pants in outrage, drive down to Florham Park and sling the crusty mess at his office window.This receiver draft is amazing. We need to get a receiver at some point. With Robby an FA and Quincy one injury away from being a vegetable, it's vital we upgrade at WR this offseason. OL is clearly the No. 1 priority, but if we get a WR in round 1 and load up on 2-3 linemen in the next few rounds, I'm okay with that.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 05, 2019, 03:41:21 PM
This receiver draft is amazing. We need to get a receiver at some point. With Robby an FA and Quincy one injury away from being a vegetable, it's vital we upgrade at WR this offseason. OL is clearly the No. 1 priority, but if we get a WR in round 1 and load up on 2-3 linemen in the next few rounds, I'm okay with that.
I gotta believe Quincy is either restructuring or he's gone.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 05, 2019, 03:54:57 PM
I gotta believe Quincy is either restructuring or he's gone.
Who can count on him? A fragile WR is one play away from being done at all times. Made it one game this year, his last productive year was probably 2015.
Still Idzik's best pick though.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 05, 2019, 04:28:52 PM
I gotta believe Quincy is either restructuring or he's gone.He's probably gone - he even tweeted that there's a chance he never plays again. But it looks like they only save $2.4M if they get rid of him, so if he's healthy, he might be worth that.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 06, 2019, 10:45:02 AM
OL should be the overwhelming favorite to pick in R1. I'm okay with reaching on it too. It's just far too important for Darnold's future. It's a lot easier to throw to lower caliber receivers when you have time to throw than to throw to elite receivers from your back.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 06, 2019, 11:00:17 AM
If it's as deep a WR as is being advertised, I'll be pretty disappointed if the first-round pick goes to that position.
OL should be the overwhelming favorite to pick in R1. I'm okay with reaching on it too. It's just far too important for Darnold's future. It's a lot easier to throw to lower caliber receivers when you have time to throw than to throw to elite receivers from your back.
It's dependent on free agency. Douglas goes out on the first day of free agency and signs high end talent along the offensive line than my tune might change.
I get the argument is that corner is top heavy and receiver is deep so we may as well grab from the second rung after Okudah, and look towards day 2 to bring in a receiver, but this team has ignored drafting on the offensive side of the ball and at skill positions for so long that I'm not going to scoff at the idea of drafting a CeeDee Lamb if free agency sorts out the trenches.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 06, 2019, 11:05:50 AM
It's dependent on free agency. Douglas goes out on the first day of free agency and signs high end talent along the offensive line than my tune might change.
I get the argument is that corner is top heavy and receiver is deep so we may as well grab from the second rung after Okudah, and look towards day 2 to bring in a receiver, but this team has ignored drafting on the offensive side of the ball and at skill positions for so long that I'm not going to scoff at the idea of drafting a CeeDee Lamb if free agency sorts out the trenches.
There's no way to sign 5 starting-caliber OL in FA, and there isn't anyone on the OL now that should remain a starter (and I still like Harrison as a center, but as a backup). Draft OL early and often. I won't waver from that opinion.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 06, 2019, 11:07:49 AM
There's no way to sign 5 starting-caliber OL in FA, and there isn't anyone on the OL now that should remain a starter (and I still like Harrison as a center, but as a backup). Draft OL early and often. I won't waver from that opinion.
True.
But suppose they sign two new tackles. There isn't an interior lineman worth drafting in the top 10 where we're likely to pick IMHO.
I'm with you philosophically (BUILD THAT WALL), but you can't reach for need either. Luckily they have a high second and are very likely to have two picks in the third round within the first 15 selections.
Post by: MBGreen on December 06, 2019, 11:10:45 AM
There's no way to sign 5 starting-caliber OL in FA, and there isn't anyone on the OL now that should remain a starter (and I still like Harrison as a center, but as a backup). Draft OL early and often. I won't waver from that opinion.
It's probably going to take 2 drafts to rebuild the OL for the long haul. We may sign some OL in FA, but they'll be stopgap players.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 06, 2019, 11:25:34 AM
It's probably going to take 2 drafts to rebuild the OL for the long haul. We may sign some OL in FA, but they'll be stopgap players.
Probably, but the sooner we start the sooner we finish and we'll immediately be better than we are now. One of the best RBs in the NFL can maybe get more than 2 yards per carry.
Post by: Johnny English on December 06, 2019, 12:10:48 PM
There's no way to sign 5 starting-caliber OL in FA, and there isn't anyone on the OL now that should remain a starter (and I still like Harrison as a center, but as a backup). Draft OL early and often. I won't waver from that opinion.
Usually you're right, but I look at FA and I could honestly put together a very decent line this Spring with the exception of a center.
If we signed three starting OL in FA, traded down and took Tyler Badass late in the 1st I'd be a happy boy.
Post by: MBGreen on December 06, 2019, 12:47:40 PM
Usually you're right, but I look at FA and I could honestly put together a very decent line this Spring with the exception of a center.
If we signed three starting OL in FA, traded down and took Tyler Badass late in the 1st I'd be a happy boy.
We'll be picking thru reclamation projects and aging veterans in FA regarding the OL position. Teams don't let their OL players go to FA in their prime.
Like i said earlier, we'll sign some band-aids in FA, but it's the draft where we'll find our OL cornerstones for the future.
EDIT: My ideal scenario is to shop for skill positions in FA, and load up on OL at the draft.
Post by: Johnny English on December 06, 2019, 12:58:55 PM
We'll be picking thru reclamation projects and aging veterans in FA regarding the OL position. Teams don't let their OL players go to FA in their prime.Conklin, Scherff, Castonzo, Thuney, all quality players and neither reclamation nor aging.
Like i said earlier, we'll sign some band-aids in FA, but it's the draft where we'll find our OL cornerstones for the future.
EDIT: My ideal scenario is to shop for skill positions in FA, and load up on OL at the draft.
Post by: MBGreen on December 06, 2019, 01:46:54 PM
Conklin, Scherff, Castonzo, Thuney, all quality players and neither reclamation nor aging.
or may not make it to FA.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 06, 2019, 01:57:16 PM
or may not make it to FA.
I fully expect Conklin to make it to FA given what the Titans have invested in other parts of their line. Saffold and Lewan are already making big money, Ben Jones is on the books for 7.5 mil next year. Not to mention given how he's played, they're probably going to have to throw significant funds to keep Tannehill.
Agree with you that Scherff doesn't make it to free agency, whether by a new deal or franchise tag...but Redskins are gonna Redskin.
Pats historically don't pay their lineman on their second contracts-that may change given Tom's closing window. Would love to get Thuney in here.
Costanzo likely stays in Indy given their cap situation and lack of replacement on the roster.
There's other guys as well. Bryan Bulaga might shake free in Green Bay. Andrus Peat would be a decent addition to the interior. Ditto Daryl Williams. Not world-beaters by any stretch, but certainly better than the excrement we have now.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 06, 2019, 02:25:46 PM
But okay, let's say they sign at least 2 OL, the only thing I'd be okay with taking in round 1 other than OL is a pass rusher. Even then, I'd rather they trade down if they feel any OL available is too far a reach, and again, I'd happily reach in R1 for OL (hell, every round).
Darnold is the most significant player this franchise has had since Broadway Joe. The most important thing for him is to be upright because we've seen what he can do with even a modest amount of time to throw.
Draft offensive line early and often.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 06, 2019, 03:18:06 PM
I'm just going to say it again, they're not rebuilding the offensive line in free agency. They'll be fortunate to get one starter before the draft, and even that, I'd be fairly surprised to see.
But okay, let's say they sign at least 2 OL, the only thing I'd be okay with taking in round 1 other than OL is a pass rusher. Even then, I'd rather they trade down if they feel any OL available is too far a reach, and again, I'd happily reach in R1 for OL (hell, every round).
Darnold is the most significant player this franchise has had since Broadway Joe. The most important thing for him is to be upright because we've seen what he can do with even a modest amount of time to throw.
Draft offensive line early and often.
Some of the best offensive lineman this franchise has ever had were a product of free agency, inclusive of a hall of famer.
Mawae, Faneca, Jumbo Elliot, Pete Kendall, Damian Woody. If we don't walk out of free agency with two new starters along the offensive line I'll be furious for the very reason you said. Gotta protect Sam.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 06, 2019, 03:56:49 PM
Some of the best offensive lineman this franchise has ever had were a product of free agency, inclusive of a hall of famer.
Mawae, Faneca, Jumbo Elliot, Pete Kendall, Damian Woody. If we don't walk out of free agency with two new starters along the offensive line I'll be furious for the very reason you said. Gotta protect Sam.
Nobody lets their solid linemen go anymore though. That's why I doubt there will be enough available to acquire, and the cost will be prohibitive.
If Douglas pulls it off, he'll be an instant hero. But I'm not counting on it. I'll be happy just getting the talent throughout the draft.
Post by: MBGreen on December 06, 2019, 04:21:01 PM
Nobody lets their solid linemen go anymore though. That's why I doubt there will be enough available to acquire, and the cost will be prohibitive.
This is the point I was making 2 pages ago
Post by: mj2sexay on December 06, 2019, 04:45:45 PM
Nobody lets their solid linemen go anymore though. That's why I doubt there will be enough available to acquire, and the cost will be prohibitive.
If Douglas pulls it off, he'll be an instant hero. But I'm not counting on it. I'll be happy just getting the talent throughout the draft.
This is the point I was making 2 pages ago
But I don't think that's the case.
Trent Brown, the previously mentioned Roger Saffold and Ben Jones, Brandon Brooks, Rodney Hudson, Reilly Reiff J.C. Tretter, Mitchell Schwartz. All high end offensive lineman who were acquired via free agency.
Just to clarify, I don't see Douglas spending the money to bring in two starting tackles, but if by some freak occurrence it happens, then there's no interior lineman in this draft that warrants passing over a Ceedee Lamb, and certainly the argument can't be made that such a decision would be detrimental to Sam's development.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 06, 2019, 04:49:07 PM
But I don't think that's the case.OL is the No. 1 need for this team, followed by CB and WR (especially if Robby walks). We need to fill all three roles.
Trent Brown, the previously mentioned Roger Saffold and Ben Jones, Brandon Brooks, Rodney Hudson, Reilly Reiff J.C. Tretter, Mitchell Schwartz. All high end offensive lineman who were acquired via free agency.
Just to clarify, I don't see Douglas spending the money to bring in two starting tackles, but if by some freak occurrence it happens, then there's no interior lineman in this draft that warrants passing over a Ceedee Lamb, and certainly the argument can't be made that such a decision would be detrimental to Sam's development.
Whether it's signing 2 OL and drafting 2, or signing 1 and drafting 2-3, or what, we need to address it. That doesn't mean we have to draft an OL in round 1 if there are great players at other positions available, but we also can't head into Day 3 without a single OL in our draft class.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on December 07, 2019, 01:28:40 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 15, 2019, 07:06:00 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on December 15, 2019, 07:09:35 PM
Jets moving on up. #7 now.
I think 4 is the spot to have any shot at Thomas, 6-8 might be the spot for Wirfs
Post by: MBGreen on December 15, 2019, 07:23:43 PM
I think 4 is the spot to have any shot at Thomas, 6-8 might be the spot for WirfsWirfs or Thomas....get it done
Post by: Johnny English on December 15, 2019, 07:42:06 PM
I think 4 is the spot to have any shot at Thomas, 6-8 might be the spot for Wirfs
We're not getting #4. Miami have the Bengals and Patriots left, so their ceiling is 4 wins. The Giants probably won't win their last two, but even if they do they have the tiebreaker. Likewise Washington. Arizona have Seattle and the Rams left, both on the road. Detroit have to go on the road to Green Bay still. The very best we can do is the #6 pick and I think 8-10 is the likeliest bet.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 15, 2019, 07:44:09 PM
Wirfs or Thomas....get it doneJets have 9 picks this draft. I expect 27 of them to be o-linemen. After the draft, the Jets will have Thunderdome installed at Florham Park. All lineman enter, only 5 leave. We need an o-line full of dudes who live in solitude in a mountain cabin all offseason, killing bears with their bare hands.
Post by: Johnny English on December 15, 2019, 07:45:24 PM
Jets have 9 picks this draft. I expect 27 of them to be o-linemen. After the draft, the Jets will have Thunderdome installed at Florham Park. All lineman enter, only 5 not on IR by week 3.
FTFY
Post by: MBGreen on December 15, 2019, 07:58:35 PM
Jets have 9 picks this draft. I expect 27 of them to be o-linemen. After the draft, the Jets will have Thunderdome installed at Florham Park. All lineman enter, only 5 leave. We need an o-line full of dudes who live in solitude in a mountain cabin all offseason, killing bears with their bare hands.Gase’s injury curse will have killed them all before OTAs
Post by: Libero_2 on December 15, 2019, 09:10:27 PM
We're not getting #4. Miami have the Bengals and Patriots left, so their ceiling is 4 wins. The Giants probably won't win their last two, but even if they do they have the tiebreaker. Likewise Washington. Arizona have Seattle and the Rams left, both on the road. Detroit have to go on the road to Green Bay still. The very best we can do is the #6 pick and I think 8-10 is the likeliest bet.
Oh I don't disagree, I don't think we can get to 4 either, but I was saying that's the only chance for Thomas IMO.
My 12/15 prediction for the top 4 is 2 QB's, Chase Young and Andrew Thomas. So If we aren't at 4, I don't see much chance of Thomas being there for us.
That said, Wirfs is a hell of a consolation prize
Post by: Heismanberg on December 15, 2019, 09:22:40 PM
I think 4 is the spot to have any shot at Thomas, 6-8 might be the spot for Wirfs
We don't know who the top tackle will be at this point.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 15, 2019, 10:30:55 PM
Post by: Badger on December 16, 2019, 12:21:21 AM
We’re debating how many OL the Jets are gonna take and they’re just gonna bring back Beachum and draft a Gord in the late roundsYou're forgetting we're also gonna take another DT in the top ten.
Post by: insanity on December 16, 2019, 07:34:34 AM
Looks like he's actually a person and plays tackle
WIRFS!
Post by: MBGreen on December 16, 2019, 07:50:07 AM
I assumed Wirfs was a typo and you were all being dicks.
Looks like he's actually a person and plays tackle
WIRFS!
he's a 320lb corn-fed Iowa farm boy that can play both Tackle spots. Exactly what this oline needs.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 16, 2019, 12:50:56 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 16, 2019, 01:49:20 PM
he's a 320lb corn-fed Iowa farm boy that can play both Tackle spots. Exactly what this oline needs.
Tristan Wirfs is not a farm boy.
He’s also a right tackle.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 16, 2019, 01:58:17 PM
Considering the free agent tackle we have all seemed to have targeted (Conklin) has predominately played right tackle in the pro's, if we're going to take a tackle in the top 10, from a fit perspective its likely to be Thomas if he falls, or Jackson.
Conklin did play left tackle in college, but I'm not paying big free agent dollars and having him switch. Pay him as a right tackle, let him do what he's shown he can do and lets go draft the left tackle of the future.
Post by: MBGreen on December 16, 2019, 02:19:07 PM
Tristan Wirfs is not a farm boy.
He’s also a right tackle.
Everyone in Iowa is from the farm....because Iowa is one big farm.
#AmericanSaskatchewan
Post by: Heismanberg on December 16, 2019, 06:21:01 PM
I was about to say, Wirfs hasn't shown he can play left tackle.
Considering the free agent tackle we have all seemed to have targeted (Conklin) has predominately played right tackle in the pro's, if we're going to take a tackle in the top 10, from a fit perspective its likely to be Thomas if he falls, or Jackson.
Conklin did play left tackle in college, but I'm not paying big free agent dollars and having him switch. Pay him as a right tackle, let him do what he's shown he can do and lets go draft the left tackle of the future.
I think Wirfs can play left tackle but he’s only started one game there during his college career.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2019, 07:01:25 PM
Post by: MBGreen on December 16, 2019, 07:40:44 PM
Lucky for us we need left and right tackles.Holy excrement...twice in one week.
#SamePage
Post by: Libero_2 on December 17, 2019, 11:37:53 AM
I think Wirfs can play left tackle but he’s only started one game there during his college career.
If he’s drafted that high, it’s because someone thinks he can be a LT. if not he will go late teens to early 20s if he’s a RT only.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 17, 2019, 05:38:31 PM
If he’s drafted that high, it’s because someone thinks he can be a LT. if not he will go late teens to early 20s if he’s a RT only.
Not true
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 17, 2019, 05:40:46 PM
Not trueScherff, the guy everyone wants in FA, went top 5 and everyone figured he was an OG/RT.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 17, 2019, 10:06:26 PM
Scherff, the guy everyone wants in FA, went top 5 and everyone figured he was an OG/RT.
That draft also has sucked balls in retrospect
Post by: Heismanberg on December 17, 2019, 10:14:34 PM
That draft also has sucked balls in retrospect
Offensive Line has become so diminished over the past decade or so that elite players at any position are far more valuable than ever before.
The spread offense has created a massive gap in talent between OL and DL. Coaches are taking their best bigger athletes and using them on the defensive line.
LT and RT are equally valuable in a shotgun based scheme.
Post by: Badger on December 22, 2019, 06:37:55 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 22, 2019, 06:52:41 PM
https://twitter.com/Jason_OTC/status/1208909003159408641?s=19
Probably should have lost this game to help our pick and hurt the Dolphins pick
Post by: Johnny English on December 22, 2019, 07:17:51 PM
Conversely, if we win against a Buffalo team that has already locked in the 5th seed and will likely be resting a bunch of starters, we're guaranteed to drop beneath Oakland or Denver in the draft (because they're playing each other) and also Cleveland and Atlanta if either of them win (@ Cinci and @ Tampa respectively).
If my math is right, our final draft position is at best #6 and at worst #13.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 22, 2019, 07:46:23 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 22, 2019, 09:00:10 PM
Haven’t heard much about Chris Ballard lately...In his defense, imagine if Sam Darnold retired in training camp!
Post by: insanity on December 29, 2019, 03:09:48 PM
Same with Broncos and raiders.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 29, 2019, 03:23:45 PM
We need Denver to win today.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 29, 2019, 04:15:43 PM
Quote
Winston's pick six pushes the Jets ahead of the Falcons from 13 to 12
Praiseis Jameis
Post by: dcm1602 on December 29, 2019, 04:16:54 PM
I think 12 is the furthest we can fall and 11 is as high as we can get.
We need Denver to win today.
Jeudy?
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 29, 2019, 04:18:42 PM
Jeudy?BPA at a position of need. Luckily, I think our needs have been narrowed mainly to OL, WR, CB and RB, with the tiebreaker clearly going to OL if it's close.
Post by: Badger on December 29, 2019, 04:31:24 PM
BPA at a position of need. Luckily, I think our needs have been narrowed mainly to OL, WR, CB and RB, with the tiebreaker clearly going to OL if it's close.Presumably we cannot spend our 1st on a RB.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 29, 2019, 04:33:05 PM
Presumably we cannot spend our 1st on a RB.Yes. We need to draft a RB at some point (we've needed to for years now), but not until day 3.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 29, 2019, 04:51:57 PM
Jeudy?
Jeudy will likely be a top ten pick
We need to consider the best tackle, edge, receiver, or corner.
---
OT: Tristan Wirfs/Jedrick Wills/Mekhi Becton
EDGE: AJ Epenesa/K'Lavon Chaisson
WR: Ceedee Lamb, Tee Higgins, Henry Ruggs
CB: Shaun Wade
Post by: Heismanberg on December 29, 2019, 04:54:22 PM
Yes. We need to draft a RB at some point (we've needed to for years now), but not until day 3.
If we can fix the offensive line in places through Free Agency and Tristan Wirfs is off the board, I'd consider a trade back for Travis Etienne. He is that good. We'd obviously have to move on from Le'Veon Bell to even consider this.
I'd also be fine with using our second on JK Dobbins to pair with Bell.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 29, 2019, 04:57:37 PM
If we can fix the offensive line in places through Free Agency and Tristan Wirfs is off the board, I'd consider a trade back for Travis Etienne. He is that good. We'd obviously have to move on from Le'Veon Bell to even consider this.If we can trade back and accumulate more draft picks, then a lot more options become available to us.
I'd also be fine with using our second on JK Dobbins to pair with Bell.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 29, 2019, 05:04:38 PM
If we can trade back and accumulate more draft picks, then a lot more options become available to us.
If we end up with 11th or 12th overall, we have to hope and pray that Tua checks out medically.
That pushes down someone like Justin Herbert, who teams may opt to trade up for.
Desperate playoff-caliber teams may look to move up for a receiver too.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 29, 2019, 05:09:33 PM
If we can trade back and accumulate more draft picks, then a lot more options become available to us.That happening is just like every year we say this is the year the Pats don't make the playoffs. I refuse to believe that option exists until hell freezes over.
Post by: MBGreen on December 29, 2019, 05:10:29 PM
If we end up with 11th or 12th overall, we have to hope and pray that Tua checks out medically.Is sneaking into the top 10 out of the question now?
That pushes down someone like Justin Herbert, who teams may opt to trade up for.
Desperate playoff-caliber teams may look to move up for a receiver too.
Post by: Gorilla on December 29, 2019, 05:11:50 PM
Unless the team needs a franchise QB and there are franchise qbs available and/or we can get some spectacular, once-a-decade prospect, I don't stress too much on draft slot. So once we were clearly out of the Chase Young sweepstakes, I was cool with winning as many games as we could, since that would help the team and Sam more than losses would.
After the top 2 picks (aka a shot at Chase Young), I've been fine with the Jets picking anywhere from 4 to like 14....it's all going to be the same caliber of prospect. Jeudy, Lamb, Ruggs, A.Thomas, Wirfs, Leatherwood, Wills...I'm stoked with any of them.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 29, 2019, 05:14:46 PM
My thoughts on 2020 draft, as a fan who's also been watching college football and our draft for 30 years:
Unless the team needs a franchise QB and there are franchise qbs available and/or we can get some spectacular, once-a-decade prospect, I don't stress too much on draft slot. So once we were clearly out of the Chase Young sweepstakes, I was cool with winning as many games as we could, since that would help the team and Sam more than losses would.
After the top 2 picks (aka a shot at Chase Young), I've been fine with the Jets picking anywhere from 4 to like 14....it's all going to be the same caliber of prospect. Jeudy, Lamb, Ruggs, A.Thomas, Wirfs, Leatherwood, Wills...I'm stoked with any of them.
I want to introduce you to someone:
(https://www.thecardinalconnect.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/Mekhi-Becton.jpg)
Post by: Heismanberg on December 29, 2019, 05:15:00 PM
Is sneaking into the top 10 out of the question now?
Yes, but we didn't fall very far.
Post by: MBGreen on December 29, 2019, 05:17:38 PM
Yes, but we didn't fall very far.10-12 is still decent
Post by: MBGreen on December 29, 2019, 05:22:18 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 29, 2019, 05:24:07 PM
I would imagine Denver winning should help us
It does
Post by: Gorilla on December 29, 2019, 05:26:36 PM
I want to introduce you to someone:
Haha, or Becton, I'm cool with him too if the draft process results in him being BPA.
Like most/all on this board, I want O-Line 1, WR 2 as my preference. In J-Dog we trust!!
(wait, we're calling Douglas "J-Dog", right? Did i mess up?)
Post by: bojanglesman on December 29, 2019, 05:34:10 PM
Haha, or Becton, I'm cool with him too if the draft process results in him being BPA.Doug E. Fresh
Like most/all on this board, I want O-Line 1, WR 2 as my preference. In J-Dog we trust!!
(wait, we're calling Douglas "J-Dog", right? Did i mess up?)
Post by: Gorilla on December 29, 2019, 05:38:50 PM
Doug E. Fresh
Good to know, thx
Post by: MBGreen on December 29, 2019, 06:22:16 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 29, 2019, 06:43:25 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on December 29, 2019, 06:44:52 PM
There are possibly 5 teams ahead of us that could go all in for a QB.
Are there possibly 5 QB's worth drafting in the top 10
Post by: MBGreen on December 29, 2019, 06:45:59 PM
Are there possibly 5 QB's worth drafting in the top 10Therein lies the rub
Post by: bojanglesman on December 29, 2019, 06:48:56 PM
Are there possibly 5 QB's worth drafting in the top 10Not right now, but excrement changes a lot between now and draft day.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 29, 2019, 06:49:25 PM
Therein lies the rub
There's always the next Josh Rosen or Allen
Post by: MBGreen on December 29, 2019, 06:50:04 PM
There's always the next Josh Rosen or AllenWe need Tua to get healthy
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 29, 2019, 06:52:25 PM
Doug E. Fresh
That was my nickname in college football.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 29, 2019, 08:18:50 PM
That was my nickname in college football.
You're as stale as a Foghat concert.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 29, 2019, 10:07:12 PM
If we can fix the offensive line in places through Free Agency and Tristan Wirfs is off the board, I'd consider a trade back for Travis Etienne. He is that good. We'd obviously have to move on from Le'Veon Bell to even consider this.
I'd also be fine with using our second on JK Dobbins to pair with Bell.
What we need is home run hitters and play makers on this offense in the worst way. We only have one threat to get home on any play, and that’s Robbie (who may not be here next year).
I think a really good argument could be made for Etienne to be the best play maker in this draft class. I would not be upset in the slightest if he was a Jet. If Gase somehow gets Bell shipped out, adding Etienne would be amazing to see.
I’d still hope for Wirfs, but man a guy like Etienne would be so exciting in Green
Post by: Badger on December 29, 2019, 10:20:16 PM
If we can fix the offensive line in places through Free Agency and Tristan Wirfs is off the board, I'd consider a trade back for Travis Etienne. He is that good. We'd obviously have to move on from Le'Veon Bell to even consider this.I'll admit Etienne gives me some pause on my no-RB stance. But we'd have to have an outstanding FA session first.
I'd also be fine with using our second on JK Dobbins to pair with Bell.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 29, 2019, 10:57:00 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 30, 2019, 06:07:56 AM
Post by: Libero_2 on December 30, 2019, 08:15:37 AM
Whether or not you like Gase, everyone on this board has been saying that the offensive line is the biggest hinderance to this team. Adding Etienne without improving the offensive line leaves us in the same boat, just with a younger HB.
The idea is that he would only be an option IF we upgraded the OL in FA to a point where we can afford to use a 1st round pick on a playmaker and not an OL.
in my eyes the two biggest priorities in FA need to be OL and CB. We can't afford to use the #11 pick on a CB, we need to get young offensive talent in this building ASAP
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 30, 2019, 09:58:29 AM
But I'd probably be okay watching Douglas draft a RB in R1 just to watch the anyeurism end Gase's tenure with this organization.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 30, 2019, 03:01:46 PM
The only position that isn't OL that I'd be okay seeing drafted in the first round is EDGE.Really? I think WR and CB are blatantly obvious needs. Maybe even bigger needs than EDGE at this point.
But I'd probably be okay watching Douglas draft a RB in R1 just to watch the anyeurism end Gase's tenure with this organization.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 30, 2019, 03:18:12 PM
Really? I think WR and CB are blatantly obvious needs. Maybe even bigger needs than EDGE at this point.
Corner is a big need but I still don't want to dedicate a first rounder to it. I overwhelmingly want the first pick to be an offensive lineman, but I'll settle for someone who can rush the passer since it's been a couple of decades since we had someone to do it effectively. Obviously, that's TBD whether it'll be a need come April. We could always address it in free agency.
I don't want to draft a receiver in the first round unless they've strongly addressed OL in FA as well as EDGE. If it's a deep draft for receivers, as I've heard multiple times, take one later.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 30, 2019, 03:23:05 PM
Corner is a big need but I still don't want to dedicate a first rounder to it. I overwhelmingly want the first pick to be an offensive lineman, but I'll settle for someone who can rush the passer since it's been a couple of decades since we had someone to do it effectively. Obviously, that's TBD whether it'll be a need come April. We could always address it in free agency.
I don't want to draft a receiver in the first round unless they've strongly addressed OL in FA as well as EDGE. If it's a deep draft for receivers, as I've heard multiple times, take one later.
If it's a deep draft for wideouts get a second one later.
I'm not advocating for a wideout but this is about Darnold. If the values there at wideout when we're on the clock and OL isn't, and we can't trade, get the dude a wideout.
I'd rather have a patchwork defense and see Sam grow, then draft a freaking nother early corner.
While we will always need an edge rusher Darnolds more important. Not to mention we have like 8 lb coming off of IR
Post by: Libero_2 on December 30, 2019, 03:32:07 PM
If it's a deep draft for wideouts get a second one later.
I'm not advocating for a wideout but this is about Darnold. If the values there at wideout when we're on the clock and OL isn't, and we can't trade, get the dude a wideout.
I'd rather have a patchwork defense and see Sam grow, then draft a freaking nother early corner.
While we will always need an edge rusher Darnolds more important. Not to mention we have like 8 lb coming off of IR
I agree with DCM in the sense that we should be going playmaker heavy. We damn sure better not draft a TE this year. But doubling up on WRs and grabbing a RB seem like pretty important for our success. We need a talent infusion all over the offense.
Given that we have 7 picks, I would like to see our positional breakdown of our draft picks look something like this
2 OL (one OT and one interior), 2 WR, 1 RB 1 CB, 1 BPA pick.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 22, 2020, 11:40:26 AM
The Jets are currently slated to pick 11th.
They’re tied in SOS with Miami (from HOU) at #10.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 22, 2020, 01:05:53 PM
Post by: Johnny English on September 22, 2020, 01:13:56 PM
This actually would be a good year for the Colts to tank, too. They could trade down from a top-2 pick, pick up a bunch of picks, and finally build a roster around Luck.
Post by: Johnny English on September 22, 2020, 01:16:46 PM
2017: September 10th
2018: November 13th
2019: November 3rd
2020: September 22nd
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 22, 2020, 01:20:11 PM
Dates this post started each year:
2017: September 10th
2018: November 13th
2019: November 3rd
2020: September 22nd
What took us so long last year? Season was over by Week 2.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 22, 2020, 01:21:11 PM
This actually would be a good year for the Colts to tank, too. They could trade down from a top-2 pick, pick up a bunch of picks, and finally build a roster around Luck.
They ended up trading with us so we could get Darnold, right?
Post by: Johnny English on September 22, 2020, 01:24:21 PM
They ended up trading with us so we could get Darnold, right?
Correct. It was top 3 rather than top 2, but other than that he was spot on - they used one of those picks to get Quenton Nelson, I don't remember who else.
Obviously Smalls loses a point for not also predicting Luck's retirement.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 22, 2020, 01:39:04 PM
Correct. It was top 3 rather than top 2, but other than that he was spot on - they used one of those picks to get Quenton Nelson, I don't remember who else.Posted it in another thread, but Quenton Nelson, Braden Smith and Rock Ya-Sin. We wouldn't have drafted as well most likely, but that would have been a heck of a way to build a foundation on the OL (and at CB).
Obviously Smalls loses a point for not also predicting Luck's retirement.
Post by: Johnny English on September 22, 2020, 01:45:52 PM
Posted it in another thread, but Quenton Nelson, Braden Smith and Rock Ya-Sin. We wouldn't have drafted as well most likely, but that would have been a heck of a way to build a foundation on the OL (and at CB).
Is Rock Ya-Sin any good? I honestly don't remember having seen him play.
Post by: CatoTheElder on September 22, 2020, 01:47:46 PM
Is Rock Ya-Sin any good? I honestly don't remember having seen him play.
I don't have the answer to that, although not hearing a CB's name is generally a good sign.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 22, 2020, 01:49:06 PM
Is Rock Ya-Sin any good? I honestly don't remember having seen him play.He starts for the Colts typically. He was ill last week.
I assume he's pretty good because the Colts usually trade their shitty cornerbacks to us.
Post by: Johnny English on September 22, 2020, 01:56:41 PM
He starts for the Colts typically. He was ill last week.
I assume he's pretty good because the Colts usually trade their shitty cornerbacks to us.
Pick 6, 3 tackles, 4 PDs and opposing QB rating in single figures coming up this weekend.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on September 22, 2020, 02:13:30 PM
We have ZERO WR and he's just sitting on his $30M capspace.
I feel bad for Sam. Hopefully he catches on with another team and can prove what he can do under a competent HC and a stable organization.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 22, 2020, 02:21:37 PM
I feel bad for Sam. Hopefully he catches on with another team and can prove what he can do under a competent HC and a stable organization.
I don't want to see that, it's too hard to find a good young QB. If this thing goes south we'll have a new coach here, I know that's what you want, but in my opinion way easier than years trying to land another top 5 QB in the draft.
Post by: Johnny English on September 22, 2020, 02:23:21 PM
Post by: loyaljetsfan on September 22, 2020, 02:24:15 PM
I don't want to see that, it's too hard to find a good young QB. If this thing goes south we'll have a new coach here, I know that's what you want, but in my opinion way easier than years trying to land another top 5 QB in the draft.
TBH, I want to keep Sam. But it's clear Joe D isn't interested in looking to improve the team at all, so we're fast tracking towards a top 3 pick..and if Lawrence is there, we're probably taking him.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 22, 2020, 02:31:54 PM
TBH, I want to keep Sam. But it's clear Joe D isn't interested in looking to improve the team at all, so we're fast tracking towards a top 3 pick..and if Lawrence is there, we're probably taking him.
That's getting ahead of ourselves, then we're looking at a couple more years while he learns the ropes and Sam is three years in already, still like 23. We have a lot of needs, could take an edge rusher or some other hard to fill position with a pick that high, if we end up in that spot. I'd be real careful getting rid of Sam, especially if he plays a full season healthy this year and does what he can regardless of who is around him.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 22, 2020, 02:53:14 PM
Maybe Joe has a deal in place with Swinney that he'll come here if we draft Lawrence.They can keep Dabo.
Post by: Johnny English on September 22, 2020, 03:16:59 PM
That's getting ahead of ourselves, then we're looking at a couple more years while he learns the ropes and Sam is three years in already, still like 23. We have a lot of needs, could take an edge rusher or some other hard to fill position with a pick that high, if we end up in that spot. I'd be real careful getting rid of Sam, especially if he plays a full season healthy this year and does what he can regardless of who is around him.
If we have the #1 pick and we choose to stick with Sam, which I would very much like us to do, then that pick becomes worth a king's ransom. We're not using it on a pass rusher or anything else.
Post by: Heismanberg on September 22, 2020, 03:18:52 PM
They can keep Dabo.
Come at the king, you best not miss.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 22, 2020, 03:23:13 PM
If we have the #1 pick and we choose to stick with Sam, which I would very much like us to do, then that pick becomes worth a king's ransom. We're not using it on a pass rusher or anything else.
Hoping it doesn't get to that point, we've only been #1 overall twice. Parcells traded down when he couldn't get Peyton Manning, we got Farrior and I don't remember what else, I think the trade was with the Rams.
Either way, I'm real reluctant to have to find another QB and start that process all over again, regardless if we changes coaches, which will happen if we draft that high.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 27, 2020, 05:28:40 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on September 27, 2020, 05:57:53 PM
Denver, once Lock returns is capable of winning games. Us, not so much. Especially if we don’t fire Gase ten seconds after the final whistle on Thursday
Post by: insanity on September 27, 2020, 07:06:16 PM
#13More
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 27, 2020, 07:06:58 PM
Jets are tied for the first pick with 5 other teams
#13More
And in this scenario where this particular tie occurs, the Jets are picking 5th
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 27, 2020, 07:10:50 PM
Giants and Denver are bad teams, but still better overall teams than us.
We have a good chance, but this is going to be an annoying derriere season to be talking about this excrement every waking moment just to end up with the 4th pick and miss out on Lawrence, Sewell, and Chase
Post by: Heismanberg on September 27, 2020, 07:37:54 PM
Giants and Denver are bad teams, but still better overall teams than us.
I don't really know if the Giants are better than us, but even if they are, it's not by much.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 27, 2020, 07:41:09 PM
I don't really know if the Giants are better than us, but even if they are, it's not by much.
Now that Saquon/Shepard are out maybe, but the Giants have much better offensive skill players than us. Their OL is freaking terrible but Becton is the only thing giving us an edge
Our defenses are prob pretty similar but it’s hard to imagine another team being much worse than what we’ve seen.
Like you said, it’s not by much either way
Post by: Heismanberg on September 27, 2020, 07:46:58 PM
Now that Saquon/Shepard are out maybe, but the Giants have much better offensive skill players than us. Their OL is freaking terrible but Becton is the only thing giving us an edge
Our defenses are prob pretty similar but it’s hard to imagine another team being much worse than what we’ve seen.
Like you said, it’s not by much either way
Judge might be shittier than Gase too
Post by: loyaljetsfan on September 27, 2020, 07:49:19 PM
Judge might be shittier than Gase too
Judge gets at least 3 years before we make any accusations
SBTG
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 27, 2020, 08:49:57 PM
Judge might be shittier than Gase too
He could be. I think the biggest problem there is Gettleman being one of the worst GM’s in the league.
I think Jason Garrett is a POS but I would take him handling Darnold over Gase.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 27, 2020, 08:52:06 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 28, 2020, 08:12:26 AM
Quote
The Jets are on track to have THE toughest schedule in the league... meaning they will lose any and all draft tie-breakers... meaning:
If the Jets finish with the same record as another team, the Jets can't get the 1st pick.
Tank for Trevor!!!
Post by: Laxin on September 28, 2020, 09:32:31 AM
Tank for Trevor!!!
This team will legitimately struggle to win 2 games. I don’t see another team winning only 2 games.
Post by: MBGreen on September 28, 2020, 10:12:07 AM
This team will legitimately struggle to win 2 games. I don’t see another team winning only 2 games.
I don't see a single win on our schedule with Gase calling the shots.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 28, 2020, 10:12:58 AM
I don't see a single win on our schedule with Gase calling the shots.
Literally the only reason to keep him for the full season
Post by: MBGreen on September 28, 2020, 10:19:38 AM
Literally the only reason to keep him for the full season
correct
the epitome of a "no-win situation" (no pun intended)
Post by: CatoTheElder on September 28, 2020, 10:27:05 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 28, 2020, 10:29:20 AM
The really frustrating thing about Gase is that I think the team has quit on him so we have no way of actually evaluating any part of t he roster.
Players like Gregg Williams, let him be the lead voice. His unit has been excrement, but this team clearly needs a shakeup and we don’t have many options.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 28, 2020, 10:36:37 AM
I don't think the Jets have quit. They just suck at pretty much every level and they've played three of the better teams in the NFL. I don't think many teams quit just because there's no incentive for the players to do that. There are not many players on the roster that are good enough where they can not try as hard as they would like and still have jobs next season in the NFL. Most of our roster are guys fighting to stay in the league.
Which players have quit? Maybe some of the injured guys are taking their time coming back, but that's pure speculation. If you want to say they aren't trying as hard when they're down 3 scores in the 2nd half, I could buy that, but that's about it. The coaches have quit there, too.
We just suck.
Post by: CatoTheElder on September 28, 2020, 10:39:40 AM
People constantly posted the team quit last year. Then they finished 6-2 down the stretch.
I don't think the Jets have quit. They just suck at pretty much every level and they've played three of the better teams in the NFL. I don't think many teams quit just because there's no incentive for the players to do that. There are not many players on the roster that are good enough where they can not try as hard as they would like and still have jobs next season in the NFL. Most of our roster are guys fighting to stay in the league.
Which players have quit? Maybe some of the injured guys are taking their time coming back, but that's pure speculation. If you want to say they aren't trying as hard when they're down 3 scores in the 2nd half, I could buy that, but that's about it. The coaches have quit there, too.
We just suck.
K
Post by: AlioTheFool on September 28, 2020, 10:45:04 AM
People constantly posted the team quit last year. Then they finished 6-2 down the stretch.
I don't think the Jets have quit. They just suck at pretty much every level and they've played three of the better teams in the NFL. I don't think many teams quit just because there's no incentive for the players to do that. There are not many players on the roster that are good enough where they can not try as hard as they would like and still have jobs next season in the NFL. Most of our roster are guys fighting to stay in the league.
Which players have quit? Maybe some of the injured guys are taking their time coming back, but that's pure speculation. If you want to say they aren't trying as hard when they're down 3 scores in the 2nd half, I could buy that, but that's about it. The coaches have quit there, too.
We just suck.
On this I mostly agree with you
There may be a player or two not giving it all he's got, but I don't think these guys have quit yet. They just aren't any good
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 28, 2020, 10:50:25 AM
On this I mostly agree with youDo I think players have lost faith in Gase? Yes. Do I think they've quit? No. I generally don't think NFL teams quit, at least not when games are still in doubt. Every player wants to win and every player wants to earn his spot on a roster next year.
There may be a player or two not giving it all he's got, but I don't think these guys have quit yet. They just aren't any good
Post by: bojanglesman on September 28, 2020, 10:53:28 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 02, 2020, 04:20:34 PM
Giants 27.8%
Jets 27.7%
Jaguars 8.2%
-Cimini
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 02, 2020, 07:38:22 PM
Sam was supposed to be the guy. He should have been and could have been. More than Nacho and the other turds since. He had all the right things you want from a QB. Ruined.
Yep. And we'll do the same to Lawrence. No team is more capable to freak everything up than the Jets
Post by: Johnny English on October 02, 2020, 07:50:15 PM
Yep. And we'll do the same to Lawrence. No team is more capable to freak everything up than the Jets
Assuming he'd come. If he's as good a prospect as some claim, then he has the leverage if he wants to use it.
This team is freaking rotten.
Post by: insanity on October 05, 2020, 06:09:29 AM
We have by far the toughest schedule out of any of the winless teams.
The bengals play nearly all the winless teams including the nfc east
Post by: Libero_2 on October 05, 2020, 06:57:04 AM
There is honestly a great chance we land the number 1 pick.
We have by far the toughest schedule out of any of the winless teams.
The bengals play nearly all the winless teams including the nfc east
This of course is a double edged sword. It means we are more likely to lose games. But if there is a tie for #1, then we lose the tie breaker. For instance if the Jets/Giants both go 2-14, then they get the #1 pick because their SoS is much worse than ours, meaning they lost to worse teams.
So in order to get #1 we have to lose more games than anyone else in the league. No ties allowed. When you are looking at quite a few teams who might only win 2-3 games that’s a difficult proposition.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 06, 2020, 08:57:01 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 06, 2020, 09:05:08 AM
Tough stretch coming up here with Cards and Chargers.
The Chargers are not very good. Cardinals are very overrated, but they do a lot of things well that we don't. Hopkins will be nearly impossible to stop.
Some serious injuries and COVID listings will have to happen for us to win more than three games this season. Two wins is a stretch at this point.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 06, 2020, 09:50:34 AM
Kyler Murray's passing numbers have been abysmal. He can run great, but his passing has been pretty bad this year. I fully expect him to torch our defense through the air, but he hasn't done that yet.
I don't know why people think the Chargers are good. They have a solid but not great defense after injuries, and they have a rookie quarterback.
Both teams are significantly better than the Jets, but from an NFL-wide perspective, both teams are average.
Post by: insanity on October 06, 2020, 10:00:33 AM
Tough stretch coming up here with Cards and Chargers. Schedule gets much easier to navigate after with Bills, Chiefs, Pats
This is hilarious
I think the others missed the sarcasm in this post.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 06, 2020, 10:31:43 AM
This is hilarious2nd part was obvious sarcasm. Wasn't sure about first part.
I think the others missed the sarcasm in this post.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 10, 2020, 09:31:01 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 10, 2020, 10:31:27 PM
Post by: d sw0rdz on October 11, 2020, 03:55:26 AM
I thought that was the point of not firing Gase.
we didn't fire gase because we're a dumbass organization. tanking is the byproduct, but gase is being kept because the dumb owner believes in his genius.
Post by: Libero_2 on October 11, 2020, 06:17:24 AM
we didn't fire gase because we're a dumbass organization. tanking is the byproduct, but gase is being kept because the dumb owner believes in his genius.
We will never know the answer to this but I would love to know which of the big 'reasons' is the reason he is sticking around.
1. Christopher Johnson doesn't want to admit he made a mistake until he has no other choice
2. They don't want to pay Gase and Bowles to not coach the team.
3. The owners actually think he's good
4. They don't want to appear 'reactionary' and just fire a guy mid-season or because fans beg them too.
5. They are embracing the full on tank
In all likelihood it's probably some form of a combination, but it sure would be nice to know
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 11, 2020, 07:01:18 AM
We will never know the answer to this but I would love to know which of the big 'reasons' is the reason he is sticking around.
1. Christopher Johnson doesn't want to admit he made a mistake until he has no other choice
2. They don't want to pay Gase and Bowles to not coach the team.
3. The owners actually think he's good
4. They don't want to appear 'reactionary' and just fire a guy mid-season or because fans beg them too.
5. They are embracing the full on tank
In all likelihood it's probably some form of a combination, but it sure would be nice to know
This is the main reason, IMO
He's never worked at J&J, probably never worked a day in his life. This dude was born into a family with an ungodly amount of money and all the entitlement in the world...how could he ever be wrong?
But alas, this is a business. So he hired a CEO that is running the company into the ground and refuses to make a change? If the Jets were publicly traded, it would have been delisted by now.
They should be thankful for COVID, because right now the view of the stadium during a Jets home game would look the same if there wasn't a pandemic. EMPTY
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 11, 2020, 02:02:42 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 11, 2020, 03:14:02 PM
Need to pray for the Giants to beat up on that awful Cowboys D today
Post by: Libero_2 on October 11, 2020, 03:18:13 PM
Another week in the books
Need to pray for the Giants to beat up on that awful Cowboys D today
If the Giants score 50 I still think they lose. Their defense is some kind of bad (maybe even as bad as ours!) and Dallas will punish them. This might be one of the highest scoring outputs by any team all season for Dallas. Whatever the over is, take it
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 11, 2020, 03:21:31 PM
If the Giants score 50 I still think they lose. Their defense is some kind of bad (maybe even as bad as ours!) and Dallas will punish them. This might be one of the highest scoring outputs by any team all season for Dallas. Whatever the over is, take it
The Giants defense is not bad so far this year. Ranked 5th in yards against, 12th in points against.
The Giants defense (compared to ours) and the weakness of the NFC East (today is their first game against a division opponent) are big reasons why I think they will pick after us in the draft.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 11, 2020, 04:24:28 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 11, 2020, 04:35:31 PM
Dolphins getting a 2nd win would be nice though just to be safe. I would like to beat the Dolphins for our one win this season, so hopefully they steal a win like this just to be safe.
Post by: Libero_2 on October 11, 2020, 04:42:17 PM
Giants are the key. The good news is that division is so bad that they have a number of winnable games. Dolphins getting a 2nd win would be nice though just to be safe. I would like to beat the Dolphins for our one win this season, so hopefully they steal a win like this just to be safe.
Dolphins up 30-7 at the half.
I have to say they are bad, but they look like a 5 win team type of bad to me.
Jags, Skins and Giants are the other truly terrible teams this year. Good news is Giants/Skins are in the same terrible division. I feel confident that they can each win 2 divisional games.
Jacksonville is the team to root for in every single game this season to be sure they can win at least 3.
I simply cannot see this Jets team winning more than 2 games, and frankly, 2 games seems like wishful thinking and like I'm being overly optimistic with this defense and the horrible offense.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 11, 2020, 04:47:44 PM
Dolphins up 30-7 at the half.I agree. We are horrible. I am rooting for a win just so we don't go 0-16. I don't want that at all.
I have to say they are bad, but they look like a 5 win team type of bad to me.
Jags, Skins and Giants are the other truly terrible teams this year. Good news is Giants/Skins are in the same terrible division. I feel confident that they can each win 2 divisional games.
Jacksonville is the team to root for in every single game this season to be sure they can win at least 3.
I simply cannot see this Jets team winning more than 2 games, and frankly, 2 games seems like wishful thinking and like I'm being overly optimistic with this defense and the horrible offense.
That Cincinnati tie to Philly is huge. The Bengals are pretty awful, but they have a win and a tie already, plus they have a home game against the Giants later.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 11, 2020, 04:59:35 PM
I agree. We are horrible. I am rooting for a win just so we don't go 0-16. I don't want that at all.
That Cincinnati tie to Philly is huge. The Bengals are pretty awful, but they have a win and a tie already, plus they have a home game against the Giants later.
We still need to get the #1 pick, but Cinci is prob the one team we don’t need to worry about compared to DEN/NYG/ATL. We would still need to trade with them for the pick, but would they really give up on Burrow after a year? Every other team would def take Lawrence.
Post by: MBGreen on October 11, 2020, 05:03:58 PM
This season is a write-off...might as well get what we can out of it.
Post by: Libero_2 on October 11, 2020, 05:06:57 PM
We still need to get the #1 pick, but Cinci is prob the one team we don’t need to worry about compared to DEN/NYG/ATL. We would still need to trade with them for the pick, but would they really give up on Burrow after a year? Every other team would def take Lawrence.
If we can't have #1, Cincy having it is probably best. That gives us 2 chances, either go get Lawrence, or get Burrow.
Lawrence of course is the ultimate prize
Post by: Libero_2 on October 11, 2020, 05:08:00 PM
0-16 basically solidifies us getting Trevor Lawrence and it makes Gase look like the retard we all knew was....well most of us anyway.
This season is a write-off...might as well get what we can out of it.
I don't want the stink of 0-16 on this franchise if at all possible.
Post by: MBGreen on October 11, 2020, 05:18:07 PM
We have every flavor of stink on this franchise you can get...whats one more prrrrt stain that could land us Lawrence and show Gase the door
Post by: Libero_2 on October 11, 2020, 05:20:35 PM
Who Cares?
We have every flavor of stink on this franchise you can get...whats one more prrrrt stain that could land us Lawrence and show Gase the door
Because I'd rather go 1-15 and still get Lawrence?
But honestly the teams this year have some real badness to them. We might not be able to go 1-15 and get Lawrence because of tie breakers.
Post by: MBGreen on October 11, 2020, 05:22:45 PM
Because I'd rather go 1-15 and still get Lawrence?There are other potential 1-15 teams that will beat us to Lawrence on strength of schedule.
But honestly the teams this year have some real badness to them. We might not be able to go 1-15 and get Lawrence because of tie breakers.
The point is...if we're gonna be this awful, let's make it worthwhile.
1-15 isn't much better than pitching a goose egg
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 11, 2020, 05:40:12 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 11, 2020, 05:43:39 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 11, 2020, 05:45:14 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on October 11, 2020, 05:47:08 PM
Cowboys without Dak now in the No. 1 pick race if they lose today.
That offense is still too deadly to be in the #1 race IMO.
Post by: Johnny English on October 11, 2020, 05:48:04 PM
That offense is still too deadly to be in the #1 race IMO.
And Dalton is competent.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 11, 2020, 05:48:33 PM
He doesn't want to pay Dak. Now he has even more of an excuse.
Post by: IATA on October 11, 2020, 05:50:41 PM
Jerry will make sure they tank for Trevor.And people think firing our coach mid season will set a bad example for free agents lmao
He doesn't want to pay Dak. Now he has even more of an excuse.
Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
Post by: bojanglesman on October 11, 2020, 05:54:30 PM
0-16 basically solidifies us getting Trevor Lawrence and it makes Gase look like the retard we all knew was....well most of us anyway.We'll find a way to finish 0-16 with another team that beats us out for #1.
This season is a write-off...might as well get what we can out of it.
Post by: IATA on October 11, 2020, 05:57:27 PM
We'll find a way to finish 0-16 with another team that beats us out for #1.Point differential on a last minute hail Mary call from gase in game 16 that bell somehow catches in everyone's last hurrah to freak the Jets one last time
Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
Post by: reuben on October 11, 2020, 06:03:00 PM
0-16 is a stain that doesn't wash away. People forget 1-15 seasons.
Eh, when it was just the Buccaneers, sure. Winless seasons jumped the shark with Hue Jackson though. This mans said if we don't win more than one game again this season, I'll jump in a lake. Then they went 0-16 and he did.
No one is matching that buffoonery, ever. Thank you for your service, Hue.
Post by: Johnny English on October 11, 2020, 06:09:28 PM
Eh, when it was just the Buccaneers, sure. Winless seasons jumped the shark with Hue Jackson though. This mans said if we don't win more than one game again this season, I'll jump in a lake. Then they went 0-16 and he did.
No one is matching that buffoonery, ever. Thank you for your service, Hue.
Even though Cleveland was more recent, the Lions going 0-16 with one of the most talented receivers in history will always be the pinnacle/nadir of that particular record.
Post by: reuben on October 11, 2020, 06:19:51 PM
Post by: MBGreen on October 11, 2020, 06:25:14 PM
No one will give a excrement if we go 0-16 and Trevor Lawrence becomes the next Peyton Manning.Bingo
Post by: reuben on October 11, 2020, 06:26:26 PM
Post by: Johnny English on October 11, 2020, 06:27:20 PM
Bingo
Except Ryan Leaf is a way more likely outcome than Peyton Manning if he is drafted by the Jets.
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 11, 2020, 06:27:22 PM
No one will give a excrement if we go 0-16 and Trevor Lawrence becomes the next Peyton Manning.
No one will let 0-16 die if we turn Trevor Lawrence into David Carr.
Post by: MBGreen on October 11, 2020, 06:46:23 PM
No one will let 0-16 die if we turn Trevor Lawrence into David Carr.Fan pride for this team died years ago.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 11, 2020, 06:47:59 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 11, 2020, 06:48:28 PM
No one will let 0-16 die if we turn Trevor Lawrence into David Carr.
Good thing our pass protection isn't that bad.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 11, 2020, 06:48:43 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 11, 2020, 06:57:20 PM
Update: we are picking 3rd
Ja'Marr Chase SZN
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 11, 2020, 07:41:26 PM
Good thing our pass protection isn't that bad.
We’ll see.
Post by: Badger on October 11, 2020, 07:46:36 PM
Eh, when it was just the Buccaneers, sure. Winless seasons jumped the shark with Hue Jackson though. This mans said if we don't win more than one game again this season, I'll jump in a lake. Then they went 0-16 and he did.I honestly forgot about the Hue/Browns one. Just Tampa and Detroit.
No one is matching that buffoonery, ever. Thank you for your service, Hue.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 11, 2020, 07:48:12 PM
lol two trick plays for losses back to back, nobody can get less with more than Mike McCarthy.
I'd take him over Gase any day of the week and three times on Sunday
Post by: reuben on October 11, 2020, 09:07:33 PM
I'd take him over Gase any day of the week and three times on Sunday
I'd take a forfeited season over Gase, we need a better barometer.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 11, 2020, 09:10:51 PM
I'd take a forfeited season over Gase, we need a better barometer.
Damn. Same. I’ve been looking forward to his firing since the day he was hired. Not in a self righteous douchey manner, but in the sense that I’m impatient to move on from guaranteed failure.
Post by: Badger on October 11, 2020, 10:15:26 PM
Damn. Same. I’ve been looking forward to his firing since the day he was hired. Not in a self righteous douchey manner, but in the sense that I’m impatient to move on from guaranteed failure.I'm sure I've said it before but A) agreed and B) this was how I felt about Geno too
This franchise pulled that excrement on me twice in a decade.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 11, 2020, 11:21:14 PM
I'm sure I've said it before but A) agreed and B) this was how I felt about Geno too
This franchise pulled that excrement on me twice in a decade.
Gase is the Geno is coaches. Time is a flat circle.
Post by: IATA on October 12, 2020, 01:11:09 AM
Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
Post by: mj2sexay on October 12, 2020, 03:00:16 AM
Post by: Libero_2 on October 12, 2020, 05:49:23 AM
I’m reasonably sure if we go 0-16 and are sitting their for Lawrence, he goes back to school.
He’s made it clear he’s done in college he’s not going back. Hell supposedly he will already have his degree.
I also don’t think he would pull an Eli on us either. Jets fans can’t see it because we are saddled with this utter misery, but we will have a new coaching staff (presumably one that inspires confidence) and a slew of new faces from FA and a lot of draft capital to help him immediately, and we have a guy we believe is the long term answer at LT already in place to protect his blindside.
That’s an awful lot of reasons to believe that he can be successful here compared to a lot of teams picking #1 in recent history
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 12, 2020, 08:44:24 AM
Post by: mj2sexay on October 12, 2020, 10:16:18 AM
I know we won’t get Peytoned by Lawrence but getting Elied is still a posibility.
I know Archie hated AJ Smith ("Lord of no rings"), but Eli's never given his reasoning on why he didn't want to go.
I just realized there's also the parallel of the Chargers not realizing what they had (Brees) when they made that selection.
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 12, 2020, 10:20:10 AM
I just realized there's also the parallel of the Chargers not realizing what they had (Brees) when they made that selection.
Just made this point in the other thread, I don't think QB is our problem.
Post by: MBGreen on October 12, 2020, 10:27:02 AM
He’s made it clear he’s done in college he’s not going back. Hell supposedly he will already have his degree.
I also don’t think he would pull an Eli on us either. Jets fans can’t see it because we are saddled with this utter misery, but we will have a new coaching staff (presumably one that inspires confidence) and a slew of new faces from FA and a lot of draft capital to help him immediately, and we have a guy we believe is the long term answer at LT already in place to protect his blindside.
That’s an awful lot of reasons to believe that he can be successful here compared to a lot of teams picking #1 in recent history
It will depend who our HC is after the season. Make a reputable hire, and Sunshine doesn't pull the Eli on us.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 12, 2020, 10:29:32 AM
It will depend who our HC is after the season. Make a reputable hire, and Sunshine doesn't pull the Eli on us.
Trevor Lawrence's dad isn't Archie Manning's bitch derriere.
He wants to be the top pick and he's the kind of competitor that won't back away from the challenge.
Post by: MBGreen on October 12, 2020, 10:48:34 AM
Trevor Lawrence's dad isn't Archie Manning's bitch derriere.
He wants to be the top pick and he's the kind of competitor that won't back away from the challenge.
just like......you guessed it.....Sunshine Ronnie Bass.
Post by: Badger on October 12, 2020, 11:03:53 AM
I just realized there's also the parallel of the Chargers not realizing what they had (Brees) when they made that selection.
Thanks, I hate this
Just made this point in the other thread, I don't think QB is our problem.
At this point I only want to move on from Darnold if we have the #1, anything lower and I hope we surround him with talent and continue development, maybe with a late round long term contingency plan.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 12, 2020, 11:05:43 AM
We did the "late round contingency plan" with James Morgan this year. If we don't draft Lawrence or Fields, give me Darnold, [vet QB], and Morgan/White.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 12, 2020, 11:38:03 AM
I think most of us are in that same boat, but I do want to see how Justin Fields plays this year.
We did the "late round contingency plan" with James Morgan this year. If we don't draft Lawrence or Fields, give me Darnold, [vet QB], and Morgan/White.
I'd rather have Kyle Trask over Justin Fields
Post by: Libero_2 on October 12, 2020, 11:46:38 AM
I'd rather have Kyle Trask over Justin Fields
Which tells me (as I previously suspected), this is a one QB rodeo
Post by: MBGreen on October 12, 2020, 11:50:50 AM
I'd rather have Kyle Trask over Justin Fields
(https://img.cinemablend.com/filter:scale/cb/e/b/1/f/7/4/eb1f74bc1a52b1ac7a64308b4485b543e40e2f11926404db9c17c660a6c270d2.jpg?mw=600)
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 12, 2020, 12:04:31 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 12, 2020, 12:41:44 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 12, 2020, 12:44:12 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 12, 2020, 01:22:15 PM
I don't have a strong take on Trask's NFL prospects, but if Trask is in the 1st-round conversation, that makes me wonder how many other backup quarterbacks in college could be stars if they ever got the chance.
Justin Fields
Post by: Heismanberg on October 12, 2020, 01:42:04 PM
Justin Fields
Thank you
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 12, 2020, 01:58:31 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 14, 2020, 10:15:49 AM
Games that should benefit us:
NYG (0-5) vs WAS (1-4)
ATL (0-5) vs MIN (1-4)
JAX (1-4) vs DET (1-3)
Games where we need the underdog to win but it’s a tough game:
HOU (1-4) vs TEN (3-1) - this is the Dolphins pick
DEN (1-3) vs NE (2-2)
CIN (1-3-1) vs IND (3-2)
PHI (1-3-1) vs BAL (4-1)
LAC (1-4) - BYE week
If ATL and NYG both win and we do our thing, we can take sole possession of the 1 pick.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 14, 2020, 11:05:27 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 14, 2020, 11:06:35 AM
The funny part is the Jets are going to win 1 game and not get the 1st pick.
Puck always the optimist.
Win one game.....
Post by: Miamipuck on October 14, 2020, 11:07:52 AM
Puck always the optimist.You watched the games, that's pretty freaking optimistic.
Win one game.....
Post by: MBGreen on October 14, 2020, 11:07:53 AM
The funny part is the Jets are going to win 1 game and not get the 1st pick.
Who on the schedule are we going to beat? I'll wait....
Post by: Miamipuck on October 14, 2020, 11:08:33 AM
Who on the schedule are we going to beat? I'll wait....I don't see a win at all, you just know it will happen to freak up the first pick.
Post by: MBGreen on October 14, 2020, 11:10:17 AM
I don't see a win at all, you just know it will happen to freak up the first pick.
if it were to happen (it won't....but let's have some fun with it anyway).....it'll probably happen in week 17 against our opponent's 3rd stringers again.
But, i'm sure our locker room would've mailed it in by then, if not before. So who knows.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 14, 2020, 11:10:46 AM
I don't see a win at all, you just know it will happen to freak up the first pick.
If this isn’t at the back of your mind you’re not a Jets fan. I’ll feel better when they have a 2 game cushion.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 14, 2020, 11:14:42 AM
If this isn’t at the back of your mind you’re not a Jets fan. I’ll feel better when they have a 4 game cushion.
When there is 1 game left, then I will exhale.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 14, 2020, 11:24:58 AM
Giants are the #1 team to root for going forward and it's not particularly close. Luckily, they play in the NFC East.
Washington-New York is the most important game this week by far.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 14, 2020, 11:28:21 AM
Jets could go 0-16 and get the No. 2 pick behind the Giants.
Giants are the #1 team to root for going forward and it's not particularly close. Luckily, they play in the NFC East.
Washington-New York is the most important game this week by far.
The 2 WAS-NYG games are probably the most important non-Jets games of the year for us. As you said, we need the Giants to win at least 1 for us to even have a shot.
The only other beatable opponents they have on their schedule are PHI x2, DAL, ARI, and CIN and I’m not pencilling any of those in as wins.
Post by: Badger on October 14, 2020, 11:37:10 AM
I don't see a win at all, you just know it will happen to freak up the first pick.Season gets cancelled due to COVID and the NFL does a draft lottery and we pick 12th
Post by: Miamipuck on October 14, 2020, 11:39:51 AM
Season gets cancelled due to COVID and the NFL does a draft lottery and we pick 12th
You laugh, but we're all just waiting for this.
Post by: Badger on October 14, 2020, 11:42:20 AM
You laugh, but we're all just waiting for this.The interior DL we pick is gonna be awesome though
Post by: Heismanberg on October 14, 2020, 11:44:21 AM
The interior DL we pick is gonna be awesome though
Fortunately for us, there isn't an interior defensive lineman worth a top five pick this year.
We'll probably draft a tight end.
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 14, 2020, 11:53:20 AM
there isn't an interior defensive lineman worth a top five pick this year.
So you’re saying we’re definitely drafting a NT?
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 14, 2020, 12:12:24 PM
Fortunately for us, there isn't an interior defensive lineman worth a top five pick this year.
We'll probably draft a tight end.
Kyle Brady, Jr.
Might as well go full Kotite if we're doing Kotite. We brought the uniforms back and everything.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 14, 2020, 01:02:09 PM
Kyle Brady, Jr.
Might as well go full Kotite if we're doing Kotite. We brought the uniforms back and everything.
The second best tight end in this draft class plays for Penn State
TIME IS A FLAT CIRCLE
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 16, 2020, 11:58:08 AM
Jets going full tank for Trevor
Prob the smartest thing they’ve done in a while
Post by: bojanglesman on October 16, 2020, 12:05:21 PM
https://twitter.com/patmcafeeshow/status/1317138560806506505?s=21Hopefully they don't think Gase is helping the tank on purpose and keep him on next year.
Jets going full tank for Trevor
Prob the smartest thing they’ve done in a while
Post by: Libero_2 on October 16, 2020, 12:08:27 PM
https://twitter.com/patmcafeeshow/status/1317138560806506505?s=21
Jets going full tank for Trevor
Prob the smartest thing they’ve done in a while
Who in Jets management that 'would know' is telling Pat freaking McaFee that? Not Schefter, not Rappaport, but Pat freaking McaFee?
The only guy with a potential connection to him I can think of is Rex Hogan
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 16, 2020, 12:20:04 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 16, 2020, 12:20:12 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 16, 2020, 12:20:25 PM
Who in Jets management that 'would know' is telling Pat freaking McaFee that? Not Schefter, not Rappaport, but Pat freaking McaFee?
The only guy with a potential connection to him I can think of is Rex Hogan
Heimerdinger
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 16, 2020, 12:51:30 PM
Mark Sanchez is one of his best friends
Who the freak would be talking to Sanchez?
Post by: bojanglesman on October 16, 2020, 12:54:08 PM
Who the freak would be talking to Sanchez?
Rex's wife
Post by: Badger on October 16, 2020, 01:23:58 PM
Who the freak would be talking to Sanchez?The Masked Punter
Post by: Gorilla on October 16, 2020, 01:28:42 PM
Kyle Brady, Jr.
Might as well go full Kotite if we're doing Kotite. We brought the uniforms back and everything.
Lol, i vividly remember the '95 draft and being giddy that Warren Sapp (consensus top 3 pick) was dropping to us.
My heart sank as Kyle Brady's name was announced. We had just taken a TE in the FIRST ROUND only 3 years prior (current Walmart-employee-or-homeless person-I assume Johnny Mitchell). Let's Go Jets!
Post by: delavan on October 16, 2020, 03:42:49 PM
(https://forums.jetnation.com/uploads/monthly_2020_08/89BAF56B-C578-4336-91FE-88B01E787651.jpeg.f08c8157c5110f3598c428601f56c3c9.jpeg)
Post by: Heismanberg on October 16, 2020, 03:53:36 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on October 16, 2020, 03:54:13 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 16, 2020, 03:59:41 PM
I don't know enough about Lawrence, but I will say it would be nice to start the clock over aqain on a rookie QB contract.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=384YK1TLQG4
Try to keep your pants on
Post by: Johnny English on October 16, 2020, 04:09:51 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=384YK1TLQG4
Try to keep your pants on
6 plays, of which 3 were play-action and 1 was a bootleg. That's not happening in our offense.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 16, 2020, 04:10:51 PM
6 plays, of which 3 were play-action and 1 was a bootleg. That's not happening in our offense.
He’s not playing for Gase.
Post by: bojanglesman on October 16, 2020, 04:14:47 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=384YK1TLQG4
Try to keep your pants on
I'm sure he's good, but that was just a bunch of wide open short passes. Maybe there was more in the rest of the game, but nothing impressive there.
Post by: Libero_2 on October 16, 2020, 04:46:24 PM
I'm sure he's good, but that was just a bunch of wide open short passes. Maybe there was more in the rest of the game, but nothing impressive there.
Footwork. Arm strength. Ball placement. Eye manipulation.
I believe it was the third play of the reel, he wants to go deep, sees it’s not there and checks it down immediately. That’s an example of going through progressions. Something people are killing Sam because he either can’t or isn’t.
If you know what you are watching it’s a lot of little things that make those plays look really freaking simple.
Post by: Johnny English on October 16, 2020, 04:50:13 PM
Footwork. Arm strength. Ball placement. Eye manipulation.
I believe it was the third play of the reel, he wants to go deep, sees it’s not there and checks it down immediately. That’s an example of going through progressions. Something people are killing Sam because he either can’t or isn’t.
If you know what you are watching it’s a lot of little things that make those plays look really freaking simple.
Holy patronising bullshit, Batman.
Let's see if Lawrence can do it with less than 2 seconds before he's got a grille full of NFL linebacker.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 16, 2020, 04:51:21 PM
I'm sure he's good, but that was just a bunch of wide open short passes. Maybe there was more in the rest of the game, but nothing impressive there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DH9Hdk9IYQ
Post by: Johnny English on October 16, 2020, 04:59:34 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DH9Hdk9IYQ
Wow. Imagine if we had a QB who was really good at rolling out and making throws across his body, and finding open receivers when he's got a clean pocket.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 16, 2020, 05:00:30 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on October 16, 2020, 05:03:27 PM
Footwork. Arm strength. Ball placement. Eye manipulation.Certainly lots I don't know.
I believe it was the third play of the reel, he wants to go deep, sees it’s not there and checks it down immediately. That’s an example of going through progressions. Something people are killing Sam because he either can’t or isn’t.
If you know what you are watching it’s a lot of little things that make those plays look really freaking simple.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 16, 2020, 05:27:26 PM
Certainly lots I don't know.
freaking boatloads......
Post by: bojanglesman on October 16, 2020, 05:57:00 PM
freaking boatloads......I know how to not suck dick.
Post by: Johnny English on October 16, 2020, 06:11:37 PM
I know how to not suck dick.
Yeah but how many times did you have to be told not to use your teeth before you finally figured it out?
Post by: Libero_2 on October 16, 2020, 07:16:05 PM
Holy patronising bullshit, Batman.
Let's see if Lawrence can do it with less than 2 seconds before he's got a grille full of NFL linebacker.
I was responding to the idea that 'it was just some short passes'
Is it an elite highlight reel with epic throws all over the place? Of course not but there is more than just a guy hitting uncovered targets after sitting in the pocket forever too.
Sure it would be nice to watch him routinely make plays like you see in the NFL, but that's not something in most college kids reels. If they are quality prospects they are routinely getting the ball out on time and against college DB's, somebodies pretty much always open. Ball out with quick decision making is what you expect from top prospects, with the occasional throw with pressure in his face.
Post by: d sw0rdz on October 16, 2020, 08:24:04 PM
I was responding to the idea that 'it was just some short passes'
Is it an elite highlight reel with epic throws all over the place? Of course not but there is more than just a guy hitting uncovered targets after sitting in the pocket forever too.
Sure it would be nice to watch him routinely make plays like you see in the NFL, but that's not something in most college kids reels. If they are quality prospects they are routinely getting the ball out on time and against college DB's, somebodies pretty much always open. Ball out with quick decision making is what you expect from top prospects, with the occasional throw with pressure in his face.
i'm a big fan of lawrence but there is a little bit of homerism going on in the past few posts/pages about a player that we all may be looking into to change the state of this sorry franchise. he is getting accolades he deserves, but for fans of a team like ours, anything he does good will be highlighted and exaggerated
we're looking at all of these clips and not taking into account that lawrence's current team has a legitimate shot at beating the current jets in a game
i'm not going to act like i'm some QB aficionado but even i could watch these clips and both find things that make me go 'wow he's great' and also things to critique him on. for example i forget which clip it was but it looks like his 'pump fake' sucks. he is also skinny as hell and he's going to be getting slammed by big NFL d-lineman on actual good teams, not a fake team like ours, because of how bad our o-line is. point being if we're going to like lawrence, it shouldn't be because of these quick small clips
if we get the #1 pick we have to go lawrence all the way, and there's going to be a lot of merit behind that. i think we as fans shouldn't build our own valuation and expectation of him based off of these very short selective highlight compilations
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 16, 2020, 09:01:39 PM
Post by: Badger on October 16, 2020, 09:03:58 PM
I don’t know why people think that Lawrence will succeed with us.Because the alternative is believing no one will ever succeed with us. Or that we should pass on once in a decade talents because we don't have the perfect setup for them yet.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 16, 2020, 09:05:48 PM
i'm a big fan of lawrence but there is a little bit of homerism going on in the past few posts/pages about a player that we all may be looking into to change the state of this sorry franchise. he is getting accolades he deserves, but for fans of a team like ours, anything he does good will be highlighted and exaggerated
we're looking at all of these clips and not taking into account that lawrence's current team has a legitimate shot at beating the current jets in a game
i'm not going to act like i'm some QB aficionado but even i could watch these clips and both find things that make me go 'wow he's great' and also things to critique him on. for example i forget which clip it was but it looks like his 'pump fake' sucks. he is also skinny as hell and he's going to be getting slammed by big NFL d-lineman on actual good teams, not a fake team like ours, because of how bad our o-line is. point being if we're going to like lawrence, it shouldn't be because of these quick small clips
if we get the #1 pick we have to go lawrence all the way, and there's going to be a lot of merit behind that. i think we as fans shouldn't build our own valuation and expectation of him based off of these very short selective highlight compilations
Clemson’s offensive line and receivers are extremely inexperienced this year.
Lawrence and Etienne have really elevated that offense.
He’s also 6’6 240. Not skinny by any means.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 16, 2020, 09:10:08 PM
Because the alternative is believing no one will ever succeed with us. Or that we should pass on once in a decade talents because we don't have the perfect setup for them yet.This.
I think Lawrence will succeed because he is the best QB prospect since Andrew Luck, and we have a franchise LT and a bunch of other draft picks. And because I have to or whats the point of being a fan.
Post by: Badger on October 16, 2020, 09:14:47 PM
Clemson’s offensive line and receivers are extremely inexperienced this year.Clemson lists him at 220 and I think he looks it.
Lawrence and Etienne have really elevated that offense.
He’s also 6’6 240. Not skinny by any means.
But I assume he'd put on weight in the pros.
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 16, 2020, 10:45:32 PM
This.
I think Lawrence will succeed because he is the best QB prospect since Andrew Luck, and we have a franchise LT and a bunch of other draft picks. And because I have to or whats the point of being a fan.
So long as the Johnsons own the team, not much.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 16, 2020, 10:58:24 PM
So long as the Johnsons own the team, not much.From 2001-10, the Jets were relatively successful under the Johnsons.
I agree they are bad owners but you can win with bad owners if the right people are at GM and coach. The odds of finding the right GM and coach or are lower but it can happen. Most owners aren't that good.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 16, 2020, 11:15:55 PM
Furthermore, if they were running those same plays with the players the 2020 Jets have on the field he would be getting smoked.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 16, 2020, 11:20:45 PM
Most owners aren't that good.
Most (all) owners don’t do the Tannenbaum-Rex-Idzik-Bowles-Maccagnan-Gase-Douglas dance within the span of 10 years. Most owners let the GM hire the coach and have that coach report to a person that knows what they’re doing when it comes to running a football team instead of a clueless checked out owner that doesn’t give a excrement about day to day operations.
Post by: d sw0rdz on October 16, 2020, 11:41:58 PM
Clemson’s offensive line and receivers are extremely inexperienced this year.
Lawrence and Etienne have really elevated that offense.
He’s also 6’6 240. Not skinny by any means.
they're honestly not even real criticisms of mine, i was just playing devil's advocate and being nitpicky regarding short youtube highlight clips
i'm rooting for sam but if we get the #1 pick we cannot pass up on a talent like lawrence. at that point we just have to hope for the best but this franchise does not instill confidence in me for many reasons. we'll just have to wait and see what happens if this all ends up being the case, and hopefully in 3 years we aren't doing this with the next big QB prospect
Post by: insanity on October 17, 2020, 09:42:41 AM
If we stay at two wins or less I think we'll get the number 1 pick.
3 wins is going to be hard given how bad the giants schedule us
Post by: bojanglesman on October 17, 2020, 09:51:43 AM
I think the magic number is 2.
If we stay at two wins or less I think we'll get the number 1 pick.
3 wins is going to be hard given how bad the giants schedule us
We will find a way to go 0-16 and pick 2nd.
Post by: Badger on October 17, 2020, 11:54:52 AM
From 2001-10, the Jets were relatively successful under the Johnsons.
I agree they are bad owners but you can win with bad owners if the right people are at GM and coach. The odds of finding the right GM and coach or are lower but it can happen. Most owners aren't that good.
There's a sizeable portion of Jets fans that believe Bradway/Tannenbaum and Herm/Mangini/Rex were all bad, in addition to the Johnsons, so I guess they believe any years we were good were just freak accidents or something.
Post by: bojanglesman on October 17, 2020, 12:38:19 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on October 17, 2020, 12:39:37 PM
Can we just draft Lawrence, hire Dabo and move up for Etienne? I'm not serious but I am.
I want no part of Dabo. But Lawrence + Etienne would be a big change of pace for this offense
Post by: bojanglesman on October 17, 2020, 12:43:43 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on October 17, 2020, 12:50:35 PM
I want no part of Dabo. But Lawrence + Etienne would be a big change of pace for this offenseI don't either, Dabo would be stupid to leave Clemson, plus he would probably suck in the NFL. I do wonder who calls and designs the offense at Clemson.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 17, 2020, 01:02:08 PM
I want no part of Dabo. But Lawrence + Etienne would be a big change of pace for this offense
Dabo is a bible thumper, but he is actually an offensive genius.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 17, 2020, 01:03:04 PM
I do wonder who calls and designs the offense at Clemson.
It's mostly Dabo. Tony Elliott designs the run game and Dabo has most control over the passing offense.
Jeff Scott (passing game coordinator for a long time) left to be the head coach at USF. He was probably the best recruiter in the country.
Post by: MBGreen on October 17, 2020, 01:33:54 PM
LFG
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 17, 2020, 04:08:14 PM
Most (all) owners don’t do the Tannenbaum-Rex-Idzik-Bowles-Maccagnan-Gase-Douglas dance within the span of 10 years. Most owners let the GM hire the coach and have that coach report to a person that knows what they’re doing when it comes to running a football team instead of a clueless checked out owner that doesn’t give a excrement about day to day operations.Robert Kraft ran Parcells out of town. Couldn't succeed with Pete Carroll. Then he hires Belichick, and people view him as the best owner of all-time.
The Maras were considered great owners forever. Now they've been irrelevant for a decade, hiring a string of poor GMs and coaches.
Post by: Libero_2 on October 17, 2020, 05:15:54 PM
Dabo is a bible thumper, but he is actually an offensive genius.
My concern is Dabos way of running a program not working with pro guys. Bible thumping most likely isn’t going to get a locker room rolling the way it will at Clemson.
But at the end of the day guys will be cool with anything if they are making millions and are winning
Post by: mj2sexay on October 17, 2020, 05:58:28 PM
My concern is Dabos way of running a program not working with pro guys. Bible thumping most likely isn’t going to get a locker room rolling the way it will at Clemson.
But at the end of the day guys will be cool with anything if they are making millions and are winning
I know, Tony Dungy totally couldn't connect to his players.
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 17, 2020, 06:36:28 PM
There's a sizeable portion of Jets fans that believe Bradway/Tannenbaum and Herm/Mangini/Rex were all bad, in addition to the Johnsons, so I guess they believe any years we were good were just freak accidents or something.
Is there that much evidence that they weren't?
Since Parcells retired, only Herm and Rex have had consecutive winning seasons, both within their first two seasons.
They all followed the same pattern, the longer any coach was employed the more we saw the roster degrade and the coaching assistants get tossed off the team.
The fun part is that Gase is the outlier, being the only one who didn't come in hot.
Post by: Johnny English on October 17, 2020, 07:48:24 PM
I know, Tony Dungy totally couldn't connect to his players.
Jim Harbaugh did all right in San Francisco as well. Right now I think invoking Jesus might be about our best hope. Allah, Shiva, the Dalai Lama, bring them all.
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 17, 2020, 07:54:08 PM
Jim Harbaugh did all right in San Francisco as well. Right now I think invoking Jesus might be about our best hope. Allah, Shiva, the Dalai Lama, bring them all.
Can I interest you un the teachings of our profit Crowley?
Post by: Johnny English on October 17, 2020, 07:57:08 PM
Can I interest you un the teachings of our profit Crowley?
freak yes. Let's paint a big derriere pentagram on the floor of the locker room, light some candles, summon up Beelzebub himself and ask him a) what the freak we did to make him do this to us, and b) what the freak he wants from us to flip the script.
Post by: bojanglesman on October 17, 2020, 08:14:35 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 17, 2020, 08:30:07 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 17, 2020, 08:30:49 PM
Post by: d sw0rdz on October 17, 2020, 08:55:40 PM
it's spooky season
Post by: Jumbo on October 18, 2020, 01:07:04 AM
Is there that much evidence that they weren't?
Since Parcells retired, only Herm and Rex have had consecutive winning seasons, both within their first two seasons.
They all followed the same pattern, the longer any coach was employed the more we saw the roster degrade and the coaching assistants get tossed off the team.
The fun part is that Gase is the outlier, being the only one who didn't come in hot.
Hey that's not fair. Gase actually came in hot relatively with 7 wins in his first year
Post by: d sw0rdz on October 18, 2020, 01:25:01 AM
Hey that's not fair. Gase actually came in hot relatively with 7 wins in his first year
it was a fake 7 wins against some horrible teams.
during that season we were the team that winless teams felt they had a chance of getting their first win of the season against, and it happened twice. it happened even after our autist spent some extra thanksgiving time gameplanning for the bengals. i can and will never forget this.
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 18, 2020, 08:33:32 AM
Hey that's not fair. Gase actually came in hot relatively with 7 wins in his first year
I'm guessing this is sarcasm but in case it isn't I think a losing season is a fair cutoff for considering a coach successful.
Gase is the only one since Kotite to open the his tenure with a losing season.
Post by: MBGreen on October 18, 2020, 08:59:52 AM
jets draft Trevor Lawrence Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 18, 2020, 12:08:05 PM
Kirk Cousins INT
Post by: Laxin on October 18, 2020, 12:29:54 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 18, 2020, 12:31:36 PM
I really don’t think the Giants are that bad... they aren’t great, but they should run into 3-5 wins this year, especially in that division.I keep hearing this narrative that the Giants aren't that bad, and I really don't know where it comes from.
The Giants have been one of the worst teams in the NFL for years, and they're still awful.
They might pull off a couple wins, but a lot of bad teams can pull off a win or three, especially against the NFC East. The Jets might be in our own stratosphere of awfulness, but I do think we'll find a win at some point.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 18, 2020, 12:34:00 PM
Falcons up 10-0.
Bengals up 14-0.
Couple good results there.
Post by: Laxin on October 18, 2020, 12:44:14 PM
I keep hearing this narrative that the Giants aren't that bad, and I really don't know where it comes from.
The Giants have been one of the worst teams in the NFL for years, and they're still awful.
They might pull off a couple wins, but a lot of bad teams can pull off a win or three, especially against the NFC East. The Jets might be in our own stratosphere of awfulness, but I do think we'll find a win at some point.
I mean they’re not a good team, but I don’t think they are even close to as bad as the Jets are. People talk about the Giants as a team that could get the #1 pick. I don’t think that’ll happen. They look like an actual football team. Not a very good one... but the Jets don’t even resemble a football team at this point.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 18, 2020, 12:45:37 PM
I mean they’re not a good team, but I don’t think they are even close to as bad as the Jets are. People talk about the Giants as a team that could get the #1 pick. I don’t think that’ll happen. They look like an actual football team. Not a very good one... but the Jets don’t even resemble a football team at this point.That's fair. I just keep reading how they're SUPPOSED to beat Washington this week, and I read a lot of people pick them against the Rams and 49ers. I don't get it.
I understand why they're favored over Washington, but I think they're on the same tier.
Post by: Laxin on October 18, 2020, 12:46:30 PM
Giants up 10-0.
Falcons up 10-0.
Bengals up 14-0.
Couple good results there.
Broncos up 9-0 too
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 18, 2020, 12:55:10 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on October 18, 2020, 01:28:02 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 18, 2020, 01:55:46 PM
Wish we had Matt Peart on this team just for the prrrrt jokes when he sucks.
L, he’s good
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 18, 2020, 01:57:38 PM
L, he’s goodprrrt
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 18, 2020, 02:03:12 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 18, 2020, 02:14:25 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 18, 2020, 02:45:16 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 18, 2020, 02:55:46 PM
Post by: reuben on October 18, 2020, 02:59:51 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on October 18, 2020, 03:00:31 PM
Post by: Laxin on October 18, 2020, 03:01:03 PM
Post by: Laxin on October 18, 2020, 04:24:53 PM
Post by: mj2sexay on October 18, 2020, 05:05:00 PM
Post by: MBGreen on October 18, 2020, 06:16:05 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on October 18, 2020, 06:23:06 PM
Clemson/GT was the blueprint to what Kansas City is going to do to us.The real question is whether Mahomes or his backup play more snaps.
Post by: MBGreen on October 18, 2020, 06:24:37 PM
The real question is whether Mahomes or his backup play more snaps.
i don't think it matters
i hope they direct snap it to Bell all game.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 18, 2020, 06:25:15 PM
Jags and Football Teams might legitimately not win another game.
Washington plays New York again
Post by: reuben on October 18, 2020, 06:25:24 PM
The real question is whether Mahomes or his backup play more snaps.
Henne SZN
Post by: MBGreen on October 18, 2020, 06:29:24 PM
@MySportsUpdate
·
21m
On a positive note: The #Jets now have sole possession of the No. 1 overall pick in the 2021 NFL Draft.
LFG
Post by: bojanglesman on October 18, 2020, 06:36:48 PM
NFL UpdateNow would be a great time for a huge COVID outbreak to end the season.
@MySportsUpdate
·
21m
On a positive note: The #Jets now have sole possession of the No. 1 overall pick in the 2021 NFL Draft.
LFG
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 18, 2020, 08:17:59 PM
NFL Update
@MySportsUpdate
·
21m
On a positive note: The #Jets now have sole possession of the No. 1 overall pick in the 2021 NFL Draft.
LFG
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/2b/6a/f6/2b6af6cbcaf852e45de12fea50fc786a.jpg)
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 18, 2020, 08:18:50 PM
Post by: Badger on October 18, 2020, 08:55:07 PM
Great day of footballPossibly my most enjoyable football Sunday so far this year
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 18, 2020, 09:20:46 PM
Possibly my most enjoyable football Sunday so far this yearMe too. Watched on my phone and barely paid attention after 21-0.
Post by: mj2sexay on October 18, 2020, 10:22:29 PM
Washington plays New York again
Giants and Bengals are the hope with Washington. Jacksonville looks even more dire. They play Minnesota in Minny and that's as winnable as their schedule gets.
FFS, please let Jacksonville win 1 more.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 18, 2020, 10:26:29 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 19, 2020, 09:05:54 AM
prrrt
Quote
Matt Peart is the highest graded player for the Giants offense yesterday with 25+ snaps.
He graded 89.7 overall, including 93.4 in the run block department, while giving up a pressure on 11 pass block snaps.
Prrrrty good
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 19, 2020, 10:23:50 AM
NYG
WAS
ATL
JAX
MINN
HOU (MIA)
All of these teams have 1 win and hold the SOS tiebreaker over us besides HOU.
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 19, 2020, 10:45:24 AM
Post by: insanity on October 19, 2020, 02:54:04 PM
Still need another win from:
NYG
WAS
ATL
JAX
MINN
HOU (MIA)
All of these teams have 1 win and hold the SOS tiebreaker over us besides HOU.
Chargers play the jags next week so atleast one of those will win
Post by: Laxin on October 19, 2020, 03:21:33 PM
Still need another win from:
NYG
WAS
ATL
JAX
MINN
HOU (MIA)
All of these teams have 1 win and hold the SOS tiebreaker over us besides HOU.
One of NYG or WAS are guaranteed a win. ATL, MIN and HOU are not bad enough to finish with less than 4 wins. JAX has a handful of winnable games (LAC, MIN, HOU, CLE, CHI, IND)... hopefully they come away with 2 wins from those. The Giants only have 3 games that they should be heavy dogs. The rest are games they might be able to win.
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 19, 2020, 03:37:47 PM
Post by: cautious pessimism on October 19, 2020, 04:14:17 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 19, 2020, 04:16:09 PM
While I'm somewhat confident we will get the 1st pick, what do we do with it if Lawrence stays for his last year?
I'll be shocked if he stays, just to humor you, we should take Penei Sewell because he's the second best player in the draft.
Post by: cautious pessimism on October 19, 2020, 04:23:11 PM
I'll be shocked if he stays, just to humor you, we should take Penei Sewell because he's the second best player in the draft.
Would you really be "shocked"? Sure, there's a risk if he stays because he might get hurt or something, but that could be outweighed by not wanting to be drafted by the worst organization in the league by far.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 19, 2020, 04:29:32 PM
Would you really be "shocked"? Sure, there's a risk if he stays because he might get hurt or something, but that could be outweighed by not wanting to be drafted by the worst organization in the league by far.Yes.
Especially when Washington and Jacksonville are the next-most likely candidates. Not exactly world-class organizations...
Post by: Heismanberg on October 19, 2020, 04:34:30 PM
Would you really be "shocked"?
Yes
Post by: cautious pessimism on October 19, 2020, 04:41:29 PM
Yes.
Especially when Washington and Jacksonville are the next-most likely candidates. Not exactly world-class organizations...
So you're saying that Lawrence should declare for the 2021 draft because if he waits until 2022, WAS or JAC could draft him, and that'd be worse? Sure, that makes complete sense.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 19, 2020, 04:48:49 PM
So you're saying that Lawrence should declare for the 2021 draft because if he waits until 2022, WAS or JAC could draft him, and that'd be worse? Sure, that makes complete sense.No. You said that he wouldn't want to go in the draft because the Jets would take him.
Most teams that pick No. 1 overall, or are in contention for the No. 1 pick, are not good franchises.
Post by: cautious pessimism on October 19, 2020, 05:04:43 PM
No. You said that he wouldn't want to go in the draft because the Jets would take him.
Most teams that pick No. 1 overall, or are in contention for the No. 1 pick, are not good franchises.
And you're saying that he would rather do that than get drafted by WAS or JAC in 2022 draft.
Post by: cautious pessimism on October 19, 2020, 05:06:23 PM
Yes
A lot of things must shock you then, including Peyton Manning.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 19, 2020, 05:09:46 PM
A lot of things must shock you then, including Peyton Manning.
I've watched Trevor Lawrence's entire career at Clemson, nearly every game. He has said multiple times that this is his last season.
The only thing that could cause him to change his mind is if they end up in the National Championship and lose again.
He'd be a fool to go back for his senior season. He's graduating this winter and he's done just about everything he can except win a Heisman.
Post by: d sw0rdz on October 19, 2020, 05:12:58 PM
we hear it all the time when it's the jets. there were even articles about how sam would stay for another year were we to end up with the first pick of the 2018 draft back in 2017
plus if we end up with the 1st pick and truly want him to be our QB, i don't think there's any way we make any sort of HC - related decision that wouldn't be enticing for him. and if we end up with the 1st pick, along with our cap space + draft picks, as shitty as we are it should be a tempting enough project for a new HC looking to make a name.
we've already thrown out his name, but i can't imagine joe brady turns down the opportunity to be our HC if we end up with the 1st pick, and i can't imagine lawrence not wanting to play under a guy like brady
Post by: Badger on October 19, 2020, 05:55:00 PM
Yeah, we're bad, but so is any team that finishes with the worst record in the league in any given year.
I can't name a single component of this organization that is the same as it was when Peyton came out. Different owners, different front office, different coaches. There isn't some magical curse on the franchise.
As fans we obviously don't have a real impact on the outcome here but at a bare minimum we shouldn't feed the dumb narratives.
Post by: d sw0rdz on October 19, 2020, 06:09:24 PM
I think the fear that Lawrence will refuse to play for us is overblown. Historically it's pretty rare, the only comparable examples I can think of are Elway and Eli forcing trades from the teams that picked them and Peyton going back to school instead of going 1st overall to us. So that's three times in about 20 years, two of them from one family, with the most recent one being 16 years ago.
Yeah, we're bad, but so is any team that finishes with the worst record in the league in any given year.
I can't name a single component of this organization that is the same as it was when Peyton came out. Different owners, different front office, different coaches. There isn't some magical curse on the franchise.
As fans we obviously don't have a real impact on the outcome here but at a bare minimum we shouldn't feed the dumb narratives.
yeah fvck that family
Post by: Heismanberg on October 19, 2020, 06:37:47 PM
yeah fvck that family
Their nephew is legitimately the best passing high school quarterback that I've ever seen.
Arch Manning
He will undoubtedly be the top rated recruit in the country during his senior season.
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 19, 2020, 06:39:39 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on October 19, 2020, 06:39:59 PM
Their nephew is legitimately the best passing high school quarterback that I've ever seen.Goid, he can freak us over when we are picking #1 again in 4-5 years.
Arch Manning
He will undoubtedly be the top rated recruit in the country during his senior season.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 19, 2020, 06:41:08 PM
I don't think you're getting the vibe of the discussion, here.
I definitely do.
Just letting everyone know that there's another douche on the way.
Post by: Jumbo on October 19, 2020, 06:42:13 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 19, 2020, 06:49:28 PM
I definitely do.
Just letting everyone know that there's another douche on the way.
My bad. Carry on.
Post by: cautious pessimism on October 19, 2020, 07:17:29 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 20, 2020, 11:29:46 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 20, 2020, 01:06:59 PM
Post by: MBGreen on October 23, 2020, 06:24:35 AM
Post by: Libero_2 on October 23, 2020, 06:47:14 AM
The Giants are freaking god awful, and a real threat to our tank. Gase better be ready to tank harder down the stretch.
Or you could look at it as the Giants past 3 games have been decided by 5 total points and have all been decided in the final minute.
That suggests the Giants are CLOSE to winning games. By accident they will close a couple of those games eventually if they keep things that close.
But Danny Fumbles is really freaking up that offense
Post by: MBGreen on October 23, 2020, 06:59:14 AM
Or you could look at it as the Giants past 3 games have been decided by 5 total points and have all been decided in the final minute.
That suggests the Giants are CLOSE to winning games. By accident they will close a couple of those games eventually if they keep things that close.
But Danny Fumbles is really freaking up that offense
CLOSE only counts in horseshoes
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 23, 2020, 07:43:13 AM
CLOSE only counts in horseshoes
But it means they can win a fluke game or two. We've not been remotely close, have barely held a lead.
Post by: MBGreen on October 23, 2020, 07:45:16 AM
But it means they can win a fluke game or two. We've not been remotely close, have barely held a lead.
it doesn't matter if you're close or completely inept....a loss is a loss.
We need the Skins to start winning games too.
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 23, 2020, 08:13:28 AM
it doesn't matter if you're close or completely inept....a loss is a loss.
We need the Skins to start winning games too.
They play the Giants again, and Dallas and Philadelphia. Someone wins.
Post by: MBGreen on October 23, 2020, 08:14:47 AM
They play the Giants again, and Dallas and Philadelphia. Someone wins.
i want each of those teams to have 2 wins while we work on our 0-fer.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 23, 2020, 08:15:09 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 23, 2020, 11:24:51 AM
CLOSE only counts in horseshoesYes, but the more games you're close, the more chance to win.
The Giants have been competitive. We have not.
But yes, we need the Giants and Washington to each win at least one more game.
My goal for the season is an 0-15 start, every other team gets 2+ wins, and then we win Week 17 to knock the Patriots out of the playoffs.
Post by: mj2sexay on October 23, 2020, 11:41:31 AM
Giants can split with Dallas, can beat Philly at home and have a chance against Washington on the road. And Cincy.
What's the winnable game for the Jags? On the road against Minny or LA? At home vs Houston?
Post by: Heismanberg on October 23, 2020, 11:45:22 AM
I still don't think the Giants are the threat that Jacksonville is. Look at that schedule.
Giants can split with Dallas, can beat Philly at home and have a chance against Washington on the road. And Cincy.
What's the winnable game for the Jags? On the road against Minny or LA? At home vs Houston?
Minnesota is TERRIBLE and they are also potentially tanking for #1
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 23, 2020, 11:48:06 AM
I still don't think the Giants are the threat that Jacksonville is. Look at that schedule.I agree Jacksonville is the biggest threat. I think they're worse than the NFC East teams.
Giants can split with Dallas, can beat Philly at home and have a chance against Washington on the road. And Cincy.
What's the winnable game for the Jags? On the road against Minny or LA? At home vs Houston?
Minnesota is bad, too, though they have home games with Dallas and Jacksonville remaining.
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 23, 2020, 11:54:14 AM
Post by: Johnny English on October 23, 2020, 12:04:48 PM
Yes, but the more games you're close, the more chance to win.
The Giants have been competitive. We have not.
But yes, we need the Giants and Washington to each win at least one more game.
My goal for the season is an 0-15 start, every other team gets 2+ wins, and then we win Week 17 to knock the Patriots out of the playoffs.
I would rather the Patriots stumble to the division title at 9-7 and get bounced in the wildcard if it keeps the Bills out of the playoffs.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 23, 2020, 12:13:17 PM
I would rather the Patriots stumble to the division title at 9-7 and get bounced in the wildcard if it keeps the Bills out of the playoffs.I don't want any of the 3 to make the playoffs. I just picked the Patriots because we play them Week 17, and therefore, it would be the funniest outcome.
Post by: bojanglesman on October 23, 2020, 12:14:48 PM
Post by: Johnny English on October 23, 2020, 12:27:23 PM
I don't want any of the 3 to make the playoffs. I just picked the Patriots because we play them Week 17, and therefore, it would be the funniest outcome.
The 2-13 Jets play the 9-6 Patriots at 1pm. The 9-6 Dolphins and 9-6 Bills play at 4:05pm. Jim-Bob Cooter's revitalised Jets destroy the Patriots led by a 5 TD 300 yard performance from Sam, crushing all hopes of the Patriots making the postseason. Belichick is immediately fired post game. The Dolphins and Bills then play to a tie, meaning both miss out and the now coachless Patriots fall backwards into the playoffs. Patriots immediately call Belichick and beg him to come back, Bill is already into his 4th margarita at the airport on his way to Cabo and tells them to go freak themselves. Desperate, they turn to the only coach on the market and appoint Adam Gase to lead the Patriots for the rest of the season, who inspires them to a 41-3 defeat in the wildcard game. Kraft decides he can catch lightning in a bottle twice and hire another Jets coach to build a dynasty, and gives Gase a Gruden deal.
That would be the funniest outcome.
Post by: mj2sexay on October 23, 2020, 12:33:32 PM
Otherwise, whats to stop Belicheck from going "LOLFUCKU' benching everyone under the guise of "rest" and affording the 0-15 Jets both the opportunity to avoid historical infamy by not finishing the 0'fer and totally freaking the team out of the number 1 overall as we see Trevor on his way to the 1 win Jags, Vikings or...Giants.
Post by: Johnny English on October 23, 2020, 12:44:58 PM
Chalk it up to Jet fan paranoia, but here's hoping the Patriots are very invested in their week 17 game.
Otherwise, whats to stop Belicheck from going "LOLFUCKU' benching everyone under the guise of "rest" and affording the 0-15 Jets both the opportunity to avoid historical infamy by not finishing the 0'fer and totally freaking the team out of the number 1 overall as we see Trevor on his way to the 1 win Jags, Vikings or...Giants.
I don't think it's in Belichick's DNA to deliberately lose a game, especially to the Jets. He would place his faith in our ability to screw up Lawrence.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 23, 2020, 12:45:16 PM
Chalk it up to Jet fan paranoia, but here's hoping the Patriots are very invested in their week 17 game.Losing to an 0-15 team is a type of historical infamy in and of itself.
Otherwise, whats to stop Belicheck from going "LOLFUCKU' benching everyone under the guise of "rest" and affording the 0-15 Jets both the opportunity to avoid historical infamy by not finishing the 0'fer and totally freaking the team out of the number 1 overall as we see Trevor on his way to the 1 win Jags, Vikings or...Giants.
Post by: MBGreen on October 23, 2020, 12:52:09 PM
We should be used to disappoint enough by now to know that we're not getting the #1 pick. Come on!
BEHIND ME SATAN!!!
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 23, 2020, 01:00:20 PM
Losing to an 0-15 team is a type of historical infamy in and of itself.
We lost to the 0-14 Saints in 1980, who finished 1-15.
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 23, 2020, 01:35:56 PM
Danny Fumbles did throw an absolute dime to Evan Engram to seal the game and he dropped it.
Yeah, like 3rd and 6 or something at the end. I thought it might have been a tad out of his reach but he got his fingertips on it.
Post by: Badger on October 23, 2020, 02:28:26 PM
We should be used to disappoint enough by now to know that we're not getting the #1 pick. Come on!I didn't want to say anything but I'm far from certain of it.
Post by: delavan on October 23, 2020, 05:06:10 PM
Jets win the division at 0-16
Mirror, mirror on the wall..
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/38/2006_Ford_VM_Transit_truck_%285344207697%29.jpg/320px-2006_Ford_VM_Transit_truck_%285344207697%29.jpg)
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 25, 2020, 03:02:05 PM
Post by: Laxin on October 25, 2020, 03:03:00 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 25, 2020, 03:05:02 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on October 25, 2020, 03:09:52 PM
Washington wins, Bengals and Falcons up with a minute left.Falcons blew it
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 25, 2020, 03:10:29 PM
Granted, now the extra point is long.
Bengals just blew it.
Post by: Laxin on October 25, 2020, 03:11:47 PM
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 03:17:20 PM
KC and NWE up next. Should be a svelte 0-9 going into the bye.
Post by: Libero_2 on October 25, 2020, 03:19:51 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on October 25, 2020, 03:21:10 PM
Just keep our 0-fer intact, and we'll be fine.
KC and NWE up next. Should be a svelte 0-9 going into the bye.
It would be nice to have some wiggle room for sure. We know all these teams with 1 win obviously aren’t going to stay as they are obviously going to play each other. But man it would be nice to see the Giants, Falcons and Texans win next week
Post by: bojanglesman on October 25, 2020, 03:22:13 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 25, 2020, 03:24:22 PM
Daniel Jeremiah: The Jets rookie class is going to be really good. Good sign for things to come. They have a zillion picks in next 2 drafts.Rapaport was saying this on WFAN this week. I'm sure he gets that from Jeremiah. Jeremiah is really close with Douglas, so I'm not surprised he is saying the draft class is going to be really good.
Maybe it will be. Becton is a stud. The rest of the class has proven nothing. It was good to see Mims today, but let's see some more from him (or literally any other draft pick) before we say the Jets rookie class is going to be really good.
Post by: Libero_2 on October 25, 2020, 03:24:40 PM
Daniel Jeremiah: The Jets rookie class is going to be really good. Good sign for things to come. They have a zillion picks in next 2 drafts.
The man loves him some Joe Douglas.
We had 3 offensive rookies play well today in Perine, Becton and Mims.
Then the second half happened Mims I don’t believe got more than 1 Target (which was in triple coverage) Perine had like 4 touches and Becton played his worst half of the season, which was still pretty good football
Post by: bojanglesman on October 25, 2020, 03:25:09 PM
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 03:26:37 PM
Rapaport was saying this on WFAN this week. I'm sure he gets that from Jeremiah. Jeremiah is really close with Douglas, so I'm not surprised he is saying the draft class is going to be really good.
Maybe it will be. Becton is a stud. The rest of the class has proven nothing. It was good to see Mims today, but let's see some more from him (or literally any other draft pick) before we say the Jets rookie class is going to be really good.
I'll start judging this rookie class when there's a competent coaching staff developing them.
Post by: Heismanberg on October 25, 2020, 03:37:04 PM
Maybe it will be. Becton is a stud. The rest of the class has proven nothing. It was good to see Mims today, but let's see some more from him (or literally any other draft pick) before we say the Jets rookie class is going to be really good.
Perine had nearly 60 all-purpose yards and a TD in the first half and only had 1 touch in the second half. The roster is being completely mismanaged by the coaching staff. Same can be said for Mims who was a bright spot in the passing game early and then they completely went away from him in the second half.
Ashtyn Davis replaced McDougald and made a few tackles.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 25, 2020, 03:46:52 PM
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 03:51:13 PM
I still think Jacksonville is the biggest threat to the No. 1 pick. They are really bad.
we're worse
Post by: Libero_2 on October 25, 2020, 03:58:03 PM
we're worse
I don’t disagree but we get one bounce of the ball our way and we might win a game. If both teams go 1-15 we lose the tie breaker. So you had best be rooting for the Jags pretty damn hard. I’d also put the Giants there as well
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 25, 2020, 04:01:50 PM
I don’t disagree but we get one bounce of the ball our way and we might win a game. If both teams go 1-15 we lose the tie breaker. So you had best be rooting for the Jags pretty damn hard. I’d also put the Giants there as wellWe all know the Jets are the worst team in the NFL. That doesn't change that the Jaguars are on track for 1-15 as well.
I think you have to assume the Jets are going to win a game this year, just because it's hard to go 0-16 and the Jets are still mathematically likely to win a game. Plus, if the Jets go 0-16, #tankwatch is irrelevant because the Jets have the #1 pick. And if the Jets win 1 game, Jacksonville is the biggest threat to also lose out.
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 04:03:16 PM
I don’t disagree but we get one bounce of the ball our way and we might win a game. If both teams go 1-15 we lose the tie breaker. So you had best be rooting for the Jags pretty damn hard. I’d also put the Giants there as well
I'm rooting for this team to go 0-16....because then it doesn't matter.
That's what it's gonna take to get everything back on track (new coaching regime, plenty of picks, generational QB). Every long suffering jets fan should want this.
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 04:04:07 PM
We all know the Jets are the worst team in the NFL. That doesn't change that the Jaguars are on track for 1-15 as well.
I think you have to assume the Jets are going to win a game this year, just because it's hard to go 0-16 and the Jets are still mathematically likely to win a game. Plus, if the Jets go 0-16, #tankwatch is irrelevant because the Jets have the #1 pick. And if the Jets win 1 game, Jacksonville is the biggest threat to also lose out.
Lol...who on our schedule are we going to beat? Enlighten us.
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 04:09:31 PM
Need to keep that streak alive for the tank.
Post by: Johnny English on October 25, 2020, 04:24:08 PM
I'm rooting for this team to go 0-16....because then it doesn't matter.
That's what it's gonna take to get everything back on track (new coaching regime, plenty of picks, generational QB). Every long suffering jets fan should want this.
I think you're delusional.
Every new coaching regime has turned out to be terrible other than Rex, who you don't like.
Pretty much all the picks we've had have turned out to be excrement since about 2008, and the few that haven't we've traded away because they want nothing to do with a team that has losing baked into its DNA.
Generational QBs don't make a team competitive when the rest of the club is a mess. Just ask Andrew Luck.
Your desperation for Lawrence to be the saviour of this team is understandable, but completely misplaced. It's not going to work.
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 04:26:30 PM
I think you're delusional.
Every new coaching regime has turned out to be terrible other than Rex, who you don't like.
Pretty much all the picks we've had have turned out to be excrement since about 2008, and the few that haven't we've traded away because they want nothing to do with a team that has losing baked into its DNA.
Generational QBs don't make a team competitive when the rest of the club is a mess. Just ask Andrew Luck.
Your desperation for Lawrence to be the saviour of this team is understandable, but completely misplaced. It's not going to work.
It has a better chance to work with Lawrence than with Darnold.
The coaching hire will be key. And you're right, i don't trust the owners to not freak that up again.
I'm hoping the allure of all the picks and Lawrence will convince top tier coaches to interview with us.
Post by: Johnny English on October 25, 2020, 04:29:18 PM
It has a better chance to work with Lawrence than with Darnold.
The coaching hire will be key. And you're right, i don't trust the owners to not freak that up again.
I'm hoping the allure of all the picks and Lawrence will convince top tier coaches to interview with us.
I don't think the issue is persuading people to interview with us, it's persuading them to take the job. A top coach is going to have demands that the Johnsons have already proven they're not willing to accede to.
Post by: Johnny English on October 25, 2020, 04:31:28 PM
Lol...who on our schedule are we going to beat? Enlighten us.
I think we're going to beat the Patriots because they're excrement and the world is perverse.
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 04:31:54 PM
I don't think the issue is persuading people to interview with us, it's persuading them to take the job. A top coach is going to have demands that the Johnsons have already proven they're not willing to accede to.
You could be right....we'll have to wait and see.
What's the alternative, JE? Keep status quo and continue to plod on with Gase?
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. On one hand you're saying we're completely inept at hiring coaches (which is a valid point), and on the other hand FIRE GASE.....something has to give.
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 04:32:25 PM
I think we're going to beat the Patriots because they're excrement and the world is perverse.
lol ok
Belichick will turn on the "cover 0" and Darnold will be calling Ghostbusters again.
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 25, 2020, 04:34:13 PM
I think you're delusional.
Every new coaching regime has turned out to be terrible other than Rex, who you don't like.
Pretty much all the picks we've had have turned out to be excrement since about 2008, and the few that haven't we've traded away because they want nothing to do with a team that has losing baked into its DNA.
Generational QBs don't make a team competitive when the rest of the club is a mess. Just ask Andrew Luck.
Your desperation for Lawrence to be the saviour of this team is understandable, but completely misplaced. It's not going to work.
I’m starting to see glimmers of hope from the Douglas draft picks now that Gase isn’t actively sabotaging the offense. Perine and Mims had some decent games today. Gregg’s defense is still getting pushed around and Ashtyn Davis looks like any other safty having WRs, HBs, and TEs catching passes in front of him so no big hopes for the defensive picks yet.
Post by: Johnny English on October 25, 2020, 04:37:49 PM
You could be right....we'll have to wait and see.
What's the alternative, JE? Keep status quo and continue to plod on with Gase?
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. On one hand you're saying we're completely inept at hiring coaches (which is a valid point), and on the other hand FIRE GASE.....something has to give.
I don't have the right answer. The only thing I know isn't the answer is keeping Gase for another minute.
I just don't buy Lawrence as the great hope because the fact is that we can and will ruin him as well. You can rebuild the Titanic but this time paint it pink, it's still going to hit the iceberg and sink if the captain doesn't figure out a new way to do things.
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 04:40:30 PM
I don't have the right answer. The only thing I know isn't the answer is keeping Gase for another minute.
I just don't buy Lawrence as the great hope because the fact is that we can and will ruin him as well. You can rebuild the Titanic but this time paint it pink, it's still going to hit the iceberg and sink if the captain doesn't figure out a new way to do things.
that's where i disagree. I have faith in Joe Douglas to turn the ship around. It just wasn't going to happen in one season or with this coach.
I need to see who the Jets replace Gase with before we assume Lawrence will automatically be ruined.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 25, 2020, 04:42:03 PM
The Patriots aren't good. We play them twice.
The Chargers and Dolphins have rookie quarterbacks.
The Raiders are average.
Outside of Seattle and Kansas City, there isn't a team on the schedule where it's impossible that we win. We are clearly worse than every team remaining on the schedule, but odds are, with 9 games left, you probably win one along the line.
If you look at the betting odds, we're still favored to win a game, and the betting odds are worse than the mathematical odds.
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 04:47:47 PM
Even if you give us a 95% chance to lose every game remaining on the schedule, there's still a 37% chance we win a game. And there's no way that's the case. We have a 95% chance to lose to the Chiefs, but not the Chargers or Patriots or Dolphins.
The Patriots aren't good. We play them twice.
The Chargers and Dolphins have rookie quarterbacks.
The Raiders are average.
Outside of Seattle and Kansas City, there isn't a team on the schedule where it's impossible that we win. We are clearly worse than every team remaining on the schedule, but odds are, with 9 games left, you probably win one along the line.
If you look at the betting odds, we're still favored to win a game, and the betting odds are worse than the mathematical odds.
we'll beat those odds and lose em all.
The Dolphins shut us out already, the Chargers are better than us, the Patriots are concerning but Bill also knows how to kick the excrement out of us anyway...so there's that.
The Raiders are better than us too
it's over man. Embrace the tank.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 25, 2020, 04:48:42 PM
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 04:50:12 PM
Have you bet on the Jets to go 0-16? You really should
I should, but i won't. My bets usually blow up in my face...i can't upset the tank.
I'll continue to start the game threads (0-7 there) and stay the course.
Post by: Laxin on October 25, 2020, 04:52:54 PM
Even if you give us a 95% chance to lose every game remaining on the schedule, there's still a 37% chance we win a game. And there's no way that's the case. We have a 95% chance to lose to the Chiefs, but not the Chargers or Patriots or Dolphins.
The Patriots aren't good. We play them twice.
The Chargers and Dolphins have rookie quarterbacks.
The Raiders are average.
The same can be said about the Jaguars
Outside of Seattle and Kansas City, there isn't a team on the schedule where it's impossible that we win. We are clearly worse than every team remaining on the schedule, but odds are, with 9 games left, you probably win one along the line.
If you look at the betting odds, we're still favored to win a game, and the betting odds are worse than the mathematical odds.
Same could be said about the Jaguars... who are up 21-16
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 25, 2020, 05:35:39 PM
Same could be said about the Jaguars... who are up 21-16Exactly. That's why I think we probably end up winning a game. I'm not overly confident. It will take a lot of things going our way. But while our schedule lacks patsies, it also doesn't have too many elite teams. The Jets can do to the Chargers what the Jaguars are doing if they play well. They'll be 7-10 point underdogs, just like Jacksonville was today, but that's doable.
Or maybe they won't win a game and we do go 0-16. I prefer not to go 0-16 if we don't have to, and I enjoy rooting for my team to actually win, so I would prefer to be able to go 1-15 and get the #1 pick if possible.
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2020, 06:14:31 PM
Exactly. That's why I think we probably end up winning a game. I'm not overly confident. It will take a lot of things going our way. But while our schedule lacks patsies, it also doesn't have too many elite teams. The Jets can do to the Chargers what the Jaguars are doing if they play well. They'll be 7-10 point underdogs, just like Jacksonville was today, but that's doable.Herbert is currently raping the Jags
Or maybe they won't win a game and we do go 0-16. I prefer not to go 0-16 if we don't have to, and I enjoy rooting for my team to actually win, so I would prefer to be able to go 1-15 and get the #1 pick if possible.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 25, 2020, 07:36:21 PM
Exactly. That's why I think we probably end up winning a game. I'm not overly confident. It will take a lot of things going our way. But while our schedule lacks patsies, it also doesn't have too many elite teams. The Jets can do to the Chargers what the Jaguars are doing if they play well. They'll be 7-10 point underdogs, just like Jacksonville was today, but that's doable.
Or maybe they won't win a game and we do go 0-16. I prefer not to go 0-16 if we don't have to, and I enjoy rooting for my team to actually win, so I would prefer to be able to go 1-15 and get the #1 pick if possible.
We have the 5th toughest remaining schedule in the league.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 25, 2020, 07:38:57 PM
Even if you give us a 95% chance to lose every game remaining on the schedule, there's still a 37% chance we win a game. And there's no way that's the case. We have a 95% chance to lose to the Chiefs, but not the Chargers or Patriots or Dolphins.
The Patriots aren't good. We play them twice.
The Chargers and Dolphins have rookie quarterbacks.
The Raiders are average.
Outside of Seattle and Kansas City, there isn't a team on the schedule where it's impossible that we win. We are clearly worse than every team remaining on the schedule, but odds are, with 9 games left, you probably win one along the line.
If you look at the betting odds, we're still favored to win a game, and the betting odds are worse than the mathematical odds.
Looks like we have our resident statistical analyst to go with cap guru DCM.
Quite the one two punch
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 25, 2020, 07:41:20 PM
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 25, 2020, 08:09:19 PM
Did you bet on the Jets to go 0-16?
Nope, but I loaded up on under 6.5 wins
Post by: mj2sexay on October 25, 2020, 08:35:41 PM
I understand any Jet fan that wants to avoid the o'fer and can't bring themselves to root for it.
But I don't know if I can handle a 1-15 season only to see little lord fuckpants Tony Khan up at the podium holding a Jags jersey with Lawrence.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 25, 2020, 08:39:35 PM
0-16 is not a lock and there’s plenty of 1 win teams still out there that hold the tiebreaker against us.
This thing isn’t even close to settled until we have at least a 2 game buffer.
Post by: Badger on October 25, 2020, 10:57:14 PM
Said it last week-I am VERY concerned that the Jags don't win another game.
I understand any Jet fan that wants to avoid the o'fer and can't bring themselves to root for it.
But I don't know if I can handle a 1-15 season only to see little lord fuckpants Tony Khan up at the podium holding a Jags jersey with Lawrence.
Well if it makes you feel any better I doubt there will be a podium for the 2021 draft.
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 25, 2020, 11:13:23 PM
Even if you give us a 95% chance to lose every game remaining on the schedule, there's still a 37% chance we win a game. And there's no way that's the case. We have a 95% chance to lose to the Chiefs, but not the Chargers or Patriots or Dolphins.
The Patriots aren't good. We play them twice.
The Chargers and Dolphins have rookie quarterbacks.
The Raiders are average.
Outside of Seattle and Kansas City, there isn't a team on the schedule where it's impossible that we win. We are clearly worse than every team remaining on the schedule, but odds are, with 9 games left, you probably win one along the line.
If you look at the betting odds, we're still favored to win a game, and the betting odds are worse than the mathematical odds.
I think we're legitimately the worst team and there's enough competitive balance in the league that we'll end up with the worst record.
So cheer up.
Post by: insanity on October 26, 2020, 05:42:29 AM
Texans vs jags
Vikings vs lions
Falcons vs Broncos
Team vs giants
Chargers vs raiders
If things fall our way the texans will be the only team with one win
Post by: bojanglesman on October 26, 2020, 07:37:06 AM
Post by: MBGreen on October 26, 2020, 07:38:35 AM
Top notch excrement-team analysis. It's why I'm here.
and the titties
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 27, 2020, 12:39:28 PM
Post by: insanity on October 27, 2020, 05:33:15 PM
Post by: Johnny English on October 27, 2020, 06:11:04 PM
Trevor Lawrence has the biggest neck
And girl's hair and the world's most punchable smug face.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 27, 2020, 06:29:30 PM
And girl's hair and the world's most punchable smug face.Mahomes has the most punchable smug face IMO. He's high on the list.
If you don't believe that now, wait til Sunday.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 27, 2020, 08:47:25 PM
Quote
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/1997-over-again-trevor-lawrence-204128425.html
I can totally see this happening despite what he's said in the past.
Post by: cautious pessimism on October 28, 2020, 07:56:40 AM
I can totally see this happening despite what he's said in the past.
Careful, that article might trigger some people here.
Post by: MBGreen on October 28, 2020, 08:00:20 AM
Careful, that article might trigger some people here.
we're gonna see crap like that from now until January.
Post by: cautious pessimism on October 28, 2020, 08:13:15 AM
we're gonna see crap like that from now until January.
Agreed.
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 28, 2020, 08:38:26 AM
we're gonna see crap like that from now until January.
Tune it all out, you'll live much better.
Post by: MBGreen on October 28, 2020, 08:45:10 AM
Tune it all out, you'll live much better.
It's tough when it's plastered all over my twitter feed.
Post by: Johnny English on October 28, 2020, 09:08:11 AM
It's tough when it's plastered all over my twitter feed.
Turn off twitter, you'll live much better.
Post by: Rosetta Stoned on October 28, 2020, 09:39:05 AM
It's tough when it's plastered all over my twitter feed.
I think this here is the problem.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 28, 2020, 10:07:14 AM
Turn off twitter, you'll live much better.
Gotta agree here.
I go on once a week during Jets games, and really only to see what the injury statuses of players are, and the only other times are when someone on this board posts something. I'm much less pissed off all the time.
Post by: Gorilla on October 28, 2020, 10:08:24 AM
It's tough when it's plastered all over my twitter feed.
"It's tough not to smell excrement when I'm sticking my head in the porta potty."
Post by: MBGreen on October 28, 2020, 10:43:53 AM
Post by: MexJetinBcn on October 28, 2020, 10:53:41 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 28, 2020, 12:44:59 PM
Twitter is necessary to stay informed.
Define informed. They censor half the people out there and give voice to random morons who know less than we do.
He’ll declare and he’ll play in the NFL next year. Things have changed tremendously since Peyton Manning’s time. He’s just saying the right thing to say given the situation. Nobody would risk 40M to play one year for free just because he doesn’t want to go to a shitty team only to end up in a different shitty team the year after.
This. You don't get to be the #1 overall pick as a QB and go to a good team. That's not how it works in any year. The difference is he could come to a major market like New York and be a star or end up somewhere on a excrement team where nobody cares.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 28, 2020, 01:04:42 PM
Define informed. They censor half the people out there and give voice to random morons who know less than we do.Exactly. Good franchises don't draft high. I guess there's some reason to worry about the Giants, but let's be real - the Giants are a excrement organization now, too.
This. You don't get to be the #1 overall pick as a QB and go to a good team. That's not how it works in any year. The difference is he could come to a major market like New York and be a star or end up somewhere on a excrement team where nobody cares.
Post by: Badger on October 28, 2020, 01:09:03 PM
Define informed. They censor half the people out there and give voice to random morons who know less than we do.
I was very disappointed they banned all the Qanon accounts who were doing crucial reporting on adrenachrome harvesting.
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 28, 2020, 01:26:05 PM
I was very disappointed they banned all the Qanon accounts who were doing crucial reporting on adrenachrome harvesting.
They never banned ISIS. Remember ISIS? Good times.
Post by: Rosetta Stoned on October 28, 2020, 01:33:42 PM
They never banned ISIS. Remember ISIS? Good times.
ISIS is a hell of a band. And also where the best seasons of Archer happened.
Post by: Johnny English on October 28, 2020, 01:54:18 PM
ISIS is a hell of a band. And also where the best seasons of Archer happened.
Also the name of a stretch of the Thames that flows through Oxford, and gives its name to the University magazine and the 8 man rowing team's reserve crew and boat.
Also an Egyptian goddess.
Also the name of lots of ships over the years.
Also lots of other things that don't have any reason to be banned from Twitter or anything else.
Post by: Italian Seafood on October 29, 2020, 10:25:29 PM
Post by: IATA on October 29, 2020, 10:29:17 PM
Post by: MBGreen on October 30, 2020, 07:12:59 AM
Atlanta wins. Another small step towards greatness for the Jets.
Jacksonville is going to be a problem, especially with Glennon taking over for Minshew.
Post by: Badger on October 30, 2020, 07:20:11 AM
Jacksonville is going to be a problem, especially with Glennon taking over for Minshew.#GiraffeSZN
Post by: MBGreen on October 30, 2020, 07:24:13 AM
#GiraffeSZN
He's the gyro pilot from the Road Warrior
(https://theiapolis.com/b000000/d4/hEL/i1WNE/t3/wJG/mad-max-2.jpg)
Post by: Badger on November 01, 2020, 11:04:05 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 01, 2020, 11:08:06 AM
Quote
Sources: #Jaguars QB Gardner Minshew is expected to be inactive for next week’s game vs the #Texans. Mike Glennon and rookie Jake Luton were told to be ready to compete in practice. One will start, the other will back up against Houston.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 01, 2020, 11:17:09 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 01, 2020, 11:21:06 AM
Mike Glennon is devastating newsYeah, I'm envisioning Duval Lawrence.
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 11:22:15 AM
Yeah, I'm envisioning Duval Lawrence.(https://media1.giphy.com/media/WrgAGkGrh0MD1Z2gkO/giphy.gif?cid=349c9dd7j4h8oxmadrhzpl74a82gce6xuj1h8zhgz2eqn2wn&rid=giphy.gif)
Post by: Badger on November 01, 2020, 01:16:41 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 01, 2020, 01:19:45 PM
This is all going to come down to the Jaguars and Giants.
Post by: Badger on November 01, 2020, 01:45:28 PM
Bengals up 10.I don't have faith in Cincy to maintain that
This is all going to come down to the Jaguars and Giants.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 01, 2020, 01:57:13 PM
I don't have faith in Cincy to maintain thatNeither do I, but I also think it's unlikely we win 2 games, so Cincy is probably safe regardless.
Minny up 2 TD now.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 01, 2020, 02:08:05 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 01, 2020, 02:22:46 PM
Neither do I, but I also think it's unlikely we win 2 games, so Cincy is probably safe regardless.
Minny up 2 TD now.
Cincinnati has a tie, too. That tie helps us twice.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 01, 2020, 03:02:29 PM
Post by: Laxin on November 01, 2020, 03:07:44 PM
If this team does mess up the tank and ends up with the 2nd pick, who’s the pick? Sewell, Chase or the second best QB? With the way things have been going with Darnold is hard to imagine a scenario where we give him the keys again next year.
Post by: Badger on November 01, 2020, 03:08:13 PM
Need the Vikings and Bengals to hold on here(https://i.imgur.com/hLjXKfL.gif)
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 01, 2020, 03:08:16 PM
Rogers getting the ball back down 8 with a little less than a minute left
Post by: Badger on November 01, 2020, 03:10:50 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 01, 2020, 03:12:29 PM
I think this teams floor is the 2nd pick... I don’t see them winning two games at this point. It’s really just Jacksonville that we have to worry about.This QB class is intriguing after Lawrence with Fields, Trask, Wilson and Lance.
If this team does mess up the tank and ends up with the 2nd pick, who’s the pick? Sewell, Chase or the second best QB? With the way things have been going with Darnold is hard to imagine a scenario where we give him the keys again next year.
I think at this point, you take whichever QB the new coach likes.
Post by: casman02 on November 01, 2020, 03:13:44 PM
I think this teams floor is the 2nd pick... I don’t see them winning two games at this point. It’s really just Jacksonville that we have to worry about.
If this team does mess up the tank and ends up with the 2nd pick, who’s the pick? Sewell, Chase or the second best QB? With the way things have been going with Darnold is hard to imagine a scenario where we give him the keys again next year.
I go chase. Watching this WR corps makes me a bit sick
Post by: bojanglesman on November 01, 2020, 03:16:35 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 01, 2020, 03:18:08 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 03:19:20 PM
I think the Jets will win a game this year. At least we won't have to worry about a team resting their starters against us week 17. Pats aren't going anywhere either. Feels good to say that.
Who do they beat?
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 01, 2020, 03:20:54 PM
Who do they beat?I saw +280 on an 0-16 season entering today. -360 they would win one.
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 03:22:06 PM
I saw +280 on an 0-16 season entering today. -360 they would win one.
Our coaching staff is a bunch of cigar-smoking monkeys mashing typewriters with their faces. So, i'll ask again...who will they beat?
Post by: bojanglesman on November 01, 2020, 03:23:32 PM
Who do they beat?I don't know, that's why I say I think. They have a puncher's chance against the Browns or Vikings if they have a really awful game. If Stidham is playing for the Pats, they'd have a shot there.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 01, 2020, 03:24:54 PM
I'm just saying, the odds are that we will win a game, and the actual odds are better than that.
Our coaching staff is a bunch of cigar-smoking monkeys mashing typewriters with their faces. So, i'll ask again...who will they beat?
This is where I list a couple of teams that are on our schedule that aren't good (Patriots, Chargers, Dolphins, Raiders, Browns), and you have a smartass response, just like we've done for the last few weeks.
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 03:25:41 PM
I don't know, that's why I say I think. They have a puncher's chance against the Browns or Vikings if they have a really awful game. If Stidham is playing for the Pats, they'd have a shot there.
We don't play the Vikings this year
The Browns offense and defense is better than ours.
Belichick will scheme a win against us with his punter playing QB.
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 03:27:33 PM
I'm just saying, the odds are that we will win a game, and the actual odds are better than that.
This is where I list a couple of teams that are on our schedule that aren't good (Patriots, Chargers, Dolphins, Raiders, Browns), and you have a smartass response, just like we've done for the last few weeks.
Well...i don't believe it. The Dolphins aren't good? they shut us out 2 weeks ago.
Just stop.
It will take an act of god for us to win a game. You're smart enough to know this, now it's time to accept it.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 01, 2020, 03:27:59 PM
Today was a great tank day.
Giants beating Bardy Monday
Post by: bojanglesman on November 01, 2020, 03:29:16 PM
We don't play the Vikings this year
That's why we can win.
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 03:31:48 PM
That's why we can win.
the Jets should hire you to be the HC. #realtalk
Post by: bojanglesman on November 01, 2020, 03:32:58 PM
the Jets should hire you to be the HC. #realtalk
"The Jets have arrived at the wrong stadium, only down by 10 pts."
Post by: Rosetta Stoned on November 01, 2020, 03:33:39 PM
You're smart enough to know this, now it's time to accept it.
I think you have watched enough football to know how hard it is to go 0-16. It's still very improbable that we would lose out.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 01, 2020, 03:35:29 PM
I think you have watched enough football to know how hard it is to go 0-16. It's still very improbable that we would lose out.
This team is historically bad. It's at least a 50% chance now.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 01, 2020, 03:36:06 PM
Post by: Rosetta Stoned on November 01, 2020, 03:37:50 PM
This team is historically bad. It's at least a 50% chance now.
That would mean that we have a less than 9% chance to win every single game.
C'mon now
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 03:37:56 PM
I think you have watched enough football to know how hard it is to go 0-16. It's still very improbable that we would lose out.
Of course.
But our schedule is ridiculous. It's not a fat marshmallow like it was the back half of last season.
Gase/Gregggg are getting schooled by the likes of Brett Rypien, Nick Mullens, Fitz, etc
there's really no improvement. Still can't get into the end zone.
I'm sorry it's not something anyone wants to hear....but this is where we're at.
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 03:39:34 PM
We just hung in the first half against the Bills and the Chiefs. If anything this team is building momentum to a W once we hit the softer part of the schedule, which is in fact coming.
We'll kick FGs into the win column.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 01, 2020, 03:43:57 PM
We'll kick FGs into the win column.
14-9 Chiefs with 2:30 left in the 1st half is closer than anyone here thought it would be.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 01, 2020, 03:44:20 PM
We just hung in the first half against the Bills and the Chiefs. If anything this team is building momentum to a W once we hit the softer part of the schedule, which is in fact coming.
Jets win 30-29 on 10 FG from Sergio!
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 03:45:56 PM
14-9 Chiefs with 2:30 left in the 1st half is closer than anyone here thought it would be.
And then reality set in for the rest of the game.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 01, 2020, 03:50:31 PM
And then reality set in for the rest of the game.
The reality is that there’s still currently 3 teams that are a threat
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 03:52:29 PM
The reality is that there’s still currently 3 teams that are a threat
just need to keep winning this war of attrition.
Jax has a tough schedule like us. They're our biggest threat. Need them to pull off an upset.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 01, 2020, 03:52:41 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 01, 2020, 03:55:50 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 04:01:39 PM
With 8 games left, I think the Jets have a (small) chance to win every game except for the Seattle game. None of the teams we’re playing are very good. Anything can happen in a football game with injuries and turnovers.
There's absolutely nothing that's happened under this regime in 2020 that would lend any support to this.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 01, 2020, 04:04:07 PM
With 8 games left, I think the Jets have a (small) chance to win every game except for the Seattle game. None of the teams we’re playing are very good. Anything can happen in a football game with injuries and turnovers.
We will inevitably have a weird fluky game where we have a defensive score and a ST score in it and the other team will look like shot because they expected to steam roll us and we got a few lucky bounces early on. That’s basically how I would describe the bills game last week. It will happen again and who knows how that game will finish when the time comes.
Post by: delavan on November 01, 2020, 04:20:19 PM
Speaking of funky and weird I wonder what's goin on with The Flight Crew this year..
Post by: Jumbo on November 01, 2020, 04:25:38 PM
It's the NFL. The team is awful but all it takes is a couple of fluky events for the team to win a game.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 01, 2020, 04:28:16 PM
Speaking of funky and weird I wonder what's goin on with The Flight Crew this year..
(https://wompampsupport.azureedge.net/fetchimage?siteId=7575&v=2&jpgQuality=100&width=700&url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.kym-cdn.com%2Fentries%2Ficons%2Ffacebook%2F000%2F033%2F758%2FScreen_Shot_2020-04-28_at_12.21.48_PM.jpg)
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 04:32:13 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 01, 2020, 04:34:17 PM
The 2016 Browns lost their first 14 games before winning their 15th, and they lost 17 consecutive games after that.
It's the NFL. The team is awful but all it takes is a couple of fluky events for the team to win a game.
I'm 0-8 in starting the game thread this year. I believe in my shoddy luck.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 01, 2020, 09:07:21 PM
If Sam had all of his "weapons" healthy at the same time, it might be close to squeak one out, but even then I'd be surprised.
There's Becton, there's Q, there are flashes of Maye, Mims, and Perine, and there's an occasional good play by Sam. That's it. Oh, wait, there's also the punter and kickers. Hoo-freaking-ray.
#historicallybad
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 01, 2020, 09:45:45 PM
17 points
17 points
16 points
21 points
Post by: Libero_2 on November 01, 2020, 10:02:37 PM
#Chargers blown leads in the last four games:If it didn’t take us a month to score 21 points, I’d have faith we might have a shot there.
17 points
17 points
16 points
21 points
Seriously it’s been 4 weeks to score 21
Chiefs - 9
Bills - 10
Dolphins - 0
Cardinals - 10
Jesus we’ve only score 29 points in the past MONTH.
Why the freak does Gase still have a job?
Post by: Laxin on November 01, 2020, 10:03:10 PM
#Chargers blown leads in the last four games:
17 points
17 points
16 points
21 points
It’s a good thing this team can’t score 16 points
Post by: Badger on November 01, 2020, 10:12:29 PM
There's no way this team wins a game. What does anyone see from this team that makes you think they're capable of a win?There's still a chance a team has a bad day against us and we win 10-7 or something.
If Sam had all of his "weapons" healthy at the same time, it might be close to squeak one out, but even then I'd be surprised.
There's Becton, there's Q, there are flashes of Maye, Mims, and Perine, and there's an occasional good play by Sam. That's it. Oh, wait, there's also the punter and kickers. Hoo-freaking-ray.
#historicallybad
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 01, 2020, 10:38:22 PM
If it didn’t take us a month to score 21 points, I’d have faith we might have a shot there.
Seriously it’s been 4 weeks to score 21
Chiefs - 9
Bills - 10
Dolphins - 0
Cardinals - 10
Jesus we’ve only score 29 points in the past MONTH.
Why the freak does Gase still have a job?
I keep asking this question out loud during games. You can't make the consistency argument--unless you like consistently losing. You can't make the tutoring Sam argument--because, well...
So why is he still gainfully employed?
There's still a chance a team has a bad day against us and we win 10-7 or something.
The moon might veer off its orbit and crash sideways into the Earth tonight. Not likely, but possible.
I can't see any way this team even competes for a win, much less threatens one. The media is awarding moral victories for the Jets not losing today by 50. KC was on cruise control in the second half.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 02, 2020, 03:35:31 AM
I can't see any way this team even competes for a win, much less threatens one. The media is awarding moral victories for the Jets not losing today by 50. KC was on cruise control in the second half.
I’d wish to think that Gase still has a job because that gives us the best shot to 0-16. I’m terrified Belichick starts Stidham next week and somehow we beat the Patriots though.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 02, 2020, 05:55:57 AM
I’d wish to think that Gase still has a job because that gives us the best shot to 0-16. I’m terrified Belichick starts Stidham next week and somehow we beat the Patriots though.
People are saying Belichick can’t coach and he’s lost it. That mother fucker wants to beat us so bad this week. He is going to decimate our POS offense. And our pass defense is so bad I have to believe even their WRs are going to get open enough to score the necessary 12 points to beat us.
The under is probably the best bet next week, even if it’s only 30
Post by: Badger on November 02, 2020, 05:58:51 AM
I’d wish to think that Gase still has a job because that gives us the best shot to 0-16. I’m terrified Belichick starts Stidham next week and somehow we beat the Patriots though.Also terrifying, what if he starts Stidham and he pulls a 2002 Pennington and they win the division?
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 02, 2020, 06:06:36 AM
Also terrifying, what if he starts Stidham and he pulls a 2002 Pennington and they win the division?
Haha I think they’re too far behind already. I’m all for them winning some games so they get far from their QB of the future.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2020, 06:14:21 AM
Haha I think they’re too far behind already. I’m all for them winning some games so they get far from their QB of the future.He'll get sooo many gords in the late rounds.
Post by: insanity on November 02, 2020, 06:47:33 AM
Post by: MBGreen on November 02, 2020, 06:54:32 AM
#Chargers blown leads in the last four games:
17 points
17 points
16 points
21 points
Can't blow a lead if your opponent can't score points.
(https://i.imgflip.com/1l8thn.jpg)
Post by: MBGreen on November 02, 2020, 06:56:55 AM
I'm absolutely terrified the jets win this week, and we lose out on lawrence
On Monday night football? nah..the football gods hate us too much.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 02, 2020, 07:27:58 AM
I'm absolutely terrified the jets win this week, and we lose out on lawrence
I can totally see Belichick trying to lose on purpose just to freak us out of Lawrence.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 02, 2020, 07:55:43 AM
We're not beating the Pats. We're not beating anyone. Maybe if they fire Gase this team will be inspired, but this roster is beyond terrible, so I doubt it.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2020, 08:02:43 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 02, 2020, 11:39:33 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 02, 2020, 12:48:41 PM
Belichick wouldn't purposely lose to the Jets if his kid's life was at stake.
Not on national TV.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 02, 2020, 07:40:57 PM
Post by: WD40 on November 03, 2020, 12:56:51 PM
Some tasty tanking math.
TL;DR: Strength of schedule is key. Root for the Texans / Vikings to get better, and for the Pats / Broncos to collapse.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 03, 2020, 04:36:54 PM
Mike Glennon is devastating news
*Jake Luton is devastating news
Post by: Badger on November 03, 2020, 04:38:04 PM
*Jake Luton is devastating newsWhat is a Jake Luton?
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 03, 2020, 04:40:19 PM
What is a Jake Luton?
I'm pretty sure that's just Jake Locker trying to sneak back into the league and an assumed identity but he's being really lazy about it.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 03, 2020, 04:41:19 PM
Post by: Johnny English on November 03, 2020, 04:53:17 PM
Is it pronounced like Futon?
If you're talking about the grotty little town in Southern England it's loo-tun, so I assume his name will be pronounced differently as I don't think you people can pronounce a single place name in England correctly.
Post by: MBGreen on November 03, 2020, 04:54:42 PM
the #jagtank is srs bizness
Post by: Heismanberg on November 03, 2020, 04:57:56 PM
If you're talking about the grotty little town in Southern England it's loo-tun, so I assume his name will be pronounced differently as I don't think you people can pronounce a single place name in England correctly.
No, I'm talking about the fold-up dorm couches that Puck used to get railed on back in the 80s.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 03, 2020, 04:59:07 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 03, 2020, 05:00:23 PM
If this bum derriere quarterback wears jorts and grows a mustache, is the media going to overrate the excrement out of him like they did with Gardner Minshew?
I'm hoping the jorts/stache transform him into Jeff George
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 04, 2020, 02:39:40 PM
Jets-Pats
Giants-Skins
Texans-Jags
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 07, 2020, 09:17:35 AM
Big week
Jets-Pats
Giants-Skins
Texans-Jags
Texans and Jags gets someone a second win. We might be able to root for our team by the end, that's how it went in 1996.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 07, 2020, 03:04:21 PM
Texans and Jags gets someone a second win. We might be able to root for our team by the end, that's how it went in 1996.That's what I keep hoping for. Unfortunately, this doesn't seem like the week. And while I think Jacksonville eventually wins again for the same reasons I think the Jets find a win, there aren't any obvious wins on that schedule either.
Post by: mj2sexay on November 07, 2020, 03:14:08 PM
Texans and Jags gets someone a second win. We might be able to root for our team by the end, that's how it went in 1996.
We need the Jags to win that game.
Post by: Badger on November 08, 2020, 10:29:46 AM
Big weekI'd add the Falcons to the root list too, just to be safe.
Jets-Pats
Giants-Skins
Texans-Jags
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 08, 2020, 01:45:37 PM
Would a Jax/Hou tie be better for our draft standings than 1 of the teams losing?
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 08, 2020, 01:48:13 PM
No clear W’s on Jax schedule. CLE and MIN are their best chance.
Texans play CLE, NE, DET, and CIN
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 08, 2020, 01:49:35 PM
Kyle Allen out with a leg injury. Alex Smith time.
Falcons up 20-6 and Vikings up 20-10.
Post by: Jumbo on November 08, 2020, 01:58:40 PM
Probably a dumb and irrelevant question, but that’s never stopped me before:
Would a Jax/Hou tie be better for our draft standings than 1 of the teams losing?
Depends how bad you anticipate both being the rest of the year. If they're both going to be very close to the Jets then probably. If one is likelier to be out of range (I'd guess the Texans can fluke their way into winning a couple of games more than the Jags) you'd rather the worse team wins.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 08, 2020, 02:04:26 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 08, 2020, 04:23:08 PM
Giants up 20-3 at half.
Kyle Allen out with a leg injury. Alex Smith time.
Falcons up 20-6 and Vikings up 20-10.
Dallas is up. It's all coming together nicely.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 08, 2020, 04:40:02 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 08, 2020, 05:04:04 PM
Rapistburger heading into the locker room earlyHe'll be back in the 2nd half
Post by: bojanglesman on November 08, 2020, 05:23:58 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 08, 2020, 06:47:29 PM
Packers
Steelers
Browns
Vikings
Titans
Ravens
Bears
Colts
I still think we’ll have to lose out.
We play the Patriots x2, Chargers, Dolphins, Raiders, Seahawks, Rams and Browns.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 08, 2020, 06:49:44 PM
Jaguars are the last 1 win team leftI still don't see a win there, but it would be nice if the Jags won a game just for comfort.
Packers
Steelers
Browns
Vikings
Titans
Ravens
Bears
Colts
I still think we’ll have to lose out.
We play the Patriots x2, Chargers, Dolphins, Raiders, Seahawks, Rams and Browns.
Post by: Rosetta Stoned on November 08, 2020, 11:49:53 PM
I still don't see a win there, but it would be nice if the Jags won a game just for comfort.
The Vikings, Bears and Colts are all winnable games for them.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 09, 2020, 07:36:57 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 09, 2020, 08:01:24 AM
Saw my friend who is a Patriots fan, he is rooting for them to lose. Not sure his motivation except to keep Lawrence away from us.No one is better than us at being terrible.
Post by: Badger on November 09, 2020, 08:18:45 AM
Saw my friend who is a Patriots fan, he is rooting for them to lose. Not sure his motivation except to keep Lawrence away from us.Reminds me of the Little League episode of South Park
Post by: Jumbo on November 09, 2020, 10:59:25 AM
With a win: 37%
With a loss: 64%
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 09, 2020, 11:03:46 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 09, 2020, 11:38:54 AM
I used to have a pair of red Patriots sweats but didn't bother looking for them, they're likely long gone. I did wear a red shirt today, and Jets socks. Why the freak not?
I have never owned a Patriots thing...........you suck.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 09, 2020, 11:40:12 AM
I have never owned a Patriots thing...........you suck.
My friend was on the team back in the day. He ended up on the Dolphins later but I never got any Dolphins excrement, told him enough is enough lol.
Post by: Badger on November 09, 2020, 12:05:05 PM
I used to have a pair of red Patriots sweats but didn't bother looking for them, they're likely long gone. I did wear a red shirt today, and Jets socks. Why the freak not?I'm wearing red shorts and a Jets shirt but that's also what I'm wearing 20% of the time since March anyway
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 09, 2020, 10:24:59 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 09, 2020, 10:41:33 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 09, 2020, 10:42:46 PM
Post by: reuben on November 09, 2020, 10:47:05 PM
Post by: Jumbo on November 09, 2020, 10:48:35 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 09, 2020, 11:00:21 PM
Week 10: BYE
Week 11: at Chargers (2-6)
Week 12: vs. Dolphins (5-3)
Week 13: vs. Raiders (5-3)
Week 14: at Seahawks (6-2)
Week 15: at LA Rams (5-3)
Week 16: vs. Browns (5-3)
Week 17: at Patriots (3-5)
The Chargers have worst luck than we do with closing games out. They're the biggest threat to the tank, with that week 17 Pats game coming in a close 2nd. I'm hoping the Jags somehow pull a win out before week 17.
The rest of the teams on the list should beat us.
Post by: Badger on November 09, 2020, 11:01:17 PM
Here's our remaining schedule:Anthony Lynn revenge game doe
Week 10: BYE
Week 11: at Chargers (2-6)
Week 12: vs. Dolphins (5-3)
Week 13: vs. Raiders (5-3)
Week 14: at Seahawks (6-2)
Week 15: at LA Rams (5-3)
Week 16: vs. Browns (5-3)
Week 17: at Patriots (3-5)
The Chargers have worst luck than we do with closing games out. They're the biggest threat to the tank, with that week 17 Pats game coming in a close 2nd. I'm hoping the Jags somehow pull a win out before week 17.
The rest of the teams on the list should beat us.
Post by: MBGreen on November 09, 2020, 11:02:15 PM
Kalen Ballage revenge game doe
FYP
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 09, 2020, 11:11:07 PM
Here's our remaining schedule:
Week 10: BYE
Week 11: at Chargers (2-6)
Week 12: vs. Dolphins (5-3)
Week 13: vs. Raiders (5-3)
Week 14: at Seahawks (6-2)
Week 15: at LA Rams (5-3)
Week 16: vs. Browns (5-3)
Week 17: at Patriots (3-5)
The Chargers have worst luck than we do with closing games out. They're the biggest threat to the tank, with that week 17 Pats game coming in a close 2nd. I'm hoping the Jags somehow pull a win out before week 17.
The rest of the teams on the list should beat us.
I follow your logic on the Chargers blowing games, but they’re a little better on both O and D than the Patriots. Justin Herbert is playing miles better than Cam.
I think the pats are the worst team we play, Chargers 2nd. We just saw that we have the ability to compete with NE.
I hope it doesn’t, but it could come down to week 17.
Post by: MBGreen on November 09, 2020, 11:12:31 PM
I follow your logic on the Chargers blowing games, but they’re a little better on both O and D than the Patriots. Justin Herbert is playing miles better than Cam.
I think the pats are the worst team we play, Chargers a close 2nd.
I hope it doesn’t, but it could come down to week 17.
you're right....plus the Jets have to fly cross country to play the Chargers in LA.
I'm really hoping the Jags get a win before we play the Pats again.
Post by: Jumbo on November 09, 2020, 11:13:15 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 09, 2020, 11:15:11 PM
If anyone can do get it done, it’s Jake Luton
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 09, 2020, 11:16:30 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 09, 2020, 11:16:45 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 09, 2020, 11:19:18 PM
I really need the Jags to win another game.Unfortunately, you probably have to wait until Week 12 until they have realistic games they can lose. They aren't beating the Packers. Steelers are a little overrated and almost lost to Dallas, but they're probably beating Jacksonville, even in JAX.
From Weeks 12-14, they get the Browns, Vikings and Titans. I think those 3 games are a better chance, especially the first two.
Chicago in Week 16 is their best chance at a win, but that would obviously be a while.
Post by: MBGreen on November 09, 2020, 11:19:38 PM
Nobody ever mentions the Browns and Raiders, and I don't get it. We beat the Raiders last year. Both want to be run-first teams. That's probably our best chance defensively. Obviously, both are better than us, but they are only a half-step better than the Chargers IMO.
The Browns are getting healthy...i think Chubb is back next week. Their pass rush is killer (ask Siemian). I don't see us losing to them.
The Raiders offense (run game and pass game) is better than ours too.
I suppose there's always a chance, but you better hope for some injuries.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 09, 2020, 11:40:32 PM
Nobody ever mentions the Browns and Raiders, and I don't get it. We beat the Raiders last year. Both want to be run-first teams. That's probably our best chance defensively. Obviously, both are better than us, but they are only a half-step better than the Chargers IMO.
The Raiders are good.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 09, 2020, 11:47:11 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on November 09, 2020, 11:51:47 PM
Only game I think we have zero chance to win is the Seattle game.
Can't see us doing anything against the Rams offensively. Aaron Donald might kill Sam.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 09, 2020, 11:56:50 PM
Can't see us doing anything against the Rams offensively. Aaron Donald might kill Sam.
That’s gonna be ugly against our iOL.
Jared Goff having like 5 turnovers last week is the main reason I said that. I think Tua had 100 yards passing
Post by: Badger on November 10, 2020, 06:56:19 AM
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 10, 2020, 08:37:11 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 10, 2020, 08:41:17 AM
Two horse race now.
One just waiting to be put down after the race.
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 10, 2020, 08:42:30 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 10, 2020, 08:44:04 AM
At least there is no way for us to mess up our position this week.
If there's a possible way...
Post by: IATA on November 10, 2020, 09:29:29 AM
At least there is no way for us to mess up our position this week.
now theyre gonna take our pick away for the cameras.
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 10, 2020, 09:33:04 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 10, 2020, 09:40:54 AM
Anthony Lynn revenge game doe
Maybe they will award the Jets 2 3rd round picks. In the next 5 years arrears is the only way they will get them.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 10, 2020, 09:42:20 AM
Other realistic scenarios:
- We land first overall pick, and Lawrence pulls an Eli and refuses to play for Jets
- Christopher Johnson brings Gase back to freak up our new QB
Post by: Heismanberg on November 10, 2020, 10:08:21 AM
Lawrence pulls an Eli and refuses to play for Jets
If he does this, it's a solid scenario because we'll get a king's ransom for that pick.
Lawrence staying in school is the worst case scenario.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 10, 2020, 10:30:31 AM
If he does this, it's a solid scenario because we'll get a king's ransom for that pick.There are far worse things that can happen than getting the #1 pick, trading it for three 1st-round picks, taking Zach Wilson or Justin Fields or someone else, and then grabbing several other premium players to help.
Lawrence staying in school is the worst case scenario.
This is the best QB class on paper in a while.
And Lawrence is coming out.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 10, 2020, 10:32:30 AM
This is the best QB class on paper in a while
At least 5 QBs that could go in the top 10.
Lawrence
Trask
Fields
Wilson
Lance
If the Jets like another QB just as much or more than Lawrence, they could definitely consider moving back
Post by: Libero_2 on November 10, 2020, 10:38:28 AM
At least 5 QBs that could go in the top 10.
Lawrence
Trask
Fields
Wilson
Lance
If the Jets like another QB just as much or more than Lawrence, they could definitely consider moving back
I would love to know if we could get a team to make a trade that gets the “Ditka” re-named. If we got an offer like that it would be tremendously interesting. Hell let’s pretend we have 1 and the Jags have 2.
Jags get #1 (Lawrence)
Jets get #2 (Fields) 3 additional #1s and a #2 and a #3 across 21, 22 and 23.
My god we would be in some kind of windfall state of draft capital if that were possible.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 10, 2020, 10:43:28 AM
Post by: Gorilla on November 10, 2020, 10:52:13 AM
At least 5 QBs that could go in the top 10.
Lawrence
Trask
Fields
Wilson
Lance
If the Jets like another QB just as much or more than Lawrence, they could definitely consider moving back
If the Jets like another QB as much or more than Lawrence, then Douglas is an imbecile and we should be very concerned.
That said, if we end up with #2 or 3, I'd be plenty satisfied with Fields.
Post by: mj2sexay on November 10, 2020, 10:53:43 AM
I'll take that quick release and cannon arm of Zach Wilson though.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 10, 2020, 11:05:21 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 10, 2020, 11:07:06 AM
I would love to know if we could get a team to make a trade that gets the “Ditka” re-named. If we got an offer like that it would be tremendously interesting. Hell let’s pretend we have 1 and the Jags have 2.We're not getting that package from the team with the #2 pick, stop it. Obviously, you take that trade though if you think Fields or Lance or Wilson is worthy of a top-5 pick.
Jags get #1 (Lawrence)
Jets get #2 (Fields) 3 additional #1s and a #2 and a #3 across 21, 22 and 23.
My god we would be in some kind of windfall state of draft capital if that were possible.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 10, 2020, 09:35:38 PM
http://www.footballperspective.com/tankathon-2020-jets-jaguars-and-just-losing-enough/
Basically, for the Jets-Jaguars SOS tiebreaker, root against AFC East teams and teams on the Jets schedule. And root for AFC South teams and teams on the Jaguars schedule. Browns and Chargers cancel each other out.
Here is the Week 10 rooting interest list.
Jaguars over Packers
Ravens over Patriots (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Texans over Browns (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Chargers over Dolphins (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Cardinals over Bills (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Raiders over Broncos (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Giants over Eagles (Giants 2-7)
Washington over Lions (Washington 2-6)
Chargers are 2-6, but they'll win another game (probably against us). Granted, if they lose this one and then we beat them, that does put them in play
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 11, 2020, 07:58:31 AM
Take the haul for #1 AND trade Darnold. Mike White 2021.
You jinxed Mike White.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 11, 2020, 08:15:04 AM
Replying to Laxin's post here rather than spamming in two threads.
http://www.footballperspective.com/tankathon-2020-jets-jaguars-and-just-losing-enough/
Basically, for the Jets-Jaguars SOS tiebreaker, root against AFC East teams and teams on the Jets schedule. And root for AFC South teams and teams on the Jaguars schedule. Browns and Chargers cancel each other out.
Here is the Week 10 rooting interest list.
Jaguars over Packers
Ravens over Patriots (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Texans over Browns (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Chargers over Dolphins (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Cardinals over Bills (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Raiders over Broncos (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Giants over Eagles (Giants 2-7)
Washington over Lions (Washington 2-6)
Chargers are 2-6, but they'll win another game (probably against us). Granted, if they lose this one and then we beat them, that does put them in play
This is some deep diving tankology, my friend. We're way too good at this.
Sad part is I've pretty much forgotten the playoff tiebreakers.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 11, 2020, 08:24:57 AM
Replying to Laxin's post here rather than spamming in two threads.
http://www.footballperspective.com/tankathon-2020-jets-jaguars-and-just-losing-enough/
Basically, for the Jets-Jaguars SOS tiebreaker, root against AFC East teams and teams on the Jets schedule. And root for AFC South teams and teams on the Jaguars schedule. Browns and Chargers cancel each other out.
Here is the Week 10 rooting interest list.
Jaguars over Packers
Ravens over Patriots (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Texans over Browns (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Chargers over Dolphins (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Cardinals over Bills (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Raiders over Broncos (Jags SOS tiebreaker)
Giants over Eagles (Giants 2-7)
Washington over Lions (Washington 2-6)
Chargers are 2-6, but they'll win another game (probably against us). Granted, if they lose this one and then we beat them, that does put them in play
At least one guy at TDN thinks the jags will finish with a higher SOS than the Jets do: https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/race-top-no-1-pick-2021-nfl-draft-order
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 11, 2020, 11:41:40 AM
At least one guy at TDN thinks the jags will finish with a higher SOS than the Jets do: https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/race-top-no-1-pick-2021-nfl-draft-orderLooks like he edited the article to say the Jets likely lose the SOS tiebreaker.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 11, 2020, 12:09:42 PM
Looks like he edited the article to say the Jets likely lose the SOS tiebreaker.
He definitely did.
Post by: MBGreen on November 11, 2020, 12:11:58 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on November 12, 2020, 05:19:43 PM
(https://cdn.jetsxfactor.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/New-York-Jets-Jacksonville-Jaguars-Tank-For-Trevor-Lawrence-Strength-of-Schedule-2020-2-1024x1024.png.webp)
Apparently the single most important game left on the schedule is the Texans vs. Pats game week 11. We need Deshaun Watson to ball out in that one big time, as it represents a 2 game swing (wins to strengthen the Jags SOS, and losses by to weaken our SOS)
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 13, 2020, 09:12:05 AM
SOS won't matter in the end. As long as i keep starting the game threads, we good. I'm 0 for 9 this year.
Losing is in your DNA.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 13, 2020, 09:20:08 AM
Losing is in your DNA.
Don't let him break out the Santonio jersey. It's tank kryptonite.
Post by: MBGreen on November 13, 2020, 09:59:35 AM
Don't let him break out the Santonio jersey. It's tank kryptonite.
It's in the vault
Post by: Badger on November 15, 2020, 06:39:54 PM
The tank rooting guide for the rest of the season: https://jetsxfactor.com/2020/11/12/trevor-lawrence-race-rooting-guide-for-new-york-jets-strength-of-schedule-tiebreaker/
(https://cdn.jetsxfactor.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/New-York-Jets-Jacksonville-Jaguars-Tank-For-Trevor-Lawrence-Strength-of-Schedule-2020-2-1024x1024.png.webp)
Did not gain much ground so far this week.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 15, 2020, 06:50:02 PM
3/7 is not great.
Post by: Badger on November 15, 2020, 08:09:38 PM
Arizona, New Orleans and Presumably Baltimore.At least AZ over BUF counts double
3/7 is not great.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 15, 2020, 09:07:55 PM
At least AZ over BUF counts double
True
The won we really need is the Texans over pats here next week
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 22, 2020, 06:29:11 PM
Post by: Badger on November 22, 2020, 06:31:24 PM
The tank rooting guide for the rest of the season: https://jetsxfactor.com/2020/11/12/trevor-lawrence-race-rooting-guide-for-new-york-jets-strength-of-schedule-tiebreaker/So did we basically break even this week?
(https://cdn.jetsxfactor.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/New-York-Jets-Jacksonville-Jaguars-Tank-For-Trevor-Lawrence-Strength-of-Schedule-2020-2-1024x1024.png.webp)
Apparently the single most important game left on the schedule is the Texans vs. Pats game week 11. We need Deshaun Watson to ball out in that one big time, as it represents a 2 game swing (wins to strengthen the Jags SOS, and losses by to weaken our SOS)
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 22, 2020, 06:34:13 PM
So did we basically break even this week?
I think. Tiebreakers only matter if we win one. The Jags won Week 1, I bet they feel silly now.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 22, 2020, 06:58:37 PM
Texans beating the Patriots alone makes today a positive day for the tiebreaker. I have no idea how far away we are from potentially getting the tiebreaker at this point, but that was basically a necessary result for us.
Post by: Badger on November 22, 2020, 08:43:51 PM
I'm not sure that list is complete. I think the Dolphins losing today helps us since we played them twice and Jacksonville played them once.Good point on the Dolphins. As a general rule, rooting against the AFCE and rooting for the AFCS.
Texans beating the Patriots alone makes today a positive day for the tiebreaker. I have no idea how far away we are from potentially getting the tiebreaker at this point, but that was basically a necessary result for us.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 22, 2020, 09:00:47 PM
Post by: reuben on November 22, 2020, 09:05:24 PM
I've never been in favor of the tank, but I'm pretty confident at this point that this team is going to successfully execute it.
I'm fairly certain we're going to Jets it.
Post by: MBGreen on November 22, 2020, 09:06:38 PM
I'm fairly certain we're going to Jets it.I'll keep starting the game thread. Tank certified.
Post by: Badger on November 22, 2020, 09:13:09 PM
I'll keep starting the game thread. Tank certified.It's what you were put on this earth to do.
Post by: Jumbo on November 22, 2020, 09:17:08 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 22, 2020, 09:18:51 PM
It's what you were put on this earth to do.Doing the needful
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 22, 2020, 09:49:29 PM
The 7-3 Browns? I highly doubt it. The Patriots? Even if they don't win another game before week 17, Belichick isn't losing that game. The Dolphins? The Raiders?
Post by: Heismanberg on November 22, 2020, 09:54:17 PM
The Browns are a dreadful passing team, but great defensively and should shorten the game with their rushing attack. If Darnold plays against Cleveland, we have a shot. They aren't as good as their record.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 22, 2020, 10:02:07 PM
The Raiders are good, so no.
The Browns are a dreadful passing team, but great defensively and should shorten the game with their rushing attack. If Darnold plays against Cleveland, we have a shot. They aren't as good as their record.
That's fair enough. But the Jets are as bad as their record.
I just don't see how this team can win a game against anyone left on the schedule. The Pats game is the best chance, and Belichick would give one of his testicles to ensure he wins that game.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 22, 2020, 10:16:58 PM
We need a defensive and ST score to really have a shot. We also have to play a clean game. Honestly we had the formula rolling right up until Flacco threw the pick 6. If that is thrown out of bounds I have no idea how this game turns out.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 22, 2020, 10:22:22 PM
Post by: Badger on November 22, 2020, 10:30:50 PM
It's still the NFL and as monumentally bad as the Jets are, a team can just fail to take the Jets serious, the jets can have a good day and the Jets win. Rooting for them to lose is excrement but it is what it is..............I still maintain that I'm not rooting for them to lose - I've just detached myself from feeling anything negative when they lose and I've been that way since 0-2.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 22, 2020, 10:44:30 PM
I'm fairly certain we're going to Jets it.
Same
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 23, 2020, 09:00:48 AM
I love Sam, but he's shell shocked. We're not even competitive if he played the last two weeks.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 23, 2020, 09:06:54 AM
I still maintain that I'm not rooting for them to lose - I've just detached myself from feeling anything negative when they lose and I've been that way since 0-2.
The Jets have a habit of beating it out of you.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2020, 11:25:15 AM
I can see us beating MIA next week to freak ourselves..especially if Flacco is playing.
I love Sam, but he's shell shocked. We're not even competitive if he played the last two weeks.
Every remaining opponent except New England is fighting for a playoff spot and not at all concerned where the Jets end up in the draft. If you don't think Belichick would throw a meaningless Week 17 game to keep Trevor Lawrence out of the division, then you haven't been paying attention. Maybe not outright throw it, but rig it so to speak.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 23, 2020, 11:33:54 AM
Every remaining opponent except New England is fighting for a playoff spot and not at all concerned where the Jets end up in the draft. If you don't think Belichick would throw a meaningless Week 17 game to keep Trevor Lawrence out of the division, then you haven't been paying attention. Maybe not outright throw it, but rig it so to speak.I doubt Belichick is concerned about any QB that comes into our organization because....... he'd be in our organization.
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 23, 2020, 11:37:30 AM
I can see us beating MIA next week to freak ourselves..especially if Flacco is playing.
I love Sam, but he's shell shocked. We're not even competitive if he played the last two weeks.
USC QB drafted in the top 10 playing shook behind his OLine by year 3. Could have sworn I’ve seen that somewhere.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2020, 11:49:19 AM
I doubt Belichick is concerned about any QB that comes into our organization because....... he'd be in our organization.
I think Belichick is getting a refresher course this season on how important a franchise QB is to a team. If all he has to do is sit some guys and play a few terrible players on getaway day, you don't think he'd do it? He's a big picture guy.
Post by: MBGreen on November 23, 2020, 12:02:23 PM
I think Belichick is getting a refresher course this season on how important a franchise QB is to a team. If all he has to do is sit some guys and play a few terrible players on getaway day, you don't think he'd do it? He's a big picture guy.
Joe Douglas isn't an idiot. Mike White will start before allowing Gase to pee away a chance at Trevor Lawrence in the last week of the season.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2020, 12:07:50 PM
Joe Douglas isn't an idiot. Mike White will start before allowing Gase to pee away a chance at Trevor Lawrence in the last week of the season.
On one hand I hope you're right. On the other, it would be great to see Darnold step in and save his job by not letting us be the worst team in the NFL. If Flacco wins a game for us it really doesn't help anything.
To be clear, if Darnold does this I'd rather it's before Week 17 against a team playing for the playoffs, not against Belichick pulling the plug. If we get to 0-15 we should sign Luke Falk to play the game just to be on the safe side.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 23, 2020, 12:20:22 PM
I think Belichick is getting a refresher course this season on how important a franchise QB is to a team. If all he has to do is sit some guys and play a few terrible players on getaway day, you don't think he'd do it? He's a big picture guy.
You don't think that Belicheck would do anything and everything in his power to make us 0-16?He hates us so freaking much that if he can brand us with that, he would.
Secondly, the embarrassment of being the only team in NFL history to lose to an 0-15 team would quite likely also stop him from throwing the game. Belicheck is only concerned with his own legacy, and will do anything he can to freak with us at this point. So yeah I fully expect him to go balls to the wall to rape us into 0-16 hell hole rather than actually allow us a chance to win a game and avoid that type of negative history.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2020, 12:27:07 PM
You don't think that Belicheck would do anything and everything in his power to make us 0-16?He hates us so freaking much that if he can brand us with that, he would.
Secondly, the embarrassment of being the only team in NFL history to lose to an 0-15 team would quite likely also stop him from throwing the game. Belicheck is only concerned with his own legacy, and will do anything he can to freak with us at this point. So yeah I fully expect him to go balls to the wall to rape us into 0-16 hell hole rather than actually allow us a chance to win a game and avoid that type of negative history.
I get all that, I just think he knows he can freak us more by costing us a chance to draft a top QB he'll have to face twice a year for the rest of his career.
Post by: Johnny English on November 23, 2020, 12:29:52 PM
I get all that, I just think he knows he can freak us more by costing us a chance to draft a top QB he'll have to face twice a year for the rest of his career.
He's going to be 69 by the start of next season, how long do you think he has left coaching?
I doubt Belichick is concerned about any QB that comes into our organization because....... he'd be in our organization.
What, you think a magic quarterback isn't going to fix all of our problems? What heresy is this?
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 23, 2020, 12:33:18 PM
You don't think that Belicheck would do anything and everything in his power to make us 0-16?He hates us so freaking much that if he can brand us with that, he would.There is zero chance that Bill Belichick wants to lose to an 0-15 Jets team. I'm with you.
Secondly, the embarrassment of being the only team in NFL history to lose to an 0-15 team would quite likely also stop him from throwing the game. Belicheck is only concerned with his own legacy, and will do anything he can to freak with us at this point. So yeah I fully expect him to go balls to the wall to rape us into 0-16 hell hole rather than actually allow us a chance to win a game and avoid that type of negative history.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2020, 12:53:21 PM
He's going to be 69 by the start of next season, how long do you think he has left coaching?
Hopefully not long but who knows?
Quote
What, you think a magic quarterback isn't going to fix all of our problems? What heresy is this?
Only going by what I read and hear. Lets say we end up with him, he'll have a stud LT and looks like a stud WR that Darnold never had, and unless MBGreen buys the team he shouldn't have three coaches in his first four years. So it's not "magic" as much as it's a better prospect (so we hear) stepping into a better situation (hard not to).
That said, I think Darnold could also thrive in the same circumstances should we not get Lawrence. I don't buy this drama that he's "ruined", he's on a shitty, poorly coached team and he gets hurt a lot. And he's 23.
Post by: Johnny English on November 23, 2020, 12:54:39 PM
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/30369866/as-new-york-jets-flirt-0-16-rb-frank-gore-says-go-that
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 23, 2020, 01:43:34 PM
Frank Gore says freak your tank.Every player on the team should have that attitude.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/30369866/as-new-york-jets-flirt-0-16-rb-frank-gore-says-go-that
That's a big reason why I want the Jaguars to win so much. I hate rooting against the Jets every week. I still think it's best for the long-term health of the franchise to ensure the top pick, but it's depressing to see a guy like Gore say that his only goal this season is to get one win.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2020, 01:56:39 PM
Every player on the team should have that attitude.
That's a big reason why I want the Jaguars to win so much. I hate rooting against the Jets every week. I still think it's best for the long-term health of the franchise to ensure the top pick, but it's depressing to see a guy like Gore say that his only goal this season is to get one win.
Same. And you know Flacco doesn't give a excrement if we draft a QB, so he's dangerous to tank aspirations. I always root for us during the games, but get over the losses instantly afterwards, understanding the big picture.
I do think having Darnold gives us a silver lining whatever happens, unless this kid is as good as everyone keeps saying. People said the same about Darnold, too.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 23, 2020, 02:06:21 PM
Same. And you know Flacco doesn't give a excrement if we draft a QB, so he's dangerous to tank aspirations. I always root for us during the games, but get over the losses instantly afterwards, understanding the big picture.Lawrence is a significantly better prospect than Darnold. Fields and Wilson might be better prospects as well.
I do think having Darnold gives us a silver lining whatever happens, unless this kid is as good as everyone keeps saying. People said the same about Darnold, too.
But yes, if Darnold wants to light it up down the stretch and make this a difficult decision, that isn't a bad thing. It's a little hard to believe that Darnold would look significantly better just because Breshad Perriman and Denzel Mims were healthy, but it's possible.
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 23, 2020, 02:11:39 PM
Lawrence is a significantly better prospect than Darnold. Fields and Wilson might be better prospects as well.
But yes, if Darnold wants to light it up down the stretch and make this a difficult decision, that isn't a bad thing. It's a little hard to believe that Darnold would look significantly better just because Breshad Perriman and Denzel Mims were healthy, but it's possible.
+1
Darnold’s problems have been decision making and pocket presence. None of the WRs are really an answer to those proglems.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2020, 02:12:12 PM
Lawrence is a significantly better prospect than Darnold. Fields and Wilson might be better prospects as well.
But yes, if Darnold wants to light it up down the stretch and make this a difficult decision, that isn't a bad thing. It's a little hard to believe that Darnold would look significantly better just because Breshad Perriman and Denzel Mims were healthy, but it's possible.
The first two years he was much better after going out, seeing some games from the sideline, and then coming back in. On this team it would be the first time he had his WRs and hopefully Becton to watch his back. I'd be all for him playing well and making a stand like "you guys aren't getting rid of me so easy" kind of attitude. If it were me that would be my mindset.
Again, the only scenarios I don't want are Flacco blowing it or us falling for a trap in Foxboro in Week 17. I've been through this scenario so many times through the decades, including 1996 with Kotite playing the role of Gase and Manning the role of Lawrence, and often it's all a wash in hindsight.
Post by: Badger on November 26, 2020, 09:40:41 AM
Post by: MBGreen on November 26, 2020, 09:44:59 AM
Happy Tanksgiving boys
Tank you, sir.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 26, 2020, 09:46:23 AM
Happy Tanksgiving boys
Yes sir, Comrade.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 26, 2020, 02:58:24 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 26, 2020, 03:26:39 PM
Houston win good for the SOS tiebreaker and good for hurting the Dolphins' pick.
SOS is getting there.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 28, 2020, 07:19:05 PM
Best case tank scenario is for Darnold to play well and our defense to get shredded.
I'll be pulling for Mike Glennon's goofy derriere tomorrow.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 28, 2020, 07:20:22 PM
I think Lawrence will be a Jaguar. The Jets are going to win a game somewhere. The Jags won't.
Best case tank scenario is for Darnold to play well and our defense to get shredded.
I'll be pulling for Mike Glennon's goofy derriere tomorrow.
As will we all
Post by: dcm1602 on November 28, 2020, 09:32:25 PM
I think Lawrence will be a Jaguar. The Jets are going to win a game somewhere. The Jags won't.
Best case tank scenario is for Darnold to play well and our defense to get shredded.
I'll be pulling for Mike Glennon's goofy derriere tomorrow.
I'm thinking it's more and more likely.
I know everyone gives us a 70% chance of having the first overall pick, but the Jets schedule is just easier than Jacksonville from here out. So I think us winning a game is more likely than them.
Thw question is what happens if we land the 2nd overall pick?
I would think that still puts us in a solid position to sell the 2nd overall pick for a small bounty unless Fields completely blows up his draft stock.
Sure having the luxury of deciding Lawrence's fate would be the best thing. But if we end up moving down a few spots and get 3 extra top 2 round picks I'd be cool with it
Post by: delavan on November 28, 2020, 10:11:36 PM
I think Lawrence will be a Jaguar. The Jets are going to win a game somewhere. The Jags won't.
Best case tank scenario is for Darnold to play well and our defense to get shredded.
I'll be pulling for Mike Glennon's goofy derriere tomorrow.
I think you'll be right. I hope the Jets' 2020 faux mantra of "just loose baby!" carries into 0-16 nirvana
Post by: d sw0rdz on November 28, 2020, 10:17:03 PM
with fitz starting tomorrow's an L
LV loss
Seattle loss
LA loss
Cleveland loss
NE/belichick ain't gonna lose to an 0-15 team
I can see arguments being made for the last 2 games but at this point, with this team, with the way darnold has played, and with this coach they are stretches to say the least
Post by: Jumbo on November 28, 2020, 10:19:47 PM
Post by: mj2sexay on November 28, 2020, 11:06:12 PM
where do you guys see the win in our schedule? i don't fckin see it lol
with fitz starting tomorrow's an L
LV loss
Seattle loss
LA loss
Cleveland loss
NE/belichick ain't gonna lose to an 0-15 team
I can see arguments being made for the last 2 games but at this point, with this team, with the way darnold has played, and with this coach they are stretches to say the least
I've been on here saying since week 3 saying two things;
1. Jacksonville won't win another game.
2. The Browns and Pats games in weeks 16 and 17 are the biggest "trap" games in terms of walking out with a win.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 28, 2020, 11:15:09 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 29, 2020, 04:15:38 AM
Lawrence is too good to be a Jet so we’ll figure out how to win a game when it hurts us the most. It could honestly come against one of the better teams left on our schedule and I will not bat an eyeAt least let it be Seattle so it helps us a little. Maybe.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 29, 2020, 08:07:24 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 29, 2020, 11:55:39 AM
- extra personal foul penalties
- leaky zone defense from Gegggggg
- turnovers, but not interceptions
- Gase uber conservative fullback dive playcalling with a side of 1 yard bubble screens
- injuries to players who won't be here next year anyway
- early mistakes to put it out of reach early
- refs calling against us
Need to pair this with a good performance by Darnold for trade value and continued health of players that will be here next year. May have to lean on shitty defense to allow our offense to put up good yardage, while still losing. Narrow window.
Gase isn't gonna want to lose this one since it's his old team. I'm worried he might actually do something different and aggressive.
Post by: Johnny English on November 29, 2020, 12:02:13 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on November 29, 2020, 12:05:23 PM
I hope Sam wins at least 4 of the next 6.
Given our Ol today I just hope he doesn’t die
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 29, 2020, 12:07:37 PM
I hope Sam wins at least 4 of the next 6.Find someone who loves you as much as JE loves Sam Darnold.
Post by: Johnny English on November 29, 2020, 12:09:07 PM
Find someone who loves you as much as JE loves Sam Darnold.
It's partly that, and partly that I hate tanking so much that I want all of you who are cheering for it to not get the satisfaction of the top pick. Celebrating defeat is offensive to my core.
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 29, 2020, 12:17:20 PM
Given our Ol today I just hope he doesn’t die
This.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 29, 2020, 12:18:39 PM
Given our Ol today I just hope he doesn’t dieIf he dies, he dies.
https://twitter.com/DAitken90/status/1332854248749621248
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 29, 2020, 12:35:19 PM
If he dies, he dies.
https://twitter.com/DAitken90/status/1332854248749621248
Did he think nobody would remember that her name was Shireen or was he too lazy to Google "Stannis Baratheon daughter" before hitting the tweet button on his machine that definitely had access to Google?
Post by: MBGreen on November 29, 2020, 03:48:04 PM
It's partly that, and partly that I hate tanking so much that I want all of you who are cheering for it to not get the satisfaction of the top pick. Celebrating defeat is offensive to my core.
The tank is necessary for this team. Scorched Earth in 2020, rise from the ashes in 2021.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 29, 2020, 03:52:57 PM
It's partly that, and partly that I hate tanking so much that I want all of you who are cheering for it to not get the satisfaction of the top pick. Celebrating defeat is offensive to my core.
Your the one that wants to force the Johnsons to have to evaluate WTF they are doing. Which record is more likely to cause them to re-evaluate?
0-16 and one of the 3 worst teams of all time (if not the worst)
5-11 with a 5 win push to close the season, which as of the start of the day there are 16 teams with 5 wins or less, and could possibly have as many as 10 this season alone with a 5-11 record or worse.
I know which one I would expect is more likely to make them think about things and need to make some changes if only to save face in the media
Post by: Libero_2 on November 29, 2020, 03:56:33 PM
The tank is necessary for this team. Scorched Earth in 2020, rise from the ashes in 2021.
Our goal for 2021 should be two fold,
1. the greatest single season win turnaround in the league compared to the previous year
2. the best follow up to an 0-16 season ever.
Generally that script flip for #1 is usually 8 wins. And the better of the 2 follow ups to 0-16 were the Browns going 7-8-1.
So basically I want to go 8-8 in 2021. New coaching staff, new QB, new schemes and a excrement ton of new players to help out what we seem to be learning weekly is a fairly decent core group of young guys who are surrounded by excrement vets
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 29, 2020, 05:17:41 PM
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 29, 2020, 06:28:02 PM
When we finish 0-16, Gase might still keep his job.
FYP
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 29, 2020, 06:53:02 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 29, 2020, 06:56:04 PM
FYPLol settle down.
Post by: Johnny English on November 29, 2020, 07:13:35 PM
The tank is necessary for this team. Scorched Earth in 2020, rise from the ashes in 2021.
I feel like you haven't really considered what going 0-16 means. You seem to think it has some kind of magical outcome.
Talk to me about the Lions and the Browns and why you want to be them.
Post by: Johnny English on November 29, 2020, 07:14:40 PM
Your the one that wants to force the Johnsons to have to evaluate WTF they are doing. Which record is more likely to cause them to re-evaluate?
0-16 and one of the 3 worst teams of all time (if not the worst)
5-11 with a 5 win push to close the season, which as of the start of the day there are 16 teams with 5 wins or less, and could possibly have as many as 10 this season alone with a 5-11 record or worse.
I know which one I would expect is more likely to make them think about things and need to make some changes if only to save face in the media
I don't understand why you think the next five games will change their mind about what they think is the best thing for this team.
Post by: Jumbo on November 29, 2020, 07:15:17 PM
I feel like you haven't really considered what going 0-16 means. You seem to think it has some kind of magical outcome.
Talk to me about the Lions and the Browns and why you want to be them.
Would love to be 8-3 and on the up and up right now like the Browns. Mayfield is not ideal as the #1 pick QB but they have a bunch of talent.
Post by: Johnny English on November 29, 2020, 07:24:12 PM
Would love to be 8-3 and on the up and up right now like the Browns. Mayfield is not ideal as the #1 pick QB but they have a bunch of talent.
They're on the exact same course as the Lions have been since they drafted Stafford, clinging desperately to the hope of the magic quarterback and surrounding him with expensive talents and inexplicably continuing to fail for reasons that no one can actually put their finger on.
Post by: Badger on November 29, 2020, 07:29:58 PM
They're on the exact same course as the Lions have been since they drafted Stafford, clinging desperately to the hope of the magic quarterback and surrounding him with expensive talents and inexplicably continuing to fail for reasons that no one can actually put their finger on.
What reasons? Finger them for us.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 29, 2020, 07:36:58 PM
As you enjoy the idea of Trevor Lawrence and a new head coach and a full draft class in addition, just remember that the Johnsons are still the owners, and by the time that Lawrence hits his prime, you'll either be old or dead. Eat at Arby's.
Post by: Jumbo on November 29, 2020, 07:42:49 PM
They're on the exact same course as the Lions have been since they drafted Stafford, clinging desperately to the hope of the magic quarterback and surrounding him with expensive talents and inexplicably continuing to fail for reasons that no one can actually put their finger on.
Considering how much Stefanski does not seem to trust Mayfield I don't really think this is true at all. Wouldn't be surprised if they moved on from Mayfield post-2021, even.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 29, 2020, 07:48:10 PM
I don't understand why you think the next five games will change their mind about what they think is the best thing for this team.
Your the one who has been arguing that the team needs to make serious changes, and they will only look at themselves if they are forced to. You have said having the #1 pick will not force them to re-evaluate the situation at all. But picking #3 would because there would be no 'magical qb' at the end of the tank rainbow.
Until Gase is actually fired, then the Johnsons clearly haven't made up their freaking minds for sure. If we do magically finish 5-11 then he might stick around. Nobody expects that. In fact I would bet that you could get absurdly good odds on that parlay (Jets win 5 in a row to finish 5-11 and retain Gase for 2021).
Post by: Libero_2 on November 29, 2020, 07:49:18 PM
Considering how much Stefanski does not seem to trust Mayfield I don't really think this is true at all. Wouldn't be surprised if they moved on from Mayfield post-2021, even.
A Mayfield for Stafford swap would be fun to see (but obviously impossible for a variety of reasons)
Post by: Johnny English on November 29, 2020, 07:53:29 PM
What reasons? Finger them for us.
I can't. They're inexplicable. They got the magic quarterback and that's all that needs to happen. Well, and the new coach. And then the next one. And the one after that. But that's it. And no one can quite figure out why it hasn't worked yet.
Post by: Johnny English on November 29, 2020, 07:55:21 PM
JE is basically turning into Nihilist Arby's.
As you enjoy the idea of Trevor Lawrence and a new head coach and a full draft class in addition, just remember that the Johnsons are still the owners, and by the time that Lawrence hits his prime, you'll either be old or dead. Eat at Arby's.
Uh... yeah, pretty much. Until I'm given any kind of evidence to think otherwise, there's no logical reason to believe that the magic Trevor will fix anything at all. And I respect your optimism about the coach but I still think there's a very decent chance that it's Gase come next September.
Post by: Johnny English on November 29, 2020, 07:56:33 PM
Considering how much Stefanski does not seem to trust Mayfield I don't really think this is true at all. Wouldn't be surprised if they moved on from Mayfield post-2021, even.
Not. A. Chance.
Magic quarterbacks are the NFL's biggest fallacy, and pretty much every owner buys into it.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 29, 2020, 07:59:10 PM
Not. A. Chance.Okay, but Woody is not making decisions in free agency. The owners might buy that in Cleveland, and that might make it harder for them to move away from Baker if they have to, but the GM and coach don't. They play around Mayfield, kind of like the Jets did with Sanchez.
Magic quarterbacks are the NFL's biggest fallacy, and pretty much every owner buys into it.
The Browns are 8-3 and they might have missed on their 1st-round QB. Imagine if they actually hit on their QB. Lawrence is a much better prospect than Baker or Sam was.
Post by: Badger on November 29, 2020, 08:22:55 PM
I can't. They're inexplicable. They got the magic quarterback and that's all that needs to happen. Well, and the new coach. And then the next one. And the one after that. But that's it. And no one can quite figure out why it hasn't worked yet.I thought refusing to explain something was an unforgivable sin of snark
Post by: Libero_2 on November 29, 2020, 08:33:17 PM
Not. A. Chance.
Magic quarterbacks are the NFL's biggest fallacy, and pretty much every owner buys into it.
Can we agree the “magic QB” as you call it is the most important piece of any team? If you have him, you are going to be really freaking good.
Your Brady’s, Rodgers, Wilson’s and Mahomes are those magic QBs. If you don’t have one then your team will at best be good for a short while. But what is the last team to have a 5-10 year in-interrupted run of being good without the “magic QB?” Barring injury to said QB?
Chances are better that a Lawrence can be one of those guys than any one in the draft in 8 years. That’s why everyone wants the guy.
The Chiefs were a freaking train wreck before Reid got there. Reid was the reason they went after Mahomes.
The Patriots were a total disaster before Brady entered the fold, Belicheck was on his way to being fired before Brady stepped in. Wilson was a 3rd rounder on a team who had no QB and turned Seattle into a team that struggled the year before to the playoffs. Big Ben took the Steelers to a ring in year 2.
If you can get that guy, everything is easier. Lawrence could be that guy, that’s why it’s worth taking the shot. But you are right, just because you get the guy, it doesn’t guarantee anything, look at the Dolphins and Marino. But the list of all time great QBs who never won a ring is a whole lot smaller than all time greats who didn’t because their organization failed them.
Until you have your QB you have to keep trying to find him until you get him.
Post by: Johnny English on November 29, 2020, 08:47:19 PM
Can we agree the “magic QB” as you call it is the most important piece of any team? If you have him, you are going to be really freaking good.
No, no we can't. For reasons I've already explained and the rest of our post also proves.
Quote
Your Brady’s, Rodgers, Wilson’s and Mahomes are those magic QBs. If you don’t have one then your team will at best be good for a short while. But what is the last team to have a 5-10 year in-interrupted run of being good without the “magic QB?” Barring injury to said QB?
Chances are better that a Lawrence can be one of those guys than any one in the draft in 8 years. That’s why everyone wants the guy.
The Chiefs were a freaking train wreck before Reid got there. Reid was the reason they went after Mahomes.
The Patriots were a total disaster before Brady entered the fold, Belicheck was on his way to being fired before Brady stepped in. Wilson was a 3rd rounder on a team who had no QB and turned Seattle into a team that struggled the year before to the playoffs. Big Ben took the Steelers to a ring in year 2.
If you can get that guy, everything is easier. Lawrence could be that guy, that’s why it’s worth taking the shot. But you are right, just because you get the guy, it doesn’t guarantee anything, look at the Dolphins and Marino. But the list of all time great QBs who never won a ring is a whole lot smaller than all time greats who didn’t because their organization failed them.
Until you have your QB you have to keep trying to find him until you get him.
No, you're failing to understand what a magic quarterback is - specifically, it's a quarterback for which a team deliberately fails in the delusional belief that they're somehow going to magically transform your abysmal failure of a franchise into a Super Bowl winner. Just ask Colts and Lions and Browns fans.
We are going to continue to fail if or when we draft Lawrence and then all the tank whiners are going to be confused as to why.
Post by: reuben on November 29, 2020, 08:55:47 PM
Post by: Jumbo on November 29, 2020, 08:58:35 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 29, 2020, 09:00:14 PM
I mean, we're already into 0-11. It's not the ideal scenario but at this point we're much better off securing the #1 pick than anything else. I'm not sure how anything else is arguable.
I really don’t think there is anything for us to accomplish.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 29, 2020, 09:10:47 PM
No, no we can't. For reasons I've already explained and the rest of our post also proves.
No, you're failing to understand what a magic quarterback is - specifically, it's a quarterback for which a team deliberately fails in the delusional belief that they're somehow going to magically transform your abysmal failure of a franchise into a Super Bowl winner. Just ask Colts and Lions and Browns fans.
We are going to continue to fail if or when we draft Lawrence and then all the tank whiners are going to be confused as to why.
Your damn right. Here I was thinking the magic quarterback was the elite unicorn, one of the 3-5 best guys at the position in the league.
For you it’s just the guy at the top of any draft that fans might be excited about.
Neither the 0-16 Lions or the 0-16 Browns had fan bases excited thinking “if we just get the #1 pick the QB will be our savior. Neither of those teams had any freaking clue who the QB they’d be drafting was when they were 0-3. Hell Browns fans didn’t know they were drafting Baker until it was announced.
Lawrence is a very different beast than either of those guys. The last true “tank” year was the Suck for Luck campaign and the Colts turned around to a playoff team from 1-15. Id say those fans were pretty happy.
The situation you are describing as “the magic QB” is literally any QB that any team takes in round 1 who doesn’t have a “QBs of the future” at the moment. Basically anybody who reached for a QB, your Christian Ponders your Jake Lockers, your Josh Rosens of the world.
Based on this mentality, and assuming any first round QB is a waste of time unless you are already an organization that knows how to win. So yeah every team that sucks will always suck and every team that’s good will always be good forever. Thank god we’ve cleared that up and I can now die happy knowing the Jets will always be bad forever and I’ll never miss out on them accidentally winning
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 29, 2020, 09:23:21 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 29, 2020, 09:45:58 PM
I don't think it's too difficult to grasp and I think he's right in many respects.
Going 0-16 is no way to build a foundation for sustainable success, in fact the teams that have gone 0-16 have done anything but.
I think that's a pretty reasonable opinion since the two dipshits we have as owners have seemed to make worse and worse decisions as time has passed and haven't seemed to learn anything from prior mistakes. That said I am sure this time will be different.
Post by: mj2sexay on November 29, 2020, 09:50:30 PM
I still think there's a very decent chance that it's Gase come next September.
I'm actually not as averse to the nihilistic outlook at this point given how time is a flat circle with this franchise, (and considering Woody's last shameful foray in trying to hire his front office/coach), but there is no shot they bring back Gase. This is one situation where the organization bending to the whims of the back page will benefit.
I fully expect Gase to be relieved of duty on Black Monday and Joe D to be given the opportunity to take his shot at hiring a coach.
The point of JE's argument is rooting for the Jets to be among the historically worst teams ever is pretty dumb.
I don't think it's too difficult to grasp and I think he's right in many respects.
Going 0-16 is no way to build a foundation for sustainable success, in fact the teams that have gone 0-16 have done anything but.
I think that's a pretty reasonable opinion since the two dipshits we have as owners have seemed to make worse and worse decisions as time has passed and haven't seemed to learn anything from prior mistakes. That said I am sure this time will be different.
I've been actively rooting for the Jags every Sunday in the hopes that I can actually watch and enjoy a football game like a normal person again.
There's no question getting the first overall is whats best for the franchise. If it takes 0-16 to get there, then that's unfortunate, but so be it. I take no joy in any of this.
FWIW, Cleveland is 8-3 right now. I'd kill to be the Browns. How pathetic is that?
Post by: Heismanberg on November 29, 2020, 09:53:46 PM
The point of JE's argument is rooting for the Jets to be among the historically worst teams ever is pretty dumb.
I don't think it's too difficult to grasp and I think he's right in many respects.
Going 0-16 is no way to build a foundation for sustainable success, in fact the teams that have gone 0-16 have done anything but.
If 0-16 gets Adam Gase out of here and we get Trevor Lawrence, it's more than worth it. It would also give us the top pick in the second round.
The #1 pick and a chance to coach Trevor Lawrence makes this job desirable. The #2 pick does not. That's what we are rooting for.
We aren't rooting against this team. We are rooting for the future of the franchise.
Post by: Laxin on November 29, 2020, 09:56:31 PM
The point of JE's argument is rooting for the Jets to be among the historically worst teams ever is pretty dumb.
I don't think it's too difficult to grasp and I think he's right in many respects.
Going 0-16 is no way to build a foundation for sustainable success, in fact the teams that have gone 0-16 have done anything but.
I think that's a pretty reasonable opinion since the two dipshits we have as owners have seemed to make worse and worse decisions as time has passed and haven't seemed to learn anything from prior mistakes. That said I am sure this time will be different.
This seems fine in theory but it ignores context and any nuance behind this situation. This franchise is already the laughing stock of the NFL. If going 0-16 compared to 1-15 gets this franchise the best player available at the most important position available, I think it would be stupid to hope for that one win simply to rid this franchise of the excrement stain that is 0-16.
If the Jaguars had 3 wins, I think every Jets fan would be rooting on a weekly basis for this team to win. I think it’s hard to argue that winning a game or two is better for this franchise long term knowing what we know now.
Post by: MBGreen on November 29, 2020, 10:00:08 PM
If 0-16 gets Adam Gase out of here and we get Trevor Lawrence, it's more than worth it. It would also give us the top pick in the second round.MB thanks you for this post
The #1 pick and a chance to coach Trevor Lawrence makes this job desirable. The #2 pick does not. That's what we are rooting for.
We aren't rooting against this team. We are rooting for the future of the franchise.
Been saying this for a few weeks now
Post by: Jumbo on November 29, 2020, 10:08:10 PM
The point of JE's argument is rooting for the Jets to be among the historically worst teams ever is pretty dumb.
I don't think it's too difficult to grasp and I think he's right in many respects.
Going 0-16 is no way to build a foundation for sustainable success, in fact the teams that have gone 0-16 have done anything but.
I think that's a pretty reasonable opinion since the two dipshits we have as owners have seemed to make worse and worse decisions as time has passed and haven't seemed to learn anything from prior mistakes. That said I am sure this time will be different.
sample size of 2, one of which is too recent to say anything for certain.
We're not talking about tanking for 0-16 from the beginning of the season. We're talking about tanking for 0-16 over the course of 5 games when a top 2 pick is already virtually guaranteed, and waiting at the #1 pick is the best QB prospect in 10 years. When faced with that position, hell yeah I don't give a excrement if we lose every game if that's what it takes, especially when one win ties us with the Jags and puts us with significantly worse chances to get #1.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 29, 2020, 10:14:17 PM
This seems fine in theory but it ignores context and any nuance behind this situation. This franchise is already the laughing stock of the NFL. If going 0-16 compared to 1-15 gets this franchise the best player available at the most important position available, I think it would be stupid to hope for that one win simply to rid this franchise of the excrement stain that is 0-16.
If the Jaguars had 3 wins, I think every Jets fan would be rooting on a weekly basis for this team to win. I think it’s hard to argue that winning a game or two is better for this franchise long term knowing what we know now.
The Jets were not the laughingstock of the NFL. They obviously weren't the top team but conversely they weren't the worst team either. However, being a middling mediocre franchise is nothing to hang your hat on.
The problem isn't getting the best player in the draft, the problem is the confluence of decisions that have led to the Jets getting the so called best player in the draft. The people that made many of those decisions are still here. That's a gigantic problem. Firing Gase solves a little but not the majority.
Post by: MBGreen on November 29, 2020, 10:18:56 PM
The Jets were not the laughingstock of the NFL. They obviously weren't the top team but conversely they weren't the worst team either. However, being a middling mediocre franchise is nothing to hang your hat on.If you're waiting for a change in ownership, I have a puck approved bridge to sell you.
The problem isn't getting the best player in the draft, the problem is the confluence of decisions that have led to the Jets getting the so called best played in the draft. The people that made many of those decisions are still here. That's a gigantic problem. Firing Gase solves a little but not the majority.
Nobody likes the Johnsons, but they're not going anywhere.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 29, 2020, 10:23:32 PM
If 0-16 gets Adam Gase out of here and we get Trevor Lawrence, it's more than worth it. It would also give us the top pick in the second round.
The #1 pick and a chance to coach Trevor Lawrence makes this job desirable. The #2 pick does not. That's what we are rooting for.
We aren't rooting against this team. We are rooting for the future of the franchise.
I am rooting for the Jets to have sustainable success. I just don't feel going 0-16 team is a way to approach it.
Gase should have been fired after week 3, launched into the sun actually. Douglas should have the power to search for his own guy and get on with it. I am still not confident that the hiring process for a new coach won't be a goatfuck.
I do no t think Trevor Lawrence and a new coach will cure all that ails this franchise but getting rid of that, that's not going to happen.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 29, 2020, 10:24:34 PM
If you're waiting for a change in ownership, I have a puck approved bridge to sell you.
Nobody likes the Johnsons, but they're not going anywhere.
cool story bro
Post by: MBGreen on November 29, 2020, 10:26:29 PM
cool story broEnjoy the tank
Post by: Miamipuck on November 29, 2020, 10:28:04 PM
I'm actually not as averse to the nihilistic outlook at this point given how time is a flat circle with this franchise, (and considering Woody's last shameful foray in trying to hire his front office/coach), but there is no shot they bring back Gase. This is one situation where the organization bending to the whims of the back page will benefit.
I fully expect Gase to be relieved of duty on Black Monday and Joe D to be given the opportunity to take his shot at hiring a coach.
I've been actively rooting for the Jags every Sunday in the hopes that I can actually watch and enjoy a football game like a normal person again.
There's no question getting the first overall is whats best for the franchise. If it takes 0-16 to get there, then that's unfortunate, but so be it. I take no joy in any of this.
FWIW, Cleveland is 8-3 right now. I'd kill to be the Browns. How pathetic is that?
I guess it circumvents rooting for the Jets to lose....but to answer your question: haha
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4gi3cppAD8&ab_channel=hsiaoyen00 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4gi3cppAD8&ab_channel=hsiaoyen00)
Post by: MBGreen on November 29, 2020, 10:28:08 PM
I do no t think Trevor Lawrence and a new coach will cure all that ails this franchise but getting rid of that, that's not going to happen.
Lol
Post by: Miamipuck on November 29, 2020, 10:30:18 PM
There's my bridge bitch.
Lol
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 29, 2020, 10:32:49 PM
The Jets were not the laughingstock of the NFL. They obviously weren't the top team but conversely they weren't the worst team either. However, being a middling mediocre franchise is nothing to hang your hat on.
The problem isn't getting the best player in the draft, the problem is the confluence of decisions that have led to the Jets getting the so called best played in the draft. The people that made many of those decisions are still here. That's a gigantic problem. Firing Gase solves a little but not the majority.
In that case winning a few games at the tail end of this season is not going to solve much. This team is going to go 0-16 because it was built to go 0-16.
Sustained success isn’t going to be something that we can measure from anything that happens this season.
Ideally, the Johnsons will let Douglas pick the new HC, or at least keep him involved in the hiring process.
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 29, 2020, 10:43:49 PM
I do no t think Trevor Lawrence and a new coach will cure all that ails this franchise but getting rid of that, that's not going to happen.
I agree with you that those two pieces aren’t going to turn this team around from 0-16 to the playoffs. The roster is in need of upgrades at every position. Even our star players (or what passes for star on this team at least) have all had injury concerns this season. Hopefully that’s just a symptom of this year but that can’t be determined right now.
The more nihilistic among us (yo) are positing that the FO is operating exactly in line with the last three regimes in terms of personnel decisions and overall affect on the team. My opinion of Douglas has gotten slightly better with Becton’s debut and Mims finally seeing the field, but the team actively got worse in year two of his tenure. You can throw as much blame on Gase as he earned but Douglas also put this team together. I’m warming to his draft pics, I still haven’t seen anything to tell me that he can attract good FAs.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 29, 2020, 10:58:29 PM
I agree with you that those two pieces aren’t going to turn this team around from 0-16 to the playoffs. The roster is in need of upgrades at every position. Even our star players (or what passes for star on this team at least) have all had injury concerns this season. Hopefully that’s just a symptom of this year but that can’t be determined right now.
The more nihilistic among us (yo) are positing that the FO is operating exactly in line with the last three regimes in terms of personnel decisions and overall affect on the team. My opinion of Douglas has gotten slightly better with Becton’s debut and Mims finally seeing the field, but the team actively got worse in year two of his tenure. You can throw as much blame on Gase as he earned but Douglas also put this team together. I’m warming to his draft pics, I still haven’t seen anything to tell me that he can attract good FAs.
We all had posts thinking, positing that Idzik and Duff may finally be righting the ship. I am fairly certain if you look at posting histories you will find something of the sort. How quickly each of us realized that those two were freaking morons is up for debate. I took too long to turn on Duff, Idzik not so much.
Anyway, Douglas can finally be the answer and be our version of Ozzie Newsome, who knows. I am going to take a much longer time to decide on him. He's done some good but has also made his share of mistakes, plus like you said, the team has taken a big turn for the worst in year 2 of his tenure. The jury is still out. That said, I would love for him to be the chief component of the new coach search. This way the future of the team is part and parcel his. He's the GM and any franchise worth their salt has the GM being the deciding factor in any major decision as far as constructing the team. Some teams have Presidents oversee things, but that's mostly for more broader decisions.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 30, 2020, 01:01:31 AM
I've been actively rooting for the Jags every Sunday in the hopes that I can actually watch and enjoy a football game like a normal person again.
There's no question getting the first overall is whats best for the franchise. If it takes 0-16 to get there, then that's unfortunate, but so be it. I take no joy in any of this.
Exactly. I don't want to go 0-16. I'm on record several times saying I want to win a game. However, I've come around to the viewpoint that the No. 1 pick is more important than a meaningless win just to avoid the 0-16 scarlet letter. I don't really care about that. I care about a Super Bowl. If the best path to get the Jets to a Super Bowl and to the playoffs is getting Trevor Lawrence, and I think it is, sign me up.
I root for the Jaguars every week, too. I would love to root for the Jets again this year. I hope we're freerolling in Week 17 and can beat the Patriots. I think some Jets fans want to go 0-16 because they hate Gase so much they want that on his record. I don't care at all about that. I don't want the Jets to go 0-16, but I'm willing to accept that. Give me 0-15-1.
Post by: dcm1602 on November 30, 2020, 03:01:32 AM
In both instances you're a horrendous freaking joke and the very worst in the league.
The difference between the 1st and 2nd overall pick this year is franchise changing.
Will the 1st round pick make us a contender? Certainly not.
But it'll do far more to getting us on track than being 2-14 with the 2nd overall pick would.
Honestly I could care less if we draft Lawrence or auction the pick off for a monumental fortune.
The fact is we traded our best player for future draft picks this year, our second best player sat out the season. Cut the most expensive player on our team this year, had a QB injured all year (and playing like excrement) and soon will purge our pathetic head coach.
0-16 would be historically bad, but there were specific actions that occurred that effectively turned this into a rebuilding year. Would we have been 0-16 with Adams, Mosley, and the terrible Bell? Probably not
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 30, 2020, 08:11:35 AM
Uh... yeah, pretty much. Until I'm given any kind of evidence to think otherwise, there's no logical reason to believe that the magic Trevor will fix anything at all. And I respect your optimism about the coach but I still think there's a very decent chance that it's Gase come next September.
This sums up my thoughts on the team as well. They have not proven they can do anything correct, so I'm thinking:
- If they get Trevor, they'll ruin him like they did Sam
- I expect Gase to be back next year, bc we have clowns for owners
- and if they do fire Gase, I'm sure they'll use the same firm they used to hire Idzik to find the next HC.
Post by: MBGreen on November 30, 2020, 08:15:19 AM
This sums up my thoughts on the team as well. They have not proven they can do anything correct, so I'm thinking:
- If they get Trevor, they'll ruin him like they did Sam
- I expect Gase to be back next year, bc we have clowns for owners
- and if they do fire Gase, I'm sure they'll use the same firm they used to hire Idzik to find the next HC.
We're on our way to securing the #1 pick. We're gonna get a new HC. Optimism is at an all time high this morning.
(https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/015/878/thatsnoneofmy.jpg)
Post by: bojanglesman on November 30, 2020, 08:21:03 AM
We're on our way to securing the #1 pick. We're gonna get a new HC. Optimism is at an all time high this morning.I'm telling you, we will win one of these last 5 games. I don't know how, but it will happen.
(https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/015/878/thatsnoneofmy.jpg)
Post by: MBGreen on November 30, 2020, 08:26:12 AM
I'm telling you, we will win one of these last 5 games. I don't know how, but it will happen.
not with Gase calling plays. And me starting the game thread.
#lethalcombo
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2020, 08:57:01 AM
Post by: Johnny English on November 30, 2020, 09:01:59 AM
The strategy is basically to suck for long enough that your fans celebrate what other teams would consider mediocrity as some kind of success. It's the sports equivalent of Stockholm Syndrome.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 30, 2020, 09:05:03 AM
draft an overhyped #1 overall QB to add to a scorched earth roster
Trevor Lawrence is not overhyped, at all.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 30, 2020, 09:06:25 AM
Trevor Lawrence is not overhyped, at all.
He will be once he dons the Jets jersey
Post by: Johnny English on November 30, 2020, 09:11:34 AM
Trevor Lawrence is not overhyped, at all.Of course he is. With the level of obsession some fans have shown this season he could be the second coming of Joe Montana and he'd be unable to live up to the hype. Overhyped doesn't mean he's not good, it means that the expectation levels have become too high.
He is not going to be the franchise saviour that is expected of him, because no one player can be.
Post by: MBGreen on November 30, 2020, 09:16:40 AM
Of course he is. With the level of obsession some fans have shown this season he could be the second coming of Joe Montana and he'd be unable to live up to the hype. Overhyped doesn't mean he's not good, it means that the expectation levels have become too high.
He is not going to be the franchise saviour that is expected of him, because no one player can be.
Trevor Lawrence is a step in the right direction for rebuilding this team. Unfortunately, hiring Gase made us take 2 steps back....but i see the light at the end of the tunnel. Hiring the right coach, drafting Lawrence and building around him will bring us success....nobody will give a excrement about an 0-16 season if we become playoff contenders.
Without a little optimism, what's the point of rooting for this team? You should probably ask yourself that. And you've only been around for the last 10 years....you don't know what suffering is.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 30, 2020, 09:24:00 AM
Sam Darnold could throw 20 more INTs over these last few games and Johnny English would still think we need to trade the #1 pick to get him help.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 30, 2020, 09:37:43 AM
The Jets were not the laughingstock of the NFL. They obviously weren't the top team but conversely they weren't the worst team either. However, being a middling mediocre franchise is nothing to hang your hat on.
The problem isn't getting the best player in the draft, the problem is the confluence of decisions that have led to the Jets getting the so called best player in the draft. The people that made many of those decisions are still here. That's a gigantic problem. Firing Gase solves a little but not the majority.
Wrong
Post by: bojanglesman on November 30, 2020, 10:06:27 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 30, 2020, 10:06:56 AM
Feels like we're following the Cleveland / Detroit model for success - stink it up terribly for multiple seasons, draft an overhyped #1 overall QB to add to a scorched earth roster, sit back and wait for him to make magic happen, blame everyone except him when it somehow doesn't. All we're missing is the supremely talented wideout that we can fail to use properly as we work our way through a string of excrement coaches.
The strategy is basically to suck for long enough that your fans celebrate what other teams would consider mediocrity as some kind of success. It's the sports equivalent of Stockholm Syndrome.
I'm with you on the stance of being anti-tank, but I disagree with you about Lawrence.
The Patriots were a true laughingstock, even under Belichick, until Bledsoe started playing better, got hurt, and in walked some guy named Tom.
The Colts were unbelievably bad until Peyton.
A great QB fixes a lot of problems. I agree with your line of thinking that Lawrence isn't some magical force that comes in and instantly turns this ship around. But he is a great centerpiece to a true rebuild.
If they draft Lawrence, I'd want them to put a lot of draft capital into OL and WR. I'd be fine completely ignoring defense in the '21 draft. Load up on protection and guys to catch the ball, and give him the chance this team never gave Sanchez or Darnold.
Post by: Badger on November 30, 2020, 10:10:30 AM
I'm with you on the stance of being anti-tank, but I disagree with you about Lawrence.
The Patriots were a true laughingstock, even under Belichick, until Bledsoe started playing better, got hurt, and in walked some guy named Tom.
The Colts were unbelievably bad until Peyton.
A great QB fixes a lot of problems. I agree with your line of thinking that Lawrence isn't some magical force that comes in and instantly turns this ship around. But he is a great centerpiece to a true rebuild.
If they draft Lawrence, I'd want them to put a lot of draft capital into OL and WR. I'd be fine completely ignoring defense in the '21 draft. Load up on protection and guys to catch the ball, and give him the chance this team never gave Sanchez or Darnold.
I've made this point before but it falls on deaf ears. There was nothing special about these owners until they won something on the back of an exceptional QB.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 30, 2020, 10:30:31 AM
In my head, I'm comparing a mediocre QB on the tail end of a rookie contract to a better QB prospect on the relative cheap for 4 years. Even if Darnold improves, you have to pay him $$$$$ in 2022. That would be a good problem to have, but is he really more likely to play better in 2021 than Lawrence would? We have 3 years that say no so far.
I'm not blind to the fact that the Jets could freak up anything, but giving them a clean slate gives them the best chance not to, along with a more attractive situation for the best coaching candidates. Coaches aren't going to want to be tied to Darnold year 1. I don't think they are any more likely to change the way things are done regarding ownership by keeping Darnold or losing out. Jets are gonna keep on Jetsing or not. Keeping Darnold won't force any self-reflection by the Johnsons.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 30, 2020, 10:30:52 AM
There was nothing special about these owners until they won something on the back of an exceptional QB.
Joe Namath has the best sports quote of all-time: when you win, nothing hurts
Everyone loved Woody in 2009 and 2010
Post by: Heismanberg on November 30, 2020, 10:32:50 AM
I still think resetting the QB rookie contract by drafting Lawrence (or any top QB rookie) is a big deal. It opens up cap for the rest of the team for 4 years.
0-16 also gives us the top pick in the second round.
This team would have Trevor Lawrence, Seattle's first and third, the top pick in round two, loads of cap space, and a new coach. Sam Darnold will likely be traded for more pieces, likely a third at this point. Then we'll have two firsts again in 2022.
Johnny English is acting like Lawrence is the only thing that will change in 2021. We have a significant amount of resources to build around the quarterback.
Post by: MBGreen on November 30, 2020, 10:38:00 AM
0-16 also gives us the top pick in the second round.
This team would have Trevor Lawrence, Seattle's first and third, the top pick in round two, loads of cap space, and a new coach. Sam Darnold will likely be traded for more pieces, likely a third at this point. Then we'll have two firsts again in 2022.
Johnny English is acting like Lawrence is the only thing that will change in 2021. We have a significant amount of resources to build around the quarterback.
bingo
Post by: bojanglesman on November 30, 2020, 10:39:06 AM
bingoI forgot about having the top pick in the 2nd round. Another valuable trading piece if they choose so.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 30, 2020, 10:59:44 AM
Feels like we're following the Cleveland / Detroit model for success - stink it up terribly for multiple seasons, draft an overhyped #1 overall QB to add to a scorched earth roster, sit back and wait for him to make magic happen, blame everyone except him when it somehow doesn't. All we're missing is the supremely talented wideout that we can fail to use properly as we work our way through a string of excrement coaches.You laugh at people talking about the #1 QB as if people view him as the magical answer to fix all our issues (which nobody really says). Yet the way you treat Sam Darnold is the exact same thing that you're criticizing from others.
The strategy is basically to suck for long enough that your fans celebrate what other teams would consider mediocrity as some kind of success. It's the sports equivalent of Stockholm Syndrome.
The Jets went with a scorched earth roster and drafted an overhyped QB at No. 3 overall with significant turnover issues, and now that it isn't working, you are blaming everyone except Darnold.
What you are describing is what the Jets just did with Darnold. We built no infrastructure for him to succeed, and he isn't succeeding. Part of that is Darnold's fault, part of that is the team's fault.
With Lawrence, we wouldn't have traded away 3 additional 2nd-round picks that we could use to build around him. Instead, we would have EXTRA picks which we could use to build around him.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 30, 2020, 11:01:46 AM
Feels like we're following the Cleveland / Detroit model for success - stink it up terribly for multiple seasons, draft an overhyped #1 overall QB to add to a scorched earth roster, sit back and wait for him to make magic happen, blame everyone except him when it somehow doesn't. All we're missing is the supremely talented wideout that we can fail to use properly as we work our way through a string of excrement coaches.
The strategy is basically to suck for long enough that your fans celebrate what other teams would consider mediocrity as some kind of success. It's the sports equivalent of Stockholm Syndrome.
I'll say this again.
Lions Fans and Browns Fans were not cheering for 0-16, they were not praying to get #1 overall all season long because their 'savior' was there waiting for them. When they ended up going 0-16 and picking #1, they were excited that they would be getting a QB in hopes that guy could be their Rodgers/Brady/Brees/Mahomes etc.
The Colts Fans were excited at the idea of getting Luck and were ecstatic to get #1 because of what he meant for the future, that would have been unknown if Peyton stuck around off the injuries. Thats the last fanbase to be excited about the possibility of #1 overall and getting their guy, because Luck was that freaking good.
People hyped up Sam after his Rose Bowl, and clearly backed the truck up a bit during his final college season. Thats why he ended up there at #3. But he still had everything necessary to be the guy. We just fucked him up.
Lawrence is better as a prospect than all those guys. He will cover up the mistakes of a lot of bad that we might make in the coming years. But we have to hope we will do enough around him to let him become what he is capable of.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 30, 2020, 11:38:39 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2020, 11:40:18 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 30, 2020, 11:41:33 AM
Using the Browns example as a team that didn’t use 0-16 and a HC/QB change as a catalyst to turn it around is an interesting argumentThe Browns also fired their owner, too.
(oh wait, they didn't? they had the same crappy owner? oh.)
Post by: Jumbo on November 30, 2020, 11:42:29 AM
Funny how the Jets have now completely fucked up the 2 QB's in a row they have drafted high and yet people have complete confidence that this time they will do it correctly, it's going to be different.
Lawrence may already be better than Darnold or Sanchez ever were. It's just not even close. Sanchez just sucked even in a good situation, but there will be the pieces and opportunity to build more around Lawrence that Darnold never really got in time.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 30, 2020, 11:44:23 AM
Funny how the Jets have now completely fucked up the 2 QB's in a row they have drafted high and yet people have complete confidence that this time they will do it correctly, it's going to be different.
You know it’s possible to think this and still be smart enough to realize that drafting a new QB is the right decision regardless.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 30, 2020, 11:45:14 AM
Funny how the Jets have now completely fucked up the 2 QB's in a row they have drafted high and yet people have complete confidence that this time they will do it correctly, it's going to be different.1. I have no idea if it's going to be different, but Lawrence is a significantly better prospect than Darnold or Sanchez.
2. I don't see how you can blame the Jets for both Sanchez and Darnold. They gave Sanchez an elite supporting cast in his developmental years. They gave Darnold nothing. Darnold, sure, the Jets deserve a lot of blame. And the Jets didn't do a good job around Sanchez after his first two seasons. But Sanchez's problems in the NFL were mostly because he was never that good.
3. In 2018, the Jets traded a ton of draft capital to get Darnold. In 2020-21, the Jets traded a ton of draft capital to get help around Lawrence. They are perfectly positioned to help out Lawrence, which they weren't for Darnold.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2020, 12:00:12 PM
1. I have no idea if it's going to be different, but Lawrence is a significantly better prospect than Darnold or Sanchez.Sanchez may have ultimately been unredeemable, we will never know. They (Rex) threw him to the wolves, he never had a chance to learn behind any credible veteran. They spent hardly any assets building around him, the teams personnel went down hill quick in the 3 years he was starter. They are a great lesson in how not to build around a young QB. Again, we know he sucked but at the time we were all saying WTF with regards to their decisions of building a competent offense.
2. I don't see how you can blame the Jets for both Sanchez and Darnold. They gave Sanchez an elite supporting cast in his developmental years. They gave Darnold nothing. Darnold, sure, the Jets deserve a lot of blame. And the Jets didn't do a good job around Sanchez after his first two seasons. But Sanchez's problems in the NFL were mostly because he was never that good.
3. In 2018, the Jets traded a ton of draft capital to get Darnold. In 2020-21, the Jets traded a ton of draft capital to get help around Lawrence. They are perfectly positioned to help out Lawrence, which they weren't for Darnold.
I am not going to get into the Darnold/Gase thing we beat it to death 50 times over.
But yeah suffice to say I don't agree with you, I think they did everything in their power to screw up both Darnold and Sanchez, it's almost like they intentionally tried to freak them up it's such a thorough job of it.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2020, 12:03:52 PM
Lawrence may already be better than Darnold or Sanchez ever were. It's just not even close. Sanchez just sucked even in a good situation, but there will be the pieces and opportunity to build more around Lawrence that Darnold never really got in time.
Lawrence very well maybe. I haven't seen him play and am not a draft guru and will not ever pretend to be. That said, we fucked Darnold and Sanchez up good and hard. That's my point.
You know it’s possible to think this and still be smart enough to realize that drafting a new QB is the right decision regardless.
Not possible................
Post by: Johnny English on November 30, 2020, 12:06:16 PM
Using the Browns example as a team that didn’t use 0-16 and a HC/QB change as a catalyst to turn it around is an interesting argumentPlease read the last paragraph of my previous post.
Post by: Jumbo on November 30, 2020, 12:12:32 PM
Lawrence very well maybe. I haven't seen him play and am not a draft guru and will not ever pretend to be. That said, we fucked Darnold and Sanchez up good and hard. That's my point.
I guess. Regardless, the point is that the Jets almost certainly will have either the #1 or #2 overall pick unless they manage to somehow finish out 3-2 (or better). Given that, I would much rather lose out for the #1 pick in a draft like this where it's much more valuable. Anything about "we'll ruin Lawrence" or something like that is mitigated by the fact that assuming we'd also take a QB #2, they'd be much more likely to be significantly hindered by the current state of the team.
Post by: Badger on November 30, 2020, 12:17:16 PM
Funny how the Colts have now completely fucked up the 2 QB's in a row they have drafted high and yet people have complete confidence that this time they will do it correctly, it's going to be different.
-Miamicolt, 1998
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2020, 12:25:08 PM
-Miamicolt, 1998
Odd how your joke is completely inaccurate but run with it.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 30, 2020, 12:29:02 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2020, 12:31:15 PM
Keep ignoring the fact that we had a young Darnold and had the cream of the coaching crop wanting to come here and yet still fucked that up. Most definitely keep ignoring that.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 30, 2020, 12:32:03 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2020, 12:35:16 PM
https://twitter.com/michael_nania/status/1333258119472885760?s=21
Hahaha
Nick Mangold
@nickmangold
·
15h
I realize you’re probably 7 years old so I’m going to be nice but you should probably refrain from cursing as it should get you a bar of soap in your mouth, which I’d gladly administer.....
Quote Tweet
BullyUpNYG
@BullyUpNYG
· 16h
You watch that giants o line today you freaking fat hairy slob @nickmangold twitter.com/nickmangold/st…
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 30, 2020, 12:36:04 PM
Keep ignoring the fact that we had a young Darnold and had the cream of the coaching crop wanting to come here and yet still fucked that up. Most definitely keep ignoring that.
You must have been at the pub for the thousands of posts already addressing that.
I have posts on this board stating that:
1) we weren’t guaranteed to improve at the HC position following the Rex firing
2) we weren’t guaranteed to improve at the HC position following the Bowles firing
I will go on the record and say it will be impossible for the Jets to not improve at the HC position following the Gase firing.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2020, 12:40:01 PM
You must have been at the pub for the thousands of posts already addressing that.
I have posts on this board stating that:
1) we weren’t guaranteed to improve at the HC position following the Rex firing
2) we weren’t guaranteed to improve at the HC position following the Bowles firing
I will go on the record and say it will be impossible for the Jets to not improve at the HC position following the Gase firing.
Everyone understands that, yet I don't find it comforting even in the slightest. I wish I was at the Pub with JE.
Post by: Johnny English on November 30, 2020, 12:53:55 PM
You must have been at the pub for the thousands of posts already addressing that.
I have posts on this board stating that:
1) we weren’t guaranteed to improve at the HC position following the Rex firing
2) we weren’t guaranteed to improve at the HC position following the Bowles firing
I will go on the record and say it will be impossible for the Jets to not improve at the HC position following the Gase firing.
I'm willing to bet that I could find Detroit fans saying the same thing about firing Jim Caldwell. Who, you will recall, we interviewed prior to hiring Gase.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 30, 2020, 12:58:45 PM
I'm willing to bet that I could find Detroit fans saying the same thing about firing Jim Caldwell. Who, you will recall, we interviewed prior to hiring Gase.Jim Caldwell was 36-28 with the Lions and is 62-50 in his career. He's not a great coach, but he's a JAG in coaching terms. I'm willing to bet you could find morons on the internet saying a lot of moronic things. Doesn't mean it means anything.
There are also varying degrees of "bad" for head coach.
I've heard countless times how bad a coach Rex was. Well, we nearly went to a Super Bowl with him. We won 10 games with Bowles.
Mike McCarthy won a Super Bowl.
Dan Quinn nearly won a Super Bowl.
Matt Nagy was 12-4 recently
You don't need an elite coach to have success. And there aren't many elite coaches. You just can't have an actively bad coach like Gase.
Kind of depressing how this has turned into the SOJF board.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2020, 01:24:35 PM
I've heard countless times how bad a coach Rex was. Well, we nearly went to a Super Bowl with him.
Twice in a row. But that was on the tail end of a mostly successful decade plus, so perceptions change. Changing the coach is easy, everyone who thinks they can be a coach expects an instant upgrade. Those of us who could remember having truly bad coaches knew the grass isn't always greener, now everyone knows.
Post by: Badger on November 30, 2020, 03:12:47 PM
Odd how your joke is completely inaccurate but run with it.The Colts drafted Chandler and George within a decade of Manning, all under the same ownership. It's extremely accurate.
Post by: dcm1602 on November 30, 2020, 03:26:14 PM
I'm willing to bet that I could find Detroit fans saying the same thing about firing Jim Caldwell. Who, you will recall, we interviewed prior to hiring Gase.
Rooney Rule
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2020, 03:53:31 PM
The Colts drafted Chandler and George within a decade of Manning, all under the same ownership. It's extremely accurate.
Jeff George was a #1 overall, too, in 1990.
Fun fact, the Jets had the #2 overall (off a 4-12 of all things) and took Blair Thomas. Funner fact, my friend, Chris Singleton, was the #8 overall that year.
Post by: insanity on November 30, 2020, 03:54:16 PM
Jim Caldwell was 36-28 with the Lions and is 62-50 in his career. He's not a great coach, but he's a JAG in coaching terms. I'm willing to bet you could find morons on the internet saying a lot of moronic things. Doesn't mean it means anything.He's also won two superbowls with two different teams.
There are also varying degrees of "bad" for head coach.
I've heard countless times how bad a coach Rex was. Well, we nearly went to a Super Bowl with him. We won 10 games with Bowles.
Mike McCarthy won a Super Bowl.
Dan Quinn nearly won a Super Bowl.
Matt Nagy was 12-4 recently
You don't need an elite coach to have success. And there aren't many elite coaches. You just can't have an actively bad coach like Gase.
Kind of depressing how this has turned into the SOJF board.
Post by: Badger on November 30, 2020, 04:49:56 PM
He's also won two superbowls with two different teams.Wouldn't mind him as an OC. Not a HC.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2020, 07:34:53 PM
The Colts drafted Chandler and George within a decade of Manning, all under the same ownership. It's extremely accurate.
Chandler was a mid round 2nd not a top talent. Jeff George had one of the best arms ever he was just a degenerate gambler that couldn't get his life together.
If he was a college prospect today he would give Lawrence a run for the money both literally and figuratively. So he is an example ofvwhat can go wrong with a top talent.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2020, 07:44:56 PM
Jim Caldwell was 36-28 with the Lions and is 62-50 in his career. He's not a great coach, but he's a JAG in coaching terms. I'm willing to bet you could find morons on the internet saying a lot of moronic things. Doesn't mean it means anything..
There are also varying degrees of "bad" for head coach.
I've heard countless times how bad a coach Rex was. Well, we nearly went to a Super Bowl with him. We won 10 games with Bowles.
Mike McCarthy won a Super Bowl.
Dan Quinn nearly won a Super Bowl.
Matt Nagy was 12-4 recently
You don't need an elite coach to have success. And there aren't many elite coaches. You just can't have an actively bad coach like Gase.
Kind of depressing how this has turned into the SOJF board.
With all the group think in this place there are only two that aren't overly optimistic about the future of this team....... seriously what do you expect being a fan of one of the single worst constructed teams in NFL history? Puppies and Rainbows?
I don't like the ownership and feel they're going to freak it up but I am all to happy to be wrong.
Post by: Badger on December 01, 2020, 07:41:02 AM
vs LAV (6-5)
at SEA (8-3)
at LAR (7-4)
vs CLE (8-3)
at NE (5-6)
#Jaguars remaining schedule
at MIN (5-6)
vs TEN (8-3)
at BAL (6-4)
vs CHI (5-6)
at IND (7-4)
Post by: MBGreen on December 01, 2020, 09:10:54 AM
#Jets remaining schedule
vs LAV (6-5)
at SEA (8-3)
at LAR (7-4)
vs CLE (8-3)
at NE (5-6)
#Jaguars remaining schedule
at MIN (5-6)
vs TEN (8-3)
at BAL (6-4)
vs CHI (5-6)
at IND (7-4)
The Jags playing the Bears at home could be our saving grace.
Post by: Badger on December 01, 2020, 09:32:41 AM
The Jags playing the Bears at home could be our saving grace.But but but the Johnsons
They can't possibly ever have a championship team, because they've never had one before! My inductive reasoning is unassailable.
Post by: MBGreen on December 01, 2020, 09:38:13 AM
But but but the Johnsons
They can't possibly ever have a championship team! My inductive reasoning is unassailable.
"Damn..the Johnsons were gonna get away with it, if it weren't for you meddling kids"
Post by: Libero_2 on December 01, 2020, 09:49:35 AM
But but but the Johnsons
They can't possibly ever have a championship team, because they've never had one before! My inductive reasoning is unassailable.
They've never had an 0-16 team either. So there's that
Post by: mj2sexay on December 01, 2020, 10:18:04 AM
Jeff George had one of the best arms ever he was just a degenerate gambler that couldn't get his life together.
Was he really?! What's up with the Colts taking QB's who you're more likely to see at the track then in a film room?
That actually bolsters Badgers point. The same ownership group in which Peyton Manning was drafted under, was also the one that hired the people who drafted Art Schlichter.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 01, 2020, 11:29:09 AM
Was he really?! What's up with the Colts taking QB's who you're more likely to see at the track then in a film room?Actually it bolsters both arguments but the group think tank that has a difficult time processing other opinions might not contemplate it.
That actually bolsters Badgers point. The same ownership group in which Peyton Manning was drafted under, was also the one that hired the people who drafted Art Schlichter.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 01, 2020, 02:35:39 PM
#Jets remaining schedule
at SEA (8-3)
at LAR (7-4)
Good year to get this little stretch out of the way.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 01, 2020, 05:20:36 PM
Good year to get this little stretch out of the way.
Hopefully they make us come back to the east coast and fly back out there similar to the Raiders this week.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2020, 11:43:30 AM
Hopefully they make us come back to the east coast and fly back out there similar to the Raiders this week.
It won't matter, we're losing both games. Our secondary isn't stopping either of those QBs on 3rd down unless someone drops a pass. Once Frank Gore gets tired it will be over.
Post by: Badger on December 02, 2020, 02:20:40 PM
Post by: MBGreen on December 02, 2020, 02:23:14 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 04, 2020, 04:05:52 PM
Post by: Badger on December 06, 2020, 12:06:00 PM
Post by: Laxin on December 06, 2020, 04:03:46 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 06, 2020, 04:27:36 PM
This will come down to the Pats game. The next 3 are really tough. The Jags’ best chance at a win are vs the Bears, which isn’t a huge stretch.The Jags have been close for a few weeks now.
Jaguars could compete with the Titans at home, too. They had a chance to beat them in Week 2.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 06, 2020, 04:59:16 PM
SOS tiebreaker all but gone.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 06, 2020, 05:10:35 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on December 06, 2020, 05:26:41 PM
https://twitter.com/Michael_Nania/status/1335705943531786240
SOS tiebreaker all but gone.
We never really had a shot. It's kind of amazing that we have the most difficult schedule in the league this year. After having one of the softest stretches we've ever seen a year ago.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 06, 2020, 05:38:59 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on December 06, 2020, 05:39:41 PM
We never really had a shot. It's kind of amazing that we have the most difficult schedule in the league this year. After having one of the softest stretches we've ever seen a year ago.
Well it's probably the best year ever to have the hardest schedule in the league. Between the Rona, it being the last year of the Gase era, and the way the draft is looking.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 06, 2020, 11:46:37 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 07, 2020, 11:27:58 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 07, 2020, 11:34:08 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 12, 2020, 05:13:53 PM
Someone tell JE it’s past his bedtime
Post by: Johnny English on December 12, 2020, 05:39:15 PM
https://twitter.com/jeremyschaap/status/1337796206429413377?s=21
Someone tell JE it’s past his bedtime
He started well and then he got stupid.
Tanking is excrement and should not be rewarded, but giving the top pick to the best teams makes even less sense.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 12, 2020, 08:00:46 PM
He started well and then he got stupid.
Tanking is excrement and should not be rewarded, but giving the top pick to the best teams makes even less sense.
Do you think there is a team in the NFL worse than the Jets in the 2020 season?
Post by: dcm1602 on December 12, 2020, 08:43:07 PM
He started well and then he got stupid.
Tanking is excrement and should not be rewarded, but giving the top pick to the best teams makes even less sense.
Yep I agree
I'd somewhat consider, having the draft order get reversed for teams who did not make the playoffs.
Ie the first pick would go to the team most narrowly missing the playoffs.
This way you don't stack the best teams, nor do you encourage people to get rewarded for losing more.
From a fan perspective, how much better would it be to never have to hope your team loses (unless you'd want them to intentionally miss the playoffs for draft picks).
They could always throw in an extra 2nd round pick or something for the xyz worst teams so that they don't get left too far behind as well or something
Post by: delavan on December 13, 2020, 05:08:35 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 13, 2020, 05:16:01 PM
Yep I agree
I'd somewhat consider, having the draft order get reversed for teams who did not make the playoffs.
Ie the first pick would go to the team most narrowly missing the playoffs.
This way you don't stack the best teams, nor do you encourage people to get rewarded for losing more.
From a fan perspective, how much better would it be to never have to hope your team loses (unless you'd want them to intentionally miss the playoffs for draft picks).
They could always throw in an extra 2nd round pick or something for the xyz worst teams so that they don't get left too far behind as well or something
I actually don't hate this idea.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 13, 2020, 06:02:50 PM
I actually don't hate this idea.
Starting in 2021 of course
Post by: dcm1602 on December 14, 2020, 12:38:07 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 14, 2020, 01:15:05 AM
If we go through all this misery the entire freaking season, then lose the 1st pick week 17. Then seriously freak this teamWatch.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 14, 2020, 04:50:05 AM
If we go through all this misery the entire freaking season, then lose the 1st pick week 17. Then seriously freak this team
That seems to be the exact type of bullshit we would pull.
But man I just think Belicheck would rather brand us with 0-16 than assume he can't ruin yet another promising young QB of the NYJ
Post by: bojanglesman on December 14, 2020, 05:57:47 AM
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 07:11:36 AM
If we go through all this misery the entire freaking season, then lose the 1st pick week 17. Then seriously freak this team
LOL...watch the freaking games. This team isn't winning excrement. At this point, Stidham will shred this defense.
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 07:12:56 AM
I hope the Jags miracle a win before then. Belichick isn't going to quit, but they aren't that good. It's a winnable game for the Jets.
We'll kick a FG on the first drive, and then give up 28-40 points. Rinse and repeat.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 14, 2020, 07:28:37 AM
LOL...watch the freaking games. This team isn't winning excrement. At this point, Stidham will shred this defense.
I watched the Jets play New England when they were still in playoff contention.
Week 17 might be time they evaluate Stidham
If he's horrible, we could certainly beat them
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 07:31:42 AM
I watched the Jets play New England when they were still in playoff contention.
Week 17 might be time they evaluate Stidham
If he's horrible, we could certainly beat them
We failed to pass for 200 yards and score a TD against the league's worst pass D yesterday. I think you need to settle down.
Plus our D is in more disarray under Frank Bush, the guy didn't call a single blitz.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 14, 2020, 07:36:04 AM
We failed to pass for 200 yards and score a TD against the league's worst pass D yesterday. I think you need to settle down.
Plus our D is in more disarray under Frank Bush, the guy didn't call a single blitz.
I certainly don't favor us to win it.
But it's our easiest game since well the last time we played the Pats.
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 07:41:35 AM
I certainly don't favor us to win it.
But it's our easiest game since well the last time we played the Pats.
We just need to make sure Darnold is starting that game. Belichick is his daddy.
If Flacco starts, then my anxiety may rise.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 14, 2020, 07:45:16 AM
We just need to make sure Darnold is starting that game. Belichick is his daddy.
If Flacco starts, then my anxiety may rise.
I mean in my eyes Jacksonville has 3 winnable games vs our one
So TBD
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 07:54:25 AM
I mean in my eyes Jacksonville has 3 winnable games vs our one
So TBD
praying for #MinshewMagic
Post by: dcm1602 on December 14, 2020, 07:56:25 AM
praying for #MinshewMagic
On a side note ESPNS computer simulation bullshit that simulates the rest of the season 10,000 times. Only gives us a 74% chance of the top pick
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 08:00:31 AM
On a side note ESPNS computer simulation bullshit that simulates the rest of the season 10,000 times. Only gives us a 74% chance of the top pick
that's because the simulator has code within in to factor in Jets fuckups.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 14, 2020, 11:56:57 AM
LOL...watch the freaking games. This team isn't winning excrement. At this point, Stidham will shred this defense.Did you watch the first Patriots game?
Post by: Heismanberg on December 14, 2020, 11:59:33 AM
We failed to pass for 200 yards and score a TD against the league's worst pass D yesterday. I think you need to settle down.
I don't care about what our awful offense did. The Patriots* offense cannot move the football. They rely on the run game, which our defense usually handles pretty well.
That's the issue for Week 17.
It's going to be an extremely ugly football game.
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 12:29:27 PM
I don't care about what our awful offense did. The Patriots* offense cannot move the football. They rely on the run game, which our defense usually handles pretty well.They'll run the ball straight up Frank's bush.
That's the issue for Week 17.
It's going to be an extremely ugly football game.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 14, 2020, 12:31:19 PM
Plus our D is in more disarray under Frank Bush, the guy didn't call a single blitz.Also, I thought you were joking about this in the other thread, but I really don't think the reason the defense struggled was because we didn't call an all-out blitz during the game.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 14, 2020, 12:32:43 PM
I don't care about what our awful offense did. The Patriots* offense cannot move the football. They rely on the run game, which our defense usually handles pretty well.The good news is that Darnold would be playing instead of Flacco, so we'll probably complete one pass over 20 yards all game.
That's the issue for Week 17.
It's going to be an extremely ugly football game.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 14, 2020, 12:33:10 PM
Plus our D is in more disarray under Frank Bush, the guy didn't call a single blitz.
Just because he didn't call an all out blitz doesn't mean he didn't call plays with a blitz.
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 12:33:19 PM
Also, I thought you were joking about this in the other thread, but I really don't think the reason the defense struggled was because we didn't call an all-out blitz during the game.No...not all out blitzes. No blitzes.
He rushed 3 or 4 all game.
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 12:35:27 PM
Still, we stink.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 14, 2020, 12:36:22 PM
Still, we stink.This part, I agree with.
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 12:38:02 PM
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 12:44:48 PM
I don't care about what our awful offense did. The Patriots* offense cannot move the football. They rely on the run game, which our defense usually handles pretty well.Also...the one aspect of this team (kicking) that was working, isn't anymore.
That's the issue for Week 17.
It's going to be an extremely ugly football game.
Frank Bush makes this D worse, not better.
And well, you're already aware of our shitty offense.
The pats are little better than us in every phase including coaching.
Unless belichick throws in the towel, I don't see us winning anything.
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 01:01:30 PM
@AdamSchefter
·
26m
Doug Marrone named Gardner Minshew II as Jacksonville’s new starting QB.
bout time
Post by: loyaljetsfan on December 14, 2020, 01:26:12 PM
Also...the one aspect of this team (kicking) that was working, isn't anymore.
Frank Bush makes this D worse, not better.
And well, you're already aware of our shitty offense.
The pats are little better than us in every phase including coaching.
Unless belichick throws in the towel, I don't see us winning anything.
I can see Belichick starting their punter at QB just so we win and lose out on Lawrence.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 14, 2020, 01:36:50 PM
I can see Belichick starting their punter at QB just so we win and lose out on Lawrence.
This is how I see this going, which is why I'm following Jacksonville so closely. Or he starts the guy Jamal had the pick-6 against last year. We need to activate Luke Falk just to be on the safe side.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 14, 2020, 01:39:17 PM
I don't see how Belichick would ever want a loss to an 0-15 Jets team on his record.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 14, 2020, 01:41:44 PM
I can see Belichick starting their punter at QB just so we win and lose out on Lawrence.
We would win on 3 blocked punt TDs with Cam back there punting
Post by: Badger on December 14, 2020, 01:44:23 PM
Adam SchefterLFG
@AdamSchefter
·
26m
Doug Marrone named Gardner Minshew II as Jacksonville’s new starting QB.
bout time
Post by: MBGreen on December 14, 2020, 01:49:08 PM
Non-Jets fans try to convince me that Belichick is going to try to tank this game.
I don't see how Belichick would ever want a loss to an 0-15 Jets team on his record.
Belichick isn't tanking. That narrative needs to die.
We're all just insecure because nobody has been able to trust this franchise since 1969.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 14, 2020, 01:50:50 PM
Non-Jets fans try to convince me that Belichick is going to try to tank this game.
I don't see how Belichick would ever want a loss to an 0-15 Jets team on his record.
He knows the next decade is bigger than one game, that's why. Is anyone going to give him excrement over a meaningless Week 17 game after winning the division 19 years out of 20 and keeping a top QB out of our division for the next 10-15 years? No.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 14, 2020, 01:58:10 PM
He knows the next decade is bigger than one game, that's why. Is anyone going to give him excrement over a meaningless Week 17 game after winning the division 19 years out of 20 and keeping a top QB out of our division for the next 10-15 years? No.I don't know how you can feel this way and still be rooting for the Jets this season. You clearly know that losing out is best for the Jets, yet you are rooting for them anyway?
What you just said is literally the reason most of us are rooting for losses. But no coaches and players want to lose games. Belichick might be a rare exception since he has all the job security in the world, but I can't imagine he would want to have a loss to an 0-15 team on his record this year. Belichick is going to be 69 years old next year - I don't think he's that concerned about the next 10-15 years.
Post by: Johnny English on December 14, 2020, 01:58:34 PM
He knows the next decade is bigger than one game, that's why. Is anyone going to give him excrement over a meaningless Week 17 game after winning the division 19 years out of 20 and keeping a top QB out of our division for the next 10-15 years? No.
I'll tell you exactly what would happen. The media would ask him how he feels about losing to the 0-15 Jets and whether he did it deliberately to keep the Jets from drafting Lawrence, he'd give them a grunt and maybe the merest hint of a smirk, and then they'd spend the offseason writing countless inches about how the tactical mastermind played 4D chess with the Jets.
The flipside to that is that they put the exclamation point on the Jets' 0-16 season, they ask him how he feels about ensuring that the Jets draft Lawrence, he gives them a grunt and maybe the merest hint of a smirk, and then they spend the offseason writing countless inches about how the tactical mastermind knows that the Jets will ruin Lawrence and that his legacy of dominating the sorry Jets is underscored by him finishing off their 0-16 season to cement his legend.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 14, 2020, 02:03:05 PM
I'll tell you exactly what would happen. The media would ask him how he feels about losing to the 0-15 Jets and whether he did it deliberately to keep the Jets from drafting Lawrence, he'd give them a grunt and maybe the merest hint of a smirk, and then they'd spend the offseason writing countless inches about how the tactical mastermind played 4D chess with the Jets.Nailed it.
The flipside to that is that they put the exclamation point on the Jets' 0-16 season, they ask him how he feels about ensuring that the Jets draft Lawrence, he gives them a grunt and maybe the merest hint of a smirk, and then they spend the offseason writing countless inches about how the tactical mastermind knows that the Jets will ruin Lawrence and that his legacy of dominating the sorry Jets is underscored by him finishing off their 0-16 season to cement his legend.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 14, 2020, 02:11:36 PM
I don't know how you can feel this way and still be rooting for the Jets this season. You clearly know that losing out is best for the Jets, yet you are rooting for them anyway?
What you just said is literally the reason most of us are rooting for losses. But no coaches and players want to lose games. Belichick might be a rare exception since he has all the job security in the world, but I can't imagine he would want to have a loss to an 0-15 team on his record this year. Belichick is going to be 69 years old next year - I don't think he's that concerned about the next 10-15 years.
I realize in the big picture--at this point, this year--it's best for us to lose. From kickoff to the gun I want us to win, but at this point, like everyone else I'm severely conflicted. When it appeared the Raider game was in hand, Costello was already tweeting about Lawrence looking for real estate in Jacksonville, bo was posting pics of him in a Jags uniform and I was pissed. Then of course, we all know what happened.
Belichick can't outright throw a game, he'd be banned from the league, but he can pull starters, do whatever. I wouldn't put it past him.
Post by: Johnny English on December 14, 2020, 02:18:51 PM
Belichick can't outright throw a game, he'd be banned from the league
If that was true then half of our coaching staff, our GM and our owners would all be the subject of NFL investigations right now.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 14, 2020, 02:41:28 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 14, 2020, 02:46:46 PM
We should start James Morgan in Week 17.
How is this supposed to help Frank Gore?
Post by: bojanglesman on December 14, 2020, 02:50:04 PM
How is this supposed to help Frank Gore?More handoffs because Morgan sucks right now.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 14, 2020, 02:55:27 PM
If that was true then half of our coaching staff, our GM and our owners would all be the subject of NFL investigations right now.
That's incompetence, not throwing games.
For a reference, Pat Riley got in trouble years back for just resting key guys with a playoff spot sewn up, because people gamble on the games, pay for tickets, etc.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 14, 2020, 07:56:35 PM
(http://blob:https://pasteboard.co/4c2240db-64aa-48c0-af41-9602a4d04905)
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 14, 2020, 08:13:30 PM
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/544292787324469248
(http://blob:https://pasteboard.co/4c2240db-64aa-48c0-af41-9602a4d04905)
Our #1 fan, was right as usual. Probably that Titans game.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 14, 2020, 08:28:57 PM
Our #1 fan, was right as usual. Probably that Titans game.
Yeah, because Jameis Winston turned out to be such a great player...
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 14, 2020, 08:42:48 PM
Yeah, because Jameis Winston turned out to be such a great player...
Adam Gase ruined him. Who went first, him or Mariota? I don't even remember. Was just talking about that game the other day on here. The game, the pick, none of it made any difference to anyone.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 14, 2020, 09:25:10 PM
Adam Gase ruined him. Who went first, him or Mariota? I don't even remember. Was just talking about that game the other day on here. The game, the pick, none of it made any difference to anyone.
Jameis Winston went first.
Both suck but Mariota is worse than Winston.
Post by: Johnny English on December 14, 2020, 09:26:13 PM
Jameis Winston went first.
Both suck but Mariota is worse than Winston.
But Mariota is much easier to root for.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 14, 2020, 09:41:58 PM
But Mariota is much easier to root for.
Of course he is
Post by: mj2sexay on December 15, 2020, 11:18:56 PM
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/544292787324469248
(http://blob:https://pasteboard.co/4c2240db-64aa-48c0-af41-9602a4d04905)
Just let him buy in and cut Woody a check already!
Yeah, because Jameis Winston turned out to be such a great player...
For what its worth, depending on whether or not they had a higher strength of schedule that year they'd have ended up with the 4th or 5th pick.
I'd kill to have a receiver like Cooper on this team and if Scherff hits FA he's going to be a top target this offseason.
In the final analysis, the 2015 draft had a pretty shitty top 10.
Post by: Badger on December 16, 2020, 11:16:17 AM
Gregg Williams
Sergio Castillo, maybe also Ficken
Whoever was covering Ruggs at the end of the Raiders game
Obviously excluding Gase because freak that guy, but maybe Dowell.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 16, 2020, 11:25:04 AM
If we were to create a dedication to Friends of the Tank, who deserves to be featured/mentioned?
Gregg Williams
Sergio Castillo, maybe also Ficken
Whoever was covering Ruggs at the end of the Raiders game
Obviously excluding Gase because freak that guy, but maybe Dowell.
Mosley for opting out
Herndon for getting everyone's hopes up for a breakout, then being useless
Nick Folk for the last second FG to beat us
Chris Johnson for not firing Gase
Post by: MBGreen on December 16, 2020, 11:34:17 AM
If we were to create a dedication to Friends of the Tank, who deserves to be featured/mentioned?
Gregg Williams
Sergio Castillo, maybe also Ficken
Whoever was covering Ruggs at the end of the Raiders game
Obviously excluding Gase because freak that guy, but maybe Dowell.
Mosley for opting out
Herndon for getting everyone's hopes up for a breakout, then being useless
Nick Folk for the last second FG to beat us
Chris Johnson for not firing Gase
none of these guys start the game threads
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2020, 11:38:41 AM
Whoever was covering Ruggs at the end of the Raiders game
Lamar Jackson (ours, not the other one).
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 16, 2020, 11:47:48 AM
Joe Flacco for chucking the deep ball at the end of the Patriots game
Josh Andrews
Post by: Jumbo on December 16, 2020, 01:05:35 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 16, 2020, 01:25:20 PM
https://twitter.com/tim_mcmanus/status/1339266173708406785?s=21
I wonder which example he would put Adam Gase's actions in, because he sure as hell isn't trying to win games.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 16, 2020, 01:32:44 PM
https://twitter.com/tim_mcmanus/status/1339266173708406785?s=21Afuckingmen jesus you douchebags should watch this.
Post by: Jumbo on December 16, 2020, 01:39:21 PM
Post by: Badger on December 16, 2020, 02:11:35 PM
Mosley for opting outI think the key is we want to single out people who aided the tank but aren't a big reason that we are in position to tank. So I'd say no to Chris Johnson.
Herndon for getting everyone's hopes up for a breakout, then being useless
Nick Folk for the last second FG to beat us
Chris Johnson for not firing Gase
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2020, 02:29:07 PM
It's still almost undeniably better from a fan position for the Jets to lose out; I just thought it was interesting to hear that perspective from a longtime NFL vet.
That's the difference between fans and players. If you're a player on an 0-13 team you might be the guy replaced with a high draft pick. Plus, its your job and you're on film, so if you want to keep playing in the league and you're on film dogging it, you have a problem. Players can't worry about draft position or tanking. You think Darnold wants us to be in position to draft Trevor Lawrence?
Post by: loyaljetsfan on December 16, 2020, 06:54:42 PM
Quote
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/30525441/could-clemson-trevor-lawrence-likely-no-1-nfl-draft-pick-spurn-new-york-jets
I would not be surprised in the least, if somehow we didn't get Lawrence with the 1st overall pick.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2020, 07:06:36 PM
I would not be surprised in the least, if somehow we didn't get Lawrence with the 1st overall pick.
The article is pure speculation by agents who have nothing to do with Lawrence. Typical ESPN filler nonsense. Pretty hard to get a better scenario than being the #1 overall pick going to the #1 market in the country. Another year in college won't change anything. Assuming he didn't get hurt or drop off in performance, he'd still be headed to the worst team in football, likely in a less attractive place.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 16, 2020, 09:01:56 PM
Not likely, but not crazy. Hopefully the Jags beat the Bears week 17.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 16, 2020, 10:20:37 PM
Colin Cowherd brought up the idea that the Pats may bench Cam and start Stidham week 17 against the Jets so they can lose without saying they did it on purpose and freak over the Jets. Since the Pats will probably be eliminated by then, it will be written off as Belichick evaluating his younger QB. The Jets could beat the Pats without Cam, even with Belichick coaching to win. Worst case, they beat the Jets and its a win anyway for them.
Not likely, but not crazy. Hopefully the Jags beat the Bears week 17.
Along those same lines, we could start Morgan for the same reasons. But I don't think either will happen by injury.
Belicheck wants to bury this franchise and 0-16 is the best way to do it. If he doesn't get back to winning next year (AKA gets his own QB) I can see him hanging it up at 70. If he can get a QB thats a different story of longevity there. My point is, either way I can't see him being worried more about Lawrence than his own QB situation.
Post by: MBGreen on December 17, 2020, 06:50:32 AM
Colin Cowherd brought up the idea that the Pats may bench Cam and start Stidham week 17 against the Jets so they can lose without saying they did it on purpose and freak over the Jets. Since the Pats will probably be eliminated by then, it will be written off as Belichick evaluating his younger QB. The Jets could beat the Pats without Cam, even with Belichick coaching to win. Worst case, they beat the Jets and its a win anyway for them.
Not likely, but not crazy. Hopefully the Jags beat the Bears week 17.
The Jets will score a FG on their first drive, like every week. And that will be it.
The Pats should win. You think Frank Bush's D will stop anything? They were picking freaking dandelions last Sunday.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 17, 2020, 07:26:49 AM
Post by: MBGreen on December 17, 2020, 07:43:40 AM
I remember looking at our schedule last year when it was released and thinking "I don't see a single win here".....i hated being right.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 17, 2020, 07:44:56 AM
Why does anyone listen to Colin Cowherd?Saw it on twitter in passing.
Post by: ScotlandJet on December 17, 2020, 09:24:37 AM
This season can't end fast enough. I hate it. I've hated it since kickoff in week 1.
I remember looking at our schedule last year when it was released and thinking "I don't see a single win here".....i hated being right.
It's tragic. I love The Jets being in the play off hunt at this time of year it makes all the hullubaloo about the festive period bearable. I'm like you just wanting the season done. The only thing I'm looking forward to is Black Monday.
Post by: MBGreen on December 17, 2020, 10:25:58 AM
It's tragic. I love The Jets being in the play off hunt at this time of year it makes all the hullubaloo about the festive period bearable. I'm like you just wanting the season done. The only thing I'm looking forward to is Black Monday.
Amen brother
Post by: MexJetinBcn on December 18, 2020, 08:20:17 AM
It's tragic. I love The Jets being in the play off hunt at this time of year it makes all the hullubaloo about the festive period bearable. I'm like you just wanting the season done. The only thing I'm looking forward to is Black Monday.
x3
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 18, 2020, 04:38:12 PM
This season has been miserable. All I want are the Jaguars to win (or tie) again so I can root for a win.
I also think next season will be very exciting so I look forward to that.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 18, 2020, 05:05:19 PM
All I want is to watch relevant Jets games. Watching relevant Jets games is one of my favorite things to do which is why I've been posting on Jets message boards since I was freaking 10.We are still gonna suck next year, but at least there will be promise.
This season has been miserable. All I want are the Jaguars to win (or tie) again so I can root for a win.
I also think next season will be very exciting so I look forward to that.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 18, 2020, 05:52:00 PM
We are still gonna suck next year, but at least there will be promise.Probably. But we might not. If Gase is this bad, a new coach and new roster could play relevant games into December. Especially if our QB is the real deal.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 18, 2020, 08:07:46 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 18, 2020, 10:00:42 PM
Probably. But we might not. If Gase is this bad, a new coach and new roster could play relevant games into December. Especially if our QB is the real deal.
Parcells went 9-7 with virtually the same roster Kotite went 1-15 with. We were a few dumb plays from 10-6 and the playoffs.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 18, 2020, 11:43:01 PM
Parcells went 9-7 with virtually the same roster Kotite went 1-15 with. We were a few dumb plays from 10-6 and the playoffs.Yep. 1996-97 is probably the most extreme example but we have done it before.
2005 was one of the uglier years in my life. Next year, playoffs.
2017 was awful, too. Next 3 years, they were a Super Bowl contender.
Until Gase arrived, we had a string of 1st-year coaches leading turnarounds. 2019 draft is a decent bsse. Quinnen and Becton can be top 5 or top 10 next year at important positions. QB play can't get a whole lot worse.
I'm not expecting playoffs but having a young QB is fun if he is promising. It also ensures I won't really be rooting for losses since we will have our franchise QB (hopefully).
Post by: dcm1602 on December 21, 2020, 09:40:03 AM
Post by: Johnny English on December 21, 2020, 09:51:02 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 21, 2020, 09:53:06 AM
https://www.sny.tv/articles/mekhi-becton-has-a-message-for-fans-that-wanted-the-jets-to-lose
The fans that talked excrement to his mom on Twitter are despicable.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 21, 2020, 09:53:09 AM
Either clinching the division or clinching the wildcard and eliminated from the division?
Especially with an older QB and having had a relatively early bye week
Post by: MBGreen on December 21, 2020, 09:54:13 AM
The fans that talked excrement to his mom on Twitter are despicable.
Agreed.
I don't blame the players for wanting to win. Attacking Becton's mom is gross.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 21, 2020, 09:54:40 AM
Anyone know what has to happen this week for the colts to test) rest their starters week 17?
Either clinching the division or clinching the wildcard and eliminated from the division?
They aren’t going to rest their starters.
We need bad Trubisky to come back this weekend.
Post by: MBGreen on December 21, 2020, 09:55:42 AM
They aren’t going to rest their starters.
We need bad Trubisky to come back this weekend.
David Montgomery is on a tear over the last 2 weeks. That's why the Bears are winning, they found their run game.
Post by: insanity on December 21, 2020, 09:57:30 AM
David Montgomery is on a tear over the last 2 weeks. That's why the Bears are winning, they found their run game.Good thing the bears have the leagues worst run defense
Post by: Johnny English on December 21, 2020, 09:58:10 AM
The fans that talked excrement to his mom on Twitter are despicable.
I didn't hear about the but I agree. Also very stupid as you really don't want Mekhi and his dad hunting you down.
Post by: delavan on December 21, 2020, 11:21:00 AM
The fans that talked excrement to his mom on Twitter are despicable.
Sickening. Who even THINKS of that excrement?
Post by: Libero_2 on December 21, 2020, 11:29:42 AM
Sickening. Who even THINKS of that excrement?
Twitter breeds so much hatred
Post by: Badger on December 21, 2020, 09:03:46 PM
https://twitter.com/dpbrugler/status/1341217129673191424?s=19
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 21, 2020, 09:47:09 PM
If the Bengals win we are mathematically guaranteed a top 2 pick
https://twitter.com/dpbrugler/status/1341217129673191424?s=19
So far so good. I can envision a Jags win.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 21, 2020, 10:15:38 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 22, 2020, 08:46:54 AM
Post by: insanity on December 22, 2020, 09:41:32 AM
If you’re not first you’re lastThat doesn't make any sense. There is 2nd, 3rd, 4th...
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 22, 2020, 11:07:08 AM
That doesn't make any sense. There is 2nd, 3rd, 4th...
Hell, you can even be 5th...
Post by: delavan on December 22, 2020, 01:30:52 PM
If you’re not first you’re last
That doesn't make any sense. There is 2nd, 3rd, 4th...
Hell, you can even be 5th...
SFD ftw. If you're not Lawrence, you're abhorrence.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 23, 2020, 08:25:05 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 23, 2020, 08:25:55 PM
Quote
Jaguars head coach Doug Marrone said they would rest Robinson for Wednesday's practice, but it appears the likelihood is that the Jaguars will have their star rookie running back against a surging 7-7 Bears team.
"James, what we are going to do is we are going to rest him [Wednesday], I think, and be cautious with him," Marrone said. "But obviously he has already said he wants to play and feels like he will play. That is him speaking."
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 24, 2020, 08:57:44 AM
Damn y’all really overanalyzed a Ricky Bobby quote
Haha I was gonna say something but just let it go.
Once on TGG I mentioned about the Germans bombing Pearl Harbor and someone corrected me.
Post by: insanity on December 24, 2020, 09:55:32 AM
Damn y’all really overanalyzed a Ricky Bobby quoteDo you not realize our responses are also quotes from the movie?
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 24, 2020, 09:57:13 AM
Damn y’all really overanalyzed a Ricky Bobby quote
No one overanalyzed anything... insanity continued the quote and I finished it.
https://youtu.be/20iio0wLpPA
Post by: Badger on December 24, 2020, 11:07:03 AM
Damn y’all really overanalyzed a Ricky Bobby quoteThey were also quoting the movie.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 24, 2020, 12:50:28 PM
Post by: reuben on December 24, 2020, 02:29:33 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 24, 2020, 02:40:22 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 24, 2020, 02:52:01 PM
Jags are going to win on Sunday and then we're going to beat the Pats. Brace yourselves. 2020 wants one more thrust.
I'm feeling ok about the Jags. They're where we were last week, the players and coaches don't want to lose, just the fans. It's the Bears, not the 85 Bears.
Well I’m dumb
I remembered the main line, forgot the rest of the movie.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 24, 2020, 03:41:29 PM
I also don't think its impossible they beat the Colts. We dont know what that game will mean to the Colts yet. And the Jaguars already beat them once. Division games can be tricky.
Post by: insanity on December 24, 2020, 05:25:20 PM
I'm hoping Jags players are motivated by the Jets winning. They haven't won since week 1. They want to win.There is no scenario where the game means nothing g to the colts
I also don't think its impossible they beat the Colts. We dont know what that game will mean to the Colts yet. And the Jaguars already beat them once. Division games can be tricky.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 24, 2020, 05:27:04 PM
There is no scenario where the game means nothing g to the colts
Which means they could still lose to the Jaguars for the second time this season
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 24, 2020, 07:34:00 PM
Which means they could still lose to the Jaguars for the second time this season
(https://i.imgur.com/rhPWtm6.gif)
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 24, 2020, 07:54:55 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 24, 2020, 07:57:19 PM
My Jaguars fan friend thinks that it is inevitable that the Jags beat the Bears. So there's that
It’s only fair after the bullshit we just pulled
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 24, 2020, 08:01:05 PM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EqDEYfkXYAA6dRe?format=jpg&name=900x900)
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 24, 2020, 09:01:10 PM
All I want for Christmas is for this man to win a game.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EqDEYfkXYAA6dRe?format=jpg&name=900x900)
Looks like he's ready for his shot on Live PD. #FloridaMan
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 24, 2020, 09:30:12 PM
My Jaguars fan friend thinks that it is inevitable that the Jags beat the Bears. So there's that
There's Jaguars fans?
Post by: dcm1602 on December 24, 2020, 09:41:45 PM
There is no scenario where the game means nothing g to the colts
It's impossible for them to either be eliminated or clinched after this week?
Per google how the colts can clinch the playoffs this week
IND win + BAL loss or tie OR
IND win + MIA loss or tie OR
IND tie + BAL loss OR
IND tie + MIA loss
Post by: Badger on December 24, 2020, 10:27:37 PM
It's impossible for them to either be eliminated or clinched after this week?The Colts have the same record as the division-leading Titans. Even if they clinch a berth this week they'll still want the division if it's in reach.
Per google how the colts can clinch the playoffs this week
IND win + BAL loss or tie OR
IND win + MIA loss or tie OR
IND tie + BAL loss OR
IND tie + MIA loss
Post by: dcm1602 on December 25, 2020, 12:04:03 AM
The Colts have the same record as the division-leading Titans. Even if they clinch a berth this week they'll still want the division if it's in reach.
Yeah I haven't done the math on the tiebreaker and whether they can clinch a wildcard while being eliminated from the division
I mean with no fans in the stands, I'd think having a week 17 bye week would be more valuable than having home field wildcard weekend
Post by: Heismanberg on December 25, 2020, 12:08:33 AM
Yeah I haven't done the math
We know.
Post by: Johnny English on December 25, 2020, 12:10:35 AM
There's Jaguars fans?Yeah, I know a bunch of fans of a bunch of teams but the Jags ain't one.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 25, 2020, 01:18:01 AM
Yeah, I know a bunch of fans of a bunch of teams but the Jags ain't one.
They were our tailgate opponent one year, I don't remember any from that game.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 25, 2020, 02:57:20 AM
Post by: insanity on December 25, 2020, 08:38:59 AM
Which means they could still lose to the Jaguars for the second time this seasonCorrect so they won't be resting their starters
Post by: insanity on December 25, 2020, 08:39:26 AM
Looks like he's ready for his shot on Live PD. #FloridaManI was thinking james franco in springbreakers
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2020, 02:38:09 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 27, 2020, 03:29:48 PM
Post by: MBGreen on December 27, 2020, 03:38:33 PM
See you next year, Tank Watch.It was a pleasure tanking with all you diehard Jets fans...you know who you are. *hugs*
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 27, 2020, 03:41:24 PM
It was a pleasure tanking with all you diehard Jets fans...you know who you are. *hugs*I am looking forward to being able to dig deep on playoff scenario generators to come up with ways to get the Jets into the playoffs. I don't like the Jets being this shitty for this long.
To me, the reasons to tank are
- You are eliminated from the playoffs
- You need a quarterback or Trevor Lawrence/Andrew Luck/Peyton Manning is available
This year checked both categories. Also, there's a very big difference in trying to tank for the #1 pick and tanking for the #5 pick.
Post by: Badger on December 27, 2020, 03:42:51 PM
See you next year, Tank Watch.
It was a pleasure tanking with all you diehard Jets fans...you know who you are. *hugs*https://youtu.be/uffHb6JgoiQ
Post by: MBGreen on December 27, 2020, 03:56:44 PM
I am looking forward to being able to dig deep on playoff scenario generators to come up with ways to get the Jets into the playoffs. I don't like the Jets being this shitty for this long.
To me, the reasons to tank are
- You are eliminated from the playoffs
- You need a quarterback or Trevor Lawrence/Andrew Luck/Peyton Manning is available
This year checked both categories. Also, there's a very big difference in trying to tank for the #1 pick and tanking for the #5 pick.
We've always been on the same page with this rationale.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 27, 2020, 03:58:59 PM
We've always been on the same page with this rationale.But even still, this is the first year I actively rooted against the Jets. I was thrilled when the Raiders scored. My heart sank when I saw the flag on the Cam Akers touchdown. There have been other times where losing was for the best, but I didn't get fully behind the tank until this year, just because it was the #1 pick and because of who was available at #1.
Usually, the Jets aren't bad enough to get the #1 pick.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 27, 2020, 04:01:06 PM
https://youtu.be/uffHb6JgoiQ
(https://i.ibb.co/znN2pZT/C14-FD001-9371-49-BC-AEDC-FE0196999-AF1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/98G46Wk)
Post by: MBGreen on December 27, 2020, 04:03:07 PM
But even still, this is the first year I actively rooted against the Jets. I was thrilled when the Raiders scored. My heart sank when I saw the flag on the Cam Akers touchdown. There have been other times where losing was for the best, but I didn't get fully behind the tank until this year, just because it was the #1 pick and because of who was available at #1.
Usually, the Jets aren't bad enough to get the #1 pick.
Again...same page.
I don't want to root for a tank ever again. But if the tank makes more sense for the future well-being of this team (like it did this year), i would.
Post by: Badger on December 27, 2020, 04:05:18 PM
(https://i.ibb.co/znN2pZT/C14-FD001-9371-49-BC-AEDC-FE0196999-AF1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/98G46Wk)Haha ow
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 28, 2020, 09:25:07 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on December 29, 2020, 10:06:06 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 29, 2020, 11:41:30 AM
You guys sound like a bunch of beaten wives pulling up chairs to start a self help group.
By saying it's good we won a couple and let's pile dirt on New England?
Post by: Badger on December 29, 2020, 12:11:09 PM
By saying it's good we won a couple and let's pile dirt on New England?Puck didn't actually read any of the posts he just leaves that general comment in most threads.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 29, 2020, 12:19:29 PM
Puck didn't actually read any of the posts he just leaves that general comment in most threads.
I was just reading the first ten pages or so of this thread, good comedy. Let's go 0-16 so we can get Darnold, anyone who said he might not work out was shouted down, MB wanting to fire Bowles and fix all our problems, Fenwyr was alive, people having faith in Macc. Quality stuff.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 29, 2020, 01:07:58 PM
I was just reading the first ten pages or so of this thread, good comedy. Let's go 0-16 so we can get Darnold, anyone who said he might not work out was shouted down, MB wanting to fire Bowles and fix all our problems, Fenwyr was alive, people having faith in Macc. Quality stuff.Sometimes I love looking back through these old threads.
That said, had we gone 1-15 to get Darnold, we would have been able to keep our 3 2nd-round picks and hopefully built around Darnold. Instead, we won a few games, had to sacrifice significant assets, and it probably helped stunt his and the team's growth.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 29, 2020, 01:33:35 PM
Sometimes I love looking back through these old threads.
That said, had we gone 1-15 to get Darnold, we would have been able to keep our 3 2nd-round picks and hopefully built around Darnold. Instead, we won a few games, had to sacrifice significant assets, and it probably helped stunt his and the team's growth.
Maybe. We didn't know then how historically bad Macc was, and right on the heels of Idzik. Looking back I'm not sure Bowles ever had a chance here, he had the good Fitz year, the bad Fitz year, the tank for a QB and cut cap year, and Darnold's rookie year.
Post by: MBGreen on December 29, 2020, 01:34:15 PM
I was just reading the first ten pages or so of this thread, good comedy. Let's go 0-16 so we can get Darnold, anyone who said he might not work out was shouted down, MB wanting to fire Bowles and fix all our problems, Fenwyr was alive, people having faith in Macc. Quality stuff.Christopher Johnson should let me fire Gase....
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 03, 2021, 06:04:36 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 24, 2021, 03:18:19 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 24, 2021, 03:20:06 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 24, 2021, 03:22:01 PM
Thank god we didn't trade our 2022 1st-round pick to move up for a wide receiver.
Thank god we didn't keep Sam Darnold
Post by: bojanglesman on October 24, 2021, 03:24:11 PM
Thank god we didn't trade our 2022 1st-round pick to move up for a wide receiver.We'll just pick a good player and excrement on him.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 24, 2021, 03:26:47 PM
Thank god we didn't keep Sam DarnoldImagine having a crappy Sam Darnold and having to replace him in this quarterback draft.
Granted, Wilson hasn't done much this season, and now he's hurt, but he's at least flashed. Hopefully, he'll be back sooner rather than later.
That said, maybe this QB class also just sucks
Post by: dcm1602 on October 25, 2021, 01:07:59 AM
Thank god we didn't keep Sam Darnold
Honestly depends on what we could've traded the 2nd overall pick for.
Wilson has a way to go to convince us he's the guy. But some real talented dudes went early on, and I imagine if we traded the 2nd pick to someone else they'd probably look like dogshit and we'd be getting a top 5 pick
Post by: Heismanberg on October 25, 2021, 07:25:05 AM
Honestly depends on what we could've traded the 2nd overall pick for.
No, it doesn’t.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 25, 2021, 09:49:26 AM
Post by: MBGreen on October 25, 2021, 10:24:29 AM
Could have taken Chase/Sewell at 2, taken Mac Jones at 14 and we’d be 7-0 right now
lol....Darnold would never
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 26, 2021, 01:16:37 PM
Quote
https://twitter.com/OptimisticJets/status/1452838706159702017/photo/1
Jets currently own the 4th and 8th overall pick in the 2022 draft.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 15, 2021, 08:14:32 AM
3 and 7 now. woohoo.
Post by: MBGreen on November 15, 2021, 08:47:35 AM
https://twitter.com/OptimisticJets/status/1460043387193679873?t=c28XxhmmHAloANPw84fiHg&s=19
3 and 7 now. woohoo.
7 is a prime spot for some dumbfuck team to trade up to.
#FleeceModeEngaged
Post by: bojanglesman on November 15, 2021, 10:09:40 AM
7 is a prime spot for some dumbfuck team to trade up to.I think I've stopped caring about where we draft. It hasn't helped us despite many years of being near the top. We just draft guys that everyone says belongs there, yet never proves to be the case. I don't even blame the GM, it just happens. Everyone, myself included, thinks our picks are good at the time, yet they just don't work out for the most part. Previous GMs speak for themselves. Douglas' first draft is mostly excrement so far, but there's still time.
#FleeceModeEngaged
We can fleece everyone all day long, but it only matters what we do with the fleece.
Post by: insanity on November 15, 2021, 10:32:55 AM
I think I've stopped caring about where we draft. It hasn't helped us despite many years of being near the top. We just draft guys that everyone says belongs there, yet never proves to be the case. I don't even blame the GM, it just happens. Everyone, myself included, thinks our picks are good at the time, yet they just don't work out for the most part. Previous GMs speak for themselves. Douglas' first draft is mostly excrement so far, but there's still time.But what else do we have to look forward to...
We can fleece everyone all day long, but it only matters what we do with the fleece.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 15, 2021, 10:34:46 AM
Post by: Johnny English on November 15, 2021, 10:42:21 AM
I think I've stopped caring about where we draft. It hasn't helped us despite many years of being near the top. We just draft guys that everyone says belongs there, yet never proves to be the case. I don't even blame the GM, it just happens. Everyone, myself included, thinks our picks are good at the time, yet they just don't work out for the most part. Previous GMs speak for themselves. Douglas' first draft is mostly excrement so far, but there's still time.
We can fleece everyone all day long, but it only matters what we do with the fleece.
I think in part because there seems to be an expectation at times that once you've drafted the player the job is done, and all we have to do is sit back and wait for the player to magically turn into a Pro Bowler. The absolutely miserable coaching that we've had almost without exception for the last decade is why our draft picks rarely pan out - I don't think it's any coincidence that the only time we've been good in that period is the season when the roster was full of veterans who didn't need any help figuring out how to play in the NFL.
I think you're right to not blame the GMs, at least not entirely. It doesn't really matter who you pick if your coaches are incapable of helping the rookie become the man, and you don't have the veterans to assist.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 15, 2021, 10:51:02 AM
I think in part because there seems to be an expectation at times that once you've drafted the player the job is done, and all we have to do is sit back and wait for the player to magically turn into a Pro Bowler. The absolutely miserable coaching that we've had almost without exception for the last decade is why our draft picks rarely pan out - I don't think it's any coincidence that the only time we've been good in that period is the season when the roster was full of veterans who didn't need any help figuring out how to play in the NFL.Makes sense.
I think you're right to not blame the GMs, at least not entirely. It doesn't really matter who you pick if your coaches are incapable of helping the rookie become the man, and you don't have the veterans to assist.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 15, 2021, 10:55:10 AM
But what else do we have to look forward to...(https://c.tenor.com/xqK5tDkZQA0AAAAC/misery-kathy-bates.gif)
Post by: MBGreen on November 15, 2021, 11:00:55 AM
I think I've stopped caring about where we draft. It hasn't helped us despite many years of being near the top. We just draft guys that everyone says belongs there, yet never proves to be the case. I don't even blame the GM, it just happens. Everyone, myself included, thinks our picks are good at the time, yet they just don't work out for the most part. Previous GMs speak for themselves. Douglas' first draft is mostly excrement so far, but there's still time.
We can fleece everyone all day long, but it only matters what we do with the fleece.
#WetBlanketModeEngaged
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 15, 2021, 11:45:41 AM
I think in part because there seems to be an expectation at times that once you've drafted the player the job is done, and all we have to do is sit back and wait for the player to magically turn into a Pro Bowler. The absolutely miserable coaching that we've had almost without exception for the last decade is why our draft picks rarely pan out - I don't think it's any coincidence that the only time we've been good in that period is the season when the roster was full of veterans who didn't need any help figuring out how to play in the NFL.I don't think anyone really has the expectation that all draft picks are going to magically turn into Pro Bowlers. And we know the coaching has been a problem here for a while.
I think you're right to not blame the GMs, at least not entirely. It doesn't really matter who you pick if your coaches are incapable of helping the rookie become the man, and you don't have the veterans to assist.
That said, the one bright spot about this season is that we have a number of rookies playing legitimately well. AVT looks like a star right now. Moore has already been more productive than Mims was last season. Carter's yards per attempt sucks, but he passes the eye test with flying colors. Defensively, we're playing a lot of late picks, and while they haven't always been great, getting multiple starters on Day 3 as rookies is a positive, even if they can't/shouldn't all start long-term.
So does that mean Saleh is good at developing players? Or did we just draft well and bring in good players? Pretty sure it's a combination, but I would lean towards the players themselves over the coaching.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 15, 2021, 11:46:49 AM
So does that mean Saleh is good at developing players? Or did we just draft well and bring in good players? Pretty sure it's a combination, but I would lean towards the players themselves over the coaching.
I think Saleh and his coaching staff were much more involved in the draft process than previous regimes.
Post by: Johnny English on November 15, 2021, 11:56:07 AM
I don't think anyone really has the expectation that all draft picks are going to magically turn into Pro Bowlers. And we know the coaching has been a problem here for a while.
Let me rephrase - there is the assumption that when a player on his rookie contract fails to live up to expectations that it is because the player was actually crap all along, was overdrafted, and the failing is the GM's for taking him in the first place instead of *insert name of player we passed on who subsequently turned out great*.
I'm not aiming this at anyone in particular as I suspect we're all guilty of it at times to a greater or lesser degree, but it would be interesting (but not sufficiently so to make it worth the effort) to compare what people said about a player on draft night, and what they're saying about him three years later when he's playing excrement / on the bubble / getting cut. No one ever says "freak, he was such a good player and we really let him down", it's usually "what the freak was GM Bloggs thinking when he reached for that clown?" or a variation thereof.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 15, 2021, 12:22:15 PM
Let me rephrase - there is the assumption that when a player on his rookie contract fails to live up to expectations that it is because the player was actually crap all along, was overdrafted, and the failing is the GM's for taking him in the first place instead of *insert name of player we passed on who subsequently turned out great*.That's fair. I try to look at the positives on most players we draft. And a lot of guys fail for different reasons. I liked the Jachai Polite pick because he flashed on film and the risk seemed worth it in round 3. I can't know he's that much of a clusterf*ck off the field.
I'm not aiming this at anyone in particular as I suspect we're all guilty of it at times to a greater or lesser degree, but it would be interesting (but not sufficiently so to make it worth the effort) to compare what people said about a player on draft night, and what they're saying about him three years later when he's playing excrement / on the bubble / getting cut. No one ever says "freak, he was such a good player and we really let him down", it's usually "what the freak was GM Bloggs thinking when he reached for that clown?" or a variation thereof.
And part of the problem with our recent drafts was the Darnold trade. That gutted our drafts in 2018 and 2019. We can joke about how bad our 2nd-round pick history is, but not having a 2nd-round pick in back-to-back years in a rebuild was a big problem.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 15, 2021, 01:12:48 PM
That's fair. I try to look at the positives on most players we draft. And a lot of guys fail for different reasons. I liked the Jachai Polite pick because he flashed on film and the risk seemed worth it in round 3. I can't know he's that much of a clusterf*ck off the field.
And part of the problem with our recent drafts was the Darnold trade. That gutted our drafts in 2018 and 2019. We can joke about how bad our 2nd-round pick history is, but not having a 2nd-round pick in back-to-back years in a rebuild was a big problem.
And that's a perfect example.
Everyone on this board, every single poster, was of the mindset that "We're not getting Darnold, so it's down to whoever is the #2 for us." I don't want to scroll through posts, and someone can correct me with theirs if I'm wrong, but no one was unhappy with getting Darnold and everyone thought we got the best QB in the draft.
Was Darnold destined to fail? Or was he failed by an organization that routinely makes a habit of wrecking QBs?
Post by: Heismanberg on November 15, 2021, 01:14:17 PM
Was Darnold destined to fail? Or was he failed by an organization that routinely makes a habit of wrecking QBs?
Have you not seen him play for Carolina?
Post by: MBGreen on November 15, 2021, 01:15:08 PM
And that's a perfect example.
Everyone on this board, every single poster, was of the mindset that "We're not getting Darnold, so it's down to whoever is the #2 for us." I don't want to scroll through posts, and someone can correct me with theirs if I'm wrong, but no one was unhappy with getting Darnold and everyone thought we got the best QB in the draft.
Was Darnold destined to fail? Or was he failed by an organization that routinely makes a habit of wrecking QBs?
Given how Darnold fared in Carolina....it was his destiny to crash and burn. He flashed at times, but he makes god awful decisions with the football. And as much as i want to lay that on the feet of the coaching staff, he was like this at USC as well.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 15, 2021, 01:20:23 PM
Darnold was flawed in college. I thought he was overrated as a college player in his final season. I still liked him as an NFL prospect, and I was thrilled to draft him because I figured with his age and positive traits, he had a chance to be really good. But it didn't work out.
Also, we talk about a routine habit of wrecking quarterbacks. We've spent three 1st-round picks on quarterbacks in the last 25 years. Chad Pennington was good, and his issues were more injuries. Sanchez and Darnold busted. Hackenberg was a terrible prospect, and I don't even count him. Geno was an OK prospect, and you can argue he didn't get a full chance here because he got punched in the face by IK. His best games were at the end of his 2nd season, and then he never really played again. Did we wreck him? I don't really think so.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 15, 2021, 01:23:31 PM
Have you not seen him play for Carolina?
I don't understand this line of thought.
A ruined QB doesn't mean he was destined to be so.
It's an impossible argument from either side because you only have the result to compare, but I believe coaching and supporting cast makes or breaks a young QB. Sam's broken, but I don't believe he was destined to be.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 15, 2021, 01:32:52 PM
I don't understand this line of thought.I don't think he was necessarily destined to be broken (and he's still only 24, so maybe he resurfaces somewhere in a couple years).
A ruined QB doesn't mean he was destined to be so.
It's an impossible argument from either side because you only have the result to compare, but I believe coaching and supporting cast makes or breaks a young QB. Sam's broken, but I don't believe he was destined to be.
Coaching matters greatly, but some players are good enough to overcome that. On the flip side, a Sean McVay can only take a Jared Goff so far.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 15, 2021, 01:37:51 PM
I don't understand this line of thought.
You guys argued all offseason to take a tackle or receiver and build around Sam Darnold.
We traded Darnold to a team with one of the most sought after offensive minds in the football world at OC and a loaded supported cast. He still stinks.
That's my line of thinking. He wasn't good. We hoped that he would be, but he wasn't.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 15, 2021, 01:44:58 PM
Had we traded down, we would likely have read Deshaun Watson rumors for the last several months.
Post by: Badger on November 15, 2021, 02:21:04 PM
http://www.tankathon.com/nfl/power_rankings
Post by: Andrew Ryan on November 15, 2021, 02:36:29 PM
Post by: Andrew Ryan on November 15, 2021, 02:52:49 PM
Still crying about the 6th rounder we traded for Flacco
http://www.tankathon.com/nfl/power_rankings
We currently have almost 28x the draft capital of the Rams.
Post by: reuben on November 15, 2021, 03:02:17 PM
We currently have almost 28x the draft capital of the Rams.
And yet they still somehow have eight picks.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 15, 2021, 06:35:16 PM
And yet they still somehow have eight picks.
And we sure as hell wish we could trade places with them every day of the year but draft day
Post by: Andrew Ryan on November 15, 2021, 06:42:48 PM
And we sure as hell wish we could trade places with them every day of the year but draft day
If they win the Super Bowl this year, sure. If not, we should revisit this in a year or two.
Post by: delavan on November 15, 2021, 09:33:55 PM
Turn heel for Evan NealThat's the deal, now make it real
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 15, 2021, 09:38:41 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 16, 2021, 07:02:17 AM
Halibut is a fine meal, you can eat it while listening to Seal.
the face of Seal is real, because he slipped on an orange peel.
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 16, 2021, 07:11:02 AM
the face of Seal is real, because he slipped on an orange peel.
I admire the zeal with which you "Yes, and!" this spiel.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 21, 2021, 03:11:33 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 21, 2021, 03:12:06 PM
#2 and #7Man it would be something if we could back up the 2021 draft with another great class.
Post by: MBGreen on November 21, 2021, 03:12:51 PM
Man it would be something if we could back up the 2021 draft with another great class.We will
Post by: Andrew Ryan on November 21, 2021, 03:16:06 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 21, 2021, 06:20:58 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 21, 2021, 06:21:44 PM
5 picks, 5 gordsWe got a Tard instead
Post by: bojanglesman on November 21, 2021, 06:26:29 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 21, 2021, 06:29:34 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 21, 2021, 06:53:50 PM
Jets are gonna have 2 top 5 picks ehNa, the Seahawks will win a few meaningless games.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 21, 2021, 06:56:05 PM
Na, the Seahawks will win a few meaningless games.
Who knows what’s going to happen. Still a shot the Seahawks actually pick higher than us. 2 top 5 picks would be amazing to restock this roster. Use 1 and trade the other for a bounty. Still have 2 top 15 picks and more to work with
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 22, 2021, 12:53:38 AM
Who knows what’s going to happen. Still a shot the Seahawks actually pick higher than us. 2 top 5 picks would be amazing to restock this roster. Use 1 and trade the other for a bounty. Still have 2 top 15 picks and more to work withI will never criticize trading down because it's almost always the +EV move. But any trade bounty I would hope is primarily in the 2022 draft. We need to start improving ASAP. I'm sick of being a laughingstock every damn year, and we have to build around Wilson for a run in 2023-24.
Post by: Libero_2 on November 22, 2021, 05:59:28 AM
I will never criticize trading down because it's almost always the +EV move. But any trade bounty I would hope is primarily in the 2022 draft. We need to start improving ASAP. I'm sick of being a laughingstock every damn year, and we have to build around Wilson for a run in 2023-24.
My ideal haul would drop us down 4-5 slots for a 2 this year and at least a 2 next draft.
Imagine our choice of pass rushers at 2, and trading pass rusher #2 away at 5 to get the 11th pick, 44th picks this year and a top 60 pick next year? We would have tons of good options at 11, from top playmakers to lineman to a strong secondary player, and the much less desirable (at this point) trade down again option.
Then again top pass rusher at 5 and elite #1 WR prospect at 5 is not a bad outcome either. Its quite possibly more exciting
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 22, 2021, 11:54:48 AM
My ideal haul would drop us down 4-5 slots for a 2 this year and at least a 2 next draft.The other good thing about trades and accumulating picks is that it allows you to trade for veterans and still have enough picks to build for the long haul. I hate the Flacco trade, but when you have as many picks as we have, you can afford to give up a 6th-rounder. We could also trade picks for a veteran to help us at [insert position of need].
Imagine our choice of pass rushers at 2, and trading pass rusher #2 away at 5 to get the 11th pick, 44th picks this year and a top 60 pick next year? We would have tons of good options at 11, from top playmakers to lineman to a strong secondary player, and the much less desirable (at this point) trade down again option.
Then again top pass rusher at 5 and elite #1 WR prospect at 5 is not a bad outcome either. Its quite possibly more exciting
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 28, 2021, 03:22:09 PM
4th and 5th pick right now.
Jags and Texans play each other once, which is nice. We also play Jacksonville, so if we lose that game, the No. 2 pick is still in play.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 28, 2021, 03:29:02 PM
Post by: Badger on November 28, 2021, 03:32:11 PM
Losing to JAX would suck TBH, I’d rather win that one, even if we end up picking 5th and not 2ndYeah, their fans have been kind of annoying on the internet.
Post by: reuben on November 28, 2021, 03:58:14 PM
Post by: Badger on November 28, 2021, 04:09:56 PM
A WFT win would be so huge.That would be the final nail to make Seattle check out of the season I think.
Post by: MBGreen on November 28, 2021, 04:16:11 PM
That would be the final nail to make Seattle check out of the season I think.I think Russ Wilson has already mentally packed his bags.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 28, 2021, 04:18:53 PM
I think Russ Wilson has already mentally packed his bags.Not before making a documentary about his struggle with the decision that shows how hard he worked and prayed for guidance while working out his finger.
Post by: MBGreen on November 28, 2021, 04:19:52 PM
Not before making a documentary about his struggle with the decision that shows how hard he worked and prayed for guidance while working out his finger.If there's Ciara nudity...ill give it a chance
Post by: reuben on November 28, 2021, 04:21:11 PM
With that said, the Jamal Adams schadenfreude the next couple of seasons is going to be juuuuust *MUAH*
Post by: bojanglesman on November 28, 2021, 04:26:07 PM
I normally don't hold grudges against players for doing what they need to do to get their money: labor all the way, baby.Yep. freak him.
With that said, the Jamal Adams schadenfreude the next couple of seasons is going to be juuuuust *MUAH*
Post by: bojanglesman on November 28, 2021, 04:26:18 PM
If there's Ciara nudity...ill give it a chanceYou have my attention.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 28, 2021, 04:53:35 PM
This would be hilarious, and they would have to move the draft back to Radio City.
Post by: Badger on November 28, 2021, 05:15:07 PM
I think Russ Wilson has already mentally packed his bags.I think he's still gonna give it 100% when he's on the field. But if we can get Pete Carroll to check out then the whole team is just gonna coast til the end.
Post by: Badger on November 28, 2021, 05:17:46 PM
I normally don't hold grudges against players for doing what they need to do to get their money: labor all the way, baby.Seattle finishing with a worse record than us this year would be gravy.
With that said, the Jamal Adams schadenfreude the next couple of seasons is going to be juuuuust *MUAH*
Post by: delavan on November 28, 2021, 07:47:07 PM
That would be the final nail to make Seattle check out of the season I think.Chase Young playing would've been nice.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 12, 2021, 03:43:09 PM
Post by: casman02 on December 12, 2021, 06:22:13 PM
Post by: reuben on December 12, 2021, 06:22:52 PM
4th and 7th right now. Jags and Texans play each other next week.
These schmucks are gonna tie. 0-0
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 19, 2021, 03:17:10 PM
Lose to Jacksonville, and Hutch or Thibodeaux is likely ours...
Post by: Libero_2 on December 19, 2021, 03:23:03 PM
Next week is the tank Super Bowl.
Lose to Jacksonville, and Hutch or Thibodeaux is likely ours...
How so? Wouldn’t we be “behind” Houston in draft order for head 2 head?
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 19, 2021, 03:23:31 PM
Next week is the tank Super Bowl.
Lose to Jacksonville, and Hutch or Thibodeaux is likely ours...
This is what we live for...
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 19, 2021, 03:24:46 PM
How so? Wouldn’t we be “behind” Houston in draft order for head 2 head?
I'm pretty sure head to head results aren't taken into consideration when determining the draft order. It's all about strength of schedule.
Post by: d sw0rdz on December 19, 2021, 03:25:36 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 19, 2021, 03:25:48 PM
How so? Wouldn’t we be “behind” Houston in draft order for head 2 head?Easier SOS gets higher pick, not head-to-head.
You're right though, we are technically behind Houston now.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 19, 2021, 03:30:30 PM
Easier SOS gets higher pick, not head-to-head.
You're right though, we are technically behind Houston now.
Looking at both our remaining schedules, we should "overtake" them in SOS, I would think.
Post by: reuben on December 19, 2021, 04:03:26 PM
Razor-thin margins in SOS. Detroit's doesn't matter because of the tie. Glad NYG and Chicago's are nice and high.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 19, 2021, 04:14:01 PM
That’s…. So depressing
Post by: Badger on December 19, 2021, 04:37:52 PM
a hypothetical loss to a meyer-less, resurgent jacksonville under a new coach isn't as bad of a thought as it was a week agoIt's still pretty bad an I'd rather see the win.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 19, 2021, 05:29:10 PM
I took a nap instead of stream today's game. I feel like I made the right call here.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 19, 2021, 05:46:43 PM
I'm done watching us lose this season, unfortunately that probably means that I'm done watching us this season.1st half was fun. Echols' pick six was the most exciting play the Jets have had in weeks. Wasn't all bad.
I took a nap instead of stream today's game. I feel like I made the right call here.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 19, 2021, 05:48:03 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 19, 2021, 05:50:10 PM
I was elated to see that Wilson didn't throw any INTs in two straight games.No touchdown passes either though...
He's now failed to throw a touchdown pass in 7 of his 10 games this season. He did run for a score in 2 of those 7 games, including today
Post by: Heismanberg on December 19, 2021, 05:52:24 PM
No touchdown passes either though...
He's now failed to throw a touchdown pass in 7 of his 10 games this season. He did run for a score in 2 of those 7 games, including today
LaFleur would rather hand it off to Berrios because his family was at the game
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 19, 2021, 05:55:27 PM
LaFleur would rather hand it off to Berrios because his family was at the gameThat was basically Miami's offensive game plan today. Give it to Duke in front of his fans. And we have no run defense, so it works.
Post by: Laxin on December 19, 2021, 11:02:32 PM
If we lose to the Jaguars am I right in understanding that the #1 pick is actually in play? Obviously Detroit has to win another game, but considering they just smoked the NFC leading 10-3 Cardinals that seems possible.
That’s…. So depressing
Lions could beat the Falcons. Next week has big draft implications… sad it comes to this every year
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 19, 2021, 11:44:12 PM
But next week, I would rather lose 35-31 with Zach playing well than win 9-6 with Zach playing badly/being unproductive. We will almost certainly lose to Tampa Bay and Buffalo, so next week is the swing game between getting an edge rusher we want, and being in a mini-no-man's land. Obviously, a lot can change between now and draft day, but it seems Hutchinson and Thibodeaux are a notch above everyone else.
I don't want this to be Quinnen vs Bosa part 2.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 19, 2021, 11:52:39 PM
https://www.thejetoffensive.com/index.php/topic,3781.480.html
Very costly win. No Bosa for us.
Bosa really isn’t that much better than Polite, Allen, and Ferrell.
We’ll be in a better position to land a WR or an OT now.
Duff will draft DT lol
We have a franchise quarterback, $100 million in cap space, and what's looking like a top-3 pick in the draft. Anyone who can still find something to complain about deserves to be sterilized quickly.
Post by: Badger on December 20, 2021, 06:08:37 AM
The most important thing is Zach Wilson and our young players playing well and gaining confidence. That's why it's hard for me root for a tank in Year 1 of a new regime and a rookie QB and an extremely young team. Last year it was easy with Gase.An ugly win is still a win for Saleh's sake. Zach isn't the only one who needs to build up some success.
But next week, I would rather lose 35-31 with Zach playing well than win 9-6 with Zach playing badly/being unproductive. We will almost certainly lose to Tampa Bay and Buffalo, so next week is the swing game between getting an edge rusher we want, and being in a mini-no-man's land. Obviously, a lot can change between now and draft day, but it seems Hutchinson and Thibodeaux are a notch above everyone else.
I don't want this to be Quinnen vs Bosa part 2.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 20, 2021, 07:16:36 AM
It's still pretty bad an I'd rather see the win.
Considering the outcome of last year I'd rather have the loss.
Get us a freaking transformational player at the top of the draft.
I'm sick of three freaking consolation prizes.
Post by: Badger on December 20, 2021, 08:10:59 AM
Considering the outcome of last year I'd rather have the loss.You may have a point in theory but last year isn't the best example considering Lawrence isn't doing meaningfully better than Wilson so far.
Get us a freaking transformational player at the top of the draft.
I'm sick of three freaking consolation prizes.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2021, 08:21:46 AM
You may have a point in theory but last year isn't the best example considering Lawrence isn't doing meaningfully better than Wilson so far.
One passing TD in the last 7 games.
Post by: Badger on December 20, 2021, 08:25:34 AM
Post by: MBGreen on December 20, 2021, 09:04:46 AM
Repeating myself for the nth time but last year I could tolerate the pro-tank sentiment because Gase/Darnold were lame ducks. Now that the teardown phase is complete, all wins are constructive.Hutch or Thibs in green/white next year...along with a healthy Carl Lawson.
I'm leaning towards the tank.As long as Wilson continues to improve.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 09:15:16 AM
Hutch or Thibs in green/white next year...along with a healthy Carl Lawson.
I'm leaning towards the tank.As long as Wilson continues to improve.
Repeating myself for the Nth time: we need to bring in more than one pass rusher this offseason. We can't trust Lawson's durability and Huff isn't anything more than a rotational guy right now.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 20, 2021, 09:25:59 AM
Repeating myself for the Nth time: we need to bring in more than one pass rusher this offseason. We can't trust Lawson's durability and Huff isn't anything more than a rotational guy right now.
I think that if we are able to get Hutchinson or Thibs we need a guy to take Vinny Curry’s role that he never actually got to play. That’s the missing piece when we have a healthy Lawson back.
Thibs/Hutch
JFM
Q
Lawson
Curry role
Marshall
Shepard (or replacement as his deal is up)
Huff
That’s a pretty damn good DL with some pretty solid Depth. Also doesn’t include guys like Kyle Philips who has proven he can certainly play as well.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 20, 2021, 09:35:29 AM
Post by: insanity on December 20, 2021, 09:47:44 AM
You may have a point in theory but last year isn't the best example considering Lawrence isn't doing meaningfully better than Wilson so far.I mean even in the quinnen draft, boss is great, but he's always injured. Did we really get that less of an impact player?
Post by: MBGreen on December 20, 2021, 09:54:58 AM
Repeating myself for the Nth time: we need to bring in more than one pass rusher this offseason. We can't trust Lawson's durability and Huff isn't anything more than a rotational guy right now.
what are you saying...activate Operation Horsefly? Just say the word, homie.
Post by: MBGreen on December 20, 2021, 10:01:30 AM
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 10:06:02 AM
what are you saying...activate Operation Horsefly? Just say the word, homie.
Can we activate it in opposing teams' OLine meetings?
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 10:11:33 AM
JFM is being paid like a pass rusher too. So im not sure where Cato is getting the idea we're shorthanded there going into next season. Once the D gets shored up in the offseason, i think the pass rushing depth will be apparent.
Mostly the times where we've needed the DLine to step up and instead the entire roster has completely disappeared.
Post by: MBGreen on December 20, 2021, 10:11:43 AM
Can we activate it in opposing teams' OLine meetings?
I will check the java code....should be doable.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2021, 10:13:53 AM
I think that if we are able to get Hutchinson or Thibs we need a guy to take Vinny Curry’s role that he never actually got to play. That’s the missing piece when we have a healthy Lawson back.
Thibs/Hutch
JFM
Q
Lawson
Curry role
Marshall
Shepard (or replacement as his deal is up)
Huff
That’s a pretty damn good DL with some pretty solid Depth. Also doesn’t include guys like Kyle Philips who has proven he can certainly play as well.
Shepherd is a goner because he's garbage, and I imagine they cut Rankins and Lawson as they would save $14.5M and only eat $750K in dead money. You didn't mention Fatukasi, presumably because he's FA, but he has been a starter when healthy so I imagine they'd like to keep him.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 10:16:18 AM
Shepherd is a goner because he's garbage, and I imagine they cut Rankins and Lawson as they would save $14.5M and only eat $750K in dead money. You didn't mention Fatukasi, presumably because he's FA, but he has been a starter when healthy so I imagine they'd like to keep him.
OK, I'm just going to ask, are you expecting the team to cut Carl or Shaq?
Because I'm assuming Libero was referencing having Carl there.
Post by: MBGreen on December 20, 2021, 10:17:25 AM
Mostly the times where we've needed the DLine to step up and instead the entire roster has completely disappeared.
i just think the D as a whole is so devoid of talent and experience...that the D line can't perform up to expectation.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2021, 10:19:46 AM
OK, I'm just going to ask, are you expecting the team to cut Carl or Shaq?
Because I'm assuming Libero was referencing having Carl there.
Yes, I was talking about the excrement one.
Cutting Carl would cost us $15.66M in dead money. Cutting Shaq saves us $9M with no dead money.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 10:20:06 AM
i just think the D as a whole is so devoid of talent and experience...that the D line can't perform up to expectation.
...which is why I am advocating adding more talent, especially when we have one projected starter and one projected backup coming off of serious injuries.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 10:21:20 AM
Yes, I was talking about the excrement one.
Cutting Carl would cost us $15.66M in dead money. Cutting Shaq saves us $9M with no dead money.
OK so referencing players not listed. Sorry, I was confused by having two players at the same spot with the same last name.
Post by: MBGreen on December 20, 2021, 10:22:29 AM
...which is why I am advocating adding more talent, especially when we have one projected starter and one projected backup coming off of serious injuries.
which is why i'm on board for the Hutch/Thibs tank.
If we somehow fall out of contention for them....i have no issue with adding to the Dline. But i'd probably make the LB corp a higher priority.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2021, 10:23:02 AM
OK so referencing players not listed. Sorry, I was confused by having two players at the same spot with the same last name.
Yeah, I was referring to Libero's suggestion that we have a lot of depth when I think in fact we will cut most of it (for a net loss of very little value on the field, and significant savings).
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2021, 11:20:59 AM
I mean even in the quinnen draft, boss is great, but he's always injured. Did we really get that less of an impact player?Nick Bosa has 15 sacks this sesson. Quinnen has 15.5 in his career.
Yes, we did get a significantly less impactful player.
Now obviously, sometimes you can get lucky, too, and the guy who goes earlier is less good. Maybe Karlaftis is a better pro than Hutch or Thibodeaux. Odds are against it though.
Post by: insanity on December 20, 2021, 11:32:35 AM
Nick Bosa has 15 sacks this sesson. Quinnen has 15.5 in his career.Jesus christ. Didn't realize how well he has been playing this year
Yes, we did get a significantly less impactful player.
Now obviously, sometimes you can get lucky, too, and the guy who goes earlier is less good. Maybe Karlaftis is a better pro than Hutch or Thibodeaux. Odds are against it though.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 20, 2021, 11:35:12 AM
Was looking to see if there were any egregious takes on Quinnen/Bosa and tanking in 2019 (the last time we would have been tanking for a pass rusher). Some fun posts.
https://www.thejetoffensive.com/index.php/topic,3781.480.html
Forgive me, but I don't find my take to be that egregious.
Q is a great player and I'm happy to have him, but it's not even close as to whether or not I'd rather have him or Bosa. That win meant nothing in the long run.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2021, 11:52:13 AM
Forgive me, but I don't find my take to be that egregious.Never said it was egregious. Was just quoting posts I found interesting. I agree with you. Most of us were rooting for wins, but it's not like those wins helped in any way.
Q is a great player and I'm happy to have him, but it's not even close as to whether or not I'd rather have him or Bosa. That win meant nothing in the long run.
The goal is that we win and Zach plays well and we can build something into next year. But losing might be better in the long run if there is a big enough gap between Hutch/Thibodeaux and everyone else. Maybe there is, maybe there isn't.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 20, 2021, 11:59:39 AM
Never said it was egregious. Was just quoting posts I found interesting. I agree with you. Most of us were rooting for wins, but it's not like those wins helped in any way.
The goal is that we win and Zach plays well and we can build something into next year. But losing might be better in the long run if there is a big enough gap between Hutch/Thibodeaux and everyone else. Maybe there is, maybe there isn't.
I've been in the camp of "you tank for a quarterback and if you have a young quarterback you try to rack as many wins as you can no matter the draft implications because establishing culture is more important" but I look at Aiden Hutchinson specifically and think "alright, what's three more L's."
Post by: Miamipuck on December 20, 2021, 12:01:46 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 12:03:28 PM
I just really don't want to see him getting smashed into the ground or developing any Sanchez-like, post-contact tendencies.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2021, 12:08:51 PM
I've been in the camp of "you tank for a quarterback and if you have a young quarterback you try to rack as many wins as you can no matter the draft implications because establishing culture is more important" but I look at Aiden Hutchinson specifically and think "alright, what's three more L's."Yep. I never considered tanking until now. Jumped off my damn couch for the Echols pick-six yesterday since I wanted a win.
But this game might be the one exception. Jacksonville is literally one of our prime competitors for this pick, and based on what I've read and heard early on, there's a big gap between Hutch/Thibs and everyone else. And we are so unlikely to beat Tampa Bay or Buffalo in the next 2 weeks (and if we do, hey, we beat Tom Brady or we finally beat a division team, so it's a win-win).
Someone brought up the comparison to the Quinnen/Bosa draft, and while Quinnen is a solid player, he has not been worth the #3 pick in the draft. That was a 1-man draft for us (Bosa) with a QB who snuck into the top pick, and we had the pick right after the 1 man went. I don't want to be in that scenario again this year. I was begging the Jets to trade down from the Quinnen pick, but we didn't and we probably couldn't have because there was nobody to really trade up for. That might be the case again this year.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2021, 12:19:23 PM
I've been in the camp of "you tank for a quarterback and if you have a young quarterback you try to rack as many wins as you can no matter the draft implications because establishing culture is more important" but I look at Aiden Hutchinson specifically and think "alright, what's three more L's."
Beating Buffalo in week 18 to keep them out of the postseason would be the absolute freaking best.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on December 20, 2021, 12:20:16 PM
Yep. I never considered tanking until now. Jumped off my damn couch for the Echols pick-six yesterday since I wanted a win.
But this game might be the one exception. Jacksonville is literally one of our prime competitors for this pick, and based on what I've read and heard early on, there's a big gap between Hutch/Thibs and everyone else. And we are so unlikely to beat Tampa Bay or Buffalo in the next 2 weeks (and if we do, hey, we beat Tom Brady or we finally beat a division team, so it's a win-win).
Someone brought up the comparison to the Quinnen/Bosa draft, and while Quinnen is a solid player, he has not been worth the #3 pick in the draft. That was a 1-man draft for us (Bosa) with a QB who snuck into the top pick, and we had the pick right after the 1 man went. I don't want to be in that scenario again this year. I was begging the Jets to trade down from the Quinnen pick, but we didn't and we probably couldn't have because there was nobody to really trade up for. That might be the case again this year.
That right there, is exactly where I'm at.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2021, 12:24:58 PM
Someone brought up the comparison to the Quinnen/Bosa draft, and while Quinnen is a solid player, he has not been worth the #3 pick in the draft. That was a 1-man draft for us (Bosa) with a QB who snuck into the top pick, and we had the pick right after the 1 man went. I don't want to be in that scenario again this year. I was begging the Jets to trade down from the Quinnen pick, but we didn't and we probably couldn't have because there was nobody to really trade up for. That might be the case again this year.
That's the key thing though, isn't it? Much as we like to blame Maccagnan for everything from hiring Adam Gase to the failure of the Middle East peace process and all drafts in between, there was literally no other option but to take Q. About the only players we might have been better off taking on day 1 are Devin Bush and Ed Oliver, and both of them would have been pilloried as being huge reaches. 2019 was quite a mediocre class.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 20, 2021, 12:31:50 PM
Post by: insanity on December 20, 2021, 12:39:52 PM
That right there, is exactly where I'm at.I hate these kind of statements.
Please tell me who in the first round was worthy of the #3 pick in that draft.
Don't worry I'll wait...
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 12:49:28 PM
I hate these kind of statements.
Please tell me who in the first round was worthy of the #3 pick in that draft.
Don't worry I'll wait...
Basically anyone in the top 5-7 who didn't go 1 or 2, in hindsight.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2021, 01:18:05 PM
That's the key thing though, isn't it? Much as we like to blame Maccagnan for everything from hiring Adam Gase to the failure of the Middle East peace process and all drafts in between, there was literally no other option but to take Q. About the only players we might have been better off taking on day 1 are Devin Bush and Ed Oliver, and both of them would have been pilloried as being huge reaches. 2019 was quite a mediocre class.I'm not saying Quinnen was a bad pick. He was the best player on the board that year with the #3 pick. I really wish we had traded down, but we probably wouldn't have gotten an amazing haul (or maybe he didn't even try, nobody knows).
The point is that if the gap between Thibs/Hutch and the next edge guys is as big as the gap was in retrospect between Bosa and Quinnen, we are probably better off losing this game. It's impossible to know that since the draft is a bit of a crapshoot, but most people seem to think that is the most likely scenario.
This team has no difference-makers on either side of the ball right now. I am worried that our draft picks will fall in a range where the elite prospects at premium positions are gone.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2021, 01:28:52 PM
The point is that if the gap between Thibs/Hutch and the next edge guys is as big as the gap was in retrospect between Bosa and Quinnen, we are probably better off losing this game. It's impossible to know that since the draft is a bit of a crapshoot, but most people seem to think that is the most likely scenario.
I would have more sympathy with this view if EDGE was the only position at which we had a need, but there are multiple players who would be an immediate and obvious upgrade at other positions, and value for the pick at #3. So I don't buy the comparison with 2019.
Post by: Badger on December 20, 2021, 01:39:01 PM
OK so referencing players not listed. Sorry, I was confused by having two players at the same spot with the same last name.
We're all fucked up with similar names on the roster. The Lawsons, Q bros, the Elijahs, the Michael Carters, triple Davis, two Connors, twice the Bryce...
Thank Allah for Hamsah Nasirildeen who will never be confused with anyone else.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 01:47:16 PM
We're all fucked up with similar names on the roster. The Lawsons, Q bros, the Elijahs, the Michael Carters, triple Davis, two Connors, twice the Bryce...
Thank Allah for Hamsah Nasirildeen who will never be confused with anyone else.
I used to play bass guitar in Twice the Bryce in the early 2010s.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on December 20, 2021, 02:16:14 PM
I hate these kind of statements.
Please tell me who in the first round was worthy of the #3 pick in that draft.
Don't worry I'll wait...
I am not making an argument that we should have drafted someone else. All I am saying is that Q has been a good player, but you expect a 3rd overall pick to be a franchise changer...that he is not.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2021, 02:27:51 PM
I would have more sympathy with this view if EDGE was the only position at which we had a need, but there are multiple players who would be an immediate and obvious upgrade at other positions, and value for the pick at #3. So I don't buy the comparison with 2019.EDGE certainly isn't the only position we have a need, but virtually every mock I've seen has Hutch and Thibodeaux as 1-2 in some order.
Outside of QB, EDGE might be the 2nd-most important position on a team behind QB. At worst, it is top 4. And on our defense, it is vitally important.
So if those 2 are gone, we're either taking an elite prospect at a less important position (Hamilton, Stingley) or we're taking a non-can't-miss prospect at a premium position (the 2nd-tier edges, or the top OT or WR).
Granted, I haven't dug into the draft that much yet, and it's so early in the process where I could be wrong. But as of now, there is a huge gap in the impact they would make on the Jets between Hutch/Thibs and the next-best options.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2021, 02:28:58 PM
I am not making an argument that we should have drafted someone else. All I am saying is that Q has been a good player, but you expect a 3rd overall pick to be a franchise changer...that he is not.And I am worried that if we end up taking a 2nd-tier edge at 4 or 7, we get a very good edge, but not a true difference maker that this team sorely needs. That's where the Quinnen-Bosa comparison comes in for me. I'm not arguing we should have taken someone else. I wish we had traded down, but who knows if that was an option.
Post by: insanity on December 20, 2021, 02:56:31 PM
I am not making an argument that we should have drafted someone else. All I am saying is that Q has been a good player, but you expect a 3rd overall pick to be a franchise changer...that he is not.Why should a 3rd overall defensive tackle be a franchise changing player? Where does this expectation come from? It is absolute bullshit.
We established that no other player in the first round was more worthy to be taken at 3. So maybe the problem isn't the players, but our ridiculous expectations...
Post by: insanity on December 20, 2021, 03:04:20 PM
2019
- Kyler
- Bosa
- Quinnen
- Ferrell
- Devin White
2018
- Baker
- Saquon
- Darnold
- Denzel Ward
- Bradley Chubb
2017
- Myles Garrett
- Mitchell Trubisky
- Solomon Thoomas
- Leonard Fournette
- Corey Davis
People's expectations are the problem, not the the gm, the coaches, and the players.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 20, 2021, 03:05:09 PM
Post by: insanity on December 20, 2021, 03:09:18 PM
Not all 3rd overall picks are created equally. Some years that will get you a franchise altering player, some years it will not.Correct. That doesn't mean it was a bad pick, it's just the luck of the draw.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 03:23:43 PM
If the gulf between these two and the rest of the top five is that wide in terms of talent level and impact to the team then why not be more aggressive in changing the roster?
Or are we just all discussing the lack of pass rushers here in a vacuum without considering what the available WR and CB talent could do for the team?
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2021, 04:06:19 PM
If Thibodeaux or Hutchinson are franchise changing players then I'm not opposed to using some of the extra draft picks to try and move up to the #2 or 3 spots to try and get one of them.An edge rusher in the top 5 is a much more valuable use of that pick than a cornerback. Not even close.
If the gulf between these two and the rest of the top five is that wide in terms of talent level and impact to the team then why not be more aggressive in changing the roster?
Or are we just all discussing the lack of pass rushers here in a vacuum without considering what the available WR and CB talent could do for the team?
And the edge rushers from what I've heard so far are can't-miss prospects. Are the receivers?
If we don't have a pick high enough to get Thibodeaux or Hutchinson, it's worth a discussion trading up. But is a win over the Jaguars really worth giving up a 2nd or 3rd round pick given all our needs? Not even close.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2021, 04:15:24 PM
So if those 2 are gone, we're either taking an elite prospect at a less important position (Hamilton, Stingley) or we're taking a non-can't-miss prospect at a premium position (the 2nd-tier edges, or the top OT or WR).
From what I have read, there are 2 OL picks who are pretty much can't miss and can both play multiple positions, and one who's can't miss at an arguably slightly lower value position. And I don't think that an elite player in our secondary is less important, Championship contending defenses can be built around a good secondary.
Of course getting an elite pass rusher would be awesome, but this isn't like 2019 and the consolation for not getting a top 2 pick isn't the best of a bad set of options. Beating Jacksonville, and if it makes a difference to them reaching the postseason then also Buffalo, is the optimal outcome for me.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2021, 04:18:04 PM
Looking at the top 5 drafted from '19-'17(Excluding 2021 and 2020 as they are two soon to tell) only 3 players have been franchise changing.I'm not sure why you're turning this into a "was Quinnen Williams worth the No. 3 pick" argument. That's completely irrelevant.
2019
- Kyler
- Bosa
- Quinnen
- Ferrell
- Devin White
2018
- Baker
- Saquon
- Darnold
- Denzel Ward
- Bradley Chubb
2017
- Myles Garrett
- Mitchell Trubisky
- Solomon Thoomas
- Leonard Fournette
- Corey Davis
People's expectations are the problem, not the the gm, the coaches, and the players.
The point is that Hutchinson and Thibodeaux are both thought of similarly to other super-elite edges who have gotten drafted lately. Most of those guys have turned into stars (Bosa, Bosa, Garrett). And while Quinnen was a very good prospect, he wasn't viewed as high as Bosa was.
In fact, if you look at your list, there are 2 obvious examples that could relate to 2022.
- 2019: Bosa was clearly the No. 1 DL, and he's a stud. Quinnen is good but a clear step back. Clelin Ferrell had no business going that high, but clearly, there's a major gap between the can't-miss guy and the next tier.
- 2017: Myles Garrett was clearly the No. 1 DL, and he's a stud. Solomon Thomas is several steps back.
If Thibodeaux and Hutchinson are the Bosa/Garrett level prospects like they are getting hyped as, I don't want to get the 2nd-tier prospect. It's not a perfect science at all, but I'd rather have the clear mega-blue-chip prospect than the next guy on the list.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 04:25:58 PM
An edge rusher in the top 5 is a much more valuable use of that pick than a cornerback. Not even close.
And the edge rushers from what I've heard so far are can't-miss prospects. Are the receivers?
If we don't have a pick high enough to get Thibodeaux or Hutchinson, it's worth a discussion trading up. But is a win over the Jaguars really worth giving up a 2nd or 3rd round pick given all our needs? Not even close.
Please show me where I tried to make this argument.
Are you saying the second tier edge rushers are better choices in the top 5 than Stingley?
Post by: reuben on December 20, 2021, 04:52:57 PM
Or are we just all discussing the lack of pass rushers here in a vacuum without considering what the available WR and CB talent could do for the team?
Yeah, I'm just not worried about missing out on EDGE 1 or 2, not on a team with so many holes. Missing out on Bosa stings because it was so recent and because it was kind of a garbage draft. For every 2019, there's a 2006, where we miss out on once-in-a-lifetime talents like Mario Williams and Reggie Bush and Vince Young and have to settle for boring ol' Brick Ferguson. Or a 2011, when the certified slam dunks were Von Miller and Marcel Dareus and god help you if you finished outside the top ten and had to settle for a second-tier guy like JJ Watt.
There's a shitload of talent at the top of this draft at just about every position except quarterback, running back, and tight end. We're exceptionally well-positioned no matter how the rest of the season goes, here or in Seattle.
Post by: insanity on December 20, 2021, 04:53:36 PM
I'm not sure why you're turning this into a "was Quinnen Williams worth the No. 3 pick" argument. That's completely irrelevant.Irrelevant yes, but mentioned and discussed often, also yes.
I said my peace
Post by: Heismanberg on December 20, 2021, 05:05:46 PM
The DRC comp makes a lot of sense for him
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2021, 05:24:19 PM
Please show me where I tried to make this argument.Not trying to argue with you in particular - I'm just saying that in the long run, that might be what we're dealing with.
Are you saying the second tier edge rushers are better choices in the top 5 than Stingley?
I haven't dug in enough to think that a second-tier edge rusher is a better top-5 pick than the CBs or OTs or WRs. But if this is viewed as a two-man draft at the top, and we have a chance to get one of those two guys, and it fills our biggest need for 15 years running, I really hope we can get one.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 20, 2021, 07:12:15 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 20, 2021, 08:37:24 PM
Not trying to argue with you in particular - I'm just saying that in the long run, that might be what we're dealing with.
I haven't dug in enough to think that a second-tier edge rusher is a better top-5 pick than the CBs or OTs or WRs. But if this is viewed as a two-man draft at the top, and we have a chance to get one of those two guys, and it fills our biggest need for 15 years running, I really hope we can get one.
Yea, but 99% of the board is pretty much in agreement on this point so I figured we'd be taking the next step in the conversation.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 20, 2021, 11:43:09 PM
As much as losing to the Jaguars would suck, no one will remember that if we get Thibs/Hutch and he turns out to be a stud.
Yup. Not rooting for losses, as always, but I don’t buy that a win over a excrement, bleeding out Jacksonville team means too much. More of a game that you just don’t want to lose cause that’s kinda embarrassing
I just need to see Zach finish out the season strong
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 22, 2021, 08:49:38 AM
Post by: Badger on December 22, 2021, 09:07:55 AM
Can anyone confirm that we would actually improve our draft position by losing? It looks pretty tight in terms of SOS.Sadly, we need the playoff machine but for the draft order.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 22, 2021, 11:05:31 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 22, 2021, 11:08:28 AM
(https://c.tenor.com/_GSIS3hUaxkAAAAM/straight-outta-compton-o-shea-j-ackson-jr.gif)
Post by: MBGreen on December 22, 2021, 11:10:09 AM
“You are a bad/dumb fan if you root for X! True Jets fans could only root for Y!”
(https://c.tenor.com/_GSIS3hUaxkAAAAM/straight-outta-compton-o-shea-j-ackson-jr.gif)
Just keep it a bean
Post by: Johnny English on December 22, 2021, 11:10:18 AM
“You are a bad/dumb fan if you root for X! True Jets fans could only root for Y!”
(https://c.tenor.com/_GSIS3hUaxkAAAAM/straight-outta-compton-o-shea-j-ackson-jr.gif)
Uh, where were you to defend me against this last season?
Post by: MBGreen on December 22, 2021, 11:11:00 AM
Uh, where were you to defend me against this last season?
You chose poorly last year
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 22, 2021, 11:16:43 AM
Uh, where were you to defend me against this last season?
You know my quote applies to you as well, right? Hence the variables
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 22, 2021, 11:18:04 AM
Post by: Johnny English on December 22, 2021, 11:18:50 AM
You know my quote applies to you as well, right? Hence the variables
Except I never accused anyone of being a bad fan for rooting for the tank, only that I hated it and couldn't/wouldn't ever do it as it's anathema to everything that makes me a sports fan.
Meanwhile I got excrement on extensively, in particular for celebrating when we finally won a game.
Post by: MBGreen on December 22, 2021, 11:19:56 AM
Except I never accused anyone of being a bad fan for rooting for the tank, only that I hated it and couldn't/wouldn't ever do it as it's anathema to everything that makes me a sports fan.
Meanwhile I got excrement on extensively, in particular for celebrating when we finally won a game.
that's because you put your selfish needs before the team. #tsktsk
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 22, 2021, 11:19:57 AM
Except I never accused anyone of being a bad fan for rooting for the tank, only that I hated it and couldn't/wouldn't ever do it as it's anathema to everything that makes me a sports fan.
Meanwhile I got excrement on extensively, in particular for celebrating when we finally won a game.
I wasn’t 100% on your stance other than you were anti-tank
That game was nothing to celebrate. I got zero joy out of it
Post by: Johnny English on December 22, 2021, 11:24:14 AM
I wasn’t 100% on your stance other than you were anti-tank
That game was nothing to celebrate. I got zero joy out of it
After 13 defeats in a row it felt like finally whacking off after having both arms in a cast for three months.
Post by: Badger on December 22, 2021, 11:27:33 AM
After 13 defeats in a row it felt like finally whacking off after having both arms in a cast for three months.Last year's wins were more like /r/ruinedorgasms
Post by: bojanglesman on December 22, 2021, 11:57:06 AM
Post by: reuben on December 22, 2021, 12:02:03 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 22, 2021, 12:16:21 PM
A key component of last year's unique circumstance was that I've never wished failure on a current Jets coach the way I wished it on Adam Gase. Draft picks be damned, I wanted that man to fail spectacularly.
OK this is understandable.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 22, 2021, 01:27:04 PM
Can anyone confirm that we would actually improve our draft position by losing? It looks pretty tight in terms of SOS.
Well on the flip side our draft position would get worse if we won.
So you can say our draft position improved by losing.
Obviously lots of excrement can happen with tie breakers and there's two weeks left after that. Plus a ton of excrement happening with covid.
So you could see garbage tesms win match ups and way more likely teams rest/hide starters the during one/several of the last weeks
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 22, 2021, 01:29:30 PM
Well on the flip side our draft position would get worse if we won.
So you can say our draft position improved by losing.
Obviously lots of excrement can happen with tie breakers and there's two weeks left after that. Plus a ton of excrement happening with covid.
So you could see garbage tesms win match ups and way more likely teams rest/hide starters the during one/several of the last weeks
You don’t know that’s true either. I think its possible that we have the 4 pick or above locked in as long as we lose to the Buccs and Bills.
I’m asking if someone has seen anyone do the math on these scenarios. I’m too lazy to do it at this point in time. Doesn’t really make sense to do so until after this weekend.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 22, 2021, 01:53:27 PM
You don’t know that’s true either. I think its possible that we have the 4 pick or above locked in as long as we lose to the Buccs and Bills.
I’m asking if someone has seen anyone do the math on these scenarios. I’m too lazy to do it at this point in time. Doesn’t really make sense to do so until after this weekend.
I don't think anyone has done the math as there's quite a few variables with SOS
But the biggest thing is the Jets play two teams with winning records.
The bears and Giants each play 3 teams with losing records.
However the bears and giants do play each other. So I think that alone means barring the Jets winning multiple games we probably have a top 4 pick.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on December 22, 2021, 02:15:10 PM
You don’t know that’s true either. I think its possible that we have the 4 pick or above locked in as long as we lose to the Buccs and Bills.
I’m asking if someone has seen anyone do the math on these scenarios. I’m too lazy to do it at this point in time. Doesn’t really make sense to do so until after this weekend.
I can already see this happening...
We have the #2 pick in the draft going into Bills game. Bills have nothing to play for and start the second string team...Jets win a meaningless game and drop to the the #3 spot missing out on both EDGE rushers.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 22, 2021, 02:21:09 PM
I can already see this happening...I'd be surprised if the Bills have nothing to play for. Very little chance of that.
We have the #2 pick in the draft going into Bills game. Bills have nothing to play for and start the second string team...Jets win a meaningless game and drop to the the #3 spot missing out on both EDGE rushers.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on December 22, 2021, 02:22:27 PM
I'd be surprised if the Bills have nothing to play for.
Agreed...but they're the Jets...excrement like this always happen
Post by: Johnny English on December 22, 2021, 02:32:33 PM
Post by: reuben on December 22, 2021, 02:55:08 PM
Texans: 0.502
Jaguars: 0.505
Jets: 0.505
Jets and Jags would have equal SOS. Divisional WL would be equal since we were both swept. Conference WL would be equal since all wins were AFC. Next would be head-to-head which would be in our favor.
Texans at 1, Jets at 2, Jags at 3.
Note that I have Lions beating Atlanta.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 22, 2021, 05:55:28 PM
I calculated SOS for the three 3-14 teams using my picks on the ESPN playoff generator for the remaining games: http://espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs/machine/_/results/401326553~1~401326554~1~401326555~2~401326556~2~401326557~2~401326558~1~401326559~2~401326560~2~401326561~1~401326562~2~401326563~1~401326564~1~401326565~1~401326566~1~401326567~1~401326568~1~401326569~1~401326570~1~401326571~2~401326573~1~401326574~1~401326575~1~401326576~2~401326577~1~401326578~1~401326579~1~401326580~1~401326572~1~401326581~1~401326582~1~401326583~1~401326584~1~401326585~2~401326586~1~401326587~1~401326588~2~401326589~2~401326590~2~401326591~2~401326592~2~401326600~2~401326599~1~401326598~2~401326597~1~401326596~1~401326595~2~401326594~2~401326593~1 (http://espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs/machine/_/results/401326553~1~401326554~1~401326555~2~401326556~2~401326557~2~401326558~1~401326559~2~401326560~2~401326561~1~401326562~2~401326563~1~401326564~1~401326565~1~401326566~1~401326567~1~401326568~1~401326569~1~401326570~1~401326571~2~401326573~1~401326574~1~401326575~1~401326576~2~401326577~1~401326578~1~401326579~1~401326580~1~401326572~1~401326581~1~401326582~1~401326583~1~401326584~1~401326585~2~401326586~1~401326587~1~401326588~2~401326589~2~401326590~2~401326591~2~401326592~2~401326600~2~401326599~1~401326598~2~401326597~1~401326596~1~401326595~2~401326594~2~401326593~1)
Texans: 0.502
Jaguars: 0.505
Jets: 0.505
Jets and Jags would have equal SOS. Divisional WL would be equal since we were both swept. Conference WL would be equal since all wins were AFC. Next would be head-to-head which would be in our favor.
Texans at 1, Jets at 2, Jags at 3.
Note that I have Lions beating Atlanta.
(https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/images/kevin-garnett-uncut-1576099668.jpg?crop=0.495xw:0.990xh;0,0&resize=980:*)
Post by: casman02 on December 22, 2021, 06:15:29 PM
(I too would rather the higher first but I am trying to be more positive)
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 22, 2021, 06:38:35 PM
The only thing do add at this point, though not ideal, is if we do end up in a tie with the Jags (or any other) and lose out on the SOS, is at least the 2nd rounder will be higher...
(I too would rather the higher first but I am trying to be more positive)
If I didn't already know that we've had this conversation before I'd swear we already had this conversation before.
Post by: Badger on December 22, 2021, 07:00:14 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211223/ebad133639f43341da0d068348b23e08.jpg)
Post by: reuben on December 22, 2021, 08:21:12 PM
The only thing do add at this point, though not ideal, is if we do end up in a tie with the Jags (or any other) and lose out on the SOS, is at least the 2nd rounder will be higher...
(I too would rather the higher first but I am trying to be more positive)
Another fun tie-breaker silver lining is that if Carolina holds a winning SOS tie-breaker (their SOS is pretty low), it flips in the 2nd and 4th round. We hold their 2nd and 4th round picks.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 23, 2021, 05:56:59 PM
Post by: reuben on December 23, 2021, 10:56:36 PM
EVERYBODY JUST CROSS YOUR FINGERS AND HOPE THE MATH GODS TAKE MERCY ON US
Quote
Week 16
Chicago over @Seattle (SEA loss + CHI win)
@Houston over LA Chargers (HOU win)
Tampa Bay over @Carolina (CAR loss + lowers SOS of NYJ)
Detroit over @Atlanta (DET win + lowers SOS of NYJ)
Baltimore over @Cincinnati (Lowers SOS of NYJ)
@Las Vegas over Denver (Lowers SOS of NYJ)
@Arizona over Indianapolis (Lowers SOS of NYJ)
@Tennessee over San Francisco (Raises SOS of JAX and HOU)
LA Rams over @Minnesota (Raises SOS of JAX and HOU)
Cleveland over @Green Bay (Raises SOS of HOU)
NY Giants over @Philadelphia (Lowers SOS of NYJ + NYG win)
Week 17
Detroit over @Seattle (SEA loss + DET win)
Jacksonville over @New England (JAX win + lowers SOS of NYJ)
Houston over @San Francisco (HOU win)
@New Orleans over Carolina (CAR loss)
@Washington over Philadelphia (Lowers SOS of NYJ)
Kansas City over @Cincinnati (Lowers SOS of NYJ)
Atlanta over @Buffalo (Lowers SOS of NYJ)
Cleveland over @Pittsburgh (Raises SOS of HOU)
@LA Chargers over Denver (Lowers SOS of NYJ + Raises SOS of HOU)
@Dallas over Arizona (Raises SOS of JAX and HOU)
@Tennessee over Miami (Lowers SOS of NYJ + Raises SOS of JAX and HOU)
@Indianapolis over Las Vegas (Raises SOS of NYJ, JAX, and HOU, but a bigger increase for JAX and HOU than NYJ since they play IND twice)
Week 18
@Detroit over Green Bay (DET win)
@Houston over Tennessee (HOU win)
@Jacksonville over Indianapolis (JAX win)
@Arizona over Seattle (SEA loss)
@Tampa Bay over Carolina (CAR loss)
@NY Giants over Washington (NYG win)
Chicago over @Minnesota (CHI win)
Dallas over @Philadelphia (Lowers SOS of NYJ)
Kansas City over @Denver (Lowers SOS of NYJ)
@Atlanta over New Orleans (Raises SOS of JAX)
@Las Vegas over LA Chargers (Raises SOS of HOU)
@Cleveland over Cincinnati (Raises SOS of HOU + Lowers SOS of NYJ)
Post by: Libero_2 on December 23, 2021, 11:43:57 PM
Here's Jet X tank rooting guide, lest some other poor fellows root for the Titans on my advice. Though they erroneously advise us to root for Tennessee as well.
EVERYBODY JUST CROSS YOUR FINGERS AND HOPE THE MATH GODS TAKE MERCY ON US
At the end of the day we want as many Titans and Colts wins as possible. It’s not a bad break that Tennessee won tonight. Let’s have them get hot and run the table…
Post by: insanity on December 24, 2021, 10:10:37 AM
Post by: Badger on December 24, 2021, 10:14:56 AM
Goff out. So long to the lions chances at winning again this year.I've never heard of either of the backup QBs they have.
Post by: Badger on December 24, 2021, 10:54:52 AM
Beating JAX probably cements us at 4 barring any unlikely upset victories by the 3 shittier teams.
Losing to JAX doesn't help us without considerable help in the SOS department.
If DET, JAX, and HOU all pick ahead of us, DET is the only one we can hope will take a QB. And that's not even a certainty since they may keep rolling with Goff. JAX is obviously not going to, and I suspect HOU will explore Mills a while longer (not to mention whatever becomes of Watson).
If we somehow win multiple games before the end of the season, players like Burks, Ekwonu, Hamilton may all be in play and could make immediate impacts in 2022. We're not screwed.
Post by: MBGreen on December 24, 2021, 10:58:25 AM
Random thoughts.
Beating JAX probably cements us at 4 barring any unlikely upset victories by the 3 shittier teams.
Losing to JAX doesn't help us without considerable help in the SOS department.
If DET, JAX, and HOU all pick ahead of us, DET is the only one we can hope will take a QB. And that's not even a certainty since they may keep rolling with Goff. JAX is obviously not going to, and I suspect HOU will explore Mills a while longer (not to mention whatever becomes of Watson).
If we somehow win multiple games before the end of the season, players like Burks, Ekwonu, Hamilton may all be in play and could make immediate impacts in 2022. We're not screwed.
I agree with this...especially the not screwed part. And yet, my greedy heart still yearns to draft one of the EDGE guys at the top of the 1st.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 24, 2021, 12:02:14 PM
It's never a guarantee, but I hope we get get Thibs or Hutch.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 24, 2021, 02:55:43 PM
I agree with this...especially the not screwed part. And yet, my greedy heart still yearns to draft one of the EDGE guys at the top of the 1st.
I'm going to console myself by remembering all of the DLine we picked in the first round that either never panned out or quickly turned to garbage.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 24, 2021, 04:34:30 PM
Either way, we will have an awesome chance to build up our roster. But if we don't get one of those 2 edges, it would be a little bit of a kick in the nuts. Back-to-back years having an abysmal season, and neither year do we get the guy(s) we want most.
It's never a guarantee, but I hope we get get Thibs or Hutch.
Just have to hope that JAX takes an offensive tackle if they are ahead of us
Post by: Badger on December 24, 2021, 10:33:25 PM
Just have to hope that JAX takes an offensive tackle if they are ahead of usI just realized - do you think they'll be less likely to take an edge because they already have Josh Allen?
Post by: Heismanberg on December 24, 2021, 11:12:36 PM
I just realized - do you think they'll be less likely to take an edge because they already have Josh Allen?
I hope so
Post by: Libero_2 on December 25, 2021, 12:25:18 AM
I hope so
I think a lot is going to depend on the new coach. Hopefully they go with an offense heavy approach to try and build around T-Law and that leads to them taking an offensive player in April. That said we still need a guy like Neal to grade out really freaking highly for them
I can’t see how we could be competitive this week with this many absences. But if any team could freak up the chance to beat us, it would be the Jaguars.
Post by: MBGreen on December 25, 2021, 12:04:01 PM
I hope soI think the Jags will target Evan Neal
Post by: bojanglesman on December 26, 2021, 01:40:13 PM
Post by: Badger on December 26, 2021, 03:15:30 PM
https://www.tankathon.com/nfl
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 03:23:58 PM
Post by: loyaljetsfan on December 26, 2021, 03:47:37 PM
Can't trade down.
Who do you want at 4?
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 03:49:03 PM
Hutch, Thibs, Neal went 1-3.Doesn't matter. We beat the Jaguars! Party at JE's house.
Can't trade down.
Who do you want at 4?
Post by: Heismanberg on December 26, 2021, 03:49:17 PM
Hutch, Thibs, Neal went 1-3.
Can't trade down.
Who do you want at 4?
Ekwonu, an offensive lineman I’d take over Neal
Or
Ojabo (depending on how he tests at the combine)
Post by: Heismanberg on December 26, 2021, 03:49:59 PM
Post by: d sw0rdz on December 26, 2021, 03:55:18 PM
especially when your team doesn't need a QB
Post by: Badger on December 26, 2021, 04:00:00 PM
Hutch, Thibs, Neal went 1-3.Burks
Can't trade down.
Who do you want at 4?
Then BPA with our next pick
Post by: Badger on December 26, 2021, 04:20:59 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 26, 2021, 04:30:18 PM
in a year where there isn't a runaway QB prospect like lawrence that looks a lock to go #1, lamenting about top 5 draft pick position in december is a monumental waste of time
especially when your team doesn't need a QB
We have two picks in the top 10 but we don't have the #2 overall.
Something about a bag of 20s not being a bag of 50s.
Post by: MBGreen on December 26, 2021, 04:32:52 PM
BurksDo you take Burks over Garrett Wilson?
Then BPA with our next pick
Probably deserves its own thread
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 04:49:25 PM
Do you take Burks over Garrett Wilson?We have the next 4-5 months to debate that. Watched some Burks film over the last week. Some good, some bad. Guy is a freak athlete though.
Probably deserves its own thread
Post by: Laxin on December 26, 2021, 04:58:33 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 26, 2021, 05:04:54 PM
It's possible that winning this game is a blessing in disguise. If it causes the Jets to draft Burks (or an offensive talent) with that first pick instead of a pass rusher, it would probably mean more for Wilson's development. Having a DK Metcalf or Demaryius Thomas level talent with Moore at WR would do a whole lot for Wilson. Even if Wilson's not the guy, the next QB would be stepping into an offense with actual talent.
I can see this. Honestly the last competent attempt to build an offense on this team was when Tannenbaum signed Braylon Edwards and traded for Santonio Holmes, before he fucked it up by bringing in Plax and Derrick Mason.
I'd be very happy if the team prioritized building a competent offense around Wilson over a pass rusher.
Post by: Johnny English on December 26, 2021, 05:05:53 PM
Honestly the last competent attempt to build an offense on this team was when Tannenbaum signed Braylon Edwards and traded for Santonio Holmes
2015
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 26, 2021, 05:15:59 PM
2015
2015 feels like more of a fluke than an actual result of competence.
Post by: MBGreen on December 26, 2021, 05:17:07 PM
2015 feels like more of a fluke than an actual result of competence.#Fitzmagic
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 26, 2021, 05:18:11 PM
#Fitzmagic
That's the biggest argument in my favor.
Post by: Johnny English on December 26, 2021, 05:20:12 PM
2015 feels like more of a fluke than an actual result of competence.
It wasn't an accident that we signed Marshall and Fitz to add to Decker and Ivory, and give Brick and Mangold one last run. There was a deliberate attempt to build a top notch veteran offense and have a tilt, and it was brilliant.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 26, 2021, 05:24:51 PM
It wasn't an accident that we signed Marshall and Fitz to add to Decker and Ivory, and give Brick and Mangold one last run. There was a deliberate attempt to build a top notch veteran offense and have a tilt, and it was brilliant.
Signing Fitz as a starter is a 50/50 chance to succeed at best. Literally for this team.
Post by: Badger on December 26, 2021, 05:26:04 PM
2015 feels like more of a fluke than an actual result of competence.The 2015 offense had good bones. The fluky part was IK/Geno, Fitz playing out of his mind in 2015 and imploding in 2016. Had we gone into those years with an actual QB instead of an idiot and a journeyman we might have seen more success.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 26, 2021, 05:26:39 PM
The 2015 offense had good bones. The fluky part was Fitz playing out of his mind in 2015 and imploding in 2016. Had we gone into those years with an actual QB instead of Geno and a journeyman we might have seen more success.
Which is exactly why it is a fluke.
Post by: MBGreen on December 26, 2021, 05:26:41 PM
That's the biggest argument in my favor.Indeed
Post by: Badger on December 26, 2021, 05:28:31 PM
Which is exactly why it is a fluke.But the offense besides the QB was well-constructed. OL was solid, Marshall and Decker and Ivory, etc. If you had plugged in another solid QB it still would have looked good.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 26, 2021, 05:37:25 PM
But the offense besides the QB was well-constructed. OL was solid, Marshall and Decker and Ivory, etc. If you had plugged in another solid QB it still would have looked good.
Ivory was gone by 2016 so he wasn't really a good building block, and Marshall and Ivory were both on the down slope. It was more of a "win now" set up. Kind of feels like Fitzpatrick burned down the whole team.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 05:47:24 PM
It wasn't an accident that we signed Marshall and Fitz to add to Decker and Ivory, and give Brick and Mangold one last run. There was a deliberate attempt to build a top notch veteran offense and have a tilt, and it was brilliant.Exactly. We had a great receiving corps, a good running game, and a decent enough offensive line to survive.
Fitz played well, but we set him up for success with Decker and Marshall, one of the better receiving duos in the NFL, not to mention Enunwa who was a good 3rd receiver when healthy.
While I'm annoyed we won't get an elite edge rusher, we still have a lot of draft picks to build up both sides of the ball. I think Elijah Moore has a chance to be a star. Corey Davis was a disappointment this season, but overall, I think he's a good player. Add one more player to that group and bring back Berrios, and we have a really nice looking receiver corps when healthy.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 26, 2021, 05:58:59 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 06:13:12 PM
Based on Tankathon, Texans SOS is at .492 and ours is .512. Texans play SF and TEN and we play TB and BUF, so we aren't really making up ground there.
Unless Houston wins again, best case scenario seems 4. Houston might be able to beat the Titans again in Week 17 though. Kyle Shanahan has been atrocious as a home favorite, so maybe HOU can get a win there, but unlikely.
Would have been 2 and 7 if the Jags scored on the final play today.
Post by: Johnny English on December 26, 2021, 06:17:28 PM
Would have been 3 and 7 if the Jags scored on the final play today.
Unless Middleton had actually chosen to kick the three FGs he left on the table because he was playing to give the offense opportunities rather than win percentages.
The what if game is stupid, it's butterflies and hurricanes.
Post by: MBGreen on December 26, 2021, 06:17:45 PM
4 and 7 again.
Based on Tankathon, Texans SOS is at .492 and ours is .512. Texans play SF and TEN and we play TB and BUF, so we aren't really making up ground there.
Unless Houston wins again, best case scenario seems 4. Houston might be able to beat the Titans again in Week 17 though. Kyle Shanahan has been atrocious as a home favorite, so maybe HOU can get a win there, but unlikely.
Would have been 2 and 7 if the Jags scored on the final play today.
It's not 2...so get over it.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 06:19:24 PM
It's not 2...so get over it.Literally just stating the facts.
Based on the draft value chart, that final play was the equivalent of losing the #21 pick in the draft.
It would have been one thing if Wilson threw a TD pass on the final play to cost us the draft pick. I would have taken that in a heartbeat. But when they got to the 1-yard line, I wanted them to score. It would have been for the best long-term.
Post by: MBGreen on December 26, 2021, 06:20:33 PM
Literally just stating the facts.
Based on the draft value chart, that final play was the equivalent of losing the #21 pick in the draft.
Better invest in some therapy.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 06:32:42 PM
Better invest in some therapy.Was today's victory worth the #21 pick in the draft?
Seems like you're angrier than I am.
Post by: Laxin on December 26, 2021, 06:40:07 PM
Was today's victory worth the #21 pick in the draft?
Seems like you're angrier than I am.
Honestly it seems like we discuss this every year. It’s sad, but it seems like more often than not it doesn’t matter much. Having a GM that drafts well consistently is all that matters.
Although losing out on Bosa in 2019 still hurts
Post by: Badger on December 26, 2021, 06:47:24 PM
Honestly it seems like we discuss this every year. It’s sad, but it seems like more often than not it doesn’t matter much. Having a GM that drafts well consistently is all that matters.
Although losing out on Bosa in 2019 still hurts
In 2018 we had Darnold's development to hope for - every win was worth it unless one somehow knew that Darnold would be gone in 3 years.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 06:48:38 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 06:48:46 PM
Honestly it seems like we discuss this every year. It’s sad, but it seems like more often than not it doesn’t matter much. Having a GM that drafts well consistently is all that matters.That's all I worry about. If the gap between Thibs/Hutch and the next guys are that big, then today will be one of those games we look at 5 years later and think SOJ.
Although losing out on Bosa in 2019 still hurts
But it's the draft, so you never know for sure, so there's a chance we get WR or OL or other positions are better than the edge rushers. Since it seems like we'll likely miss out on those guys, I hope like hell that is the case.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 06:49:15 PM
We always refer back to Bosa but there was some debate at the time who the best player in the draft was (between Bosa and Q) and there was even some talk that the Cards could have taken Q at 1. My point being there's no guarantee that if the Jets had the #2 pick they were taking Bosa over Q.Yes, there was. People liked Quinnen, and there were a couple people who thought they should take Q over Bosa, but that was never really realistic.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 06:51:55 PM
Yes, there was. People liked Quinnen, and there were a couple people who thought they should take Q over Bosa, but that was never really realistic.
What exactly are you basing that on? It mostly sounded like a 50/50 proposition at the time. If anything, the general consensus was that Bosa was the safer pick while Quinnen had the better upside.
Post by: MBGreen on December 26, 2021, 06:55:57 PM
Was today's victory worth the #21 pick in the draft?
Seems like you're angrier than I am.
I'm fine..
i've stated multiple times i only care about Zach's learning curve this season, and he's moving in the right direction.
I know you're disappointed he hasn't thrown for 400 yards and 4 TDs yet, but that isn't an expectation in year 1 imo.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 06:56:27 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 06:56:38 PM
We won one game that season after starting 3-3. In only late-season win that year, Darnold went 16-24 for 170 yds with a TD and an Int against the Bills. We lost every other late-season game that year.
In 2018 we had Darnold's development to hope for - every win was worth it unless one somehow knew that Darnold would be gone in 3 years.
My hope has been that we would lose games like that Packers game. That Packers game was a model for what I hoped this season would be like. Darnold threw for 341 yards in that game and played great in a loss, and he led a game-tying drive late in that game.
Even the Titans game was a great model. Wilson missed a ton of throws in that game, but we won that game largely on his arm, even despite the missed throws. That was a perfect developmental game.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 06:57:39 PM
How do we know Hutch/Thibs aren't going to become Jedeveon Clowney while Karlaftis/Ojabo become Khalil Mack? It's easy to say this pick is more valuable than that pick but history shows that a higher pick offers no real assurance of a better player.You never know for sure, but the percentages are always higher the higher up you draft.
Post by: Badger on December 26, 2021, 07:00:00 PM
My hope has been that we would lose games like that Packers game. That Packers game was a model for what I hoped this season would be like. Darnold threw for 341 yards in that game and played great in a loss, and he led a game-tying drive late in that game.
Yeah, but that's atypical. As I said earlier the reality of being pro-tank comes down to rooting for your team to suck vs taking wins however they come.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 07:00:12 PM
Post by: reuben on December 26, 2021, 07:02:24 PM
If the gap between Thibs/Hutch and the next guys are that big
I don't think it's as big as it seems now. I think David Ojabo might blow up the Combine.
I know everyone says "Yeah but Hutch is on the other side" but that excrement is a two-way street. Teams give their LT's a LOT of help against Ojabo.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 26, 2021, 07:03:35 PM
I don’t care how we find them, draft them, pay them, develop them IDGAF, just go find them so we can try to win
Post by: dcm1602 on December 26, 2021, 07:07:08 PM
Look at all the teams that would be in the playoffs if the season ended today. How many top-5 picks have they had recently (let alone top-2 picks)?
If make a safe assumption that having a top QB is more important than having top 5 draft picks
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 07:10:32 PM
I don't think it's as big as it seems now. I think David Ojabo might blow up the Combine.I don't think Ojabo is as good of a scheme fit for us. Every time I watch him, he's being a stand-up edge rusher. He's definitely an athletic freak, but he seems like a better fit for a 3-4.
I know everyone says "Yeah but Hutch is on the other side" but that excrement is a two-way street. Teams give their LT's a LOT of help against Ojabo.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 07:14:02 PM
If make a safe assumption that having a top QB is more important than having top 5 draft picks
Of course, but that doesn't change my point which is that top-5 picks aren't essential to winning.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 26, 2021, 07:16:17 PM
I don't think it's as big as it seems now. I think David Ojabo might blow up the Combine.
I know everyone says "Yeah but Hutch is on the other side" but that excrement is a two-way street. Teams give their LT's a LOT of help against Ojabo.
Karlaftis is a top five overall prospect in most drafts too
EDGE is loaded
This draft is also loaded at LB.
Post by: Jumbo on December 26, 2021, 07:17:53 PM
Look at all the teams that would be in the playoffs if the season ended today. How many top-5 picks have they had recently (let alone top-2 picks)?
It all comes down to hitting on the QB. 50% of the top-2 picks in the last 3 drafts are slated to make the playoffs this year and it's because they're QBs their teams hit on (Murray/Burrow went #1, and Nick Bosa is on a more complete team that's on the line of the playoff hunt). That's true for most of the QBs that went around the top 5 as well like Josh Allen, Herbert, etc.
But I think the recent top picks also show if the elite pass rusher is there it's probably also preferable to get them than the drop off especially at their position. You'd be much better off in 2017 with Myles Garrett (#1 pick) than Solomon Thomas, Leonard Fournette, Corey Davis, Jamal Adams, or Mike Williams (picks 3-7).
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 07:18:01 PM
There's also the possibility of trading back and picking up additional assets that way.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 07:19:56 PM
Derek Stingley and George Karlaftis aren't bad consolation prizes.Taking a cornerback in the 1st round compared to an edge rusher would be a massive kick in the balls.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 07:23:48 PM
Taking a cornerback in the 1st round compared to an edge rusher would be a massive kick in the balls.
Corner isn't my preference either and I don't think we'll go in that direction but Stingley is arguably the most talented corner to enter the draft since Ramsey.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 07:26:14 PM
Post by: reuben on December 26, 2021, 07:28:15 PM
This fanbase's constant handwringing over draft picks is nauseating.
Give me a modestly successful team and I'll give a much smaller excrement about draft picks and free agents.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 07:31:00 PM
This fanbase's constant handwringing over draft picks is nauseating.The franchise constantly being eliminated from playoff contention at the beginning of December is what is nauseating.
I just react to what is in front of me. When the product is garbage, you wish upon draft picks to turn things around. The 2021 draft is a great start. Need another big draft next year, and if we can get that, 2022-25 have a chance to be special.
Nobody cared about what draft pick we would get from 2008-11 and in 2015.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 26, 2021, 07:35:21 PM
Evan Neal, Derek Stingley, Kyle Hamilton, and George Karlaftis aren't bad consolation prizes.
There's also the possibility of trading back and picking up additional assets that way.
Icky Ekwonu is better than Neal
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 07:44:49 PM
The franchise constantly being eliminated from playoff contention at the beginning of December is what is nauseating.
I just react to what is in front of me. When the product is garbage, you wish upon draft picks to turn things around. The 2021 draft is a great start. Need another big draft next year, and if we can get that, 2022-25 have a chance to be special.
Nobody cared about what draft pick we would get from 2008-11 and in 2015.
You shouldn't care about draft positioning regardless because if higher picks were the elixir to what ails us then we would have turned things around by now and the teams picking behind us wouldn't constantly be fielding better teams than ours. What we need are people that are capable of identifying and developing talent. That's it. Good teams find and develop good players regardless of where their draft picks are.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 07:50:38 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 07:55:59 PM
You shouldn't care about draft positioning regardless because if higher picks were the elixir to what ails us then we would have turned things around by now and the teams picking behind us wouldn't constantly be fielding better teams than ours. What we need are people that are capable of identifying and developing talent. That's it. Good teams find and develop good players regardless of where their draft picks are.We've had two top-5 picks in the last decade, so it's not like we're getting the Grade A premium prospects every draft.
I agree that draft position isn't everything, or even the primary thing, but it damn sure helps.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 07:58:45 PM
There's a good chance Joey Bosa, Myles Garrett, and Chase Young are all going to be watching the playoffs from their sofas this year and Nick Bosa's likely to be one-and-done.Not sure what your point is. All those teams would be significantly worse without them. Nobody is saying they are the elixir to cure everything. But if you draft well over a couple of years, that's how you get good. Though nothing is more important than quarterback, and outside of maybe Herbert, none of those teams have great quarterback play.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 08:01:16 PM
Not sure what your point is. All those teams would be significantly worse without them. Nobody is saying they are the elixir to cure everything. But if you draft well over a couple of years, that's how you get good. Though nothing is more important than quarterback, and outside of maybe Herbert, none of those teams have great quarterback play.
What you're upset about is missing out on a top-2 edge rusher. My point was that of all the top-5 edge rushers drafted recently only one would be in the playoffs if the season ended today. That's relevant to this discussion.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 08:05:16 PM
We don't need a top-2 pick to surround Wilson with talent this offseason.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 08:08:31 PM
What you're upset about is missing out on a top-2 edge rusher. My point was that of all the top-5 edge rushers drafted recently only one would be in the playoffs if the season ended today. That's relevant to this discussion.Nah.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 26, 2021, 08:09:28 PM
The Jets could make it to 3 reasonably since the Texans seem kind of unpredictable.
I bet in the end we are picking at 4 and 7. Seattle will beat the Lions, but the Bears will beat the Giants. There certainly could be a SOS deal I'm not up on where one leapfrogs the other.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 08:12:17 PM
I don't think that Seattle pick can reasonably get any higher than 7 unless there's a big upset or a good team shuts it down week 18.Seems that way. Really excited about next year's draft, no matter what picks we get. But it is a kick in the nuts if we have to go from the uber-elite prospects to the next level down, or we need to take a less-premium position with those picks. It doesn't change the fact that next year's draft is one of the most important in franchise history, and we need to end up with several starters from it. If we end up with several starters from next year's draft, missing out on the edge rushers won't be as big of a deal. But if those edge rushers are superstars, and we draft guys who aren't at that level, it would suck. Of course, maybe those edge rushers don't live up to the hype, and we end up with Hall of Famers at 4 and 8.
The Jets could make it to 3 reasonably since the Texans seem kind of unpredictable.
I bet in the end we are picking at 4 and 8. Seattle will beat the Lions. The Giants are freaking awful.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 08:15:15 PM
Nah.
Are you kidding me, dude? You've been whining nonstop since the game ended today because the win seemingly pushed us out of position to draft a premier edge rusher.
You did the same thing last year when we beat the Rams and how much worse off are we today? We're better off than the Jaguars.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 08:17:34 PM
Are you kidding me, dude? You've been whining nonstop since the game ended today because it seemingly put us out of position to draft a premier edge rusher.It is completely irrelevant how teams who have drafted edge rushers in the past have done this season as an overall team. Sorry, but that's a fact.
You did the same thing last year when we beat the Rams and how much worse off are we today? We're better off than the Jaguars.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 08:21:55 PM
It is completely irrelevant how teams who have drafted edge rushers in the past have done this season as an overall team. Sorry, but that's a fact.
If your argument is that I'm cherry picking, you're welcome to expand this to more seasons.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 08:24:40 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 08:25:57 PM
I honestly don't understand why you're being unreasonably obtuse.That's how I feel about you and half this board tonight.
I don't think I'm whining. I said that if we were going to win, I wish it had been one when we relied more on Zach's arm. I also said I wished the Jaguars had scored at the end so that we had a better chance to get one of the elite edge rushers. Everyone on the board jumped down my throat for those takes, so I've been defending myself ever since. Zach played well today, we just didn't ask him to do a lot.
I know an edge rusher isn't going to solve everything. I know that we have a chance to build just as good a team from 4 and 8 as we do from 2 and 8. But the percentages of getting an elite player are better at 2 than they are at 4. That's pretty clear.
I don't care that the teams that drafted elite edge rushers in the top 3 recently are currently on the playoff bubble. That's completely irrelevant.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 26, 2021, 08:28:09 PM
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 08:33:48 PM
I know an edge rusher isn't going to solve everything. I know that we have a chance to build just as good a team from 4 and 8 as we do from 2 and 8. But the percentages of getting an elite player are better at 2 than they are at 4. That's pretty clear.
I'm not sure if this is true and it can vary wildly from draft to draft.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 08:37:39 PM
I'm not sure if this is true and it can vary wildly from draft to draft.Now you are just arguing for the sake of it (something I am familiar with).
Every pick has a better chance of succeeding than the one before it. Otherwise why would any team ever trade up and give up picks
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 09:12:27 PM
Every pick has a better chance of succeeding than the one after it. Otherwise why would any team ever trade up and give up picks
I don't agree with this premise. I believe it's a gross oversimplification of what causes a pick to ultimately succeed (or fail). Teams trade up because they covet a player they don't expect to make it past teams drafting ahead of them but that doesn't make it any more or less likely that the player is better than any of the players available at the team's original draft slot.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 26, 2021, 09:18:23 PM
I don't agree with this premise. I think it's a gross oversimplification of what causes a pick to ultimately succeed (or fail).
Instead of arguing semantics. Literally everyone on the planet can agree that the earlier a draft pick is, the more valuable it is.
Obviously there's a ton of factors that come into actual outcomes
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 09:19:25 PM
Instead of arguing semantics. Literally everyone on the planet can agree that the earlier a draft pick is, the more valuable it is.
Obviously there's a ton of factors that come into actual outcomes
It's not about semantics, it's about understanding that relative draft positioning isn't nearly as important as many make it out to be.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 26, 2021, 09:31:29 PM
It's not about semantics, it's about understanding that relative draft positioning isn't nearly as important as many make it out to be.
It's not
Except at the very top of the draft.
And this is blatantly reflected in the draft trade value chart.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 09:34:27 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on December 26, 2021, 09:40:22 PM
The trade value chart is a guideline and hasn't been updated since Jimmy Johnson invented in the 90s.
Of course. But it's one of the only tools that attempts to measure and value draft picks.
Of course it's subjective, but the premise it shows is that the value of draft picks drops off quickly after the top 2 to 3
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 09:41:38 PM
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 10:03:22 PM
I really can't believe AR called me the obtuse one, yet he's spent multiple posts arguing against higher picks being worth more than lower picks.
That is not at all what I've suggested. I've pushed back on the notion that a higher pick assures you a player with a better chance of succeeding than one chosen with a lower pick.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 10:07:04 PM
Of course. But it's one of the only tools that attempts to measure and value draft picks.
Of course it's subjective, but the premise it shows is that the value of draft picks drops off quickly after the top 2 to 3
My main issue with the trade value chart is that it assumes that the relative value of draft picks is static from year to year when it clearly isn't.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 26, 2021, 10:11:26 PM
My main issue with the trade value chart is that it assumes that the relative value of draft picks is static from year to year
If someone had an accurate tool that accounted for every single pick every single year, it would be locked up in a freaking vault somewhere, and the dude who made it would probably be one of the most successful GMs in the league.
Of course not every single draft has the same players circumstances or distributions.
Regardless this is a stupid freaking argument. Literally nobody here can accurately quantify the value of every draft pick. However literal common sense makes it a universal truth that a higher pick will always offer more options than any pick after it
And I mean look at other sports. They also tend to have have similar draft distributions where right at the top of the draft tend to go one or two ultra rare talents. Then the rest of the draft is standard fsre
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 10:20:38 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 10:22:08 PM
That is not at all what I've suggested. I've pushed back on the notion that a higher pick assures you a player with a better chance of succeeding than one chosen with a lower pick.Nothing is never assured, and nobody ever pushed that notion. You're arguing against nobody.
All I've said, which is based on fact and common sense, is that higher picks are more likely to be better players than lower picks. Surely you agree? If not, I can't help you.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 26, 2021, 10:32:33 PM
The Second Wave of EDGE
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 10:34:24 PM
Nothing is never assured, and nobody ever pushed that notion. You're arguing against nobody.
All I've said, which is based on fact and common sense, is that higher picks are more likely to be better players than lower picks. Surely you agree? If not, I can't help you.
I'm not sure how this is any different than what you quoted or what I originally responded to but, once again, I believe this is a gross oversimplification of what causes a pick to ultimately succeed or fail. While you would of course prefer to have a higher pick so you can have a better pick of the litter, this does not inherently give the players chosen higher a better chance of succeeding than the players chosen lower.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 10:41:58 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 26, 2021, 10:45:57 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 26, 2021, 10:52:26 PM
This draft class is absolutely loaded at edge. We can either take one with one of our 1sts or wait until the 2nd. Any one of these guys could be as good or better than the ones we're potentially missing out on given the right circumstances.
Carl Lawson was a fourth round pick
Post by: Miamipuck on December 26, 2021, 10:53:39 PM
Carl Lawson was a fourth round pick
He hasn't played a down for the Jets yet.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 26, 2021, 10:54:35 PM
He hasn't played a down for the Jets yet.
No excrement, Puck.
The Jets also didn't draft him, but Cincinnati was able to find a premier pass rusher (with injury concerns) outside of the premium rounds.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 26, 2021, 10:56:42 PM
The Jets also didn't draft him,
No excrement Heismanberg.
Post by: Jumbo on December 26, 2021, 11:00:26 PM
Finding a productive player at EDGE outside of the first round is possible but it's unlikely compared to literally every other position, besides possibly in recent times QB.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on December 26, 2021, 11:05:21 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on December 27, 2021, 02:01:48 AM
Nicccce.
Post by: CatoTheElder on December 27, 2021, 05:59:58 AM
I don't think Ojabo is as good of a scheme fit for us. Every time I watch him, he's being a stand-up edge rusher. He's definitely an athletic freak, but he seems like a better fit for a 3-4.
Michigan runs a lot of 3-4 looks with Hutchinson playing standing up as well so not sure where you're basing the opinion that one is better to convert to 4-3 than the other. If anything I'd take the more athletic one.
Karlaftis is interesting. A lot of his highlight reels show plays where he's actually setting an edge or anticipating a screen. Seems like he'd fall more into an all around player than a pure EDGE rusher but my sample size for him is very limited so I could very well be saying something stupid right there.
Post by: d sw0rdz on December 27, 2021, 10:52:19 AM
is it likely that they're both gone by the first 3 picks? yeah, maybe. but it's still far from a given this far out lmfaoo.
we don't know how the top of the draft will shake out. the season isn't even over yet. we don't know if a QB needy team(s) will trade into the top 5. we don't know if the teams who already have their QB will opt for more offensive talent, be it skill player or OL (or trade down to said QB-needy teams). we don't know whether there will be a top 5-10 talent that shoots up even further after interviews / the combine. we've seen that happen time and again, year after year
still way too early to be lamenting about what we're missing out on with the 4th pick
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2021, 10:54:06 AM
is it likely that they're both gone by the first 3 picks?
It's a near lock unless one of them gets hurts or arrested.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 27, 2021, 11:02:35 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 27, 2021, 11:11:28 AM
Post by: Badger on January 02, 2022, 02:59:00 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 02, 2022, 03:01:38 PM
Last week, I was totally fine with the gut punch loss. Not to Brady.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 02, 2022, 03:08:22 PM
Post by: MBGreen on January 02, 2022, 03:17:28 PM
Go TexansSpeak it into existence
Post by: Johnny English on January 02, 2022, 06:16:19 PM
Post by: Badger on January 02, 2022, 06:17:13 PM
We are now officially out of the running for the 1 and 2 picks. By my reckoning the worst we can end up with is the 6th and 7th, the best is 3rd and 5th.Will probably be 4th and 7th.
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 02, 2022, 06:22:52 PM
Post by: reuben on January 02, 2022, 07:30:14 PM
We are now officially out of the running for the 1 and 2 picks. By my reckoning the worst we can end up with is the 6th and 7th, the best is 3rd and 5th.
*7th
No possible way to get to 5 and no way to catch Carolina SoS with a Seattle division loss and a Carolina division win.
Post by: Johnny English on January 02, 2022, 07:30:47 PM
In typical Jets fashion, we win the close game against the team that a loss wouldn't have hurt against (Jacksonville), and we lose the close game against the QB we always lose to.
In atypical Jets fashion, we show solid progress by beating the team we're supposed to beat and having a real good go at beating the team we're not supposed to.
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 02, 2022, 07:32:33 PM
In atypical Jets fashion, we show solid progress by beating the team we're supposed to beat and having a real good go at beating the team we're not supposed to.We did this in Geno's rookie year and Darnold's rookie year.
The hope is that we continue it going forward into next season. Plenty of reasons for optimism, but a lot of work needs to be done.
Post by: CatoTheElder on January 02, 2022, 07:38:38 PM
In atypical Jets fashion, we show solid progress by beating the team we're supposed to beat and having a real good go at beating the team we're not supposed to.
You idiot, we're supposed to lose os we can get better draft picks.
Post by: casman02 on January 02, 2022, 08:30:51 PM
May need to end up Carolina loses next week. If they win and Seattle loses, not sure the SOS will work in our favor. Then Carolina may end up with the worse 2nd round pick
Post by: Badger on January 02, 2022, 10:20:51 PM
Have to root for the Cardinals next week. Thankfully they are not known for choking at the end of the year.
Cards have a lot to play for - if they win and the Rams lose (a solid possibility) then Cards win the division on a tiebreaker. They play at the same time thankfully.
If the Cards had lost today they would be unable to win the division while already having a playoff berth clinched, they may have been tempted to rest key players. With the division in reach I can't see them doing that.
Seattle only has pride and rivalry to fight for. We'll see how far that carries them.
Post by: insanity on January 08, 2022, 12:17:30 PM
Nania has one but it's a bit confusing
Post by: Badger on January 08, 2022, 02:21:37 PM
Anyone have any good rooting guides?I don't think the SOS minutiae is worth it, it seems like the tiebreakers are pretty set.
Nania has one but it's a bit confusing
Root against Seattle and Carolina, root for Houston.
Post by: MBGreen on January 08, 2022, 02:57:23 PM
I don't think the SOS minutiae is worth it, it seems like the tiebreakers are pretty set.No Derrick Henry tomorrow...so a glimmer of hope for Houston
Root against Seattle and Carolina, root for Houston.
Post by: reuben on January 08, 2022, 03:30:40 PM
I don't think the SOS minutiae is worth it, it seems like the tiebreakers are pretty set.
Root against Seattle and Carolina, root for Houston.
It matters a lot if Seattle wins, but I'm not entertaining that as a possibility even though they've got a pretty good shot.
Post by: MBGreen on January 08, 2022, 03:34:50 PM
It matters a lot if Seattle wins, but I'm not entertaining that as a possibility even though they've got a pretty good shot.It's in Arizona and the Cards have a lot to play for.
I juat looked at the Cards' home record. Nevermind.
Post by: insanity on January 08, 2022, 10:28:20 PM
Post by: insanity on January 09, 2022, 08:41:34 AM
If the Jets win tomorrow the lowest we will pick is 5 if one of the following teams win: hou, Ari, min, cle.Burrow isn't playing. If the Jets win the worst we pick is number 5 in the draft. Let's get that W
Post by: bojanglesman on January 09, 2022, 08:52:33 AM
Post by: Badger on January 09, 2022, 12:36:03 PM
Seattle really needs to lose. That pick will drop like a rock if they manage to beat the Cardinals. AZ won earlier in the year in Seattle and they still have the #2 seed to play for at home. It's a good setup, but Russell Wilson is still good.I underestimated the uncertainty between picks 7-13.
LFG Cards
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 09, 2022, 12:52:15 PM
Post by: insanity on January 09, 2022, 01:57:25 PM
Post by: Laxin on January 09, 2022, 02:36:48 PM
Not that it affects the Jets at this point, but the Jags and Lions are both winning as well.
Post by: Badger on January 09, 2022, 02:40:58 PM
Texans are making a come back, only down 3.Welp
Not that it affects the Jets at this point, but the Jags and Lions are both winning as well.
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 09, 2022, 03:00:46 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on January 09, 2022, 03:02:09 PM
Jets beating the Jaguars may have cost the Jets the #1 pick in the draft.
Man FOH
Post by: MBGreen on January 09, 2022, 03:06:22 PM
Jets beating the Jaguars may have cost the Jets the #1 pick in the draft.Who gives a excrement
Post by: bojanglesman on January 09, 2022, 03:10:52 PM
Jets beating the Jaguars may have cost the Jets the #1 pick in the draft.That sucks, but a whole lot less than if we needed a QB in a QB-strong draft.
Post by: ons on January 09, 2022, 03:39:02 PM
Jets beating the Jaguars may have cost the Jets the #1 pick in the draft.
On the other hand we'd be bad enough to lose to the most dysfunctional team in football this year.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on January 09, 2022, 04:06:36 PM
On the other hand we'd be bad enough to lose to the most dysfunctional team in football this year.
Their dysfunction is the only thing that prevented that from happening.
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 09, 2022, 04:12:27 PM
Their dysfunction is the only thing that prevented that from happening.If they didn't spike it on 3rd-and-1, we probably are getting Thibodeaux. That play was so comically bad.
I was rooting for the Jets most of that game, really until the final few plays. If the Jaguars scored on 3rd or 4th and goal from the 1 to win that game, it would have meant absolutely nothing in terms of our team development long-term, but it would have delivered us a much better pick. I did not think it would be #1 though.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 09, 2022, 04:18:30 PM
Post by: Laxin on January 09, 2022, 04:23:25 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on January 07, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Just a discussion around the Texans potentially blowing the top pick by bearing the colts this year.
But looking at how winning those meaningless December games have cost teams. Unsurprisingly we are mentioned twice over the past 5 seasons.
Post by: Badger on January 07, 2023, 04:45:49 PM
Post by: MBGreen on January 07, 2023, 06:23:27 PM
Picking in the low teens vs the mid teens isn't going to alter the course of the franchise unlike picking 1 vs 2 in a QB year.Having a pick in the low teens is more valuable if you want to trade back.
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 07, 2023, 06:30:37 PM
If the Patriots win before our game ends, I'd probably root against the Jets for the draft pick. But I'll plan on rooting for the Jets to knock them out of the playoffs. If the Dolphins were already eliminated, I'm not sure where I'd land.
Post by: Libero_2 on January 07, 2023, 06:55:08 PM
Picking in the low teens vs the mid teens isn't going to alter the course of the franchise unlike picking 1 vs 2 in a QB year.
The point wasn’t about us this year, it was more other people agreeing with us for JE’s benefit more than anything else
Post by: dcm1602 on January 07, 2023, 07:08:01 PM
If it was us knocking out Miami in favor of Baltimore or Pittsburgh fine
But knocking out Miami so New England can get in?
There's no feel good story there
Plus with the health of Miamis QB room its not like they are going to do excrement
And it's not like we're cheering for our young QB of the future. It's more about some old dinosaur who I doubt plays next year
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 07, 2023, 07:14:34 PM
There's no upside to us winning this gameThe upside is that you build back a little bit of positive vibes in the building and don't end the season on a 6-game losing streak. And if Garrett and Sauce and some of our other young guys are the ones making plays, then you can look at that for hope.
If it was us knocking out Miami in favor of Baltimore or Pittsburgh fine
But knocking out Miami so New England can get in?
There's no feel good story there
Plus with the health of Miamis QB room its not like they are going to do excrement
And it's not like we're cheering for our young QB of the future. It's more about some old dinosaur who I doubt plays next year
Post by: dcm1602 on January 07, 2023, 07:46:36 PM
That's the equivalent of getting an extra 1st round pick (25th overall per the trade value chart)
Now mathematically its highly unlikely we finish either 7th or 22nd
But we're talking a substantial potential shift
At the end of the day I'd like to see us get some young guys out there anyway
Maybe see if Bryce Hall remembers how to play football
Post by: Heismanberg on January 07, 2023, 08:50:13 PM
Maybe see if Bryce Hall remembers how to play football
There's no reason to take Sauce, Reed, or MC2 out of the game.
Post by: dcm1602 on January 07, 2023, 09:00:37 PM
Play him and then see if you can get a reasonable return on him in the offseason
Post by: Jumbo on January 07, 2023, 09:15:25 PM
The Jets could end up drafting between 7 and 22
That's the equivalent of getting an extra 1st round pick (25th overall per the trade value chart)
Now mathematically its highly unlikely we finish either 7th or 22nd
But we're talking a substantial potential shift
At the end of the day I'd like to see us get some young guys out there anyway.
It does mean that beating Miami isn't so terrible, as they probably(?) end up above us in the draft order even with a loss and even if they somehow end up higher, they've already forfeited their pick.
Maybe see if Bryce Hall remembers how to play football
I don't see how there's any chance we pick 22 since the highest we can be picking is 18 missing the playoffs. There's also no chance we pick in the top 9, as even if ATL and CAR win they have a significantly lower SOS for the tiebreaker and #7 is currently LV who are 6-11, which we have no chance to be worse than. Our SOS is much higher than basically any relevant team besides Detroit, so we should probably be hoping they lose.
I think the range is from #10 (requiring NO/TEN/CLE to win) to #18. Which is still significant but not so large of a spread
Post by: dcm1602 on January 07, 2023, 09:21:27 PM
I don't see how there's any chance we pick 22 since the highest we can be picking is 18 missing the playoffs. There's also no chance we pick in the top 9, as even if ATL and CAR win they have a significantly lower SOS for the tiebreaker and #7 is currently LV who are 6-11, which we have no chance to be worse than. Our SOS is much higher than basically any relevant team besides Detroit, so we should probably be hoping they lose.
I think the range is from #10 (requiring NO/TEN/CLE to win) to #18. Which is still significant but not so large of a spread
Quote
The mathematical possibilities are somewhat limited for the Jets as they head into the final weekend of the season. The good news is that even if they win on Sunday, which would be bad for their draft order in a meaningless game, they can only fall so far. The worst-case scenario would have them falling to No. 22, but according to playoffstatus.com, there is less than a one percent chance of their pick falling below No. 16.
If the Jets lose, they could climb as high as the No. 7 pick, but no higher because there are six teams in the NFL who enter the final weekend with only five wins and there is no way the Jets can mathematically jump them in draft order.
For the Jets to get all the way up to No. 7, they’d have to lose and the Falcons, Raiders, Titans, Panthers and Browns would all have to win. Ultimately, the Jets pick is almost certain to fall between No. 10 and No. 15. But the more teams above who win, the better it is for them.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nj.com/jets/2023/01/jets-draft-order-2023-how-high-could-they-pick-what-needs-should-they-fill-who-to-root-for-week-18.html%3foutputType=amp
Post by: Jumbo on January 07, 2023, 09:27:14 PM
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nj.com/jets/2023/01/jets-draft-order-2023-how-high-could-they-pick-what-needs-should-they-fill-who-to-root-for-week-18.html%3foutputType=amp
The author of this article does not know how to interpret data correctly, unless they think that every team still has a chance to pick #32. http://playoffstatus.com/nfl/nfldraftorder.html
Every chance above >1% has us between #10 and #16. Which is still significant.
Post by: dcm1602 on January 07, 2023, 09:31:27 PM
The author of this article does not know how to interpret data correctly, unless they think that every team still has a chance to pick #32. http://playoffstatus.com/nfl/nfldraftorder.html
Every chance above >1% has us between #10 and #16. Which is still significant.
Definitely should have actually looked at that data
Between 10 and 16 isn't nearly as massive of a jump, especially when those numbers you linked suggest it's almost certainly going to be bweeen 11-15
Post by: Badger on January 07, 2023, 10:06:58 PM
The point wasn’t about us this year, it was more other people agreeing with us for JE’s benefit more than anything elseI was only referring to this year. 2020 was an exception to my usual inclinations.
Post by: Libero_2 on January 08, 2023, 05:30:54 AM
I was only referring to this year. 2020 was an exception to my usual inclinations.
Oh I agree. But if we are ever in a similar boat, or as MB suggests, in 2023 to tank for a 2024 QB…. Then we should at least do it correctly.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on January 08, 2023, 01:05:11 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on January 08, 2023, 01:30:57 PM
Post by: Andrew Ryan on January 08, 2023, 01:36:35 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on January 08, 2023, 01:39:21 PM
I might be in the minority here but between the Pats, Fish, and Steelers, I'm most comfortable with seeing the Fish in the playoffs (especially if Thompson has to start another game).I hate all 3 of them, but I am contractually bound to hate the Dolphins and Pats more.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on January 08, 2023, 01:42:24 PM
I hate all 3 of them, but I am contractually bound to hate the Dolphins and Pats more.
I'd enjoy the Fish getting blown out of the wild card round more than seeing the Steelers sneak into the playoffs for the second year in a row.
Post by: bojanglesman on January 08, 2023, 03:20:47 PM
Post by: Badger on January 08, 2023, 03:22:08 PM
Are we set at 13?Seems so.
NO, CLE, TEN losing screwed us out of being top 10.
Post by: Jumbo on January 08, 2023, 03:33:34 PM
Are we set at 13?
Yes. SOS cannot change enough for us to jump Cleveland in the order
Post by: MBGreen on January 08, 2023, 03:42:18 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on January 08, 2023, 03:49:14 PM
Post by: Jumbo on January 08, 2023, 03:51:51 PM
I’m actually taking a lot of solace in not being one of the ten worst teams in the league by this metric.
Despite the last place schedule we had a top 5 SOS this season.
Post by: steves850 on January 09, 2023, 08:58:56 AM
Post by: CatoTheElder on January 09, 2023, 09:14:19 AM
Post by: d sw0rdz on January 09, 2023, 05:49:47 PM
If we sit at 13, Stroud or Levis may be available. Do we roll the dice?
if that happens i hope we pull a tradeback
Post by: bojanglesman on January 09, 2023, 05:53:32 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on January 09, 2023, 06:11:57 PM
I can't imagine we even consider drafting a QB this year.
This would be worse to me than keeping MLF is to MB
I'd wholeheartedly be on the fire Joe Douglas bandwagon if we draft a QB in the 1st
Post by: MexJetinBcn on January 10, 2023, 03:50:48 AM
Despite the last place schedule we had a top 5 SOS this season.
We finished tied with 7 teams at 7-9 but will pick 13th instead of 7th in the draft because of our SOS
Post by: MBGreen on January 10, 2023, 07:52:12 AM
We finished tied with 7 teams at 7-9 but will pick 13th instead of 7th in the draft because of our SOS
Same old jets
Post by: Badger on January 15, 2023, 07:27:38 PM
https://youtu.be/5gPjZf6c7SU
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 15, 2023, 07:31:21 PM
Rich Eisen was rightIf we lose that game (and the Browns game)...
https://youtu.be/5gPjZf6c7SU
- Trevor Lawrence is still our QB and is developing at a normal rate for a young QB where we have faith in him
- Jets are a playoff team this year
- Jets don't have to worry about QB this offseason, so we can load up on OL, DL, LB and safety in the draft and FA
- Jets snap the longest active playoff drought in the NFL
- MLF is probably still OC and Saleh is viewed in a more positive light
- Johnny English is slightly less happy because he wasn't able to throw his Rams victory party
- Zach Wilson and Urban Meyer and the Jaguars become the first team in NFL history to go 0-17
Post by: Andrew Ryan on January 15, 2023, 07:35:53 PM
Post by: Jumbo on January 15, 2023, 07:39:17 PM
If we lose that game (and the Browns game)...
- Trevor Lawrence is still our QB and is developing at a normal rate for a young QB where we have faith in him
- Jets are a playoff team this year
- Jets don't have to worry about QB this offseason, so we can load up on OL, DL, LB and safety in the draft and FA
- Jets snap the longest active playoff drought in the NFL
- MLF is probably still OC and Saleh is viewed in a more positive light
- Johnny English is slightly less happy because he wasn't able to throw his Rams victory party
- Zach Wilson and Urban Meyer and the Jaguars become the first team in NFL history to go 0-17
yeah but we needed the 13 players still on our roster from that team to win those games for adam gase to develop the C U L T U R E
Post by: reuben on January 15, 2023, 07:49:29 PM
If we lose that game (and the Browns game)...
- Trevor Lawrence is still our QB and is developing at a normal rate for a young QB where we have faith in him
- Jets are a playoff team this year
- Jets don't have to worry about QB this offseason, so we can load up on OL, DL, LB and safety in the draft and FA
- Jets snap the longest active playoff drought in the NFL
- MLF is probably still OC and Saleh is viewed in a more positive light
- Johnny English is slightly less happy because he wasn't able to throw his Rams victory party
- Zach Wilson and Urban Meyer and the Jaguars become the first team in NFL history to go 0-17
Not sure we don't wind up with Urban, but I'm certain the Jaguars wouldn't have. Dude only wanted the easiest possible path to success in the NFL, for now obvious reasons.
Post by: Johnny English on January 15, 2023, 08:08:24 PM
If we lose that game (and the Browns game)...
- Trevor Lawrence is still our QB and is developing at a normal rate for a young QB where we have faith in him
Why can Trevor Lawrence outperform MLF and Calabrese's poor coaching and QB development, but not Urban Meyer's?
Post by: CatoTheElder on January 15, 2023, 09:55:27 PM
This is such a loser franchise that we complain about not being the worst team in a given season.
Post by: dcm1602 on January 15, 2023, 10:12:28 PM
I don't care.
This is such a loser franchise that we complain about not being the worst team in a given season.
No we're complaining because instead of having a guy that can be a decent to good QB for the next 12-20 years, we got embarrassed for having a pathetic joke and a fraud for barely over a year. And we'll miss our window yet again because we have among the worst QB play in the league all the freaking time
Post by: CatoTheElder on January 15, 2023, 10:16:58 PM
No we're complaining because instead of having a guy that can be a decent to good QB for the next 12-20 years, we got embarrassed for having a pathetic joke and a fraud for barely over a year. And we'll miss our window yet again because we have among the worst QB play in the league all the freaking time
Sounds like some loser excrement.
Post by: dcm1602 on January 15, 2023, 10:18:05 PM
I think the ineptitude of the decision makers in the Zach Wilson process was as much if not a bigger problem than actually winning the games that took Trevor off the table
Post by: Andrew Ryan on January 15, 2023, 10:27:17 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on January 15, 2023, 10:31:10 PM
Zach was the consensus #2 QB prospect. The 49ers and Eagles both would have drafted him if they had the opportunity.
Would the 49ers and eagles both have traded their 1st round QB's on rookie contracts to have drafted him?
Not here to beat a dead horse, is what it is
Post by: Andrew Ryan on January 15, 2023, 10:34:05 PM
Would the 49ers and eagles both have traded their 1st round QB's on rookie contracts to have drafted him?
Not here to beat a dead horse, is what it is
I don't know. If they had Sam Darnold going into year four, it was possible, if not probable.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on January 15, 2023, 10:37:41 PM
Post by: Andrew Ryan on January 15, 2023, 10:44:01 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 15, 2023, 10:46:08 PM
Taking Zach to replace Sam made sense if you were any number of people who believed he was a superior talent. Obviously the decision has not worked out to this point but it was not bad process.You needed to not believe Sam was the answer, and you needed to believe Zach was.
You don't get many opportunities to pick that high in a draft when you need a QB. We are running into that issue now, though this QB class isn't that good.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on January 15, 2023, 11:14:07 PM
Post by: Johnny English on January 15, 2023, 11:21:01 PM
If you believe you have the opportunity to upgrade at QB, you do it.Sure. They believed wrong.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on January 16, 2023, 04:31:08 AM
Sure. They believed wrong.
They believed wrong by choosing Zach, they didn't believe wrong by dumping Darnold.
Post by: MBGreen on January 16, 2023, 06:39:43 AM
Darnold stinks btw.
Post by: dcm1602 on January 16, 2023, 07:46:50 AM
You guys really love living in the past eh?
Darnold stinks btw.
Tends to happen when you have the longest playoff drought in the league
Post by: MBGreen on January 16, 2023, 07:50:03 AM
Tends to happen when you have the longest playoff drought in the league
Keep dwelling on it, you'll feel better.
Post by: Badger on January 16, 2023, 12:15:00 PM
You guys really love living in the past eh?Somehow keeping Darnold > drafting a new QB or acquiring a 26 yr old MVP
Darnold stinks btw.
Post by: MBGreen on January 16, 2023, 12:20:00 PM
Somehow keeping Darnold > drafting a new QB or acquiring a 26 yr old MVP
we're on the same page, young bull.
Boggles the mind.
Post by: Coach K on January 16, 2023, 12:31:52 PM
Somehow keeping Darnold > drafting a new QB or acquiring a 26 yr old MVPHe just needed the great MLF. We killed two perfectly good top tier QBs and OCs for impatience
/sarcasm
Post by: dcm1602 on January 16, 2023, 02:12:57 PM
Somehow keeping Darnold > drafting a new QB or acquiring a 26 yr old MVP
Does drafting Zach Wilson really count as drafting a QB?
Post by: delavan on January 16, 2023, 06:33:21 PM
Does drafting Zach Wilson really count as drafting a QB?
Post by: delavan on January 16, 2023, 06:33:40 PM
Does drafting Zach Wilson really count as drafting a QB?
Post by: delavan on January 16, 2023, 06:34:03 PM
Does drafting Zach Wilson really count as drafting a QB?
Post by: MBGreen on September 26, 2023, 12:12:20 PM
Post by: loyaljetsfan on September 26, 2023, 04:33:53 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on September 26, 2023, 04:39:04 PM
#collapseforcaleb
I do not want a QB that paints his fingernails
Post by: Andrew Ryan on September 26, 2023, 04:40:26 PM
I do not want a QB that paints his fingernails
At least he doesn't sound like Kermit the Frog?
Post by: MBGreen on September 26, 2023, 04:42:14 PM
I do not want a QB that paints his fingernails
if he wins us a Superbowl, he can wear a dress for all i care.
Post by: Jumbo on September 26, 2023, 04:43:31 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on September 26, 2023, 04:44:15 PM
Honestly, I would prefer some Penix.
I don't like lefties
Post by: Andrew Ryan on September 26, 2023, 04:45:54 PM
Post by: MBGreen on September 26, 2023, 04:47:10 PM
Obtaining the #1 pick is now a more attainable goal than making the playoffs so I'm firmly in that camp. Finish the job we couldn't in 2020.
JE will have a stroke reading this post.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 26, 2023, 04:49:48 PM
Post by: Andrew Ryan on September 26, 2023, 04:51:25 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on September 26, 2023, 05:01:43 PM
I do not want a QB that paints his fingernails
Maybe you should just get over your hangups instead of making them the board’s problems.
Post by: Badger on September 26, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Maybe you should just get over your hangups instead of making them the board’s problems.*takes out calipers to measure his hairline*
Post by: Badger on September 26, 2023, 05:05:40 PM
Obtaining the #1 pick is now a more attainable goal than making the playoffs so I'm firmly in that camp. Finish the job we couldn't in 2020.Better start working out trades for all of our players who like winning.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 26, 2023, 05:09:28 PM
Better start working out trades for all of our players who like winning.Maybe we can loan players like it's the Premier League.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 26, 2023, 05:15:40 PM
#collapseforcaleb
I need y’all to let this dream die early. It isn’t happening.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 26, 2023, 05:17:18 PM
Barring the unexpected, we're going to have a clear disadvantage at QB every game we play for the rest of the season. I'm not sure there's another team that can say that.
Bears/Panthers aka the Bears/Bears
We have a much better overall team than either.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on September 26, 2023, 05:21:20 PM
Bears/Panthers aka the Bears/Bears
We have a much better overall team than either.
While we obviously have more talent than both of those teams, I'm not sure either will have a clear disadvantage at QB in that game which was my point.
The team with the better QB wins the majority of the time. That's especially true when the team with the inferior QB is outcoached.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 26, 2023, 07:46:56 PM
Week 4:
• Vikings (0-3) vs. Panthers (0-3)
• Broncos (0-3) vs. Bears (0-3)
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 26, 2023, 07:52:40 PM
4 winless teams left and they play each other this weekI don't think the Jets are going to be bad enough to get a top-5 pick, but if they are, the Broncos game could be very relevant.
Week 4:
• Vikings (0-3) vs. Panthers (0-3)
• Broncos (0-3) vs. Bears (0-3)
Post by: ScotlandJet on September 27, 2023, 10:50:09 AM
I don't think the Jets are going to be bad enough to get a top-5 pick, but if they are, the Broncos game could be very relevant.
Groan! We are already on suck watch for a better pick.
I can't believe a season that started with so much optimism has turned to this.
Post by: Coach K on September 27, 2023, 05:55:43 PM
We'd need 2 or 3 big injuries on D for this thread to become worth discussing in earnest
Which I'd never wish for . Draft better and play better pick position be damned.
Sent from my SM-G988U using Tapatalk
Post by: Andrew Ryan on September 27, 2023, 08:20:48 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 27, 2023, 09:26:03 PM
The Athletic has a model that currently projects us to finish with the 3rd worst record (behind the Bears and Cardinals). Given our options at QB, I don't think it's that far fetched.
I’m sure that’s factoring in schedule analysis I can’t bother to look at this early on, but I think:
Arizona is actually decent (Dobbs is somehow playing well and their defense has been really good so far)
Panthers are worse than us.
Broncos could become a dumpster fire but we should have our answer in week 5.
That’s all I got.
I still agree with Coach K that the overall team is too good to finish bottom 3.
Post by: MBGreen on September 27, 2023, 09:57:18 PM
I’m sure that’s factoring in schedule analysis I can’t bother to look at this early on, but I think:(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230928/c43056293d4451f0827ad4cf4d5dda54.jpg)
Arizona is actually decent (Dobbs is somehow playing well and their defense has been really good so far)
Panthers are worse than us.
Broncos could become a dumpster fire but we should have our answer in week 5.
That’s all I got.
I still agree with Coach K that the overall team is too good to finish bottom 3.
Post by: Coach K on September 27, 2023, 10:17:18 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230928/c43056293d4451f0827ad4cf4d5dda54.jpg)Lol I've seen that one . Still very accurate
Sent from my SM-G988U using Tapatalk
Post by: Badger on September 27, 2023, 10:19:03 PM
I still agree with Coach K that the overall team is too good to finish bottom 3.
Unless they completely give up.
Post by: Coach K on September 27, 2023, 10:39:53 PM
Sent from my SM-G988U using Tapatalk
Post by: Coach K on September 27, 2023, 10:40:59 PM
Yeah this is a possibility but that's probably only the case if they go into bye still chirping about zach being good and the rest of the team needing to step up because that locker room will only hold up for so long under that MO if we keep losing
Unless they completely give up.
Sent from my SM-G988U using Tapatalk
Post by: mj2sexay on September 27, 2023, 10:55:03 PM
And even if they were, we all know that Jets-Browns with the Browns needing the W for the playoffs would feature an incredibly disappointing bust of a signing in Dalvin Cook going off for like 130 with two scores as Thomas Morestead makes a desperate last second tackle to stop a punt return and seal the Browns shocking loss.
C'mon. We've all played knifey/spoony before. Fucked is us. The only escape from the perpetual non stop assrape of being a fan of this franchise is the sweet release of death.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 28, 2023, 08:17:09 AM
Unless they completely give up.
They didn’t give up last year, but Breece and AVT going down was curtains for our season. And we still picked 15th
Post by: MBGreen on September 28, 2023, 08:19:06 AM
They didn’t give up last year, but Breece and AVT going down was curtains for our season. And we still picked 15th
what if MLF was better than Hackett?
*runs and hides*
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 28, 2023, 09:52:07 AM
what if MLF was better than Hackett?
*runs and hides*
What if Bowles was better than Gase?
What if I’m a prophet?
All of these guys stink, just for clarity.
Post by: MBGreen on September 28, 2023, 09:56:06 AM
What if Bowles was better than Gase?
What if I’m a prophet?
All of these guys stink, just for clarity.
Now you're getting it.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 28, 2023, 10:56:57 AM
Post by: MBGreen on September 28, 2023, 10:58:27 AM
What if this pile of excrement is better than this pile of puke?
bam profit
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 28, 2023, 12:06:22 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on September 28, 2023, 12:16:52 PM
I keep thinking we're too good to get a top-3 pick, and I still mostly think that. But the Jets are 1-8 in their last 9 games. There's a chance this gets out of hand quickly, and whenever you have the worst QB situation in the league, anything bad can happen.
We're not able to score league average points. The defense is Super Bowl good but the offense completely negates it.
We'll probably win a few more games this year, but because the defense and special teams score points. The offense barely spends time in opposing territory, never mind scoring points.
Post by: Heismanberg on September 28, 2023, 12:19:40 PM
The defense is Super Bowl good
Is it?
Post by: AlioTheFool on September 28, 2023, 12:23:50 PM
Is it?
I guess that's a fair question. But it's impossible to say definitively with the current offense.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 28, 2023, 12:26:48 PM
Is it?
We'll find out this weekend. The Chiefs won't take the foot off the pedal if they get a lead like the Pats. If we hold them in the mid 20's or under with our excrement QB play, we have a good defense. I don't see that happening whether our defense is good or not.
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 28, 2023, 12:34:11 PM
The problem is that the Browns, Ravens, Bills, Cowboys, 49ers, Patriots, Steelers, Chiefs and Eagles also may have Super Bowl defenses.
Post by: Coach K on September 28, 2023, 02:11:56 PM
The defense is Super Bowl good. I don't think that's really debatable.This
The problem is that the Browns, Ravens, Bills, Cowboys, 49ers, Patriots, Steelers, Chiefs and Eagles also may have Super Bowl defenses.
Sent from my SM-G988U using Tapatalk
Post by: Badger on October 02, 2023, 11:33:37 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 02, 2023, 04:24:11 PM
edited because I'm dumb #ittfrsp
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 02, 2023, 04:27:28 PM
The Jets have the longest odds to make the AFC of any team.
I think you a letter there.
#ITTFFSP
Post by: steves850 on October 02, 2023, 04:34:55 PM
I think you a letter there.No he didn’t. If the Jets don’t have a winning record they’ll be relegated to the new USXL.
#ITTFFSP
Post by: Badger on October 14, 2023, 07:48:10 PM
Post by: Badger on October 15, 2023, 06:59:09 PM
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 15, 2023, 07:01:35 PM
My Giants fan friend wants them to collapse for Caleb.
Wonderful.
Can we lock this excrement, please?
Post by: Heismanberg on October 15, 2023, 07:01:54 PM
Post by: Badger on October 15, 2023, 07:08:24 PM
Wonderful.Compromise, moved it to the NFL forum
Can we lock this excrement, please?
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 15, 2023, 08:01:46 PM
Post by: Badger on October 15, 2023, 08:10:15 PM
Stupid. Leave it in the Jets forum and just ignore it until the next time we need to tank. Hopefully it will be a while.I'll move it back when we suck again
Post by: CatoTheElder on October 15, 2023, 08:18:29 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on October 15, 2023, 09:17:17 PM
I'll move it back when we suck again
15 years.
Post by: reuben on October 15, 2023, 09:48:08 PM
Brian Hoyer beat them today. I forgot Brian Hoyer was still in the league.
Post by: Jumbo on October 15, 2023, 09:50:47 PM
This thread is now a lolPatriots thread because I don't think there's another win on their schedule.
Brian Hoyer beat them today. I forgot Brian Hoyer was still in the league.
They play the Jets one more time, so at least one more
Post by: bojanglesman on November 19, 2023, 06:02:08 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 19, 2023, 06:19:01 PM
Post by: Johnny English on November 19, 2023, 06:26:34 PM
I blame whoever moved this thread to the NFL forum for this entire season. Hubris.
(https://i.imgur.com/ZmNlZqP.png)
Done after the Eagles game. Seems clear who is responsible for destroying our season.
Post by: Badger on November 19, 2023, 06:31:53 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/ZmNlZqP.png)Never would have come to this if you hadn't cost us Trevor Lawrence (the one season where this thread wasn't pathetic).
Done after the Eagles game. Seems clear who is responsible for destroying our season.
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 19, 2023, 06:32:52 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 19, 2023, 06:38:29 PM
Never would have come to this if you hadn't cost us Trevor Lawrence (the one season where this thread wasn't pathetic).Fair point. You two can share the blame.
Post by: Badger on November 19, 2023, 07:01:38 PM
Fair point. You two can share the blame.Technically this is on MB for bumping it in the first place.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 19, 2023, 07:02:30 PM
Technically this is on MB for bumping it in the first place.Everything is partly MB's fault. I thought that was implied.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 19, 2023, 07:03:13 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 19, 2023, 07:04:03 PM
Technically this is on MB for bumping it in the first place.I didn't bump it ...
Still your fault
Post by: CatoTheElder on November 19, 2023, 07:21:44 PM
Technically this is on MB for bumping it in the first place.
Three-way knife fight I'd rather watch than our game against the Phins.
Post by: MBGreen on November 20, 2023, 07:04:16 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 20, 2023, 07:30:11 AM
the loss yesterday bumped the Jets up from 13 to 11 in the draft order, according to tankathon.we're back babbie!
Post by: MBGreen on November 20, 2023, 07:32:58 AM
we're back babbie!
regulators!......mount up
Post by: d sw0rdz on November 20, 2023, 07:54:34 AM
regulators!......mount up
pain
every year
Post by: Heismanberg on November 20, 2023, 08:34:49 AM
We can beat all three of them. They also stand in our way for a better pick.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 20, 2023, 08:54:47 AM
Post by: Johnny English on November 20, 2023, 09:13:32 AM
I can already tell that Week 18 New England game is going to be painful for both sides with the draft implications and rivalry implications.
Belichick isn't rolling over against the Jets to get a better draft pick, so if we beat them it isn't because they let us. And I really hope we do.
Post by: MBGreen on November 20, 2023, 11:04:34 AM
we should be able to beat Atlanta and New England, but then i quickly remember our offense is below XFL level...
a top 10 pick is certainly on the table for us in 2024.
If it so happens we end up with a top 10 pick...trading back a few spots to recoup our 2nd rounder (and more) would be my first choice.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 20, 2023, 11:49:20 AM
If it so happens we end up with a top 10 pick...trading back a few spots to recoup our 2nd rounder (and more) would be my first choice.
Caleb Williams
Drake Maye
Marvin Harrison Jr.
Those are Top 3 locks
We need to get a close to the Top 5 as possible to have a shot at Joe Alt or Olu Fashanu. If we land outside the Top 5, we've still got a really good shot at landing an elite prospect like Malik Nabers.
The second tier OTs like Graham Barton, Taliese Fuaga, and Amarius Mims would be in play too.
Post by: Johnny English on November 20, 2023, 12:46:19 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on November 20, 2023, 12:48:04 PM
Give Jim Harbaugh all the money, tell him to bring Sherrone Moore with him, draft JJ McCarthy.
Why do you want this team to suck?
Post by: Johnny English on November 20, 2023, 12:52:30 PM
Why do you want this team to suck?
Jim Harbaugh is elite
Post by: Heismanberg on November 20, 2023, 12:53:45 PM
Jim Harbaugh is elite
JJ McCarthy is not (and we don't have a second round pick)
Post by: Johnny English on November 20, 2023, 12:55:48 PM
JJ McCarthy is not (and we don't have a second round pick)
He could be. He looks pretty fine at Michigan when he isn't injured.
We don't need the QB to win the game for us. We need a QB who can execute a scheme that will.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 20, 2023, 12:58:11 PM
He could be. He looks pretty fine at Michigan when he isn't injured.
We don't need the QB to win the game for us. We need a QB who can execute a scheme that will.
Will he have the other team’s signals in the NFL?
Post by: Johnny English on November 20, 2023, 01:02:01 PM
Will he have the other team’s signals in the NFL?
Hopefully
Post by: Badger on November 20, 2023, 01:44:07 PM
Since everyone is in a bad mood, i thought i would make things worse by bumping this thread. Enjoy!
I didn't bump it ...PWWWWWWCH
Still your fault
Post by: MBGreen on November 20, 2023, 02:38:04 PM
PWWWWWWCH
wasn't me...was at the pub.