Post by: Badger on August 11, 2015, 09:04:10 PM
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/11/c8a6b96d9a67c5210aa83a75469702a0.jpg)
Post by: Heismanberg on August 11, 2015, 09:05:21 PM
Let's gooooooooooooo
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 11, 2015, 10:00:44 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on August 11, 2015, 10:03:24 PM
Post by: Johnny English on August 11, 2015, 10:22:08 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on August 12, 2015, 05:53:27 AM
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 12, 2015, 06:48:55 AM
Post by: Cane on August 12, 2015, 08:25:16 AM
Now we have a season to look forward to.
loljetsfan might be a better name.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 12, 2015, 08:26:57 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on August 12, 2015, 10:17:35 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KO4Z4NHk4Lk
That never gets old. He sounds like someone getting their balls waxed with alcohol.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 12, 2015, 10:21:57 AM
That never gets old. He sounds like someone getting their balls waxed with alcohol.
It's hilarious, but I love that excrement. He gets fired up. We haven't had a leader like that in a while.
I know there's a high chance that he'll do some bad things out there, but when he's on, it will be fun, exciting football again for the team and fans.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 12, 2015, 10:23:51 AM
Now we have a season to look forward to.
I'm conflicted. You hate to see this kind of thing, Geno seems like a good guy and I feel bad for him that this happened, but on the flip side him starting was one of the main reasons I felt this season was doomed to failure. Not that Fitzpatrick is some kind of savior but we knew what Geno was going to do and that was going to be another season closer to death without winning anything.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 12, 2015, 10:24:33 AM
Geno seems like a good guy
No, he doesn't. Especially after what Ryan Clark said this morning.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 12, 2015, 10:25:29 AM
No, he doesn't. Especially after what Ryan Clark said this morning.
Who is Ryan Clark? I'm basing it on my own perception of him being here for 2-1/2 years.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 12, 2015, 10:29:29 AM
Who is Ryan Clark? I'm basing it on my own perception of him being here for 2-1/2 years.
http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2015/08/ex-nfl_safety_ryan_clark_says_jets_geno_smith_not.html
Post by: Tommy on August 12, 2015, 10:43:37 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 12, 2015, 10:48:39 AM
http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2015/08/ex-nfl_safety_ryan_clark_says_jets_geno_smith_not.html
With apologies to bojanglesman, this is how I picture it going down:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3T_M28lIn4
Post by: bojanglesman on August 12, 2015, 11:18:10 AM
With apologies to bojanglesman, this is how I picture it going down:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3T_M28lIn4
Ha. That would have been much smoother.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 12, 2015, 11:19:46 AM
Ha. That would have been much smoother.
Even after 10 years and about a million times I still laugh every time I see that shot.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on August 12, 2015, 07:03:11 PM
– Jets are better off at QB with Fitzpatrick [ESPN NFL Nation]
http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/174055/inside-slant-jets-are-better-at-qb-today-with-ryan-fitzpatrick
– The Jets will be better with Ryan Fitzpatrick [NJAM]
http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2015/08/geno_smith_holy_cow_jets_are_you_serious_column_po.html
– Jets offense will probably be better with Fitzpatrick [FiveThirtyEight]
– Is Fitzpatrick actually an upgrade over Geno Smith? [Wall Street Journal]
http://www.wsj.com/articles/is-ryan-fitzpatrick-actually-an-upgrade-over-geno-smith-for-jets-1439332177
– Jets can survive without Geno, perhaps even be better [CBS Sports]
– Fitzpatrick, by any measure, is the better quarterback [CBS New York]
Post by: Derek Smalls on August 12, 2015, 08:15:55 PM
Post by: Badger on August 12, 2015, 08:43:38 PM
Post by: Johnny English on August 12, 2015, 10:20:35 PM
Fitz was a better QB than Geno the last 2 years but he's capped out at a mediocre QB. The goal with Geno was that he could be the long-term answer. But those articles have merit.
I don't think he ever really could have. He's never shown any sign of being able to handle the mental side of the game.
Post by: AlioTheFool on August 12, 2015, 11:27:24 PM
And now we don't have to wait until we're 0-4 in October thanks to Geno to see what Fitz can do. It just sucks if Geno really had "figured it out" and we just lost the future over a plane ticket and limo ride.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on August 13, 2015, 07:02:43 AM
No one disputes what the plan was - we just thought it wasn't a good plan.
It wasn't a good plan, but it was one of the only options with our limited resources at the QB position. If Geno improved, great. if not, we know what we (should) have in Fitzpatrick. I would feel a lot better about this whole thing if we didn't have terrible depth at the position.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on August 13, 2015, 07:05:26 AM
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 13, 2015, 07:09:27 AM
seriously though, all this team needs is average QB play and we're dangerous. We've been hamstrung by the position for longer than I care to remember.
Which is exactly why Geno getting knocked the freak out is the best thing to happen to this franchise in years.
Post by: ukilledkenny on August 13, 2015, 07:16:48 AM
Which is exactly why Geno getting knocked the freak out is the best thing to happen to this franchise in years.
Except Fitz could have played without us losing a capable #2. No matter how much anyone hates Geno no argument can be made that Petty or a guy off the street is a better backup.
Post by: Laxin on August 13, 2015, 07:50:18 AM
Which is exactly why Geno getting knocked the freak out is the best thing to happen to this franchise in years.
I think this is pretty damn harsh. If Geno didn't play well or Fitz was clearly the better QB, the end result would be the same without having a young QB get his jaw broken and get his future determined for him. If Fitz was head and shoulders above Geno (like many are making him out to be), then I see no reason as to why Gailey and Bowles wouldn't make the change from a QB they have no attachment to at either the start of the season or during the preseason.
Post by: nyjunc on August 13, 2015, 10:48:37 AM
I'm conflicted. You hate to see this kind of thing, Geno seems like a good guy and I feel bad for him that this happened, but on the flip side him starting was one of the main reasons I felt this season was doomed to failure. Not that Fitzpatrick is some kind of savior but we knew what Geno was going to do and that was going to be another season closer to death without winning anything.
we had a better shot w/ geno. geno was still a bit of an unknown, Fitz is known and not very good. he will put up decent #s and fool some people but he's a Kyle Orton/Matt Moore type that you can't win with. I hope I am wrong but I have seen too much of him to have any confidence in him.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 13, 2015, 10:51:07 AM
we had a better shot w/ geno.
Welp, this settles it. We're better off with Ryan Fitzpatrick.
Post by: MBGreen on August 13, 2015, 10:58:10 AM
we had a better shot w/ geno. geno was still a bit of an unknown, Fitz is known and not very good. he will put up decent #s and fool some people but he's a Kyle Orton/Matt Moore type that you can't win with. I hope I am wrong but I have seen too much of him to have any confidence in him.
Did you not see enough of Geno to come to the same conclusion?
Fitz is a stopgap....no more no less.
Post by: nyjunc on August 13, 2015, 11:04:42 AM
Did you not see enough of Geno to come to the same conclusion?
Fitz is a stopgap....no more no less.
I am not pro Geno but I was interested to see him in this system w/ this talent around him. there was still hope, Fitz is nothing more than a quality backup. if he has to start long term we aren't winning.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 13, 2015, 11:06:45 AM
if he has to start long term we aren't winning.
His contract expires after this season.
We aren't winning a damn thing with Geno Smith. He loses games. All this team needs right now is someone that won't do that.
Post by: MBGreen on August 13, 2015, 11:09:00 AM
I am not pro Geno but I was interested to see him in this system w/ this talent around him. there was still hope, Fitz is nothing more than a quality backup. if he has to start long term we aren't winning.
I'm with you in that i wanted to see what Geno could do in this offense.
But after seeing how he handles himself in the locker room....i hope we never see him in green/white again.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 13, 2015, 11:09:44 AM
He is a terrible player.
Post by: Tommy on August 13, 2015, 11:18:17 AM
I am not pro Geno but I was interested to see him in this system w/ this talent around him. there was still hope, Fitz is nothing more than a quality backup. if he has to start long term we aren't winning.
We always say this about bad young quarterbacks. Sanchez went into an entirely different system with better talent around him in Philly and he was still, well, Sanchez.
Post by: nyjunc on August 13, 2015, 11:30:42 AM
His contract expires after this season.
We aren't winning a damn thing with Geno Smith. He loses games. All this team needs right now is someone that won't do that.
I meant more than coming in for part of a game or a couple of games.
w/ geno we won 8 games 2 years ago w/ a roster half as talented as we have now. I wouldn't say w/ confidence we'd win w/ geno but I wouldn't rule it out either.
Post by: nyjunc on August 13, 2015, 11:31:44 AM
I'm with you in that i wanted to see what Geno could do in this offense.
But after seeing how he handles himself in the locker room....i hope we never see him in green/white again.
I think his time has come, if Fitz plays reasonably well and we are winning I don't think geno ever sees the field again for us.
Post by: nyjunc on August 13, 2015, 11:32:51 AM
We always say this about bad young quarterbacks. Sanchez went into an entirely different system with better talent around him in Philly and he was still, well, Sanchez.
he was actually very good, the offense scored almost a TD more per game w/ him under C than w/ Foles(who is a pretty good QB). They missed the playoffs b/c they couldn't stop anyone. if we had mark this year we'd be a playoff lock.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 13, 2015, 11:33:26 AM
w/ geno we won 8 games 2 years ago w/ a roster half as talented as we have now. I wouldn't say w/ confidence we'd win w/ geno but I wouldn't rule it out either.
Smith didn't win those games. He isn't a pitcher.
Fitzpatrick and the Texans won 6 games...the worst team in the NFL the previous season.
Post by: Tommy on August 13, 2015, 11:41:14 AM
Post by: MBGreen on August 13, 2015, 11:44:28 AM
At the end of the day Geno and Fitz are basically stopgaps. I don't even think the coaching staff was under the delusion that either guy is the long term answer for this offense. We lost one stop gap, and are now stuck with another. Except now we have a more experienced stop gap.
The jets didn't view Geno as a stopgap.
Post by: Miamipuck on August 13, 2015, 11:45:57 AM
The jets didn't view Geno as a stopgap.
He was thought more of a stop punch.
Post by: Tommy on August 13, 2015, 11:51:22 AM
The jets didn't view Geno as a stopgap.
Yea they did.
Post by: bojanglesman on August 13, 2015, 11:53:21 AM
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 13, 2015, 11:53:47 AM
I think this is pretty damn harsh. If Geno didn't play well or Fitz was clearly the better QB, the end result would be the same without having a young QB get his jaw broken and get his future determined for him. If Fitz was head and shoulders above Geno (like many are making him out to be), then I see no reason as to why Gailey and Bowles wouldn't make the change from a QB they have no attachment to at either the start of the season or during the preseason.
Not quite...with Geno out, we can start the Fitz era at 0-0 versus 1-3 had he not.
Post by: MBGreen on August 13, 2015, 11:54:24 AM
Yea they did.
do you know what a stopgap is, Tommy?
Post by: Tommy on August 13, 2015, 11:54:46 AM
do you know what a stopgap is, Tommy?
Yes. Do you?
Post by: nyjunc on August 13, 2015, 11:57:04 AM
Smith didn't win those games. He isn't a pitcher.
Fitzpatrick and the Texans won 6 games...the worst team in the NFL the previous season.
yeah, the coaching change and health had npthing to do w/ that.
By the way, Houston as 6-6 w/ Fitz and 3-1 w/ other starting Qbs,
No team has ever won more than 6 games in a season w/ Fitz starting.
Post by: MBGreen on August 13, 2015, 11:59:43 AM
Yes. Do you?
Of course i do.
Fitzpatrick isn't the long term solution here due to talent, age, and the length of contract he signed. Geno, is a young QB that the Jets invested a high draft pick on. Given the fact Geno wasn't traded or cut after a new coaching staff/GM were hired leads me to believe they wanted to see what they have in him....before making any decisions regarding his future here.
the latter isn't a stopgap.
Post by: Derek Smalls on August 13, 2015, 12:09:37 PM
Geno, is a young QB that the Jets invested a high draft pick on. Given the fact Geno wasn't traded or cut after a new coaching staff/GM were hired leads me to believe they wanted to see what they have in him....before making any decisions regarding his future here.
the latter isn't a stopgap.
It would have made no sense to cut Geno, nor would it have made much sense to trade him at a discount.
He's a stopgap in the sense that he was starting because we had no way to get better options. Same with Fitz. But unlike Fitz, Geno had an outside chance to grow into more than that, so he wasn't your typical stopgap.
Post by: MBGreen on August 13, 2015, 12:12:07 PM
It would have made no sense to cut Geno, nor would it have made much sense to trade him at a discount.
He's a stopgap in the sense that he was starting because we had no way to get better options. Same with Fitz. But unlike Fitz, Geno had an outside chance to grow into more than that, so he wasn't your typical stopgap.
IMO, a stopgap is a player we know is only here in the short term (1 or 2 years). Granted, we all didn't want Geno...but before the locker room situation, the Jets were going to give him the chance to succeed and grow into his position. I don't believe Geno was a stopgap in the eyes of the Jets before the fight happened.
Post by: Tommy on August 13, 2015, 12:13:52 PM
Of course i do.
Fitzpatrick isn't the long term solution here due to talent, age, and the length of contract he signed. Geno, is a young QB that the Jets invested a high draft pick on. Given the fact Geno wasn't traded or cut after a new coaching staff/GM were hired leads me to believe they wanted to see what they have in him....before making any decisions regarding his future here.
the latter isn't a stopgap.
I'm sorry, did you say something? All I heard was "Derp I'm MBGreen and I can never admit that I'm wrong, ey!"
Post by: MBGreen on August 13, 2015, 12:17:40 PM
I'm sorry, did you say something? All I heard was "Derp I'm MBGreen and I can never admit that I'm wrong, ey!"
Oh...i expected you to retort with "Geno is a stupid n*gger, and that's okay, cause i'm high".
my bad.
Post by: Ignatius J Reilly on August 13, 2015, 01:49:44 PM
Except Fitz could have played without us losing a capable #2. No matter how much anyone hates Geno no argument can be made that Petty or a guy off the street is a better backup.
Yep. Like I said when it happened, I'm not upset Geno won't be starting. I'm upset because he should have lost the job on the field. This was the worst way for him not to be starting, and it's silly to pretend the method didn't make a difference. He was doing all the right things in camp, and so instead of shitting the bed and demonstrating for the coaching staff that it was absolutely the wrong move for him to start, they have the ambiguity of Geno in mid season possibly taking the job back. I'm not sure Fitz is going to succeed. I don't see how anyone could feel certain that he'll play well enough for the CS to guarantee his job when Geno is back. He will likely be better, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's good enough not to give Geno another shot if you're Gailey and Bowles.
Post by: ScotlandJet on August 13, 2015, 02:22:48 PM
Yep. Like I said when it happened, I'm not upset Geno won't be starting. I'm upset because he should have lost the job on the field. This was the worst way for him not to be starting, and it's silly to pretend the method didn't make a difference. He was doing all the right things in camp, and so instead of shitting the bed and demonstrating for the coaching staff that it was absolutely the wrong move for him to start, they have the ambiguity of Geno in mid season possibly taking the job back. I'm not sure Fitz is going to succeed. I don't see how anyone could feel certain that he'll play well enough for the CS to guarantee his job when Geno is back. He will likely be better, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's good enough not to give Geno another shot if you're Gailey and Bowles.
I'm not high on Geno being a stable QB who could have guided this ship in the right direction but we've all got to be disappointed that he isn't being given the chance to start and see if the positive noises from inside the camp might have come to fruition on the back of the new offensive tools we acquired.
I like Fitz by a long way and our roster is suited to us being a solid team with him being a good positive arm coupled with the experience he has obtained over his time in the NFL- I agree however this mess could lead to a lot of second guessing if we struggle early in the season.
This is a total freaking embarrassment by the way- I'm just back from vacation in the beautiful Algarve where my wife has banned all connection with the outside world and I come come home to this excrement! FFS you Yanks annoy the freaking life out of me at times!
Post by: bojanglesman on August 13, 2015, 02:36:52 PM
I'm not high on Geno being a stable QB who could have guided this ship in the right direction but we've all got to be disappointed that he isn't being given the chance to start and see if the positive noises from inside the camp might have come to fruition on the back of the new offensive tools we acquired.
I like Fitz by a long way and our roster is suited to us being a solid team with him being a good positive arm coupled with the experience he has obtained over his time in the NFL- I agree however this mess could lead to a lot of second guessing if we struggle early in the season.
This is a total freaking embarrassment by the way- I'm just back from vacation in the beautiful Algarve where my wife has banned all connection with the outside world and I come come home to this excrement! FFS you Yanks annoy the freaking life out of me at times!
That's what you get for listening to your wife!
Post by: Miamipuck on August 13, 2015, 02:38:18 PM
I'm not high on Geno being a stable QB who could have guided this ship in the right direction but we've all got to be disappointed that he isn't being given the chance to start and see if the positive noises from inside the camp might have come to fruition on the back of the new offensive tools we acquired.
I like Fitz by a long way and our roster is suited to us being a solid team with him being a good positive arm coupled with the experience he has obtained over his time in the NFL- I agree however this mess could lead to a lot of second guessing if we struggle early in the season.
This is a total freaking embarrassment by the way- I'm just back from vacation in the beautiful Algarve where my wife has banned all connection with the outside world and I come come home to this excrement! FFS you Yanks annoy the freaking life out of me at times!
Total embarrassment? The one other guy in Scotland that loves American football is a Bills fan?
Post by: ScotlandJet on August 13, 2015, 02:40:55 PM
Total embarrassment? The one other guy in Scotland that loves American football is a Bills fan?
Name him
Post by: Miamipuck on August 13, 2015, 02:44:08 PM
Name him
I was hoping you would because apparently he's busting your balls enough to cause "total freaking embarrassment."
Post by: ScotlandJet on August 13, 2015, 02:49:11 PM
I was hoping you would because apparently he's busting your balls enough to cause "total freaking embarrassment."
Ho Ho!
This nonsense even hit the UK; I was laughing at how stupid this could be hoping it was Brady or Manning and realized it was about my team; it was like laughing at a bust up suitcase on baggage reclaim and then realizing it was yours!
Post by: Johnny English on August 13, 2015, 04:13:08 PM
Name him
Hamish MacTavish.
Post by: nyjunc on August 13, 2015, 04:35:24 PM
Name him
;D
(http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20121112213642/simpsons/images/b/bd/Willie.jpg)
Post by: Johnny English on August 13, 2015, 04:52:07 PM
Post by: Badger on August 13, 2015, 05:27:33 PM
We always say this about bad young quarterbacks. Sanchez went into an entirely different system with better talent around him in Philly and he was still, well, Sanchez.
Still better than Geno
Post by: Badger on August 13, 2015, 05:30:34 PM
I'm not high on Geno being a stable QB who could have guided this ship in the right direction but we've all got to be disappointed that he isn't being given the chance to start and see if the positive noises from inside the camp might have come to fruition on the back of the new offensive tools we acquired.
Thanks, I'll pass.
Post by: Miamipuck on August 13, 2015, 07:22:44 PM
Thanks, I'll pass.
Hahaha
Post by: Johnny English on August 19, 2015, 11:50:06 PM
Post by: sg3 on August 20, 2015, 04:21:57 AM
Except Fitz could have played without us losing a capable #2. No matter how much anyone hates Geno no argument can be made that Petty or a guy off the street is a better backup.Geno and capable should really never be used in the same sentence
Post by: sg3 on August 20, 2015, 04:29:22 AM
he was actually very good, the offense scored almost a TD more per game w/ him under C than w/ Foles(who is a pretty good QB). They missed the playoffs b/c they couldn't stop anyone. if we had mark this year we'd be a playoff lock.Buttfumble took over a 6-2 Eagles team with the first playoff seed and "led" them to 4-4 in the final 8 games and watching the postseason at home on TV
A really awful QB although not quite as crappy as Punchy Geno is. Fortunately neither will ever be playing QB for the Jets again
Post by: MexJetinBcn on August 20, 2015, 06:40:08 AM
Post by: ukilledkenny on August 20, 2015, 07:17:35 AM
Post by: sg3 on August 20, 2015, 07:32:40 AM
Someone who calls Sanchez, "buttfumble" doesn't deserve any respect, to be honest.Cmon , first it's the most memorable moment of his miserable career.
And I was actually being nice. I said he wasn't close to being the worst Jet QB of the last six seasons.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 20, 2015, 07:52:17 AM
Cmon , first it's the most memorable moment of his miserable career.
The back-to-back trips to the AFC Championship are far more memorable.
But please let the media and other fucktard fans tell you something different.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 09:13:19 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/WcY9uGX.jpg)
besides Cutler who beat a team under .500 for his lone playoff win one of the others have a single playoff win but at least the other guys besides Fitz have made it.
Cmon , first it's the most memorable moment of his miserable career.
And I was actually being nice. I said he wasn't close to being the worst Jet QB of the last six seasons.
He had a million memorable moments that were positive, if a whiny jet fans thinks back to a meaningless play in a blowout game that is their problem. If we had Mark on this years team w/ these weapons and this D we'd be a title contender.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 20, 2015, 09:23:31 AM
Cmon , first it's the most memorable moment of his miserable career.
And I was actually being nice. I said he wasn't close to being the worst Jet QB of the last six seasons.
Someone is looking to dethrone DCM.
QFT^
How you simply ignore the back to back trips to the AFC Title game is freaking retarded. Are you even old enough to remember the last we made it that far?
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 20, 2015, 09:25:06 AM
besides Cutler who beat a team under .500 for his lone playoff win one of the others have a single playoff win but at least the other guys besides Fitz have made it.
commas are your friend
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 09:27:16 AM
besides Cutler who beat a team under .500 for his lone playoff win one of the others have a single playoff win but at least the other guys besides Fitz have made it.
He had a million memorable moments that were positive, if a whiny jet fans thinks back to a meaningless play in a blowout game that is their problem. If we had Mark on this years team w/ these weapons and this D we'd be a title contender.
You have to at least admit that Fitz got those numbers with far less talent around him than the other guys.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 09:35:12 AM
commas are your friend
I don't know what happened there.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 09:36:20 AM
You have to at least admit that Fitz got those numbers with far less talent around him than the other guys.
Fitz had talent last year and had talent in Buffalo. he definitely had less than Dalton and Cutler but he had enough talent to succeed.
by the way, I wouldn't want any of those 4 Qbs(except maybe Dalton who is still young) leading my team.
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 09:38:39 AM
Fitz had talent last year and had talent in Buffalo. he definitely had less than Dalton and Cutler but he had enough talent to succeed.
by the way, I wouldn't want any of those 4 Qbs(except maybe Dalton who is still young) leading my team.
Well above average QBs come at an insane premium in today's NFL, so if you have an average QB, you need to compensate on other sides of the ball. If we go in with an elite defense and above average tools on offense (which we have), then average QB play should be enough to make the playoffs.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 09:45:05 AM
Well above average QBs come at an insane premium in today's NFL, so if you have an average QB, you need to compensate on other sides of the ball. If we go in with an elite defense and above average tools on offense (which we have), then average QB play should be enough to make the playoffs.
if Fitz plays average football we should be a playoff contender, the problem w/ Fitz's #s is he is a great garbage time QB but has held back teams he has been on. he has played on playoff contenders before. Hopefully that changes this year.
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 09:55:01 AM
if Fitz plays average football we should be a playoff contender, the problem w/ Fitz's #s is he is a great garbage time QB but has held back teams he has been on. he has played on playoff contenders before. Hopefully that changes this year.
Garbage time? Fitz had a 66pct completion percentage in wins last year, and 11 TD 2 INT over 6 wins.
Post by: bojanglesman on August 20, 2015, 10:00:10 AM
Garbage time? Fitz had a 66pct completion percentage in wins last year, and 11 TD 2 INT over 6 wins.
Tommy outta nowhere with the valid point!
Post by: Johnny English on August 20, 2015, 10:03:32 AM
Garbage time? Fitz had a 66pct completion percentage in wins last year, and 11 TD 2 INT over 6 wins.
I don't know who you are and we don't approve of people hacking JO members' accounts, but in this case I'll allow it.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 10:08:08 AM
Garbage time? Fitz had a 66pct completion percentage in wins last year, and 11 TD 2 INT over 6 wins.
do you think that # gets skewed b/c of the 6 TD game? where 3 of the TDs came when the game was out of hand.
also, in the 6 wins he led Houston to wins over:
4-12 Washington
3-13 Oakland
9-7 Buffalo(where they won by 6 and Watt scored on D)
2-14 Tennessee(twice)
3-13 jax
one team over .500, one team w/ as many as 5 wins and in that game they won by 6 and the D scored a TD.
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 10:15:41 AM
do you think that # gets skewed b/c of the 6 TD game? where 3 of the TDs came when the game was out of hand.
also, in the 6 wins he led Houston to wins over:
4-12 Washington
3-13 Oakland
9-7 Buffalo(where they won by 6 and Watt scored on D)
2-14 Tennessee(twice)
3-13 jax
one team over .500, one team w/ as many as 5 wins and in that game they won by 6 and the D scored a TD.
Wins are wins man. You've said so yourself before. And even if you take away those 3 TDs, he still went 8 TD and 2 INT over those 6 wins. That's still pretty good.
Also, I'm not exactly sure what you're arguing here. No one is claiming that Fitz is the second coming of Dan Marino. He's average. His stats prove that he's average. His career up to this point is proof that he's average. And average is what we need right now. Should we settle for average? Of course not. But that's all we have... right now.
Post by: Johnny English on August 20, 2015, 10:18:21 AM
do you think that # gets skewed b/c of the 6 TD game? where 3 of the TDs came when the game was out of hand.
also, in the 6 wins he led Houston to wins over:
4-12 Washington
3-13 Oakland
9-7 Buffalo(where they won by 6 and Watt scored on D)
2-14 Tennessee(twice)
3-13 jax
one team over .500, one team w/ as many as 5 wins and in that game they won by 6 and the D scored a TD.
Geno managed to lose twice to the 9-7 Bills, as well as to the 5-11 Bears and the 7-9 Vikings. I'll take a QB who can beat the excrement teams over one who can't.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 10:19:00 AM
Wins are wins man. You've said so yourself before. And even if you take away those 3 TDs, he still went 8 TD and 2 INT over those 6 wins. That's still pretty good.
Also, I'm not exactly sure what you're arguing here. No one is claiming that Fitz is the second coming of Dan Marino. He's average. His stats prove that he's average. His career up to this point is proof that he's average. And average is what we need right now. Should we settle for average? Of course not. But that's all we have... right now.
My point is he is not as good as his #s indicate, he's been a really good garbage time guy. he fools fans that don't watch him play, he doesn't make enough plays in critical spots. I HOPE he plays well and we win, I am not confident based on what he has done throughout his career.
Post by: bojanglesman on August 20, 2015, 10:19:08 AM
Wins are wins man. You've said so yourself before. And even if you take away those 3 TDs, he still went 8 TD and 2 INT over those 6 wins. That's still pretty good.
Also, I'm not exactly sure what you're arguing here. No one is claiming that Fitz is the second coming of Dan Marino. He's average. His stats prove that he's average. His career up to this point is proof that he's average. And average is what we need right now. Should we settle for average? Of course not. But that's all we have... right now.
I wonder if the Ashley Madison hackers went through Tommy's account to hack into JO?
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 10:19:50 AM
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 10:21:45 AM
My point is he is not as good as his #s indicate, he's been a really good garbage time guy. he fools fans that don't watch him play, he doesn't make enough plays in critical spots. I HOPE he plays well and we win, I am not confident based on what he has done throughout his career.
How else are you going to judge a player over their career if you're throwing their stats out the window? Unless you're Fitzpatrick's mother and watched every single game he's played, I'd take your small sample size with a grain of salt and trust actual objective stats.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 10:21:54 AM
Geno managed to lose twice to the 9-7 Bills, as well as to the 5-11 Bears and the 7-9 Vikings. I'll take a QB who can beat the excrement teams over one who can't.
Geno lost once, the 2nd time he came in and that game was over.
Houston's D held Buffalo to 17 pts and scored a TD, in 2 games our D allowed 43 and 31 pts.
Fitz also lost to 6-10 NYG so he couldn't beat all the bad teams he faced.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 10:22:22 AM
Also, over the corse of his career, Fitz has a 62pct completion rate, 57 TD and 18 INT across 38 wins.
meaningless, all that matters are wins and in his career he has never led a team to more than 6 wins.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 10:23:08 AM
How else are you going to judge a player over their career if you're throwing their stats out the window? Unless you're Fitzpatrick's mother and watched every single game he's played, I'd take your small sample size with a grain of salt and trust actual objective stats.
the only stat that truly matters is wins, if a guy is getting garbage time #s that doesn't impress me. make plays to help win games.
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 10:24:17 AM
Sounds about average to me.
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 10:25:47 AM
the only stat that truly matters is wins, if a guy is getting garbage time #s that doesn't impress me. make plays to help win games.
How are wins important to you when you just scrutinized his 6 wins last season where he played very well against below average teams? Do wins only count when they're against teams with winning records?
Post by: bojanglesman on August 20, 2015, 10:30:14 AM
Of course, what will happen is that Fitzpatrick will go into the bye at 1-3 or 2-2 and it will be a toss-up as to whether to keep going with him or not. At this point, unless Geno by miracle comes in and gets us to the playoffs, I'm ready for a clean slate at QB for 2016.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 10:31:02 AM
How are wins important to you when you just scrutinized his 6 wins last season where he played very well against below average teams? Do wins only count when they're against teams with winning records?
ummm b/c he was 6-6 as a starter and his backups were 3-1.
I scrutinized b/c you posted #s when most of those Tds were accumulated in 1 game. he had 6 TDs in one game, 5 the other 5 games.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 10:32:03 AM
It's pretty simple for this year. What Fitz is vs. Geno's potential. There are too many factors that have played into this not being a straight up competition. Fitz was coming off a broken leg so wasn't 100% out of the gate and Geno got his jaw broken. Just a weird scenario. It is what it is.
Of course, what will happen is that Fitzpatrick will go into the bye at 1-3 or 2-2 and it will be a toss-up as to whether to keep going with him or not. At this point, unless Geno by miracle comes in and gets us to the playoffs, I'm ready for a clean slate at QB for 2016.
if we are 1-3 or even 2-2 I think they go to geno.
Just develop Petty and hopefully we will have something for the future.
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 10:36:54 AM
ummm b/c he was 6-6 as a starter and his backups were 3-1.
I scrutinized b/c you posted #s when most of those Tds were accumulated in 1 game. he had 6 TDs in one game, 5 the other 5 games.
You keep focusing on that one game. We're talking about Fitz over the course of his entire career. I think his performance when the game is tied is a good indication of where he really is. You can't argue those stats were during garbage time. Again, I've done more than enough to prove that Fitz is, and always has been, an average quarterback.
And what does it mean to be an average quarterback anyway? Can an average quarterback carry his team to the playoffs? Not without help. Hopefully this new FO and CS has brought in enough of that help.
Post by: bojanglesman on August 20, 2015, 10:38:28 AM
his backups were 3-1.
2 of those wins were Cleveland and Jacksonville. They don't count.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 10:40:02 AM
Post by: MBGreen on August 20, 2015, 10:42:10 AM
My guess it Fitzpatrick has a good start and gets injured around October. Then Geno comes in and is erratic until Fitzpatrick comes back and replaces him.
this is a realistic prediction.
On the same page with IS....next thing you know Transgender surgery will become trendy.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 10:43:17 AM
You keep focusing on that one game. We're talking about Fitz over the course of his entire career. I think his performance when the game is tied is a good indication of where he really is. You can't argue those stats were during garbage time. Again, I've done more than enough to prove that Fitz is, and always has been, an average quarterback.
And what does it mean to be an average quarterback anyway? Can an average quarterback carry his team to the playoffs? Not without help. Hopefully this new FO and CS has brought in enough of that help.
over his career? never led a team to more than 6 wins.
2 of those wins were Cleveland and Jacksonville. They don't count.
so they beat bad teams at a higher % than Fitz.
and they also beat playoff bound Baltimore and didn't get a D/STs score to do so.
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 10:44:30 AM
over his career? never led a team to more than 6 wins.
Good stats + Below average record / career = average.
Post by: Miamipuck on August 20, 2015, 10:48:04 AM
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 20, 2015, 10:49:13 AM
meaningless, all that matters are wins and in his career he has never led a team to more than 6 wins.
I would argue that he has more talent on this team than he's ever had. Especially defensively.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 10:51:25 AM
Good stats + Below average record / career = average.
going back to the original point the stats are misleading. far too often fans just look at #s, what is more important is how the #s were accumulated.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 10:52:08 AM
I would argue that he has more talent on this team than he's ever had. Especially defensively.
Probably true but he has had some talented teams to work with. I am rooting for him, I hope I am wrong about him. I'm just not excited to watch him play.
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 10:54:43 AM
going back to the original point the stats are misleading. far too often fans just look at #s, what is more important is how the #s were accumulated.
Fine. If Fitz's numbers don't tell the whole story, then you're going to have to come up with numbers that at least tell the story you're going with. Subjective analysis on a few games you've watched doesn't count.
In countering your point that most of his good stats came as a result of "garbage time" when the game was already out of hand, I showed you stats when the game is tied. Show me something, man.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 20, 2015, 10:55:08 AM
Probably true but he has had some talented teams to work with. I am rooting for him, I hope I am wrong about him. I'm just not excited to watch him play.
Fitz starting gives me hope for this season. I know what we had in Geno...and it was next to nothing
Post by: MBGreen on August 20, 2015, 10:55:36 AM
Post by: Johnny English on August 20, 2015, 10:55:42 AM
Probably true but he has had some talented teams to work with. I am rooting for him, I hope I am wrong about him. I'm just not excited to watch him play.
I don't think anyone is excited to watch Fitz, but plenty aren't dreading it the way we were Geno.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 10:56:26 AM
Post by: MBGreen on August 20, 2015, 10:56:56 AM
Welcome to the transition year, gents.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 10:57:30 AM
Welcome to the transition year, gents.
Already looking forward to the Devils getting going.
Post by: Johnny English on August 20, 2015, 10:58:31 AM
Already looking forward to the Devils getting going.
Why?
Post by: MBGreen on August 20, 2015, 10:58:57 AM
Already looking forward to the Devils getting going.
Watching the Wpg Jets regress this year should be fun for me too.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 10:59:28 AM
Fitz starting gives me hope for this season. I know what we had in Geno...and it was next to nothing
for me Geno sucked the last 2 years but is still a bit of an unknown and would have top half NFL weapons this year for the first time. for Fitz I have seen what he can do and it doesn't excite me. I think we had a better shot w/ geno improving than we do w/ Fitz but I hope I am wrong.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 11:00:15 AM
Fitz is the lesser of 2 evils. Bottom line.
Welcome to the transition year, gents.
I disagree and we have the talent around the QB where at worst we should be playoff contenders.
Post by: MBGreen on August 20, 2015, 11:02:03 AM
I disagree and we have the talent around the QB where at worst we should be playoff contenders.
I won't argue that we have the talent at other positions. But until we have our franchise QB, we'll struggle to compete with NWE for the division.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 11:05:53 AM
Why?
Because they're up next.
My other teams:
Dodgers--will stay in the race but blow it either at the end or in the playoffs
Knicks--next
Fiorentina--6-8 months away from a meaningful/interesting game
Post by: Johnny English on August 20, 2015, 11:07:33 AM
Because they're up next.
My other teams:
Dodgers--will stay in the race but blow it either at the end or in the playoffs
Knicks--next
Fiorentina--6-8 months away from a meaningful/interesting game
You should be looking forward to the Jets more than that, as they are going to suck less than the Devils this year. The Devils are going to suck a lot.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 11:07:48 AM
I won't argue that we have the talent at other positions. But until we have our franchise QB, we'll struggle to compete with NWE for the division.
until Brady retires no one has a shot at the division but I think we have the pieces in place to have our best D in my lifetime(assuming Richardson doesn't miss too many more games). we have good backs, good WRs, the OL is solid. we just need the QB to avoid too many major blunders and make a few plays in some close games.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 11:10:17 AM
You should be looking forward to the Jets more than that, as they are going to suck less than the Devils this year. The Devils are going to suck a lot.
That's very possible, but the Devils have a lot better history of overachieving than the Jets.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 11:11:26 AM
until Brady retires no one has a shot at the division..
This. I'm thinking 2-3 more years for him, hopefully Belichick goes with him and Rex never gets a good QB. Still a lot of waiting and a couple of ifs just for us to have a chance.
Post by: Jetaho on August 20, 2015, 11:22:29 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on August 20, 2015, 11:24:38 AM
until Brady retires no one has a shot
I wouldn't say no one has a shot, but odds are certainly against it. The difference this year is that there are 3 strong defenses getting in Brady's face twice a year. Like Rex or not, he knows how to give Brady trouble, and he'll have the best pass rush he's ever had to do it.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 11:45:37 AM
I wouldn't say no one has a shot, but odds are certainly against it. The difference this year is that there are 3 strong defenses getting in Brady's face twice a year. Like Rex or not, he knows how to give Brady trouble, and he'll have the best pass rush he's ever had to do it.
as long as Brady is healthy they will find a way. maybe they win the division w/ 10-11 wins instead of 12-14 but they will find a way.
Post by: Tommy on August 20, 2015, 12:27:28 PM
Fitzmeh isn't taking us to the playoffs. He's average, coming off a pretty serious injury, and is likely to get injured again. Then Geno will come in to a chorus of boos, throw an incompletion and get boo'd even louder so that he will throw INTs on his next 2 throws. Geno will get yanked. Then we will bring in Flynn, who will suck because that's what he does. Flynn will pull his hammy in Week 8 and the CS will bow to fan pressure from a series of billboards and be compelled by Woody to start Petty. Petty will be terrible because he isn't ready to be an NFL QB and we will turn him into a sucky headcase by microanalyzing his every throw and giving up on him after his first start. Then Petty will be involved in an accidental shooting while hunting with TJ Conley and be out for the season. We will bring Geno back but the booing will blow out one of his eardrums, landing him on IR. We will then sign another veteran excrement QB to play out the string with no intention of him lasting long term. At the end of the season, we will release Geno, Fitz, Flynn, and random excrement veteran QB, sign a mediocre and overpaid veteran, draft another QB to compete for our QB job, and sign a UFA from East Bumblefuck State who once posted a YouTube video of him throwing a football through a moving train's doors. Rinse and repeat.
Solid prediction. We're Jets fans after all.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 12:38:18 PM
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 20, 2015, 12:38:43 PM
for me Geno sucked the last 2 years but is still a bit of an unknown and would have top half NFL weapons this year for the first time. for Fitz I have seen what he can do and it doesn't excite me. I think we had a better shot w/ geno improving than we do w/ Fitz but I hope I am wrong.
What you have in Geno is scrambling out of the pocket, then running out of bounds for a 5 yard loss vs throwing the ball away. You also will have 4 INT's in a half.
In Fitz you have a guy that doesn't totally suck and will at least not lose the game for you.
Post by: AlioTheFool on August 20, 2015, 12:45:52 PM
That said, Geno was the "higher potential" guy this year, but Fitz is the "better option to win consistently" guy. If the staff was right about Geno, we lost a lot over $600. If it was all a smokescreen that was allowing Geno to hang himself, then IK did us a big favor by getting Fitz early first-team reps.
The last point I want to make is that Tommy absolutely owned this thread.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 12:48:06 PM
What you have in Geno is scrambling out of the pocket, then running out of bounds for a 5 yard loss vs throwing the ball away. You also will have 4 INT's in a half.
In Fitz you have a guy that doesn't totally suck and will at least not lose the game for you.
geno Smith has never thrown more than 3 INTs in a game.
Fitz has thrown four or more 3 times but I am guessing he didn't lose the game for his teams?
In 29 starts Geno has thrown 2 or more INTs 9 times. 31% of starts
In 89 starts Fitz has thrown 2 or more INTs 27 times. 30% of starts
what a huge difference
Post by: Johnny English on August 20, 2015, 12:49:29 PM
geno Smith has never thrown more than 3 INTs in a game.
That's only because he was pulled before half time.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 12:49:57 PM
If Petty gets until the halfway point of the season to sit and learn, I wouldn't feel terrible if he wound up getting playing time. If he did, it would be due to catastrophic injuries to Fitz, Flynn, and again to Smith, or because they all played like absolute excrement and it was time for change anyway.Flynn is not going to play unless Fitz gets hurt while geno is still hurt. once Geno is healthy Flynn will be released.
That said, Geno was the "higher potential" guy this year, but Fitz is the "better option to win consistently" guy. If the staff was right about Geno, we lost a lot over $600. If it was all a smokescreen that was allowing Geno to hang himself, then IK did us a big favor by getting Fitz early first-team reps.
The last point I want to make is that Tommy absolutely owned this thread.
Fitz is never a "better option to win consistently"
In 29 starts Geno has 11 wins, 38%
in 89 starts Fitz has 33 wins, 37%
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 12:51:27 PM
That's only because he was pulled before half time.
First quarter, to be exact.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 12:52:07 PM
That's only because he was pulled before half time.
that is true, he may have thrown 10 that day if not yanked but he was.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 12:53:47 PM
that is true, he may have thrown 10 that day if not yanked but he was.
That's ok, Vick picked up the slack with another pick or two and some fumbles.
#FireRex
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 20, 2015, 12:54:52 PM
geno Smith has never thrown more than 3 INTs in a game.
Fitz has thrown four or more 3 times but I am guessing he didn't lose the game for his teams?
In 29 starts Geno has thrown 2 or more INTs 9 times. 31% of starts
In 89 starts Fitz has thrown 2 or more INTs 27 times. 30% of starts
what a huge difference
3 INT in one quarter is pretty sad.
Why don't you also look at overall productivity? % of games where a QB threw multiple INT's clearly doesn't tell the whole story.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 12:56:29 PM
3 INT in one quarter is pretty sad.
Why don't you also look at overall productivity? % of games where a QB threw multiple INT's clearly doesn't tell the whole story.
it's beyond sad, he was brutal that day.
never winning more than 6 games tells the story for me.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 20, 2015, 01:04:13 PM
it's beyond sad, he was brutal that day.
never winning more than 6 games tells the story for me.
Football is such a team sport that measuring a QB on wins alone is silly.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 01:18:33 PM
Football is such a team sport that measuring a QB on wins alone is silly.
the game is about winning, he's played on teams capable of winning and failed. he wasn't playing on the '76 Bucs that had no chance.
Post by: AlioTheFool on August 20, 2015, 01:19:19 PM
geno Smith has never thrown more than 3 INTs in a game.
Fitz has thrown four or more 3 times but I am guessing he didn't lose the game for his teams?
In 29 starts Geno has thrown 2 or more INTs 9 times. 31% of starts
In 89 starts Fitz has thrown 2 or more INTs 27 times. 30% of starts
what a huge difference
Fitz has thrown 3 or more TDs 12 times in his career. 29 times he threw 2 or more TDs. 13% and 21% of his starts, respectively. But I'm guessing his TDs didn't help his team win though.
Geno has thrown 3 or more TDs twice. 5 times he threw 2 or more. That's good for 7% and 17% of his starts, respectively.
6% and 4% are bigger differences than 1%.
Fitz has a 123/101 TDs/INTs ratio for his career.
Geno has a 25/34 TDs/INTs ratio for his career.
It's pretty clear who has been more detrimental to their team if you're even remotely trying.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 01:23:01 PM
Fitz has thrown 3 or more TDs 12 times in his career. 29 times he threw 2 or more TDs. 13% and 21% of his starts, respectively. But I'm guessing his TDs didn't help his team win though.
Geno has thrown 3 or more TDs twice. 5 times he threw 2 or more. That's good for 7% and 17% of his starts, respectively.
6% and 4% are bigger differences than 1%.
Fitz has a 123/101 TDs/INTs ratio for his career.
Geno has a 25/34 TDs/INTs ratio for his career.
It's pretty clear who has been more detrimental to their team if you're even remotely trying.
clearly it didn't since he has never won more than 6 games in his career in a single season.
stats w/o context don't tell us a lot.
Post by: Miamipuck on August 20, 2015, 01:24:50 PM
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 01:28:51 PM
Jesus stats are only good when you use them, freak off with that stupid useless bullshit,
when do I just use stats alone? I don't but meaningless fantasy stats tells us very little. This is what fools fans into thinking players are better than they are. there are fans that think Kyle Orton was good, that think jay Cutler is good, that think Philip Rivers is elite.
Let's look at the time Buffalo was 5-2 and looked like they were charging toward their first playoff app. Know what Ryan did the next 3 weeks? Put up 11(8 in garbage time), 7 and 6 points in 3 losses. After that 5-2 start Buffalo would lose 8 of 9 to finish 6-10. Fitz threw 24 Tds and had almost 4,000 yds. looks nice on paper but when you pile up meaningless stats in garbage time it doesn't matter.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 20, 2015, 01:33:17 PM
the game is about winning, he's played on teams capable of winning and failed. he wasn't playing on the '76 Bucs that had no chance.
It's not even a stat associated with the position. We aren't talking about MLB pitchers or goalies.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 01:33:45 PM
Jesus stats
Age: 33
Ht: 5-10
Wt: 160
Throws: Right
Bats: Both
Died: 2
Came Back: 1
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 01:38:49 PM
It's not even a stat associated with the position. We aren't talking about MLB pitchers or goalies.
QBs are judged on wins and losses mostly. Usually better #s will help a tam win more but that isn't always the case.
Post by: sg3 on August 20, 2015, 02:10:21 PM
QBs are judged on wins and losses mostly. Usually better #s will help a tam win more but that isn't always the case.Dan Marino, Jim Kelly and Dan Fouts had great stats but never won a Superbowl so obviously they were worse QBs than Jeff Hostetler, Jim McMahon, Doug Williams, Brad Johnson and Mark Rypien
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 02:15:02 PM
Dan Marino, Jim Kelly and Dan Fouts had great stats but never won a Superbowl so obviously they were worse QBs than Jeff Hostetler, Jim McMahon, Doug Williams, Brad Johnson and Mark Rypien
yep, b/c that is EXACTLY what I said.
marino consistently elevated average talent to the playoffs
Kelly went to 4 SBs
Fouts made multiple title games and the playoffs a ton of times(though I do think gets overrated based on his 3s in that offense)
that's clearly the same as a guy like Fitz never winning more than 6 games, a guy like Rivers who has one title game app(and needed his backup to get him there), a guy like Cutler w/ 1 playoff win in his life that was a against a sub .500 team w/ a bye. Same thing. ::)
Post by: sg3 on August 20, 2015, 02:32:18 PM
yep, b/c that is EXACTLY what I said.Why don't we stay on the one important question for the Jets in 2015.
marino consistently elevated average talent to the playoffs
Kelly went to 4 SBs
Fouts made multiple title games and the playoffs a ton of times(though I do think gets overrated based on his 3s in that offense)
that's clearly the same as a guy like Fitz never winning more than 6 games, a guy like Rivers who has one title game app(and needed his backup to get him there), a guy like Cutler w/ 1 playoff win in his life that was a against a sub .500 team w/ a bye. Same thing. ::)
And the answer to that question is indisputable
Ryan Fitzpatrick is a vastly better QB at age 32 than Geno Smith will ever be at any age.
And so are Bryce Petty, Matt Flynn, btw.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 02:50:23 PM
Why don't we stay on the one important question for the Jets in 2015.
And the answer to that question is indisputable
Ryan Fitzpatrick is a vastly better QB at age 32 than Geno Smith will ever be at any age.
And so are Bryce Petty, Matt Flynn, btw.
He's better than geno has been the last 2 years, doesn't mean he'd be better than geno this year.
if you think matt Flynn is better you obviously have never seen Flynn play except for that meaningless game for Gb a few years ago.
Post by: Johnny English on August 20, 2015, 02:59:32 PM
He's better than geno has been the last 2 years, doesn't mean he'd be better than geno this year.
if you think matt Flynn is better you obviously have never seen Flynn play except for that meaningless game for Gb a few years ago.
One meaningless game is the primary argument I've heard this offseason for Geno Smith. But for that one meaningless game 95% of people would have written him off completely rather than the 50% or so that have.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 03:02:55 PM
One meaningless game is the primary argument I've heard this offseason for Geno Smith. But for that one meaningless game 95% of people would have written him off completely rather than the 50% or so that have.
It happens to also be his last game, so maybe people think he "figured it all out" that last week. Also, Rex got fired the next day and a lot of people here think he was the problem and now Geno will be an All-Pro without Rex holding him back.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 03:04:41 PM
One meaningless game is the primary argument I've heard this offseason for Geno Smith. But for that one meaningless game 95% of people would have written him off completely rather than the 50% or so that have.
Geno may have sucked this year too but he was still a bit of an unknown. we know what Fitz is. I think our best chance to win was if Geno improved w/ the new offense and new weapons. Those chances still may have been slim but there was hope. I have no hope for Fitz but again I hope I am wrong. My hope for Geno had nothing to do w/ his game vs. Miami. he played well to end 2013 then sucked in 2014, my hope was w/ the new OC and the upgraded weapons.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 03:05:28 PM
It happens to also be his last game, so maybe people think he "figured it all out" that last week. Also, Rex got fired the next day and a lot of people here think he was the problem and now Geno will be an All-Pro without Rex holding him back.
how anyone could think rex was the problem is beyond me. Fans are crazy, always need a scapegoat.
Post by: Miamipuck on August 20, 2015, 03:13:00 PM
It happens to also be his last game, so maybe people think he "figured it all out" that last week. Also, Rex got fired the next day and a lot of people here think he was the problem and now Geno will be an All-Pro without Rex holding him back.
That's bullshit, everyone here that wanted Rex gone also thinks Geno sucks. There isn't one person that thinks Geno wiil be an all pro with or without Rex, not one. Hyperbole aside there isn't many here who think he's even a mediocre QB at this point, again with or without Rex and all his numerous faults as a coach.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 03:13:09 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 03:19:57 PM
That's bullshit, everyone here that wanted Rex gone also thinks Geno sucks. There isn't one person that thinks Geno wiil be an all pro with or without Rex, not one. Hyperbole aside there isn't many here who think he's even a mediocre QB at this point, again with or without Rex and all his numerous faults as a coach.
So it should be all fixed now, Rex and Geno are out, no reason we should ever lose a game.
Post by: sg3 on August 20, 2015, 03:22:41 PM
Geno may have sucked this year too but he was still a bit of an unknown. we know what Fitz is. I think our best chance to win was if Geno improved w/ the new offense and new weapons. Those chances still may have been slim but there was hope. I have no hope for Fitz but again I hope I am wrong. My hope for Geno had nothing to do w/ his game vs. Miami. he played well to end 2013 then sucked in 2014, my hope was w/ the new OC and the upgraded weapons.
Sorry
Dupe post
Deleted
Post by: sg3 on August 20, 2015, 03:29:49 PM
Geno may have sucked this year too but he was still a bit of an unknown. we know what Fitz is. I think our best chance to win was if Geno improved w/ the new offense and new weapons. Those chances still may have been slim but there was hope. I have no hope for Fitz but again I hope I am wrong. My hope for Geno had nothing to do w/ his game vs. Miami. he played well to end 2013 then sucked in 2014, my hope was w/ the new OC and the upgraded weapons.Agree 100 %
We all know what Fitzpatrick is....an infinitely better NFL QB than Geno will ever be.
And thanks to IK, we won't have to sit around and be 1-3 or 0-4 at the bye before Geno was removed and replaced by Fitzpatrick
Post by: Miamipuck on August 20, 2015, 03:35:56 PM
So it should be all fixed now, Rex and Geno are out, no reason we should ever lose a game.
It may be worse before we get better but Rex was a seriously flawed coach that wore out his welcome. Yeah he had his good points but enough is enough already, his schtik isn't meant to last a lifetime and certainly his record didn't warrant a Jets coaching gig in perpetuity. Lets see how Bowles does before we proclaim anything.
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 03:42:53 PM
I see what junc is saying, Geno has youth and upside going for him that Fitzpatrick doesn't, but I'm not sure how good Geno is ever going to be. I was a lot more high on Sanchez going into year 3, not just because of the team's success but how he carried himself and approached the job.
you know how I feel about mark, I will not back geno like that but I also wanted to see him get a chance w/ this roster and coaching.
Agree 100 %
We all know what Fitzpatrick is....an infinitely better NFL QB than Geno will ever be.
And thanks to IK, we won't have to sit around and be 1-3 or 0-4 at the bye before Geno was removed and replaced by Fitzpatrick
we don't know he will be better than geno. a mediocre team in terms of talent was able to win 8 games w/ Geno, no team has ever been able to do that w/ Fitz. I like winning not meaningless fantasy #s.
It may be worse before we get better but Rex was a seriously flawed coach that wore out his welcome. Yeah he had his good points but enough is enough already, his schtik isn't meant to last a lifetime and certainly his record didn't warrant a Jets coaching gig in perpetuity. Lets see how Bowles does before we proclaim anything.
Rex wasn't the problem, talent acquisition was the problem.
I am happy w/ Bowles but chances are in 2-3 years jet fans will be bashing Bowles and praising the next coach.
Post by: Miamipuck on August 20, 2015, 03:46:41 PM
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 03:51:06 PM
Lol ok Rex wasn't the problem, in my opinion he was, so thank you for your opinion, that he wasn't.
in a few years you'll bash Bowles and the nest guy will be great. I understand how it works.
Post by: Miamipuck on August 20, 2015, 04:34:20 PM
Post by: nyjunc on August 20, 2015, 04:44:51 PM
Great and five years from now you'll still be sucking Rex's rooster, I know it works.
I appreciate players and coaches that help my team win. I like to win. I want rex to lose in Buffalo but that doesn't mean I shouldn't appreciate him getting my team closer to a SB than I had ever seen before.
Post by: Badger on August 20, 2015, 06:01:50 PM
That's bullshit, everyone here that wanted Rex gone also thinks Geno sucks. There isn't one person that thinks Geno wiil be an all pro with or without Rex, not one. Hyperbole aside there isn't many here who think he's even a mediocre QB at this point, again with or without Rex and all his numerous faults as a coach.
Everyone here yes, but there's a not insignificant group of idiots out there that think Geno is a better QB than Rex was a HC.
Post by: sg3 on August 20, 2015, 06:24:04 PM
I appreciate players and coaches that help my team win. I like to win. I want rex to lose in Buffalo but that doesn't mean I shouldn't appreciate him getting my team closer to a SB than I had ever seen before.You were born after January 1999 when the Jets lost the AFC Championship game at Mile High??
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 07:01:31 PM
in a few months you'll bash Bowles and the nest guy will be great. I understand how it works.
FYP
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 20, 2015, 07:02:42 PM
You were born after January 1999 when the Jets lost the AFC Championship game at Mile High??
Both teams got equally close.
Post by: sg3 on August 20, 2015, 07:11:14 PM
Both teams got equally close.As I said
Post by: Miamipuck on August 20, 2015, 07:48:39 PM
FYP
Show me where I bashed Rex prior to last season, I will wait for you to find go ahead. He got a sufficiently long leash and deserved no more.
Post by: Derek Smalls on August 20, 2015, 07:56:39 PM
geno Smith has never thrown more than 3 INTs in a game.Now that I know what kind of stats you won't throw away right away, I present Mark Sanchez.
Fitz has thrown four or more 3 times but I am guessing he didn't lose the game for his teams?
In 29 starts Geno has thrown 2 or more INTs 9 times. 31% of starts
In 89 starts Fitz has thrown 2 or more INTs 27 times. 30% of starts
what a huge difference
Sanchez has thrown 2 or more Ints 21 times in his career and he's started 70 games. One of the 2-Int games came off the bench when he played 3 quarters. So if we include that, it's 21/71 (30%).
Mark has thrown 3 or more Ints in 8/70 starts (11%)
Fitz has thrown 3 or more Ints in 10/97 starts (10%)
Geno has thrown 3 or more Ints in 3/30 starts (10%).
Mark has thrown 4 or more Ints in 3/70 starts (4%).
Fitz has thrown 4 or more Ints in 3/97 starts (3%).
Geno has never thrown 4 or more Ints in a game.
Quote from: nyjunc
Geno may have sucked this year too but he was still a bit of an unknown. we know what Fitz is. I think our best chance to win was if Geno improved w/ the new offense and new weapons. Those chances still may have been slim but there was hope. I have no hope for Fitz but again I hope I am wrong. My hope for Geno had nothing to do w/ his game vs. Miami. he played well to end 2013 then sucked in 2014, my hope was w/ the new OC and the upgraded weapons.
I 100% agree with this. I have a little more hope for Fitz than you do because I think the Jets have more talent around him than he's used to playing with, but the Jets' best chance for a good year was for Geno to develop into something more than what Fitz is. We know Fitz is a below average starting QB. Geno has played worse than that thus far in his career, but he had the potential to develop into more.
Post by: Johnny English on August 20, 2015, 07:58:35 PM
FYP
People supported Rex for a long time despite his obvious failings. It was when he showed no sign or recognising or correcting those failings that they started to lose patience.
It's also OK to call coaches and GMs out early if they're doing things that don't make any sense. Idzik was a good example, from the outset he made questionable decisions and there's no point in being patient when someone sets off on the wrong track and shows no sign of recognising it.
Post by: Johnny English on August 20, 2015, 08:00:15 PM
Geno has never thrown 4 or more Ints in a game.
That may be technically true but I'm not accepting it as a valid stat, no matter how many times it gets repeated.
Post by: Derek Smalls on August 20, 2015, 08:25:15 PM
That may be technically true but I'm not accepting it as a valid stat, no matter how many times it gets repeated.
That's fair. I'm not using that to back Geno, just stating it as fact.
Post by: Badger on August 20, 2015, 08:39:28 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on August 20, 2015, 09:29:12 PM
Geno has never grown a beard. Just stating it as fact.(http://www.terezowens.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/BRSSrUtCEAETD66.jpg-large.jpeg)
(http://cdn.fansided.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/229/files/2014/12/nick-mangold-nfl-new-england-patriots-new-york-jets-850x560.jpg)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CMJbo3HXAAE_N7g.jpg)
(http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/blogs/Geno-Smith-punch-insta-08-11-15.png)
Post by: Badger on August 21, 2015, 05:27:00 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on August 21, 2015, 09:13:12 AM
clearly it didn't since he has never won more than 6 games in his career in a single season.
stats w/o context don't tell us a lot.
Jesus stats are only good when you use them, freak off with that stupid useless bullshit,
I knew that would be his answer. That's why I posted parallel and directly conflicting stats to his load of horseshit. I generally don't like trolling, but he's being ridiculous even for himself in this thread.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 09:40:39 AM
You were born after January 1999 when the Jets lost the AFC Championship game at Mile High??
we had no chance late in that game, in Pitt we had a chance if our D could have gotten one stop late. it was the only title game we lost w/in a score.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 09:44:20 AM
Now that I know what kind of stats you won't throw away right away, I present Mark Sanchez.
Sanchez has thrown 2 or more Ints 21 times in his career and he's started 70 games. One of the 2-Int games came off the bench when he played 3 quarters. So if we include that, it's 21/71 (30%).
Mark has thrown 3 or more Ints in 8/70 starts (11%)
Fitz has thrown 3 or more Ints in 10/97 starts (10%)
Geno has thrown 3 or more Ints in 3/30 starts (10%).
Mark has thrown 4 or more Ints in 3/70 starts (4%).
Fitz has thrown 4 or more Ints in 3/97 starts (3%).
Geno has never thrown 4 or more Ints in a game.
I 100% agree with this. I have a little more hope for Fitz than you do because I think the Jets have more talent around him than he's used to playing with, but the Jets' best chance for a good year was for Geno to develop into something more than what Fitz is. We know Fitz is a below average starting QB. Geno has played worse than that thus far in his career, but he had the potential to develop into more.
awesome but mark also made big plays, led us to a ton of late game wins and played really well in postseason on the road. he had ONE bad year(2012) where his main weapons were a rookie Stephen Hill, Chaz Schilens and Clyde Gates. throw in an innovative OC like Sparano and just for fun the distraction of tebow. how could he not have succeeded?
the lowest amount of games he helped us win in a season was 6, in that 2012 season W/ Schilens and co.
I knew that would be his answer. That's why I posted parallel and directly conflicting stats to his load of horseshit. I generally don't like trolling, but he's being ridiculous even for himself in this thread.
alio, I destroyed your weak argument. Please don't bash me for it. try to do better next time.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 21, 2015, 09:53:09 AM
awesome but mark also made big plays, led us to a ton of late game wins and played really well in postseason on the road. he had ONE bad year(2012) where his main weapons were a rookie Stephen Hill, Chaz Schilens and Clyde Gates. throw in an innovative OC like Sparano and just for fun the distraction of tebow. how could he not have succeeded?
the lowest amount of games he helped us win in a season was 6, in that 2012 season W/ Schilens and co.
Losing Santonio in Week 4 was a killer. Also losing Revis in Week 3, although that wasn't on offense, it certainly didn't help us.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 09:58:42 AM
Losing Santonio in Week 4 was a killer. Also losing Revis in Week 3, although that wasn't on offense, it certainly didn't help us.
those 2 were killers and Keller missed a bunch of time and was never really healthy. He had 2 quality weapons going into that season and both barely played. He had no shot to succeed and b/c of that season our GM got fired and we brought in a GM who brought in Geno and ran Mark out of town. Is mark great? of course not but he's an average NFL QB that can play in big games which is certainly much better than what we have had the last2 years and better than anything Fitz has ever done.
Post by: AlioTheFool on August 21, 2015, 10:17:43 AM
alio, I destroyed your weak argument. Please don't bash me for it. try to do better next time.
STFU junc. You didn't "destroy" anything. You flat out ignored that TDs/INTs is an important factor in gauging a QB's performance. Why? Because Fitzpatrick has a better ratio than Geno and that didn't fit your argument.
If a QB's INTs directly contribute to a team's losses, which was your own contention, then his TDs directly contribute to his team's winning. Of course, both of those contentions lack any context whatsoever, but don't let that stop you from talking about others using context.
A quarterback's job is to throw passes. A QB's TD throws, or INTs, or completion percentage are tangible things that directly relate to that player's influence on his team's success. Of course there are other factors that contribute to wins/losses, but those are the ones he can directly control.
Fitzpatrick is 1752/2911 in his career for a 60.2 completion percentage.
Smith is 466/810 for a 57.5 completion percentage.
3% is again a higher percentage than your weak bullshit 1% difference in their ability to throw to the wrong jersey.
In every measurable way, Ryan Fitzpatrick is more capable of doing a better job for his team than Geno Smith.
You used interceptions to substantiate your argument--without any context other than "those made his teams lose" which is utterly laughable. You attempted to cherry-pick a statistic that you felt reinforced your argument and you neglected to think that anyone else had any ability to use the internet to look up any other stats that might directly dispute your point.
I know you love to troll, which is why I generally just sit back and don't bother responding to you, but your bullshit use of a single statistic--minus any context whatsoever, all the while talking about how others don't use context--was just too ripe a fruit to avoid picking.
Post by: Miamipuck on August 21, 2015, 10:26:44 AM
STFU junc. You didn't "destroy" anything. You flat out ignored that TDs/INTs is an important factor in gauging a QB's performance. Why? Because Fitzpatrick has a better ratio than Geno and that didn't fit your argument.
If a QB's INTs directly contribute to a team's losses, which was your own contention, then his TDs directly contribute to his team's winning. Of course, both of those contentions lack any context whatsoever, but don't let that stop you from talking about others using context.
A quarterback's job is to throw passes. A QB's TD throws, or INTs, or completion percentage are tangible things that directly relate to that player's influence on his team's success. Of course there are other factors that contribute to wins/losses, but those are the ones he can directly control.
Fitzpatrick is 1752/2911 in his career for a 60.2 completion percentage.
Smith is 466/810 for a 57.5 completion percentage.
3% is again a higher percentage than your weak bullshit 1% difference in their ability to throw to the wrong jersey.
In every measurable way, Ryan Fitzpatrick is more capable of doing a better job for his team than Geno Smith.
You used interceptions to substantiate your argument--without any context other than "those made his teams lose" which is utterly laughable. You attempted to cherry-pick a statistic that you felt reinforced your argument and you neglected to think that anyone else had any ability to use the internet to look up any other stats that might directly dispute your point.
I know you love to troll, which is why I generally just sit back and don't bother responding to you, but your bullshit use of a single statistic--minus any context whatsoever, all the while talking about how others don't use context--was just too ripe a fruit to avoid picking.
(http://media.tumblr.com/a76e9d7073102ad459e39924c020c398/tumblr_inline_n9n52gly2T1snsm4e.gif)
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 10:27:33 AM
STFU junc. You didn't "destroy" anything. You flat out ignored that TDs/INTs is an important factor in gauging a QB's performance. Why? Because Fitzpatrick has a better ratio than Geno and that didn't fit your argument.
If a QB's INTs directly contribute to a team's losses, which was your own contention, then his TDs directly contribute to his team's winning. Of course, both of those contentions lack any context whatsoever, but don't let that stop you from talking about others using context.
A quarterback's job is to throw passes. A QB's TD throws, or INTs, or completion percentage are tangible things that directly relate to that player's influence on his team's success. Of course there are other factors that contribute to wins/losses, but those are the ones he can directly control.
Fitzpatrick is 1752/2911 in his career for a 60.2 completion percentage.
Smith is 466/810 for a 57.5 completion percentage.
3% is again a higher percentage than your weak bullshit 1% difference in their ability to throw to the wrong jersey.
In every measurable way, Ryan Fitzpatrick is more capable of doing a better job for his team than Geno Smith.
You used interceptions to substantiate your argument--without any context other than "those made his teams lose" which is utterly laughable. You attempted to cherry-pick a statistic that you felt reinforced your argument and you neglected to think that anyone else had any ability to use the internet to look up any other stats that might directly dispute your point.
I know you love to troll, which is why I generally just sit back and don't bother responding to you, but your bullshit use of a single statistic--minus any context whatsoever, all the while talking about how others don't use context--was just too ripe a fruit to avoid picking.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 10:29:06 AM
STFU junc. You didn't "destroy" anything. You flat out ignored that TDs/INTs is an important factor in gauging a QB's performance. Why? Because Fitzpatrick has a better ratio than Geno and that didn't fit your argument.
If a QB's INTs directly contribute to a team's losses, which was your own contention, then his TDs directly contribute to his team's winning. Of course, both of those contentions lack any context whatsoever, but don't let that stop you from talking about others using context.
A quarterback's job is to throw passes. A QB's TD throws, or INTs, or completion percentage are tangible things that directly relate to that player's influence on his team's success. Of course there are other factors that contribute to wins/losses, but those are the ones he can directly control.
Fitzpatrick is 1752/2911 in his career for a 60.2 completion percentage.
Smith is 466/810 for a 57.5 completion percentage.
3% is again a higher percentage than your weak bullshit 1% difference in their ability to throw to the wrong jersey.
In every measurable way, Ryan Fitzpatrick is more capable of doing a better job for his team than Geno Smith.
You used interceptions to substantiate your argument--without any context other than "those made his teams lose" which is utterly laughable. You attempted to cherry-pick a statistic that you felt reinforced your argument and you neglected to think that anyone else had any ability to use the internet to look up any other stats that might directly dispute your point.
I know you love to troll, which is why I generally just sit back and don't bother responding to you, but your bullshit use of a single statistic--minus any context whatsoever, all the while talking about how others don't use context--was just too ripe a fruit to avoid picking.
I can't help you if you cannot read and do not understand what you are watching. get back to your statsheets and don't watch football. that should help for future discussions.
you can call me a troll but at least I know what I am talking about. you had to bash me b/c you couldn't bash what I was writing. If you think Fitz has been good and are wowed by his fantasy #s that's on your football stupidity. there's a reason this guy goes from team to team every year. some day you will realize this.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 10:30:07 AM
(http://media.tumblr.com/a76e9d7073102ad459e39924c020c398/tumblr_inline_n9n52gly2T1snsm4e.gif)
this just confirms it. thanks puck
Post by: AlioTheFool on August 21, 2015, 10:33:39 AM
Quote from: @WilliamsonNFL
: Amazingly, When Tom Brady’s team allows at least 24 points? He is 41-42! @fboutsiders
I guess that dude sucks. He should be throwing 4 TDs every game with 0 INTs. I mean, it's ridiculous that he doesn't will his team to win when they only give up 24 points!
Post by: loyaljetsfan on August 21, 2015, 10:39:21 AM
Agree 100 %
We all know what Fitzpatrick is....an infinitely better NFL QB than Geno will ever be.
And thanks to IK, we won't have to sit around and be 1-3 or 0-4 at the bye before Geno was removed and replaced by Fitzpatrick
My thoughts exactly
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 10:42:04 AM
I'll just leave this here:
I guess that dude sucks. He should be throwing 4 TDs every game with 0 INTs. I mean, it's ridiculous that he doesn't will his team to win when they only give up 24 points!
what does this have to do w/ anything? you just like #s out of context. did you see his D allow 24 pts in the SUPER BOWL? did he win?
Post by: Miamipuck on August 21, 2015, 10:45:15 AM
You're wrong because I say so, I use red herrings, nonsensical arguments, pull stuff out of my poopchute to deflect and use stats to my advantage while saying you use stats wrong because I don't understand context in any way shape or form, I must be right as we know the person that squawks the loudest and most is always right and generally I just simply troll.
Just confirms it, thanks junc!
Post by: AlioTheFool on August 21, 2015, 10:47:29 AM
I can't help you if you cannot read and do not understand what you are watching. get back to your statsheets and don't watch football. that should help for future discussions.
you can call me a troll but at least I know what I am talking about. you had to bash me b/c you couldn't bash what I was writing. If you think Fitz has been good and are wowed by his fantasy #s that's on your football stupidity. there's a reason this guy goes from team to team every year. some day you will realize this.
I really do struggle to understand something, I'll admit.
I can't honestly figure out whether you're a purposeful troll or whether you really are this amazing foolish.
I bashed everything you wrote. Hell, I went so far as to meticulously point out where your argument fell apart at the seams. I know, I know, this is me being too stupid to understand your nonsense bullshit and I'm just being an poopchute attacking you, blah, blah, blah.
You're wrong. Which isn't unusual for you. Neither is it unusual for you to not admit as much. No one is surprised, I'm sure.
The only thing I'll say in direct response to your post is that you're completely misunderstanding my argument, whether intentionally or because you just don't get it. I never once said--nor even hinted--that Fitzpatrick is "good", nor that I was "wowed" by any of his performances. I simply said that by the numbers, Fitzpatrick has measurably proven himself more capable of helping his team win than Geno.
Am I happy to have Ryan Fitzpatrick as my starting QB? No, not even remotely. Actually, I don't think anyone is other than your straw man assertions. All anyone has said is that Fitz has shown more than Geno thus far in both of their careers. That may not be saying much, but that's actually saying a lot.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 10:54:24 AM
Just confirms it, thanks junc!
that is usually how your arguments go, bash the poster instead of trying to attack the info in the post. Typical.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 10:55:44 AM
I really do struggle to understand something, I'll admit.
I can't honestly figure out whether you're a purposeful troll or whether you really are this amazing foolish.
I bashed everything you wrote. Hell, I went so far as to meticulously point out where your argument fell apart at the seams. I know, I know, this is me being too stupid to understand your nonsense bullshit and I'm just being an poopchute attacking you, blah, blah, blah.
You're wrong. Which isn't unusual for you. Neither is it unusual for you to not admit as much. No one is surprised, I'm sure.
The only thing I'll say in direct response to your post is that you're completely misunderstanding my argument, whether intentionally or because you just don't get it. I never once said--nor even hinted--that Fitzpatrick is "good", nor that I was "wowed" by any of his performances. I simply said that by the numbers, Fitzpatrick has measurably proven himself more capable of helping his team win than Geno.
Am I happy to have Ryan Fitzpatrick as my starting QB? No, not even remotely. Actually, I don't think anyone is other than your straw man assertions. All anyone has said is that Fitz has shown more than Geno thus far in both of their careers. That may not be saying much, but that's actually saying a lot.
you bashed ME. you just keep posting stats w/o context, that should help your arguments. Fitz is clearly great, he has a good QB rating, he had a 6 TD game last year! we should be a SB lock w/ such a good QB based on his stats w/o context.
Fitz hasn't shown anything to anyone who has actually watched him.
Post by: Miamipuck on August 21, 2015, 10:58:35 AM
I just make excrement up, use stats how I see fit, basically only use ones that bolster my argument and downpplay those that don't. I don't stop for nothing because I have nothing better to do than be right about every single freaking thing because winning on the internet is the end all be all. I love trolling.
that is usually how your arguments go, post a bunch of nonsense. Typical. Just like you're doing to Alio who pretty much destroyed your horseshit argument. But I know you won because you said so.
Post by: sg3 on August 21, 2015, 11:02:41 AM
that is usually how your arguments go, bash the poster instead of trying to attack the info in the post. Typical.Isn't there an Eagle forum where you can express your unrequited love for your HOF hero Mark?
Post by: Johnny English on August 21, 2015, 11:05:09 AM
Isn't there an Eagle forum where you can express your unrequited love for your HOF hero Mark?
Steady on there telling people to go post elsewhere, Mr 4 Days On The Site.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 11:06:23 AM
that is usually how your arguments go, post a bunch of nonsense. Typical. Just like you're doing to Alio who pretty much destroyed your horseshit argument. But I know you won because you said so.
yep, he destroyed it by posting stats of 4 QBs that haven't won anything and all of the stats were out of context. you thinking he destroyed says more about you and your lack of knowledge.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 11:07:23 AM
Isn't there an Eagle forum where you can express your unrequited love for your HOF hero Mark?
another good argument! you guys are really making me think today.
Post by: Laxin on August 21, 2015, 11:10:04 AM
Steady on there telling people to go post elsewhere, Mr 4 Days On The Site.
lol
Post by: Miamipuck on August 21, 2015, 11:15:02 AM
yep, he destroyed it by posting stats of 4 QBs that haven't won anything and all of the stats were out of context. you thinking he destroyed says more about you and your lack of knowledge.
You thinking he didn't destroy you tells us all we need to know about you and shows your general lack of knowledge.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 11:35:29 AM
You thinking he didn't destroy you tells us all we need to know about you and shows your general lack of knowledge.
awesome, fitzy is the bestest! SB here we come! you are teaching me so much.
Post by: AlioTheFool on August 21, 2015, 11:35:37 AM
you bashed ME. you just keep posting stats w/o context, that should help your arguments. Fitz is clearly great, he has a good QB rating, he had a 6 TD game last year! we should be a SB lock w/ such a good QB based on his stats w/o context.
Fitz hasn't shown anything to anyone who has actually watched him.
Yeah, I bashed YOU. Because you're being insufferable.
I didn't post stats without context. You did. I responded to that nonsense where you tried to use a 1% higher rate of interceptions for Fitzpatrick over Smith to prove your point that we're somehow markedly worse off now that Geno is down. I posted both of their stats regarding how many TDs vs those INTs they both threw to show that Fitzpatrick--while throwing slightly more INTs--throws multiple percentage points more TDs than Smith.
I also posted how Fitzpatrick has multiple points better completion percentage than Smith, which is better than the paltry 1% increase in INT risk. That means Fitzpatrick is better capable of helping his team win than Geno.
I've said it repeatedly. So have others. Not a single person has said Fitzpatrick is great. I don't know of anyone who has even said he is "good." The adjective most used to describe Fitz is "average." But that again doesn't fit your straw-man argument, so you ignore it.
Post by: Derek Smalls on August 21, 2015, 11:39:29 AM
awesome but mark also made big plays, led us to a ton of late game wins and played really well in postseason on the road. he had ONE bad year(2012) where his main weapons were a rookie Stephen Hill, Chaz Schilens and Clyde Gates. throw in an innovative OC like Sparano and just for fun the distraction of tebow. how could he not have succeeded?And Geno's worst year came when he had those same weapons, except instead of Chaz Schilens and Clyde Gates, he had Santonio's ghost and David Nelson. Both Mark and Geno won 8 games their rookie seasons. Both had terrible weapons, both had terrible TD-Int ratios. The difference is that Mark had a running game and defense that Geno has never had.
the lowest amount of games he helped us win in a season was 6, in that 2012 season W/ Schilens and co.
Post by: Miamipuck on August 21, 2015, 11:40:23 AM
When I lose an argument because of sleazy arguing, I act like a little newborn.
You're teaching me so much.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 11:44:39 AM
And Geno's worst year came when he had those same weapons, except instead of Chaz Schilens and Clyde Gates, he had Santonio's ghost and David Nelson. Both Mark and Geno won 8 games their rookie seasons. Both had terrible weapons, both had terrible TD-Int ratios. The difference is that Mark had a running game and defense that Geno has never had.
Mark was significantly better than Geno as a rookie but I agree he hsn't had the weapons though his run game was very good his rookie year and Mark's his rookie year was vastly overrated based on 2 games w/ an awful Buf team and the Oak game.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on August 21, 2015, 12:07:24 PM
Steady on there telling people to go post elsewhere, Mr 4 Days On The Site.
In his defense junc probably already is a member of an Eagles board
Post by: Johnny English on August 21, 2015, 12:08:36 PM
In his defense junc probably already is a member of an Eagles board
With 12,000 posts and a bunch of confused Iggles fans unsure whether to throw batteries at him or not.
Post by: Tommy on August 21, 2015, 12:08:41 PM
Mark was significantly better than Geno as a rookie but I agree he hsn't had the weapons though his run game was very good his rookie year and Mark's his rookie year was vastly overrated based on 2 games w/ an awful Buf team and the Oak game.
Significantly? They had nearly identical stats for the regular season. Slight edge in completion percentage to Geno and more yards. Also Mark had the league's best rushing offense, best OL, and best overall defense.
Subjectively Mark Sanchez was better, but significantly? That's just not true.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on August 21, 2015, 12:09:20 PM
With 12,000 posts and a bunch of confused Iggles fans unsure whether to throw batteries at him or not.
Hahahahah.
Post by: Derek Smalls on August 21, 2015, 12:12:31 PM
The one thing with Fitz that I don't love is that most of his good numbers last year came against an atrocious schedule. The Jets schedule isn't bad this year, but there are tougher defenses than he played against last year.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 12:15:45 PM
Fitz has had a better QBR than Jets QBs each of the last 4 seasons. That's a very low bar, but if Fitz can play like Sanchez circa 2010-11, this team can compete if the other pieces fall into place. And that's basically been what Fitz has been over the last few seasons.
The one thing with Fitz that I don't love is that most of his good numbers last year came against an atrocious schedule. The Jets schedule isn't bad this year, but there are tougher defenses than he played against last year.
if he can play like sanchez 2010 we will contend for an AFC title. he has never been able to play like that before though but I am rooting for it.
most of his good #s came from one game too.
I am not a #s guy, I would love big #s but I want them to help us win.
Post by: Tommy on August 21, 2015, 12:18:11 PM
Then again it's the Jets, so why the freak would that ever happen.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 12:22:57 PM
Maybe he'll have a late-career breakout year like Vinny did in 1998. If he can somehow step it up from average to above-average, this team is going places.
Then again it's the Jets, so why the freak would that ever happen.
I hope so but Vinny was a little different though we did sign him to come in and back up a younger QB.
He has to be average, protect the ball. he's going to turn it over but limit the disastrous mistakes. W/ our D/STs we should be in most games if we limit the disastrous Tos.
Post by: Derek Smalls on August 21, 2015, 12:30:47 PM
if he can play like sanchez 2010 we will contend for an AFC title. he has never been able to play like that before though but I am rooting for it.2014 Fitz vs 2010 Sanchez
Comp pct: Fitz 63% to Mark 55%
Yds per att: Fitz 8.0 to Mark 6.5
QBR: Fitz 57 to Mark 44
Passer rating: Fitz 95 to Mark 75
TD-Int: Fitz 17-8 to Mark 17-13
Pass YPG: Fitz 207 to Mark 206
Fitz was also markedly better in the 4th quarter of games (76 QBR to 30, 68% to 46% comp, 4-2 TD-Int to 2-4 TD-Int) than Mark.
There's no reason that Fitz can't do what Mark did. Rely on the run game, play defense, and don't screw it up.
Post by: MBGreen on August 21, 2015, 12:41:24 PM
In his defense junc probably already is a member of an Eagles board
4 honks
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 12:44:56 PM
2014 Fitz vs 2010 Sanchez
Comp pct: Fitz 63% to Mark 55%
Yds per att: Fitz 8.0 to Mark 6.5
QBR: Fitz 57 to Mark 44
Passer rating: Fitz 95 to Mark 75
TD-Int: Fitz 17-8 to Mark 17-13
Pass YPG: Fitz 207 to Mark 206
Fitz was also markedly better in the 4th quarter of games (76 QBR to 30, 68% to 46% comp, 4-2 TD-Int to 2-4 TD-Int) than Mark.
There's no reason that Fitz can't do what Mark did. Rely on the run game, play defense, and don't screw it up.
this is what happens when you just look at #s. I like you Derek, you seem like a knowledgeable poster but you are misguided here.
Ryan had 2 4QC/GWDs last season, in 2010 Mark had 6 including one on the road in the playoffs.
Ryan's 2 comebacks/GW drives were trailing by 3 at Oakland and led great drive to win in final seconds and trailing by 3 at jax finishing off a drive to start the 4th for the lead that the D would never surrender.
compare that to sanchez 2010:
at Denver: after tying game in 4th D immediately allows Den to retake lead then w/ almost all hope lost on 4th down trailing by 3 he scramble, bought time and gave Holmes a chance to make a play. a ball he would have caught but was interfered and it set up GW TD.
at det: Trailing by 10 on the road w/ 4 mins left. leads us to 10 pts then we win toss and leads us down for chip shot FG to win it.
at Cle: despite holding a +20 min edge in TOP the D blew another late lead and the game went to OT. In FG range but w/ K having missed 3 kicks already and time winding down threw to Holmes who made a great move and scored GW TD.
vs. Hou: D blows 24-7 4th qtr lead, w/ no timeouts and ball inside our 30 trailing by 4(needing a TD) w/ :49 secs left led one of greatest drive sin jets history which included 2 picture perfect passes to Edwards and Holmes.
at Pitt: had never won in Pitt before but this was total team effort though Mark play great that day.
at Ind playoffs: he sucked in the 1st half, run game got us going but w/ the season on the line set up chip shot FG moments after Vinatieri kicked FG to give Indy 2 pt lead in final minute.
you can keep the QB rating in 4th qtr and any other #s, Mark came through big time for us in 4th qtrs. and throughout that season w/ a mediocre ground game and up and down D.
Post by: Derek Smalls on August 21, 2015, 01:12:28 PM
this is what happens when you just look at #s. I like you Derek, you seem like a knowledgeable poster but you are misguided here.Your gift of using numbers when they support you, but ignoring numbers when they go against you remains unmatched. 4th-quarter game-winning drives are nice, but here's how many points the offense scored in those games.
Ryan had 2 4QC/GWDs last season, in 2010 Mark had 6 including one on the road in the playoffs.
Ryan's 2 comebacks/GW drives were trailing by 3 at Oakland and led great drive to win in final seconds and trailing by 3 at jax finishing off a drive to start the 4th for the lead that the D would never surrender.
compare that to sanchez 2010:
at Denver: after tying game in 4th D immediately allows Den to retake lead then w/ almost all hope lost on 4th down trailing by 3 he scramble, bought time and gave Holmes a chance to make a play. a ball he would have caught but was interfered and it set up GW TD.
at det: Trailing by 10 on the road w/ 4 mins left. leads us to 10 pts then we win toss and leads us down for chip shot FG to win it.
at Cle: despite holding a +20 min edge in TOP the D blew another late lead and the game went to OT. In FG range but w/ K having missed 3 kicks already and time winding down threw to Holmes who made a great move and scored GW TD.
vs. Hou: D blows 24-7 4th qtr lead, w/ no timeouts and ball inside our 30 trailing by 4(needing a TD) w/ :49 secs left led one of greatest drive sin jets history which included 2 picture perfect passes to Edwards and Holmes.
at Pitt: had never won in Pitt before but this was total team effort though Mark play great that day.
at Ind playoffs: he sucked in the 1st half, run game got us going but w/ the season on the line set up chip shot FG moments after Vinatieri kicked FG to give Indy 2 pt lead in final minute.
you can keep the QB rating in 4th qtr and any other #s, Mark came through big time for us in 4th qtrs. and throughout that season w/ a mediocre ground game and up and down D.
Denver: 24
Detroit: 23
Cleveland: 26 (including a full OT)
Houston: 30 (against a godawful defense)
Pittsburgh: 22
Colts: 17
Maybe if the offense was scoring more early in the game, they wouldn't have needed miracle touchdowns late.
I was always a Sanchez supporter when he was our QB. But he was never better than a mediocre QB with the Jets. I was just sold on the promise he could become better. And for a variety of reasons that never happened.
(P.S. this is Jetfanmack)
Regardless, it's not as if there were a slight edge in the stats: Fitz had Mark crushed in most statistical categories. So I'm certainly not out of line suggesting Fitz can do what Mark did overall in 2010-11.
Post by: bojanglesman on August 21, 2015, 01:18:01 PM
Post by: MBGreen on August 21, 2015, 01:27:18 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on August 21, 2015, 01:27:58 PM
Anyway, FitzGod going to take us to the playoffs.
Post by: bojanglesman on August 21, 2015, 01:30:36 PM
A curve in the xy-plane may be described by a pair of parametric equations
x=x(t)
y=y(t)
where x and y are related through their dependence on t. This is particularly useful when neither x nor y is a function of the other.
The derivative of y with respect to x (in terms of the parameter t) is given by
dxdy=dtdxdtdy
More rigorously, let f be defined at all x in an open interval containing c, except possibly at c itself.
Let A and B be sets.
A function F:AB is a relation that assigns to each xA a unique yB. We write y=f(x) and call y the value of f at x or the image of x under f. We also say that f maps x to y.
The set A is called the domain of f. The set of all possible values of f(x) in B is called the range of f. Here, we will only consider real-valued functions of a real variable, so A and B will both be subsets of the real numbers. If A is left unspecified, we will assume it to be the largest set of real numbers such that for all xA, f(x) is real.
h(x)=xex=(x)(ex)
h(x)=x2sinx=(x2)(sinx)
h(x)=e−x2cos2x=(e−x2)(cos2x)
In each of these examples, the values of the function h can be written in the form
h(x)=f(x)g(x)
for functions f(x) and g(x). If we know the derivative of f(x) and g(x), the Product Rule provides a formula for the derivative of h(x)=f(x)g(x):
h(x)=f(x)g(x)=f(x)g(x)+f(x)g(x)
Proof
If h(x)=xex then
h(x)==(x)ex+x(ex)ex+xex
If h(x)=x2sinx then
h(x)==(x2)sinx+(x2)(sinx)2xsinx+x2cosx
If h(x)=e−x2cos2x then
h(x)==(e−x2)cos2x+e−x2(cos2x)−2xe−x2cos2x−2e−x2sin2x
Then
limxcf(x)=L
if and only if for each 0, there exists a 0 such that
if 0x−c then f(x)−L
In words, limxcf(x)=L if and only if by taking x close enough to c we can get f(x) arbitrarily close to L.
It is often possible to re-write the parametric equations without the parameter. In the second example, x3=cos, y3=sin. Since cos2+sin2=1, x32+x32=1 . Then x2+y2=9, which is the equation of a circle as expected. When you do eliminate the parameter, always check that you have not introduced extraneous portions of the curve.
Every curve has infinitely many parametrizations, amounting to different scales for the parameter. For example,
xy==3cos23sin2
traces out the circle from the second example twice as "quickly," completing a full revolution in rather than 2 units of .
Every equation y=f(x) may be re-written in parametric form by letting x=t, y=f(t).
If x=t2−3 and y=t8, then dtdx=2t and dtdy=8t7. So
dxdydx2d2y==dtdxdtdy=2t8t7=4t6ddxdxdy= dtdx dtd[dxdy] =2t24t5=12t4
limx2x2+12=4 since the function f(x)=x2+12 is continuous at x=2 and f(2)=4.
limxx1=0 since as x increases, x1 gets arbitrarily close to 0.
limx0+lnx tends to − and so does not exist since as x decreases to 0, lnx gets arbitrarily large in magnitude and negative.
limx3x−3x2−9=6 even though f(x)=x−3x2−9 is undefined at 3 since x−3x2−9=x+3 and limx3x+3=6.
What about something like limx0xsinx? When we cannot easily "reason out" the value of a limit, we can often use numerical methods or L'Hôpital's Rule to determine the value of the limit. Can you convince yourself that limx0xsinx=1?
f(2) f(−5) limx−3f(x)
limx2+f(x) limx−5+f(x) limx−f(x)
limx2−f(x) limx−5−f(x) limxf(x)
limx2f(x) limx−5f(x) limxcf(x) for c=−5−32
I have destroyed you!!!!!!
Post by: Laxin on August 21, 2015, 01:31:59 PM
this is what happens when you just look at #s. I like you Derek, you seem like a knowledgeable poster but you are misguided here.
This is so unbelievably condescending... even for you, junc.
Post by: Miamipuck on August 21, 2015, 01:32:42 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on August 21, 2015, 01:51:10 PM
Post by: Johnny English on August 21, 2015, 01:54:20 PM
I can't even believe what I'm seeing. Is junc a TGG plant? This is ludicrous even for him.
Bloody TGG plants coming over here and cluttering up our board with their discussions about football.
Post by: AlioTheFool on August 21, 2015, 02:22:05 PM
Bloody TGG plants coming over here and cluttering up our board with their discussions about football.
Come on.
Post by: Johnny English on August 21, 2015, 02:24:15 PM
Come on.
The fact that junc has a different view to you and is prepared to argue it past the point at which most people would be tying nooses for themselves does not make him a "plant".
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 02:52:58 PM
Your gift of using numbers when they support you, but ignoring numbers when they go against you remains unmatched. 4th-quarter game-winning drives are nice, but here's how many points the offense scored in those games.
Denver: 24
Detroit: 23
Cleveland: 26 (including a full OT)
Houston: 30 (against a godawful defense)
Pittsburgh: 22
Colts: 17
Maybe if the offense was scoring more early in the game, they wouldn't have needed miracle touchdowns late.
I was always a Sanchez supporter when he was our QB. But he was never better than a mediocre QB with the Jets. I was just sold on the promise he could become better. And for a variety of reasons that never happened.
(P.S. this is Jetfanmack)
Regardless, it's not as if there were a slight edge in the stats: Fitz had Mark crushed in most statistical categories. So I'm certainly not out of line suggesting Fitz can do what Mark did overall in 2010-11.
they scored enough points to win those games, right?
maybe if our K doesn't miss 3 Fgs and the D doesn't blow a late lead we don't need OT at Cle?
maybe if our D can hold a 24-7 4th qtr lead against a bad Texans team we don't need that late game magic?
is there something wrong w/ scoring 24, 23, 30, 26 pts? I can see complaining about 17 but the gameplan was to control the clock and keep the ball away from indy but how can we complain about those other scores?
Fitz can have the edge in stats all he wants, if he's our QB in 2010 we don't make the playoffs. there's more to this than just #s. Fitz was 6-6 as starter last year, backups were 3-1.
I can't help myself! (and I like Mark)
Anyway, FitzGod going to take us to the playoffs.
I hope you are right, I want to be wrong here just like I wanted to be wrong in 2008 about the favre move. Unfortunately I was right then but I hope I am wrong now.
This is so unbelievably condescending... even for you, junc.
Not rally, I actually do like his posts for the most part but I am allowed to disagree with him. I think too many people just look at stats w/o context. For me it's about how the stats are accumulated more than the accumulations.
Bloody TGG plants coming over here and cluttering up our board with their discussions about football.
haha, thank you.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 02:53:51 PM
The fact that junc has a different view to you and is prepared to argue it past the point at which most people would be tying nooses for themselves does not make him a "plant".
I have never understood why people care so much about my opinions? I don't ask anyone to agree w/me but I will argue my points until I have nothing left. would it be fun to just agree w/ each other anyway?
Post by: AlioTheFool on August 21, 2015, 03:15:41 PM
The fact that junc has a different view to you and is prepared to argue it past the point at which most people would be tying nooses for themselves does not make him a "plant".
Oh, okay. I meant the "plant" thing sarcastically. I thought it was obvious, so my mistake there.
I have never understood why people care so much about my opinions? I don't ask anyone to agree w/me but I will argue my points until I have nothing left. would it be fun to just agree w/ each other anyway?
And you'll clutter up whole pages of threads to do it.
You keep talking this nonsense about "context" but ignore everything that disputes your arguments. You don't argue against what is presented against you, you simply write it off and claim a "win" like this is a contest.
I posted earlier and you flatly ignored it, so I'll repeat myself.
I didn't post stats without context. You did. I responded to that nonsense where you tried to use a 1% higher rate of interceptions for Fitzpatrick over Smith to prove your point that we're somehow markedly worse off now that Geno is down. I posted both of their stats regarding how many TDs vs those INTs they both threw to show that Fitzpatrick--while throwing slightly more INTs--throws multiple percentage points more TDs than Smith.
I also posted how Fitzpatrick has multiple points better completion percentage than Smith, which is better than the paltry 1% increase in INT risk. That means Fitzpatrick is better capable of helping his team win than Geno.
I've said it repeatedly. So have others. Not a single person has said Fitzpatrick is great. I don't know of anyone who has even said he is "good." The adjective most used to describe Fitz is "average." But that again doesn't fit your straw-man argument, so you ignore it.
And for someone who keeps repeating himself about the lack of tools that led to Sanchez's downfall, you're easily skipping over that this will be one of the most talented receiver groups Fitzpatrick will have led in his career.
You keep talking about this intangible "context" but keep ignoring any actual context presented in response. What your arguments amount to is: "My eyes tell me everything anyone needs to know, and you should all just listen because I know more about everything than anyone else."
I'm about to go on vacation, so I'll be leaving this dumpster fire behind, but go ahead, we all know you can't help but respond.
Post by: nyjunc on August 21, 2015, 03:21:33 PM
Oh, okay. I meant the "plant" thing sarcastically. I thought it was obvious, so my mistake there.
And you'll clutter up whole pages of threads to do it.
You keep talking this nonsense about "context" but ignore everything that disputes your arguments. You don't argue against what is presented against you, you simply write it off and claim a "win" like this is a contest.
I posted earlier and you flatly ignored it, so I'll repeat myself.
And for someone who keeps repeating himself about the lack of tools that led to Sanchez's downfall, you're easily skipping over that this will be one of the most talented receiver groups Fitzpatrick will have led in his career.
You keep talking about this intangible "context" but keep ignoring any actual context presented in response. What your arguments amount to is: "My eyes tell me everything anyone needs to know, and you should all just listen because I know more about everything than anyone else."
I'm about to go on vacation, so I'll be leaving this dumpster fire behind, but go ahead, we all know you can't help but respond.
I don't ignore anything that disputes my arguments, I attack those arguments. when someone posts stats w/o context as their argument it's easy to tear apart.
show me what you posted that was not stats w/o context? maybe I missed it and I apologize.
Fitz has had talent, he had a lot last year, he had a lot in Buffalo. he didn't have NYJ 2012-2014 weapons.
I have watched Fitz, he's nowhere near as good as his #s indicate. #s tell part of the story but far too often people allow it to tell the whole story. some guys play better than their stats, others worse. Fitz is a guy worse than his #s like a Cutler, like an orton, etc...
yes, how dare I respond to a discussion on a message board! we all know this is here only to post one opinion and move on and ignore everything else that has been posted. ::)
Post by: sg3 on August 21, 2015, 05:06:56 PM
How come you aren't arguing your "Tyrod Taylor is a read option QB" position right until you have nothing left??
Post by: Johnny English on August 21, 2015, 08:02:07 PM
So junc man
How come you aren't arguing your "Tyrod Taylor is a read option QB" position right until you have nothing left??
Are you referring to the dicussion in which junc discussed the topic, considered the responses, apologised and accepted he was wrong?
Post by: sg3 on August 22, 2015, 04:53:22 AM
Are you referring to the dicussion in which junc discussed the topic, considered the responses, apologised and accepted he was wrong?An admission of being wrong about Suckchez would be a huge first step in his recovery
Post by: Badger on August 22, 2015, 06:43:23 AM
An admission of being wrong about Suckchez would be a huge first step in his recovery
The only thing junc needs to admit he was wrong about was his prediction that Kerry Collins would lead the 2011 Colts to 10-11 wins. Apparently the only reason he didn't was because the whole team didn't try.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 23, 2015, 09:48:56 AM
Quote
Decker has been impressed by the manner in which Fitzpatrick conducts himself in the meetings. He said it's not unusual to see Fitzpatrick quiz the other quarterbacks on the specifics of a particular play call -- the protection schemes, the sight adjustments, hot reads, etc. Decker said, "He prepares like every play is game-like."
This is good for Bryce Petty (and Geno Smith).
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 07:48:16 AM
Are you referring to the dicussion in which junc discussed the topic, considered the responses, apologised and accepted he was wrong?
thank you.
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 07:49:03 AM
An admission of being wrong about Suckchez would be a huge first step in his recovery
when I am not wrong I do not admit it. if we had mark we'd be a playoff lock.
Fitz the other night is what Fitz is, if you didn't watch the game and looked at his #s you'd think he played pretty well but he was awful.
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 07:50:08 AM
The only thing junc needs to admit he was wrong about was his prediction that Kerry Collins would lead the 2011 Colts to 10-11 wins. Apparently the only reason he didn't was because the whole team didn't try.
sorry, how was I supposed to know Indy would tank? the point of that argument was Peyton wasn't leading a talentless team, a year later a rookie QB to them to double digit wins and back to the playoffs.
Peyton has always had top 3 weapons his entire career and every January he underachieves unless things break perfectly for him like 2006.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 24, 2015, 07:53:29 AM
but he was awful.
No, he wasn't.
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 08:20:54 AM
No, he wasn't.
he was awful. all he did was check down, as soon as he saw any rush he stopped looking downfield and looked to run, he was inaccurate, his was delivering floaters. he was terrible but he had a high completion percentage!
Post by: Heismanberg on August 24, 2015, 08:27:52 AM
he was awful. all he did was check down, as soon as he saw any rush he stopped looking downfield and looked to run, he was inaccurate, his was delivering floaters. he was terrible but he had a high completion percentage!
This is such a stupid freaking way of thinking.
"All he did was take care of the football! He sucks."
Post by: sg3 on August 24, 2015, 08:28:03 AM
The definition of AWFUL for an NFL QB is Buttfumble and his 52 TURNOVERS IN 2011 AND 2012.
We'd be a lock with Suckchez all right....a lock for the division basement and 3 wins.
But I apologize really. I should remember that junc is as head over heels in mad love with Butt as one heterosexual man can be with another man.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 24, 2015, 08:28:37 AM
This thread is dildos
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 08:34:22 AM
This is such a stupid freaking way of thinking.
"All he did was take care of the football! He sucks."
if the D is playing like they are capable just not turning it over will be ok. when the D is being torn to shreds and STs sucks we need more than just not turning it over.
It's preseason, I don't care, the point is this is what Fitz is(except he does turn it over at a high rate) and those that don't watch will see high comp % and think he's good. he's not, there's a reason he's been on a million teams and never succeeded on any of them.
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 08:35:43 AM
Awful?
The definition of AWFUL for an NFL QB is Buttfumble and his 52 TURNOVERS IN 2011 AND 2012.
We'd be a lock with Suckchez all right....a lock for the division basement and 3 wins.
But I apologize really. I should remember that junc is as head over heels in mad love with Butt as one heterosexual man can be with another man.
2012 yes, 2011 you leave out a key point where he set a franchise record for total TDs and our D blew numerous games that season.
when he had the talent to work with he succeeded, when he had Chaz Schilens and co. he failed. imagine Fitz working w/ Schilens, Stephen Hill and Clyde Gates instead of Marshall, Decker and Kerley?
Post by: sg3 on August 24, 2015, 08:41:09 AM
if the D is playing like they are capable just not turning it over will be ok. when the D is being torn to shreds and STs sucks we need more than just not turning it over.If only my beloved little Marky was still.here
It's preseason, I don't care, the point is this is what Fitz is(except he does turn it over at a high rate) and those that don't watch will see high comp % and think he's good. he's not, there's a reason he's been on a million teams and never succeeded on any of them.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 24, 2015, 08:45:01 AM
It's preseason, I don't care, the point is this is what Fitz is(except he does turn it over at a high rate) and those that don't watch will see high comp % and think he's good. he's not, there's a reason he's been on a million teams and never succeeded on any of them.
Who's not watching? I watched that entire game. There's no box score scouting going on here.
Fitzpatrick was not awful. He got rid of the football and made a couple of really nice throws to Marshall. He's an average player with a high football IQ. That's what I saw on Friday.
He's had success in the NFL. There's no reason for you to alter the narrative just to make your argument.
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 08:47:36 AM
Who's not watching? I watched that entire game. There's no box score scouting going on here.
Fitzpatrick was not awful. He got rid of the football and made a couple of really nice throws to Marshall. He's an average player with a high football IQ. That's what I saw on Friday.
He's had success in the NFL. There's no reason for you to alter the narrative just to make your argument.
It wasn't directed at you but those that haven't seen fitz play in his career yet point to his meaningless, out of context, stats as if he is a good QB.
he didn't make a single really nice throw.
what success has he had?
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 08:48:08 AM
If only my beloved little Marky was still.here
it amazes me that fans will bash a guy that helped us reach 2 title games and praise a guy that has done nothing in this league and nothing for us.
Post by: sg3 on August 24, 2015, 08:56:07 AM
it amazes me that fans will bash a guy that helped us reach 2 title games and praise a guy that has done nothing in this league and nothing for us.It amazes me you are still blowing kisses at a mediocrity who followed up losing both those games with two absolutely godawful seasons of 26 turnovers each
Fitzpatrick>>>>>>>>>Suckchez
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 09:02:33 AM
It amazes me you are still blowing kisses at a mediocrity who followed up losing both those games with two absolutely godawful seasons of 26 turnovers each
Fitzpatrick>>>>>>>>>Suckchez
One of those seasons he had 32 total Tds and 3 of his top 5 weapons going into that season were out of football the next year but we ignore that.
The facts are if we had a QB as good as mark we'd be a real threat in the AFC. this team is just as talented as those title game teams.
Post by: sg3 on August 24, 2015, 09:05:44 AM
Please, you are making people vomit
Post by: Johnny English on August 24, 2015, 09:06:41 AM
"As good as Mark!!!!"
Please, you are making people vomit
The only thing making me want to puke is your painfully childish way of arguing. C'mon kid, raise the bar. You're not at TGG now, you're with grownups.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 24, 2015, 09:09:40 AM
he didn't make a single really nice throw.
The throw on the two point conversion to Brandon Marshall was great. It's a throw that cannot be defended.
There were more, but your mind was made up on Fitzpatrick before he took a snap for this team.
Quote
what success has he had?
2010, 2012, 2014
If the Jets had a QB with those kind of numbers, we'd still probably be one of the better teams in the NFL.
Post by: Tommy on August 24, 2015, 09:12:58 AM
Junc is a fan of proving others wrong. He'll twist his perception to fit his narrative.
What we saw on Friday was average quarterback play. Junc so desperately wants to prove everyone that he's smarter that he's convinced that what he was was awful QB play.
Pretty psychotic if you ask me.
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 09:14:04 AM
The throw on the two point conversion to Brandon Marshall was great. It's a throw that cannot be defended.
There were more, but your mind was made up on Fitzpatrick before he took a snap for this team.
2010, 2012, 2014
If the Jets had a QB with those kind of numbers, we'd still probably be one of the better teams in the NFL.
Ok, I will agree about the 2 pt play. I can't remember the last time we converted one preseason or regular season so that was a nice throw.
2010 we made the championship game largely on the back of the passing game.
in 2012 he main weapons were rookie Stephen Hill, Chaz Schilens and Clyde Gates
In 2014 we had more talent than 2012 or 2013 but it still wasn't great, w/ better talent in Houston he led team to 6-6 record, his backups led team to 3-1 record.
My mind is made up on Ryan based on what I have seen, some guys play better than their #s, some play worse. Fitz has been worse than his #s but I hope he's great for us this year or at least good. what I saw the other night will not cut it BUT it is preseason.
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 09:16:10 AM
Junc isn't a fan of the NY Jets. He'd rather see Fitz fail so he can say he was right. He wants Brady's suspension reduced so he can say he was right.
Junc is a fan of proving others wrong. He'll twist his perception to fit his narrative.
What we saw on Friday was average quarterback play. Junc so desperately wants to prove everyone that he's smarter that he's convinced that what he was was awful QB play.
Pretty psychotic if you ask me.
I'm rooting for Fitz as I do every player that plays for us. I hope to be wrong about Fitz just as I hoped to be wrong about Brett favre. Unfortunately I was right about Favre.
I just want to win, doesn't matter who is helping us do it.
If you think that was average QB play I can't help you. I guess you impressed he had one good drive against backups but overall he was terrible and we'd have lost that game badly if it was a reg season game.
Post by: Heismanberg on August 24, 2015, 09:28:56 AM
2010 we made the championship game largely on the back of the passing game.
hahahahahaha
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 09:30:24 AM
hahahahahaha
how many times did we need the pass game to pull out a game?
at Denver
vs. Houston
at Det
at Cle
at Pitt
vs. NE
at Miami
at Indy playoffs(though the run game settled things down and got us the lead before we blew it and the pass O led the GW drive)
Post by: MBGreen on August 24, 2015, 09:35:32 AM
If only my beloved little Marky was still.here
wtf is this excrement
Post by: MexJetinBcn on August 24, 2015, 10:16:05 AM
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 10:26:40 AM
Post by: sg3 on August 24, 2015, 11:08:59 AM
I just hope Fitz is mediocre and our D lives up to the hype.God forbid if he's better than mediocre. Wouldn't want to see you pounding your fists into your TV
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 11:13:43 AM
God forbid if he's better than mediocre. Wouldn't want to see you pounding your fists into your TV
I am trying to be realistic, I'd love it if he was great. I'd love to win the next 5 SBs too but can we be realistic?
Post by: MexJetinBcn on August 24, 2015, 11:16:16 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on August 24, 2015, 11:17:07 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 24, 2015, 11:25:21 AM
Fitzpatrick might be great for a game or 2 but not for an entire stretch. If he's mediocre/average the Jets should be in playoff contention.
That's all we need right now. We're a running and defensive team, if the QB just doesn't kill us we should have a chance. Same place we've been the past few years but we've had QBs leading the league in turnovers. so far no picks, that's what we need.
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 12:13:16 PM
Fitzpatrick might be great for a game or 2 but not for an entire stretch. If he's mediocre/average the Jets should be in playoff contention.
limit TOs(the game changing TOs), make a play here and there and if this D is as good as it is on paper then we will be a playoff contender.
Post by: nyjunc on August 24, 2015, 12:14:09 PM
That's all we need right now. We're a running and defensive team, if the QB just doesn't kill us we should have a chance. Same place we've been the past few years but we've had QBs leading the league in turnovers. so far no picks, that's what we need.
Ride Ivory and don't forget about Powell. we have some good backs.
Post by: Jetaho on August 24, 2015, 12:30:28 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 24, 2015, 12:34:38 PM
I'd love me some mediocre QB play.
Haha, sad but that's what it has come to for us.
Post by: ScotlandJet on August 24, 2015, 02:08:13 PM
Can you please stop the high-school style arguments? It was fun like for the first two posts, now it's just annoying.
Whooo,I like it, Mex is getting a set of balls hanging with this annoying freaking crowd.
Post by: Badger on August 24, 2015, 05:10:17 PM
Aye, fook.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on August 25, 2015, 02:38:12 PM
Whooo,I like it, Mex is getting a set of balls hanging with this annoying freaking crowd.
Someone needed to show some huevos rancheros in this forum once and for all :P
Post by: Pope on August 25, 2015, 05:31:30 PM
Post by: Badger on August 25, 2015, 05:39:18 PM
This thread is AIDS
AIDZmagic
Post by: Tommy on August 31, 2015, 11:26:28 AM
Post by: Johnny English on August 31, 2015, 02:25:58 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on August 31, 2015, 02:54:34 PM
Fitz won't play on Thursday. Smart move by Bowles. Lots of Petty to watch, I guess.I think Petty will get a half, maybe less. Then the other two clipboard holders close it out for the temporary 3rd qb job.
Post by: Johnny English on August 31, 2015, 02:57:16 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on August 31, 2015, 02:59:18 PM
I can't imagine we go into the season with four QBs, so unless Geno goes on PUP/NFI then I don't see how Flynn or Johnson gets a job with us.I agree. Neither will be here after Geno is back. One of them will be here until Geno is able to play. They need to have a 3rd qb for the first few games.
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 31, 2015, 03:01:49 PM
One of them will be here until Geno is able to play.
So, for eternity.
Post by: bojanglesman on August 31, 2015, 03:02:24 PM
So, for eternity.Ha.
Post by: Badger on August 31, 2015, 07:40:58 PM
Post by: ukilledkenny on August 31, 2015, 07:53:34 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 31, 2015, 07:58:51 PM
Can't complain about that.
We'll take that, especially considering where we're coming from. If the D is anything close to what it should be and he plays like this we might be ok.
Post by: Heismanberg on September 01, 2015, 06:06:52 AM
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/31/d5bbc0955b98560fe8bc951fb32babb7.jpg)
"average"
Post by: Libero_2 on September 01, 2015, 06:08:57 AM
"average"
Preseason
Post by: Heismanberg on September 01, 2015, 06:12:41 AM
Preseason
(http://media.giphy.com/media/14r9VMLSuQUzQs/giphy.gif)
Post by: AlioTheFool on September 01, 2015, 11:42:28 AM
We won't get to see/hear anything the next week-plus but hopefully he continues to build rapport with the offense leading up to the opener.
This week I doubt we'll see much Petty. He's going to be on the roster so there's not much reason to play him. It'll be the Flynn vs. Johnson show for the right to still have a job on Saturday.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 01, 2015, 11:52:00 AM
This week I doubt we'll see much Petty. He's going to be on the roster so there's not much reason to play him.
I think he'll play some to get some more experience under center. He needs all he can get because he's likely to play zero this regular season.
Post by: Tommy on September 01, 2015, 11:56:35 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 01, 2015, 12:17:07 PM
IK solved the Geno problem.
So simply put yet so true.
I think he'll play some to get some more experience under center. He needs all he can get because he's likely to play zero this regular season.
If we can't use this game to get Petty a ton of reps why even have the game anymore? We have to save him now? I'd play him at least into the 3rd quarter.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 01, 2015, 01:03:04 PM
So simply put yet so true.
If we can't use this game to get Petty a ton of reps why even have the game anymore? We have to save him now? I'd play him at least into the 3rd quarter.
The only argument against it would be fear of injury, but you can't coach scared all the time. You would want him healthy for next year to battle for the starter role, not coming off some surgery. I'd still play him for at least a quarter and see how things look then. You might need more than a half to evaluate the other two turds. I would think it's Flynn unless he is obviously still hampered by his injuries.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 01, 2015, 01:11:29 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on September 01, 2015, 02:08:04 PM
The Jets currently have two QBs who have yet to play that are both fighting for one roster spot. That spot is likely to be the guy behind Fitzpatrick and ahead of Petty. The organization owes it to itself to give both of them as much time as possible to prove who should get that job.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 01, 2015, 02:11:03 PM
Petty has nothing to prove. He's going to be on the active roster in week 1. It doesn't make any sense to play him.
The Jets currently have two QBs who have yet to play that are both fighting for one roster spot. That spot is likely to be the guy behind Fitzpatrick and ahead of Petty. The organization owes it to itself to give both of them as much time as possible to prove who should get that job.
It's not about Petty proving anything. Of course he'll be on the roster. He needs experience.
The other two guys need to play for a different reason. I don't think it will affect the evaluation of Flynn and Johnson if Petty plays for a quarter.
Post by: AlioTheFool on September 01, 2015, 02:15:28 PM
It's not about Petty proving anything. Of course he'll be on the roster. He needs experience.
The other two guys need to play for a different reason. I don't think it will affect the evaluation of Flynn and Johnson if Petty plays for a quarter.
Petty may play a quarter. I wouldn't be shocked if he played less (1 series) though.
He's had some in-game reps already and he shouldn't see the field at all the rest of the year. He should be in learn-everything-you-can mode the rest of the way.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 01, 2015, 04:05:14 PM
Post by: Tommy on September 01, 2015, 04:34:52 PM
It's not about Petty proving anything. Of course he'll be on the roster. He needs experience.
The other two guys need to play for a different reason. I don't think it will affect the evaluation of Flynn and Johnson if Petty plays for a quarter.
Is a few quarters against scrubs in a meaningless preseason game really going to make that much of a difference?
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 01, 2015, 04:38:50 PM
Is a few quarters against scrubs in a meaningless preseason game really going to make that much of a difference?
If you've never played in the NFL and you have the next 11 months to lift weights and look at film, why not? It's not like he's above the level he would be playing at, where else is he going to get reps?
Post by: Tommy on September 01, 2015, 04:40:20 PM
If you've never played in the NFL and you have the next 11 months to lift weights and look at film, why not? It's not like he's above the level he would be playing at, where else is he going to get reps?
Well it's not like he won't not get experience in the next 11 months by not just sitting there watching tape and practicing with the rest of the team.
Post by: Italian Seafood on September 01, 2015, 04:42:26 PM
Well it's not like he won't not get experience in the next 11 months by not just sitting there watching tape and practicing with the rest of the team.
That helps, but there's no minor league, no Europe league, nowhere to play at game speed for a whole year. For a guy who needs reps and practice more than anything, I don't get it. Even if he got hurt, which we hope he didn't, he's not going to play again this year anyway.
Post by: Tommy on September 01, 2015, 04:43:24 PM
That helps, but there's no minor league, no Europe league, nowhere to play at game speed for a whole year. For a guy who needs reps and practice more than anything, I don't get it. Even if he got hurt, which we hope he didn't, he's not going to play again this year anyway.
Yeah I hear ya. There really is no downside.
Post by: bojanglesman on September 14, 2015, 10:16:19 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on September 14, 2015, 10:25:00 AM
Post by: ScotlandJet on September 14, 2015, 02:27:15 PM
Love the beard.
I don't. It's stupid and unkempt.
Nice performance from Fitz yesterday- loads of veteran calm, which is what we need. I've always liked him even if sometimes his personal expectation of his skill set exceeds his ability.
I'm wondering how far he can take us with this team, not thinking stupid stuff like deep play offs but I really think he can keep us in the AFC East shake up if the defense keeps performing. Having a genuine beast at wide out like Marshall anything is possible- wish we had at least one decent tight end.
Post by: Miamipuck on September 14, 2015, 02:31:13 PM
I don't. It's stupid and unkempt.
His ancestors are from Scotland, they're unkempt drunks, what do you expect?
Post by: Johnny English on September 14, 2015, 02:41:28 PM
His ancestors are from Scotland, they're unkempt drunks, what do you expect?
I believe that Fitzpatrick is an Irish name, not Scottish. Not all Celts are Scottish.
Post by: ScotlandJet on September 14, 2015, 02:45:41 PM
His ancestors are from Scotland, they're unkempt drunks, what do you expect?
My Goatee is sharpened up every time I visit New York at "Sals".
Post by: ScotlandJet on September 14, 2015, 02:47:23 PM
I believe that Fitzpatrick is an Irish name, not Scottish. Not all Celts are Scottish.
Well spotted JE. This was a little difficult for Puck to work out because he was busy surfing the latest "Beach Boy Huts" on South beach.
Post by: Miamipuck on September 14, 2015, 02:49:59 PM
I believe that Fitzpatrick is an Irish name, not Scottish. Not all Celts are Scottish.
The point of busting balls isn't to be correct. If I said you're small gay dude that was taken from a Lord of the Rings novel, chances are you ............ wait bad example.
Post by: Miamipuck on September 14, 2015, 02:51:38 PM
Well spotted JE. This was a little difficult for Puck to work out because he was busy surfing the latest "Beach Boy Huts" on South beach.
Close, I actually was watching Splendor in the derriere on my headphones while at work.
JE, see how ball busting works?
Post by: Johnny English on September 14, 2015, 02:52:59 PM
Close, I actually was watching Splendor in the derriere on my headphones while at work.
JE, see how ball busting works?
Not really. You're clearly the expert on how to handle balls.
Post by: ScotlandJet on September 14, 2015, 02:54:57 PM
The point of busting balls isn't to be correct. If I said you're small gay dude that was taken from a Lord of the Rings novel, chances are you ............ wait bad example.
I don't like the 'small'.
Post by: Miamipuck on September 14, 2015, 02:55:06 PM
Not really. You're clearly the expert on how to handle balls.
As opposed to you gargling them?
Post by: Johnny English on September 14, 2015, 02:56:12 PM
As opposed to you gargling them?
I don't..... that doesn't make any sense.
Post by: Miamipuck on September 14, 2015, 03:01:46 PM
I don't..... that doesn't make any sense.
You must be so much fun at parties.
I don't like the 'small'.
Well if I said big it would all be one giant lie.
Post by: dcm1602 on September 14, 2015, 03:10:13 PM
Not really. You're clearly the expert on how to handle balls.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETizgacdvDg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETizgacdvDg)
Post by: Badger on September 18, 2015, 07:38:35 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on September 19, 2015, 12:46:54 AM
http://www.newyorkjets.com/videos/videos/JetLife-Get-to-Know-the-Bearded-Man/981a9aa4-75ab-45fd-83d4-91d060792c6d?campaign=tw
Books and Rubik's Cubes
Post by: MexJetinBcn on September 19, 2015, 05:40:17 AM
Post by: Coach K on September 19, 2015, 08:22:39 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on September 19, 2015, 08:31:00 AM
The real Red Rifle
what
Post by: Emerson Boozer on September 19, 2015, 08:15:11 PM
what
Googled red rifle. Saw this.
(https://jerkfest.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/bengals-andy-dalton-the-red-rifle-is-making-the-leap-to-stardom-this-season-in-the-nfl.png)
Post by: Badger on September 21, 2015, 11:35:51 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 21, 2015, 11:43:25 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 21, 2015, 11:45:29 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on September 21, 2015, 11:48:56 PM
Quote
chrisrock: Ike enemkpali the MVP of the New York Jets. http://t.co/qkLyfsxday
Post by: Libero_2 on September 22, 2015, 05:48:38 AM
^whoever that is, I pray that they never stop
Agreed
Post by: Hemi on September 22, 2015, 06:04:34 AM
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/21/5c6d825d7e8aba047cb2f277b8e7b910.jpg)
That is awesome. Lol
Post by: Badger on September 22, 2015, 06:24:25 PM
Edit: cleansed.
Post by: Badger on October 01, 2015, 08:42:53 PM
Post by: ukilledkenny on October 01, 2015, 09:48:52 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on October 01, 2015, 11:47:00 PM
Fitz should stay starter just because of that hirt.
Isn't that Decker?
Post by: Laxin on October 02, 2015, 06:43:50 AM
Isn't that Decker?
Its Tanner Purdum
Post by: ukilledkenny on October 02, 2015, 10:06:19 AM
Isn't that Decker?
I just meant because the shirt is cool and it should become more popular.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 02, 2015, 10:08:10 AM
Its Tanner Purdum
No no no that's a beautiful man, it has to be Decker.
Post by: Pope on October 03, 2015, 08:46:31 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 03, 2015, 09:07:45 AM
Does anyone know the deal is with those orange glasses all the players were wearing
They block out certain light that keeps you awake.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 03, 2015, 11:55:50 AM
They block out certain light that keeps you awake.
Just have a few shots of Scotch.
Post by: Badger on October 04, 2015, 12:02:11 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on October 04, 2015, 12:16:54 PM
.
Post by: IATA on October 04, 2015, 09:08:01 PM
No no no that's a beautiful man, it has to be Decker.
Puck should do an intensive review of all NFL rosters to determine the hottest team. dcm can help.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 04, 2015, 11:20:18 PM
Puck should do an intensive review of all NFL rosters to determine the hottest team. dcm can help.
You can help if you want.
Post by: nyjunc on October 05, 2015, 07:45:07 AM
Post by: Badger on October 18, 2015, 03:43:20 PM
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/18/0adba14e3f6714d2bee0880c570728c0.jpg)
Post by: insanity on October 18, 2015, 04:30:36 PM
Post by: Badger on October 18, 2015, 05:15:39 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on October 18, 2015, 05:18:56 PM
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/18/0e57c55c6d2173ae9af63cb3c652b48b.jpg)
(http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view7/2981631/no-marbles-o.gif)
Post by: nyjunc on October 19, 2015, 07:25:21 AM
Post by: Johnny English on October 19, 2015, 07:52:57 AM
Fitz played his best game of the year by far. we can do some damage if he plays like this consistently.
The pick was a shitty decision, but other than that he was pretty much flawless.
Post by: nyjunc on October 19, 2015, 08:24:01 AM
The pick was a shitty decision, but other than that he was pretty much flawless.
he wasn't perfect but he was really good.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 19, 2015, 08:26:08 AM
DCM mode engaged
Fitz played his best game of the year by far. we can do some damage if he plays like this consistently.
FYP
Post by: ukilledkenny on October 19, 2015, 09:52:02 AM
Am I the only one who thought the Marshall TD was a pick when it left his hands, though?
Post by: insanity on October 19, 2015, 09:57:41 AM
Fitz was good and is keeping the Geno rumbling on the lowest setting.
Am I the only one who thought the Marshall TD was a pick when it left his hands, though?
It was clear that it was supposed to be a back shoulder throw, from the offset, but I was worried because the corner played good coverage and Fitz under threw the ball.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 19, 2015, 10:14:19 AM
Quote
“but right now, I’m just excited to wrap up the press conference and go home and eat some chili in the crockpot and just enjoy this one for a little bit.”
-FitzGod
Post by: Heismanberg on October 19, 2015, 10:54:38 AM
-FitzGod
Geno doesn't even own a crockpot.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 19, 2015, 10:55:48 AM
Geno doesn't even own a crockpot.
Geno doesn't eat chili because it's "too spicy."
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 19, 2015, 10:57:14 AM
Geno doesn't even own a crockpot.
Because he wouldn't know what time to turn it off
Post by: Miamipuck on October 19, 2015, 10:58:07 AM
Geno doesn't eat chili because it's "too spicy."
If he did he would excrement himself.
Post by: Tommy on October 19, 2015, 11:21:11 AM
Post by: ukilledkenny on October 19, 2015, 12:08:43 PM
Post by: Tommy on October 19, 2015, 12:12:18 PM
I made chili in the crock pot yesterday and I have a beard. I am Fitz!
You better make that excrement next week.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 19, 2015, 01:53:45 PM
But that's what happens when you have a guy like Marshall. If we throw that to some of the guys we had the last couple years, that's picked. But Marshall can make a play on it and make his QB look good.
Fitz played very well though. His pass to Decker that got us down to the 1-yardline might have been his best throw all year. Very happy with how he played yesterday.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 19, 2015, 02:02:09 PM
Fitz's touchdown pass to Marshall was extremely lucky and it should have been picked.
But that's what happens when you have a guy like Marshall. If we throw that to some of the guys we had the last couple years, that's picked. But Marshall can make a play on it and make his QB look good.
Fitz played very well though. His pass to Decker that got us down to the 1-yardline might have been his best throw all year. Very happy with how he played yesterday.
He almost broke up the pick as well, that was an unlucky bounce to something called a Bashaud Breeland.
Post by: nyjunc on October 19, 2015, 02:10:21 PM
Fitz's touchdown pass to Marshall was extremely lucky and it should have been picked.
But that's what happens when you have a guy like Marshall. If we throw that to some of the guys we had the last couple years, that's picked. But Marshall can make a play on it and make his QB look good.
Fitz played very well though. His pass to Decker that got us down to the 1-yardline might have been his best throw all year. Very happy with how he played yesterday.
that pass was perfect, if he can play like this we have a real shot Sunday and beyond.
Post by: bojanglesman on October 19, 2015, 04:38:40 PM
Post by: nyjunc on October 19, 2015, 04:42:08 PM
I think Fitz got hit on that under thrown TD to Marshall. Not sure.
I thought so too, I checked the DVR when I got home and it didn't look like but I couldn't tell b/c they didn't show any close up replays.
Post by: bojanglesman on October 19, 2015, 04:49:34 PM
I thought so too, I checked the DVR when I got home and it didn't look like but I couldn't tell b/c they didn't show any close up replays.It seemed way too underthrown to be bad aim.
Post by: JFIF on October 20, 2015, 02:58:19 AM
Post by: MexJetinBcn on October 20, 2015, 05:35:55 AM
Fitz doesn't have any games yet where he hasn't thrown a pick.
But he has thrown a TD pass in every game too. ;)
Post by: ukilledkenny on October 20, 2015, 05:42:07 AM
Fitz doesn't have any games yet where he hasn't thrown a pick.
They haven't been in terrible spots so this hasn't bothered me much yet.
Post by: nyjunc on October 20, 2015, 08:10:18 AM
They haven't been in terrible spots so this hasn't bothered me much yet.
the 2 in eagle territory were in bad spots, cost us points each time in a close loss. he hasn't had the disastrous TO deep in our territory or a pick 6 but he has had a few bad INTs.
Post by: ukilledkenny on October 20, 2015, 08:14:12 AM
the 2 in eagle territory were in bad spots, cost us points each time in a close loss. he hasn't had the disastrous TO deep in our territory or a pick 6 but he has had a few bad INTs.
True, none of them have killed the team is more what I meant. They had the chance to overcome any turnover he made.
Post by: sg3 on October 20, 2015, 08:15:07 AM
We all know we'd be discussing Draft 2016 if IK hadn't Mo Lewis'd the Jets in the summer
Post by: nyjunc on October 20, 2015, 09:00:16 AM
It's nice to be talking about a game for first place next Sunday
We all know we'd be discussing Draft 2016 if IK hadn't Mo Lewis'd the Jets in the summer
how do we know that exactly?
Post by: nyjunc on October 20, 2015, 09:00:36 AM
True, none of them have killed the team is more what I meant. They had the chance to overcome any turnover he made.
I'm with you.
Post by: MoreCharacters on October 20, 2015, 09:31:11 AM
fitzmagic
fitzmagic
fitzmagic
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 20, 2015, 09:48:23 AM
how do we know that exactly?
Here we go...
Post by: Tommy on October 20, 2015, 09:49:37 AM
Here we go...
Junc is right. There's actually no way to know. I'm happy where we are right now, and that's all that matters. No reason for SG to even bring it up.
Post by: sg3 on October 20, 2015, 09:54:12 AM
Junc is right. There's actually no way to know. I'm happy where we are right now, and that's all that matters. No reason for SG to even bring it up.You're right
As long as "even worse than sanchez" stays tied to the bench until Petty is ready to officially be appointed #2 QB, we will all be happy together
Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk
Post by: MBGreen on October 20, 2015, 10:24:58 AM
You're right
As long as "even worse than sanchez" stays tied to the bench until Petty is ready to officially be appointed #2 QB, we will all be happy together
Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk
I thought you left town, Wrecks.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 20, 2015, 10:25:32 AM
Junc is right. There's actually no way to know. I'm happy where we are right now, and that's all that matters. No reason for SG to even bring it up.
Yes there is...if you watched any games over the last 2 seasons...you'd know.
You have to be happy with the QB play...it's not stellar, but when the bar is set SO low with Geno you take this any day of the week.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 20, 2015, 10:26:30 AM
You're right
As long as "even worse than sanchez" stays tied to the bench until Petty is ready to officially be appointed #2 QB, we will all be happy together
Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk
I thought you were to suppose to give up on bad nicknames...or does this not count since it contains 4 words?
Post by: Tommy on October 20, 2015, 10:27:44 AM
Yes there is...if you watched any games over the last 2 seasons...you'd know.
You have to be happy with the QB play...it's not stellar, but when the bar is set SO low with Geno you take this any day of the week.
I'm pretty confident that Geno would still suck, but I'm just saying that we can't say definitively that he wouldn't have had the same success as Fitz. That doesn't change the fact that I'm happy with both the change and where we are right now.
Post by: nyjunc on October 20, 2015, 12:18:59 PM
Yes there is...if you watched any games over the last 2 seasons...you'd know.
You have to be happy with the QB play...it's not stellar, but when the bar is set SO low with Geno you take this any day of the week.
oh, I didn't realize Chan Gailey was here, james Carpenter was here and some scrub named Brandon Marshall was here among other changes so you are right we know ::)
Post by: nyjunc on October 20, 2015, 12:20:08 PM
I'm pretty confident that Geno would still suck, but I'm just saying that we can't say definitively that he wouldn't have had the same success as Fitz. That doesn't change the fact that I'm happy with both the change and where we are right now.
Fitz was very good on Sunday but hasn't been very good the rest of the year. it's reasonable to think we could be 4-1 or 5-0 w/ Geno or we could be 2-3 or 3-2. we don't know. I'm happy we are 4-1 and I want to be 5-1, I want Fitz to play most games like he did Sunday.
Post by: Chrebet86 on October 20, 2015, 01:27:51 PM
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Post by: Pope on October 20, 2015, 01:28:51 PM
Post by: Johnny English on October 20, 2015, 01:44:23 PM
Semi/Unrelated but I wonder what the talk is right now during the bye week regarding the QB situation at Broncos forums. No way they bench Peyton during an undefeated run but I think the rumblings are getting louder
Is their backup still Brock Osweiler? I can't imagine the talk is too serious if that's the case, he might be OK but replacing a franchise QB with a completely unknown quantity when you're 6-0 has the risk of backfiring at a level rarely seen.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on October 20, 2015, 01:47:22 PM
oh, I didn't realize Chan Gailey was here, james Carpenter was here and some scrub named Brandon Marshall was here among other changes so you are right we know ::)
Geno is flat out dumb and makes bad decisions. None of what is listed above can cure that.
Post by: nyjunc on October 20, 2015, 01:57:06 PM
Geno is flat out dumb and makes bad decisions. None of what is listed above can cure that.
maybe that is true but it's not fair to compare what he had to work with to what Fitz had to work with and the reality is geno will play at some point w/ as reckless as Fitz is running the ball. he has taken some big shots and that will likely continue.
I am NOT pro Geno I just don't think it is fair to compare his work the last 2 years to what he could have done this year.
Post by: bojanglesman on October 20, 2015, 02:02:14 PM
Quote
NFL Total Access @NFLTotalAccess
We're playing #MemeThis! What was Ryan Fitzpatrick thinking here?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CRx4tJZVAAA_i6X.jpg)
Send us your memes! Best make air!
Post by: Badger on October 20, 2015, 02:17:11 PM
Post by: nyjunc on October 20, 2015, 02:49:32 PM
Post by: MBGreen on October 20, 2015, 02:50:44 PM
One thing that is easy to see is that his teammates love him.
what gave it away...the handful of tit?
Post by: reuben on October 20, 2015, 07:57:19 PM
Semi/Unrelated but I wonder what the talk is right now during the bye week regarding the QB situation at Broncos forums. No way they bench Peyton during an undefeated run but I think the rumblings are getting louder
#BenchPeyton is getting pretty big, actually. freaking Colorado hill people and their Twitters.
Post by: nyjunc on October 21, 2015, 08:04:24 AM
#BenchPeyton is getting pretty big, actually. freaking Colorado hill people and their Twitters.
they are a little out of it, they aren't used to Peyton playing like this until January.
Post by: bojanglesman on October 23, 2015, 02:37:28 PM
http://www.newyorkjets.com/videos/videos/Micd-Up-Ryan-Fitzpatrick-vs-Redskins-/361fbcda-c79e-4a5a-b885-aa01684d648c
Funny.
Post by: MoreCharacters on October 24, 2015, 05:27:06 PM
maybe $15.50 for 3D
i'd buy milk duds at the gas station though
Post by: Badger on October 24, 2015, 06:56:40 PM
i would pay $11.50 to go see the fitzmagic-marshall buddy comedy
maybe $15.50 for 3D
i'd buy milk duds at the gas station though
Would you pay face value for a Jets ticket to attend the upcoming Jaguars tailgate?
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 01, 2015, 10:51:51 PM
Quote
It's nice to be talking about a game for first place next Sunday
We all know we'd be discussing Draft 2016 if IK hadn't Mo Lewis'd the Jets in the summerhow do we know that exactly?
Now we freaking know
Post by: Tommy on November 01, 2015, 10:54:01 PM
Now we freaking know
He'll just counter with "Well, Geno was thrown right in there without having practiced much with the first team in months."
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 01, 2015, 10:55:09 PM
He'll just counter with "Well, Geno was thrown right in there without having practiced much with the first team in months."
He wouldn't if he watched the game
Post by: nyjunc on November 02, 2015, 07:11:13 AM
Post by: IATA on November 02, 2015, 07:33:34 AM
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Post by: nyjunc on November 02, 2015, 07:35:14 AM
Post by: ukilledkenny on November 02, 2015, 08:18:36 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 02, 2015, 09:50:03 AM
now we know what? are you guys seriously blaming geno? our D got gashed all game long, we had no chance. Geno played pretty well overall. Jet fans are just the worst.
Half of this post is correct. The defense is why we lost, but Geno did not play pretty well. I'm not blaming Smith for the loss, but he's not an NFL QB from the neck up.
Post by: MBGreen on November 02, 2015, 09:50:47 AM
now we know what? are you guys seriously blaming geno? our D got gashed all game long, we had no chance. Geno played pretty well overall. Jet fans are just the worst.
lolwat
Post by: Heismanberg on November 02, 2015, 09:52:23 AM
are you guys seriously blaming geno?
No one here blamed Geno Smith for the loss. He's just a horrible QB. He has no pocket presence. Oakland has the league's worst pass defense and he put up some numbers in garbage time. It was no that impressive. He is a single read QB still and that's embarrassing.
The kid that shredded us yesterday could have been the quarterback of this football team if Idzik didn't waste a draft pick and an entire season on a garbage player.
Post by: nyjunc on November 02, 2015, 10:29:47 AM
No one here blamed Geno Smith for the loss. He's just a horrible QB. He has no pocket presence. Oakland has the league's worst pass defense and he put up some numbers in garbage time. It was no that impressive. He is a single read QB still and that's embarrassing.
The kid that shredded us yesterday could have been the quarterback of this football team if Idzik didn't waste a draft pick and an entire season on a garbage player.
I keep seeing this about the league's worst pass defense. we had no run game and the game was out of hand early so we had to pass, that makes it a little tougher and one of the reasons they have the worst pass D was b/c Rivers in total garbage time put up great, meaningless #s last week when his team never had a shot. We had a small shot, Geno made some nice reads, some nice throws and he had some poor decisions and throws. the worst thing were those 2 sacks, other than that he played pretty well especially factoring in the situation and marshall in and out of the lineup.
No argument on idzik, the geno pick wasn't a good one and to top it off he rushed him when he wasn't ready.
w/ all this said we need Geno for at least a few weeks here. If our D plays well we can win some games, if not we won't win and that is the same for when Fitz is playing. It sucks b/c Fitz was finally playing really well the last 2 games but he played reckless when he ran and it was going to catch up to him at some point.
Post by: Jumbo on November 02, 2015, 10:35:22 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 11:21:53 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 02, 2015, 11:29:52 AM
Do we know yet how long Fitzpatrick is out? And is sliding that freaking hard for a 10 year vet? How many more guys? Chad, Sanchez, now Fitzpatrick, WTF?
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 02, 2015, 11:37:56 AM
The biggest dropoff from Fitzpatrick to Geno was trying to finish drives. Where Fitz finds Decker in the end zone, Geno runs around and can't find anyone.
Do we know yet how long Fitzpatrick is out? And is sliding that freaking hard for a 10 year vet? How many more guys? Chad, Sanchez, now Fitzpatrick, WTF?
I'm thinking Fitz is out long term. He said in his postgame yesterday that the thumb was dislocated and when they put it back in it came right back out. His tendons must be severed and I think the MRI will show that.
I've never seen/heard of this before so I don't know what the surgery/rehab would entail, but if the same thing were to happen to an elbow, that's Tommy John surgery and at least 12 months away from a return.
Post by: nyjunc on November 02, 2015, 11:39:33 AM
The biggest dropoff from Fitzpatrick to Geno was trying to finish drives. Where Fitz finds Decker in the end zone, Geno runs around and can't find anyone.
Do we know yet how long Fitzpatrick is out? And is sliding that freaking hard for a 10 year vet? How many more guys? Chad, Sanchez, now Fitzpatrick, WTF?
Didn't Fitz find Decker in the EZ? didn't one of his runarounds lead to a TD to davis?
Post by: Tommy on November 02, 2015, 11:41:09 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 02, 2015, 11:41:55 AM
Didn't Fitz find Decker in the EZ? didn't one of his runarounds lead to a TD to davis?
Geno stalled a couple of drives we badly needed at the end by taking terrible sacks and underthrowing Marshall at the pylon. He was better than I thought he would be after the obligatory turnover but doesn't finish drives. Not just yesterday, ever.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 02, 2015, 11:43:02 AM
Geno or Fitz, if it wasn't for our defense laying a big fat egg, we likely win that game.
This too. That was the hard part to figure out.
Post by: nyjunc on November 02, 2015, 11:46:03 AM
Geno stalled a couple of drives we badly needed at the end by taking terrible sacks and underthrowing Marshall at the pylon. He was better than I thought he would be after the obligatory turnover but doesn't finish drives. Not just yesterday, ever.
Fitz has been underthrowing WRs all season though. I thought Marshall was interfered w/ on the play at the GL but they didn't call it.
Post by: nyjunc on November 02, 2015, 11:46:29 AM
Geno or Fitz, if it wasn't for our defense laying a big fat egg, we likely win that game.
this is it, no matter who is under C if our D doesn't get back to playing good football we won't win enough.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 12:14:20 PM
I'm thinking Fitz is out long term. He said in his postgame yesterday that the thumb was dislocated and when they put it back in it came right back out. His tendons must be severed and I think the MRI will show that.It's his non-throwing thumb. No way it's the whole year.
I've never seen/heard of this before so I don't know what the surgery/rehab would entail, but if the same thing were to happen to an elbow, that's Tommy John surgery and at least 12 months away from a return.
Post by: nyjunc on November 02, 2015, 12:27:28 PM
It's his non-throwing thumb. No way it's the whole year.
that hand is still important
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 02, 2015, 12:38:12 PM
It's his non-throwing thumb. No way it's the whole year.
that hand is still important
Exactly.
Again, I don't know the subtleties of blowing out ligaments in the thumb, but a person coming off Tommy John can't throw for months post-surgery. Like ACL surgery, they're taking a tendon from a cadaver and attaching it to your bones.
If it's anything the same, how is he going to handle gripping a snap from under center--and worse, catching and holding a shotgun snap?
Like Fitz said, this is uncharted territory.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 02, 2015, 12:44:34 PM
Like ACL surgery, they're taking a tendon from a cadaver and attaching it to your bones.
Or they can just take a piece of your hamstring and leave the corpses alone...
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 12:51:13 PM
Exactly.I'm not saying he won't miss time, but he will come back from this in a few weeks. Of course it's important and of course he can't play right after surgery.
Again, I don't know the subtleties of blowing out ligaments in the thumb, but a person coming off Tommy John can't throw for months post-surgery. Like ACL surgery, they're taking a tendon from a cadaver and attaching it to your bones.
If it's anything the same, how is he going to handle gripping a snap from under center--and worse, catching and holding a shotgun snap?
Like Fitz said, this is uncharted territory.
It doesn't have to be 100% for him to play. 4 weeks sounds about right.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 02, 2015, 12:57:52 PM
Colin Kaepernick and Matthew Stafford are currently making absurd money playing for bottom-feeder franchises that may be looking for a fresh start. Jay Cutler is probably on his way out of Chicago as well.
Drew Brees might become a free agent if the Saints fail to make the playoffs.
Robert Griffin III will almost certainly be playing somewhere other than Washington next year.
If Ryan Fitzpatrick is out for more than 4 weeks, this season could very well become lost. That means we'll have a shot at a high draft pick which could be used on an elite tackle prospect or a quarterback.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 01:04:11 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on November 02, 2015, 01:06:12 PM
I just hope we hit on our 1st rounder again no matter the position.
We've been saying this for what feels like forever now, but it has to be an offensive player this time.
Post by: NDMick on November 02, 2015, 01:07:28 PM
We've been saying this for what feels like forever now, but it has to be an offensive player this time.
6 years. In 09 they addressed the offense with Sanchez, Greene, and Slauson.
#Rex'sguys
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 01:08:35 PM
We've been saying this for what feels like forever now, but it has to be an offensive player this time.It would be nice. If we could hit on an elite OLB in the first, I wouldn't complain. Other than that, we need offensive help. OL and QB.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 02, 2015, 01:10:01 PM
It would be nice. If we could hit on an elite OLB in the first, I wouldn't complain. Other than that, we need offensive help. OL and QB.
Not even an OLB. Just someone elite in the linebacking corps would be pretty cool.
Jaylon Smith from Notre Dame would be a complete badass in this defense.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 02, 2015, 01:36:32 PM
Or they can just take a piece of your hamstring and leave the corpses alone...
That's fine. My only real point was that putting a tendon there that wasn't there Saturday makes for a potentially long recovery time (based on the idea of comparing it to other ligament replacement surgeries).
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 01:43:41 PM
That's fine. My only real point was that putting a tendon there that wasn't there Saturday makes for a potentially long recovery time (based on the idea of comparing it to other ligament replacement surgeries).Anybody remember this from 2009?
Quote
Bengals’ QB Carson Palmer revealed after Saturday’s playoff loss to the Jets that he is scheduled to undergo surgery on his left (non-throwing) thumb sometime this week. Palmer apparently tore the ligaments in his thumb in October and he has had it taped and worn a protective glove on the injured hand since then. He said that the injury did not affect his ability to throw but he admitted that it gave him trouble when he handed the ball to running backs. The surgery will keep him out for several months but the team expects him to be ready for team OTA’s.
It may not be exactly the same injury ligament--wise but my point is that it isn't the same as an injury to a throwing arm or a leg regarding return to the field.
EDIT: I do wonder if he could have come back sooner than the off season recovery timeline if he decided to have surgery right after the injury. That might be why he decided not to have it and just play through it. Obviously it depends on which ligament(s) is torn.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 02, 2015, 01:44:52 PM
Anybody remember this from 2009?
It may not be exactly the same injury ligament--wise but my point is that it isn't the same as an injury to a throwing arm or a leg regarding return to the field.
Good find
Post by: nyjunc on November 02, 2015, 01:48:28 PM
Anybody remember this from 2009?
It may not be exactly the same injury ligament--wise but my point is that it isn't the same as an injury to a throwing arm or a leg regarding playing.
I don't, thanks for posting. I do remember Cincy not being as good in the 2nd half and I would assume that may have played a role.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 01:49:26 PM
I don't, thanks for posting. I do remember Cincy not being as good in the 2nd half and I would assume that may have played a role.I remember him handing off right handed because he couldn't do it with his left. It looked really weird.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 01:53:40 PM
Fitz did come back in and complete a pass, so it can be done.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 02, 2015, 01:54:44 PM
Would you rather have Fitz that has difficulty handing off/taking snaps but can throw normally or healthy Geno? Legit question.
Fitzpatrick gives us the best chance to win.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 01:55:42 PM
Fitzpatrick gives us the best chance to win.Are you Rex?
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 01:58:02 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on November 02, 2015, 01:59:00 PM
If he's up for it, I say give Fitz some Advil and duct tape and send his bearded derriere back out there. From the Jets perspective, he isn't some rookie we are worried about ruining long-term. Now if his thumb is dangling by the skin or something, that's different.
Give him a cortisone shot and go win some football games.
Post by: nyjunc on November 02, 2015, 02:04:00 PM
Would you rather have Fitz that has difficulty handing off/taking snaps but can throw normally or healthy Geno? Legit question.
Fitz did come back in and complete a pass, so it can be done.
Fitz brings more than play to the position, he brings actual leadership and a calm demeanor. as far as play there's not much difference, if any, btw the 2.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 02:10:00 PM
(http://media.jrn.com/images/660*526/b99139122z.1_20131111002824_000_g813cmu8.1-0.jpg)
Post by: nyjunc on November 02, 2015, 02:17:50 PM
I still say with or without surgery, he's back on the field in 4 weeks or less. Tape or a splint can stabilize it well. I think they should give him the club bandage for comedy value.
(http://media.jrn.com/images/660*526/b99139122z.1_20131111002824_000_g813cmu8.1-0.jpg)
I think one of those old fashioned plaster casts and geno should sign it.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 02, 2015, 02:30:41 PM
Would you rather have Fitz that has difficulty handing off/taking snaps but can throw normally or healthy Geno? Legit question.
Fitz did come back in and complete a pass, so it can be done.
Fitzpatrick gives us the best chance to win.
This.
Nice find Bo re: Palmer. Again, I don't ever remember hearing of an injury like this before, but obviously something like it has.
I'll take an injured Fitzpatrick over a healthy Geno any day. As long as the injury doesn't hinder his ability to take the snaps without fumbling, I'd like to see him in the game.
Post by: nyjunc on November 02, 2015, 02:35:23 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 02:39:23 PM
Quote
Bowles: Fitzpatrick has ligament damage in his left thumb. Day-to-day. Geno: big bruise on shoulder, day-to-day as well.
Wow, that actually sounds optimistic. Didn't hear any mention of surgery.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 02, 2015, 02:40:53 PM
Wow, that actually sounds optimistic. Didn't hear any mention of surgery.
Manish Mehta @MMehtaNYDN 37s38 seconds ago
Bowles says Fitzpatrick could put off surgery until after season. Depends on his pain tolerance.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 02:41:02 PM
Hopefully he can play through it.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 02, 2015, 02:41:22 PM
Manish Mehta @MMehtaNYDN 37s38 seconds ago
Bowles says Fitzpatrick could put off surgery until after season. Depends on his pain tolerance.
Time to man the freak up and play ball.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 02:43:16 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 02, 2015, 02:58:17 PM
Post by: ukilledkenny on November 02, 2015, 04:48:30 PM
Post by: Badger on November 02, 2015, 04:59:31 PM
Manish Mehta @MMehtaNYDN 37s38 seconds ago
Bowles says Fitzpatrick could put off surgery until after season. Depends on his pain tolerance.
Godking
Post by: bojanglesman on November 02, 2015, 05:25:36 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2015, 10:53:16 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 03, 2015, 11:37:30 AM
Post by: nyjunc on November 03, 2015, 12:05:28 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 03, 2015, 12:08:51 PM
I decided to take a look into thumb tendons to see what Fitz is facing. There are 3 that control the thumb, all starting connected to muscle in the forearm, passing through the wrist, then connecting to the thumb's bones. If he plays through this he's a total badass.(https://stoysnetcdn.com/lern/lernler9048/lernler9048_3.jpg)
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 03, 2015, 12:17:13 PM
(https://stoysnetcdn.com/lern/lernler9048/lernler9048_3.jpg)
LOL
Can you hook Fitz up with a paw to get him through the rest of the season? If he drops a snap he can just bury the ball.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2015, 12:25:31 PM
if geno is healthy he's playing(assuming Fitz cannot go).
Here's to hoping Geno's not healthy enough to play.
Post by: Tommy on November 03, 2015, 12:27:55 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on November 03, 2015, 12:28:59 PM
I really don't want to see Petty out there.
What if he goes out there and plays his derriere off?
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2015, 12:30:31 PM
As much as I've had it with Geno, I really don't want to see Petty out there.
I wouldn't want to see him at all this year if Fitz were healthy enough to play. But if Fitzpatrick can't play, I'd much rather see what we have in Petty than see more of what we know we have in Geno.
Post by: Tommy on November 03, 2015, 12:31:43 PM
What if he goes out there and plays his derriere off?
Well the reason I don't want him out there is that it's highly unlikely that he plays his derriere off and does well.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 03, 2015, 12:32:30 PM
Well the reason I don't want him out there is that it's highly unlikely that he plays his derriere off and does well.
If we're going to have shitty QB play, I'd much rather see what the rookie can do.
Post by: Tommy on November 03, 2015, 12:41:54 PM
If we're going to have shitty QB play, I'd much rather see what the rookie can do.
That's a fair point.
Post by: nyjunc on November 03, 2015, 12:46:16 PM
Here's to hoping Geno's not healthy enough to play.
geno is going to play well, if he can't play well w/ this O then he is done. we can run it, we have top notch weapons and a good OC. The key for us is on D, if they play like they did last week we won't win, if they play like they did when we were winning we'll win no matter who the QB is.
Post by: MBGreen on November 03, 2015, 12:48:07 PM
geno is going to play well, if he can't play well w/ this O then he is done. we can run it, we have top notch weapons and a good OC. The key for us is on D, if they play like they did last week we won't win, if they play like they did when we were winning we'll win no matter who the QB is.
he's already done.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 03, 2015, 12:50:19 PM
geno is going to play well, if he can't play well w/ this O then he is done. we can run it, we have top notch weapons and a good OC. The key for us is on D, if they play like they did last week we won't win, if they play like they did when we were winning we'll win no matter who the QB is.
I'm willing to go with this for at least a game. We're 4-3, hopefully the D performance in Oakland was an aberration, we can stuff the Jags and Geno can play well enough to win. I don't think he's ever going to be our guy, but he's here now and has enough going for him to hopefuly keep us afloat until we can hopefully get Fitzpatrick back.
If we were 1-6 like last year I'd be all in with Petty but that's not the situation right now. If Geno shits the bed I'd not hesitate to go with Petty now, but Geno if healthy has to get the first crack at 4-3.
Post by: nyjunc on November 03, 2015, 12:52:30 PM
he's already done.
maybe he is? but he deserves a shot w/ this talent around him.
QB wasn't why we were 4-1 and it wasn't why we lost the last 2 weeks.
Post by: MBGreen on November 03, 2015, 12:53:49 PM
maybe he is? but he deserves a shot w/ this talent around him.
QB wasn't why we were 4-1 and it wasn't why we lost the last 2 weeks.
Did you not see the retarded decision-making from that one-trick pony on Sunday?
Post by: Miamipuck on November 03, 2015, 12:55:36 PM
Did you not see the retarded decision-making from that one-trick pony on Sunday?
How can you afford cable with the conversion rate the way it is?
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 03, 2015, 12:56:10 PM
geno is going to play well, if he can't play well w/ this O then he is done. we can run it, we have top notch weapons and a good OC. The key for us is on D, if they play like they did last week we won't win, if they play like they did when we were winning we'll win no matter who the QB is.
The ONLY reason why this might hold true is because we are playing Jacksonville
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2015, 01:13:41 PM
geno is going to play well, if he can't play well w/ this O then he is done. we can run it, we have top notch weapons and a good OC. The key for us is on D, if they play like they did last week we won't win, if they play like they did when we were winning we'll win no matter who the QB is.
I disagree.
Firstly, you can't say he will play well any more than I can say he won't. More than that though, it always matters who the QB is. I don't care how well the defense plays, you still need a QB who doesn't make poor decisions--and that's a trademark character trait of Geno's.
Thanks. But no thanks.
maybe he is? but he deserves a shot w/ this talent around him.
QB wasn't why we were 4-1 and it wasn't why we lost the last 2 weeks.
Fitz most certainly helped us get to 4-1, and I firmly believe this team gave up the moment Fitz went down and Geno came in.
He doesn't "deserve" a shot with this talent. He's been a self-absorbed jerkoff for two years who has never done anything to warrant such an attitude. He's no leader, and he makes awful decisions on the field. I want nothing to do with Geno Smith anymore.
Post by: nyjunc on November 03, 2015, 01:22:52 PM
I disagree.
Firstly, you can't say he will play well any more than I can say he won't. More than that though, it always matters who the QB is. I don't care how well the defense plays, you still need a QB who doesn't make poor decisions--and that's a trademark character trait of Geno's.
Thanks. But no thanks.
Fitz most certainly helped us get to 4-1, and I firmly believe this team gave up the moment Fitz went down and Geno came in.
He doesn't "deserve" a shot with this talent. He's been a self-absorbed jerkoff for two years who has never done anything to warrant such an attitude. He's no leader, and he makes awful decisions on the field. I want nothing to do with Geno Smith anymore.
Fitz helped but was way down the list, the only win he played well in was the Washington game and our D dominated the 2nd half. if the D plays the way they are capable w/ the weapons in this O around the QB Geno will be fine.
Post by: nyjunc on November 03, 2015, 01:23:39 PM
Did you not see the retarded decision-making from that one-trick pony on Sunday?
late in a game we really had no shot in he took 2 bad sacks, I get it but he did help us somewhat get back into that game.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2015, 01:26:33 PM
Fitz helped but was way down the list, the only win he played well in was the Washington game and our D dominated the 2nd half. if the D plays the way they are capable w/ the weapons in this O around the QB Geno will be fine.
I just don't believe that.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 03, 2015, 01:27:12 PM
He doesn't "deserve" a shot with this talent. He's been a self-absorbed jerkoff for two years who has never done anything to warrant such an attitude. He's no leader, and he makes awful decisions on the field. I want nothing to do with Geno Smith anymore.
Me neither, but it's not about he deserves a chance as much as he's our best chance to win if Fitzpatrick can't go. If he slips up I'd pull him but at 4-3 I have to start him over Petty if those are the choices.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 03, 2015, 01:27:18 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2015, 01:32:38 PM
Geno was not so bad in my opinion but it's telling that the team was completely deflated after Fitz got injured. It felt like the last years of the Rex regime and I'm pretty sure the fact of having No. 7 on the field had a lot to do with that. He can't be the starter of this team.
We're definitely on the same page here.
Post by: nyjunc on November 03, 2015, 01:36:19 PM
Geno was not so bad in my opinion but it's telling that the team was completely deflated after Fitz got injured. It felt like the last years of the Rex regime and I'm pretty sure the fact of having No. 7 on the field had a lot to do with that. He can't be the starter of this team.
the team wasn't deflated, the D was awful like they have been all but 2 halves the last 3 weeks.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 03, 2015, 01:36:48 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 03, 2015, 01:43:03 PM
the team wasn't deflated, the D was awful like they have been all but 2 halves the last 3 weeks.
Pretty sure that was inferred by numerous sources, well if not deflated at least not entirely enthused with #7 under center, call it what you will. Geno had to take a stupid hit like he did on the sideline to get the teams confidence back, I honestly think that was for the team because it was freaking stupid. Overall, I think you can kind of tell the team doesn't really like him much.
Post by: nyjunc on November 03, 2015, 01:54:05 PM
does the team like him? I don't know, from the outside looking in it looks like they love Fitz and are lukewarm at best w/ geno. that is a problem but what choice do we have?
Post by: Miamipuck on November 03, 2015, 01:58:42 PM
Post by: ukilledkenny on November 03, 2015, 02:02:59 PM
Jets fans have PTSD from the last 2 stints of throwing rookie QBs out there in their first year.
Everyone on this site was saying he needed to sit at least a year and maybe two not that long ago. The rational side of anyone with a pulse on this site knows throwing Petty in isn't going to be the right move in his development.
Post by: nyjunc on November 03, 2015, 02:05:25 PM
It happens, when popular players go down, teams get deflated, down, especially when the alternative to that player is so distasteful. It's human nature. The fact it happened won't bother me if they come back and act like professionals next game.I am not buying that, Fitz didn't die. he wasn't carted off w/o being able to move. he was right there on the sideline. the team was unprepared and played awful football, was going to happen no matter who was in there.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 03, 2015, 02:07:59 PM
I am not buying that, Fitz didn't die. he wasn't carted off w/o being able to move. he was right there on the sideline. the team was unprepared and played awful football, was going to happen no matter who was in there.
Maybe/maybe not. I don't particularly like how they played and I think there's no excuse for it but fact is they were excrement. There's probably more than 1 reason for the lackluster in all respects performance.
BTW I am not excusing that waste of a game/effort by any stretch, just having a conversation.
Post by: nyjunc on November 03, 2015, 02:22:05 PM
Maybe/maybe not. I don't particularly like how they played and I think there's no excuse for it but fact is they were excrement. There's probably more than 1 reason for the lackluster in all respects performance.
BTW I am not excusing that waste of a game/effort by any stretch, just having a conversation.
ok, no problem w/ that. it was an embarrassing effort by the D, a continuation of the 4th qtr against NE. I can't pin that on emotions b/c Fitz got banged up.
Post by: ScotlandJet on November 03, 2015, 02:33:58 PM
Losing Fitz was most certainly a contributory factor but we weren't winning that game a against a hungry Raider side with a really comfortable young QB.
As for Geno, I would love to give the guy the benefit of doubt but he has that cloak of bungling inadequacy shroud over him which Sanchez carried around after that Butt fumble. There is no place for him in New York now, this will not end well.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 03, 2015, 03:09:36 PM
Everyone on this site was saying he needed to sit at least a year and maybe two not that long ago. The rational side of anyone with a pulse on this site knows throwing Petty in isn't going to be the right move in his development.
I agree. I was just saying that as Jets fans we are all so scorned from the last 2 QB situations that we probably wouldn't want any QB to play any their first year.
Post by: ukilledkenny on November 03, 2015, 03:26:46 PM
I agree. I was just saying that as Jets fans we are all so scorned from the last 2 QB situations that we probably wouldn't want any QB to play any their first year.
If we pick someone in the first round this coming draft I would be cool with them starting. Sanchez wasn't ruined by starting as a rookie.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 03, 2015, 03:39:10 PM
Sanchez wasn't ruined by starting as a rookie.
No, a lot of young guys start as rookies now. Putting Petty in now is different than starting him from Week 1 as a rookie and putting the whole season in his hands. He's third on the depth chart and possibly pressed into playing, a lot less pressure there. If he does get in, however it goes, he'll have some experience to draw from and film to look at during the long off season. I'm still hoping we don't need him but it's not going to ruin his career of we do.
Post by: Pope on November 03, 2015, 03:44:48 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 03, 2015, 03:57:52 PM
I see nothing wrong with putting Petty out there for a week or two against some shitty teams. It's not like it's going to ruin him, I'd think it would be a good test for him.
Exactly.
As for the deflation thing, I know people around here hate to hear about the body language police but there was a specific instance I noticed during the game Sunday. It was after a bad play on offense (incompletion?) and they flashed to our offensive line. Carpenter (I think it was him) was shaking his head and looked clearly disgusted.
I said to my son at the time "That is how this team feels when Geno is in." That was after the team was playing noticeably more undisciplined than previous games.
Wilkerson reiterated on the radio yesterday that there were guys loafing on defense on Sunday. Both he and Harris (both of whom I thought played the best on defense Sunday) were vocal that the team didn't play with enough heart. I partially blame coaching for that, but I also partially blame the fact that a QB whose teammates dislike him wound up in the game.
Post by: nyjunc on November 03, 2015, 04:43:20 PM
Exactly.
As for the deflation thing, I know people around here hate to hear about the body language police but there was a specific instance I noticed during the game Sunday. It was after a bad play on offense (incompletion?) and they flashed to our offensive line. Carpenter (I think it was him) was shaking his head and looked clearly disgusted.
I said to my son at the time "That is how this team feels when Geno is in." That was after the team was playing noticeably more undisciplined than previous games.
Wilkerson reiterated on the radio yesterday that there were guys loafing on defense on Sunday. Both he and Harris (both of whom I thought played the best on defense Sunday) were vocal that the team didn't play with enough heart. I partially blame coaching for that, but I also partially blame the fact that a QB whose teammates dislike him wound up in the game.
I am sure no one was ever disgusted w/ Fitz's INTs or his underthrows- just geno.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 03, 2015, 08:51:03 PM
The defense quit on Sunday. That's not on Geno. Is it possible that the team has no faith in Geno and mailed it in when he came in? I guess, but if that's the case, that's as much of an indictment on the team and the coaching staff as it is on Geno.
Geno wasn't terrible, and the majority of the stats came after being down a lot, but the Jets were also down a lot early. Jets running backs had 28 yards on 18 carries. He was also under far more pressure than Fitz ever was. Part of that is Geno's lack of pocket presence, but a big part of that was also missing Mangold.
Geno: 27-42, 265, 2 TD, 1 Int last week.
Fitz: 21-35, 245, 2 TD. 1 Int this season (1st 6 games on average)
Those are their season averages (Fitz is really 1.8 TD and 1.2 Int, but I rounded them both in his favor). And Geno did it without starter reps and without his top offensive lineman (and no running game). Plus, the receiving corps was banged up to the point that Kenbrell Thompkins played 52 snaps.
I'm not arguing Geno is good. I'm just arguing he's competent enough where we can win with him. He still drives me crazy with some of the things he does, and I trust Fitzpatrick more than I trust Geno, but Geno should be able to be decent enough to win.
Post by: Pope on November 03, 2015, 08:58:43 PM
I agree with everything nyjunc has said for the last few pages.These are all good points and people will tell you to go freak yourself I'm sure. Geno's problem though is that his freak ups seem monumental in comparison. His interception wasn't terrible as it was 40 yards down field and Oakland netted 0 points off the pick.
The defense quit on Sunday. That's not on Geno. Is it possible that the team has no faith in Geno and mailed it in when he came in? I guess, but if that's the case, that's as much of an indictment on the team and the coaching staff as it is on Geno.
Geno wasn't terrible, and the majority of the stats came after being down a lot, but the Jets were also down a lot early. Jets running backs had 28 yards on 18 carries. He was also under far more pressure than Fitz ever was. Part of that is Geno's lack of pocket presence, but a big part of that was also missing Mangold.
Geno: 27-42, 265, 2 TD, 1 Int last week.
Fitz: 21-35, 245, 2 TD. 1 Int this season (1st 6 games on average)
Those are their season averages (Fitz is really 1.8 TD and 1.2 Int, but I rounded them both in his favor). And Geno did it without starter reps and without his top offensive lineman (and no running game). Plus, the receiving corps was banged up to the point that Kenbrell Thompkins played 52 snaps.
I'm not arguing Geno is good. I'm just arguing he's competent enough where we can win with him. He still drives me crazy with some of the things he does, and I trust Fitzpatrick more than I trust Geno, but Geno should be able to be decent enough to win.
I think the fanbase has lost all patience in him because of the way he ended the game. It's the same colossal stupidity that he's shown in the past and it seems to come at the absolute worst moments of the game. He had a few nice drives in the middle of the game but crumbled and made bad decisions with the football once we crawled back. I think the Raiders D let up a bit too.
Although the numbers are similar most fans will feel more comfortable with Fitz behind center late in the 4th than with Geno. I feel anxious every time Geno drops back.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 03, 2015, 09:00:39 PM
Post by: Tommy on November 03, 2015, 09:25:28 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 03, 2015, 11:15:28 PM
Post by: Badger on November 04, 2015, 07:37:50 AM
I don't buy the defense mailing it in. That's bullshit. It's probably more on the coaching staff than anything. They didn't gameplan for the Raiders as well as they had for other teams. Could be a combination of the two. But I find it really unlikely that they'd excrement the bed just because Fitz got hurt. That doesn't make much sense at all.
This coaching staff is 0-2 in games after the game after a bye.
Post by: nyjunc on November 04, 2015, 08:04:42 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 04, 2015, 10:24:03 AM
This coaching staff is 0-2 in games after the game after a bye.
That's it, clean house. #FireEveryone
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 04, 2015, 10:36:49 AM
These are all good points and people will tell you to go freak yourself I'm sure. Geno's problem though is that his freak ups seem monumental in comparison. His interception wasn't terrible as it was 40 yards down field and Oakland netted 0 points off the pick.
I think the fanbase has lost all patience in him because of the way he ended the game. It's the same colossal stupidity that he's shown in the past and it seems to come at the absolute worst moments of the game. He had a few nice drives in the middle of the game but crumbled and made bad decisions with the football once we crawled back. I think the Raiders D let up a bit too.
Although the numbers are similar most fans will feel more comfortable with Fitz behind center late in the 4th than with Geno. I feel anxious every time Geno drops back.
This post is pretty spot on. What Geno did Sunday looked "fine" when factored in with everything else. The question is: are we okay with a "fine" performance in a terrible game? I'm not. Not when we've seen the awful play he's capable of.
While their numbers aren't so different, Fitzpatrick is clearly a better QB personality-wise, and decision-making-wise than Geno. If I had the choice of Drew Brees, I wouldn't start either Fitz or Geno. But given the choice between the two, Fitz gets it every time.
You brought up a good point regarding the Raiders D backing off. Geno had success Sunday in so-called "garbage time." The Jets were in an early hole and remained there all game. The Jets aren't the only team in football who go "prevent" when rolling.
FTR, those that are attacking the idea that the team was deflated by Geno, two points:
1) I flat out said I blame coaching for it. This was two weeks in a row I was less than impressed with Bowles.
2) It's funny that people seem to think players in any sport are somehow not human. When Geno came in, how many fans' first thought was: "Well, we just lost"? Is it hard to believe that a player on the field, who has suffered through Geno's performances more directly than us, could be a bit deflated?
Post by: Miamipuck on November 04, 2015, 10:59:17 AM
These are all good points and people will tell you to go freak yourself I'm sure. Geno's problem though is that his freak ups seem monumental in comparison. His interception wasn't terrible as it was 40 yards down field and Oakland netted 0 points off the pick.
I think the fanbase has lost all patience in him because of the way he ended the game. It's the same colossal stupidity that he's shown in the past and it seems to come at the absolute worst moments of the game. He had a few nice drives in the middle of the game but crumbled and made bad decisions with the football once we crawled back. I think the Raiders D let up a bit too.
Although the numbers are similar most fans will feel more comfortable with Fitz behind center late in the 4th than with Geno. I feel anxious every time Geno drops back.
(http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j151/charliedontsurf_photos/clayton-bigsby-chappelle_zpsdc14f1ae.jpg)
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 04, 2015, 12:55:44 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 04, 2015, 01:03:22 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 04, 2015, 01:20:42 PM
Quote from: @KMart_LI
I find it fascinating that Ryan Fitzpatrick is a beacon of hope for #Jets fans... But given how highly teammates speak of Fitz, I get it
Who's at QB has no bearing on how players feel.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 04, 2015, 01:22:04 PM
Who's at QB has no bearing on how players feel.
what
Post by: bojanglesman on November 04, 2015, 01:25:50 PM
Who's at QB has no bearing on how players feel.Put in Jake Heaps then.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 04, 2015, 01:30:17 PM
what
It was in reference to the idea that players couldn't possibly be deflated by Geno taking over for Fitz. When teammates talk about Geno they're civil and "say all the right things." When they talk about Fitzpatrick, they clearly like him and rally under him.
Put in Jake Heaps then.
I guess the point wasn't clear?
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 04, 2015, 01:34:34 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 04, 2015, 01:43:03 PM
Hopefully Bryce petty starts Sunday. If the players like him more than Fitzpatrick.... Super Bowl!!
Because that's an equivalent argument to: when Geno Smith took over for an injured Ryan Fitzpatrick the team was deflated.
Post by: nyjunc on November 04, 2015, 01:43:57 PM
Because that's an equivalent argument to: when Geno Smith took over for an injured Ryan Fitzpatrick the team was deflated.that is just such nonsense. I hope we aren't that soft.
Post by: Tommy on November 04, 2015, 01:48:46 PM
Post by: nyjunc on November 04, 2015, 01:54:16 PM
The defense looked bad. I highly doubt they would allow themselves to look bad just because they don't feel like putting up a big effort under the leadership of a player they don't like. They're pros, so they're not going to play all listless just because.
this team under Bowles is very even, they aren't an up and down group. I have a hard time believing in a 0-0 game the team would get deflated and give up especially after geno came in and finished off that drive w/ points including a big 3rd down throw to keep the drive alive.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 04, 2015, 01:56:27 PM
Post by: NDMick on November 04, 2015, 02:24:45 PM
Post by: nyjunc on November 04, 2015, 02:24:55 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 04, 2015, 02:28:53 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 04, 2015, 02:34:11 PM
Fitz will start on sunday
(http://i.imgur.com/gSgIz1V.png)
Post by: Tommy on November 04, 2015, 02:54:46 PM
"Geno is the starter, we like what we've seen."
CS after one game of watching Geno in a real game, and their starting QB having a fucked up thumb:
"Fitz will start. We've seen enough of Geno."
Post by: nyjunc on November 04, 2015, 03:06:46 PM
CS during the preseason:
"Geno is the starter, we like what we've seen."
CS after one game of watching Geno in a real game, and their starting QB having a fucked up thumb:
"Fitz will start. We've seen enough of Geno."
Fitz is the starter, if healthy he's playing. this was not about geno(who is also banged up).
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 04, 2015, 03:15:20 PM
Post by: Badger on November 04, 2015, 03:33:08 PM
Fitz will start on sunday
Balls of steel.
Post by: ukilledkenny on November 04, 2015, 06:52:07 PM
Post by: Badger on November 04, 2015, 07:37:21 PM
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/11/04/a4034d9b7ca50b29afeaebfcfa0ff03a.jpg)
Post by: Coach K on November 05, 2015, 06:25:05 AM
First comment
"That's great! Any word if the defense will play?"
Lol
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 05, 2015, 07:24:17 AM
Quote
3. The Fitzpatrick news created a palpable sense of relief in the locker room. It's apparent from listening to players that Fitzpatrick has won their trust and they believe he gives them the best chance of winning. Some people might interpret that as an anti-Geno sentiment; I think it's more pro-Fitzpatrick. The Jets (4-3) have dropped two in a row and can't afford a loss on Sunday to the lowly Jaguars. The players know this, and they're grateful Fitzpatrick will be leading them.
Full article here: http://espn.go.com/blog/newyork-jets/post/_/id/55754/gap-between-ryan-fitzpatrick-and-geno-smith-wider-than-ever
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 05, 2015, 10:30:30 AM
The article confirming he will play on NFL.com
First comment
"That's great! Any word if the defense will play?"
Lol
LOL
It's Cimini but...
Full article here: http://espn.go.com/blog/newyork-jets/post/_/id/55754/gap-between-ryan-fitzpatrick-and-geno-smith-wider-than-ever
I think Geno would have to prove himself where Fitzpatrick already has shown he can win with this team and this offense. So it makes perfect sense that the players are relieved they can keep going with what has worked for the most part this season.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 05, 2015, 11:36:41 AM
FITZPATRICK 2.0
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/11/04/a4034d9b7ca50b29afeaebfcfa0ff03a.jpg)
His hand looks like Luke Skywalkers after Vader cut it off
Post by: Badger on November 05, 2015, 11:50:25 AM
His hand looks like Luke Skywalkers after Vader cut it off
I thought exactly the same thing.
Post by: insanity on November 05, 2015, 11:56:22 AM
His hand looks like Luke Skywalkers after Vader cut it off
Agents of shield Coulson hand!
Post by: Johnny English on November 05, 2015, 12:01:56 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 05, 2015, 12:24:58 PM
LOLEverything you've read from the players is how much they love Fitzpatrick. He seems like a great guy, he knows the offense better than anyone, and he's shown toughness on several occasions, including this week. As soon as Geno went down, Fitzpatrick became the guy, and he deserves to remain the guy if he's healthy enough to play well and not get re-injured.
I think Geno would have to prove himself where Fitzpatrick already has shown he can win with this team and this offense. So it makes perfect sense that the players are relieved they can keep going with what has worked for the most part this season.
Post by: Badger on November 05, 2015, 03:57:38 PM
Agents of shield Coulson hand!
But less contrived.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 08, 2015, 04:18:08 PM
Post by: Coach K on November 08, 2015, 04:26:20 PM
13 TDs and 7 INTs
I'm assuming we'd have to go back to Chad to sniff that TD:INT ratio
Or Favre before his meltdown hiding the bad elbow
Post by: bojanglesman on November 08, 2015, 04:27:04 PM
Post by: Tommy on November 08, 2015, 04:27:46 PM
I'm assuming we'd have to go back to Chad to sniff that TD:INT ratio
Or Favre before his meltdown hiding the bad elbow
Not to take anything away from Fitz, but this is probably our best #1 and #2 WR corps ever.
Post by: Coach K on November 08, 2015, 04:29:59 PM
Not to take anything away from Fitz, but this is probably our best #1 and #2 WR corps ever.
Wouldn't argue that . Just nice to not be kneecapped by turnovers for once
Post by: Heismanberg on November 08, 2015, 04:30:04 PM
Not to take anything away from Fitz, but this is probably our best #1 and #2 WR corps ever.
They aren't making those decisions for him though. Fitzpatrick has been incredible in the redzone so far this season.
But his ability to avoid sacks and keep plays alive from the pocket has been his greatest asset to this team.
---
On the touchdown to Brandon Marshall, he made a great adjustment and catch...but that was also a perfectly thrown, indefensible ball.
Post by: Tommy on November 08, 2015, 04:32:01 PM
They aren't making those decisions for him though. Fitzpatrick has been incredible in the redzone so far this season.
But his ability to avoid sacks and keep plays alive from the pocket has been his greatest asset to this team.
---
On the touchdown to Brandon Marshall, he made a great adjustment and catch...but that was also a perfectly thrown, indefensible ball.
Yeah, but he's a below-average quarterback.
/junc
Post by: Coach K on November 08, 2015, 04:34:01 PM
They aren't making those decisions for him though. Fitzpatrick has been incredible in the redzone so far this season.
But his ability to avoid sacks and keep plays alive from the pocket has been his greatest asset to this team.
---
On the touchdown to Brandon Marshall, he made a great adjustment and catch...but that was also a perfectly thrown, indefensible ball.
His pocket presence has been top notch
Post by: Ornstein on November 08, 2015, 04:54:39 PM
Post by: MBGreen on November 08, 2015, 04:56:00 PM
I'll never understand why the Texans would get rid of Fitz. He's by far better then Mallet and Hoyer and the team loved him.Maybe they didnt like his durability
Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
Post by: Heismanberg on November 08, 2015, 05:01:38 PM
I'll never understand why the Texans would get rid of Fitz. He's by far better then Mallet and Hoyer and the team loved him.
Bill O'Brien thinks that he can turn any quarterback into a solid player. Hoyer and Mallett are his guys.
Shows how much he really knows...
Post by: Badger on November 08, 2015, 07:56:21 PM
Bill O'Brien thinks that he can turn any quarterback into a solid player. Hoyer and Mallett are his guys.
Shows how much he really knows...
I think almost every coach thinks this way about their area of expertise.
Post by: nyjunc on November 09, 2015, 07:46:00 AM
The last game he didn't play well in was the Miami game, since the bye he has been really good.
Post by: nyjunc on November 09, 2015, 07:46:56 AM
I'll never understand why the Texans would get rid of Fitz. He's by far better then Mallet and Hoyer and the team loved him.
The Texans have many more issues than the QB, if Fitz is in Hou they still stink. Fitz is playing well for us but there's a reason he changes teams every year.
Post by: Johnny English on November 09, 2015, 08:01:22 AM
Thompkins(who is playing well in his 2 games)
I may have to revise my opinion of Thompkins if he continues to show up like he did yesterday.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 09, 2015, 09:25:54 AM
Fitz is playing well for us but there's a reason he changes teams every year.
If he didn't break his leg last season, he's probably still their QB. He was having an excellent season in Houston.
Post by: nyjunc on November 09, 2015, 10:00:21 AM
If he didn't break his leg last season, he's probably still their QB. He was having an excellent season in Houston.he was not, he had a great game for them but he was not having an excellent season. he may still be there if he didn't break his leg or he may have been let go again. who knows? I am glad we have him now.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 09, 2015, 10:09:22 AM
he was not, he had a great game for them but he was not having an excellent season.
Why does it matter that he had a great game? That's still a part of that season, is it not?
Fitzpatrick was responsible for 19 TDs in a little over 11 games. The 6 TD game boosts his passing statistics, but like I said, that's still a part of that season.
6-5 as a starter on a team that you claim stinks.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 09, 2015, 10:35:59 AM
They aren't making those decisions for him though. Fitzpatrick has been incredible in the redzone so far this season.
But his ability to avoid sacks and keep plays alive from the pocket has been his greatest asset to this team.
This is the key. We can analyze arm strength and a million other things, what you do with the ball once it's snapped to you is the difference. Not that we could have kicked a FG yesterday, but too often in the past we've had to settle for FGs and that costs you the game, it would have yesterday.
Post by: Johnny English on November 09, 2015, 10:43:55 AM
Ryan Fitzpatrick is the 1st QB in NFL history to start and win against the same opponent (JAX) for 5 different teams. #JAXvsNYJ
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 09, 2015, 11:29:49 AM
Last year we were at 36.17%...
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 09, 2015, 11:45:01 AM
Jets have the #1 Red Zone offense in the league at 75% with Fitz at the helm
Last year we were at 36.17%...
Marshall and a healthy Decker are a big part of that, along with having Fitzpatrick making better decisions with the ball than Geno.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 09, 2015, 12:10:06 PM
If he didn't break his leg last season, he's probably still their QB. He was having an excellent season in Houston.He was benched halfway through last season, so clearly Houston didn't think his season was THAT excellent. He was fine (better than any Jets quarterback in the last 5 years), but excellent is a bit extreme. The Titans game made his season look a lot better.
But as for him this season, his ability to manipulate the pocket, avoid sacks, and convert in the red zone have been his best assets.
Post by: Badger on November 09, 2015, 12:12:02 PM
Why does it matter that he had a great game? That's still a part of that season, is it not?
Fitzpatrick was responsible for 19 TDs in a little over 11 games. The 6 TD game boosts his passing statistics, but like I said, that's still a part of that season.
6-5 as a starter on a team that you claim stinks.
They would have gone 8-3 with Kerry Collins.
Post by: Tommy on November 09, 2015, 12:14:18 PM
He was benched halfway through last season, so clearly Houston didn't think his season was THAT excellent. He was fine (better than any Jets quarterback in the last 5 years), but excellent is a bit extreme. The Titans game made his season look a lot better.
But as for him this season, his ability to manipulate the pocket, avoid sacks, and convert in the red zone have been his best assets.
That's really all you can really ask for in a QB in today's NFL. If you're one of the lucky few, you get that and the ability to carry a team on your shoulders. We should never count on that. I'd be fine with going with Fitz next season while we use our money and draft to plug holes elsewhere.
Post by: Johnny English on November 09, 2015, 12:22:55 PM
Post by: Badger on November 09, 2015, 12:24:08 PM
Every time I open this thread I get that freaking Pilot song stuck in my head for the next twenty minutes.
I wasn't having that problem until I read this.
Post by: Johnny English on November 09, 2015, 12:25:19 PM
I wasn't having that problem until I read this.
If I have to suffer then so do you.
Post by: nyjunc on November 09, 2015, 12:34:05 PM
They would have gone 8-3 with Kerry Collins.
you know how I knew Indy was going to win yesterday? b/c it was a big game for peyton but we do have to hand it peyton, w/ such crap around him to be able to take the team to the same spot Tim tebow took them 2 of the last 3 years is damn impressive! ;D
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 09, 2015, 12:39:11 PM
That's really all you can really ask for in a QB in today's NFL. If you're one of the lucky few, you get that and the ability to carry a team on your shoulders. We should never count on that. I'd be fine with going with Fitz next season while we use our money and draft to plug holes elsewhere.
This is a good point. Being in a division with Brady and a city with Eli all these years you see that and think we have to have that great QB to win and it's not always the case. It would be great to get one, but we've won with Pennington, won with Sanchez and we can win with Fitzpatrick. Until we get Brady and Belichick out of our division we're fighting for the Wild Card anyway, from there it's about managing and winning on the road in the playoffs, which I think a veteran like Fitzpatrick can do.
Post by: nyjunc on November 09, 2015, 12:41:22 PM
This is a good point. Being in a division with Brady and a city with Eli all these years you see that and think we have to have that great QB to win and it's not always the case. It would be great to get one, but we've won with Pennington, won with Sanchez and we can win with Fitzpatrick. Until we get Brady and Belichick out of our division we're fighting for the Wild Card anyway, from there it's about managing and winning on the road in the playoffs, which I think a veteran like Fitzpatrick can do.
TBD if we can win w/ Fitz, if he plays like he has in recent weeks we can but he's never proved over the course of 16 games that he can do that.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 09, 2015, 12:45:02 PM
TBD if we can win w/ Fitz, if he plays like he has in recent weeks we can but he's never proved over the course of 16 games that he can do that.
He's never been here before, and he seems like a guy who is getting better with age. He doesn't have the tremendous physical ability that will leave him in a few years, he's a more cerebral QB who gets better with experience. He just has to stay healthy and we need our line as intact as possible to protect him and allow us to run the ball.
Post by: Tommy on November 09, 2015, 12:54:58 PM
Post by: nyjunc on November 09, 2015, 01:17:15 PM
He's never been here before, and he seems like a guy who is getting better with age. He doesn't have the tremendous physical ability that will leave him in a few years, he's a more cerebral QB who gets better with experience. He just has to stay healthy and we need our line as intact as possible to protect him and allow us to run the ball.
he's never been in position before mainly do to his inconsistent play. we saw that guy earlier in the year, the last 3+ games he's been a guy we can win w/ and, of course, now our D and run game suck. if we can get the D and run game back on track and Fitz keeps playing like he has we'll be dangerous.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 09, 2015, 01:21:49 PM
he's never been in position before mainly do to his inconsistent play. we saw that guy earlier in the year, the last 3+ games he's been a guy we can win w/ and, of course, now our D and run game suck. if we can get the D and run game back on track and Fitz keeps playing like he has we'll be dangerous.
Schedule helps us too. We were talking abut that yesterday, kind of like 2006--veteran QB to cover some flaws, rookie coach, easy schedule, now halfway back to 10-6.
Post by: nyjunc on November 09, 2015, 01:31:09 PM
Schedule helps us too. We were talking abut that yesterday, kind of like 2006--veteran QB to cover some flaws, rookie coach, easy schedule, now halfway back to 10-6.
this week is HUGE, if we can get through it w/ a W we are in great shape.
Post by: Badger on November 09, 2015, 01:34:23 PM
Schedule helps us too. We were talking abut that yesterday, kind of like 2006--veteran QB to cover some flaws, rookie coach, easy schedule, now halfway back to 10-6.
I was actually thinking 2004. We could get swept by NE but still make it to the divisional round in the AFC.
Post by: Pope on November 09, 2015, 02:59:19 PM
We were fortunate against Jacksonville with some late mistakes on their part. Better teams will eat us alive if continue to give up 400 through the air and can't run the ball for more than 1 YPC
Post by: SixFeetDeep on November 10, 2015, 02:15:26 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 10, 2015, 02:23:16 PM
It's already been mentioned, but it is now confirmed that Fitz will be getting surgery on his thumb Friday.
The phuck he is, I am going down to Florham Park right now and putting a stop to it.
Post by: Johnny English on November 10, 2015, 02:55:19 PM
It's already been mentioned, but it is now confirmed that Fitz will be getting surgery on his thumb Friday.
Was there any indication of how long they expect him to be out?
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 10, 2015, 02:57:00 PM
Was there any indication of how long they expect him to be out?
In theory he won't miss even a game, unless the surgery goes wrong.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 10, 2015, 03:08:14 PM
Was there any indication of how long they expect him to be out?
Yeah, they think that he'll be able to play with that same brace on.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 10, 2015, 03:14:55 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 11, 2015, 09:35:44 AM
I mentioned in different thread that he's not throwing to Marshall much early. Marshall is being well-covered early, so Fitz is taking advantage by throwing to other guys like Decker. Then, in crunch time, he's going to his difference maker when it really matters.
The things holding this team back right now are injuries and the defense. If the defense was playing better this team would be rolling. If the defense were healthy, the defense would be playing better.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 11, 2015, 10:13:42 AM
Fitzpatrick has been very good. Anyone who says otherwise is being ridiculous at this point. His decision making is better than we've seen since Chad from the position. Sure, he's got the weapons, but he's still making smart throws.
I mentioned in different thread that he's not throwing to Marshall much early. Marshall is being well-covered early, so Fitz is taking advantage by throwing to other guys like Decker. Then, in crunch time, he's going to his difference maker when it really matters.
The things holding this team back right now are injuries and the defense. If the defense was playing better this team would be rolling. If the defense were healthy, the defense would be playing better.
You get through different parts of the season different ways. Our record and position right now is pretty good. Get this win at home, division game, AFC game, and then 10 days off to get guys healthy and be ready for the next phase of the season.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 11, 2015, 10:34:22 AM
You get through different parts of the season different ways. Our record and position right now is pretty good. Get this win at home, division game, AFC game, and then 10 days off to get guys healthy and be ready for the next phase of the season.
Winning tomorrow night is a huge boost to this season, no question.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 13, 2015, 10:35:58 AM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTs3sBPXAAEeyQX.jpg)
Post by: nyjunc on November 13, 2015, 10:39:53 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 13, 2015, 10:45:07 AM
I really like the way Fitz has played the last month. He played a lot better than his #s showed last night though made some poor decisions down the stretch but he had some critical drops. I see him getting way too much blame this morning.
It's New York that's what happens to QB's.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 13, 2015, 10:45:16 AM
I really like the way Fitz has played the last month. He played a lot better than his #s showed last night though made some poor decisions down the stretch but he had some critical drops. I see him getting way too much blame this morning.
Yep. The first INT was a risky throw, but it was right on target. Marshall usually brings that in. Most of the time, that ball falls harmlessly to the turf at worst. The last throw was just desperation. Bills were playing back and he had to get aggressive. Couldn't dump it over the middle to anyone open with no timeouts left. To me, that last one was equivalent to getting an INT on a hail mary. Fairly blameless.
Post by: ukilledkenny on November 13, 2015, 11:08:58 AM
Post by: nyjunc on November 13, 2015, 11:58:52 AM
Yep. The first INT was a risky throw, but it was right on target. Marshall usually brings that in. Most of the time, that ball falls harmlessly to the turf at worst. The last throw was just desperation. Bills were playing back and he had to get aggressive. Couldn't dump it over the middle to anyone open with no timeouts left. To me, that last one was equivalent to getting an INT on a hail mary. Fairly blameless.
we botched the use of timeouts on that last Bills drive or we would have had another 40 secs, still likely not enough but w/ that time we would have had more options that forcing a sideline route.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 13, 2015, 12:11:15 PM
we botched the use of timeouts on that last Bills drive or we would have had another 40 secs, still likely not enough but w/ that time we would have had more options that forcing a sideline route.
We couldn't stop them from running for first downs until it was too late. That was the root of the problem, however you use the timeouts.
Post by: nyjunc on November 13, 2015, 01:20:09 PM
We couldn't stop them from running for first downs until it was too late. That was the root of the problem, however you use the timeouts.
he used our last TO w/ I think 2:28 to go, the playclock was at 25 so they could have run that play and the clock stops at 2 mins. ifthat happens they run the 2nd down play and we call TO, let's say there is 1:50 to play at that point then they run the 3rd down play and milk the clock and we have about a minute. he used the last TO after they picked up a 1st down then fter 1st down the 2 min warning so after 2nd down instead of being able to stop the clock at 1:50 or so they were able to bleed it down to 1:18 then punted w/ :35.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 13, 2015, 01:52:05 PM
he used our last TO w/ I think 2:28 to go, the playclock was at 25 so they could have run that play and the clock stops at 2 mins. ifthat happens they run the 2nd down play and we call TO, let's say there is 1:50 to play at that point then they run the 3rd down play and milk the clock and we have about a minute. he used the last TO after they picked up a 1st down then fter 1st down the 2 min warning so after 2nd down instead of being able to stop the clock at 1:50 or so they were able to bleed it down to 1:18 then punted w/ :35.That's a whole lot of hindsighted arm chair coaching there. You had the luxury of time to determine what he should have done after the fact. He had to make a quick decision. Easier said than done. Sure there are coaches that would have done what you said, but I'd certainly not judge him for doing things the way he did. It just didn't work out.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 13, 2015, 02:09:32 PM
As much as I like Rex, I don't miss him using them up on challenges and getting to the end of the game needing all three and not having them. For a while last night their offense looked like they needed a timeout on every play just to get the snap off.
Post by: nyjunc on November 13, 2015, 02:23:14 PM
That's a whole lot of hindsighted arm chair coaching there. You had the luxury of time to determine what he should have done after the fact. He had to make a quick decision. Easier said than done. Sure there are coaches that would have done what you said, but I'd certainly not judge him for doing things the way he did. It just didn't work out.
he has to know that or have someone telling him. he has to look at the playclock. he's a rookie HC, he's under fire for the first time w/ all these decisions. These are all learning experiences, I am not bashing him but he made mistakes that really hurt us. that particular one we probably don't have enough time anyway but it's something he needs to be aware of.
Post by: nyjunc on November 13, 2015, 02:23:54 PM
We had all three when we turned the ball over on downs inside the 10 with over 3:00 left. They hadn't converted a first down in over a quarter, so it made sense to use them and try to get a 3 and out. I'm ok with that, it's when you get to that spot and you've burned one or two that irritates me.
As much as I like Rex, I don't miss him using them up on challenges and getting to the end of the game needing all three and not having them. For a while last night their offense looked like they needed a timeout on every play just to get the snap off.
w/ Rex we used to waste them on D all the time, last night taylor blew all 3 TOs.
Post by: Pope on November 13, 2015, 02:54:30 PM
Post by: nyjunc on November 13, 2015, 03:58:20 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 13, 2015, 04:02:47 PM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTs3sBPXAAEeyQX.jpg)
Post by: ScotlandJet on November 13, 2015, 05:44:51 PM
I made a mistake on the TOs thing, Bowles did nothing wrong. the graphics on the broadcast were wrong. I just rewatched it online.
Fitz has played well, he has been one of the team's strengths. Few mistakes here and there but these losses aren't his fault
On the Money with this
Post by: Fenwyr on November 14, 2015, 11:51:20 AM
Posting this again, because I'm still laughing.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTs3sBPXAAEeyQX.jpg)
Marshall freaking with Fitz's beard when we were down big was pretty funny too. Marshall seems to have a great attitude. Very happy to have him on this team.
Post by: Badger on November 14, 2015, 06:32:15 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 14, 2015, 08:33:44 PM
Post by: Tommy on November 14, 2015, 08:34:32 PM
Fitz had thumb surgery this morning and is expected to play @ HOU.
I thought he was supposed to have the surgery yesterday? Wonder why they delayed it a day. That's a full day of recovery missed.
Post by: Badger on November 14, 2015, 08:49:29 PM
I thought he was supposed to have the surgery yesterday? Wonder why they delayed it a day. That's a full day of recovery missed.
You're right, it was yesterday, I was looking at an old post.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 15, 2015, 02:20:57 AM
Are they fusing it? That's common when you tear the ligaments in your thumb. In fact a buddy of mine just got that as the only option to repair his thumb injury the other day.Doubt it. They were discussing the difficulty of the surgery regarding the ligament as time goes on. Fusing isn't really affected by time.
Post by: guinness77 on November 22, 2015, 03:28:45 PM
I'd like to know who the Jets should have brought it during the offseason who was a realistic choice. I'm not delusional to think he's the greatest or our starter moving forward, but...I'd like to know who they should have brought in instead.
Post by: Jumbo on November 22, 2015, 03:30:32 PM
Since this would be the more appropriate thread.
I'd like to know who the Jets should have brought it during the offseason who was a realistic choice. I'm not delusional to think he's the greatest or our starter moving forward, but...I'd like to know who they should have brought in instead.
I don't think anyone is hating on the move... he's been fine and an upgrade over what Geno would have been. But looking forward I don't see a reason to keep starting him past this season if we can find someone better in the draft or free agency
Post by: MBGreen on November 22, 2015, 03:46:20 PM
Since this would be the more appropriate thread.
I'd like to know who the Jets should have brought it during the offseason who was a realistic choice. I'm not delusional to think he's the greatest or our starter moving forward, but...I'd like to know who they should have brought in instead.
I thought it was a great move in the offseason. Bring in a guy who's clearly better than Geno, has a history of success with your new OC, and the move was cost effective. Even after the trade was made, i only viewed Fitz as a 1 or 2 year stopgap.
Post by: Badger on November 22, 2015, 03:49:47 PM
I don't think anyone is hating on the move... he's been fine and an upgrade over what Geno would have been. But looking forward I don't see a reason to keep starting him past this season if we can find someone better in the draft or free agency
I don't think anyone advocated not trying to improve the QB position in favor of keeping Fitz at any point this season.
Post by: ukilledkenny on November 22, 2015, 03:52:39 PM
I actually was pretty lukewarm on him when the team was winning. I think he has played better throughout the season while everything has been crumbling around him.
Post by: Badger on November 22, 2015, 04:00:26 PM
With all the holes we need to fill in the draft combined with likely not being in a position to draft a potential franchise QB I'm still alright with Fitz for next year and maybe even another after that. He hasn't been the reason this team has fallen apart since the 4-1 start.
I actually was pretty lukewarm on him when the team was winning. I think he has played better throughout the season while everything has been crumbling around him.
We definitely have many needs but if a QB is the BPA (or close to it), they should go for it.
I'm not against keeping him around for cheap since he'd be a fine backup.
Post by: ukilledkenny on November 22, 2015, 04:02:29 PM
We definitely have many needs but if a QB is the BPA (or close to it), they should go for it.
I'm not against keeping him around for cheap since he'd be a fine backup.
Obviously, if one is available we should get him. Just don't think we are in a position to go reaching for someone whose talent doesn't really justify the draft spot. This is the first year in awhile that QB hasn't actively hurt the team.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 22, 2015, 04:17:55 PM
Todd Bowles said he is committed to Ryan Fitzpatrick but wouldn't definitively say if Fitzpatrick will start next week.
Post by: Badger on November 22, 2015, 04:22:58 PM
Seth Walder @SethWalderNYDN 49s49 seconds ago
Todd Bowles said he is committed to Ryan Fitzpatrick but wouldn't definitively say if Fitzpatrick will start next week.
So in other words, not committed.
Post by: MBGreen on November 22, 2015, 04:24:03 PM
So in other words, not committed.
If he starts Geno ahead of Fitz, the tank is on.
Post by: ukilledkenny on November 22, 2015, 04:27:54 PM
If he starts Geno ahead of Fitz, the tank is on.
If Bowles tanks it half way through his rookie head coaching season it's time to start talking about who his replacement will be after next season.
Post by: Badger on November 22, 2015, 04:32:44 PM
If he starts Geno ahead of Fitz, the tank is on.
"To go north, you must go south. To reach the west, you must go east. To go forward you must go back, and to touch the light you must pass beneath the shadow."
So basically we have to start Geno to replace Geno.
(I am in no way endorsing the tank)
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 22, 2015, 04:33:37 PM
Fitz: 1st Jets QB with back-to-back games sub-50% completion with 30 attempts since 1988.
Post by: Tommy on November 22, 2015, 04:40:34 PM
As I've said many times, Geno's numbers are essentially Fitzpatrick's numbers. Starting Geno does not mean a tank.
Fitz: 1st Jets QB with back-to-back games sub-50% completion with 30 attempts since 1988.
Key difference in their numbers: turnovers.
Post by: ukilledkenny on November 22, 2015, 04:45:28 PM
As I've said many times, Geno's numbers are essentially Fitzpatrick's numbers. Starting Geno does not mean a tank.
Fitz: 1st Jets QB with back-to-back games sub-50% completion with 30 attempts since 1988.
After watching Fitz closely this season and Geno the last two years it's pretty clear that Fitz ends up a net positive for the team while Geno ends up a net negative. The context does matter.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 22, 2015, 04:52:31 PM
After watching Fitz closely this season and Geno the last two years it's pretty clear that Fitz ends up a net positive for the team while Geno ends up a net negative. The context does matter.I agree, but if we're going to blame the supporting cast every time Fitzpatrick has a bad game, what about Geno? He had NOTHING around him for 2 years, except for Decker a couple games last year when he was actually healthy.
Fitz is a better QB, but not by enough where we shouldn't even consider a benching. And in my opinion, a benching would be more to evaluate what Geno can be going forward moreso than turning the season around.
Post by: Badger on November 22, 2015, 05:28:44 PM
I agree, but if we're going to blame the supporting cast every time Fitzpatrick has a bad game, what about Geno?
Why dwell on our former QB?
Post by: ukilledkenny on November 22, 2015, 08:37:20 PM
I agree, but if we're going to blame the supporting cast every time Fitzpatrick has a bad game, what about Geno? He had NOTHING around him for 2 years, except for Decker a couple games last year when he was actually healthy.
Fitz is a better QB, but not by enough where we shouldn't even consider a benching. And in my opinion, a benching would be more to evaluate what Geno can be going forward moreso than turning the season around.
The offensive line with a not so good Brick and Mangold harldy playing for weeks is what's killing the offense right now along with some bad drops. Fitz definitely makes some bad throws but to me those are very far down the list of offensive problems.
If we are going to bench Fitz to look at what we have it should be for Petty.
Post by: Pope on November 22, 2015, 08:46:36 PM
Fitz has been what you expect of him. Good leader who will hold down the fort but you can't rely on him to win you games. Great QB to have if you're up by a score or two. When he's put in the position to comeback in a two score game he struggles.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 22, 2015, 08:50:02 PM
Enunwa start to figure excrement out.
He is playing the role that should belong to Jace Amaro.
Post by: Coach K on November 23, 2015, 08:10:24 AM
Post by: nyjunc on November 23, 2015, 08:51:00 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on November 23, 2015, 09:14:06 AM
Amaro wouldbe been huge this year. Especially now that our WRS couldn't catch AIDS
Amaro would probably have numerous bonehead drops by now too, but I definitely think he would have helped a lot this season.
Post by: nyjunc on November 23, 2015, 09:17:22 AM
Amaro wouldbe been huge this year. Especially now that our WRS couldn't catch AIDS
Maybe but he the OC didn't seem to take a liking to him early.
Post by: guinness77 on November 23, 2015, 09:34:25 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2015, 09:44:44 AM
Fitz isn't why we have been losing. how does that game change if Marshall catches that deep ball early and/or Smith catches that perfect deep ball late?
Exactly.
Fitzpatrick played well enough to win, and I give him huge props for playing nine days after surgery and those 3rd, 4th down and TD runs. I would stick with him for as long as we can until someone better comes along or if/when Petty turns into a starting QB. He's not spectacular but he's tough, smart and experienced, we can at least be competitive and win games with him. But learn to freaking slide for freak sake.
Post by: ons on November 23, 2015, 09:57:12 AM
That being said, I don't think it's time to bench Fitz yet, he gives us the best chance to win this season and a wild-card run is still completely possible.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 23, 2015, 10:01:12 AM
Looking at the Bengals building their offense around Dalton - you don't need a once in a lifetime type of talent playing QB to win games. Fitz is good enough to win in this league with a great supporting cast, but this year's roster just isn't there. Probably as good of a receivers as we've had in years, but still not deep enough, consistent enough, or explosive enough to consistently win with a quarterback like Fitz.
That being said, I don't think it's time to bench Fitz yet, he gives us the best chance to win this season and a wild-card run is still completely possible.
The Bengals haven't won a playoff game with Dalton as QB yet and that's despite having arguably the most talented roster in the entire NFL..
Post by: ons on November 23, 2015, 10:16:54 AM
The Bengals haven't won a playoff game with Dalton as QB yet and that's despite having arguably the most talented roster in the entire NFL..
I don't want Dalton specifically, but I'd rather have a roster like the Bengals than an elite QB prospect getting destroyed by the lack of talent around him.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2015, 10:31:38 AM
Post by: MBGreen on November 23, 2015, 10:38:03 AM
Our roster as it's constructed is fine, but we're banged up on the O-line and that's killing the run game. Didn't help that we had JJ Watt yesterday with Mangold going out. But our O-line when healthy, WRs and RBs are good enough to win with, we were winning when everyone was healthy and contributing.
Our oline is over the hill. Watching Brick get bullied yesterday was sad.
Post by: Pope on November 23, 2015, 10:42:07 AM
1: QB
2. LT, RG, C
3. OLB and ILB
Will also need help with WR, TE, CB (Cro is gone and Revis will decline in a couple years). I'd like to take a swing at a RB in the early rounds but it's too much of a luxury at the moment considering our more pressing needs
Post by: MBGreen on November 23, 2015, 10:48:56 AM
We need two really good drafts right now. The way I see it we will need desperately:
1: QB
2. LT, RG, C
3. OLB and ILB
Will also need help with WR, TE, CB (Cro is gone and Revis will decline in a couple years). I'd like to take a swing at a RB in the early rounds but it's too much of a luxury at the moment considering our more pressing needs
100% agree
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2015, 10:50:36 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on November 23, 2015, 11:24:33 AM
I agree we need to draft O-line. Brick and Mangold are heading past the 10-year mark, we take for granted how good they've been for so long. We haven't even discussed left tackle or who is starting since the Pennington shoulder recovery days.
I'd like to see us draft one high and sign a big name OL free agent.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 23, 2015, 12:24:48 PM
Fitz isn't why we have been losing. how does that game change if Marshall catches that deep ball early and/or Smith catches that perfect deep ball late?
I'm with junc 100% on this one. If you discount Powell's few successful runs, Fitz was least responsible for yesterday on the entire team.
Post by: Tommy on November 23, 2015, 12:29:57 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 23, 2015, 12:38:56 PM
Also how many games can we say we lost because of Fitz this season? Sanchez was good for at least a couple per season, and never mind Geno the last two seasons.
I don't think we can say Fitz lost a single game. Did he do enough to win at times? No, but that's asking a lot more of him than he's here for.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2015, 12:42:40 PM
I don't think we can say Fitz lost a single game. Did he do enough to win at times? No, but that's asking a lot more of him than he's here for.
Exactly. The last two games have ended with desperation picks where a top notch QB might go down the field and get the score, but I can't put any losses on him.
Speaking of Sanchez, I was one of his last supporters but it looks like he's never going to not be turnover prone.
Post by: nyjunc on November 23, 2015, 12:43:14 PM
Also how many games can we say we lost because of Fitz this season? Sanchez was good for at least a couple per season, and never mind Geno the last two seasons.
we rarely lost a game mainly b/c of sanchez. Fitz tried to lose games early this season but the D and marshall were playing great, now Fitz has been playing better but those around him have collapsed.
Post by: nyjunc on November 23, 2015, 12:44:30 PM
Exactly. The last two games have ended with desperation picks where a top notch QB might go down the field and get the score, but I can't put any losses on him.
Speaking of Sanchez, I was one of his last supporters but it looks like he's never going to not be turnover prone.
he will always turn it over but 2 of his 3 TOs yesterday were in garbage time, he didn't do enough but if he was perfect yesterday they still lose big. Hard to win when allowing an opposing QB to throw 5 TDs and an opposing RB to rush for over 230 yds.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2015, 03:26:40 PM
he will always turn it over but 2 of his 3 TOs yesterday were in garbage time, he didn't do enough but if he was perfect yesterday they still lose big. Hard to win when allowing an opposing QB to throw 5 TDs and an opposing RB to rush for over 230 yds.
Honestly I was following the stat line but saw none of the game, looked like he started ok.
I was so annoyed by night time that I didn't even watch the highlights, and I usually always try to catch Deion win or lose.
Post by: nyjunc on November 23, 2015, 04:08:35 PM
Honestly I was following the stat line but saw none of the game, looked like he started ok.
I was so annoyed by night time that I didn't even watch the highlights, and I usually always try to catch Deion win or lose.
I didn't watch much of it, I flipped over during commercials of our game.
Post by: insanity on November 23, 2015, 05:20:59 PM
we rarely lost a game mainly b/c of sanchez. Fitz tried to lose games early this season but the D and marshall were playing great, now Fitz has been playing better but those around him have collapsed.
You clearly have wiped his 37 fumbles and 4 int games from your memory. Sanchez hands down won us more games than Fitz, but Sanchez also lost us a bunch of games.
Post by: Pope on November 23, 2015, 07:01:23 PM
Either way, rest of season Fitz is our best bet and you ride that train until we are mathematically eliminated. With our running game falling off the face of the earth this past month I can't see our QB having much success
Post by: Cane on November 23, 2015, 09:05:52 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 23, 2015, 09:13:28 PM
Per the Fitz is average discussion, how many starting QBs are better than Fitz right now? I'd say a comfy 24/31, and potentially a few more.
Probably about right. Still an upgrade from last year.
Post by: Cane on November 23, 2015, 09:22:34 PM
Probably about right. Still an upgrade from last year.
And still a position that requires an upgrade for next year through any avenue possible.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 23, 2015, 09:24:15 PM
And still a position that requires an upgrade for next year through any avenue possible.
How and who?
Post by: Pope on November 23, 2015, 09:54:18 PM
Per the Fitz is average discussion, how many starting QBs are better than Fitz right now? I'd say a comfy 24/31, and potentially a few more.
I'm not too interested in ranking which quarterbacks I'd take over him considering his age. A question like that involves other variables.. age, contract, skillset/scheme, etc. If you say all things are equal and you need to rank all quarterbacks based on one year's production I suppose Fitz would fall into the 18-24 range for me personally.
Out of curiosity here are his current numbers:
Passing yards per game: 31st [2199 yds] (I think this is skewed due to the thumb injury game. Stat adjusted he is probably 28th)
Touchdowns: 12th most amongst QBs [16 TD]
Interceptions: 6th most amongst QBs [11 INT]
Passer Rating: 81.5
Completion percentage: 58.4
Don't want to figure out where he ranks in passer rating and percentage because NFL.com includes guys who have thrown 1 or 2 passes in those rankings. Overall, his numbers aren't great. Granted I think his leadership/intangibles boost him up a bit. In the end.. he's probably our best bet regardless.
Post by: Ornstein on November 23, 2015, 10:43:45 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 23, 2015, 11:16:34 PM
Post by: Ornstein on November 24, 2015, 12:21:54 AM
Teams figured out to get beat deep and let our WRs drop perfect passes? Yeah, they have figured out Fitz.
His play started going downhill long before his receivers excrement the bed.
Post by: Coach K on November 24, 2015, 07:51:38 AM
Amaro would probably have numerous bonehead drops by now too, but I definitely think he would have helped a lot this season.
I agree. I wanted him thpugh I think he's got potential but he severely needed this season to work through that .
Just scheme wise alone he'd be a red zone threat , and we wouldn't struggle as much short to intermediate .
He'd at the very least open up passing lanes for Decker and marshall a little and if he actually started playing consistently, no more 8 in the box .
Granted that's best case scenario.
Post by: Coach K on November 24, 2015, 07:59:37 AM
The sad freaking thing is were 2 drafts away from fixing the offense unless we hit big in FA
Ideally we could draft a LT, sign a OG
Probably move on from Brick to free up space to get a WR
Cromartie goes, sign a CB.
It can be done, but we need to actually hit on a 2nd rd pick
Post by: Coach K on November 24, 2015, 08:02:27 AM
Wrong thread my bad tangent, as usual
Post by: nyjunc on November 24, 2015, 08:08:55 AM
You clearly have wiped his 37 fumbles and 4 int games from your memory. Sanchez hands down won us more games than Fitz, but Sanchez also lost us a bunch of games.
he definitely lost a bunch(mostly in 2012 where he had no help) but not nearly as many as people like to pretend.
Post by: nyjunc on November 24, 2015, 08:10:33 AM
His play started going downhill long before his receivers excrement the bed.
His play vastly improved the last month since the beginning of the season. His mistakes early were being covered up by excellent D, Ivory and Brandon marshall. Now Fitz is playing much better but Marshall has been bad, Ivory has struggled and the D atrocious.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 24, 2015, 08:40:50 AM
Post by: Coach K on November 24, 2015, 08:48:12 AM
The main thing I've noticed (and this may be pure luck) is that when Fitz throws an INT, it usually isn't the back breaker, pick-6 variety. It certainly seemed that every time Geno or Sanchez threw an INT, the worst possible outcome occurred afterwards (pick-6, INT deep in our own territory, etc). This is nothing to celebrate over, but it's the little things.....
He plays well enough to keep us in games
His brain just turns to mush when we're down by 10+
But I' can't even blame Houston game on him when I flew out there and watched the drops live. freaking brutal .
We need a true blue chip WR prospect . Marshall looks like he's getting dick slapped in the face by father tine last few weeks , smith looks exactly like someone who played in an urban meyer system ag this point . And Decker is an eternal number 2
Amaro would make it look slightly less dire. But it still remains my perception of the position long term ..
Smith can still get it goin but thst system handcuffed him development wise at OSU.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 24, 2015, 11:03:03 AM
The main thing I've noticed (and this may be pure luck) is that when Fitz throws an INT, it usually isn't the back breaker, pick-6 variety. It certainly seemed that every time Geno or Sanchez threw an INT, the worst possible outcome occurred afterwards (pick-6, INT deep in our own territory, etc). This is nothing to celebrate over, but it's the little things.....
His INT number includes a lot of end of game throws where we're about to lose anyway. He doesn't seem to throw those killer ones when we're about to score or backed up in our own end. And he doesn't fumble nearly as much as Sanchez and Geno, that's what made me completely nuts, especially with Sanchez. Picks are going to happen when you throw it enough but hang on to the freaking ball. Especially in the pocket, there's nobody behind you, there's a real good chance if the D gets it they're going in with it.
Post by: Johnny English on November 24, 2015, 11:08:48 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 24, 2015, 11:17:10 AM
I feel like a number of his picks in the last few games have been on fourth down when we're going for it towards the end of the game, and in that situation a pick twenty yards downfield is probably better than, or at least no more harmful than, an incomplete pass.
At least a couple of them were, end of the Buffalo game and the first one at Houston. The last one at Houston was on 1st down and we had enough time to get down the field. Analyst said it was a great play by the CB, but that's a bad pick. They're giving you space in the prevent, you can't throw a pick on 1st down.
Post by: Badger on November 24, 2015, 11:20:09 AM
Not gonna lie, Treadwell in Green and White gives me a chub lol
Wrong thread my bad tangent, as usual
Welcome to team Megaquon.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 24, 2015, 02:08:23 PM
Statistically, he has the worst deep ball in the NFL, and it's not even particularly close. He also throws the ball deep more than most quarterbacks. I don't know if that's on Gailey for putting Fitz in a position to fail, or Fitz for rarely making a 2nd read, but it's a problem.
Marshall hasn't helped lately. He's catching less than half his targets over the last month, after being over 70% early in the season. Meanwhile, Devin Smith has had a nightmare season.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 24, 2015, 02:13:57 PM
Fitz is better than what we've had recently, but he can't throw deep, and when we fall behind in games, that makes it very difficult for him to lead a comeback. 5 of his interceptions have come in the 4th quarter, 2nd-most in the league, usually when we're trying to come back. On one hand, it's not as big a deal because he's trying to push the ball down the field. On the other hand, it's not good that whenever he tries to push the ball down the field, bad things happen.
Statistically, he has the worst deep ball in the NFL, and it's not even particularly close. He also throws the ball deep more than most quarterbacks. I don't know if that's on Gailey for putting Fitz in a position to fail, or Fitz for rarely making a 2nd read, but it's a problem.
Marshall hasn't helped lately. He's catching less than half his targets over the last month, after being over 70% early in the season. Meanwhile, Devin Smith has had a nightmare season.
Poor starts to the game. So that's on everyone, coaches on down to Fitz himself. Start a game strong and they won't have to open it up so much.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 24, 2015, 02:20:35 PM
Post by: ScotlandJet on November 24, 2015, 02:27:06 PM
Poor starts to the game. So that's on everyone, coaches on down to Fitz himself. Start a game strong and they won't have to open it up so much.
Finally a cerebral post from you. Hope springs eternal.
I think you are spot on; we seem to be sleep walking in to games and then get in a jam and end up chasing which is causing a ton of problems for our anemic offence. I blame this on the coaches especially.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 24, 2015, 02:31:47 PM
Finally a cerebral post from you. Hope springs eternal.
I think you are spot on; we seem to be sleep walking in to games and then get in a jam and end up chasing which is causing a ton of problems for our anemic offence. I blame this on the coaches especially.
You don't like my whimsical posting style?
Too phucking bad and Happy Thanksgiving!
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 24, 2015, 02:57:45 PM
Post by: ScotlandJet on November 24, 2015, 03:06:15 PM
You don't like my whimsical posting style?
Too phucking bad and Happy Thanksgiving!
Ha! Happy freaking Thanksgiving homo!
Post by: Miamipuck on November 24, 2015, 03:16:17 PM
Ha! Happy freaking Thanksgiving homo!
Hahaha yes I am, I am all lathered up in anticipation of eating rooster nonstop.
One year you will have to spend Thanksgiving in the States.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 25, 2015, 11:14:58 AM
Fitzpatrick is who he is, and he's really played better than expected of him. If this team did what it was designed to do: stifling defense and a strong running attack, Fitz would be a hero right now.
As for Marshall, his production fell off a cliff after the Patriots showed everyone how to shut him down. We wouldn't even be talking about it if someone besides Decker were able to do anything on the field. Marshall's getting doubled, so someone is open every play. Unfortunately, no one can catch the damn ball.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 25, 2015, 12:08:35 PM
Out of 32 quarterbacks, 2 get intercepted on a higher percentage of passes than Fitz.
I know I'm critical of Fitz, but it's because he's not that good. I would start Fitz again this week, but I'd he struggles again, I'd strongly considering Geno. That doesn't mean I think Geno is a lock to be better, it just means the status quo isn't working and the backup isn't much worse with the potential to be better.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 25, 2015, 12:11:09 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 25, 2015, 12:26:15 PM
Meanwhile, Geno has 64% comp, 8.1 yds per att, 8 td, 4 int in his last 5 games. Do I think it can last? Probably not, but expecting Fitz to turn into a good quarterback on his 6th team is less crazy than thinking a 25 year old could improve.
Post by: nyjunc on November 25, 2015, 12:36:42 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 25, 2015, 12:42:59 PM
you guys know I was critical of Fitz early but I really think he's been good since the Wash game. The pieces around him have crumbled, Ivory and marshall were carrying our O and both have struggled mightily the last 3-4 games. the D was great early and has been BAD the last 3-4 games. Our season isn't riding on Fitz, it's riding on the D getting going again and Marshall/Ivory getting healthy and playing like they are capable.I agree the team success comes down to the defense and running game. Fitz is too limited to win when those units aren't clicking. Geno probably is, too.
When our running game was great in September, we were a very good team. Now that the running game is mediocre, the offense isn't good enough, and the defense has had a few slip ups (see Oakland game).
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 25, 2015, 12:52:28 PM
You can choose to ride or die with the QB who ranks in the bottom 10 in most major QB categories if you want. 5 teams have already determined that Fitz isn't the answer.
Meanwhile, Geno has 64% comp, 8.1 yds per att, 8 td, 4 int in his last 5 games. Do I think it can last? Probably not, but expecting Fitz to turn into a good quarterback on his 6th team is less crazy than thinking a 25 year old could improve.
I think you're relying too heavily on stats. His INT number is deceptive in relation to how he's played, his completion percentage and yards per attempt would be better if guys hung onto the ball better. When you watch him run the offense, he moves the ball and gets us in the end zone enough to win more than he does anything causing us to lose.
Post by: nyjunc on November 25, 2015, 01:07:51 PM
I agree the team success comes down to the defense and running game. Fitz is too limited to win when those units aren't clicking. Geno probably is, too.
When our running game was great in September, we were a very good team. Now that the running game is mediocre, the offense isn't good enough, and the defense has had a few slip ups (see Oakland game).
w/ the run game and D struggling he has still given us a chance to win games.
Post by: Johnny English on November 25, 2015, 05:03:40 PM
https://twitter.com/nyjets/status/669619196733489152
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 25, 2015, 05:25:30 PM
I think you're relying too heavily on stats. His INT number is deceptive in relation to how he's played, his completion percentage and yards per attempt would be better if guys hung onto the ball better.
Because Stephen Hill and Chaz Schilens were known for their hands and hanging onto the football. It's not like the Jets are the only team that can't catch.
The Jets offense has mostly been miserable in games the Jets can't run the ball.
I already miss the beard but maybe he'll get laid more and that will help his game on Sundays.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 26, 2015, 08:47:21 AM
Because Stephen Hill and Chaz Schilens were known for their hands and hanging onto the football. It's not like the Jets are the only team that can't catch.
The Jets offense has mostly been miserable in games the Jets can't run the ball.
I already miss the beard but maybe he'll get laid more and that will help his game on Sundays.
Those guys have nothing to with Fitzpatrick. Just because it was no better then doesn't make it any better now.
Also, he credits Rex in part for shaving the beard. #BringBackRex
Post by: Johnny English on November 26, 2015, 08:53:19 AM
Post by: Emerson Boozer on November 26, 2015, 08:29:53 PM
I already miss the beard but maybe he'll get laid more and that will help his game on Sundays.
He's married. Chances are not getting laid.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 26, 2015, 08:37:12 PM
He's married. Chances are not getting laid.
Only road game in the next month is the Giants, that's not going to help him.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 27, 2015, 06:15:32 AM
He's married. Chances are not getting laid.He has 37 kids. He's getting laid some.
Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
Post by: Johnny English on November 27, 2015, 10:54:20 AM
He has 37 kids. He's getting laid some.
Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
I don't think the kids prove that he's getting laid, they prove that his wife is.
Post by: Johnny English on November 27, 2015, 10:55:48 AM
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-mGQFSiULdOI/T-v0DlYzGnI/AAAAAAAAADw/VGYYBZsNTbA/s320/Ryan+Fitzpatrick-wife-liza.jpg)
All wrong.
Post by: bojanglesman on November 27, 2015, 10:58:52 AM
Have you seen what he looks like without the beard?
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-mGQFSiULdOI/T-v0DlYzGnI/AAAAAAAAADw/VGYYBZsNTbA/s320/Ryan+Fitzpatrick-wife-liza.jpg)
All wrong.
Wife looks pretty hot in that pic. Good for him.
Post by: JFIF on November 28, 2015, 01:03:21 AM
Wife looks pretty hot in that pic. Good for him.
I mean, he's a white millionaire athlete with a Harvard education. His wife is likely gonna be hot
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 28, 2015, 11:13:32 AM
I mean, he's a white millionaire athlete with a Harvard education. His wife is likely gonna be hot
If not he would have been completely wasting his time.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 28, 2015, 11:18:47 AM
I mean, he's a white millionaire......
Aren't we all?
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 28, 2015, 12:32:25 PM
Aren't we all?
According to the Democrats, yes.
Post by: Badger on November 29, 2015, 02:47:14 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on November 29, 2015, 03:17:19 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on November 29, 2015, 03:18:59 PM
I think Fitz completed his first deep ball of the season today
Nope he hit the Bomb to Marshall in London as well.
If only he could hit deep against someone other than Miami
Post by: Tommy on November 29, 2015, 03:20:31 PM
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 29, 2015, 03:22:52 PM
Post by: Badger on November 29, 2015, 03:25:04 PM
Fitzpatrick after going to the barber shop: 10 TD 0 INT. We have the key now.
But he doesn't have enough beard to spare now for the remaining games. Will shaving pubes have the same effect?
Post by: Coach K on November 29, 2015, 03:33:30 PM
But he doesn't have enough beard to spare now for the remaining games. Will shaving pubes have the same effect?
Priceless
Post by: Badger on November 29, 2015, 03:59:05 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on November 29, 2015, 04:04:23 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 29, 2015, 04:20:32 PM
But he doesn't have enough beard to spare now for the remaining games. Will shaving pubes have the same effect?
We need a bye week.
Post by: Scruggy on November 30, 2015, 07:35:23 AM
I like hearing Fitz scream like a girl after a TD. Hilarious.
The Irish Tenor.
I got all my homies at the bar singing "Ho Ho Ho Fitzmagic, you know! Never believe it's not so!" In high falsetto.
Post by: MBGreen on November 30, 2015, 07:37:12 AM
The Irish Tenor.
I got all my homies at the bar singing "Ho Ho Ho Fitzmagic, you know! Never believe it's not so!" In high falsetto.
3.5 honks
Post by: nyjunc on November 30, 2015, 09:09:31 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2015, 09:15:11 AM
Post by: Johnny English on November 30, 2015, 09:18:32 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 30, 2015, 09:25:03 AM
I love Fitzpatrick's toughness and how he acts as a leader. But if any other QB averaged an interception per game, completed less than 60 Pct of his passes and averaged less than 7 yes per attempt, we'd crush him.
Out of 32 quarterbacks, 2 get intercepted on a higher percentage of passes than Fitz.
I know I'm critical of Fitz, but it's because he's not that good. I would start Fitz again this week, but I'd he struggles again, I'd strongly considering Geno. That doesn't mean I think Geno is a lock to be better, it just means the status quo isn't working and the backup isn't much worse with the potential to be better.
You don't still feel like this today, right?
he has far exceeded my expectations.
I had markedly higher expectations than you and he's exceeded mine.
Post by: nyjunc on November 30, 2015, 10:13:38 AM
I just wish the fucker would slide.
I don't think that will ever change
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 30, 2015, 10:21:35 AM
You don't still feel like this today, right?
He's played fine this year. But Fitzpatrick is a guy with a long history of being a mediocre quarterback. His numbers this year are mostly in line with his better seasons in the NFL, but I don't expect him to suddenly turn into a good quarterback at this stage of his career. He's having the best year by any quarterback we've had since Favre.
This doesn't mean he's the long-term answer. Honestly, there's not a whole lot Fitz can do to prove to me he deserves to be the long-term answer, other than play lights out football. He's started 100 games in his career - he probably is who he is.
My point the whole time was that Geno would put up similar numbers to Fitzpatrick had he gotten a chance to play, and that Geno is young enough where he can potentially develop into the long-term answer (like a 10% shot). I've always said Fitzpatrick is a better QB than Geno right now, though Geno would open up our offense and give us slightly more upside.
I stand by all that. I never hated Fitz. I actually really like and respect Fitz, and I'm really happy we have him. I just want to caution people from thinking Fitz is better than he is.
If we can find an upgrade this offseason, it would be ideal. However, I don't see where that upgrade comes from, so I think there's a good chance the QB room looks very similar next season.
When we're running really well, and we're playing really good defense, we can win with Fitz. But a lot of quarterbacks can say that. It's no coincidence that the Jets' results are more tied to how well the running game has played than practically any other team in the NFL.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 30, 2015, 10:24:14 AM
This doesn't mean he's the long-term answer.
Literally nobody thinks that he is
Post by: nyjunc on November 30, 2015, 10:29:41 AM
He's played fine this year. But Fitzpatrick is a guy with a long history of being a mediocre quarterback. His numbers this year are mostly in line with his better seasons in the NFL, but I don't expect him to suddenly turn into a good quarterback at this stage of his career. He's having the best year by any quarterback we've had since Favre.
This doesn't mean he's the long-term answer. Honestly, there's not a whole lot Fitz can do to prove to me he deserves to be the long-term answer, other than play lights out football. He's started 100 games in his career - he probably is who he is.
My point the whole time was that Geno would put up similar numbers to Fitzpatrick had he gotten a chance to play, and that Geno is young enough where he can potentially develop into the long-term answer (like a 10% shot). I've always said Fitzpatrick is a better QB than Geno right now, though Geno would open up our offense and give us slightly more upside.
I stand by all that. I never hated Fitz. I actually really like and respect Fitz, and I'm really happy we have him. I just want to caution people from thinking Fitz is better than he is.
If we can find an upgrade this offseason, it would be ideal. However, I don't see where that upgrade comes from, so I think there's a good chance the QB room looks very similar next season.
When we're running really well, and we're playing really good defense, we can win with Fitz. But a lot of quarterbacks can say that. It's no coincidence that the Jets' results are more tied to how well the running game has played than practically any other team in the NFL.
we didn't run the ball well yesterday, don't let the final #s fool you. the bulk of our rush yds were in garbage time.
I don't think anyone was more critical of Fitz than me but he has shown me a lot this last 5-6 weeks. It's not all about #s, I didn't think he played anywhere near as good as his #s early in the year and I think he has played MUCH better than his #s the last 5-6 weeks. we can win with him but we need our other units to step up.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2015, 10:47:40 AM
You never know what he can do with this offense if he stays healthy and we just block. Alex Smith is just figuring it out now and I believe he has been around longer.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 30, 2015, 10:49:15 AM
Literally nobody thinks that he is
And that's using the word "literally" correctly.
DS, that's a completely straw man argument you're making. Neither Fitz nor Geno will be here 3 years from now (one will be gone in February--and he's not the guy Duff traded for).
Geno's "potential" is irrelevant at this point. He's had opportunities and squandered them, whereas Fitzpatrick has capitalized on his. Fitz gives this team the best chance to win right now, and since neither has a long-term future with this team, you go with the guy who will win for you now.
Post by: AlioTheFool on November 30, 2015, 10:50:47 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2015, 10:54:22 AM
An interesting Fitz note: He has 20 TDs this year. The franchise record, held by Vinny, is 29.
Vinny had Keyshawn and Chrebet, Fitzpatrick has Marshall and Decker, that makes a big difference. For 3/4 of one year Sanchez had Edwards and Holmes, aside from that it's been since the 98 team we have had these weapons in the red zone.
Post by: insanity on November 30, 2015, 11:05:17 AM
When we're running really well, and we're playing really good defense, we can win with Fitz. But a lot of quarterbacks can say that.
Geno can't. If the Jets give a good effort an defense and strong run support, you can rest assured that Fitz will do his job to win us the game. Geno is prone to make a big mistake and cost the Jets points.
Also, you really need to stop comparing quarterbacks by looking at the box score. Fitz and Geno's numbers look similar, but Fitz has played muched better than Geno has and ever will.
Fitz never gets sacked - Fitz is the least sacked QB in the league.
Through 11 games Fitz has only been sacked 11 times. Last year Geno was sacked 28 times through 14 games (43 times in 16 games the year before). The more notable statistic is these 11 sacks only netted 56 yards which means when Fitz gets sacked it doesn't put us in 2nd or 3rd and long situations (Also note 7 out of the 11 sacks came after Fitz hurt his hand. Botched snaps due to Fitz's hand have accounted for many of his sacks).
Fitz doesn't turn the ball over
Fitz currently averaging 1 interception per game which is a little high, but half of his interceptions come in garbage time at the end of a half or game.
Fitz has fumbled the ball 4 times this year, three of which I believe were botched snaps and only 1 was recovered by the other team. Geno fumbled the ball 8 times in 14 games.
Fitz's interceptions don't put the Jets defense in bad situations
I'll admit Fitz's decision making at times on his deep balls gives me agitate, but those deep balls are similar to us punting. As fans we've been begging our quarterbacks for years to air the ball out more often. We have 2 great wide receivers who are great at jump balls. If our quarterback trusts our receivers to make a play so should we.
I challenge you to name me 2 games where Fitz's decision making resulted in points off turnovers.
I know I sound like a Fitz homer every time I defend him, but for years we've been saying if we just had a quarterback who won't lose us a game and can make a big play here and there, we would have a shot. Fitz is that guy. He isn't Brady, Brees or Manning, but his play can be comparable to second tier players
Post by: Badger on November 30, 2015, 11:15:40 AM
Geno is not going to be the answer. He might get better than he was but he's not taking us anywhere Fitzpatrick won't take us. Fitz makes better decisions in the red zone and has mostly limited turnovers. For the foreseeable future until we land or happen into a great franchise QB, he can play the position and we won't be a garbage team. In a league that is mostly 6-5 or 5-6 that will work for now.
You never know what he can do with this offense if he stays healthy and we just block. Alex Smith is just figuring it out now and I believe he has been around longer.
Alex Smith figured it out in 2011, his 7th season. Fitz is what he is.
Post by: Badger on November 30, 2015, 11:17:12 AM
Vinny had Keyshawn and Chrebet, Fitzpatrick has Marshall and Decker, that makes a big difference. For 3/4 of one year Sanchez had Edwards and Holmes, aside from that it's been since the 98 team we have had these weapons in the red zone.
Sanchez had 26 TD in 2011 with Holmes and Plax.
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 30, 2015, 11:18:04 AM
And that's using the word "literally" correctly.It's hard to tell because this board is a giant lovefest for Fitz half the time. I like him a lot, too, but he's a very limited quarterback.
DS, that's a completely straw man argument you're making. Neither Fitz nor Geno will be here 3 years from now (one will be gone in February--and he's not the guy Duff traded for).
Fitz is playing light years better than Geno played in 2013-14. The question is how much would Geno have developed from 2014-2015. Last time we saw Geno, he played the best game of his career, a game that was as good as any game Fitz has played this season, and our weapons now are far better than what he had to deal with.
I understand why it's the case, but it's funny to me that Geno is considered someone with no long-term future, and Petty is considered a long-term project, even though they are less than a year apart in age. I don't have much faith in Geno going forward, and I'm okay if we move on without him, but it's still interesting.
If Fitzpatrick struggled for the third straight week against Miami, I would have strongly considered pulling the plug and seeing what Geno could do against the Giants. But at this point, we should ride with Fitzpatrick for the foreseeable future this year.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2015, 11:20:34 AM
Sanchez had 26 TD in 2011 with Holmes and Plax.
True, but Plaxico had his in bunches, which meant 2 or 3 great games and a lot of games on the side of a milk carton. In my opinion Holmes and Edwards were the better WR tandem over the course of a season. Holmes had that stretch in 2010 where he won us a bunch of games in a row, at Denver, Detroit and Cleveland, then home vs Houston. The playoff game at Foxboro both were huge.
Post by: Badger on November 30, 2015, 11:22:02 AM
True, but Plaxico had his in bunches, which meant 2 or 3 great games and a lot of games on the side of a milk carton. In my opinion Holmes and Edwards were the better WR tandem over the course of a season. Holmes had that stretch in 2010 where he won us a bunch of games in a row, at Denver, Detroit and Cleveland, then home vs Houston. The playoff game at Foxboro both were huge.
I agree. I was just throwing the number out there.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2015, 11:23:07 AM
Last time we saw Geno, he played the best game of his career, a game that was as good as any game Fitz has played this season, and our weapons now are far better than what he had to deal with.
That game was vs a Miami team with their bags packed who mailed it in, and Geno still gave away a TD with a stupid fumble early on.
And we have seen him since, at Oakland in a game we needed where he wasn't very good.
Post by: insanity on November 30, 2015, 11:26:47 AM
It's hard to tell because this board is a giant lovefest for Fitz half the time. I like him a lot, too, but he's a very limited quarterback.
Fitz is playing light years better than Geno played in 2013-14. The question is how much would Geno have developed from 2014-2015. Last time we saw Geno, he played the best game of his career, a game that was as good as any game Fitz has played this season, and our weapons now are far better than what he had to deal with.
I understand why it's the case, but it's funny to me that Geno is considered someone with no long-term future, and Petty is considered a long-term project, even though they are less than a year apart in age. I don't have much faith in Geno going forward, and I'm okay if we move on without him, but it's still interesting.
If Fitzpatrick struggled for the third straight week against Miami, I would have strongly considered pulling the plug and seeing what Geno could do against the Giants. But at this point, we should ride with Fitzpatrick for the foreseeable future this year.
Because Bryce Petty hasn't played a game yet and Geno Smith perpetually turns the ball over and can't read a defense. He has no situational awareness. I was interested in what he was able to do coming into the season, but what he showed in the Raider game made me lose all hope.
Post by: mj2sexay on November 30, 2015, 11:28:02 AM
He doesn't play until hope for the playoffs is lost. Having said that, I'd still rather see him under center than Petty if unfortunately everything goes off the rails. Give Bryce his red shirt year.
Post by: Johnny English on November 30, 2015, 11:30:44 AM
Because Bryce Petty hasn't played a game yet and Geno Smith perpetually turns the ball over and can't read a defense. He has no situational awareness. I was interested in what he was able to do coming into the season, but what he showed in the Raider game made me lose all hope.
Beat me to it.
No-one is saying that Petty is the long term future. He at least still has the potential to be, but we have yet to see anything upon which to form a view.
Geno Smith has proven himself to be unsuited to be the leader of the team on or off the field, and he has no place at the club. The Enemkpali situation was the final straw.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 30, 2015, 11:32:37 AM
It's hard to tell because this board is a giant lovefest for Fitz half the time.
No, we just aren't a bunch of Geno Smith dick-riders.
Post by: Coach K on November 30, 2015, 11:37:41 AM
I saw enough. The team also radiates respect for Fitz and seems uninspired by Geno
That's all I need to know.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2015, 11:37:53 AM
It's hard to tell because this board is a giant lovefest for Fitz half the time. I like him a lot, too, but he's a very limited quarterback.
Fitz is playing light years better than Geno played in 2013-14. The question is how much would Geno have developed from 2014-2015. Last time we saw Geno, he played the best game of his career, a game that was as good as any game Fitz has played this season, and our weapons now are far better than what he had to deal with.
I understand why it's the case, but it's funny to me that Geno is considered someone with no long-term future, and Petty is considered a long-term project, even though they are less than a year apart in age. I don't have much faith in Geno going forward, and I'm okay if we move on without him, but it's still interesting.
If Fitzpatrick struggled for the third straight week against Miami, I would have strongly considered pulling the plug and seeing what Geno could do against the Giants. But at this point, we should ride with Fitzpatrick for the foreseeable future this year.
They played the same team with the same results.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 30, 2015, 11:39:48 AM
Mack will always be able to say "but Geno never got a chance!" and I'm perfectly okay with that because Smith is awful and doesn't deserve another shot at this.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2015, 11:41:12 AM
It's no secret I at least argued that Geno never had a supporting cast and I was curious to see what he could do with this bunch.
I saw enough. The team also radiates respect for Fitz and seems uninspired by Geno
That's all I need to know.
I think Geno can get us down the field ok with this offense, the problem is he's not as efficient in the red zone and more prone to turn it over along the way. That results in less points for us and better field position for the opponent, which translates into losing more games.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2015, 11:41:19 AM
There's more to the position than statistics. Fitzpatrick does more for this team than Geno Smith ever will.
That's the single most obvious thing in my opinion.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 30, 2015, 11:44:03 AM
That's the single most obvious thing in my opinion.
On the redzone TD to Decker, Fitzpatrick changed the play at the line and made that entire thing happen.
Smith wouldn't see that or make the adjustment. Smith also can't make protection calls to save his life and Fitzpatrick is great at it.
Post by: Badger on November 30, 2015, 11:45:18 AM
No, we just aren't a bunch of Geno Smith dick-riders.
People like Fitz because he was one of the best options available and is an improvement over his predecessor. Geno was neither of those.
And everyone knows he's not the long term QB.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2015, 11:45:53 AM
People like Fitz because he was one of the best options available and is an improvement over his predecessor. Geno was neither of those.
And everyone knows he's not the long term QB.
This in a nutshell.
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2015, 11:46:29 AM
On the redzone TD to Decker, Fitzpatrick changed the play at the line and made that entire thing happen.
Smith wouldn't see that or make the adjustment. Smith also can't make protection calls to save his life and Fitzpatrick is great at it.
He loves the round peg in a square hole.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2015, 11:48:37 AM
People like Fitz because he was one of the best options available and is an improvement over his predecessor. Geno was neither of those.
And everyone knows he's not the long term QB.
Exactly. He's just not killing us, which is pretty rare dating all the way back to Pennington.
Favre gave us a good 11 games and fell apart, Sanchez has good spurts in his first three years but ultimately killed us, Geno was worse. And all that time we've had mostly good defenses and have been in games, just had a QB who would turn it over and kill us.
Post by: Johnny English on November 30, 2015, 12:00:32 PM
They played the same team with the same results.
Personnel wise the Dolphins team that Fitz has beaten is far more talented than the one Geno beat. (I realise that the same argument is true of the Jets.)
Post by: Miamipuck on November 30, 2015, 12:06:22 PM
Personnel wise the Dolphins team that Fitz has beaten is far more talented than the one Geno beat. (I realise that the same argument is true of the Jets.)
I am just saying that you can't use the Fins as an argument for Smith when Fitz did the same exact thing against them. They're not the 2000 Ravens. It's basically a non event and not really a good argument for Smith.
Post by: Tommy on November 30, 2015, 12:14:45 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on November 30, 2015, 12:21:21 PM
Does anyone here think that we'd have a better record had Geno started at the beginning of the season?
Derek Smalls thinks we'd have the same record.
Post by: insanity on November 30, 2015, 12:53:46 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on November 30, 2015, 01:25:05 PM
No, we just aren't a bunch of Geno Smith dick-riders.If thinking he had a 5-10% chance of being the long-term answer, and saying multiple times that I'm okay moving on from him makes me a Geno Smith dick-rider, then I think Ryan Fitzpatrick already impregnated half this board.
Geno was playing well enough against the Raiders, until he fucked up the two plays at the end of the game, taking two dumb sacks. Those mental errors are why Geno struggled for his first two years, and it's hard to have much faith in him if he's still making those decisions. He didn't take starter reps all week and Mangold was out, but those plays at the end were inexcusable.
In the six games the Jets won this year, we forced 20 turnovers and averaged 141 rushing yards per game. Fitzpatrick helped, but just like the 2009-10 blueprints, the games we have won have mostly been on the back of our defense and running game with the quarterback managing the game. Fitzpatrick has done a good job of that, and like Coach K said, the team respects Fitzpatrick a lot. Geno never earned that.
Post by: Heismanberg on November 30, 2015, 01:44:02 PM
The Robertson trade was bad and Vernon Gholston was a massive bust, but Smith set this team back more than either of those guys. We passed over an outstanding group of QB prospects for this slouch.
Post by: MBGreen on November 30, 2015, 01:48:56 PM
Gholston also got $21 million guaranteed. Gross.
Post by: mj2sexay on November 30, 2015, 01:55:57 PM
Geno was bad, and having him in the fold led the front office to pass on Carr. But I can't overstate how destructive the Gholston pick was.
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 30, 2015, 02:39:00 PM
I don't think anyone will top Vernon Gholston as our shittiest draft pick, even Geno. At least we didn't burn a 1st rounder on Geno, and he actually won a game or 2. Gholston provided ZERO value.
Gholston also got $21 million guaranteed. Gross.
Milliner is a very close second
Post by: loyaljetsfan on November 30, 2015, 02:45:32 PM
freaking. Fitz.
Post by: reuben on November 30, 2015, 04:17:52 PM
Milliner is a very close second
No way. Kyle Brady, Mike Nugent, and Stephen Hill were worse.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2015, 04:36:06 PM
No way. Kyle Brady, Mike Nugent, and Stephen Hill were worse.
Brady had some good years, albeit not for where he was drafted. Nugent is still kicking 10 years later, just not for us. Again, taken too high but not in the Gholston, Milliner category. Hill is up there.
I see the point about Geno being worse because he did play. Interesting take but it makes sense.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on November 30, 2015, 05:31:40 PM
Favre gave us a good 11 games and fell apart, Sanchez has good spurts in his first three years but ultimately killed us, Geno was worse. And all that time we've had mostly good defenses and have been in games, just had a QB who would turn it over and kill us.
The fun thing is that Sanchez was at his best when it mattered the most. Last-minute drives, playoff games... The problem is that he was excrement in all the rest.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2015, 05:49:35 PM
The fun thing is that Sanchez was at his best when it mattered the most. Last-minute drives, playoff games... The problem is that he was excrement in all the rest.
That's why I had a lot of hope for him, reminded me of early Eli.
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2015, 05:52:52 PM
Post by: Tommy on November 30, 2015, 07:14:56 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on November 30, 2015, 07:21:59 PM
Heard Fitz got a bunch of cheers at the Rangers game tonight. Quite the reversal from deafening boos when they showed Geno earlier this year.
Well, it is a hockey crowd.
Post by: Pope on December 01, 2015, 12:47:16 AM
Post by: nyjunc on December 01, 2015, 08:37:02 AM
That's why I had a lot of hope for him, reminded me of early Eli.
he did, he was better than early Eli but the Giants kept adding weapons for Eli and we decided to strip mark of all the talent around him and expect him to improve.
Post by: NDMick on December 01, 2015, 10:51:04 AM
he did, he was better than early Eli but the Giants kept adding weapons for Eli and we decided to strip mark of all the talent around him and expect him to improve.
It was a textbook demonstration of how to ruin a young QB, no matter their talent level.
They should teach a class on it.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 01, 2015, 11:21:34 AM
It was a textbook demonstration of how to ruin a young QB, no matter their talent level.
They should teach a class on it.
Perhaps, but what is the excuse now for him turning the ball over at the same rate years later on a different team with a supposed offensive "genius" for a coach?
Post by: nyjunc on December 01, 2015, 12:02:59 PM
Perhaps, but what is the excuse now for him turning the ball over at the same rate years later on a different team with a supposed offensive "genius" for a coach?
he's a TO prone guy just as Eli still is but he also still makes plays.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 01, 2015, 12:04:45 PM
he's a TO prone guy just as Eli still is but he also still makes plays.
And they left their GM/coach in place once they realized they could win, even if they don't win every year. That's where it starts for any good organization and it rolls downhill to the players.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 01, 2015, 12:07:39 PM
And they left their GM/coach in place once they realized they could win, even if they don't win every year. That's where it starts for any good organization and it rolls downhill to the players.
Yeah no it was time for Rex to do something else, whether you thought he was a good coach or not, it got stale and the Jets needed a professional GM/scouting dept. You can't ask another GM/SD to take Rex, to recruit the right people you need them to get "their" guy.
There have been too many stories of the coaches overriding the scouts on draft decisions, enough is enough. Get a professional staff in here, one that does their homework and works in conjunction with the coaches not one that gets steamrolled by and/or is just in servitude to them.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 01, 2015, 12:18:34 PM
Yeah no it was time for Rex to do something else, whether you thought he was a good coach or not, it got stale and the Jets needed a professional GM/scouting dept. You can't ask another GM/SD to take Rex, to recruit the right people you need them to get "their" guy.
There have been too many stories of the coaches overriding the scouts on draft decisions, enough is enough. Get a professional staff in here, one that does their homework and works in conjunction with the coaches not one that gets steamrolled by and/or is just in servitude to them.
To me it goes back to firing Tannenbaum. Instead of firing him after 5 or 6 good years, maybe they should have had that conversation with him instead of bringing in Idzik, which sabotaged the coach and set the whole franchise back. It's not written in stone that everyone has to move on every four years, especially when the people have had success and wanted to be here. Just look at the good teams, Pats, Giants, Steelers, they don't do it that way.
Post by: Johnny English on December 01, 2015, 12:20:11 PM
To me it goes back to firing Tannenbaum. Instead of firing him after 5 or 6 good years, maybe they should have had that conversation with him instead of bringing in Idzik, which sabotaged the coach and set the whole franchise back. It's not written in stone that everyone has to move on every four years, especially when the people have had success and wanted to be here. Just look at the good teams, Pats, Giants, Steelers, they don't do it that way.
Well, at least Tannenbaum learned his lesson about not going out and making huge splashy signings at the expense of depth.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 01, 2015, 12:20:57 PM
To me it goes back to firing Tannenbaum. Instead of firing him after 5 or 6 good years, maybe they should have had that conversation with him instead of bringing in Idzik, which sabotaged the coach and set the whole franchise back. It's not written in stone that everyone has to move on every four years, especially when the people have had success and wanted to be here. Just look at the good teams, Pats, Giants, Steelers, they don't do it that way.
Meh, the Jets, aside from the Idzik debacle, have been stable enough.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 01, 2015, 12:24:43 PM
Well, at least Tannenbaum learned his lesson about not going out and making huge splashy signings at the expense of depth.
Everything you do doesn't always work, but he made us a good team for a sustained period from 2006-2011. Maybe as the owner you tell him to adjust a few things, but I don't think you start firing people if you want to be a good, stable organization.
Meh, the Jets, aside from the Idzik debacle, have been stable enough.
Yeah, we've had our braintrust in place for months now.
Post by: Johnny English on December 01, 2015, 12:31:05 PM
Everything you do doesn't always work, but he made us a good team for a sustained period from 2006-2011. Maybe as the owner you tell him to adjust a few things, but I don't think you start firing people if you want to be a good, stable organization.
Which wasn't my point. He's gone to Miami and done exactly the same things he did in NY, which is great fun and everything for a little while (well, it was for us) but isn't the way to build a long term sustainable franchise.
Being a GM isn't an apprenticeship or a "give it a go" kind of job. It's a job for elite businesspeople who are masters of all sorts of essential corporate skills, including but not limited to strategic thinking, thorough planning, complex negotiation, conflict management and sales/lobbying. Tannenbaum is proven adept in at least a couple of those, but he has shown little or no aptitude for others and crucially, appears unable or unwilling to recognise his prior shortcomings in those areas.
I'd let him run my sales team, but I wouldn't put him in charge of the whole shop.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 01, 2015, 12:37:11 PM
Yeah, we've had our braintrust in place for months now.
Meh squared, Tannenbaum was a Jets employee since 1997, gm-06-12, Rex was HC for 6 years, Bradway was here forever. The Jets for the most part are pretty stable.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 01, 2015, 12:38:48 PM
Which wasn't my point. He's gone to Miami and done exactly the same things he did in NY, which is great fun and everything for a little while (well, it was for us) but isn't the way to build a long term sustainable franchise.
Being a GM isn't an apprenticeship or a "give it a go" kind of job. It's a job for elite businesspeople who are masters of all sorts of essential corporate skills, including but not limited to strategic thinking, thorough planning, complex negotiation, conflict management and sales/lobbying. Tannenbaum is proven adept in at least a couple of those, but he has shown little or no aptitude for others and crucially, appears unable or unwilling to recognise his prior shortcomings in those areas.
I'd let him run my sales team, but I wouldn't put him in charge of the whole shop.
Pretty good post for a bum.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 01, 2015, 12:50:59 PM
My point is one of the major differences in their development was Eli is in a stable organization where Sanchez had the rug pulled out from under him. New GM drafts his own QB, proves to be incompetent and that was the end of Sanchez's tenure in NY. That didn't happen to Eli because they left the people in place who were making the decisions, and a few years later that paid off. Then a few more years later it paid off again. They haven't been a juggernaut every year either, but they kept people in place who they knew could win, that led to chances which they took full advantage of. They don't go back to square one every few years because the fans get upset or the Francesas of the world say they need to.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 01, 2015, 12:55:40 PM
We can argue Tannenbaum all day, the comparison was Eli and Sanchez. Both had similar traits as young QBs--shaky but able to step up in key spots like the end of games and the playoffs.
My point is one of the major differences in their development was Eli is in a stable organization where Sanchez had the rug pulled out from under him. New GM drafts his own QB, proves to be incompetent and that was the end of Sanchez's tenure in NY. That didn't happen to Eli because they left the people in place who were making the decisions, and a few years later that paid off. Then a few more years later it paid off again. They haven't been a juggernaut every year either, but they kept people in place who they knew could win, that led to chances which they took full advantage of. They don't go back to square one every few years because the fans get upset or the Francesas of the world say they need to.
Yeah and neither did the Jets, our central point but spin it however you want to.
Post by: nyjunc on December 01, 2015, 12:59:00 PM
Which wasn't my point. He's gone to Miami and done exactly the same things he did in NY, which is great fun and everything for a little while (well, it was for us) but isn't the way to build a long term sustainable franchise.
Being a GM isn't an apprenticeship or a "give it a go" kind of job. It's a job for elite businesspeople who are masters of all sorts of essential corporate skills, including but not limited to strategic thinking, thorough planning, complex negotiation, conflict management and sales/lobbying. Tannenbaum is proven adept in at least a couple of those, but he has shown little or no aptitude for others and crucially, appears unable or unwilling to recognise his prior shortcomings in those areas.
I'd let him run my sales team, but I wouldn't put him in charge of the whole shop.
he's been in Miami for 5 minutes. can you give the guy a chance? all he did here was build a legit SB contender. Our problems really got bad when we fired him and hired Idzik.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 01, 2015, 01:00:44 PM
Yeah and neither did the Jets, our central point but spin it however you want to.
We fired the GM after 2012 and the coach and GM after 2014, sorry that's not stability. We had a good run for a while there but got back to our blow it up ways in recent years. I hope to hell we leave Duff and Bowles in place once the natives get restless again (probably later this month), but I'm not banking on it. Remember what I said last off season, write it down--the Jets need to stay in Costanza mode, whatever they're about to do, do the opposite.
Post by: Johnny English on December 01, 2015, 01:06:17 PM
We can argue Tannenbaum all day, the comparison was Eli and Sanchez. Both had similar traits as young QBs--shaky but able to step up in key spots like the end of games and the playoffs.
My point is one of the major differences in their development was Eli is in a stable organization where Sanchez had the rug pulled out from under him. New GM drafts his own QB, proves to be incompetent and that was the end of Sanchez's tenure in NY.
Yeah, you're missing a couple of years out there. Who pulled the rug out from underneath Sanchez?
he's been in Miami for 5 minutes. can you give the guy a chance? all he did here was build a legit SB contender. Our problems really got bad when we fired him and hired Idzik.
I had no problem with him when he built a legit SB contender. The issue was more with him, y'know, dismantling it again.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 01, 2015, 01:10:28 PM
Yeah, you're missing a couple of years out there. Who pulled the rug out from underneath Sanchez?
I had no problem with him when he built a legit SB contender. The issue was more with him, y'know, dismantling it again.
When you bring in veterans to make a run and cap out, that's going to happen. You have to look at the big picture, not get wrapped up in the moment, which is my point about the Giants.
Regarding Sanchez, Idzik drafted Geno and cut Sanchez the following spring with no better option on the roster because Geno was his guy. So the answer to your question is your boy, John Idzik.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 01, 2015, 01:13:53 PM
We fired the GM after 2012 and the coach and GM after 2014, sorry that's not stability. We had a good run for a while there but got back to our blow it up ways in recent years. I hope to hell we leave Duff and Bowles in place once the natives get restless again (probably later this month), but I'm not banking on it. Remember what I said last off season, write it down--the Jets need to stay in Costanza mode, whatever they're about to do, do the opposite.Sorry but your narrative is wrong, completely wrong, I am sorry it just is. You can't say," hurr durr they fired the coach/gm we're unstable!":
The HC was here for 6 years. There are 6 guys + Marvin Lewis currently coaching for longer than that, Garrett and Carroll are in their 6th year.
GM's, 9 longer than Tanny's 7 years as GM, at least 2 will never be fired:
(http://puu.sh/gw7Gd/cc5635fae7.png)
Post by: Johnny English on December 01, 2015, 01:15:49 PM
The point was, Tannenbaum was the guy who pulled the rug from under Sanchez by taking away his weapons. Rex helped him with the whole Derrick Mason thing. If the Jets had found a way to keep Holmes, Edwards and Cotchery together we'd have carried on getting better, but we didn't. We didn't support Sanchez properly and that's why Tannenbaum went. Long term stability isn't about just keeping the same guy in place regardless of his actions and assuming that things will magically work out, it's about planning long term. You can't make a sensible argument that Tannenbaum did that.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 01, 2015, 01:21:36 PM
Obviously you'll not find me defending Idzik.
The point was, Tannenbaum was the guy who pulled the rug from under Sanchez by taking away his weapons. Rex helped him with the whole Derrick Mason thing. If the Jets had found a way to keep Holmes, Edwards and Cotchery together we'd have carried on getting better, but we didn't. We didn't support Sanchez properly and that's why Tannenbaum went. Long term stability isn't about just keeping the same guy in place regardless of his actions and assuming that things will magically work out, it's about planning long term. You can't make a sensible argument that Tannenbaum did that.
But again, you come up against the cap and you have to make choices. Those ended up being mistakes, so was Tebow, but they were intended to help, not derail Sanchez. Idzik's whole plan was to replace him with his own guy because he was here to fix everything.
Post by: Johnny English on December 01, 2015, 01:25:09 PM
But again, you come up against the cap and you have to make choices. Those ended up being mistakes, so was Tebow, but they were intended to help, not derail Sanchez. Idzik's whole plan was to replace him with his own guy because he was here to fix everything.
Again, not talking about Idzik. No-one's suggesting his thankfully brief tenure was anything other than catastrophically awful.
So which is worse? A guy without a plan, or a guy with a plan that's wrong? In the end the net result is the same. I refer you to my previous point about it being a job for people with elite skills. There is no latitude for "his heart was in the right place", you either succeed consistently or you are replaced. It's the nature of being the top guy at any multi-million dollar corporation.
Post by: nyjunc on December 01, 2015, 01:28:29 PM
Yeah, you're missing a couple of years out there. Who pulled the rug out from underneath Sanchez?
I had no problem with him when he built a legit SB contender. The issue was more with him, y'know, dismantling it again.
he went for it from 2008-2010. we knew there would be cap issues, he built that team up, had to tear it down a bit. he deserved a chance to rebuild it back up.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 01, 2015, 01:32:38 PM
Again, not talking about Idzik. No-one's suggesting his thankfully brief tenure was anything other than catastrophically awful.
So which is worse? A guy without a plan, or a guy with a plan that's wrong? In the end the net result is the same. I refer you to my previous point about it being a job for people with elite skills. There is no latitude for "his heart was in the right place", you either succeed consistently or you are replaced. It's the nature of being the top guy at any multi-million dollar corporation.
But you're acting as if Tannenbaum had never executed a good plan, he did. He drafted a lot of the good players we still have, put the back to back AFC Championship Game teams together. When the veterans get old and you're against the cap, the best laid plans might not get you back there. They put a lot of stock in Sanchez and Holmes to be a big duo, so you have to live with some other WRs not as good as you had. Greene looked like a legit horse to run behind our line and cover some flaws. That was the problem, those guys didn't do it, not the peripheral guys like Mason or Plaxico. They were a by-product of being capped out. But when you have people you've won with (like the Giants), you give them a chance to sort it out, you don't blow up the operation. Coming off 2012 when our best player on both sides of the ball (Holmes, Revis) were lost in September, to me wasn't the time to rebuild.
Post by: Johnny English on December 01, 2015, 01:41:48 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 01, 2015, 01:51:27 PM
You see a plan. I see a man who flew by the seat of his pants, and continues to do so. There was never a plan beyond "how can we make the team as good as possible this year?".
In fairness, he did have a plan. It's the one Idzik put into motion with cuts that Tanny built into his contracts. He sold out a couple of years to get the team to the AFCC twice. It was time to move on from him like this year was time to move on from Rex, but in both cases bitterness clouds the job they did.
Post by: Pope on December 01, 2015, 02:06:47 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on December 01, 2015, 02:08:31 PM
Enough with the Suckchez excrement. How can one ruin what sucked in the first place?
Fixed for you.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on December 01, 2015, 02:11:01 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 01, 2015, 07:28:36 PM
You see a plan. I see a man who flew by the seat of his pants, and continues to do so. There was never a plan beyond "how can we make the team as good as possible this year?".
That's most teams' plan most years. It's a high turnover business, if you plan for 3 years from now you won't last long enough to see it.
Post by: Tommy on December 01, 2015, 07:46:11 PM
Enough with the Sanchez excrement. How can one ruin what sucked in the first place?
I love how whenever Sanchez is brought up his defenders are quick to blame the CS for him sucking. "But they ruined his development!"
Post by: NDMick on December 01, 2015, 07:51:47 PM
I love how whenever Sanchez is brought up his defenders are quick to blame the CS for him sucking. "But they ruined his development!"
If you knew how it worked you'd realize it wasn't just him. Everyone is in agreement about it. Get on board.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 01, 2015, 10:00:36 PM
Woody made a mistake firing him
lmaoooooooooo
Post by: ukilledkenny on December 02, 2015, 10:46:47 AM
I love how whenever Sanchez is brought up his defenders are quick to blame the CS for him sucking. "But they ruined his development!"
He obviously never would have been a top guy since he is still throwing awful redzone picks in philly but it is a fact that the offensive talent surrounding him fell apart after year two.
That's a FO problem, though.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on December 02, 2015, 10:53:58 AM
lmaoooooooooo
Sorry to tell you but in hindsight it was. Hiring Idzik was a much worse one of course, but do you think the team would have sucked as bad with Tanny as it did with Idzik? If not, then the decision was a mistake, not much debate there.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2015, 01:23:31 PM
Post by: nyjunc on December 02, 2015, 02:17:42 PM
Sanchez had some hurdles to deal with in year three but at that point he needed to step up and start carrying some of the load, he didn't. Looking at him years later we know why, but at the time that's what the Jets expected him to do. Some of the blame can be put on the coaches, the cap, the WRs, whatever, but a lot of it was him too as it's plain to see now.
he stepped up and started carrying some of the load in year 2 and then again in year 3. year 3 the talent around him got a lot worse but he could win w/ those guys, what he had in 2012 was as bad as can be.
Post by: ukilledkenny on December 02, 2015, 02:21:39 PM
Sanchez had some hurdles to deal with in year three but at that point he needed to step up and start carrying some of the load, he didn't. Looking at him years later we know why, but at the time that's what the Jets expected him to do. Some of the blame can be put on the coaches, the cap, the WRs, whatever, but a lot of it was him too as it's plain to see now.
I never hear of any other team with a third year QB consciously get less talented on offense and just say the young QB needs to figure it out.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2015, 02:47:17 PM
I never hear of any other team with a third year QB consciously get less talented on offense and just say the young QB needs to figure it out.
If you have no cap space you can't keep everyone, you have to make some decisions with the knowledge that you might not be as good as you just were. So they had to prioritize--Mangold got his money, Brick, they had to pick a WR and gave Holmes the money, coming off 2010 that made the most sense. It wasn't like they gutted the roster and told Sanchez it's on you. He had his #1 WR, a good line, Keller, LT was getting old but Greene looked like he was the next #1 RB. Sanchez had enough to work with, Plaxico was no slouch, he didn't take the next step forward and Holmes didn't help him. In hindsight it makes sense because it appears Sanchez just isn't as good as we hoped he'd be.
Post by: nyjunc on December 02, 2015, 03:21:25 PM
If you have no cap space you can't keep everyone, you have to make some decisions with the knowledge that you might not be as good as you just were. So they had to prioritize--Mangold got his money, Brick, they had to pick a WR and gave Holmes the money, coming off 2010 that made the most sense. It wasn't like they gutted the roster and told Sanchez it's on you. He had his #1 WR, a good line, Keller, LT was getting old but Greene looked like he was the next #1 RB. Sanchez had enough to work with, Plaxico was no slouch, he didn't take the next step forward and Holmes didn't help him. In hindsight it makes sense because it appears Sanchez just isn't as good as we hoped he'd be.
and he set a franchise record for total TDs in that season despite 3 of his top 5 weapons entering that season being out of football after that season.
he faltered down the stretch as did the entire team but the D killed us. they got torched at Philly, we were dominating that Giant game and they allowed the game changing and season changing 99 yd TD then in what was a meaningless week 17 game they allowed a 13+ min drive to Matt Moore to blow a 4th qtr lead.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 02, 2015, 03:39:49 PM
and he set a franchise record for total TDs in that season despite 3 of his top 5 weapons entering that season being out of football after that season.
he faltered down the stretch as did the entire team but the D killed us. they got torched at Philly, we were dominating that Giant game and they allowed the game changing and season changing 99 yd TD then in what was a meaningless week 17 game they allowed a 13+ min drive to Matt Moore to blow a 4th qtr lead.
Yeah, most of 2011 we were ok, in 2012 we lost Holmes in September. That's what I mean about pulling the plug after 2012, to me that wasn't enough time considering the line of credit these guys should have afforded themselves with their good seasons, particularly Tannenbaum. Firing him led directly to the end of Sanchez.
Again I'm mixed on Sanchez, I think he got shortchanged in the end here but at the same time he doesn't appear to be as good a QB as we thought he would be.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 02, 2015, 03:45:43 PM
Post by: nyjunc on December 02, 2015, 03:49:15 PM
Sanchez was fine in 2010-11. He wasn't great, he wasn't terrible. He is kind of similar to what Fitz is doing now, though I think Fitz is a little better. But he regressed so much in 2012, and he hadn't been good enough prior to that to earn the job another year. He still should have started in 2013 as Geno clearly was not ready, but he got hurt in preseason, which Rex bears some responsibility for.
he was really good in 2010, in 2011 his #s went up but he wasn't nearly as good.
Post by: Badger on December 02, 2015, 08:54:23 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 02, 2015, 09:41:16 PM
Geno would never disrespect his teammate like that
Post by: Miamipuck on December 02, 2015, 10:14:42 PM
^ classless
Geno would never disrespect his teammate like that
Not true he did disrespect IK's knuckles.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 06, 2015, 08:48:43 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 06, 2015, 08:51:24 PM
I think it's time to consider maybe Fitz can be more than a stopgap for 1 year. I don't mean 8 years or anything, but he could hold the fort for 2-3 years if he stays healthy. It's easy to say that after a game like today, but I've been thinking it for a while now. The guy isn't 40 years old or anything.I'm still far from sold on Fitz as a long-term answer. But I've thought all year that as long as Fitz played well, he's probably the guy next year. It will be hard to find an upgrade - we won't draft high enough. A trade/free agent would likely cost too much, and there's a good chance there isn't an upgrade available in a trade or free agency.
I really wouldn't be surprised if next year features the same QB room as this year does, with Fitz, Geno and Petty.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 06, 2015, 08:52:25 PM
I really wouldn't be surprised if next year features the same QB room as this year does, with Fitz, Geno and Petty.
You're the only one that wants Geno back. He isn't staying after the punch.
Post by: Badger on December 06, 2015, 08:54:29 PM
I really wouldn't be surprised if next year features the same QB room as this year does, with Fitz, Geno and Petty.
If this happens, something has gone wrong.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 06, 2015, 08:54:53 PM
You're the only one that wants Geno back. He isn't staying after the punch.
He is a cheap backup with experience, but he really is a downer here. He needs a new team.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 06, 2015, 08:55:23 PM
Post by: Badger on December 06, 2015, 08:58:51 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 06, 2015, 09:01:25 PM
Fitz is a UFA after the season and there's no reason to not bring him back on a short deal (3 years max). But this team needs to make a serious push to find the long term guy or at least improve the group of QBs on the roster. They can't gamble and let him walk only to come up empty handed in FA and the draft.
He'll stay if he keeps playing this way. He seems to have a great relationship with Gailey and Marshall.
Post by: Coach K on December 06, 2015, 09:06:48 PM
I think you bring him back on a 2 year deal and still draft another prospect if they feel lukewarm on Pettys transition
Fitz is still a stopgap. I'm just comfortable with the idea of him next yesr if he can close out the season at this level of play
Post by: Badger on December 06, 2015, 09:12:19 PM
They have to make a serious choice on where Petty fits into the big picture
I think you bring him back on a 2 year deal and still draft another prospect if they feel lukewarm on Pettys transition
Fitz is still a stopgap. I'm just comfortable with the idea of him next yesr if he can close out the season at this level of play
I agree that two years would be ideal. The first year we should be going in expecting him to start, the second year is just insurance in case we haven't found the next guy yet.
Of course all of this is still premature, there's still at least four games to play that will go a long way toward forming an opinion. It only took about three games for the consensus on Sanchez to go from generally OK to outright dislike.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 06, 2015, 09:13:21 PM
You're the only one that wants Geno back. He isn't staying after the punch.I never said I wanted him back. If we could trade him for a late conditional pick like the Jaguars did with Gabbert, I wouldn't be surprised. I just don't expect the Jets to outright cut him, and I also don't think that would necessarily be prudent, unless they are really confident in Petty.
Agree on the 2-year deal bit. Maybe a 3-year deal with the last year being funny money.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 06, 2015, 09:14:30 PM
Post by: Pope on December 06, 2015, 09:18:04 PM
Post by: Badger on December 06, 2015, 09:27:17 PM
Cutting a shitty player that no one on the team respects isn't prudent?
Trading him would be even better, if possible.
I think he's a better second stringer than many teams have. But he belongs on a team with an established QB so they aren't even entertaining the thought of him being the starter going into the season. At that point he'll being going into his fourth season as a still developmental player - no team trying to make the leap from bad/mediocre to good should be relying on him.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 06, 2015, 09:35:55 PM
They have to make a serious choice on where Petty fits into the big picture
I think you bring him back on a 2 year deal and still draft another prospect if they feel lukewarm on Pettys transition
Fitz is still a stopgap. I'm just comfortable with the idea of him next yesr if he can close out the season at this level of play
Petty will not be in the picture. He was is and will continue to be a project. Best case scenario with him is he competes for the #2 spot next year, and thats probably a stretch.
I think Petty has at minimum one more year as the #3 qb before seriously getting considered for 2 or better
Post by: insanity on December 06, 2015, 09:43:13 PM
Petty will not be in the picture. He was is and will continue to be a project. Best case scenario with him is he competes for the #2 spot next year, and thats probably a stretch.
I think Petty has at minimum one more year as the #3 qb before seriously getting considered for 2 or better
If that's truly the case than we can't draft a qb this year because we won't have a viable back up
Post by: dcm1602 on December 06, 2015, 09:46:32 PM
If that's truly the case than we can't draft a qb this year because we won't have a viable back up
If you draft a QB early he is a viable backup
And if Petty is incredibly raw still (ie no chance of being the #2) we could always practice squad him and go into the season Fitz Geno Rookie
Post by: Heismanberg on December 06, 2015, 10:00:02 PM
If you draft a QB early he is a viable backup
And if Petty is incredibly raw still (ie no chance of being the #2) we could always practice squad him and go into the season Fitz Geno Rookie
You get more retarded with each passing day
Post by: Johnny English on December 06, 2015, 10:02:31 PM
Petty will not be in the picture. He was is and will continue to be a project. Best case scenario with him is he competes for the #2 spot next year, and thats probably a stretch.
I think Petty has at minimum one more year as the #3 qb before seriously getting considered for 2 or better
Why? Why do you think that? What is it about your extensive study of Bryce Petty's performance in training that makes you think that?
Post by: Badger on December 06, 2015, 10:06:18 PM
Why? Why do you think that? What is it about your extensive study of Bryce Petty's performance in training that makes you think that?
His Madden rating is a mere 69.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 06, 2015, 10:07:28 PM
Why? Why do you think that? What is it about your extensive study of Bryce Petty's performance in training that makes you think that?
Whens the last time you saw a QB drafted in the middle rounds go from total project to #2 in a year ?
Post by: Heismanberg on December 06, 2015, 10:14:26 PM
His Madden rating is a mere 69.
But EA thinks he's good enough to give him a customized face.
Peen, Mannion, and Hundley have generic faces.
It is a sign.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 06, 2015, 10:16:00 PM
Whens the last time you saw a QB drafted in the middle rounds go from total project to #2 in a year ?
Why do you keep calling him a project? You don't know excrement about anything, especially football.
Post by: Johnny English on December 06, 2015, 10:16:33 PM
Whens the last time you saw a QB drafted in the middle rounds go from total project to #2 in a year ?
Why have you decided he's a "total project", given we've seen nothing of him other than some pre-season snaps? Who knows how good or how ready he is? He showed some physical ability when we saw him in pre-season, I've no idea how he has progressed since and I doubt you have.
And in answer to your question, 2010.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 06, 2015, 10:25:02 PM
Why do you keep calling him a project? You don't know excrement about anything, especially football.
http://www.ganggreennation.com/2015/11/4/9666934/bryce-petty-the-project
http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2015/05/jets_see_bryce_petty_as_long-term_project_not_imme.html
Quote
Bowles was asked if it was fair to say whether it would take more than a year for Petty to perhaps be in the mix as a potential starter.
"You've got to make progress before you can kind of make those kind of decisions, and we haven't even gotten him here to get him on the field yet," Bowles said. "So I don't know how fast that can happen."
Quote
It would be an awfully big leap of faith to include Petty, a fourth-round pick, in the quarterback conversation for 2016 unless there's evidence he can play at this level.
Quote
http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york-jets/post/_/id/54055/will-rookie-qb-bryce-petty-be-a-heartbreaker-for-the-jets
Its pretty freaking clear that Bryce Petty is a project, anyone who says otherwise is either retarded or just trying to be a contrarian. Obviously none of us know how well he is progressing and its completely possible that hes excelling. But considering where he came from and where hes got to go, hes a long shot to be the #1 or #2 next year.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 06, 2015, 10:26:41 PM
Post by: mj2sexay on December 06, 2015, 10:29:16 PM
His Madden rating is a mere 69.
Hah! The devil my friend is in the details. Bryce has that 88 short accuracy. Dink and dunk fools all day.
Post by: Johnny English on December 06, 2015, 10:31:57 PM
http://www.ganggreennation.com/2015/11/4/9666934/bryce-petty-the-project
http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2015/05/jets_see_bryce_petty_as_long-term_project_not_imme.html
http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york-jets/post/_/id/54055/will-rookie-qb-bryce-petty-be-a-heartbreaker-for-the-jets
Its pretty freaking clear that Bryce Petty is a project, anyone who says otherwise is either retarded or just trying to be a contrarian. Obviously none of us know how well he is progressing and its completely possible that hes excelling. But considering where he came from and where hes got to go, hes a long shot to be the #1 or #2 next year.
So, uh, how does Bowles' non-committal on Petty's ability to be a starter have a bearing on your view that he has "no chance of being the #2"?
Post by: Heismanberg on December 06, 2015, 10:33:00 PM
But considering where he came from
Where did he come from? Please tell us. I guarantee your stupid derriere has no idea what kind of offense Baylor runs. But go ahead and go look it up real quick. Gang Green Nation might help you out there.
You don't know what in the hell you're talking about. He may not be ready to start right now or next year, but he isn't some ridiculously far behind, raw prospect. He has very good physical talent and he's a pretty smart kid. More than capable of being a backup in the NFL at the very least.
Again, shut the freak up about things you don't know anything about.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 06, 2015, 10:35:24 PM
Goodnight
Post by: Tommy on December 06, 2015, 10:35:50 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 06, 2015, 10:37:00 PM
Bump this next offseason
Goodnight
Bump your head into the sharpest knife you can find
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 06, 2015, 11:38:02 PM
He's got a nice ceiling because he's supposedly smart and coachable, he's got a good arm, and he's shown toughness and some mobility. He has most of the raw tools that you look for in a franchise quarterback.
There are two choices the Jets have to make about Petty this offseason.
- Is he still worth developing? (almost certainly)
- Can he be the primary backup next season? (anybody's guess, I would think not)
You resign Fitz, you bring back Petty, and then you decide what you want to do with the other spot.
IMO, without a clear long-term quarterback, we should have 2 of the 3 QB spots devoted to younger quarterbacks who are developing. Petty will be one. Geno is young enough to still be developed, and he's under contract, but he might be damaged goods with this team.
If Petty is ready to be the primary backup, it makes it much easier to move on from Geno, and then you can bring in another QB in the draft. If Petty isn't ready, it makes more sense to keep someone with starting experience like Geno.
Post by: Johnny English on December 06, 2015, 11:40:51 PM
Geno is young enough to still be developed, and he's under contract, but he might be damaged goods with this team.
Might be? I believe that Merriam-Webster are currently planning for their 2016 edition to include a picture of Geno Smith alongside the entry for the term.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 06, 2015, 11:45:14 PM
Anyone coming from that type of offense is a project.
RGIII made a pretty quick transition to the NFL game coming out of that same system. Obviously, things haven't worked out for him in Washington, but injuries had more to do with that than his play.
(I agree that Baylor's offense is very different from an NFL offense)
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 07, 2015, 12:05:08 AM
RGIII made a pretty quick transition to the NFL game coming out of that same system. Obviously, things haven't worked out for him in Washington, but injuries had more to do with that than his play.It seemed like the Redskins completely revamped their offense to work around RG3, particularly his running ability. Petty isn't a good enough prospect to fully commit to doing that with.
(I agree that Baylor's offense is very different from an NFL offense)
I always looked at him spending at least a year and a half on the bench before we considered voluntarily playing him. If he's developing quickly and they think he has a serious chance to play well next year, that's great. I'm just not expecting that.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 07, 2015, 12:16:16 AM
It seemed like the Redskins completely revamped their offense to work around RG3, particularly his running ability. Petty isn't a good enough prospect to fully commit to doing that with.
The NFL coverages and blitzes Griffin faced and the route concepts are still the same though. Making progressions is the biggest issue coming out of an Air Raid offense like that. It's a little more advanced than what Holgorsen does at WVU though.
We're running an offensive that is shotgun-heavy with a lot of five wide sets. Formations that Petty has experience in.
If he's able to sit behind Fitzpatrick for another season in 2016, I think he'll be mentally ready to be serviceable player. That doesn't mean we won't try to upgrade the position.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 07, 2015, 12:18:33 AM
If he's able to sit behind Fitzpatrick for another season in 2016, I think he'll be mentally ready to be serviceable player. That doesn't mean we won't try to upgrade the position.Absolutely. 2 years on the bench with Fitzpatrick should really help him out. After that, he should be ready to contribute as a backup or maybe even a starter.
Post by: nyjunc on December 07, 2015, 07:12:07 AM
Post by: MBGreen on December 07, 2015, 08:18:42 AM
I am so glad I was dead wrong on fitz, the man has been amazing.
Quoted because junc.
Post by: Badger on December 07, 2015, 11:03:37 AM
I was dead wrong
Post by: bojanglesman on December 07, 2015, 11:14:47 AM
I was dead wrong.
(http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/whaaa.gif)
Post by: Coach K on December 07, 2015, 11:19:33 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 07, 2015, 03:23:27 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on December 07, 2015, 08:20:42 PM
Baylor runs a pro-style but not really offense.
This is the smartest post in this thread so far
Post by: Tommy on December 07, 2015, 09:58:41 PM
This is the smartest post in this thread so far
Wtf. I don't remember typing that at all.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 08, 2015, 05:24:47 AM
Wtf. I don't remember typing that at all.
I always knew autocorrect was smarter than you
Post by: bojanglesman on December 08, 2015, 06:03:22 AM
Wtf. I don't remember typing that at all.Might wanna cut back a pound or 2 of coke.
Post by: insanity on December 08, 2015, 07:32:11 AM
Might wanna cut back a pound or 2 of coke.
Coke is measure in kilos, you noob
Post by: bojanglesman on December 08, 2015, 07:36:45 AM
Coke is measure in kilos, you noobOk. Cut back 2.2 pounds.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 08, 2015, 08:22:43 AM
Ok. Cut back 2.2 pounds.
You say "Key", as in " I need to sell a key to kickstart my veterinary practice" you don't say I need 2.2 pounds.......... must we teach you everything you freaking noob.
Post by: Badger on December 08, 2015, 11:13:32 AM
Post by: insanity on December 08, 2015, 11:21:36 AM
Fitz was nominated for the FedEx Noob of the week.
FYP
Post by: bojanglesman on December 08, 2015, 11:23:14 AM
Post by: Johnny English on December 08, 2015, 12:00:33 PM
Fitz was nominated for the FedEx Air Player of the week.
Cam had five passing TDs (and a pick) and Roethlisberger had four TDs. Both had higher ratings than Fitz. It's nice for him to be nominated but I doubt he wins it.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 08, 2015, 02:10:13 PM
Cam had five passing TDs (and a pick) and Roethlisberger had four TDs. Both had higher ratings than Fitz. It's nice for him to be nominated but I doubt he wins it.
Not to mention they both have name power behind them. I honestly doubt anyone outside of NYJ fans give two fucks about Fitz.
Post by: Badger on December 08, 2015, 09:08:42 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on December 08, 2015, 09:12:19 PM
http://pro32.ap.org/article/fitzpatrick-marshall-tag-teaming-jets-playoff-push
My first response was that its freaking crazy neither ever made the playoffs. But Fitz (who historically isnt a good QB)) not so surprising. Its really surprising with Marshall though. Because not only is he an elite player at some key positions, hes also played on some good teams as well
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 09, 2015, 03:08:14 AM
Post by: Badger on December 09, 2015, 05:23:58 AM
My first response was that its freaking crazy neither ever made the playoffs. But Fitz (who historically isnt a good QB)) not so surprising. Its really surprising with Marshall though. Because not only is he an elite player at some key positions, hes also played on some good teams as well
Look at who their respective head coaches were. Not exactly perennial contenders.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 09, 2015, 11:09:30 AM
This is the best supporting cast he's had. It's hard to imagine how many sacks our offensive line would've given up if Geno Smith was back there. Fitzpatrick's ability in the pocket is easily his best attribute.
Post by: Murrell2878 on December 09, 2015, 11:34:48 AM
I am so glad I was dead wrong on fitz, the man has been amazing.
Kiss of death? You said the same thing after Favre beat the Pats then --minus the Ten game -- it all went downhill.....
Post by: Pope on December 09, 2015, 11:38:20 AM
Post by: nyjunc on December 09, 2015, 02:17:37 PM
Kiss of death? You said the same thing after Favre beat the Pats then --minus the Ten game -- it all went downhill.....
I did and I turned out to be right on Favre but Fitz has played so much better than favre '08. Favre had 3-4 good games in '08 but we were 8-3 then he reverted back to early season form and we watched Chad lead a team half as talented to a div title. I am much more confident in Fitz based on how he has played this year than Favre '08.
Post by: JFIF on December 09, 2015, 02:21:30 PM
It's kind of poetic if you think about it. Fitzpatrick and Brandon Marshall are two of the best journeyman players in the NFL.
journeyman are expendable. Marshall has been an all pro type player for the past 7 years or so.
Fitz is definitely a journeyman
Post by: JFIF on December 09, 2015, 02:26:06 PM
Fitzpatrick is underrated as hell as a QB in the NFL. He's had some up-and-down seasons, but for a dude that is not the most physically gifted player at the position, he's done a lot of good things for a number of bad football teams. It isn't all about statistics. His teammates always love him. He can make some bad teams somewhat competitive in different ways.
This is the best supporting cast he's had. It's hard to imagine how many sacks our offensive line would've given up if Geno Smith was back there. Fitzpatrick's ability in the pocket is easily his best attribute.
This is really romanticizing Fitz. He's been incredibly average,sometimes below average for his career. He is what he is, which is below average to average as a QB. The sample size is very large on his play. The narrative that he somehow helped all these bad teams is just fluff and isn't tangible. That's not something you could possibly know unless you were actually in the locker rooms. I don't think anyone underrates him. I think the analysis on Fitz is pretty reasonable and level.
I'm glad he is playing well and he's average enough to win some games with this supporting cast, which is what this team needs given Geno's tendency to make really stupid mistakes.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 09, 2015, 02:31:54 PM
Post by: Pope on December 09, 2015, 02:35:34 PM
The best compliment I can give Fitz: I don't remember the last time I was anywhere near this confident when a pass left a Jets QBs hand. For the last 6 years, I'm just waiting for a pick-6 on every pass.This is essentially it. Fitz by comparison to his predecessors makes him look even better
Post by: Heismanberg on December 09, 2015, 02:38:28 PM
That's not something you could possibly know unless you were actually in the locker rooms.
What does him playing well (Buffalo, Houston, Tennessee) on some bad teams have to do with being in the locker room?
If he was below average, he wouldn't have received so many shots to start games in this league. He is a pretty good player and he's proved that for a number of teams.
Post by: nyjunc on December 09, 2015, 02:43:28 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 09, 2015, 02:45:54 PM
he played so well he is on his 6th-7th team. He's playing well this year especially since the early struggles but there's a reason he's bounced around the league.
There's also a reason why he's started for so many teams.
Post by: nyjunc on December 09, 2015, 03:07:33 PM
There's also a reason why he's started for so many teams.
injuries.
I don't want to knock the guy, he's playing really well for us. I love this offense, first time I can say that in a long time.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 09, 2015, 03:24:09 PM
injuries.
I don't want to knock the guy, he's playing really well for us. I love this offense, first time I can say that in a long time.
You'll find a way to knock him no matter what. You admitted you were wrong. Take your damn seat and stay there.
Post by: nyjunc on December 09, 2015, 03:31:11 PM
You'll find a way to knock him no matter what. You admitted you were wrong. Take your damn seat and stay there.
that doesn't mean I was wrong the 1st qtr of the season or for his career. he has played really well for us since October but he hasn't been a good QB in this league previously. sorry you don't like to deal in reality, now you are going to pretend like he is Rich gannon.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 09, 2015, 03:40:49 PM
Vinny came here as a backup at 35 and it turned out to be the perfect situation for him, revived his career and he played another 5-6 years even after the Achilles.
Post by: nyjunc on December 09, 2015, 03:53:10 PM
Fitz has shown flashes, just hasn't sustained it. In Buffalo they gave him a big contract mid season when they were 5-1 or whatever it was, last year he was doing well and broke his leg. Now he's playing well again, it's not like he's been garbage his whole career and the light went on, could be a natural progression and everything falling into place.
Vinny came here as a backup at 35 and it turned out to be the perfect situation for him, revived his career and he played another 5-6 years even after the Achilles.
his #s were skewed by the 6 TD game. they were 6-6 w/ him and 3-1 w/o him.
Vinny had success elsewhere, he helped Cle get to the playoffs and was a pro bowl QB. people just thought he was too old. He was also a #1 overall pick and was one of the most physically gifted passers of all time.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 09, 2015, 04:10:06 PM
now you are going to pretend like he is Rich gannon.
Who are you to say that he can't turn out the same way that Gannon did?
Post by: dcm1602 on December 09, 2015, 04:12:01 PM
The best compliment I can give Fitz: I don't remember the last time I was anywhere near this confident when a pass left a Jets QBs hand. For the last 6 years, I'm just waiting for a pick-6 on every pass.
Even his deep ball?
Post by: nyjunc on December 09, 2015, 04:17:33 PM
Who are you to say that he can't turn out the same way that Gannon did?
I hope he does but 6 good games is a little early to make that proclamation.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 09, 2015, 04:21:47 PM
I hope he does but 6 good games is a little early to make that proclamation.
Rich Gannon was efficient. He didn't put up huge numbers. All we need is for Fitzpatrick to keep taking care of the football.
If our OL improves and the running game gets a little more consistent, then it's not hard to see him doing well for another season or two.
Post by: nyjunc on December 09, 2015, 04:24:46 PM
Rich Gannon was efficient. He didn't put up huge numbers. All we need is for Fitzpatrick to keep taking care of the football.
If our OL improves and the running game gets a little more consistent, then it's not hard to see him doing well for another season or two.
Gannon was the best QB in the league for a couple of years. He won an NFL MVP award, was a 2 time 1st team all pro and led a team to the SB. he threw for 4700 yds in 2002.
can he do well? yes, can he be Rich gannon? I'd love to see it but I wouldn't hold out hope for that.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 09, 2015, 04:52:08 PM
Gannon was the best QB in the league for a couple of years. He won an NFL MVP award, was a 2 time 1st team all pro and led a team to the SB. he threw for 4700 yds in 2002.
can he do well? yes, can he be Rich gannon? I'd love to see it but I wouldn't hold out hope for that.
Fitz was nominated for the Fedex air player of the week. He pretty much is Rich Gannon
Post by: bojanglesman on December 09, 2015, 05:43:37 PM
Even his deep ball?
At worst it usually floats harmlessly to the turf. Usually.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 09, 2015, 08:56:55 PM
Stephen Hill can be Calvin Johnson.
Geno Smith can be Aaron Rodgers.
Dee Milliner can be Darrelle Revis.
Rontez Miles can be Ed Reed.
Quincy Enunwa can be Anquan Boldin,
I mean why not?
Post by: Badger on December 09, 2015, 09:41:16 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 09, 2015, 09:42:44 PM
Fitzpatrick can be Rich Gannon.
Stephen Hill can be Calvin Johnson.
Geno Smith can be Aaron Rodgers.
Dee Milliner can be Darrelle Revis.
Rontez Miles can be Ed Reed.
Quincy Enunwa can be Anquan Boldin,
I mean why not?
Derek Smalls can be Petrozza's ball washer
Post by: Heismanberg on December 09, 2015, 09:45:12 PM
He was a journeyman that finally found the right fit and did well for a few years.
Post by: nyjunc on December 10, 2015, 08:40:44 AM
Rice was at the end of his career, Brandon Marshall is better than Rice in oak or Brown.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 10, 2015, 10:22:35 AM
Gannon was special in Oakland.
...no. He was extremely efficient and he was a smart enough to operate Gruden's scheme.
Rice on his last leg was still a great player. So was Tim Brown. He had Andre Rison for a little while too.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 10, 2015, 10:40:00 AM
For example, in his 2nd-best season in 2001, he was the only QB with a 3-1 TD-Int ratio and 1 of 4 with a 2-1 TD-Int ratio. This year, 9 QBs have a 3-1 ratio and 19 have a 2-1 ratio.
In his best season in 2002, Gannon averaged 7.6 yards per attempt, 3rd in the NFL. Today, he would rank 10th in that category.
Maybe I overrated Rich Gannon in my original post, but the new rules have redefined what a great QB is statistically.
My main point is expecting a 33-year old to suddenly turn into a top-5 quarterback, which Gannon was for a 2-3 year span, is extremely unlikely. For every Rich Gannon, there are 50 quarterbacks that age that don't have a late-career resurgence.
Fitz is playing the best of his career, but he's not a top-5 quarterback like Gannon turned into, and it's a huge leap to think he ever will be one.
Post by: nyjunc on December 10, 2015, 10:59:09 AM
...no. He was extremely efficient and he was a smart enough to operate Gruden's scheme.
Rice on his last leg was still a great player. So was Tim Brown. He had Andre Rison for a little while too.
you clearly don't remember him in Oakland, he was special there and while Rice could still play he wasn't the jerry Rice we all remember in SF.
Andre Rison? seriously?
Tim Brown was a top WR. Doesn't change the fact of how great Gannon was in those years.
Post by: Tommy on December 10, 2015, 11:26:03 AM
Post by: nyjunc on December 10, 2015, 12:03:35 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on December 10, 2015, 12:05:59 PM
Gannon was 1st team all pro in 200 and 2002. Peyton was already an established top QB and favre was still in his prime yet Gannon was 1st team AP 2 of 3 years. that kind of tells us all we need to know.
Is 1802 years between all pro teams the record? That's a pretty big gap.
Post by: nyjunc on December 10, 2015, 12:15:23 PM
Is 1802 years between all pro teams the record? That's a pretty big gap.
I think that proves his greatness ;D
Post by: Miamipuck on December 10, 2015, 12:17:12 PM
I think that proves his greatness ;D
That certainly goes a long way. lol
Post by: sg3 on December 10, 2015, 01:44:35 PM
Sent from my LG-H811 using Tapatalk
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 10, 2015, 01:56:40 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on December 10, 2015, 06:05:05 PM
Fitz, if nothing else, is the best leader at the QB position this team has had since at least Pennington. It's not a tangible thing, but it's underrated. Marshall and Decker seem to adore him. Apart from any comparisons, it's just nice to finally have a guy back there who I don't feel is one brain fart away from throwing away a game.
I havent heard a single thing about Fitz having west coast summer minicamps at his parents house with foodtrucks and excrement
Post by: Pope on December 10, 2015, 07:16:55 PM
Post by: Badger on December 10, 2015, 10:24:24 PM
Post by: MoreCharacters on December 10, 2015, 11:08:06 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 12, 2015, 07:29:12 PM
good news
Post by: Libero_2 on December 12, 2015, 07:53:42 PM
Hell if he throws 8 INTs and 1 TD over the final 4 weeks, he won't end up being retained
Post by: Heismanberg on December 13, 2015, 03:05:51 PM
Post by: Tommy on December 13, 2015, 03:16:48 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 13, 2015, 03:26:07 PM
What's his stats so far this season after today?
Don't feel like adding up the yardage, but he has over 3000 yards with 25 TDs and 11 INTs.
Post by: Tommy on December 13, 2015, 03:27:41 PM
Don't feel like adding up the yardage, but he has over 3000 yards with 25 TDs and 11 INTs.
That's unreal. For a Jets QB.
Post by: insanity on December 13, 2015, 03:30:15 PM
That's unreal. For a Jets QB.
If Geno had a chance he would be just as good.
Post by: Tommy on December 13, 2015, 03:30:40 PM
If Geno had a chance he would be just as good.
Oh for sure.
Post by: MBGreen on December 13, 2015, 03:31:10 PM
Don't feel like adding up the yardage, but he has over 3000 yards with 25 TDs and 11 INTs.Tight numbers.
And a pleasant surprise, because none of us could've predicted Fitz to be this efficient at the beginning of the season.
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Post by: Heismanberg on December 13, 2015, 03:31:12 PM
If Geno had a chance he would be just as good.
The broken play to Marshall for the long TD never happens if Geno Smith is on the field. He'd probably get the snap and try to scramble.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 13, 2015, 03:31:41 PM
And a pleasant surprise, because none of us could've predicted Fitz to be this efficient at the beginning of the season.
o rly
Post by: reuben on December 13, 2015, 03:32:02 PM
Don't feel like adding up the yardage, but he has over 3000 yards with 25 TDs and 11 INTs.
Geno Smith would have added up the yardage.
Post by: MBGreen on December 13, 2015, 03:32:46 PM
o rly
(https://media.giphy.com/media/l41lIkTqv4NTHPktO/giphy.gif)
Post by: Heismanberg on December 13, 2015, 03:35:01 PM
Geno Smith would have added up the yardage.
Geno Smith would have subtracted the yardage
Post by: MBGreen on December 13, 2015, 03:36:39 PM
Post by: Badger on December 13, 2015, 06:53:19 PM
Post by: insanity on December 13, 2015, 07:48:20 PM
Tight numbers.
And a pleasant surprise, because none of us could've predicted Fitz to be this efficient at the beginning of the season.
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(https://media.riffsy.com/images/dda4afbd1514da0f6b0aef6d33ddd65b/raw)
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 13, 2015, 08:27:09 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 13, 2015, 08:59:44 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 14, 2015, 10:54:18 AM
Fitz has been very solid, but it helps to have the best receiving duo in Jets history.
Having Marshall and Decker is certainly helpful and would make any QB perform better, but it's time to start giving credit where due: Fitzpatrick himself is elevating the play of the offense.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 14, 2015, 11:09:17 AM
Having Marshall and Decker is certainly helpful and would make any QB perform better, but it's time to start giving credit where due: Fitzpatrick himself is elevating the play of the offense.I said he's been very solid. He's going to have statistically one of the best years in Jets history by a quarterback. It's a very low bar to climb, but he's played well. I've said all year he's been our best QB since Favre in 2008. Might have to adjust that to Pennington in 2002, assuming Fitz doesn't revert back to Bills/Texans game Fitz.
Post by: Coach K on December 14, 2015, 03:53:16 PM
I said he's been very solid. He's going to have statistically one of the best years in Jets history by a quarterback. It's a very low bar to climb, but he's played well. I've said all year he's been our best QB since Favre in 2008. Might have to adjust that to Pennington in 2002, assuming Fitz doesn't revert back to Bills/Texans game Fitz.
Bills one yeah.
Texans game. No sir. He's never in the position to make those bad throws if the WRS would've caught anything the previous 55 minutes lol
I only stress it because watching the drops in person was an extra kick to the nuts
Post by: nyjunc on December 14, 2015, 04:56:59 PM
I said he's been very solid. He's going to have statistically one of the best years in Jets history by a quarterback. It's a very low bar to climb, but he's played well. I've said all year he's been our best QB since Favre in 2008. Might have to adjust that to Pennington in 2002, assuming Fitz doesn't revert back to Bills/Texans game Fitz.
he's been light years better than favre, the best QB season since Chad '04 was Sanchez 2010. statistically he has blown by that but mark was vital in so many late game comebacks and helped us win 11 games and get back to the title game. we get to the playoffs and compete and I will move it past Mark 2010 and into Chad 2004 territory but he's not close to Chad '02 or Vinny '98.
Post by: Pope on December 14, 2015, 05:08:50 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on December 14, 2015, 05:36:56 PM
I know he's not the long term answer, but excrement in the present he has been nothing short of fantastic.
If the moves the coaching staff made solidify special teams, the Jets will be a tough team to beat.
Post by: Tommy on December 14, 2015, 07:12:48 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on December 14, 2015, 08:39:51 PM
Im all for keeping Fitz and developing two QBs behind him (one being Petty)
And hoping one of them eventually becomes a starter
Post by: Heismanberg on December 14, 2015, 08:54:24 PM
I just hope what happened with Fitz in Buffalo doesnt repeat itself (give him a contract and he becomes hot excrement again)
Im all for keeping Fitz and developing two QBs behind him (one being Petty)
And hoping one of them eventually becomes a starter
Shut the freak up
Post by: Johnny English on December 14, 2015, 08:59:33 PM
There's a massive anomaly in the QB room that needs to find a new job next summer though.
Post by: Pope on December 14, 2015, 09:00:12 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 15, 2015, 09:49:41 AM
To be fair to dcm, and I know it's not a thing we like to be, if Petty is going to become an NFL QB then Fitz is exactly the sort of guy he should be learning from.
There's a massive anomaly in the QB room that needs to find a new job next summer though.
100% agree.
I'm completely on the "bring Fitz back" bandwagon. The key for me with Fitzpatrick was always whether he'd stay healthy. Granted, he's had a pretty major injury, but he's completely fought through it.
Post by: nyjunc on December 15, 2015, 10:08:30 AM
I highly doubt we'd give Fitz a big contract. If anything it would be a short term deal with incentives
I don't think we can give him a big contract and it would be very dangerous to give him one.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 15, 2015, 10:16:28 AM
That said there's no way in God's green earth he's getting a huge contract off of this one year.
Post by: guinness77 on December 15, 2015, 11:04:20 AM
Saying that. Guy's been a warrior, has obviously performed above and beyond what anybody thought in training camp and is obviously a popular guy amongst his teammates. I'm all for keeping him. freak Geno, draft another guy (especially if he's BPA) and groom Petty.
I'd, ideally, like to see two years guaranteed with a mutually agreed upon 3rd, but I wouldn't be upset if all 3 were guaranteed.
Post by: Murrell2878 on December 15, 2015, 11:14:43 AM
Post by: Murrell2878 on December 15, 2015, 11:16:22 AM
Post by: nyjunc on December 15, 2015, 11:30:58 AM
And it's amazing that he could very well end up breaking Jets QB records and all of this became possible because Geno wouldn't pay $600 and ended up getting knocked the freak out! Simply amazing.... But that's the Jets for you!! :)
I know Geno was having a good camp but I wonder if Fitz would have beat him out anyway?
Post by: Miamipuck on December 15, 2015, 11:47:09 AM
Post by: Johnny English on December 15, 2015, 11:55:12 AM
I can't imagine from the system Bowles likes, good defense and solid offense (not a lot of turnovers) I would bet my left nut Geno would be in similar circumstances and Fitz would be where he is regardless. But thank goodness we didn't test the validity of that hypothesis.
(http://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/61674424.jpg)
Post by: ukilledkenny on December 15, 2015, 02:08:00 PM
Yeah, me neither.
I do wish we didn't have to have that whole situation and Fitz could have just beat him out in the normal way but whatever.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 15, 2015, 03:18:48 PM
You guys aren't even going to consider that Geno might have had an even better year than Fitz?
Yeah, me neither.
I do wish we didn't have to have that whole situation and Fitz could have just beat him out in the normal way but whatever.
The problem with that is: had it played out, maybe Geno gets the first few starts back in September and we lose to the Browns, Colts or Phins early. If we had lost any of those, we'd be all but out of the playoff hunt today.
Plus, Fitz would've taken longer to gel into the offense--while games counted.
Post by: nyjunc on December 15, 2015, 03:28:05 PM
The problem with that is: had it played out, maybe Geno gets the first few starts back in September and we lose to the Browns, Colts or Phins early. If we had lost any of those, we'd be all but out of the playoff hunt today.
Plus, Fitz would've taken longer to gel into the offense--while games counted.
let's not forget Fitz wasn't playing well early, chances are we beat those teams no matter who was at QB.
Post by: Johnny English on December 15, 2015, 03:37:55 PM
let's not forget Fitz wasn't playing well early, chances are we beat those teams no matter who was at QB.
In which case Geno wouldn't have lost the job, and we'd not be 8-5 now.
It's all ifs, buts and maybes, but the fact is that Ik is our season MVP, as sg3 (RIP) has been saying.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 15, 2015, 03:49:40 PM
Speculating on our record with Geno instead of Fitz is pure guesswork, but I would guess we'd be 7-6 with Geno. Don't think we would have beaten the Giants. Every other game, I think we would have won.
Post by: nyjunc on December 15, 2015, 03:58:12 PM
The thing with Geno is that people who wanted him to play were hoping he'd take a big step forward with a much improved supporting cast, similar to how Fitzpatrick has improved with the best supporting cast in his career. That's why I was in favor of Geno being the starter in the preseason. Even though I didn't have much faith in Geno, I didn't want to completely give up on a 24 year old with physical talent who played his best football in the last few games we had seen him.
Speculating on our record with Geno instead of Fitz is pure guesswork, but I would guess we'd be 7-6 with Geno. Don't think we would have beaten the Giants. Every other game, I think we would have won.
it's hard to say where we'd be, maybe we score more early against the Giants and beat them? maybe we turn it over and get killed? we don't know.
Post by: Johnny English on December 15, 2015, 04:19:14 PM
The thing with Geno is that people who wanted him to play were hoping he'd take a big step forward with a much improved supporting cast, similar to how Fitzpatrick has improved with the best supporting cast in his career. That's why I was in favor of Geno being the starter in the preseason. Even though I didn't have much faith in Geno, I didn't want to completely give up on a 24 year old with physical talent who played his best football in the last few games we had seen him.
Speculating on our record with Geno instead of Fitz is pure guesswork, but I would guess we'd be 7-6 with Geno. Don't think we would have beaten the Giants. Every other game, I think we would have won.
I disagree entirely. It has nothing to do with his physical talents and everything to do with the locker room. This team is playing for Fitz because he's a leader and it's abundantly clear in every interview and press conference how the team feels about Fitz. The punch didn't lose Geno the job, his lack of maturity and leadership did; it caused the punch, but if it wasn't that it would have been something else.
You think the offensive line wants to play for Geno the way it has for Fitz? You think the defense goes back on the field feeling the same way when the QB they're putting out there is likely to give them a short field to work with within the next five minutes? This is a team transformed, and it's as much by subtraction of Geno as it is addition of Fitz.
Geno Smith needs to leave this club. The moment he comes back in will be a complete deflation of the team spirit, we already saw that once this season. No more please.
Post by: Tommy on December 15, 2015, 04:29:26 PM
I disagree entirely. It has nothing to do with his physical talents and everything to do with the locker room. This team is playing for Fitz because he's a leader and it's abundantly clear in every interview and press conference how the team feels about Fitz. The punch didn't lose Geno the job, his lack of maturity and leadership did; it caused the punch, but if it wasn't that it would have been something else.
You think the offensive line wants to play for Geno the way it has for Fitz? You think the defense goes back on the field feeling the same way when the QB they're putting out there is likely to give them a short field to work with within the next five minutes? This is a team transformed, and it's as much by subtraction of Geno as it is addition of Fitz.
Geno Smith needs to leave this club. The moment he comes back in will be a complete deflation of the team spirit, we already saw that once this season. No more please.
To be fair it's tough to say that Fitz transformed the team when the team was already transformed before training camp even started. We really don't know what would've come out of Geno starting, and I'm fine with the results so far because I seriously doubt that our record and chances of winning would be any higher.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 15, 2015, 05:01:45 PM
I disagree entirely. It has nothing to do with his physical talents and everything to do with the locker room. This team is playing for Fitz because he's a leader and it's abundantly clear in every interview and press conference how the team feels about Fitz. The punch didn't lose Geno the job, his lack of maturity and leadership did; it caused the punch, but if it wasn't that it would have been something else.The team clearly loves Fitz. But saying that the offensive line doesn't want to work as hard when Geno is on the field, and that the defense doesn't want to play as hard are completely made-up reasons. You really think Darrelle Revis isn't covering someone as hard, or Sheldon Richardson isn't going to try to beat his man because Geno is in at QB instead of Fitz? And the one game this year Geno played, we were so banged up that Wesley Johnson and Kenbrell Thompkins played almost every snap. It's unfortunate that players decided they would rather get injured rather than play with Geno.
You think the offensive line wants to play for Geno the way it has for Fitz? You think the defense goes back on the field feeling the same way when the QB they're putting out there is likely to give them a short field to work with within the next five minutes? This is a team transformed, and it's as much by subtraction of Geno as it is addition of Fitz.
Geno Smith needs to leave this club. The moment he comes back in will be a complete deflation of the team spirit, we already saw that once this season. No more please.
And if you're using a short field argument, the Jets have had MORE 3-and-outs this year than they did last year through the same number of games...
Post by: Libero_2 on December 15, 2015, 05:05:05 PM
The team clearly loves Fitz. But saying that the offensive line doesn't want to work as hard when Geno is on the field, and that the defense doesn't want to play as hard are completely made-up reasons. You really think Darrelle Revis isn't covering someone as hard, or Sheldon Richardson isn't going to try to beat his man because Geno is in at QB instead of Fitz? And the one game this year Geno played, we were so banged up that Wesley Johnson and Kenbrell Thompkins played almost every snap. It's unfortunate that players decided they would rather get injured rather than play with Geno.
And if you're using a short field argument, the Jets have had MORE 3-and-outs this year than they did last year through the same number of games...
The short field argument is about turnovers. Yes we have more 3 and outs, but we have to be on pace for at least 10 less turnovers as well. Probably more than that
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 15, 2015, 05:05:58 PM
And it's amazing that he could very well end up breaking Jets QB records and all of this became possible because Geno wouldn't pay $600 and ended up getting knocked the freak out! Simply amazing.... But that's the Jets for you!! :)That's the lack of maturity. No one will know the full story behind that, and I hate the idea of blaming the victim in this scenario. But clearly Geno did something that caused IK to punch him in the face, and that shows immaturity. If IK didn't punch Geno in the face, there's a good chance he's still the starter. Maybe Geno ends up doing something else down the line, but I think Bowles runs a much tighter ship. Look at Calvin Pryor the last 2 seasons.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 15, 2015, 05:06:49 PM
The short field argument is about turnovers. Yes we have more 3 and outs, but we have to be on pace for at least 10 less turnovers as well. Probably more than thatJets have 19 turnovers this year. Through 13 games last season, the Jets had 22 turnovers.
Post by: Libero_2 on December 15, 2015, 06:20:32 PM
Jets have 19 turnovers this year. Through 13 games last season, the Jets had 22 turnovers.
Out of curiosity, how many of those TOs came from the QB position vs. other players?
This years it's felt like we have had more fumbles from non QBs than in the past.
Either way, it feels like the number of TOs has been far better, probably because of the many TOs we have, most of them have come late in games when it's basically already over, instead of when the game was still in doubt.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 15, 2015, 06:54:44 PM
Out of curiosity, how many of those TOs came from the QB position vs. other players?This year: Fitz has 12, Geno has 1, everyone else has 6.
This years it's felt like we have had more fumbles from non QBs than in the past.
Either way, it feels like the number of TOs has been far better, probably because of the many TOs we have, most of them have come late in games when it's basically already over, instead of when the game was still in doubt.
Last year: Geno had 14, Vick had 4, everyone 4.
Turnovers in 1-score games through 13 games:
- This year: Fitz: 8, all other players: 4 (not Geno)
- Last year: Geno: 9, all other players: 3 (not Vick)
Post by: MexJetinBcn on December 15, 2015, 07:21:09 PM
Post by: Johnny English on December 15, 2015, 07:22:24 PM
The team clearly loves Fitz. But saying that the offensive line doesn't want to work as hard when Geno is on the field, and that the defense doesn't want to play as hard are completely made-up reasons. You really think Darrelle Revis isn't covering someone as hard, or Sheldon Richardson isn't going to try to beat his man because Geno is in at QB instead of Fitz? And the one game this year Geno played, we were so banged up that Wesley Johnson and Kenbrell Thompkins played almost every snap. It's unfortunate that players decided they would rather get injured rather than play with Geno.
And if you're using a short field argument, the Jets have had MORE 3-and-outs this year than they did last year through the same number of games...
I think that while players will still give their best effort regardless of who is under center, they will inevitably play a lot better when the team is pulling together and clicking. I think it has been clear at times, both with Geno and with Sanchez, that the defense has become quite frustrated with repeatedly being put into difficult positions and asked to rescue the offense. I think it's very obvious that the playcalling on both sides of the ball is very different when you have to account for the quarterback's consistent failure to read, communicate and execute. And I think that all of that inevitably translates to the mood of the locker room, to the cohesiveness and effectiveness of the team, and to the commitment to excellence that becomes second nature when you're part of a team that you believe in.
I can not see a single reason why Geno Smith should ever wear a Jets jersey again, barring an injury to Fitz in the next three games. When this season is done, he should be out of the door.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on December 15, 2015, 08:06:16 PM
2015: Fitzpatrick's INTs
On passes shorter than 10 yards: 1
From 11 to 20: 3
From 21 to 30: 1
More than 31: 6
On our own 1-20: 0
Own 21-50: 5
Opp 49-20: 6
Opp 19-1: 0
2014: Geno's INTs
On passes shorter than 10 yards: 6
From 11 to 20: 2
From 21 to 30: 2
More than 31: 1
On our own 1-20: 4
Own 21-50: 6
Opp 49-20: 2
Opp 19-1: 1
Of course, I would need to cross-check both tables but at first glance, Fitz's INTs have all came outside of 20s and mostly after his passes traveled more than 31 yards, which amounts to a short punts. Geno's, on the other hand, came mostly on dump-offs (how could he manage to do that?) and almost all of them in our own half (4 in our own 20). It's a huge, huge, difference.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 15, 2015, 08:47:41 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on December 15, 2015, 09:04:20 PM
It's not the fact that the players will dog it when they have a teammate they won't respect, it brings an air of divisiveness. Nfl teams need to be cohesive units, successful plays are a coordination of all eleven players doing their job as one. When you have a QB they don't respect, that doesn't recognize situations, isn't a leader, the unit lacks cohesion and breaks down. That happens despite the team giving maximum effort.
Here's a what if, that I think is valid:
Maybe Geno doesn't recognize the proper protection as well as Fitz, that causes more holding penalties.
Geno holds the ball longer, more holding calls.
Who knows maybe Fitz's attention to detail helps in other areas like penalties, where the Jets are #2 in the league, meaning second least penalised team in the entire league.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 15, 2015, 09:17:43 PM
Post by: MexJetinBcn on December 15, 2015, 09:22:38 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 15, 2015, 09:24:25 PM
I can't deal with that excrement.
Post by: Johnny English on December 15, 2015, 09:58:00 PM
I have a headache and I don't want to sift through this, but can someone tell me if Derek Smalls is dick-riding Geno Smith again?
I can't deal with that excrement.
I wouldn't say he's dick-riding him. I just don't think he's putting the boot in sufficiently hard.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 15, 2015, 09:59:39 PM
I wouldn't say he's dick-riding him. I just don't think he's putting the boot in sufficiently hard.
If he still thinks that Geno Smith would have similar numbers to Fitzpatrick's then he is dick-riding.
Post by: Pope on December 15, 2015, 11:10:52 PM
I think the eye test is the best gauge at the moment because there are so many variables this year between the OL injuries (specifically Mangold), change in coaching staff, personnel additions both offensively and defensively, as well as strength of schedule.
At the end of the day Fitz has proven that he deserves to start at QB for the time being. Could Geno have played comparably with all things being equal.. maybe but based on his resume and the game he spot started in this year I'm confidently going to say no.
The Jets should roll with Fitz as the starting QB until 2017 in hope of someone being groomed to replace him.
Post by: JFIF on December 15, 2015, 11:35:54 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 16, 2015, 02:52:27 AM
Way less than that, I'd think 3 years, 21 millionFitz is a legit NFL starting quarterback coming off back-to-back years where he's posted 42 Pass TD and 19 Int. Legit NFL starting quarterbacks make more than $7M a year. He's a flawed quarterback, but he's played well enough where I think $7M is on the low side. Of course, some of the money will be fake, just like in most contracts.
The one thing that could keep his price down is that some of the teams that still need quarterbacks have already employed Fitz. Cleveland, St. Louis and San Francisco could all use a guy like Fitz.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on December 16, 2015, 06:42:49 AM
Fitz is a legit NFL starting quarterback coming off back-to-back years where he's posted 42 Pass TD and 19 Int. Legit NFL starting quarterbacks make more than $7M a year. He's a flawed quarterback, but he's played well enough where I think $7M is on the low side. Of course, some of the money will be fake, just like in most contracts.
The one thing that could keep his price down is that some of the teams that still need quarterbacks have already employed Fitz. Cleveland, St. Louis and San Francisco could all use a guy like Fitz.
He has just been a starter for a full year (with us), and he lost his job in Houston (unfairly, probably). A reserve in the NFL makes 4 million a year, a solid starter makes 10. For me, 7-8 looks like market price.
Post by: insanity on December 16, 2015, 07:19:12 AM
Good QBs get paid lots of money
Fitz doesn't get paid lots of money
∴ Fitz isn't a good QB
Post by: Coach K on December 16, 2015, 07:30:38 AM
If we can't find his replacement going into the final year, shame on Duff
Post by: Coach K on December 16, 2015, 07:32:57 AM
Fitz is a legit NFL starting quarterback coming off back-to-back years where he's posted 42 Pass TD and 19 Int. Legit NFL starting quarterbacks make more than $7M a year. He's a flawed quarterback, but he's played well enough where I think $7M is on the low side. Of course, some of the money will be fake, just like in most contracts.
The one thing that could keep his price down is that some of the teams that still need quarterbacks have already employed Fitz. Cleveland, St. Louis and San Francisco could all use a guy like Fitz.
I doubt he jumps ship to learn a new system deal with a different locker room and leave Decker n Marshall for an extra 3 ir 4 million over the life of his extension
Post by: nyjunc on December 16, 2015, 07:59:02 AM
Post by: nyjunc on December 16, 2015, 09:32:00 AM
Post by: Tommy on December 16, 2015, 09:50:00 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 16, 2015, 11:14:45 AM
Derek Smalls' new logic
Good QBs get paid lots of money
Fitz doesn't get paid lots of money
∴ Fitz isn't a good QB
It doesn't really matter what I post because you and Heismanberg will just make things up and say that I said them, trying to be clever and usually failing.
Quote from: Coach K
I doubt he jumps ship to learn a new system deal with a different locker room and leave Decker n Marshall for an extra 3 ir 4 million over the life of his extension
I hope you're right. I'd be shocked if Fitz goes anywhere, but I think we might have to pay up. Typically, players and agents don't like leaving a lot of money on the table, if the Jets try to lowball him.
Post by: Johnny English on December 16, 2015, 11:32:56 AM
I hope you're right. I'd be shocked if Fitz goes anywhere, but I think we might have to pay up. Typically, players and agents don't like leaving a lot of money on the table, if the Jets try to lowball him.
I think the comparison point for both sides here is Josh McCown. Journeyman who bounced around the league being OK without ever being special, then had a really good season at Chicago when Cutler went down. Clearly there's a difference there in that McCown was always the going back to being the number two when Cutler came back, but he went looking for a #1 job, got $10M over two years from Cleveland and now he's back in QB purgatory.
In that context I think giving Fitz in the region of $20M for three years with half of it guaranteed would be a great deal for both sides.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2015, 11:37:54 AM
Post by: MoreCharacters on December 16, 2015, 11:44:38 AM
Post by: Tommy on December 16, 2015, 11:46:13 AM
I somehow don't think Ryan Fitzpatrick is going to be in your next Dunkin Donuts commercial.
lolololol
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2015, 11:57:26 AM
I somehow don't think Ryan Fitzpatrick is going to be in your next Dunkin Donuts commercial.
Might not be his style, but the point is if he's worried about maximizing his income potential he could do that here without taking a bigger contract from a crappy team.
Post by: Tommy on December 16, 2015, 12:27:51 PM
Might not be his style, but the point is if he's worried about maximizing his income potential he could do that here without taking a bigger contract from a crappy team.
Is there a team out there with better receivers that's going to need a QB next season anyway?
Post by: Murrell2878 on December 16, 2015, 12:45:54 PM
Ok, I already found statistical evidence of the main difference between the two.
2015: Fitzpatrick's INTs
On passes shorter than 10 yards: 1
From 11 to 20: 3
From 21 to 30: 1
More than 31: 6
On our own 1-20: 0
Own 21-50: 5
Opp 49-20: 6
Opp 19-1: 0
2014: Geno's INTs
On passes shorter than 10 yards: 6
From 11 to 20: 2
From 21 to 30: 2
More than 31: 1
On our own 1-20: 4
Own 21-50: 6
Opp 49-20: 2
Opp 19-1: 1
Of course, I would need to cross-check both tables but at first glance, Fitz's INTs have all came outside of 20s and mostly after his passes traveled more than 31 yards, which amounts to a short punts. Geno's, on the other hand, came mostly on dump-offs (how could he manage to do that?) and almost all of them in our own half (4 in our own 20). It's a huge, huge, difference.
Great job. This says a lot!
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 16, 2015, 12:48:55 PM
Is there a team out there with better receivers that's going to need a QB next season anyway?
Doubtful. He knows how easily things can change so why mess up a good thing? He can stay here indefinitely, as long as he plays well we win enough we won't be in position to draft a can't miss QB.
Post by: Murrell2878 on December 16, 2015, 12:49:12 PM
(https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xta1/v/t1.0-9/12347823_10153185066321231_2647365557486582186_n.jpg?oh=c04db8fc38a49de98fad388bff2199ad&oe=56D4F453)
Two weeks in a row we have the AFC Offensive Player of the Week.... WHAT?!?!?!? If I'm dreaming don't wake me up. Has this ever happened before?
Post by: Murrell2878 on December 16, 2015, 12:50:53 PM
Post by: nyjunc on December 16, 2015, 01:01:14 PM
How badly do you think Houston wishes they had Fitzpatrick right now?
they are in 1st place w/o him.
Post by: Fenwyr on December 16, 2015, 01:04:08 PM
they are in 1st place w/o him.
Yeah, but still...
Post by: Johnny English on December 16, 2015, 01:19:32 PM
they are in 1st place w/o him.
No they aren't. The Colts hold the tiebreaker and that's the difference between the AFC fourth seed and tenth seed, which is where the Texans are right now.
The Jets are 8-5 at least in part because of our quarterback. The Texans are 6-7 despite their quarterbacks.
Post by: nyjunc on December 16, 2015, 01:21:07 PM
No they aren't. The Colts hold the tiebreaker and that's the difference between the AFC fourth seed and tenth seed, which is where the Texans are right now.
The Jets are 8-5 at least in part because of our quarterback. The Texans are 6-7 despite their quarterbacks.
their QB was a big reason why they beat us. there's 3 weeks left, they are tied for 1st and control their own destiny.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 16, 2015, 01:38:39 PM
Hoyer: 18 TD, 6 Int, 60.5% comp, 7.2 yds per att
Fitzpatrick is 25 TD, 11 Int, 60.0% comp, 7.0 yds per att
O'Brien seems to want more though, as he benched Fitzpatrick after he played relatively well last year, and he benched Hoyer this year.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 16, 2015, 01:53:26 PM
Both Hoyer and Fitzpatrick have played well.
Hoyer: 18 TD, 6 Int, 60.5% comp, 7.2 yds per att
Fitzpatrick is 25 TD, 11 Int, 60.0% comp, 7.0 yds per att
O'Brien seems to want more though, as he benched Fitzpatrick after he played relatively well last year, and he benched Hoyer this year.
I thought Hoyer got hurt, not benched.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 16, 2015, 01:56:37 PM
I thought Hoyer got hurt, not benched.This time he did, but I was more referring to when he was benched for Mallett early in the year. Granted, Hoyer hadn't done much of anything, partly because it was after Week 1.
Post by: insanity on December 16, 2015, 03:23:52 PM
Both Hoyer and Fitzpatrick have played well.
Hoyer: 18 TD, 6 Int, 60.5% comp, 7.2 yds per att
Fitzpatrick is 25 TD, 11 Int, 60.0% comp, 7.0 yds per att
O'Brien seems to want more though, as he benched Fitzpatrick after he played relatively well last year, and he benched Hoyer this year.
I'm starting to think you don't watch any football.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 16, 2015, 04:02:36 PM
I'm starting to think you don't watch any football.I've always thought Ryan Fitzpatrick's dick is too deep inside your poopchute to ever actually make a point.
Post by: Tommy on December 16, 2015, 04:38:29 PM
I've always thought Ryan Fitzpatrick's dick is too deep inside your poopchute to ever actually make a point.
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Post by: ukilledkenny on December 16, 2015, 05:01:55 PM
I've always thought Ryan Fitzpatrick's dick is too deep inside your poopchute to ever actually make a point.
I agree with this.
Post by: Pope on December 16, 2015, 07:23:48 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on December 16, 2015, 08:06:09 PM
Yeah insanity just walks into a thread like a drunken redneck and curses someone out then leavesHahahaha
There's literally half a dozen that do that here.
Post by: MBGreen on December 16, 2015, 08:10:04 PM
I've always thought Ryan Fitzpatrick's dick is too deep inside your poopchute to ever actually make a point.
lmao
Post by: Johnny English on December 16, 2015, 08:39:47 PM
I've always thought Ryan Fitzpatrick's dick is too deep inside your poopchute to ever actually make a point.
Did you just call Ryan Fitzpatrick gay?
Geno lover confirmed.
Post by: insanity on December 17, 2015, 12:18:59 AM
Yeah insanity just walks into a thread like a drunken redneck and curses someone out then leaves
freak you ya god damn queer. America was a better place without your kind
Post by: Coach K on December 17, 2015, 07:35:21 AM
their QB was a big reason why they beat us. there's 3 weeks left, they are tied for 1st and control their own destiny.
TJ Yates beat us.
I actually think he's the best one on their roster but O Brien has the dumbest fascination with guys
Post by: MBGreen on December 17, 2015, 07:36:50 AM
freak you ya god damn queer. America was a better place without your kind
(https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/12342629_10208525500076745_9209357521038905037_n.jpg?oh=81bf3baec8db9af8034ebfb71a659825&oe=56D7542F)
Post by: insanity on December 17, 2015, 09:46:50 AM
I've always thought Ryan Fitzpatrick's dick is too deep inside your poopchute to ever actually make a point.
You just said Hoyer was having a good season, and then compared him to Ryan Fitzpatrick. If you watched even one game of his you could tell that he is not even close to a good quarterback.
edited for typo
Post by: Heismanberg on December 17, 2015, 09:50:30 AM
You just said Hoyer was having a good season, and then compared him to Ryan Fitzpatrick. If you watched even one game you of his you could tell that he is not even close to a good quarterback.
stats
Post by: Johnny English on December 17, 2015, 10:56:48 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 17, 2015, 11:24:59 AM
Post by: Tommy on December 17, 2015, 11:29:48 AM
Thing about Vinny's 1998 season is he didn't start the first two games, Foley started 3 in all (0-3), with Vinny we were 12-1.
Wow I keep forgetting that.
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 17, 2015, 11:43:38 AM
Wow I keep forgetting that.
Crazy. After missing 1999 we started 6-1 in 2000 after the Monday Night Miracle, at that time the Jets record with Vinny at QB was 18-2, including playoffs 19-3. Not counting the 1999 opener where he was injured while we were ahead and we lost on a late FG.
Post by: nyjunc on December 17, 2015, 12:32:12 PM
Crazy. After missing 1999 we started 6-1 in 2000 after the Monday Night Miracle, at that time the Jets record with Vinny at QB was 18-2, including playoffs 19-3. Not counting the 1999 opener where he was injured while we were ahead and we lost on a late FG.
it was actually 18-3 in the reg season at the time of the 6-1 start and the 3 losses were:
1998 at Indy when we lost on a last min TD pass against 3-13 Indy
1999 week 1 against NE when he was lost for the season early in the game
2000 vs. Pitt when he played a snap or 2 and Ray Lucas came in for him
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 17, 2015, 12:38:57 PM
it was actually 18-3 in the reg season at the time of the 6-1 start and the 3 losses were:
1998 at Indy when we lost on a last min TD pass against 3-13 Indy
1999 week 1 against NE when he was lost for the season early in the game
2000 vs. Pitt when he played a snap or 2 and Ray Lucas came in for him
That's right, he barely played in that Pittsburgh game. After 99 we thought we had a future guy in Lucas but he never panned out and we had drafted Pennington already. I can't count the 99 opener as a loss for Vinny, I realize he started the game and we lost officially.
Post by: nyjunc on December 17, 2015, 12:56:13 PM
That's right, he barely played in that Pittsburgh game. After 99 we thought we had a future guy in Lucas but he never panned out and we had drafted Pennington already. I can't count the 99 opener as a loss for Vinny, I realize he started the game and we lost officially.
it goes on his record but 2 of the 3 losses at that time he barely played in.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 17, 2015, 01:27:27 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 17, 2015, 01:49:21 PM
You just said Hoyer was having a good season, and then compared him to Ryan Fitzpatrick. If you watched even one game of his you could tell that he is not even close to a good quarterback.Why can't both be having good seasons? Their numbers are virtually identical, Fitzpatrick has the better team around him both offensively and defensively, and both have been great in the red zone.
edited for typo
That said, it sounds like you and Heismanberg have watched a lot of Texans games this year, so I'll defer to your film study.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 17, 2015, 02:15:02 PM
Fitz will cost us a 6th-round pick due to playing time this season. Still a steal.
Maybe we can explain to the league that Geno would have been just as good so they will credit it back.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 17, 2015, 02:24:00 PM
Well, hopefully, if we decide to trade Geno this offseason, we could get a 7th that turns into a 6th with playing time, just like we gave up. Problem is, Geno probably wouldn't be getting the playing time.
Maybe we can explain to the league that Geno would have been just as good so they will credit it back.
Post by: insanity on December 17, 2015, 03:03:15 PM
Why can't both be having good seasons? Their numbers are virtually identical, Fitzpatrick has the better team around him both offensively and defensively, and both have been great in the red zone.
That said, it sounds like you and Heismanberg have watched a lot of Texans games this year, so I'll defer to your film study.
They can both be having good seasons, but td, int, and ypa dont even come close to telling the story of how well a quarterback is playing. Unfortunately it's not like baseball where you can look at BA, OPS, HR, RBIs, and say these hitters are comparable. Basic stats just do not tell the story. This is the same reason I've gotten so frustrated with you comparing Fitz and Geno.
At the end of the day, Fitz is still an average quarterback, but his physical tools and intelligence are a great fit in Chan Gailey's offense. It's the reason I was excited for Fitz to come here, and why, since the start of the season, I've been optimistic that we needed to continue to ride with him when his play was mediocre. Fitz will never be a fit for every team or every offensive scheme, and the laundry list of teams which he has played for clearly proves this, but he can be, and has been, successful and a plus player in this scheme....
And at the end of the day, that is what we have all been asking for, for the past 5 years... A quarterback who can manage the team, not make mistakes, and make a big play every once in a while to get us out of a rut.
Side note, I think the Texans propensity for using the Wildcat, especially on third downs, is a good measurement for how well Hoyer is playing.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 17, 2015, 03:42:51 PM
At the end of the day, Fitz is still an average quarterback, but his physical tools and intelligence are a great fit in Chan Gailey's offense. It's the reason I was excited for Fitz to come here, and why, since the start of the season, I've been optimistic that we needed to continue to ride with him when his play was mediocre. Fitz will never be a fit for every team or every offensive scheme, and the laundry list of teams which he has played for clearly proves this, but he can be, and has been, successful and a plus player in this scheme....I agree with almost everything above. Only difference was that I had a shorter leash on Fitz, and if he had struggled for a 3rd straight game against Miami, I was willing to make a move. Luckily, he threw 4 TDs and didn't make that an issue.
And at the end of the day, that is what we have all been asking for, for the past 5 years... A quarterback who can manage the team, not make mistakes, and make a big play every once in a while to get us out of a rut.
I was excited for Fitz, too. As soon as we got Maccagnan, I was hoping we'd get Fitz. He was a more proven QB than anyone we've had recently, even if his upside is limited. He played well in Houston last year, and I was hoping the improved weapons would help him out here if he got the chance to play, which he obviously did.
As for the Texans' wildcat, I think that has more to do with trying to get the running game going (Houston is 31st in yards per carry) than anything else.
I've never said Fitz was better than Geno. I pretty much agreed with what the coaching staff did - give Geno a chance until he falters because he's young. Then IK happened and threw that out the window.
Post by: JFIF on December 17, 2015, 07:30:14 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on December 17, 2015, 07:47:07 PM
Is IK the fourth or fifth most popular former jets player right now?
I would rank him higher.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 19, 2015, 10:32:20 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on December 19, 2015, 10:34:31 PM
Clutch as hell
Had a horrible interception, but made two huge drives down the field and threw a perfect pass to Kenbrell freaking Thompkins and willed the team down the field in the 4th quarter.
Fitz is now 10-1 TD:INT in the past month. And 4-0
Post by: Johnny English on December 19, 2015, 10:40:08 PM
Post by: Tommy on December 19, 2015, 10:42:12 PM
Worst pick of the season, but every QB has the odd one. His account is in plenty of credit.
That was his only Sanchez/Geno-Esque INT.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 19, 2015, 10:44:35 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 19, 2015, 10:45:55 PM
He was beat to hell by the end of this one.
This is the first time since he's been a Jet that I've seen him get consistently rattled by pass rush.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 19, 2015, 10:46:17 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 19, 2015, 10:48:36 PM
The pressure really got to him tonight at times. He took a lot of hits in the pocket and a few more on his sneaks and scrambles.
He was beat to hell by the end of this one.
This is the first time since he's been a Jet that I've seen him get consistently rattled by pass rush.
But he hung in there and got us the 10 points we needed at the end.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 19, 2015, 10:49:07 PM
It's complete luck, but Fitz doesn't throw backbreaking INTs this year. They only got 3 pts out of that. If Geno throws it, it's a pick 6There were studies early in the year that Fitz threw a ton of pickable passes and was lucky not to have them intercepted. I'm not so sure about that, but it does seem like Fitz's interceptions don't come back to bite us as much.
Quote from: Mr. Electric
The pressure really got to him tonight at times. He took a lot of hits in the pocket and a few more on his sneaks and scrambles.It seems like Gailey tells him that if the rush is coming, take off and scramble and see if you can get something positive. Fitz has done a great job avoiding sacks, but I would bet he's got a ton of 0-2 yard runs this season. The offensive line really needs to step up.
He was beat to hell by the end of this one.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 19, 2015, 10:49:13 PM
But he hung in there and got us the 10 points we needed at the end.
Sure did.
Post by: Johnny English on December 19, 2015, 10:54:22 PM
The pressure really got to him tonight at times. He took a lot of hits in the pocket and a few more on his sneaks and scrambles.
He was beat to hell by the end of this one.
This is the first time since he's been a Jet that I've seen him get consistently rattled by pass rush.
The offensive line really needs to step up.
I don't disagree with either of you, but the Cowboys' line was really, really good. There's a lot of talent there and if Romo wasn't dead they'd have won that division weeks ago.
Post by: Coach K on December 19, 2015, 10:54:37 PM
Enunwa needs major props tonight.
Post by: Coach K on December 19, 2015, 10:55:17 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 19, 2015, 11:26:11 PM
I don't disagree with either of you, but the Cowboys' line was really, really good. There's a lot of talent there and if Romo wasn't dead they'd have won that division weeks ago.The Cowboys front is very good. But the offensive line had been allowing more pressure than usual before last week against the Titans. Seemed to regress again tonight.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 19, 2015, 11:40:34 PM
This is the best season an NYJ quarterback has had in my lifetime. Fitzpatrick is the best NYJ quarterback that I've seen.
That's how bad this team's QB situation has been. Pennington was just so limited. I love that dude, but injuries killed him and he was never able to put up big numbers. A journeyman is the best this team has done at the position in 28 seasons...
Post by: mj2sexay on December 19, 2015, 11:50:41 PM
I said this about Brandon Marshall as a wideout a few weeks ago and I'm going to say it about Ryan Fitzpatrick as a quarterback:
This is the best season an NYJ quarterback has had in my lifetime. Fitzpatrick is the best NYJ quarterback that I've seen.
That's how bad this team's QB situation has been. Pennington was just so limited. I love that dude, but injuries killed him and he was never able to put up big numbers. A journeyman is the best this team has done at the position in 28 seasons...
I understand Fitzy has been fantastic, and he's absolutely having a comparable year to Vinny in 98 if not exceeding what Vinny Greenhead did.
But Pennys 12 game stretch as a starter in 2002 is still the best stretch I've ever seen from a Jets player under center. He was unconscious.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 19, 2015, 11:57:21 PM
However, it's pretty clear that this is the best season by a Jets QB since then.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 19, 2015, 11:59:50 PM
But Pennys 12 game stretch as a starter in 2002 is still the best stretch I've ever seen from a Jets player under center. He was unconscious.
That New England/Green Bay/Indianapolis stretch from that season is one of my favorite NYJ moments.
I just think that what Fitzpatrick's doing has become more impressive as the season goes on.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2015, 12:00:03 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 20, 2015, 12:01:54 AM
This season deserves a playoff appearance. That means we probably have to root for a Patriots win tomorrow - if they win and either Denver or Cinci lose they're guaranteed a bye and given how banged up they are, no way they don't rest starters next week.
We need Denver to beat Pittsburgh.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2015, 12:07:27 AM
We need Denver to beat Pittsburgh.
Yes, although if they don't they have Cincinnati the week after and if they lose both of those then they're in trouble, because they could easily lose the division to KC. They'll obviously beat the Chargers on the last day but their conference record isn't that good if they lose to Pitt and Cinci.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2015, 12:09:10 AM
That New England/Green Bay/Indianapolis stretch from that season is one of my favorite NYJ moments.That stretch and the win over the Patriots in 2010 are 1 and 1a.
I just think that what Fitzpatrick's doing has become more impressive as the season goes on.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2015, 12:10:33 AM
That stretch and the win over the Patriots in 2010 are 1 and 1a.
That Patriots win is my single happiest moment as a Jets fan, although I don't have as many years into it as most of you.
Post by: mj2sexay on December 20, 2015, 12:18:59 AM
That Patriots win is my single happiest moment as a Jets fan, although I don't have as many years into it as most of you.
I was in the building for both the Green Bay and Indy game, and like a rube even saved pieces of confetti that I'm sure are still somewhere amongst my sports keepsakes still at my parents house. I LOVED that stretch. But 2010 on the road against New England is so easily my most favorite moment as a Jets fan. I'm not sure if that speaks more to my irrational hatred of the Pats, or what. But Braylon carrying two Pats defensive backs into the end zone is such a sweet memory.
Lets freaking beat them next week. Saturday night I'll be doing any sort of rain dance I can read up on from now until then in the hopes that the weather presents a problem for fagboy trying to go to the air 57 times again.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2015, 12:28:30 AM
Post by: Emerson Boozer on December 20, 2015, 12:52:55 AM
This season deserves a playoff appearance. That means we probably have to root for a Patriots win tomorrow - if they win and either Denver or Cinci lose they're guaranteed a bye and given how banged up they are, no way they don't rest starters next week.
They are playing the Titans. You won't need to Syrian your voice rooting.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 20, 2015, 12:57:00 AM
Now, if we finish 11-5 and we miss the playoffs on a 6-game winning streak, it will be one of the biggest heartbreaks in Jets history.
Post by: Johnny English on December 20, 2015, 12:58:32 AM
They are playing the Titans. You won't need to Syrian your voice rooting.
Is this some kind of technical muso speak, or are you neck deep in Kentucky's finest?
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 21, 2015, 09:15:02 AM
I figured he'd be an above average game manager for us if he could stay healthy. He's had multiple injuries, hell his face got opened up Saturday night, and he's still went out and won games himself.
I love this guy. Is he the "best" Jets QB in my lifetime? I don't know. But he's probably replaced Chad as my "favorite."
Post by: Tommy on December 21, 2015, 10:10:38 AM
Like others said, the interception was far and away the worst he's thrown this year. That said, the way he's played late in games far exceeds anything I hoped for from him this year.
I figured he'd be an above average game manager for us if he could stay healthy. He's had multiple injuries, hell his face got opened up Saturday night, and he's still went out and won games himself.
I love this guy. Is he the "best" Jets QB in my lifetime? I don't know. But he's probably replaced Chad as my "favorite."
That INT was bad, but everyone's reaction at the bar was more "ahhhh damn" than "WHAT THE freak. Every fuckn time! Get this jackass off the field!" That was so common under Sanchez/Geno.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 21, 2015, 10:22:29 AM
That INT was bad, but everyone's reaction at the bar was more "ahhhh damn" than "WHAT THE freak. Every fuckn time! Get this jackass off the field!" That was so common under Sanchez/Geno.
Yeah, that's the basic reaction we had. "Oh crap. That sucks. Come on defense!" and on the replay we were like "Damn, that was a terrible pass." But we were never mad about it. Under Geno or Sanchez I'd have been throwing things under the same conditions.
Post by: Pope on December 21, 2015, 12:32:44 PM
That INT was bad, but everyone's reaction at the bar was more "ahhhh damn" than "WHAT THE freak. Every fuckn time! Get this jackass off the field!" That was so common under Sanchez/Geno.So true.. the culture at QB has changed as of late. I actually trust Fitz to move the ball downfield vs in the past I would cringe on every pass play
Post by: nyjunc on December 21, 2015, 12:47:03 PM
So true.. the culture at QB has changed as of late. I actually trust Fitz to move the ball downfield vs in the past I would cringe on every pass play
I love Fitz but that INt and some poor play came when Marshall was on the bench. Marshall is our offensive MVP and he and decker have made life very easy for the QB.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 21, 2015, 02:13:54 PM
I love Fitz but that INt and some poor play came when Marshall was on the bench. Marshall is our offensive MVP and he and decker have made life very easy for the QB.I agree that Marshall has helped make Fitz a MUCH better quarterback.
That said, here's a great play by Fitzpatrick that has nothing to do with Marshall and Decker.
Look at Fitz and Kenbrell on this play (this is the big play late in the Cowboys game).
Kenbrell has barely even gotten off the line at this point. This is right as Thompkins is about to get into a full sprint on his fly route. Fitz has already made up his mind to make that throw. He called this a "trust throw" after the game, and he's right, because he threw this ball to a spot, hoping Thompkins could go after it. He said after the game that Thompkins told him that he could get open against Cover 2. Thompkins was right, and Fitz trusted that he would get there. Great play.
(http://s11.postimg.org/gbft0d3xf/fitz_to_thompkins.jpg)
Post by: nyjunc on December 21, 2015, 02:36:41 PM
I agree that Marshall has helped make Fitz a MUCH better quarterback.
That said, here's a great play by Fitzpatrick that has nothing to do with Marshall and Decker.
Look at Fitz and Kenbrell on this play (this is the big play late in the Cowboys game).
Kenbrell has barely even gotten off the line at this point. This is right as Thompkins is about to get into a full sprint on his fly route. Fitz has already made up his mind to make that throw. He called this a "trust throw" after the game, and he's right, because he threw this ball to a spot, hoping Thompkins could go after it. He said after the game that Thompkins told him that he could get open against Cover 2. Thompkins was right, and Fitz trusted that he would get there. Great play.
(http://s11.postimg.org/gbft0d3xf/fitz_to_thompkins.jpg)
I'm with you, I was not trying to bash Fitz but he looked like a different guy when Marshall was out and a play like this is possible b/c all the attention marshall & Decker get.
I love everything Fitz has given us. if we finish this season off and make a little run he could slide into the 3rd best season in Jets history for a QB(Vinny '98, Chad '02) and we could have stability at this position for a few years.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 21, 2015, 02:39:29 PM
a play like this is possible b/c all the attention marshall & Decker get.
Dallas was in Cover 2.
There's no one receiving special attention on that play. It was a great route and a great throw.
Post by: Pope on December 21, 2015, 02:41:18 PM
Post by: nyjunc on December 21, 2015, 02:52:43 PM
Dallas was in Cover 2.
There's no one receiving special attention on that play. It was a great route and a great throw.
They had multiple defenders around Marshall(2 guys near, a 3rd over the top) and a defender eyeing Decker on his short route that Edelman excels at.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 21, 2015, 03:48:36 PM
They had multiple defenders around Marshall(2 guys near, a 3rd over the top) and a defender eyeing Decker on his short route that Edelman excels at.
It's Cover 2, junc. Three defenders were not on Marshall.
They ran trips away from Marshall.
The nickel corner decided to defend Decker in the flat, which was the right read by him. The safety on the trips side went down the seam with Enunwa. That created a 1v1 matchup for Thompkins.
Post by: nyjunc on December 21, 2015, 03:59:40 PM
It's Cover 2, junc. Three defenders were not on Marshall.
They ran trips away from Marshall.
The nickel corner decided to defend Decker in the flat, which was the right read by him. The safety on the trips side went down the seam with Enunwa. That created a 1v1 matchup for Thompkins.
ok.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 21, 2015, 04:08:33 PM
I think Fitz is a master con artist. He goes from team to team, plays lights out for a few weeks, earns a pay day, then proceeds to excrement the bed or get hurt so he can go to another team and restart the process
Fitzpatrick is actually Sawyer from LOST.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 21, 2015, 04:17:11 PM
ok.
(http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/c1/c1942c81435c460b60747ecfda5bf5c033d6f5c4e4f26e8f9cd3c0977487052a.jpg)
Post by: nyjunc on December 21, 2015, 04:31:50 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 21, 2015, 04:36:59 PM
they still had 3 guys around Marshall and left Thompkins alone.
I thought you were finished making a fool out of yourself. Apparently you have absolutely no idea how zone coverage works.
There's nothing wrong with your comments about Brandon Marshall and Eric Decker helping Ryan Fitzpatrick. I agree with that. They just had very little to do with this particular throw and catch though.
Post by: JFIF on December 21, 2015, 05:12:32 PM
(http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/c1/c1942c81435c460b60747ecfda5bf5c033d6f5c4e4f26e8f9cd3c0977487052a.jpg)
leading young black men to the promised land
Post by: Johnny English on December 21, 2015, 05:23:54 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 21, 2015, 05:25:33 PM
I'd need to see it again, but it's my recollection that the corner broke early to try and cut out the pass underneath leaving Thompkins alone. That suggests that either he guessed at the route and got it wildly wrong, which would be an error of epic proportions for an NFL DB in that position, or he thought he had help.
Jones played terrible coverage. Thompkins hit him when a stop and go, he bit on it, and allowed the outside release.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 21, 2015, 10:05:46 PM
Jones played terrible coverage. Thompkins hit him when a stop and go, he bit on it, and allowed the outside release.
But if Dallas was in cover 2 than the CB thought he had help, no?
Post by: Heismanberg on December 21, 2015, 10:37:48 PM
But if Dallas was in cover 2 than the CB thought he had help, no?
We just cooked their derriere with that play. I'm assuming that our offensive staff knew they'd play that kind of trips look with a Cover 2...especially after hearing that Thompkins told Fitzpatrick he could get open.
That corner doesn't think he needs help (and even if he thought he did, it wasn't there). He got beat trying to read the quarterback. Most basic secondaries will line up their corners with their backs to the sideline in zone so they can see everything coming at them. They tried to disguise it as man-to-man, which it really should have turned into if Byron Jones played it right.
Enunwa went down the seam and ran off the linebacker and the safety. The nickel corner took the first thing to the flat (Decker). Jones thought Thompkins was breaking off his route when he stutter-stepped and got caught peeking at the QB.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 21, 2015, 11:40:07 PM
Post by: JFIF on December 21, 2015, 11:42:07 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 22, 2015, 12:13:30 AM
Jones thought Thompkins was breaking off his route when he stutter-stepped and got caught peeking at the QB.And if you look at the play, it's pretty clear that's exactly what Jones was doing. His eyes were staring at the QB, so when Thompkins accelerated deep, Jones was late to react. Fitzpatrick made an anticipation throw so it was impossible for Jones to recover.
Post by: Cane on December 23, 2015, 07:47:18 AM
We just cooked their derriere with that play. I'm assuming that our offensive staff knew they'd play that kind of trips look with a Cover 2...especially after hearing that Thompkins told Fitzpatrick he could get open.
That corner doesn't think he needs help (and even if he thought he did, it wasn't there). He got beat trying to read the quarterback. Most basic secondaries will line up their corners with their backs to the sideline in zone so they can see everything coming at them. They tried to disguise it as man-to-man, which it really should have turned into if Byron Jones played it right.
Enunwa went down the seam and ran off the linebacker and the safety. The nickel corner took the first thing to the flat (Decker). Jones thought Thompkins was breaking off his route when he stutter-stepped and got caught peeking at the QB.
I'm in 100% agreement that there was just no answer for Dallas on that play. The speed of Enunwa took Wilcox out of the play, and whatever Jones was doing made him a footnote in history. I think you had it right that the Cover 2 should have adjusted to more of a man look on the near side when the trips was thrown at it. The fact that the nickel plays Decker so tight in the slot means that either he's thinking it's a man adjustment to the near side. Regardless, like you said, based on what the other ten guys are doing, Jones should have kept with Thompkins.
The backside corner and safety are bracketing Marshall as if though it is cover 2 on that side. Barry Church bails out like the ship is going down. Now I wouldn't say that what Junc said about the defense sending three defenders at Marshall was true, but that side was overloaded with coverage (and I'm guessing they called the 2) to keep the ball out of his hands. You can even see Sean Lee maintaining his depth rather than coming up on Powell to make the Marshall throw tougher. I was watching Marshall's coverage closely the whole game (my opp. had him in fantasy), so I can confirm that they were doing anything they could to throw extra defenders at him. He's just way too good to be contained.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2015, 03:15:48 PM
Post by: Badger on December 27, 2015, 03:17:14 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on December 27, 2015, 03:22:06 PM
With his 29th TD pass, Fitz has tied the Jets single season record.
Hopefully he throws a TD pass to Marshall to contribute to beating the Bills next week.
Post by: Badger on December 27, 2015, 03:41:31 PM
Actually, it was already the longest at four wins, but now it's even longer.
Post by: Ignatius J Reilly on December 27, 2015, 03:51:25 PM
This is now the longest win streak of Fitzpatrick's career.
Actually, it was already the longest at four wins, but now it's even longer.
I used to do drugs. I still do, but I used to too.
Post by: Johnny English on December 27, 2015, 04:12:51 PM
I used to do drugs. I still do, but I used to too.
We miss you, Mitch.
Post by: MBGreen on December 27, 2015, 04:54:21 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2015, 06:40:57 PM
Fitz is AWFUL. he may fool some folks who don't watch him and see decent #s, he doesn't fool me. I am fine w/ moving on from Geno if we have something to move on to. we don't at the moment.
He fooled you, bitch.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 27, 2015, 06:49:04 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2015, 06:50:22 PM
He left a ton of plays on the field today, but when you have a guy like Marshall who can make plays for you, it is a lot easier to look good.
Two big plays were also lost because of Quincy Enunwa. Thankfully he made up for it in overtime.
The worst throw he made today was when he missed Kenbrell Thompkins for the TD. He did enough to beat a very good team and he didn't throw any interceptions.
A lot of his throws to Brandon Marshall were absolutely perfect. The throw in OT that set up Decker's game winning TD was one of his best throws of the season.
Post by: Tommy on December 27, 2015, 06:54:03 PM
He left a ton of plays on the field today
You can say this about any QB in the NFL for every game.
Post by: Badger on December 27, 2015, 07:01:45 PM
You can say this about any QB in the NFL for every game.
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/201510250mia.htm
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2015, 07:05:48 PM
Post by: guinness77 on December 27, 2015, 07:12:45 PM
If you thought we were getting this before the season started, even after Smith got knocked out, I don't believe you.
These guys freaking love him too. It's obvious.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 27, 2015, 07:31:39 PM
Gailey and Fitz are a great match .
Post by: Johnny English on December 27, 2015, 07:43:08 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2015, 07:44:16 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 27, 2015, 07:44:24 PM
He starts slow a lot of games it seems like, but when we absolutely need a play, he's on point. And that usually makes up for any missed throws early .
Post by: Badger on December 27, 2015, 07:46:46 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2015, 07:48:41 PM
And that usually makes up for any missed throws early .
Did you watch god damn game dude? He made like four bad throws out of 41 attempts. You act like he can't hit water if he fell off a boat.
"He completed less than 90% of his passes? What a bum."
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 27, 2015, 07:59:36 PM
Did you watch god damn game dude? He made like four bad throws out of 41 attempts. You act like he can't hit water if he fell off a boat.I like Fitz. He missed a few passes early. It's a fact. I was at the game, so maybe there were reasons for some of them. Enunwa made a poor adjustment on one early, for instance .
"He completed less than 90% of his passes? What a bum."
Fitz was 9 for 24 on passes more than 5 yards downfield. Gailey does a great job scheming plays Fitz can make, we put the ball in our playmakers' hands and let then make plays after the catch. And Fitz generally does a great job of that. Plus, Fitz has led so many huge drives this year, so he's done great there, too.
Post by: Cane on December 27, 2015, 08:05:28 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 27, 2015, 08:09:43 PM
Fitz's problem is that he has all of the balls, so he throws passes that could bite him in the derriere. The beauty of this team is that Decker is usually open because of his routes and BMarsh doesn't even have to be open because he's one of the greatest to ever play.Exactly. He's a good short passer, and he's good at reading defenses before the snap. And he's not afraid to try to throw downfield and let his receivers make plays. He's not great at that part of the game but he does it enough to keep defenses honest.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2015, 08:10:03 PM
Gailey does a great job scheming plays Fitz can make
He also calls a lot of empty sets and takes shots which are lower percentage passes that you want to bitch about every week.
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2015, 08:15:15 PM
The scheme is a great fit for Fitzpatrick, but it also forces him to do a little too much at times.
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 27, 2015, 08:21:10 PM
He also calls a lot of empty sets and takes shots which are lower percentage passes that you want to bitch about every week.We run more shotgun 4 wide than any team in the league, mostly because of Enunwa and our horrible tight ends
Post by: Heismanberg on December 27, 2015, 08:23:46 PM
We run more shotgun 4 wide than any team in the league, mostly because of Enunwa and our horrible tight ends
It's very similar to what New England does, except they have the greatest mismatch in the NFL with Rob Gronkowski.
I just posted this in a separate thread, but if Enunwa continues to develop and learns how to track the football, he'll be a problem for a lot of safeties and linebackers. And even if he doesn't, we need to find a way to get him the ball in space because he can creates yards after the catch.
Post by: Pope on December 27, 2015, 09:34:39 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 28, 2015, 11:02:10 AM
1) His early passes sucked. He seemed to putting too much "touch" on them and wound up getting too much air underneath. It was almost like he was playing too timid. Then he settled down and completely kicked derriere.
2) If that ref doesn't stop play for some bullshit seconds to be placed back on the clock, Fitz hits an uncovered Decker on the sideline for a TD.
3) His block on a running play was ridiculous. I hate what he puts his body through, but he's got more balls than any QB I've ever watched play for this team.
Fitzmagic is the best and my favorite Jets QB of my lifetime. Sorry Chad.
Post by: Murrell2878 on December 28, 2015, 11:49:09 AM
QB Passing TD's
QB Passing Yards
QB Completions
Receptions by a single player
Receiving Yards by a single player
Receiving TDs by a single player
Most receiving TD's by a receiving duo
Team Total Passing Yards
Team Total TD Passes
Team Total Completions
Post by: Murrell2878 on December 28, 2015, 11:51:06 AM
Few things about Fitz yesterday:
1) His early passes sucked. He seemed to putting too much "touch" on them and wound up getting too much air underneath. It was almost like he was playing too timid. Then he settled down and completely kicked derriere.
2) If that ref doesn't stop play for some bullshit seconds to be placed back on the clock, Fitz hits an uncovered Decker on the sideline for a TD.
3) His block on a running play was ridiculous. I hate what he puts his body through, but he's got more balls than any QB I've ever watched play for this team.
Fitzmagic is the best and my favorite Jets QB of my lifetime. Sorry Chad.
Re: #2 ..... Yeah, WTF was that all about?!?!?
Post by: Tommy on December 28, 2015, 11:53:16 AM
Re: #2 ..... Yeah, WTF was that all about?!?!?
All I could think of was that maybe the Pats knew that the refs were going to stop the play which is why they didn't set properly.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 28, 2015, 12:03:31 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on December 28, 2015, 12:30:11 PM
The ref was looking right at the uncovered Decker and stopped play. It was blatantly obvious on the replay. No one can tell me there wasn't cheating there.
It sure took Fotz a long time to see Decker though, I was yelling snap it! And Fotz is just calmly walking to the line, notices it at the last second and was about to snap it when the officials come flying in to add 10 seconds to the clock for no reason, on a play with a running clock. It was insanely absurd
Post by: Italian Seafood on December 28, 2015, 07:30:53 PM
Few things about Fitz yesterday:
1) His early passes sucked. He seemed to putting too much "touch" on them and wound up getting too much air underneath. It was almost like he was playing too timid. Then he settled down and completely kicked derriere.
2) If that ref doesn't stop play for some bullshit seconds to be placed back on the clock, Fitz hits an uncovered Decker on the sideline for a TD.
3) His block on a running play was ridiculous. I hate what he puts his body through, but he's got more balls than any QB I've ever watched play for this team.
Fitzmagic is the best and my favorite Jets QB of my lifetime. Sorry Chad.
He's like a tougher, slightly less accurate Chad without the white boy juke moves.
Post by: MBGreen on December 29, 2015, 08:35:11 AM
good ol' Manish.
Post by: Coach K on December 29, 2015, 08:37:58 AM
Few things about Fitz yesterday:
1) His early passes sucked. He seemed to putting too much "touch" on them and wound up getting too much air underneath. It was almost like he was playing too timid. Then he settled down and completely kicked derriere.
2) If that ref doesn't stop play for some bullshit seconds to be placed back on the clock, Fitz hits an uncovered Decker on the sideline for a TD.
3) His block on a running play was ridiculous. I hate what he puts his body through, but he's got more balls than any QB I've ever watched play for this team.
Fitzmagic is the best and my favorite Jets QB of my lifetime. Sorry Chad.
I want a playoff victory before that even pops into my head.
Pre injury Chad was on his way to being a perennial top 6 qb
Post by: Coach K on December 29, 2015, 08:39:48 AM
Him playing the best football of his life's in a playoff run for the Jets is like a Disney movie
Tony Danza as the garbage picking field goal kicking wonder
Post by: Coach K on December 29, 2015, 08:42:05 AM
https://youtu.be/sm0CjMSxPCc
Post by: Laxin on December 29, 2015, 09:27:05 AM
Offensive Team Records that have already been passed or are on the verge of being passed:
QB Passing TD's
QB Passing Yards
QB Completions
Receptions by a single player
Receiving Yards by a single player
Receiving TDs by a single player
Most receiving TD's by a receiving duo
Team Total Passing Yards
Team Total TD Passes
Team Total Completions
How about total offense? Are they close?
Post by: Derek Smalls on December 29, 2015, 09:36:49 AM
Post by: Ignatius J Reilly on December 29, 2015, 09:38:41 AM
How about total offense? Are they close?
The 85 Jets had 5896 yards of total offense. The team currently has 5625.
Post by: Coach K on December 29, 2015, 09:41:27 AM
The 85 Jets had 5896 yards of total offense. The team currently has 5625.
We will get it
Post by: guinness77 on December 29, 2015, 10:18:36 AM
We will get itWe better get it if we want to win on Sunday.
Post by: JFIF on December 29, 2015, 11:20:22 AM
The 85 Jets had 5896 yards of total offense. The team currently has 5625.
That's incredibly impressive given the era.
Post by: Hemi on December 29, 2015, 12:24:30 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on December 29, 2015, 01:03:13 PM
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/jets/mehta-jets-ryan-fitzpatrick-belongs-mvp-race-article-1.2479234?utm_content=buffer434e6&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=mmehta+twitter
good ol' Manish.
I think there is serious doubt he even wins MVP in the Jets Team Vote.
Post by: bojanglesman on December 30, 2015, 09:07:11 AM
Post by: loyaljetsfan on December 30, 2015, 10:00:55 AM
The ref was looking right at the uncovered Decker and stopped play. It was blatantly obvious on the replay. No one can tell me there wasn't cheating there.
I posted this in the game thread and surprised there wasn't more discussion about this anywhere. I was trying to find the entire game and see what happened on the play prior to this blatant cheating.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 30, 2015, 09:18:49 PM
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/jets/mehta-jets-ryan-fitzpatrick-belongs-mvp-race-article-1.2479234?utm_content=buffer434e6&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=mmehta+twitter
good ol' Manish.
What the freak happened from him being the harshest Jets "writer" out there, to cheering on Fitz as MVP "ahead of tom brady and russel wilson"
Maybe he just wants Fitz to have more leverage in contract negoiations
Post by: MexJetinBcn on December 31, 2015, 08:28:19 AM
I posted this in the game thread and surprised there wasn't more discussion about this anywhere. I was trying to find the entire game and see what happened on the play prior to this blatant cheating.
When was that play? I have the coaches video of the game, maybe I can find what happened...
Post by: Miamipuck on December 31, 2015, 08:36:01 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 31, 2015, 09:25:17 AM
When was that play? I have the coaches video of the game, maybe I can find what happened...
I want to say it was in the 3Q, but I'm not certain. It'll be easy to identify the play though. Decker is literally completely alone on the right sideline.
Post by: Miamipuck on December 31, 2015, 09:28:17 AM
I want to say it was in the 3Q, but I'm not certain. It'll be easy to identify the play though. Decker is literally completely alone on the right sideline.
How about pulling the flag back, that happens what twice a season. Happens here, freak the Pats.
Post by: AlioTheFool on December 31, 2015, 09:43:14 AM
How about pulling the flag back, that happens what twice a season. Happens here, freak the Pats.
On what was clearly a legitimate flag when viewed on replay (not to mention easy to see live).
I know no one likes conspiracy theories but there is nothing anyone can say that will convince me that the Pats don't have at least one, likely more, referees in their pocket every single game they play.
Post by: dcm1602 on December 31, 2015, 12:13:54 PM
On what was clearly a legitimate flag when viewed on replay (not to mention easy to see live).
I know no one likes conspiracy theories but there is nothing anyone can say that will convince me that the Pats don't have at least one, likely more, referees in their pocket every single game they play.
I dont know if id go that far.
But I think its similar to the NBA where guys like Lebron will get flags that nobody else will. Like that championship a few years ago where Lebron got some calls, yet Durant wouldnt because he "hasnt earned them yet". Bill and Brady get favorable calls that nobody else in the league will get, and its freaking retarded . Although part of it has to be that Brady is the biggest bitch in all of sports, and will whine and cry like no other. And Bill is a nutjob who probably points out every "flag" to the refs to "help" them make the right calls
Post by: Johnny English on January 01, 2016, 06:01:38 PM
.@nyjets Ryan Fitzpatrick leads game-winning OT drive voted @CastrolUSA EDGE Clutch Performer Wk 16: http://www.nfl.com/voting/clutch-performer/2015/REG/16 … #NFLClutch
Post by: nyjunc on January 04, 2016, 09:07:30 AM
Post by: MBGreen on January 04, 2016, 09:16:20 AM
I love what Fitz did this year but yesterday he displayed why he has never made it to postseason. Just brutal, it's not all on him. he had a few drops as usual and the D was awful(I think the D was a bigger reason) but Fitz killed us. this team was more talented than the 2009/2010 teams and we couldn't even make the playoffs. one of the worst losses in our history.
I'm disappointed in yesterday's result.
But i am encouraged for the 2016 season. I think the team has something to build on.
Post by: nyjunc on January 04, 2016, 09:26:13 AM
I'm disappointed in yesterday's result.
But i am encouraged for the 2016 season. I think the team has something to build on.
remember this team is very old and had things break perfectly heading into yesterday. we have A LOT of work to do for 2016.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on January 04, 2016, 09:30:51 AM
I love what Fitz did this year but yesterday he displayed why he has never made it to postseason. Just brutal, it's not all on him. he had a few drops as usual and the D was awful(I think the D was a bigger reason) but Fitz killed us. this team was more talented than the 2009/2010 teams and we couldn't even make the playoffs. one of the worst losses in our history.
0 red zone picks all season then he throws one in a situation where we could have taken the lead with a FG. He had a great season, but that was the play we needed him to make more than any other.
Post by: NDMick on January 04, 2016, 09:34:16 AM
remember this team is very old and had things break perfectly heading into yesterday. we have A LOT of work to do for 2016.
The important players are old, yes, but there are a lot of young guys on the defense.
Looking to replace guys like Mangold, Brick, Marshall, Breno, Pace, Cromartie, Revis, and Harris will be difficult in the coming years. Except for Pace. They'll find his replacement somewhere.
Post by: MBGreen on January 04, 2016, 09:38:57 AM
remember this team is very old and had things break perfectly heading into yesterday. we have A LOT of work to do for 2016.
this rings true for the oline, and absolutely needs to be addressed in FA/Draft this offseason.
There are rumors that Colon may retire too.
I trust in this regime to infuse talent into this roster where it's needed. I don't have any reservations like i did when Tanny and Idzik were running the show.
Post by: nyjunc on January 04, 2016, 09:39:14 AM
0 red zone picks all season then he throws one in a situation where we could have taken the lead with a FG. He had a great season, but that was the play we needed him to make more than any other.
he looked spooked all day yesterday, I don't know if it was the moment or the conditions. the wind did not affect Buffalo but it affected us mainly b/c Fitz doesn't throw spirals and balls float in the wind if the spiral isn't tight.
Post by: nyjunc on January 04, 2016, 09:40:51 AM
The important players are old, yes, but there are a lot of young guys on the defense.
Looking to replace guys like Mangold, Brick, Marshall, Breno, Pace, Cromartie, Revis, and Harris will be difficult in the coming years. Except for Pace. They'll find his replacement somewhere.
looking at younger guys to build around what do we really have? Williams, Richardson, Mo(probably as a trade chip) but who else?
Post by: MBGreen on January 04, 2016, 09:43:44 AM
I'm disappointed in yesterday's result.
But i am encouraged for the 2016 season. I think the team has something to build on.
Quote
New York Jets @nyjets 3m3 minutes ago
.@EricDecker87: "There's a foundation being built...If we can find some more pieces to the puzzle we can be okay."
Big Dick and I are on the same page.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on January 04, 2016, 09:45:27 AM
looking at younger guys to build around what do we really have? Williams, Richardson, Mo(probably as a trade chip) but who else?
Marcus Williams and Calvin Pryor. Mauldin looked pretty good this year. Skrine and Gilchrist are relatively young too.
Offense is a whole nother story. They need Devin Smith and Jace Amaro to live up to their draft slots. Or just stay on the field.
Post by: nyjunc on January 04, 2016, 09:50:20 AM
Big Dick and I are on the same page.
what would you expect him to say? I hope he and you are right, I am hopeful but realistically this will not be easy.
Post by: nyjunc on January 04, 2016, 09:51:12 AM
Marcus Williams and Calvin Pryor. Mauldin looked pretty good this year. Skrine and Gilchrist are relatively young too.
Offense is a whole nother story. They need Devin Smith and Jace Amaro to live up to their draft slots. Or just stay on the field.
mauldin definitely, Pryor ok. Skrine? I'll buy it. Marcus Williams? I'm not sure.
Amaro wasn't a favorite of Gailey before he got hurt so we'll see.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on January 04, 2016, 09:55:23 AM
mauldin definitely, Pryor ok. Skrine? I'll buy it. Marcus Williams? I'm not sure.
Amaro wasn't a favorite of Gailey before he got hurt so we'll see.
I'm hopeful that Marcus Williams gets a shot at the starting CB position opposite Revis after Cro gets cut. He outplayed him all year but Cro got the snaps because he's the veteran and has the big contract.
Before the bills game, Williams was tied for 2nd in the league with 6 INTs despite playing only 27% of the snaps on defense.
Post by: Johnny English on January 04, 2016, 10:05:20 AM
I'm hopeful that Marcus Williams gets a shot at the starting CB position opposite Revis after Cro gets cut. He outplayed him all year but Cro got the snaps because he's the veteran and has the big contract.
Before the bills game, Williams was tied for 2nd in the league with 6 INTs despite playing only 27% of the snaps on defense.
I think you can read those stats all sorts of ways. Cromartie played 85% of snaps, more than any other CB on the roster, I'd be interested to see how many times he was targeted versus Williams. If you get targeted a lot you're going to get more opportunities at a pick, especially if you're being asked to cover the WR3/WR4. I don't dislike Williams at all, but I think Cro gets a really unfair crack of the whip on here. I don't think he was bad at all this season, he just earns too much for a CB2.
Post by: nyjunc on January 04, 2016, 10:11:18 AM
Post by: guinness77 on January 04, 2016, 10:24:42 AM
It was on a plate and we collectively dropped it. Since I've had kids my whole "sports watching demeanor" has thankfully dropped a few notches, but this one hurts. Losing in the playoffs would have hurt too, but at least we would have won yesterday and had a sense of accomplishment. Because when it comes down to it, I'd like to fondly remember the Giants comeback or the Pats OT win, but all I'm gonna remember is that we lost in Buffalo.
And...enough of the Rex bullshit. Some of you sound like jilted lovers. We lost to an inferior team within our division. I could care less if Weeb Eubank himself was coaching the Bills, why some of you focus on that blows my mind. We didn't win, we didn't make the playoffs, that's all you "fans" should care about. freak who their coach is.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 11:23:07 AM
Pryor ok.
Calvin Pryor was the most important player on our defense this season besides Mo Wilkerson.
Post by: JFIF on January 04, 2016, 11:26:39 AM
Post by: Murrell2878 on January 04, 2016, 11:27:30 AM
Post by: ukilledkenny on January 04, 2016, 11:28:47 AM
I think you can read those stats all sorts of ways. Cromartie played 85% of snaps, more than any other CB on the roster, I'd be interested to see how many times he was targeted versus Williams. If you get targeted a lot you're going to get more opportunities at a pick, especially if you're being asked to cover the WR3/WR4. I don't dislike Williams at all, but I think Cro gets a really unfair crack of the whip on here. I don't think he was bad at all this season, he just earns too much for a CB2.
Yeah, I seem to remember us all acknowledging he was overpaid when he got his deal but we all still had the previous secondary fresh in our minds and didn't care.
Cro's other reason for getting a lot of hate is that when he gets beat he gets absolutely toasted and just looks bad.
Post by: Johnny English on January 04, 2016, 11:32:51 AM
Yeah, I seem to remember us all acknowledging he was overpaid when he got his deal but we all still had the previous secondary fresh in our minds and didn't care.
Cro's other reason for getting a lot of hate is that when he gets beat he gets absolutely toasted and just looks bad.
That's true, but I think that's at least as much a function of him repeatedly being left in single coverage to accommodate Bowles' blitzing proclivities. If you leave a corner in single man coverage a lot he's going to get beaten sometimes.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 11:33:21 AM
I am looking forward to having Fitz back next year, but it is obvious we need to look for another QB for the future. I like Petty, but I think we should absolutely draft a QB high in the draft if a good one is available to us (in other words not reaching for one).
There are two QB prospects that belong in the first round and they will both be gone in the Top 10.
Jared Goff - QB - California
Paxton Lynch - Memphis
We aren't in the best spot to land a great QB prospect this year. Our best bet is to draft another one in the middle rounds or to just pass on this position altogether and wait until 2017.
If this team takes Connor Cook or Christian Hackenberg in the first round, Florham Park should crumble.
Post by: Johnny English on January 04, 2016, 11:36:14 AM
There are two QB prospects that belong in the first round and they will both be gone in the Top 10.
Jared Goff - QB - California
Paxton Lynch - Memphis
We aren't in the best spot to land a great QB prospect this year. Our best bet is to draft another one in the middle rounds or to just pass on this position altogether and wait until 2017.
If this team takes Connor Cook or Christian Hackenberg in the first round, Florham Park should crumble.
I'm not sure why we'd draft a developmental prospect when we've already got one. I'd like another potential starter on the books, be it a safe vet or be it a swing for the fences move like Kaep or RGIII.
Post by: Murrell2878 on January 04, 2016, 11:36:57 AM
There are two QB prospects that belong in the first round and they will both be gone in the Top 10.
Jared Goff - QB - California
Paxton Lynch - Memphis
We aren't in the best spot to land a great QB prospect this year. Our best bet is to draft another one in the middle rounds or to just pass on this position altogether and wait until 2017.
If this team takes Connor Cook or Christian Hackenberg in the first round, Florham Park should crumble.
I really like Carson Wentz from ND St. I have several of his games on DVD and will be re-watching them over the next few weeks.
I 100% agree on Cook and Hackenberg
Post by: Murrell2878 on January 04, 2016, 11:37:49 AM
I'm not sure why we'd draft a developmental prospect when we've already got one. I'd like another potential starter on the books, be it a safe vet or be it a swing for the fences move like Kaep or RGIII.
We need to find a Franchise QB. And we currently have the safe Vet (or we should have him by re-signing Fitz)
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 11:39:08 AM
I really like Carson Wentz from ND St. I have several of his games on DVD and will be re-watching them over the next few weeks.
Why do you have North Dakota State games on DVD?
Post by: Murrell2878 on January 04, 2016, 11:39:46 AM
Why do you have North Dakota State games on DVD?
LY's playoffs, the game vs. Iowa St. and this year's opener vs Montana st.
Oh... Why??? It's what I do.
Post by: Johnny English on January 04, 2016, 11:41:52 AM
We need to find a Franchise QB.
I understand that. Where are you going to put this new prospect on the roster though? Do you think that Petty is ready to be the QB2? (He might be, I don't know.) If not, are you going to carry four QBs? I doubt you're going to put a fourth round pick on the PS and risk losing him midway through the season to a team that's given up and started retooling.
My point is, I don't think there's room to carry more than one developmental prospect at the position. I think you have to either promote or ditch Petty if you want to add another.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 11:42:48 AM
I don't think he's a Top 20 prospect.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 11:43:49 AM
LY's playoffs, the game vs. Iowa St. and this year's opener vs Montana st.
Oh... Why??? It's what I do.
So the games that are on Youtube?
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 04, 2016, 11:45:38 AM
I'm not sure why we'd draft a developmental prospect when we've already got one. I'd like another potential starter on the books, be it a safe vet or be it a swing for the fences move like Kaep or RGIII.If Geno is gone, I see no problem taking another developmental QB. The goal needs to be to find a longterm answer. I'd be fine with a QB room of Fitz, Petty and a rookie. The backup situation wouldn't be great, but it gives us one more chance at maybe hitting paydirt.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 11:45:42 AM
I understand that. Where are you going to put this new prospect on the roster though? Do you think that Petty is ready to be the QB2? (He might be, I don't know.) If not, are you going to carry four QBs? I doubt you're going to put a fourth round pick on the PS and risk losing him midway through the season to a team that's given up and started retooling.
My point is, I don't think there's room to carry more than one developmental prospect at the position. I think you have to either promote or ditch Petty if you want to add another.
Get rid of Geno Smith and sign another veteran to sit in the room with Fitzpatrick and Petty. I don't think this is the year to get a quarterback.
Jared Goff has been my guy at that position since Derek Carr left the college ranks. He'll probably be a Top 3 pick. We aren't moving from 20 to 3.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 11:47:31 AM
If Geno is gone, I see no problem taking another developmental QB. The goal needs to be to find a longterm answer. I'd be fine with a QB room of Fitz, Petty and a rookie. The backup situation wouldn't be great, but it gives us one more chance at maybe hitting paydirt.
If Amaro and Smith get healthy and the team carries three healthy backs (unlike our situation this year with Ridley sitting on the shelf), I think it'd be okay to carry 4 QBs.
Fitzpatrick, Petty, a veteran free agent, and a mid-to-late round developmental rookie.
Kevin Hogan would be a great fit in that QB room. Dak Prescott would be a cool pick if it's late enough (5 to 7)
Post by: Johnny English on January 04, 2016, 11:49:55 AM
If Geno is gone, I see no problem taking another developmental QB. The goal needs to be to find a longterm answer. I'd be fine with a QB room of Fitz, Petty and a rookie. The backup situation wouldn't be great, but it gives us one more chance at maybe hitting paydirt.
I'm OK with that if the team feels that Petty is ready to wear pads on gameday, which is my point. At that point he's gone from being the project to being the backup, and there's a spot open for a new prospect. We can't go into the season knowing that if Fitz goes down the season is over though.
Get rid of Geno Smith and sign another veteran to sit in the room with Fitzpatrick and Petty. I don't think this is the year to get a quarterback.
That would be my choice. If he's available, you'll have to go some way to persuade me why we shouldn't sign Kaepernick (finances permitting, obviously). I think he could be fantastic in this scheme.
Post by: MBGreen on January 04, 2016, 11:50:54 AM
I'm OK with that if the team feels that Petty is ready to wear pads on gameday, which is my point. At that point he's gone from being the project to being the backup, and there's a spot open for a new prospect. We can't go into the season knowing that if Fitz goes down the season is over though.
That would be my choice. If he's available, you'll have to go some way to persuade me why we shouldn't sign Kaepernick (finances permitting, obviously). I think he could be fantastic in this scheme.
Now that Tomasula is gone, i'm not sure the Niners are going to let Kaep go.
Post by: Johnny English on January 04, 2016, 11:52:04 AM
Now that Tomasula is gone, i'm not sure the Niners are going to let Kaep go.
I don't know if it's Tomsula or Baalke who decided he didn't like him, but I can see a new coach wanting to try and work with Kaepernick which is why I said "if he's available".
Post by: MBGreen on January 04, 2016, 11:54:23 AM
I don't know if it's Tomsula or Baalke who decided he didn't like him, but I can see a new coach wanting to try and work with Kaepernick which is why I said "if he's available".
word
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 11:55:52 AM
That would be my choice. If he's available, you'll have to go some way to persuade me why we shouldn't sign Kaepernick (finances permitting, obviously). I think he could be fantastic in this scheme.
Here's the issues with signing a player like Colin Kaepernick.
Colin Kaepernick will want starting caliber money. He will want to compete for a starting job, which is understandable...but not the best for this team. We have some kind of stability right now, even if it is an obvious transition type of player at the position.
If Kaepernick wins a competition, you're handing the keys over to a player that was disliked by a lot of former teammates. And taking them away from a guy like Fitzpatrick that seems to be universally loved in the locker room. Fitzpatrick is a great player for transition, not competition.
If Kaepernick loses the competition, he will almost certainly act like a child and we'll have lots of money pouting on the sideline.
Post by: Johnny English on January 04, 2016, 12:00:41 PM
Here's the issues with signing a player like Colin Kaepernick.
Colin Kaepernick will want starting caliber money. He will want to compete for a starting job, which is understandable...but not the best for this team. We have some kind of stability right now, even if it is an obvious transition type of player at the position.
If Kaepernick wins a competition, you're handing the keys over to a player that was disliked by a lot of former teammates. And taking them away from a guy like Fitzpatrick that seems to be universally loved in the locker room. Fitzpatrick is a great player for transition, not competition.
If Kaepernick loses the competition, he will almost certainly act like a child and we'll have lots of money pouting on the sideline.
That makes sense. I guess the question is whether Woody, Maccagnan, Bowles et al look at this as a short term project with an ageing team and a desire to win now, or as a longer term project to create a proper developmental process that will build a roster based heavily on our own draft picks. If it's the former, then Kaepernick has the potential to turn a veteran offense into an immediate contender (as well as the potential to create an almighty clusterfuck in the locker room) in a way that Fitz doesn't.
Post by: Johnny English on January 04, 2016, 12:24:42 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 04, 2016, 12:36:17 PM
Geno as a backup is of similar quality to most other mediocre veteran backups we can sign, except he already has a year in the system, and he's younger and cheaper than most other veterans we can sign. Then he can compete with Petty to be the primary backup next season, and we can reevaluate the room after the year.
I think the clubhouse favorite is that the QB room remains the same, unless the FO thinks that Geno is a lost cause and/or Petty is ready to be the primary backup. If Petty is ready to be the primary backup, it's much easier to cut ties with Geno. And of course, if the team has given up on Geno, then you cut/trade him regardless.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 12:40:31 PM
I know everyone hates Geno, but Geno is still young, and he does have starting experience. His starting experience wasn't very good, but what backup QB that we can sign has had starting experience that is willing to sign for very cheap?
Did you not see his stupid comments today?
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 12:47:13 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 12:47:48 PM
Quote
Brandon Marshall on Fitzpatrick: "He earned everything that he’s going to get from respect to a contract. He earned every single bit of it."
More Brandon Marshall on Fitzpatrick: "He just fought all year. I’m just honored to be his teammate. I look forward to a couple more years."
Eric Decker on Ryan Fitzpatrick: "I think everybody would love to have his personality, his leadership & his play-making ability back"
Post by: nyjunc on January 04, 2016, 01:00:42 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on January 04, 2016, 01:02:04 PM
Did you not see his stupid comments today?That he's more motivated next season and not happy with the media? I don't really care about that - that doesn't bother me.
Bowles also said he's 'proud of how Geno handled himself since the punch.'
Neither comments mean much. Geno has to work hard and prove he can be an NFL-caliber quarterback, no matter what he says to the media.
And while Bowles may say publicly he's proud of Geno, we'll know everything we need to know about how he truly feels if we end up dumping Geno for little to no compensation.
Post by: MBGreen on January 04, 2016, 01:18:06 PM
That he's more motivated next season and not happy with the media? I don't really care about that - that doesn't bother me.
Bowles also said he's 'proud of how Geno handled himself since the punch.'
Neither comments mean much. Geno has to work hard and prove he can be an NFL-caliber quarterback, no matter what he says to the media.
And while Bowles may say publicly he's proud of Geno, we'll know everything we need to know about how he truly feels if we end up dumping Geno for little to no compensation.
he can work as hard as he wants...he's not NFL caliber. In fact, he may not even be CFL cailber.
Post by: Italian Seafood on January 04, 2016, 01:21:44 PM
The writers can stop with the 1998 comparisons too, that team was 12-4 with the bye wrapped up in Week 17. Maybe they have, I haven't looked and I'm checking out of football for a while.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 01:26:06 PM
That he's more motivated next season and not happy with the media? I don't really care about that - that doesn't bother me.
To me, Geno implied that he is unhappy being the backup and that he didn't work hard enough.
Just cut him.
Post by: Italian Seafood on January 04, 2016, 01:27:09 PM
To me, Geno implied that he is unhappy being the backup and that he didn't work hard enough.
Just cut him.
I don't need to see any more of him. Petty should at least be qualified to be a backup by next year.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 04, 2016, 01:28:19 PM
I don't need to see any more of him. Petty should at least be qualified to be a backup by next year.
Even if Petty isn't ready, this team can go out and sign an inexpensive veteran player that will at least bring football smarts to the team.
Smith does nothing for this team. Who cares if he's young and cheap?
Post by: nyjunc on January 04, 2016, 01:57:00 PM
Post by: ScotlandJet on January 05, 2016, 11:03:39 AM
Post by: Johnny English on January 05, 2016, 11:38:32 AM
Buffalo fans can freak off and Uproxx can freak off and anyone else who didn't watch the Jets' entire 2015 season to see what Ryan Fitzpatrick actually did for this team can freak off with them.
Post by: nyjunc on January 05, 2016, 11:40:49 AM
I'm really freaking bored of this narrative already. The Bills fans leaping about on Sunday going "Look! See! We told you Fitzpatrick would screw everything up!" annoyed the funbags off me. The guy just broke franchise records, one aberration from his season-long performance does not make them or anyone else trotting out the tired, lazy cliches any more right.
Buffalo fans can freak off and Uproxx can freak off and anyone else who didn't watch the Jets' entire 2015 season to see what Ryan Fitzpatrick actually did for this team can freak off with them.
I want Fitz back, I enjoyed watching him this season but we cannot say "one aberration". it was the biggest game of his life, the biggest game for our franchise since 2010 and while it's not all on him(I give Bowles and the D more blame than Fitz) he is up near the top in terms of blame.
Post by: Johnny English on January 05, 2016, 11:42:29 AM
I want Fitz back, I enjoyed watching him this season but we cannot say "one aberration". it was the biggest game of his life, the biggest game for our franchise since 2010 and while it's not all on him(I give Bowles and the D more blame than Fitz) he is up near the top in terms of blame.
Well, you can freak off with them all as well then. Without Fitz's play in the other 15 games we aren't competing for a playoff spot in week 17 to start with.
Post by: Pope on January 05, 2016, 11:49:35 AM
Offensively: Fitz had 3 INT, Ivory got like 6 carries, Ridley couldn't run the ball effectively, bad drops by the WR, too many 3 and outs
Defensively: Watkins was open on every play, couldn't stop them on 3rd or 4th down, couldn't contain Tyrod and couldn't generate turnovers, DL had a hard time generating pressure
Special Teams: Quigley had a excrement game and a terrible punt early on, Bullock missed FG, terrible field position all game vs incredible field position by Buffalo
On top of all that way too many penalties alongside undisciplined and unprepared play
You can place blame on whoever you want and you would be right but this loss was a complete team effort/failure
Post by: nyjunc on January 05, 2016, 11:51:46 AM
Well, you can freak off with them all as well then. Without Fitz's play in the other 15 games we aren't competing for a playoff spot in week 17 to start with.
Marshall and decker made Fitz, not the other way around. I love what Fitz did but his job was pretty easy w/ all the weapons we had. No, we are not likely in playoff position w/o him but that doesn't absolve turning into old fitz in the biggest game of his life.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 05, 2016, 11:52:43 AM
his job was pretty easy
More clueless than usually today...
Post by: Johnny English on January 05, 2016, 11:54:09 AM
Marshall and decker made Fitz, not the other way around. I love what Fitz did but his job was pretty easy w/ all the weapons we had. No, we are not likely in playoff position w/o him but that doesn't absolve turning into old fitz in the biggest game of his life.
(https://media.giphy.com/media/qeA0jZAlsCHAI/giphy.gif)
Post by: nyjunc on January 05, 2016, 11:54:45 AM
There was a lot of blame to go around on Sunday. Fitz was part of it, but there were plenty of other factors.
Offensively: Fitz had 3 INT, Ivory got like 6 carries, Ridley couldn't run the ball effectively, bad drops by the WR, too many 3 and outs
Defensively: Watkins was open on every play, couldn't stop them on 3rd or 4th down, couldn't contain Tyrod and couldn't generate turnovers, DL had a hard time generating pressure
Special Teams: Quigley had a excrement game and a terrible punt early on, Bullock missed FG, terrible field position all game vs incredible field position by Buffalo
On top of all that way too many penalties alongside undisciplined and unprepared play
You can place blame on whoever you want and you would be right but this loss was a complete team effort/failure
my 3 goats of the game:
1. Bowles- didn't have team prepared or inspired, his use of TOs and the clock was the worst I have ever seen in a big game.
2. defense- allowed Buf to move ball at will and control clock for 40 mins thus limiting opportunity for O.
3. Fitz- I don't blame him for final INT, maybe not even the 2nd INT as he was hit as he threw BUT the first INT was just one you cannot have in that situation under any circumstances.
as bad as that first INT was that was not why we lost, I feel had we kicked a FG and taken the lead the D would have given it right back but he still can't throw that INT.
Post by: nyjunc on January 05, 2016, 11:55:20 AM
More clueless than usually today...
maybe you should go to English class instead breaking down game film?
Post by: Heismanberg on January 05, 2016, 11:57:27 AM
maybe you should go to English class instead breaking down game film?
Maybe you should kill yourself.
Post by: nyjunc on January 05, 2016, 11:59:35 AM
Maybe you should kill yourself.
I am thinking about it, I was going to do it if Fitz came through sunday but alas he failed in the biggest game he has ever played in but we have meaningless records to look back on!
Post by: Heismanberg on January 05, 2016, 12:02:12 PM
I am thinking about it, I was going to do it if Fitz came through sunday but alas he failed in the biggest game he has ever played in but we have meaningless records to look back on!
Yes, we all know you are unhappy when the Jets do well. It's disgusting.
Post by: nyjunc on January 05, 2016, 12:06:12 PM
Yes, we all know you are unhappy when the Jets do well. It's disgusting.
I was pissed Fitz turned back into pre marshall/decker Fitz. I was pissed Bowles did such an awful job in preparation. I wanted the playoffs more than anyone but it wasn't meant to be. Marshall tried to drag us there but couldn't quite do it. I wish Bowles coached like marshall played and the rest of the team played like Marshall. that man transformed our team this year.
Post by: MBGreen on January 05, 2016, 12:55:49 PM
I was pissed Fitz turned back into pre marshall/decker Fitz. I was pissed Bowles did such an awful job in preparation. I wanted the playoffs more than anyone but it wasn't meant to be. Marshall tried to drag us there but couldn't quite do it. I wish Bowles coached like marshall played and the rest of the team played like Marshall. that man transformed our team this year.You keep crying about lack of preparation, yet you keep defending the poopchute who takes the team to Dave and Busters the night before a game.
Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
Post by: Italian Seafood on January 05, 2016, 12:59:06 PM
You keep crying about lack of preparation, yet you keep defending the poopchute who takes the team to Dave and Busters the night before a game.
Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
That was a Buffalo game too, wasn't it? We just haven't matched up well with that team the last few years, regardless what side Rex was on.
Post by: MBGreen on January 05, 2016, 01:01:13 PM
That was a Buffalo game too, wasn't it? We just haven't matched up well with that team the last few years, regardless what side Rex was on.Lets go get a goddamn snack.
/rex preparation
Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
Post by: Tommy on January 05, 2016, 01:15:12 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on January 05, 2016, 01:24:12 PM
We really excrement the bed against buffalo at home earlier this season. That was the time to beat Rex, and our game plan sucked. Both times. I blame the coaches more than the players.
I really don't get letting Watkins just get the first down every time on the same call, when they kept the ball for 9 minutes or whatever it was. You have Revis, how about some help behind him and take away the short route on 3rd and 5? We made good adjustments all year, that one puzzled me.
Post by: ScotlandJet on January 05, 2016, 01:35:15 PM
That was a Buffalo game too, wasn't it? We just haven't matched up well with that team the last few years, regardless what side Rex was on.
Don't go too further back- I recall going there with best team we've had since the SB win and crashing with Penny tearing his Rotator cuff; right there and then our best prospective team for years sunk and Chad was never the same.
That freaking Buffalo is one tough place to play ball and one of the reasons I was pissed about Rex going there.
Post by: ScotlandJet on January 05, 2016, 01:36:59 PM
I really don't get letting Watkins just get the first down every time on the same call, when they kept the ball for 9 minutes or whatever it was. You have Revis, how about some help behind him and take away the short route on 3rd and 5? We made good adjustments all year, that one puzzled me.
Revis was way off the coverage on Wadkins all night. For FFS double him!
Post by: Italian Seafood on January 05, 2016, 01:43:30 PM
Revis was way off the coverage on Wadkins all night. For FFS double him!
We all know Revis isn't as fast as he was, but he's smart. He knew he'd get beat deep and we couldn't afford that, so if he had no help he had to leave cushion. To his credit he didn't get beat deep, even when they tried the trick play, the coaches have to help him deep and let him get up and take away the short route. Especially by the 5th or 6th time.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 05, 2016, 01:43:52 PM
It was decent assumption, considering he scored that way early in the game.
Post by: MBGreen on January 05, 2016, 02:03:18 PM
To be fair to Revis, he was asked to play off coverage and they used a lot of zone against Buffalo because they were afraid Tyrod Taylor was going to hurt them as a scrambler.
It was decent assumption, considering he scored that way early in the game.
only because of a blatant hold on Pryor with no flag thrown.
Post by: Miamipuck on January 05, 2016, 02:06:48 PM
To be fair to Revis, he was asked to play off coverage and they used a lot of zone against Buffalo because they were afraid Tyrod Taylor was going to hurt them as a scrambler.
It was decent assumption, considering he scored that way early in the game.
Yes there are a few articles they didn't want the CB's back to the play.
Post by: Italian Seafood on January 05, 2016, 02:12:56 PM
only because of a blatant hold on Pryor with no flag thrown.
Can't rely on the refs though, if they don't call it you have to adjust accordingly.
We did keep them out of the end zone after early 2nd quarter, just could't get off the field quick enough.
Post by: MBGreen on January 05, 2016, 02:27:00 PM
Can't rely on the refs though, if they don't call it you have to adjust accordingly.
We did keep them out of the end zone after early 2nd quarter, just could't get off the field quick enough.
Of course you don't rely on the refs....but that was a penalty, and should've been called.
Post by: AlioTheFool on January 06, 2016, 01:00:33 PM
Knocking Fitz like he completely failed this team in its biggest game is disingenuous at best.
Post by: JFIF on January 06, 2016, 01:02:45 PM
In support of Fitz, if he gets better protection he doesn't throw at least one of those picks.
If Thompkins makes that catch, we're talking about Sunday's game right now. If Marshall doesn't drop a pass that hit both hands early on, it's at the very least a long first down.
Knocking Fitz like he completely failed this team in its biggest game is disingenuous at best.
Fitz - so he just throws 2?
so if Thompkins can hold the ball on an excellent play made by the defender to knock it out of his hands?
Post by: AlioTheFool on January 06, 2016, 02:05:17 PM
Fitz - so he just throws 2?
so if Thompkins can hold the ball on an excellent play made by the defender to knock it out of his hands?
If he only throws 2, there's a reasonable chance things go a lot better. Only the end zone pick was really completely his fault.
Thompkins had a second chance to catch that ball, and lost it. Yes, it was a good defensive play, but it's not unreasonable to think that a little more concentration would have had Thompkins running free on that play.
Regardless, the overlying point of my post was that pinning the loss on Fitz as though he simply crumbled (to fit a narrative that "Fitz is who he is") and lost the game is BS. This was as much a complete team loss as I think I've ever personally witnessed. Apart from Mo, I don't think there's a guy who isn't partially at fault (maybe Snacks too)--including the coaching staff.
Post by: Badger on January 17, 2016, 10:09:08 AM
http://prod.video.jets.clubs.nfl.com//NYJ/videos/dct/video_audio/2016/01-January/011316---Ryan-Fitzpatrick-Touchdown-Highlight-Draft-2-5000k.mp4
Post by: Johnny English on January 19, 2016, 03:48:34 PM
1. Why does this exist?
2. Where can I get that slow cooker?
http://www.rachaelrayshow.com/recipes/22040_chicken_squares/
Post by: Miamipuck on January 19, 2016, 04:00:28 PM
Post by: Badger on January 19, 2016, 04:43:29 PM
Man Rachel Ray is annoying, she is Fran Drescher of the cooking world.
I'd hit it.
Post by: MBGreen on January 19, 2016, 05:05:52 PM
I'd hit it.She'll bake you a cake afterward too
Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
Post by: Libero_2 on January 19, 2016, 06:26:37 PM
She'll bake you a cake afterward too
Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
Why did you think he was interested?
Post by: Miamipuck on January 19, 2016, 06:44:21 PM
I'd hit it.
With a brick sure.
Post by: MBGreen on January 19, 2016, 06:53:28 PM
Why did you think he was interested?funbags?
Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
Post by: Fenwyr on January 21, 2016, 04:56:38 PM
I'd hit it.
I'd hit both.
Post by: Tommy on January 21, 2016, 07:55:54 PM
Post by: Ignatius J Reilly on January 21, 2016, 08:31:09 PM
I'd hit it.
Ditto
Post by: Coach K on January 22, 2016, 12:37:32 AM
Where's the tennis god of hoo-ha slaying when you need him
Rofl is he dead?
Post by: Pope on January 22, 2016, 07:28:18 AM
Where's the tennis god of hoo-ha slaying when you need him
Rofl is he dead?
624 is gay and is scared to post here because of it
Post by: Miamipuck on January 22, 2016, 07:36:05 AM
624 is gay and is scared to post here because of it
That's the word on the street.
Post by: Heismanberg on January 22, 2016, 09:06:39 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on January 22, 2016, 09:18:59 AM
Post by: Coach K on January 22, 2016, 09:34:52 AM
True Religion Jean's 500
The voices in your head. PRICELESS
Post by: bojanglesman on January 22, 2016, 10:47:27 AM
The Jets aren't going to let him anywhere near free agency. You can bank on him being back here.
Post by: MBGreen on January 22, 2016, 11:43:21 AM
http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york-jets/post/_/id/58096/jets-gm-hopes-to-strike-deal-with-ryan-fitzpatrick-in-near-future
The Jets aren't going to let him anywhere near free agency. You can bank on him being back here.
nice jinx
Post by: bojanglesman on January 22, 2016, 11:52:50 AM
nice jinx
Uhh, I meant Calvin Pace.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on February 18, 2016, 10:27:24 AM
Quote
ESPN Jets reporter Rich Cimini predicts Ryan Fitzpatrick will average $8 million a year on his new deal.
The Jets are widely expected to re-sign Fitzpatrick, but the numbers will be tricky. The journeyman had a career year in 2015, but he is already 33 and failed to live up to a big contract extension in Buffalo. Cimini predicts the final deal will be a three-year, $24 million contract with $12 million guaranteed.
Post by: bojanglesman on February 18, 2016, 10:38:40 AM
I think it will be a little higher because that is what the market is for a QB who played like he did last year. He isn't Chad Henne (he just signed today for $4 million per year to be a definite backup) It's good to be a solid starting QB in a contract year. The only thing that will keep it down is if he plays nice and wants to stay in a good situation. He could easily get more than $8 million on the open market, but it might be worth it to him to stay where he's comfortable (receiving weapons, Chan) than to end up rotting in Cleveland for a few extra million bucks. In the end, he isn't going anywhere. If I were him, I'd stay put as long as the $$ is close.
I still think he'll get closer to $10 million per year, but I could be wrong. And really, all that matters is the first 2 years. I could see a 3 year, $30 million deal that in reality is a 2 year deal with a 3rd year he'll have little chance of seeing. It might average $8 million over the first 2 years.
The only way I could see him leaving is if things fell through with Denver and Osweiler and they threw a bunch of cash at Fitz. Most other teams that would be looking for a QB are in worse situations than the Jets.
Post by: Johnny English on February 23, 2016, 09:52:42 AM
That surprises me somewhat. My abiding memory of his play last season was of him extending plays through his pocket awareness and some decent protection, going through his reads and not doing (many) stupid things because he was rushed.
Post by: ukilledkenny on February 23, 2016, 10:27:04 AM
Fitz had the fourth fastest release in the NFL last season. (http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/198375/quarterbacks-quicker-release-a-product-of-subpar-protection)
That surprises me somewhat. My abiding memory of his play last season was of him extending plays through his pocket awareness and some decent protection, going through his reads and not doing (many) stupid things because he was rushed.
I don't know how they calculate this but all the times he extended the play and ended up scrambling for a few yards probably don't count. Maybe that skews things?
Post by: bojanglesman on February 23, 2016, 11:15:53 AM
Fitz had the fourth fastest release in the NFL last season. (http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/198375/quarterbacks-quicker-release-a-product-of-subpar-protection)
That surprises me somewhat. My abiding memory of his play last season was of him extending plays through his pocket awareness and some decent protection, going through his reads and not doing (many) stupid things because he was rushed.
Step 1: Drop back
Step 2: Find Marshall
Step 3: Heave ball in general direction.
Kidding. Quick release probably masked some of the o-line's deficiencies. Same thing Brady did with his shitty o-line.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 01, 2016, 04:23:08 PM
Quote
Adam Schefter @AdamSchefter 59m59 minutes ago
Eagles gave QB Sam Bradford a two-year, $36 million deal, including $26 million guaranteed, per source.
No way he gets less than $10 million per year.
Post by: Tommy on March 01, 2016, 04:26:24 PM
Well, this new Sam Bradford deal doesn't help the Jets in negotations with Fitz.
No way he gets less than $10 million per year.
Why would they do that when Sanchez is clearly better?
/Badger
Post by: Pope on March 01, 2016, 04:28:26 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 01, 2016, 04:38:30 PM
Holy excrement.. 18 million a year for freaking Bradford
Yeah, it certainly looks like the Eagles panicked and caved to Bradford's agents. There will be a new market niche created now for the middle-of-the-road QB. It used to be that there was elite, shitty, and little in between. Now there are a few QBs that fit that "OK" category. If you have a QB that can keep you competitive, he's valuable. It is what it is.
BTW, whoever Bradford's agent is, he's gonna be getting swamped with business for polishing that turd.
Post by: Pope on March 01, 2016, 04:40:18 PM
Yeah, it certainly looks like the Eagles panicked and caved to Bradford's agents. There will be a new market niche created now for the middle-of-the-road QB. It used to be that there was elite, shitty, and little in between. Now there are a few QBs that fit that "OK" category. If you have a QB that can keep you competitive, he's valuable. It is what it is.I was reading the reddit thread about the contract and people were saying it was a good deal. I don't know what freaking planet those people live on but this just blew the freaking roof off journeyman QB deals. Bradford has never strung together more than 4 good games in a row, whether due to injury or performance or both.
Fitz is gonna be asking for 20 million a year now
Post by: Badger on March 01, 2016, 05:52:00 PM
Why would they do that when Sanchez is clearly better?
/Badger
Sanchez is a much better value.
Post by: Coach K on March 01, 2016, 06:26:49 PM
Gentleman it's now more important than ever to draft a good QB. I'll be dammed if im sinking 18 into my cap for a B grade QB.
If his agent wants to bring this contract to the table he can eat a dick . Fitz should only start here 2 years max . I'd sooner keep Mo n snacks .
Let's just hope he realizes this is his best shot to start and win and will take 9 or 10 per mostly guaranteed.
I was thinking 8 per initially but this changes it a little , even with a conservative outlook
Hell I'm ready to see what Petty has in 17 if we don't make progress this year, Barring we maneuver our way into acquiring a better prospect
Post by: bojanglesman on March 01, 2016, 06:31:18 PM
Quote
Andrew Brandt: Bradford details continued: $11M signing bonus, $7M salary in 2016. $4M of 2017 salary fully guaranteed, another $4M guaranteed for injury.
Looks like $4 million of it is injury only guarantee, so it's just really bad, not terrible.
Post by: Johnny English on March 01, 2016, 07:37:16 PM
Post by: Tommy on March 01, 2016, 07:54:37 PM
I don't think it's going to screw us on Fitz. The conversation goes a bit like this: "Fitz, we like you and you like us. We don't have a huge amount of cap space but we do want to pay you a fair number. You're an intelligent guy - apparently you went to Harvard although no one ever mentions it - so I think we can all be honest with each other and admit that it's obvious that Lurie found Jim Irsay's stash, and that that deal has no bearing on what we're doing here."
Hahahahahaha
Post by: Coach K on March 01, 2016, 08:07:42 PM
im pretty sure they dont ask for 18 per. so i had the epitome of a knee jerk reaction. still stand by it under the given condition his agents would use Bradford as a benchmark though.
2 20 million 12 guaranteed, call it a day
unless the holdup is him fighting for 3 years . guess you front load guaranteed into the first two at a flat rate.
pointless, im just thinking out loud. but im willing to bet he stays, he simply doesnt have a better scenario if winning now is his main motivation.
system, personnel, familiarity with coaches.
Post by: Ornstein on March 02, 2016, 04:17:36 PM
I don't think it's going to screw us on Fitz. The conversation goes a bit like this: "Fitz, we like you and you like us. We don't have a huge amount of cap space but we do want to pay you a fair number. You're an intelligent guy - apparently you went to Harvard although no one ever mentions it - so I think we can all be honest with each other and admit that it's obvious that Lurie found Jim Irsay's stash, and that that deal has no bearing on what we're doing here."
This isn't too far off, a career backup that benefited greatly from the talent around him and an offensive system that played to his strengths shouldn't have the right to dictate a ridiculous contract because other average QB's got paid. The big difference is the ones that got paid still haven't hit their prime while Fitz is likely far past his. The team seems to love him and he loves being here so I'd be very surprised if he started asking for an outrageous contract like the other's got. Also throw in the fact that he'd probably have to uproot his family and relocate them yet again just works in our favor.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 02, 2016, 04:30:37 PM
For instance, most Jets fans would have spontaneous diarrhea if the Jets announced Fitz signed a 3 year, $40 million deal. However, if you throw in a roster bonus for next year (meaning he doesn't get it if he gets cut) and a guarantee structure to where the Jets can cut him next year with a small dead money hit, it isn't bad at all. The only way he'd see the third year is if he miracles his derriere into Dan Marino, in which case you'd gladly fork over $20 million.
You want a QB, you've gotta pay. Or play Geno Smith. That's the way it is. You don't have to like it. Sure, Fitz has motivation to take less from the Jets (Gailey, good receivers, etc), but the Jets have even more motivation to pay him to stay. What the freak are the Jets going to do if he does leave? There isn't jack excrement in the QB market right now.
Post by: Pope on March 02, 2016, 05:47:23 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 02, 2016, 08:03:10 PM
Post by: Tommy on March 02, 2016, 08:13:20 PM
Cimini says Fitz and Bradford have the same representatives.
Well that Fuckn sucks
Post by: Johnny English on March 03, 2016, 12:18:24 PM
No way will Fitz take less than 15 million per year after that Bradford deal
That would put him in Palmer / Dalton territory. You would have to be on drugs if you think he's in that group.
Post by: Pope on March 03, 2016, 12:34:50 PM
That would put him in Palmer / Dalton territory. You would have to be on drugs if you think he's in that group.No but he's only going to get a 2 or 3 year deal I think. On those terms I think the contract will be comparable to Bradford's deal
Post by: Johnny English on March 03, 2016, 12:48:18 PM
Post by: Pope on March 03, 2016, 05:05:54 PM
Bradford is on a prove it deal though. We know what Fitz is. I think he'll be 3/36/18 tops, and possibly less.Hell of a lot of money for a prove it deal
Post by: Johnny English on March 03, 2016, 05:21:03 PM
Hell of a lot of money for a prove it deal
But only two years. They believe he'll play to that value, but they're not stuck with him if he doesn't a la Chicago and Cutler. I don't think he'll justify it, but they don't have an alternative option.
Let's say we offer Fitz 3/30/18 to be our starter. What's his alternative? Is someone going to give him more than that and make him the #1, and give him as good a defense and receiving corps?
Post by: Pope on March 03, 2016, 05:24:20 PM
But only two years. They believe he'll play to that value, but they're not stuck with him if he doesn't a la Chicago and Cutler. I don't think he'll justify it, but they don't have an alternative option.I'm not sure of Fitzpatrick's motives. He may chase the money, I'm not sure. A team with a lot of cap space and a hole at QB may sign him to get franchise-level QB play for a few seasons. With the cap going up I'm not so sure someone like Cleveland or San Francisco may make a play at him for that kind of money.
Let's say we offer Fitz 3/30/18 to be our starter. What's his alternative? Is someone going to give him more than that and make him the #1, and give him as good a defense and receiving corps?
I agree that the Jets are the best current situation for him but if it's a mega contract he wants, which he has every right to as a player, he could very well shop the market.
Post by: Johnny English on March 03, 2016, 05:32:25 PM
Post by: casman02 on March 04, 2016, 03:12:42 PM
Bills: Have Taylor
Dolphins: Tannehill
Pats: Brady
Browns: Wentz/Goff
Bengals: Dalton
Ravens: Flacco
Steelers: Roethlisberger
Houston: Traded him a year ago
Indianapolis: Luck
Jags: Bortles
Titans: Mariota
Chiefs: Smith
Broncos: Osweiller
Raiders: Carr
Chargers: Rivers
Cowboys: Romo
Giants: Manning
Eagles: Bradford
Redskins: Cousins
Packers: Rodgers
Vikings: Teddy
Lions: Stafford
Bears: Cutler
Saints: Brees
Bucs: Winston
Panthers: Cam
Falcons: Ryan
49ers: Goff/Wentz
Cardinals: Palmer
Seahawks: Wilson
Rams: I see them trying to make more of a splash moving to LA(Manning?)/Lynch
I am not saying we need to totally low ball Fitz, but who else would be willing to pay him starter money? I don't know if any team is willing to go more than $10 million per.
Post by: Johnny English on March 04, 2016, 03:16:01 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 04, 2016, 03:21:05 PM
The wildcard is a team like Cleveland or the Rams signing Fitz AND drafting a rookie to sit for a year or two without the pressure of starting year one. Both teams have a crap-ton of cap space to do it. The only problem with that from Fitzpatrick's standpoint is that he wouldn't probably get the length of contract he would with the Jets because he'd have no one breathing down his neck here.
They may let him test the market if it indeed is all dried up. I think he'd at least be willing to come back to the Jets to match the best offer. Hopefully Fitz feels that the offer the Jets make will be his best one and doesn't bother looking.
Post by: dcm1602 on March 04, 2016, 03:23:04 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 04, 2016, 03:24:53 PM
Osweiller is a UFA
I think there's plenty of talk that the Broncos really want to keep him.
Post by: dcm1602 on March 04, 2016, 03:36:36 PM
I think there's plenty of talk that the Broncos really want to keep him.
And unless they tag him, I imagine other teams will too
But since theyre tagging Von Miller...
Post by: bojanglesman on March 04, 2016, 03:44:23 PM
And unless they tag him, I imagine other teams will too
But since theyre tagging Von Miller...
I know it's all about money, but put yourself in his shoes.....you can stay with the team that just won the Super Bowl and will still be strong. He's said multiple times he wants to stay with Denver. He sure as hell doesn't want to go to Cleveland. They'll get something done.
Post by: dcm1602 on March 04, 2016, 03:48:06 PM
I know it's all about money, but put yourself in his shoes.....you can stay with the team that just won the Super Bowl and will still be strong. He's said multiple times he wants to stay with Denver. He sure as hell doesn't want to go to Cleveland. They'll get something done.
It could also be the only chance of his career to get paid. How often do these QBs get monster contracts with a short resume only to suck and never be more than a backup ?
Post by: casman02 on March 04, 2016, 03:48:53 PM
I know it's all about money, but put yourself in his shoes.....you can stay with the team that just won the Super Bowl and will still be strong. He's said multiple times he wants to stay with Denver. He sure as hell doesn't want to go to Cleveland. They'll get something done.
And if he does go to Cleveland/St Louis for whatever reason, that fills one QB hole and Denver is in a worse cap situation than us
Post by: Johnny English on March 04, 2016, 03:55:38 PM
And if he does go to Cleveland/St LouisLos Angeles for whatever reason, that fills one QB hole and Denver is in a worse cap situation than us
FTFY
Post by: Pope on March 04, 2016, 04:56:06 PM
That's fair. I'm assuming that at his age he's going to value security and success as much as money, but you're right that his motives are unknown - at least to us.Let's make a friendly bet. If Fitz gets 15 Million+ per season you jack me off in the portojohn at the next tailgate. If he doesn't then I will shake your hand and admit I was wrong.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 04, 2016, 05:34:04 PM
Let's make a friendly bet. If Fitz gets 15 Million+ per season you jack me off in the portojohn at the next tailgate. If he doesn't then I will shake your hand and admit I was wrong.JE pm'd me and said it's a deal. He was in the pub. He said he'd be willing to jack you off either way.
Post by: Johnny English on March 04, 2016, 05:41:28 PM
Let's make a friendly bet. If Fitz gets 15 Million+ per season you jack me off in the portojohn at the next tailgate. If he doesn't then I will shake your hand and admit I was wrong.
That seems a little..... one-sided. Tempting though it is, I fear I must decline.
Post by: Jumbo on March 07, 2016, 09:00:26 AM
Quote
This is a surprise: #Jets QB Ryan Fitzpatrick is expected to hit the free agent market, sources say. Sides are far apart on a potential deal
Fitzy pls
Post by: Libero_2 on March 07, 2016, 09:05:55 AM
Gonna get ugly around these parts I think.
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 09:07:50 AM
https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/706854897300459520Ugh...
Fitzy pls
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 07, 2016, 09:12:38 AM
The Bradford deal may work against him actually because there's one less team in the QB market. Who is really our competition? Cleveland and the Rams. He isn't going to Cleveland unless they pay him huge sums. Rams might not be a bad spot for him. That's a pretty good team that has failed because of the lack of a QB for years. They have loads of cap space.
In the end, I still feel Fitz will be back on a reasonable deal because there are limited options. The Rams are the wildcard to me.
Post by: Pope on March 07, 2016, 09:13:15 AM
Post by: Coach K on March 07, 2016, 09:14:55 AM
You do not get into a freaking bidding war for two years of Fitzpatrick
No thanks
Post by: bojanglesman on March 07, 2016, 09:15:46 AM
Apparently Denver has high interest in Fitzpatrick. Not sure how much of that is a smokescreen but it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.I can't imagine this is anything but Denver lighting a flame under Osweiler's derriere. It would be a good spot for Fitz though. They want Osweiler to stay, otherwise they wouldn't have made him an offer.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 07, 2016, 09:17:56 AM
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 09:19:22 AM
I expected Fitz to test the market. Why the hell wouldn't he? Doesn't mean he won't be back. He needs to see what he's really worth.He wants to get paid one last time, and after the year he had i don't blame him in the least. Our cap situation is going to be our downfall here.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Libero_2 on March 07, 2016, 09:19:55 AM
I can't imagine this is anything but Denver lighting a flame under Osweiler's derriere. It would be a good spot for Fitz though. They want Osweiler to stay, otherwise they wouldn't have made him an offer.
I keep hearing Rappaport mention us as a suitor for Osweiler if he hits the market. Perhaps a QB swap is in the works?
Post by: Coach K on March 07, 2016, 09:20:20 AM
He wants to get paid one last time, and after the year he had i don't blame him in the least. Our cap situation is going to be our downfall here.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Good for him. I don't want to be tge team that does it
Post by: bojanglesman on March 07, 2016, 09:21:31 AM
He wants to get paid one last time, and after the year he had i don't blame him in the least. Our cap situation is going to be our downfall here.I don't think he will get significant offers unless it's Cleveland or the Rams. There aren't a lot of teams in the QB market that don't have one in the wings waiting to sign.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 07, 2016, 09:25:04 AM
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 09:25:11 AM
I don't think he will get significant offers unless it's Cleveland or the Rams. There aren't a lot of teams in the QB market that don't have one in the wings waiting to sign.If his agent didnt think they would get significant offers, why bother going to market?
I didnt think Bradford was gonna get paid like he did either. Weird excrement happens in this league.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 09:26:20 AM
Relax guys, Josh Freeman just got released. We're fine.When trump is elected, he'll be playing for the Rhein Fire.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Badger on March 07, 2016, 09:27:33 AM
If his agent didnt think they would get significant offers, why bother going to market?
Because they have all the leverage and nothing to lose. If they don't like what the market offers they can most likely come back here and take the original offer, whatever it is.
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 09:28:37 AM
Because they have all the leverage and nothing to lose. If they don't like what the market offers they can most likely come back here and take the original offer, whatever it is.Of course. Or they could come back with a better offer that the jets may not match.
There's significant risk on both sides.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: ukilledkenny on March 07, 2016, 09:29:03 AM
If his agent didnt think they would get significant offers, why bother going to market?
I didnt think Bradford was gonna get paid like he did either. Weird excrement happens in this league.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
We don't know what Duff is offering. Could easily be an offer he expected to be denied if he believed they would test the market no matter what.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 07, 2016, 09:34:24 AM
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 09:37:11 AM
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 09:46:39 AM
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 07, 2016, 09:53:01 AM
Actually, RG3 being released is bad news for Fitz's camp...that will be one less QB hungry suitor to shop his services to.Yep. He's at least a comparable. Doesn't have the good recent play, but much younger, higher ceiling.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 07, 2016, 09:53:21 AM
While Fitz is shopping himself, duff should bring in RG3 for a visit. Might as well look at all options.Ot at least someone else.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Libero_2 on March 07, 2016, 09:54:16 AM
While Fitz is shopping himself, duff should bring in RG3 for a visit. Might as well look at all options.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
What will RGIII get paid do you think? $5 Million? More? I assume he would only take a one year prove it deal, unless somebody offers him 10+ per year.
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 09:56:12 AM
Ot at least someone else.Bring in everybody. If fitz is going shopping, the jets shouldnt be sitting on their thumbs waiting for fitz to come to them with another offer.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 07, 2016, 09:57:58 AM
Bring in everybody. If fitz is going shopping, the jets shouldnt be sitting on their thumbs waiting for fitz to come to them with another offer.Josh Freeman babbie! Reach for the stars!
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 09:58:08 AM
What will RGIII get paid do you think? $5 Million? More? I assume he would only take a one year prove it deal, unless somebody offers him 10+ per year.I would expect he'll sign a prove-it deal. He sat for a year. But he might a desperate team that may offer more (hai Cleveland)
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Coach K on March 07, 2016, 09:58:12 AM
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 09:58:47 AM
Josh Freeman babbie! Reach for the stars!The Jets will be in tough with the Frankfurt Galaxy for Joe Blacco.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Coach K on March 07, 2016, 10:09:10 AM
The Jets will be in tough with the Frankfurt Galaxy for Joe Blacco.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
The Claymores and Fire are in the hunt too
Post by: bojanglesman on March 07, 2016, 10:16:22 AM
Post by: Coach K on March 07, 2016, 10:34:59 AM
The Jets might even want him to test the market.
Strong possibility .
He might find out Bradford only got Bradford money because , well, eaglols
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 07, 2016, 11:00:45 AM
Bring in everybody. If fitz is going shopping, the jets shouldnt be sitting on their thumbs waiting for fitz to come to them with another offer.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
It's time to find out what Geno can do, once and for all.
See you guys in a few months.
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 11:04:13 AM
It's time to find out what Geno can do, once and for all.We already know what he can do...he can die in fires.
See you guys in a few months.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Libero_2 on March 07, 2016, 11:07:04 AM
It's time to find out what Geno can do, once and for all.
See you guys in 12 months.
Fixed your post.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 07, 2016, 11:08:37 AM
It's time to find out what Geno can do, once and for all.
See you guys in a few months.
Give him the Devils earring.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 07, 2016, 11:39:24 AM
Apparently Denver has high interest in Fitzpatrick. Not sure how much of that is a smokescreen but it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.
If Brock Osweiler turns down Denver's offer, he is a moron.
Post by: AlioTheFool on March 07, 2016, 12:04:11 PM
Right now there isn't enough money to make this year competitive. If Fitz wants anything in the Bradford neighborhood it's time to suck it up and deal with a youth-focused rebuild. We might have to live with a camp battle between Geno and Petty with a draftee in line to hold the clipboard. We need a younger secondary and to get younger on the OL. We also need a whole stable of LBs and RBs. If we're in rebuild mode we also need to start thinking post-Marshall.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 07, 2016, 12:05:18 PM
I can't believe I'm saying this now but maybe we should let Fitz walk. We need to keep Snacks. We're likely going to have to pay Mo this year because it doesn't appear suitors are lining up for a trade.
As much as I love Damon Harrison, quarterback is far more important than nose tackle.
Post by: Libero_2 on March 07, 2016, 12:23:55 PM
As much as I love Damon Harrison, quarterback is far more important than nose tackle.
But is one, maybe two years of solid (at best) QB play from Fitzpatrick, worth more than 4-5 years of an elite NT?
That's really the question Duff has to ask, weigh and answer in the next few days
Post by: Heismanberg on March 07, 2016, 12:26:14 PM
But is one, maybe two years of solid (at best) QB play from Fitzpatrick, worth more than 4-5 years of an elite NT?
Did you forget what it was like during the Sanchez and Smith years?
Snacks is a hell of a player, but nose tackle is not valuable...especially when we already have three great defensive linemen on our roster.
I've talked about this for years. Years. We have invested way too much into the defensive line and now it's come back to bite us.
Post by: Laxin on March 07, 2016, 12:26:32 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on March 07, 2016, 12:27:09 PM
Hypethetical... would you prefer Fitzpatrick at 2 years 32M, or RGIII at 1 year 5M?
Trick Question: the answer is Chase Daniel
Post by: Libero_2 on March 07, 2016, 12:33:27 PM
Did you forget what it was like during the Sanchez and Smith years?Of course I haven't forgotten, I just started a Paxton lynch thread this morning, because I sure as hell don't want to go back those days. But I also don't want to get into a bidding war for an average QB. I'd rather see what Petty has than that, especially since there is a chance if he's awful, we end up at the top of the draft where we can get a legitimate prospect.
Snacks is a hell of a player, but nose tackle is not valuable...especially when we already have three great defensive linemen on our roster.
I've talked about this for years. Years. We have invested way too much into the defensive line and now it's come back to bite us.
I want to keep Fitz, but it's still Duffs decision whether one/two years of Fitz is worth more than 4-5 years of Snacks.
No one is arguing we didn't over invest in the DL, we did. But we also haven't connected on basically any other prospects no matter where else we drafted them.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 07, 2016, 12:48:10 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on March 07, 2016, 12:49:46 PM
Fitz is a dumbass if he thinks it's a good move for him to sign with any team that doesn't have Brandon Marshall
Hopkins?
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 07, 2016, 12:50:27 PM
if we still had Idzik we would have the cap space we need and this wouldn't be an issue.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 07, 2016, 12:50:46 PM
Fitz is a dumbass if he thinks it's a good move for him to sign with any team that doesn't have Brandon MarshallAll about perception. He isn't going anywhere
Post by: Johnny English on March 07, 2016, 12:52:24 PM
Hopkins?
Not sure Fitz has the arm to really play to Nuk's strengths.
Post by: Johnny English on March 07, 2016, 12:52:47 PM
This all boils down to one thing:
if we still had Idzik we wouldn't have signed Fitz in the first place and this wouldn't be an issue.
FTFY
Post by: Coach K on March 07, 2016, 12:55:47 PM
Lol good alley oop fellas
Post by: Miamipuck on March 07, 2016, 12:58:44 PM
Not sure Fitz has the arm to really play to Nuk's strengths.
You don't think Fitz can get the ball within 6 feet of him? That's his strength.
Post by: MBGreen on March 07, 2016, 01:39:49 PM
As much as I love Damon Harrison, quarterback is far more important than nose tackle.
some clown from bleacherreport is claiming the Jets can't afford Snacks, and that the Titans are going to go hard after him.
That's the only thing i hate about the offseason, weeding through the bullshit.
Post by: Pope on March 07, 2016, 01:43:40 PM
I think we're all in for 2016/2017
Edit: unfortunately I doubt Snacks will stay given our cap situation
Post by: AlioTheFool on March 07, 2016, 02:21:37 PM
As much as I love Damon Harrison, quarterback is far more important than nose tackle.
Did you forget what it was like during the Sanchez and Smith years?
Snacks is a hell of a player, but nose tackle is not valuable...especially when we already have three great defensive linemen on our roster.
I've talked about this for years. Years. We have invested way too much into the defensive line and now it's come back to bite us.
Of course QB is the most important position on a football roster. You'll get no argument from me. The problem is: Fitzpatrick isn't a franchise QB. Regardless of what we sign him for, he's here another 3 years tops.
In the meantime we'd have lost Snacks which is a blow to that line. If you want to say we still have 3 elite linemen after that, okay, but then you're banking on keeping Mo and Sheldon, and how much are you willing to pay the two of them? Personally, I'd rather pay Sheldon and Snacks a lower total and just suffer the loss of Mo. Then spend that money elsewhere.
If I thought it was possible to fill enough holes in the short term to be competitive I'd be okay with opening the checkbook to Fitz. If he wants Bradford money, with this team, he's crazy and I'd let him walk. There just isn't enough talent (and especially depth) on this team to justify paying a short-term answer like a long-term solution.
Post by: Johnny English on March 07, 2016, 02:38:22 PM
I just don't want to have to watch Geno Smith next year.
Post by: AlioTheFool on March 07, 2016, 02:55:25 PM
The secondary is probably okay. Williams should hopefully be able to do what Cro did last year, if not more. The LBs are a huge question mark though. If we let Snacks walk, then Mo, Sheldon, and Williams have to play the line full-time.
On offense, we have zero running backs right now. That hole has to be filled. After Marshall and Decker we have nothing but question marks at WR. Our "best" TE right now is Amaro, coming off a year he didn't play. Brick and Mangold are still solid starters, and Breno is okay, but after that it gets shaky.
There is also zero depth on this team at any position. If any starter goes down, the dropoff is severe.
I just don't see how we can afford to be an all-in team if we pay Fitzpatrick like Bradford. I really don't see a realistic way we're an all-in team at all.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 07, 2016, 02:55:39 PM
I guess the question is, what are we trying to achieve? If as Pope suggests we're all in and going for it, we need a better QB than Fitz. If we're trying to stay relevant while we re-tool, he's a perfect stopgap but only the right price.
I just don't want to have to watch Geno Smith any year.
fixed for you.....
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 07, 2016, 03:53:35 PM
I guess the question is, what are we trying to achieve? If as Pope suggests we're all in and going for it, we need a better QB than Fitz. If we're trying to stay relevant while we re-tool, he's a perfect stopgap but only the right price.
I just don't want to have to watch Geno Smith next year.
Pope lays out exactly why we sign Fitz for a year or two. Nice to say we need a better QB but where do we get one? Fitz has a year in with this offense, we have a ton of veterans, take a shot. What we're trying to achieve is winning a Super Bowl, either way the whole thing is being rebuilt in a year or two so you might as well go for it now.
Post by: insanity on March 07, 2016, 04:27:54 PM
I guess the question is, what are we trying to achieve? If as Pope suggests we're all in and going for it, we need a better QB than Fitz. If we're trying to stay relevant while we re-tool, he's a perfect stopgap but only the right price.
I just don't want to have to watch Geno Smith next year.
Why do we need a better quarterback than Fitz to win the Super Bowl?
Post by: Johnny English on March 07, 2016, 05:25:13 PM
Why do we need a better quarterback than Fitz to win the Super Bowl?
Because he has never played a playoff game and while it's possible that at the first taste of postseason action he'll go full Eli, the odds would suggest that flaky pressured Fitz is more likely to show his face.
Post by: Libero_2 on March 07, 2016, 06:45:04 PM
Because he has never played a playoff game and while it's possible that at the first taste of postseason action he'll go full Eli, the odds would suggest that flaky pressured Fitz is more likely to show his face.I'd also add, we don't have the 2000 ravens or 2015 bronco's defense either
Post by: Badger on March 07, 2016, 06:59:15 PM
I'd also add, we don't have the 2000 ravens or 2015 bronco's defense either
We will once we draft our nth consecutive defensive player in the first round.
Post by: Libero_2 on March 07, 2016, 07:11:22 PM
We will once we draft our nth consecutive defensive player in the first round.
N=7
Post by: Miamipuck on March 07, 2016, 07:14:25 PM
We will once we draft our nth consecutive defensive player in the first round.
Studies have shown the best teams in the league consistently draft defense in the first round.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 07, 2016, 07:48:47 PM
Post by: Johnny English on March 07, 2016, 08:23:56 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on March 07, 2016, 09:13:54 PM
"Manish Mehta in sensible article shocker"
He has been solid since Todd Bowles took over. He occasionally writes some garbage (like his free agency preview), but most of his articles have been pretty fair.
Post by: Badger on March 07, 2016, 09:50:02 PM
He has been solid since Todd Bowles took over. He occasionally writes some garbage (like his free agency preview), but most of his articles have been pretty fair.
Give it time.
Post by: Libero_2 on March 07, 2016, 10:14:09 PM
Give it time.
If we lose Fitz or Snacks in the next week, you better believe the fire mcCagnan train will be conducted by Manish
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 08, 2016, 05:56:53 AM
I'm not sure where my breaking point is, but I don't want to make a long-term commitment for major guaranteed money to Fitz. I also don't blame Fitz for trying to get his last major contract of his career and wants to play his leverage against the Jets. It's a tricky contract considering how quarterbacks are paid absurd amounts of money.
It's making more sense to draft quarterbacks just so you don't have to pay them for a while. But even that could cause issues down the line - look at the Cousins and Osweiler negotations.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 08, 2016, 06:25:02 AM
Post by: Johnny English on March 08, 2016, 07:44:45 AM
Post by: Libero_2 on March 08, 2016, 07:58:26 AM
Denver are almost as fucked as us on cap space.
The difference is Fitz probably takes Denvers offer of 3 yrs for 45 million, if Psweiler doesn't.
Post by: insanity on March 08, 2016, 10:56:39 AM
Because he has never played a playoff game and while it's possible that at the first taste of postseason action he'll go full Eli, the odds would suggest that flaky pressured Fitz is more likely to show his face.
As it stands there are 11-13 teams whose quarterback is definitely better than ours. That is 33% of the league.
- Pats
Panthers
Packers
Seahawks
Steelers
Giants
Cardinals
Cowboys
Saints
Ravens
Colts
Chargers
Falcons
Out of those 13 quarterbacks, only 8 have the playoff experience you are looking for (25% of league).
We are not going to get that quarterback so many of us covet. It's just not going to happen anytime in the near future so you work with what you have. And what we have is a quarterback that broke just about, every offensive passing and receiving record we've ever had. Let's stop wishing we had a better quarterback and start focusing on how we can build a team that best complements Fitz's skills.
In Gailey's system Fitz is good enough to win a Super Bowl.
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 08, 2016, 01:41:15 PM
Because he has never played a playoff game and while it's possible that at the first taste of postseason action he'll go full Eli, the odds would suggest that flaky pressured Fitz is more likely to show his face.
Who else you got then? I'm not against an upgrade but it seems like Fitzpatrick is our best option in the immediate time frame. Just because he hasn't done it before, who is out there that has? Doesn't mean you throw in the towel with veterans like Brick, Mangold, Revis, Marshall, Decker, etc on the team. You take your best shot with the best option you have.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 08, 2016, 01:42:03 PM
As it stands there are 11-13 teams whose quarterback is definitely better than ours. That is 33% of the league.
- Pats
Panthers
Packers
Seahawks
Steelers
Giants
Cardinals
Cowboys
Saints
Ravens
Colts
Chargers
Falcons
Out of those 13 quarterbacks, only 8 have the playoff experience you are looking for (25% of league).
We are not going to get that quarterback so many of us covet. It's just not going to happen anytime in the near future so you work with what you have. And what we have is a quarterback that broke just about, every offensive passing and receiving record we've ever had. Let's stop wishing we had a better quarterback and start focusing on how we can build a team that best complements Fitz's skills.
In Gailey's system Fitz is good enough to win a Super Bowl.
Nice research piece. Here's mine:
This team is not good enough to win a Super Bowl with Ryan Fitzpatrick taking up $15-18 million of cap space per year.
Post by: Johnny English on March 08, 2016, 01:59:40 PM
Who else you got then? I'm not against an upgrade but it seems like Fitzpatrick is our best option in the immediate time frame. Just because he hasn't done it before, who is out there that has? Doesn't mean you throw in the towel with veterans like Brick, Mangold, Revis, Marshall, Decker, etc on the team. You take your best shot with the best option you have.
I'm not saying that there is a better option available to us, I'm saying that there's a price at which he's not worth paying given this team isn't really very close to being a contender. Honestly, I'd rather keep players with plenty of playing time left e.g. Snacks and Powell ahead of overpaying Fitz. I like Fitz, but I suspect that you could plug in one or two other vets to this team and get a similar return. We aren't going to contend until we find a leader, which means we need to keep drafting them.
Nice research piece. Here's mine:
This team is not good enough to win a Super Bowl with Ryan Fitzpatrick taking up $15-18 million of cap space per year.
A better way of saying what I took more words to say. Fitz has a value point and $15M+ isn't it.
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 08, 2016, 02:08:52 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on March 08, 2016, 02:14:12 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 08, 2016, 02:15:22 PM
I'd rather have Damon Harrison and 2 other solid players with Petty/Geno/rookie starting than giving Fitz $15M and losing Snacks. Resigning Fitz is definitely more important than resigning Snacks, but only within reason.
I'd rather trade Mo, get a high draft pick and free up cash to re-sign Snacks and Fitz. But the timing may not allow that to happen. Snacks might be gone before it's possible. I don't like the idea of trading Wilkerson, but it may make the most sense now.
Serious question, what would we do with a DL of Wilk, Leonard, and Sheldon for at least 2 more years, considering we were playing Sheldon at OLB some last year just to get him snaps? The only thing I can think of is become a 4-3 team, but I'm quite sure Bowles doesn't want to do that beyond situationally.
Post by: Johnny English on March 08, 2016, 02:16:08 PM
I'd rather have Damon Harrison and 2 other solid players with Petty/Geno/rookie starting than giving Fitz $15M and losing Snacks. Resigning Fitz is definitely more important than resigning Snacks, but only within reason.
I suspect that this is also the team's view, hence why Fitz has the opportunity to test the market.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 08, 2016, 02:17:59 PM
Post by: MBGreen on March 08, 2016, 02:22:29 PM
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 08, 2016, 02:24:27 PM
Fitz will come crawling back
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
(http://lolsnaps.com/upload_pic/RonSwansondoesnotlikefruit-57545.gif)
Post by: Miamipuck on March 08, 2016, 02:26:03 PM
Fitz will come crawling back
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
I actually meant this:
(http://i1116.photobucket.com/albums/k569/ksoob/Reactions/Gif-Exactly.gif)
Post by: insanity on March 08, 2016, 02:31:43 PM
Nice research piece. Here's mine:
This team is not good enough to win a Super Bowl with Ryan Fitzpatrick taking up $15-18 million of cap space per year.
Agreed. Although there are a number of teams that need a quarterback I think the only team we could be competing against is the Rams as we don't know who their Offensive Coordinator is. Understanding Fisher's ball control coaching style, and the fact that they have Todd Gurley to run the rock, I don't think Fitz is the best fit.
Fitz needs to be in a shotgun offense. The Browns, Texans, Broncos and likely the Rams will have a more run oriented, under center scheme. Chip Kelly will run a Shotgun offense, but Cap is a better scheme fit.
I don't see anyone else competing with us for Fitz's services and for this reason I think $10-$12 mil a year (max) will get it done.
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 08, 2016, 03:25:39 PM
I'm saying that there's a price at which he's not worth paying given this team isn't really very close to being a contender.
I see this every year, even the years we won playoff games. There's people who always think we're five years away in a league where almost everyone is transient.
We already are a contender, we went 10-6 and missed the playoffs on tie-breakers. You plug the same QB in with the same OC, veteran line and WRs, you have a good D, you're a contender. If we were coming off another 4-12 I'd be more in agreement, but I'm not sure what you're waiting for. Nobody is saying sign him to a big long term deal, but for a season or two he seems to be the guy if we're going to at least try to win. And if we're not, why keep all the other veterans?
Post by: Heismanberg on March 08, 2016, 03:26:07 PM
I'd rather have Damon Harrison and 2 other solid players with Petty/Geno/rookie starting than giving Fitz $15M and losing Snacks. Resigning Fitz is definitely more important than resigning Snacks, but only within reason.
Please stop mentioning Geno Smith in posts.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 08, 2016, 03:31:50 PM
Please stop mentioning Geno Smith in posts.Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith 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Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith Geno Smith
Post by: Heismanberg on March 08, 2016, 03:35:10 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on March 08, 2016, 03:41:41 PM
The difference between you and Mack is that you actually know that Geno Smith is pure excrement.
hahah 99.99999999999999999999999999999 %
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 08, 2016, 06:30:52 PM
Please stop mentioning Geno Smith in posts.No one talks Geno Smith as much as you do. I make a throwaway reference to Geno Smith, and now we have 5 straight posts about him, because of you.
Why are you so obsessed with Geno Smith?
Post by: Heismanberg on March 08, 2016, 06:34:57 PM
No one talks Geno Smith as much as you do. I make a throwaway reference to Geno Smith, and now we have 5 straight posts about him, because of you.
Why are you so obsessed with Geno Smith?
I am obsessed with the end of Geno Smith.
Post by: Badger on March 08, 2016, 06:55:19 PM
Post by: reuben on March 08, 2016, 10:29:40 PM
Post by: MBGreen on March 08, 2016, 10:31:46 PM
Post by: Badger on March 08, 2016, 10:38:50 PM
If you rearrange the letters in Geno Smith, you get "something," which is more than we should expect from Geno Smith moving forward.
5 honks
Post by: Fenwyr on March 09, 2016, 12:39:36 AM
If you rearrange the letters in Geno Smith, you get "something," which is more than we should expect from Geno Smith moving forward.
Brilliant. LOL
Post by: Coach K on March 09, 2016, 09:21:35 AM
If you rearrange the letters in Geno Smith, you get "something," which is more than we should expect from Geno Smith moving forward.
Alright everyone , go home for the day. Reuben won
Post by: bojanglesman on March 09, 2016, 10:00:36 AM
Quote
Ian Rapoport @RapSheet 14m14 minutes ago
If the #Broncos lose QB Brock Osweiler, expect them to come after QB Colin Kaepernick. That appears to be their backup plan.
Good for us if true. QB market withering away for Fitz.
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 09, 2016, 10:43:46 AM
If you rearrange the letters in Geno Smith, you get "something," which is more than we should expect from Geno Smith moving forward.
That is brilliant. You are the first person to ever get something out of Geno Smith.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 09, 2016, 10:51:36 AM
That is brilliant. You are the first person to ever get something out of Geno Smith.
This is patently false:
(http://usatthebiglead.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/geno-smith-fumbles-against-titans.gif)
(http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/18zjoa9l75h0mgif/ku-xlarge.gif)
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-M-NWdO2cRa0/UjKDT1-pLAI/AAAAAAAAAhk/Gn5QRE3lJDs/s1600/GENOIN1.gif)
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 09, 2016, 10:55:48 AM
Post by: Andrew Ryan on March 09, 2016, 11:11:36 AM
Post by: Coach K on March 09, 2016, 11:12:34 AM
I don't buy this team as a serious contender even with Fitz at quarterback so if he's demanding more than $25 mil over two years, he can kindly move on.
26 would be my sticking point . But I agree fundamentally
Post by: Coach K on March 09, 2016, 11:13:47 AM
Then you can overpay for 2 years
All it would really tell you is petty is nowhere near ready this yr
Post by: Miamipuck on March 09, 2016, 11:25:06 AM
LOL I stand corrected. You forgot the infamous behind the back move.
Oddly that's the one play I had in mind but couldn't find a gif and/or didn't have time to really look.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 09, 2016, 11:25:27 AM
26 would be my sticking point . But I agree fundamentally
+2
Post by: AlioTheFool on March 09, 2016, 11:26:16 AM
If you are, you sign him and hope you can restructure Brick, Breno, and maybe Mangold and Marshall. You spend what you can to keep Mo and Snacks and hope you can find a RB in the draft who can play from day 1. You also have to find LBs in FA. You're mortgaging the future (and possibly losing Sheldon after next year) but this is a one-shot deal. After that, nothing is tenable anymore anyway.
If you're ready to rebuild, you let Fitz walk. You dump Breno and/or Brick and use that money to sign Mo and Snacks at whatever the market dictates they're worth. Stock up on OL and LB in the draft. See if you can bring back Powell on a reasonable deal. And, as much as I hate to say it, you go into camp with Geno as the starter and hope Petty shows enough in camp to take the job by midway through the season.
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 09, 2016, 11:27:11 AM
I don't buy this team as a serious contender even with Fitz at quarterback so if he's demanding more than $25 mil over two years, he can kindly move on.
I think the only way we are a contender is with Fitz, but I don't think he's nearly that valuable to any other team.
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 09, 2016, 11:29:28 AM
Oddly that's the one play I had in mind but couldn't find a gif and/or didn't have time to really look.
That play does stick out, kind of sums up Geno. I don't know where you would find any of the sh*t either.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 09, 2016, 11:29:54 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on March 09, 2016, 11:30:44 AM
Jets will sign Sanchez and Tebow to pair with Geno. Volunteer for Hard Knocks.
If the Jets were to sign Sanchez I would want to be on Hard Knocks.
Post by: insanity on March 09, 2016, 11:33:05 AM
I don't buy this team as a serious contender even with Fitz at quarterback so if he's demanding more than $25 mil over two years, he can kindly move on.
If we resign Fitz, I challenge you to name 4 teams that are considerably better on paper than the Jets in the AFC.
1. Pats
2. Steelers
3. ?
4. ?
I don't want to bet our future on Fitz either, but your pessimism is ridiculous.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 09, 2016, 11:34:22 AM
If we resign Fitz, I challenge you to name 4 teams that are considerably better on paper than the Jets in the AFC.
1. Pats
2. Steelers
3. ?
4. ?
I don't want to bet our future on Fitz either, but your pessimism is ridiculous.
Raiders and Jags. Seriously. Maybe not hugely better, but they are both stacking the deck this offseason.
Also Broncos, Chiefs. If the Texans land a QB, put them on the list.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 09, 2016, 11:34:35 AM
That play does stick out, kind of sums up Geno. I don't know where you would find any of the sh*t either.
Googled: Geno Smith gifs
lol it was that simple, I knew nothing good (for Jets fans) was going to come out of that.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on March 09, 2016, 11:40:00 AM
If we resign Fitz, I challenge you to name 4 teams that are considerably better on paper than the Jets in the AFC.
1. Pats
2. Steelers
3. ?
4. ?
I don't want to bet our future on Fitz either, but your pessimism is ridiculous.
Just trying to be realistic. As history shows, it's extremely difficult to make it to, let alone win, a Super Bowl with a quarterback with limitations as pronounced as Fitzpatrick's. Unless our defense is on par with the 2000 Ravens or last year's Broncos, we're not winning a championship. If that's our ultimate goal, we should be making decisions that are in the best long-term interests of our team.
Post by: insanity on March 09, 2016, 11:41:26 AM
Raiders and Jags. Seriously. Maybe not hugely better, but they are both stacking the deck this offseason.
Also Broncos, Chiefs. If the Texans land a QB, put them on the list.
Yeah, No.
The Raiders and Jags have improved, but you can't say they are teams the Jets are likely to lose to, even with the additions they've made. No one knows what the Broncos are going to get out of Brock. I like him as a prospect, but that offense isn't scaring anyone. The Broncos are also losing their starting MLB, DE, and RG.
I'll agree with the Chiefs
Post by: insanity on March 09, 2016, 11:43:23 AM
Just trying to be realistic. As history shows, it's extremely difficult to make it to, let alone win, a Super Bowl with a quarterback with limitations as pronounced as Fitzpatrick's. Unless our defense is on par with the 2000 Ravens or last year's Broncos, we're not winning a championship. If that's our ultimate goal, we should be making decisions that are in the best long-term interests of our team.
And it's extremely difficult to get a quarterback that is elite...
Is your strategy to just suck until we find our franchise quarterback?
Post by: Coach K on March 09, 2016, 11:44:46 AM
If we resign Fitz, I challenge you to name 4 teams that are considerably better on paper than the Jets in the AFC.
1. Pats
2. Steelers
3. ?
4. ?
I don't want to bet our future on Fitz either, but your pessimism is ridiculous.
Dunno if it's Pessimism as much as just refusing to pay Fitz like a franchise qb .
The fact Bradford is overpaid and Cousins is on a franchise tag shouldn't let us cave into the Asamougha inflation equivalent of the 3rd tier qb market lol
If we lose Snacks and consider moving Mo in order to keep Fitz the move is justifiably open for criticism.
Especially predicated off 1 good season .
Fitz is worth keeping to remain competitive . Not arguable .
Just have to have tgat conversation of how much future talent do you sacrifice for him?
I don't see these players 40 percent of our cap is tied to being here in 1 or 2 years
So yeah the all in argument can be made . It'd just be a very meh all in build on paper ..
We're one injury away from the offense being dysfunctional because of no depth .
This team is just in a freaking limbo of bloated deals of yesteryear and the money Duff threw around to be competitive overnight .
TLDR version Add the Broncos. The Jets are likely in a fight for 4th spot between the Bengals and Texans (if they can get a QB)
We're competitive and should be a preseason favorite to return
But we're also a Revis injury away from getting carved on pass d.
So much to assume we can just get over the hump n all we have to do is tie up roughly 30 mil for two years of a B+ QB.
A case cam be made for either way .
Post by: Andrew Ryan on March 09, 2016, 11:45:11 AM
If we resign Fitz, I challenge you to name 4 teams that are considerably better on paper than the Jets in the AFC.
1. Pats
2. Steelers
3. ?
4. ?
I don't want to bet our future on Fitz either, but your pessimism is ridiculous.
You're right about not that many teams being better than us (at least on paper) but having a less-than-elite quarterback is a hurdle that most teams are incapable of overcoming in the playoffs.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on March 09, 2016, 11:49:24 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 09, 2016, 11:51:43 AM
We DID lose to the Raiders. Before they got better this offseason. We should have lost to the Jags. Both teams are loading up with free agents and have up and coming QBs.
Yeah, No.
The Raiders and Jags have improved, but you can't say they are teams the Jets are likely to lose to, even with the additions they've made. No one knows what the Broncos are going to get out of Brock. I like him as a prospect, but that offense isn't scaring anyone. The Broncos are also losing their starting MLB, DE, and RG.
I'll agree with the Chiefs
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 09, 2016, 11:54:05 AM
You're right about not that many teams being better than us (at least on paper) but having a less-than-elite quarterback is a hurdle that most teams are incapable of overcoming in the playoffs.
But it can be done, we did it with Sanchez, and a veteran guy like Fitz is the kind of guy you can do it with. I don't see a better option out there that gives us a better chance.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on March 09, 2016, 11:57:44 AM
If we can re-sign Fitz on a short-term deal (allowing our rookie QB a year or two to develop), that would obviously be the optimal scenario, but that should not prevent us from doing what's in the best long-term interests of our team. I believe that's what Maccagnan is thinking about right now.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 09, 2016, 12:00:27 PM
Yeah, No.
The Raiders and Jags have improved, but you can't say they are teams the Jets are likely to lose to, even with the additions they've made. No one knows what the Broncos are going to get out of Brock. I like him as a prospect, but that offense isn't scaring anyone. The Broncos are also losing their starting MLB, DE, and RG.
I'll agree with the Chiefs
The Raiders kicked the excrement out of the Jets and they have done nothing but improve.
Post by: Andrew Ryan on March 09, 2016, 12:04:40 PM
But it can be done, we did it with Sanchez, and a veteran guy like Fitz is the kind of guy you can do it with. I don't see a better option out there that gives us a better chance.
But we still only made it as far as the AFC championship game, and we returned to being a mediocre team after only two years of making the playoffs.
We need to prioritize finding a young franchise quarterback (easier said than done, I know) if we're to have any long-term success and, finally, win a championship.
Post by: Coach K on March 09, 2016, 12:11:12 PM
The Raiders kicked the excrement out of the Jets and they have done nothing but improve.
I'd take that roster over ours in a heartbeat
Post by: Miamipuck on March 09, 2016, 12:14:49 PM
I'd take that roster over ours in a heartbeat
I would agree, better young talent.
Post by: MexJetinBcn on March 09, 2016, 12:32:48 PM
The Raiders kicked the excrement out of the Jets and they have done nothing but improve.
And then they proceeded to suck for the rest of the season. The problem with talented young players is that you never know if they are actually going to pan out or not. The potential is there but, will they fulfil it?
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 09, 2016, 01:05:59 PM
But we still only made it as far as the AFC championship game, and we returned to being a mediocre team after only two years of making the playoffs.
We need to prioritize finding a young franchise quarterback (easier said than done, I know) if we're to have any long-term success and, finally, win a championship.
Not necessarily true. We didn't lose those AFC Championship games because of our QB, and we returned to being a mediocre team in part because we couldn't afford to keep some players, others got old and Sanchez never turned into that franchise QB to cover those losses.
Right now we have a lot of veterans who won't be around more than a few more years regardless of who plays QB, we had Fitzpatrick who fit in perfectly with them and the OC last season and makes the most sense for right now. We would all like to get the next great QB, maybe it's Petty, he's never played a down yet, but if we're just going to fold our tent until that happens we might as well give up. We're not coming off a terrible season, this team did some great things, most of them are coming back, try to keep the QB.
Post by: MBGreen on March 09, 2016, 02:29:52 PM
@JessieJDecker
I hope we keep Fitz!
show him your funbags.
Post by: JFIF on March 09, 2016, 02:32:50 PM
Post by: MBGreen on March 09, 2016, 02:33:22 PM
MB is the security guard who you can trick by leaving a Playboy on the ground, and just sneak past by him
confirmed
Post by: Miamipuck on March 09, 2016, 02:34:00 PM
confirmed
Seconded.....
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 09, 2016, 02:53:58 PM
If we resign Fitz, I challenge you to name 4 teams that are considerably better on paper than the Jets in the AFC.Patriots, Steelers, Broncos and Bengals. Easy one.
Post by: insanity on March 09, 2016, 03:22:53 PM
Patriots, Steelers, Broncos and Bengals. Easy one.
That's laughable.
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 09, 2016, 03:27:52 PM
That's laughable.You're a homer.
If things broke right, the Jets could compete with a lot of teams in the AFC. But to say we're better than the Broncos, who just won the Super Bowl, and the Bengals, who have been one of the best teams in the AFC for a handful of years now, is just flat out wrong.
Right now, the Jets are worse on paper than they were in 2015. Not much worse, but other teams haven't downgraded enough where I could safely say we're better.
You could make cases for Jacksonville and Oakland. You could make a case for Indianapolis if you think Andrew Luck is going to play like the player everyone thought he'd be.
Post by: MBGreen on March 09, 2016, 03:33:39 PM
With DEN QB situation, not hearing them wanting to wade into Fitzpatrick market. Kaepernick, Glennon could be potential trade options
not good enough for Denver.
Post by: insanity on March 09, 2016, 03:35:00 PM
You're a homer.
If things broke right, the Jets could compete with a lot of teams in the AFC. But to say we're better than the Broncos, who just won the Super Bowl, and the Bengals, who have been one of the best teams in the AFC for a handful of years now, is just flat out wrong.
Right now, the Jets are worse on paper than they were in 2015. Not much worse, but other teams haven't downgraded enough where I could safely say we're better.
You could make cases for Jacksonville and Oakland. You could make a case for Indianapolis if you think Andrew Luck is going to play like the player everyone thought he'd be.
So you think Broncos who just lost Peyton Manning, Brock Osweiller, Malik Jackson and Danny Trevathon are considerably better than the Jets?
So you think the Andrew Dalton led Bengals who just lost Mohammad Sanu, Marvin Jones, Pacman Jones, George Iloka, and Burfict (Suspension) are considerably better than the Jets? The team that hasn't won a playoff game since 1991?
Jacksonville and Oakland are on their way up, but I think its silly to say that they are definitely a better team than the Jets are right now.
Post by: MBGreen on March 09, 2016, 03:36:39 PM
So you think Broncos who just lost Peyton Manning, Brock Osweiller, Malik Jackson and Danny Trevathon are considerably better than the Jets?
So you think the Andrew Dalton led Bengals who just lost Mohammad Sanu, Marvin Jones, Pacman Jones, George Iloka, and Burfict (Suspension) are considerably better than the Jets? The team that hasn't won a playoff game since 1991?
Jacksonville and Oakland are on their way up, but I think its silly to say that they are definitely a better team than the Jets are right now.
Actually Iloka reupped with the Bengals.
steeerike Two
Post by: insanity on March 09, 2016, 03:39:23 PM
Actually Iloka reupped with the Bengals.
steeerike Two
I'm still right doe
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 09, 2016, 03:47:32 PM
So you think Broncos who just lost Peyton Manning, Brock Osweiller, Malik Jackson and Danny Trevathon are considerably better than the Jets?Yes. The quarterbacks for Denver were largely terrible last season, I think they can find someone to replicate 19 TD and 23 Int. And yeah, they lost Jackson and Trevathan; we lost Harrison and Cromartie.
So you think the Andrew Dalton led Bengals who just lost Mohammad Sanu, Marvin Jones, Pacman Jones, George Iloka, and Burfict (Suspension) are considerably better than the Jets? The team that hasn't won a playoff game since 1991?
The Broncos are still loaded, even with those losses. And they're better than the Jets, that's not even a debate.
Burfict is suspended 4 games, you're really throwing him among the Bengals potential losses? Particularly when Sheldon could get banned himself? And if you're throwing Mohamed Sanu as a notable loss for the Bengals, I'll throw Jeremy Kerley in for the Jets.
Those teams were also better than the Jets were last season.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 09, 2016, 05:15:14 PM
Jason La Canfora @JasonLaCanfora 1m1 minute ago
With DEN QB situation, not hearing them wanting to wade into Fitzpatrick market. Kaepernick, Glennon could be potential trade options
not good enough for Denver.
Now Glennon is a guy I wouldn't mind signing if we weren't able to get Fitz back. I'd rather have him play than Geno and he is still young and hasn't really been given a fair shot yet. He played pretty well when he's started so far. He'd be fairly cheap too. I'd rather sign him than Brian Hoyer.
Post by: MBGreen on March 09, 2016, 05:17:19 PM
Now Glennon is a guy I wouldn't mind signing if we weren't able to get Fitz back. I'd rather have him play than Geno and he is still young and hasn't really been given a fair shot yet. He played pretty well when he's started so far. He'd be fairly cheap too. I'd rather sign him than Brian Hoyer.Glennon looks too much like Idzik.....pass
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 09, 2016, 05:26:52 PM
Glennon looks too much like Idzik.....pass
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Glennon looks like Howdy Doody
Post by: MexJetinBcn on March 09, 2016, 05:47:34 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 09, 2016, 05:49:51 PM
I don't understand the love for Glennon. He's been awful most of the time he has played, thanks but no thanks.He was basically league average when he played. 29 TD, 15 Int in his career, as a young QB on a bad team.
I don't think he's particularly good, but he's not terrible. I trust Gailey to make a QB play better than he really is.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 09, 2016, 05:59:30 PM
I don't understand the love for Glennon. He's been awful most of the time he has played, thanks but no thanks.He was not awful. He was on an awful team.
Post by: Coach K on March 09, 2016, 06:02:13 PM
I wouldn't want him but I do feel he took way more blame for everything.
Schiano's tenure I'd regarded as one of the worst jobs in TB in any sport of the last 20 years lol.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 05:21:55 AM
Quote
Schefter:Jets and free-agent QB Ryan Fitzpatrick are nowhere close to an agreement, with no deal expected anytime soon, per sources.
I believe his agent is Jimmy Sexton. I'm not surprised he's playing hardball. Not over yet. Teams that need a QB are drying up.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 05:26:09 AM
The only place for him is the Jets or Broncos. He go anywhere he's dumb
FloatinBanks: @AdamSchefter I wanna see this lover of the older lady play well without Gailey, Marshall and decker.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 05:29:49 AM
Post by: Libero_2 on March 10, 2016, 05:32:48 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 05:43:58 AM
No he is not... But sooner or later one side will cave, and hopefully it's Fitzpatrick.This is 100% his agent leaking to the media as a scare tactic. He's good.
Post by: Coach K on March 10, 2016, 06:19:31 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 06:24:25 AM
Pretty sure the world is ending. Never thought I'd agree with anything RichHomie Quan would mumble out of his stupid mouthHaha. He said it more eloquently than I could have. Fitz is just trying to get his share and I can't blame him. The longer it goes on, the better for the Jets.
According to Andrew Brandt, Jimmy Sexton always drags these things out until the last second because it usually works.
Post by: Coach K on March 10, 2016, 06:24:43 AM
No he is not... But sooner or later one side will cave, and hopefully it's Fitzpatrick.
He's lost a ton of leverage . He can take his payday elsewhere
13 per yr tops . Or go freak off
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 06:26:18 AM
Post by: Coach K on March 10, 2016, 06:26:51 AM
His agent would be dying to get us to negotiate against ourselves
No thanks.
Post by: Coach K on March 10, 2016, 06:28:27 AM
This makes waaaaaay more sense now
Post by: Badger on March 10, 2016, 06:39:54 AM
Ahh sexton . Didn't know
This makes waaaaaay more sense now
I wonder if he still represents Tebow.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 10, 2016, 09:32:13 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 09:37:19 AM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CdMfiMQUYAA8L7w.jpg)
ahahaha
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 09:45:21 AM
Quote
The window is open to take Fitzpatrick from the Jets
Posted by Mike Florio on March 10, 2016, 10:26 AM EST
The Jets and quarterback Ryan Fitzpatrick are reportedly are “nowhere close to an agreement.” There’s now a clear opening for an agreement to never happen.
Per a source with knowledge of the situation, Fitzpatrick is ripe to be plucked away by another team.
Other suitors could be concerned that any interest expressed in Fitzpatrick would be used as leverage with the Jets. The reality, according to the source, is that interest expressed in Fitzpatrick could quickly lead to a deal.
The Jets and Fitzpatrick are so far apart that the pending offer is being regarded as “backup money.” And it could mean that the Jets are hoping to have Fitzpatrick as a bird in the hand as they continue to look for someone who could take over the job, sooner than later.
In playing hardball with Fitzpatrick, the Jets apparently believe that he won’t leave. He’s now ready to do it. The only question is whether someone else will open the door for him.
The door could be in Denver, where the current starting quarterback is Trevor Siemian.
Duff with the lowball. Haha. Highly unlikely Fitz would go elsewhere for a similar offer out of spite, but he'd be doing himself a disservice. He's too old for a "prove it" deal and once the Broncos sign Kaep, his best alternative is out the window. Then the best spot is either the Rams or 49ers, if they are even interested. Even if they are, I doubt it's for the money he wants. It'll be for bridge QB money. No other team can offer him the chance of success once the Broncos are off the table.
I don't think Duff is bluffing. I think he's willing to move on rather than overpay for someone with limited options. Like that RichHomieQuanCh said, he gunna freak around and be a Brown.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 10, 2016, 09:46:27 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 09:50:04 AM
There's a report out that the Jets offered him less than Philadelphia gave Chase Daniel.
Haha. Seems like Jimmy Sexton is spilling all kinds of excrement to the media to get the Jets to jump. Who knows if it's true. The Jets only concern now is if Fitz bails on the Jets out of spite, even if he gets less elsewhere. I don't think Duff is worried though. I don't think he will budge on paying him based on what Bradford and Osweiler got. The Jets should and will move on if that's what his agent is thinking. I'd rather start Glennon or whoever.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 10, 2016, 09:52:07 AM
I'd rather start Glennon or whoever.
No one wants Howdy Doody
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 09:56:51 AM
No one wants Howdy Doody
I'd rather have him than Geno.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 10:04:00 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on March 10, 2016, 10:04:01 AM
I'd rather have him than Geno.
I'd rather have dcm than Geno
Post by: Johnny English on March 10, 2016, 10:05:47 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on March 10, 2016, 10:08:02 AM
I'd rather have him than Geno.
I would rather have these options versus Geno:
(http://fscomps.fotosearch.com/compc/UNN/UNN015/u14571553.jpg)
(https://www.rover.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/enhanced-2269-1409939891-19.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/hzoEFo9.jpg)
Post by: MBGreen on March 10, 2016, 10:15:31 AM
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Johnny English on March 10, 2016, 10:17:19 AM
Duff is playing his hand correctly, and good for him for sticking to his price....if fitz wants to be a clearcut starter, he'll crawl back...other teams would most likely have him compete for the starter position.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
If the Jets are offering backup money, he's only a clearcut starter until we can find someone better which means he's competing.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 10, 2016, 10:18:24 AM
If the Jets are offering backup money, he's only a clearcut starter until we can find someone better which means he's competing.
He isn't competing for a damn thing if he comes back. It's his job and no one else's if he returns to the Jets.
Post by: MBGreen on March 10, 2016, 10:18:51 AM
If the Jets are offering backup money, he's only a clearcut starter until we can find someone better which means he's competing.If he signs with us, he'll be the starter week 1.
Beyond this year, you're right, it's open season.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Johnny English on March 10, 2016, 10:19:44 AM
He isn't competing for a damn thing if he comes back. It's his job and no one else's if he returns to the Jets.
Not this year, but you have to think that the Jets are going to keep looking for their guy.
Post by: MBGreen on March 10, 2016, 10:20:22 AM
Not this year, but you have to think that the Jets are going to keep looking for their guy.I would be pissed if they weren't
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Coach K on March 10, 2016, 10:20:45 AM
then again this was before Philidelphia wiped their derriere with logic in blowing up the QB market.
I'm very pleased to see Duff sticking to his guns. Sorry Fitz, this aint Philly and your not getting big bucks for 1 good year when you wont be on the roster in 2 years anyways.
Eat it Sexton.
Post by: MBGreen on March 10, 2016, 10:30:33 AM
Post by: Coach K on March 10, 2016, 10:31:57 AM
Also, if Denver is on the verge of acquiring Kaep....Fitz should just pack it in and come back. It sounds like the market for him is dire anyway.
lol if Sexton insists that Fitzpatrick is worth bradford money WE might trade for Kaep
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 10:34:01 AM
Things be getting interesting.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 10, 2016, 10:44:27 AM
Post by: Johnny English on March 10, 2016, 10:45:31 AM
AlbertBreer: As for the Jets, QB Ryan Fitzpatrick knows where they stand. Their offer is a little better than what Chase Daniel got in Philly.
So a little short of $10M. About what he's worth then.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 10, 2016, 10:45:52 AM
Post by: Coach K on March 10, 2016, 10:46:34 AM
AlbertBreer: As for the Jets, QB Ryan Fitzpatrick knows where they stand. Their offer is a little better than what Chase Daniel got in Philly.
i called 9 or 10 initially few days back
i freaking love you Duff
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 10, 2016, 10:46:40 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on March 10, 2016, 10:50:24 AM
Post by: Coach K on March 10, 2016, 10:51:10 AM
AlbertBreer: And that's not to say there's acrimony. Jets have told Fitzpatrick they want him as the starter. They just set a price, plan to stick to it.
pretty much.
Duff's stock is rising high right now round here
Post by: MBGreen on March 10, 2016, 10:53:37 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 11:12:42 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 10, 2016, 11:15:45 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 11:17:16 AM
Crazy how he can offer Fitz between $7M-$10M a year (presumably) and it's considered backup money.
Probably the agent's opinion.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 10, 2016, 11:19:43 AM
Crazy how he can offer Fitz between $7M-$10M a year (presumably) and it's considered backup money.
Your avatar is unnerving.
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 10, 2016, 11:28:57 AM
Your avatar is unnerving.Your avatar is unnverving.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 10, 2016, 11:42:03 AM
Your avatar is unnverving.touche
I guess we both think jellyfish are unnerving.
Post by: guinness77 on March 10, 2016, 11:49:23 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on March 10, 2016, 11:50:55 AM
Honestly, if Fitz doesn't explore the market with the kind of idiotic money that was thrown around yesterday, it would be incredibly stupid on his part. Not just that, if he can score a 4 or 5 year deal from an organization like Denver then why wouldn't he do it? He knows his window is short here and he knows our offer isn't changing.
How great would it be if he told Fitz's agent, " So, do you like sausage?"
Post by: guinness77 on March 10, 2016, 11:54:06 AM
How great would it be if he told Fitz's agent, " So, do you like sausage?"The kid from Oklahoma was only 22. Fitz is like 46.
Post by: MBGreen on March 10, 2016, 05:55:19 PM
While the Broncos try to close the Kaepernick trade, they're formulating backup plans. Have been in touch with agent for Ryan Fitzpatrick.
Post by: casman02 on March 10, 2016, 06:07:11 PM
Michael Silver @MikeSilver 27m27 minutes ago
While the Broncos try to close the Kaepernick trade, they're formulating backup plans. Have been in touch with agent for Ryan Fitzpatrick.
(http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/15/1578f4d9989d8c9448ec0a10560dc455e193b95b5ec6b8f64fe4ea83548a0b9c.jpg)
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 10, 2016, 06:10:39 PM
Post by: Johnny English on March 10, 2016, 06:12:20 PM
Post by: MBGreen on March 10, 2016, 06:14:14 PM
Denver and Fitz's agent aren't on great terms right now, given he's also Osweiler's agent.
If the Browns somehow land Kaep...excrement could get interesting with Den/Fitz/nyj
somebody is going to be left standing with their dick in their hands.
Post by: Johnny English on March 10, 2016, 06:41:45 PM
If the Browns somehow land Kaep...excrement could get interesting with Den/Fitz/nyjIf that happens the Niners will be looking for a starter as well.
somebody is going to be left standing with their dick in their hands.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 06:44:23 PM
Post by: MBGreen on March 10, 2016, 06:46:30 PM
If that happens the Niners will be looking for a starter as well.
The Niners have Gabbert.
can't believe i just typed that
Post by: Pope on March 10, 2016, 06:57:13 PM
If the Broncos weren't willing to spend a ton of money on Osweiler, I doubt they're willing to break the bank for Fitz. However, they could out-bid us.Broncos were probably hesitant on giving Brock long term starter money. If they sign Fitz it's going to be a two or three year deal while they have a championship calibre team
Post by: Johnny English on March 10, 2016, 07:27:01 PM
The Niners have Gabbert.
can't believe i just typed that
I think my brain refuses to accept him as a starter.
Post by: Coach K on March 10, 2016, 07:27:19 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on March 10, 2016, 07:27:54 PM
Post by: MBGreen on March 10, 2016, 07:29:58 PM
A friend of mine that's a Niners fan said he heard Denver and San Francisco have agreed on compensation, but the Broncos are trying to restructure Kaepernick's deal before it goes through.
time to bend over for Duff, Fitz.
Post by: Coach K on March 10, 2016, 07:49:43 PM
time to bend over for Duff, Fitz.
Now he has to play for free.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 10, 2016, 07:52:57 PM
2 words. League minimum.
time to bend over for Duff, Fitz.
Post by: Johnny English on March 10, 2016, 08:13:21 PM
time to bend over for Duff, Fitz.
"Hi Fitz? Mike Maccagnan here. Yes, good, you? Wife and kids? Good, that's good. Listen, just thought I should let you know - that offer we gave you the other day? We've kind of signed a couple of running backs that became available to us, which is good, but it's hit the finances a bit, so we're going to have to drop the offer by $500K a year. Got a bunch of calls from agents coming as well and I can't guarantee we're not going to get other opportunities we can't pass up, so it might keep dropping if it just sits on the table. Thought you should know. Anyway, good luck with the job search, I heard you almost got some interest from Denver. Bummer about the whole thing with your agent screwing them over and stuff, eh? Still, there's always Cleveland. You've got my number - say hi to Liza from me, OK?"
Post by: Badger on March 10, 2016, 08:15:46 PM
I think my brain refuses to accept him as a starter.
That means your brain is working.
Post by: dcm1602 on March 10, 2016, 09:28:44 PM
If the Browns somehow land Kaep...excrement could get interesting with Den/Fitz/nyj
somebody is going to be left standing with their dick in their hands.
Let's not forget Sanchez will probably be available
Post by: Libero_2 on March 10, 2016, 09:46:29 PM
"Hi Fitz? Mike Maccagnan here. Yes, good, you? Wife and kids? Good, that's good. Listen, just thought I should let you know - that offer we gave you the other day? We've kind of signed a couple of running backs that became available to us, which is good, but it's hit the finances a bit, so we're going to have to drop the offer by $500K a year. Got a bunch of calls from agents coming as well and I can't guarantee we're not going to get other opportunities we can't pass up, so it might keep dropping if it just sits on the table. Thought you should know. Anyway, good luck with the job search, I heard you almost got some interest from Denver. Bummer about the whole thing with your agent screwing them over and stuff, eh? Still, there's always Cleveland. You've got my number - say hi to Liza from me, OK?"
Something about this is simply priceless
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 10, 2016, 11:36:47 PM
Fit$$$
Ryan Fitzmoney
Mefitz
Post by: bojanglesman on March 11, 2016, 01:35:34 AM
So if he bounces, what terrible derogatory nickname do we call him?Shitfagit
Fit$$$
Ryan Fitzmoney
Mefitz
Post by: Jumbo on March 11, 2016, 02:31:32 AM
So if he bounces, what terrible derogatory nickname do we call him?
Fit$$$
Ryan Fitzmoney
Mefitz
dcm
Post by: Badger on March 11, 2016, 05:10:31 AM
So if he bounces, what terrible derogatory nickname do we call him?
Fit$$$
Ryan Fitzmoney
Mefitz
Still Better Than Geno
Post by: Coach K on March 11, 2016, 05:26:52 AM
So if he bounces, what terrible derogatory nickname do we call him?
Fit$$$
Ryan Fitzmoney
Mefitz
The Cleveland Browns 2017 starting QB
Post by: Miamipuck on March 11, 2016, 07:20:04 AM
So if he bounces, what terrible derogatory nickname do we call him?
Fit$$$
Ryan Fitzmoney
Mefitz
Chomo
Post by: Heismanberg on March 11, 2016, 09:59:22 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 11, 2016, 10:09:05 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 11, 2016, 10:23:56 AM
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 11, 2016, 10:30:00 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on March 11, 2016, 10:30:24 AM
Fitz got Duffzoned.
This needs to become a thing.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 11, 2016, 10:32:11 AM
I still don't think he's that valuable, or even a lock to start, for any team besides us.
He's not. This is the perfect opportunity for him. He is also the best option for us because he can hold the fort until we find the future.
Post by: MBGreen on March 11, 2016, 10:36:47 AM
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 11, 2016, 10:38:38 AM
Fitz's agent is gonna get lance harbor'd at the negotiation table
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Killed in an accident while street racing?
Post by: MBGreen on March 11, 2016, 10:39:27 AM
Killed in an accident while street racing?Or billy bob passed out picking up the blitz
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 11, 2016, 10:40:57 AM
Or billy bob passed out picking up the blitz
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
I know Varsity Blues bruh. I was making a Paul Walker joke.
frrrrrrrrrrrrrrt
Post by: MBGreen on March 11, 2016, 10:41:47 AM
I know Varsity Blues bruh. I was making a Paul Walker joke.Oh i know...just laying out da options
frrrrrrrrrrrrrrt
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Coach K on March 11, 2016, 11:04:49 AM
This was tge moment I'll never forget . When I knew I wanted a supra
Rofl
Post by: Johnny English on March 11, 2016, 11:17:54 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on March 11, 2016, 11:19:55 AM
Do you type with your forehead?
DCM does
Post by: Koz on March 11, 2016, 01:11:30 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 11, 2016, 01:14:57 PM
With Sanchez going to Denver, what's left for Fitzie to consider besides us? Cleveland and LA?
CFL.
Post by: MBGreen on March 11, 2016, 01:15:03 PM
With Sanchez going to Denver, what's left for Fitzie to consider besides us? Cleveland and LA?
LA has come out and renounced Fitz.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 11, 2016, 01:15:26 PM
With Sanchez going to Denver, what's left for Fitzie to consider besides us? Cleveland and LA?
There are reports that Cleveland and Los Angeles don't want Fitzpatrick.
Denver didn't trade for Mark Sanchez to start, so they could still add Fitzpatrick. If they acquire Colin Kaepernick, then Fitzpatrick will really have no place to go.
Post by: MBGreen on March 11, 2016, 01:19:26 PM
There are reports that Cleveland and Los Angeles don't want Fitzpatrick.
Denver didn't trade for Mark Sanchez to start, so they could still add Fitzpatrick. If they acquire Colin Kaepernick, then Fitzpatrick will really have no place to go.
/Duff'd
Post by: Heismanberg on March 11, 2016, 01:42:00 PM
Quote
AdamSchefter: Even after trading for Mark Sanchez, Broncos plan to bring in another QB to compete for starting job. Denver not done at QB yet.
Why would Fitzpatrick sign with Denver when a starting spot isn't guaranteed? The Jets are his only option now unless he's chasing money.
Post by: Jumbo on March 11, 2016, 01:47:05 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 11, 2016, 01:47:29 PM
Why would Fitzpatrick sign with Denver when a starting spot isn't guaranteed? The Jets are his only option now unless he's chasing money.
$$$?
Post by: bojanglesman on March 11, 2016, 01:48:21 PM
/Duff'd
Duffzoned
Post by: MBGreen on March 11, 2016, 01:52:24 PM
Duffzoned
i like that
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 11, 2016, 01:58:28 PM
Why would Fitzpatrick sign with Denver when a starting spot isn't guaranteed? The Jets are his only option now unless he's chasing money.
If he's chasing money his best bet is still to stay in a situation where he can be a starter in New York. Plenty of ways to supplement the income if you're a good QB in NY.
Post by: insanity on March 11, 2016, 02:06:43 PM
If he's chasing money his best bet is still to stay in a situation where he can be a starter in New York. Plenty of ways to supplement the income if you're a good QB in NY.
You mean after state income tax takes most of your money?
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 11, 2016, 02:07:35 PM
You mean after state income tax takes most of your money?
Yeah, and Bernie scoops up the rest.
Post by: insanity on March 11, 2016, 02:10:58 PM
Yeah, and Bernie scoops up the rest.
How ah tha paw gunna pay fah there matzah bawls
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 11, 2016, 02:22:11 PM
How ah tha paw gunna pay fah there matzah bawls
JO tailgate 2017:
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/a2/85/a2/a285a2bfc5d463517a3c88dba9c9d2ec.jpg)
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 11, 2016, 06:07:55 PM
Quote
Told #Jets talks with Ryan Fitzpatrick "picking back up." Still significant difference between team and player.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 11, 2016, 06:08:52 PM
Quote
NFL Source: "Jimmy Sexton severely overplayed his hand with Fitzpatrick. Totally misread his market."
Benjamin Albright
Post by: dcm1602 on March 11, 2016, 06:13:05 PM
Why would Fitzpatrick sign with Denver when a starting spot isn't guaranteed? The Jets are his only option now unless he's chasing money.
1) He wants to win and Denver is probably his best chance at a superbowl.
2) If they give him starter money, hes probably starting.
Didnt watch Sanchez much in philly, but in his time he Sanchez was absolutely horrific in the elements. I somehow doubt hes a good fit in the harsh Denver weather
Post by: dcm1602 on March 11, 2016, 06:13:52 PM
Benjamin Albright
Imagine if we end up getting him for like 4 years 15 million or something freaking retarded now (ok it wont be that good, but maybe 4 years 23 million or something like that)
Post by: bojanglesman on March 11, 2016, 06:19:15 PM
Imagine if we end up getting him for like 4 years 15 million or something freaking retarded now (ok it wont be that good, but maybe 4 years 23 million or something like that)The Jets wouldn't pull a previous offer. Everyone seems to think they offered $7-$8 million per year
I expect the Jets might take it a little higher in real world negotiations. Maybe 3 years, $8-9 million per with a way out after 2.
Post by: dcm1602 on March 11, 2016, 06:22:12 PM
The Jets wouldn't pull a previous offer. Everyone seems to think they offered $7-$8 million per year.
But Fitz went out so the market could determine his price. And the market has said they dont want him. Maybe we still offer him 7-8 a year but with even less guaranteed. Fitz tried to freak us, and its time we told him to bend over
Its funny how some are talking about how much money his 4th quarter against Buffalo cost him
Post by: bojanglesman on March 11, 2016, 06:24:00 PM
But Fitz went out so the market could determine his price. And the market has said they dont want him. Maybe we still offer him 7-8 a year but with even less guaranteed. Fitz tried to freak us, and its time we told him to bend overYou have to deal with these agents down the road with other players. I doubt they take this as personal as you imagine.
Its funny how some are talking about how much money his 4th quarter against Buffalo cost him
Post by: dcm1602 on March 11, 2016, 06:29:50 PM
You have to deal with these agents down the road with other players. I doubt they take this as personal as you imagine.
That has nothing to do with being personal.
Fitz rolled the dice and wanted the market to determine his value. The market determined that he isn't as valuable as we originally thought. Would take a bad GM to not leverage this fact to your advantage. And I agree we have to deal with these agents down the road. So why set the precedent that if you blow us off and try to screw us, that we wont use it against them ?
Post by: ukilledkenny on March 11, 2016, 06:51:16 PM
Post by: casman02 on March 12, 2016, 06:44:54 AM
Post by: MBGreen on March 12, 2016, 06:49:14 AM
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: casman02 on March 12, 2016, 06:52:29 AM
Wow...i want to see what the Rams offered him.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Twitterverse saying that account is fake
Post by: MBGreen on March 12, 2016, 06:53:09 AM
Twitterverse saying that account is fakeFine...ill go back to my nap in this airport terminal
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Badger on March 12, 2016, 08:05:25 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on March 12, 2016, 10:56:44 AM
Wow...i want to see what the Rams offered him.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
freaking chomo
Post by: MBGreen on March 12, 2016, 11:02:18 AM
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: guinness77 on March 12, 2016, 11:05:19 AM
Post by: guinness77 on March 12, 2016, 11:05:49 AM
Post by: MBGreen on March 12, 2016, 11:09:16 AM
/Watley'd
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Libero_2 on March 12, 2016, 05:46:11 PM
My question how long do we consider waiting before signing (or trying to anyways) RGIII or another QB we deem a potential fit?
I have to imagine it won't be much longer than the middle of next week before Duff throws down the ultimatum to Fitz and says if you don't sign today, we understand, but we have to move on and get a guy in this building that can play the position.
Post by: Johnny English on March 12, 2016, 06:44:30 PM
Post by: Coach K on March 13, 2016, 06:59:17 AM
Post by: Coach K on March 13, 2016, 07:01:42 AM
There will be a run on LB and OL before us.
Ryan Kelly would be a great pick imo. Start him at OG n take Mangold spot when he's done
Post by: Libero_2 on March 13, 2016, 07:14:06 AM
Paxton Lynch is now becoming a popular name in mock drafts lol
As I said when I started that thread on the eve of FA, I think Lynch has a chance to develop into something in the top 10-12 QBs in football range. If he can sit for a bit and figure out some NFL footwork.
If we draft him at 20 to start him right away because we couldn't get Fitz and/or RG3 and because we jump on "please dear god, not Geno again" bandwagon, he will fail.
But he's becoming a popular pick in mocks, because we have no QB right now. Once we either get Fitz back, sign RG3 (or none of those things) 20 for us becomes more clear. But right now, QB is the biggest unquestioned need on this roster, and that's why people are mocking a QB to us at 20
Post by: Coach K on March 13, 2016, 07:28:46 AM
As I said when I started that thread on the eve of FA, I think Lynch has a chance to develop into something in the top 10-12 QBs in football range. If he can sit for a bit and figure out some NFL footwork.
If we draft him at 20 to start him right away because we couldn't get Fitz and/or RG3 and because we jump on "please dear god, not Geno again" bandwagon, he will fail.
But he's becoming a popular pick in mocks, because we have no QB right now. Once we either get Fitz back, sign RG3 (or none of those things) 20 for us becomes more clear. But right now, QB is the biggest unquestioned need on this roster, and that's why people are mocking a QB to us at 20
No doubt . I made it a point to watch him this year. Love who he was coached by. He was a project at the NCAA level and made all the progression you can ask for . He could've flamed out easily .
Yeah no way in freaking hell he's ready to play now . The footwork is sloppy at tines and his release is slow .
Then again once you start talking release you dunno how a QB will respond to working on it .
But yeah a year or two on the bench would do him good.
And I agree with your assessment on his ceiling . Especially since Brady n Brees will likely be gone by tge time he's asked to start .
Like I said there's have to be aquite a few guys off the board before I entertain it , but I think there's a strong possibility it plays out to where he might be the value pick.
Post by: Coach K on March 13, 2016, 07:29:27 AM
Post by: Libero_2 on March 13, 2016, 07:47:28 AM
Back to Fitz. Anyone feel like if he's not signed today we move on ?
I think they give it to midweek tops
Post by: bojanglesman on March 13, 2016, 07:49:08 AM
Back to Fitz. Anyone feel like if he's not signed today we move on ?
No. Football doesn't start anytime soon. I think the Kaepernick thing has to play out first.
Post by: MBGreen on March 13, 2016, 08:47:15 AM
ESPN reporting the Broncos have talked with Ryan Fitzpatrick's reps, but his asking price is too high. #Nyj
Sexton needs to come back down to earth.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Coach K on March 13, 2016, 10:20:16 AM
Per Costello
ESPN reporting the Broncos have talked with Ryan Fitzpatrick's reps, but his asking price is too high. #Nyj
Sexton needs to come back down to earth.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Lol he's going to end up a Brown at this rate
Post by: Coach K on March 13, 2016, 10:21:04 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 13, 2016, 10:31:24 AM
Oh wait browns aren't even interested are they lolIf Kaepernick goes to Denver, who knows if Chip Kelly is interested. He still has Denver or 49ers as possibilities. Not over yet. I wouldn't be surprised if he found a comparable offer somewhere. It's not like the Jets' offer can't be topped.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 13, 2016, 10:32:06 AM
Back to Fitz. Anyone feel like if he's not signed today we move on ?
No
Post by: bojanglesman on March 13, 2016, 10:43:50 AM
You also can't just base it on per year salary. Guarantees, # of years, chance to start, etc. all play into it. I think he'll end up a Jet, but I think his agent will slow play it. No reason not to. The Jets won't sign anyone else decent unless Fitz goes away.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 13, 2016, 10:47:00 AM
chance to start
Chance to start vs. money is what it comes down to
The Jets give him the best chance at both. He'll come back. Sexton terribly misplayed his hand. The two sides will find a middle ground.
Post by: Laxin on March 13, 2016, 10:54:03 AM
Post by: MBGreen on March 13, 2016, 11:02:36 AM
Im not sure whats taking so long. This is kind of getting sad for Fitzpatrick and his agent. As each day passes, he loses leverage and just looks like a beggar going from team to team asking for more money. He had a great year last year, but clearly the league doesnt view him as that type of QB. Just accept a 2 year 20M deal with the Jets.He wants to get paid, that's what is taking so long.
Fitz will end up firing Sexton if this ends badly for him...which is looking more likely as this drags on
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 13, 2016, 11:12:44 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 13, 2016, 11:22:49 AM
Im not sure whats taking so long. This is kind of getting sad for Fitzpatrick and his agent. As each day passes, he loses leverage and just looks like a beggar going from team to team asking for more money. He had a great year last year, but clearly the league doesnt view him as that type of QB. Just accept a 2 year 20M deal with the Jets.I don't think they've offered him that much. How can he accept it?
Post by: Fenwyr on March 13, 2016, 11:47:12 AM
freak it. Get RG3 and draft Lynch. Go with RG3/Petty/Lynch and pray for the future.
Post by: Laxin on March 13, 2016, 11:48:26 AM
I don't think they've offered him that much. How can he accept it?
Thats true, I was just making a guesstimate of what I think a reasonable middle ground could be. Fitz probably wants something like the Bradford deal, and the Jets probably want half of that. I think 2 years 10 per is a fair price for both sides.
Post by: guinness77 on March 13, 2016, 11:59:14 AM
Personally, at this point, if he doesn't go to Denver, I'd be shocked. I have to think we're his number one choice but if Denver offers him something like 4/48 and a chance to start, he should take that. We're not in any position to offer that.
If we do get him, it'll be on our terms and that's why I like Duff. He's not quite Tanny, but he's definitely not Idzik.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 13, 2016, 12:03:00 PM
I watched every game
Really? I only watched the preseason.
Post by: guinness77 on March 13, 2016, 12:06:37 PM
Gailey/Powell/Forte/Marshall/Decker...hopefully Amaro. A QB with legs with that group? Hell, Fitz's legs worked with that group minus Forte and a TE.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 13, 2016, 12:10:56 PM
I know I'll probably be laughed at for this, but the thought of Kaepernick as our QB intrigues me more and more as I think about it.
The issue with Colin Kaepernick is his personality. His teammates don't like him and that can kill everything that Todd Bowles has created here so far.
He's an elite athlete and has one of the strongest arms in the NFL, but I think he'd struggle to get on the same page with our receivers. It could take a few seasons.
I'm a big supporter of bringing Ryan Fitzpatrick back because the chemistry between QB and supporting cast seemed to happen overnight with him. It was almost unbelievable. We're tearing down a lot if he doesn't come back. There's still a lot of talent, but can we can the most out of it with another QB?
Post by: guinness77 on March 13, 2016, 12:18:16 PM
I think Kaepernick looks like a gigantic douche. I hated that dumb Beats commercial. Like you said though, he has the capability to be elite and certainly has the legs to thrive in our offense. I'd like to think, last year humbled him a bit. If that didn't, nothing will.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 13, 2016, 12:19:25 PM
Oh, don't get me wrong, I want Fitz back.
I think Kaepernick looks like a gigantic douche. I hated that dumb Beats commercial. Like you said though, he has the capability to be elite and certainly has the legs to thrive in our offense. I'd like to think, last year humbled him a bit. If that didn't, nothing will.
If we're taking a chance on someone other than Fitzpatrick, I'd rather have Griffin III because at least he's not a douchebag.
Post by: Tommy on March 13, 2016, 12:23:32 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on March 13, 2016, 12:25:48 PM
I haven't been following any of this all week. Wtf is going on with this team?
Jimmy Sexton kisses hookers on the mouth
Post by: guinness77 on March 13, 2016, 12:27:06 PM
If we're taking a chance on someone other than Fitzpatrick, I'd rather have Griffin III because at least he's not a douchebag.He seems to be a pretty polarizing guy himself.
Let's just hope this works out and our best option, Fitz, returns.
Post by: reuben on March 13, 2016, 12:27:09 PM
Back to Fitz. Anyone feel like if he's not signed today we move on ?
On a Sunday? I mean you can do some excrement and be like what the freak, but never on no Sunday.
Post by: guinness77 on March 13, 2016, 12:27:57 PM
Jimmy Sexton kisses hookers on the mouth"WE'RE GOING TO RICK'S!!!"
Post by: dcm1602 on March 13, 2016, 12:35:12 PM
If we're taking a chance on someone other than Fitzpatrick, I'd rather have Griffin III because at least he's not a douchebag.
And would be cheaper plus wouldnt cost a draft pick. Im not sure which has greater upside though,they both have major red flags
Post by: Heismanberg on March 13, 2016, 12:38:05 PM
He seems to be a pretty polarizing guy himself.
The worst thing that could've happened to Griffin in Washington was Jay Gruden becoming their head coach.
He wants to be great and now he has a lot of doubters to prove wrong which is a story I can get behind. One man's trash is another man's treasure type of scenario.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 13, 2016, 12:39:14 PM
And would be cheaper plus wouldnt cost a draft pick. Im not sure which has greater upside though,they both have major red flags
Griffin is three years younger, so there's more room for improvement.
Post by: Coach K on March 13, 2016, 04:24:23 PM
And any over Hoyer lol
Post by: insanity on March 13, 2016, 07:37:48 PM
Fitz is pissing me off to be entirely honest. I watched every game, and while he put up some good numbers at times, we should have been 12-4. I was all for keeping him at a reasonable number, but am starting to just want to move on.
freak it. Get RG3 and draft Lynch. Go with RG3/Petty/Lynch and pray for the future.
It's Fitz's fault we weren't 12-4? You're a complete idiot
Post by: Badger on March 13, 2016, 09:28:11 PM
http://www.nfl.com/videos/buffalo-bills/0ap3000000417499/Geno-Smith-struggles-vs-Bills
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 14, 2016, 08:37:10 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 14, 2016, 08:40:36 AM
Anyone else feel that this has carried on a little bit too long?Longer than expected, but there are a few dominos left to fall first. Namely Kaepernick.
Post by: Coach K on March 14, 2016, 08:41:34 AM
Anyone else feel that this has carried on a little bit too long?
Me. I made a post yesterday that if it wadnt wrapped up last night something is iffy . I admittedly overreacted , but i feel were now in a 48 hour window where we will make our decision soon. Teams have established what they're not willing to pay for Fitz.
Sexton is trying to play chicken and hold Fitz for ransom to the teams left without a QB after a Kaep trade. It's the only remaining leverage play he has in his hand .
The only domino left to fall is to see if Kaep is actually traded .
It has become a weird game of poker more than usual in these situations
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 14, 2016, 08:50:19 AM
Quote
@AndrewBrandt:For those wanting a resolution re Fitzpatrick or Kaepernick, take a deep breath. There's no deadline to spur action. Could be a while.
Well at least there's that
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 14, 2016, 08:51:28 AM
Post by: Coach K on March 14, 2016, 09:01:32 AM
I wouldn't be suprised if San Fran just ends up keeping Kaepernick. He's easily the best option they have outside of Goff at #7.
Starting to think this is the case too.
Post by: ukilledkenny on March 14, 2016, 09:19:56 AM
Post by: Coach K on March 14, 2016, 09:20:39 AM
Well at least there's that
Meh I think a domino falls in one shape or form by end of tomorrow
3 years 33 million 22 guaranteed no guaranteed in yr 3
Essentially a 2 yr 22 mil deal.
I wish. If Sexton is standing pat at 13 per I wonder who blinks first .
freak you Philly
Post by: Coach K on March 14, 2016, 09:21:30 AM
We'll end up with Fitz or RG3 or both, no rush for me. We all know what we are waiting on so whenever the 49ers make their move clear the rest should move fairly quickly. 49ers probably aren't in a rush to make their move.
This.
I'm just impatient to know who will be QB
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 14, 2016, 09:59:41 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 14, 2016, 10:51:40 AM
We'll end up with Fitz or RG3 or both, no rush for me. We all know what we are waiting on so whenever the 49ers make their move clear the rest should move fairly quickly. 49ers probably aren't in a rush to make their move.
I agree for the most part but not if its holding up our other FA moves. Doubt they sign a guy like Fairley or Beachum with Fitz's contract up in the air.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 14, 2016, 10:59:38 AM
Post by: Libero_2 on March 14, 2016, 03:50:59 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 14, 2016, 05:53:27 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on March 14, 2016, 06:32:49 PM
What about a deal for Fitz with some incentives based on TDs, playoffs, ect?
I somehow doubt a guy who has never made the playoffs wants a deal with incentives to make it
Him and his agent want big money, so now to see what happens. I imagine they want guarantees
Post by: bojanglesman on March 14, 2016, 06:44:31 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on March 14, 2016, 09:01:05 PM
I kind of hope we are able to get our hands on both RG3 and Fitz. Get Geno dafuq outta here.
Why would RG3 come here if we give Fitz the contract he wants ?
Though i guess the old RG3 would be a good match for Gailey
Post by: Libero_2 on March 14, 2016, 09:43:54 PM
Why would RG3 come here if we give Fitz the contract he wants ?
Though i guess the old RG3 would be a good match for Gailey
Because apparently no one is giving him a shot to start, so come be a backup for a year and compete for the gig (perhaps the greatest gig in sports, QB in NY) in a year as Fitz ages and potentially disappoints.
He has the chance to be in a system that could help 'fix' him, as well as a kickass supporting cast, with plenty of solid weapons to work with.
No guarantees obviously, but it's a solid offer that at a minimum compares strongly to whatever else he has on the table right now.
Post by: Koz on March 15, 2016, 09:46:26 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on March 15, 2016, 09:50:12 AM
How many times a day do you find yourself coming back to this page to see if there is any new information? At least 10 for me, in the hopes that something will happen. But alas, nothing.
Go to the downtown coffee brown so you can see MB and Bo post about bodily functions, I am sure those 2 freaking idiots bowel movements would satiate your need Fitzmagic info.
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 15, 2016, 10:22:00 AM
How many times a day do you find yourself coming back to this page to see if there is any new information? At least 10 for me, in the hopes that something will happen. But alas, nothing.
This is my first go-to to see if we did anything. Just came to this thread to see if we re-signed Fitz yet. Guessing we didn't.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 15, 2016, 10:23:59 AM
Go to the downtown coffee brown so you can see MB and Bo post about bodily functions, I am sure those 2 freaking idiots bowel movements would satiate your need Fitzmagic info.
I thought you were interested in my turds.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 15, 2016, 10:41:13 AM
This is my first go-to to see if we did anything. Just came to this thread to see if we re-signed Fitz yet. Guessing we didn't.
http://www.jetoffensive.com/index.php?topic=263.msg204653#new
Post by: Tommy on March 15, 2016, 10:48:01 AM
How many times a day do you find yourself coming back to this page to see if there is any new information? At least 10 for me, in the hopes that something will happen. But alas, nothing.
Never thought the Fitz situation would become even close to the stress we all had with that Revis holdout.
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 15, 2016, 11:02:18 AM
http://www.jetoffensive.com/index.php?topic=263.msg204653#new
I knew not to click the link but did that stop me?
Post by: Koz on March 15, 2016, 11:25:53 AM
Never thought the Fitz situation would become even close to the stress we all had with that Revis holdout.
Is it true that you yelled, at the top of your lungs, "I'm Pablo Escobar, bitches...." last week?
Post by: bojanglesman on March 15, 2016, 11:29:55 AM
Is it true that you yelled, at the top of your lungs, "I'm Pablo Escobar, bitches...." last week?No, he just contracted gonorrhea.
Post by: Tommy on March 15, 2016, 11:37:25 AM
Is it true that you yelled, at the top of your lungs, "I'm Pablo Escobar, bitches...." last week?
It is, but with all the blow and Club Colombia beer it came out more like "I'm Pueblo Scotia Bar!"
Post by: Miamipuck on March 15, 2016, 11:42:09 AM
I knew not to click the link but did that stop me?
You just wanted to see if I was right about those 2 retards and other retard Badger.
Post by: ukilledkenny on March 15, 2016, 12:11:22 PM
Post by: Tommy on March 15, 2016, 12:23:09 PM
You guys don't have a sports news app of some type with automatic Jets updates? NFL app always alerts me and then I come here for the expert analysis of the move.
Yeah but I just figure you guys would find out before me and then post it here anyway.
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 15, 2016, 12:35:36 PM
You guys don't have a sports news app of some type with automatic Jets updates? NFL app always alerts me and then I come here for the expert analysis of the move.
Too much sh*t going off on my phone all the time already. This place is pretty quick, often when I come here to post Jets news less than a half hour old and it's already here.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 15, 2016, 12:37:31 PM
Too much sh*t going off on my phone all the time already. This place is pretty quick, often when I come here to post Jets news less than a half hour old and it's already here.
Half an hour? We post news in less than 2 minutes most of the time.
We're a well-oiled Twitter machine.
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 15, 2016, 12:39:50 PM
Half an hour? We post news in less than 2 minutes most of the time.
We're a well-oiled Twitter machine.
Oh yeah, I'm saying half hour tops. Usually within a few minutes. I'm generally surprised when I come here with something and it's not already here.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 15, 2016, 12:53:26 PM
Post by: Koz on March 15, 2016, 01:03:01 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on March 15, 2016, 01:25:11 PM
I don't Twitter.
BTW welcome back douchebag.
Post by: Koz on March 15, 2016, 01:29:22 PM
BTW welcome back douchebag.
Hey, thanks. Took a break from social media for a while. Still boycotting Facebook.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 15, 2016, 01:39:22 PM
Hey, thanks. Took a break from social media for a while. Still boycotting Facebook.
I don't blame you, I hope someone didn't say something bad about a family member (kids) or something? I hate that place sometimes, it's so phony.
Post by: ScotlandJet on March 15, 2016, 01:54:49 PM
I don't Twitter.
I don't Twitter either.
Post by: Koz on March 15, 2016, 01:58:59 PM
Post by: Koz on March 15, 2016, 01:59:42 PM
Better than that- a good friend's wife started a shitstorm this year when she saw that they weren't invited a Christmas party I hosted for neighbors and the photos were posted on Facebook afterwards. Mind you, they weren't invited for the last 3 years anyway. People suck.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 15, 2016, 02:00:54 PM
Better than that- a good friend's wife started a shitstorm this year when she saw that they weren't invited a Christmas party I hosted for neighbors and the photos were posted on Facebook afterwards. Mind you, they weren't invited for the last 3 years anyway. People suck.Small wonder, she sounds like an poopchute.
Post by: ScotlandJet on March 15, 2016, 02:12:22 PM
Nothing to see here.
You in this year Judge Koz?
Post by: Koz on March 15, 2016, 02:15:14 PM
You in this year Judge Koz?affirmative good sir. And yourself?
Post by: Miamipuck on March 15, 2016, 02:23:56 PM
affirmative good sir. And yourself?
He's bringing a kilt for MB and Bo to wear in their hotel room.
Post by: ScotlandJet on March 15, 2016, 02:26:09 PM
affirmative good sir. And yourself?
I'm in Koz, On pain of death if I forfiet. That crazy homo bashing, South beach lounger has a contract out on me if I'm not there.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 15, 2016, 02:28:13 PM
He's bringing a kilt for MB and Bo to wear in their hotel room.
I got a twitter alert of my name being mentioned on here. What's up?
Post by: Miamipuck on March 15, 2016, 02:34:18 PM
I got a twitter alert of my name being mentioned on here. What's up?
See that homo from Scotland was bashing you:
I'm in Koz, On pain of death if I forfiet. That crazy homo bashing, South beach lounger has a contract out on me if I'm not there.
Post by: ScotlandJet on March 15, 2016, 02:34:32 PM
I got a twitter alert of my name being mentioned on here. What's up?
What size Kilt do you take?
Post by: Miamipuck on March 15, 2016, 02:35:09 PM
What size Kilt do you take?
He takes all sizes..........
Post by: bojanglesman on March 15, 2016, 02:35:16 PM
What size Kilt do you take?
Has to be below the knee to account for my penis.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 15, 2016, 02:36:04 PM
Has to be below the knee to account for my penis.
Yeah if someone chopped your legs off.
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 15, 2016, 04:09:32 PM
Better than that- a good friend's wife started a shitstorm this year when she saw that they weren't invited a Christmas party I hosted for neighbors and the photos were posted on Facebook afterwards. Mind you, they weren't invited for the last 3 years anyway. People suck.
I don't post hardly ever on Facebook , it's good for seeing what the girls look like 30 years deciding not to f*ck me.
Post by: dcm1602 on March 17, 2016, 06:33:38 PM
Quote
The Jets have offered Fitzpatrick backup money, and they’ve yet to increase the offer. The Broncos have shown interest, but not nearly enough to get anything done.
Quote
Per a source with knowledge of the situation, nothing is currently happening.
I like this GM
Post by: Tommy on March 17, 2016, 06:38:16 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on March 17, 2016, 07:16:50 PM
Or will he eventually cave if no one offers him "starter" money? I assume he will cave but Jesus this is stringing along for longer than anyone thought. Any chance he might just walk away?
Post by: Ornstein on March 17, 2016, 07:18:38 PM
Here's a question... Would Fitz sit out if he doesn't get the money he wants?
Or will he eventually cave if no one offers him "starter" money? I assume he will cave but Jesus this is stringing along for longer than anyone thought. Any chance he might just walk away?
So rather then sign and have several million guaranteed you think there's a chance he could just sit out and kill any chance he has of ever playing again?
Post by: bojanglesman on March 17, 2016, 07:19:33 PM
Here's a question... Would Fitz sit out if he doesn't get the money he wants?No.
Or will he eventually cave if no one offers him "starter" money? I assume he will cave but Jesus this is stringing along for longer than anyone thought. Any chance he might just walk away?
Post by: dcm1602 on March 17, 2016, 07:22:26 PM
Here's a question... Would Fitz sit out if he doesn't get the money he wants?
Or will he eventually cave if no one offers him "starter" money? I assume he will cave but Jesus this is stringing along for longer than anyone thought. Any chance he might just walk away?
I doubt it.
The closet thing I could see to him "sitting out" would be a one year contract for more money. Something like 1 year 9 million with incentives to bump it up a little maybe.
His biggest issue is where else could he go and start ? I imagine theres nowhere else he would be guaranteed a starting spot.
Post by: Jetaho on March 17, 2016, 07:40:09 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on March 17, 2016, 07:49:46 PM
Post by: Johnny English on March 17, 2016, 07:53:37 PM
I guess we need to see what happens with Kaep. If hes on the 49ers roster when that contract becomes guaranteed demand for Fitz could significantly improve from a few teams
Who? Cleveland are in full rebuild mode, they have no use for a 33 year old journeyman. Denver just signed Sanchez and while you can make an argument that Fitz is a bit better, I don't think he's worth an extra $10M on an already tight cap. Is there anyone else looking for a QB?
Post by: dcm1602 on March 17, 2016, 08:08:35 PM
Who? Cleveland are in full rebuild mode, they have no use for a 33 year old journeyman. Denver just signed Sanchez and while you can make an argument that Fitz is a bit better, I don't think he's worth an extra $10M on an already tight cap. Is there anyone else looking for a QB?
Well Denver could always trade Sanchez to San Fran (even as a possible backup) if they trade Kaep to the Browns then Denver signing Fitz makes sense.
I would be supremely weary about Sanchez playing in the harsh Denver elements.
I guess barring an injury though, theres essentially no market whatsoever for Fitz.
Possibly (although I think it would be weird) Denver could even trade someone Sanchez to be a backup if they land Fitz. I think Fitz is a much better fit for Denver,
Post by: Pope on March 17, 2016, 08:18:22 PM
Here's a question... Would Fitz sit out if he doesn't get the money he wants?No way. He can sign anywhere he wants for 8 million a year minimum. To leave that kind of money on the table would be absurd
Or will he eventually cave if no one offers him "starter" money? I assume he will cave but Jesus this is stringing along for longer than anyone thought. Any chance he might just walk away?
Post by: bojanglesman on March 17, 2016, 08:56:53 PM
Well Denver could always trade Sanchez to San Fran (even as a possible backup) if they trade Kaep to the Browns then Denver signing Fitz makes sense.
I would be supremely weary about Sanchez playing in the harsh Denver elements.
I guess barring an injury though, theres essentially no market whatsoever for Fitz.
Possibly (although I think it would be weird) Denver could even trade someone Sanchez to be a backup if they land Fitz. I think Fitz is a much better fit for Denver,
Are you retar.....nevermind.
So you think Denver could conceivably trade a guy they just signed a few days ago?
Post by: Tommy on March 17, 2016, 09:04:45 PM
Are you retar.....nevermind.
So you think Denver could conceivably trade a guy they just signed a few days ago?
That's actually not that unheard of. It's happened many times before.
Post by: dcm1602 on March 17, 2016, 09:05:46 PM
Are you retar.....nevermind.
So you think Denver could conceivably trade a guy they just signed a few days ago?
Sanchez was a complete desperation move when they unexpectedly lost Osweiller (shortly after their other QB retired) leaving them literally with no QBs
They're a win now team who lost both of their QBs, and is an absolutely terrible position to draft one.
The Sanchez move had little to do with wanting him, and likely much much more with them willing to take whatever they could get.
Theres a reason that the thought of Sanchez getting traded to San Fran for Kaep was floated out there.
Post by: Tommy on March 17, 2016, 09:27:19 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 18, 2016, 12:57:43 AM
Sanchez was a complete desperation move when they unexpectedly lost Osweiller (shortly after their other QB retired) leaving them literally with no QBsI don't necessarily agree. They did move quickly to get SOMEONE in the building, but Sanchez doesn't make a lot of money, he's young enough where he could still have upside, and he cost little draft compensation. It was a very smart move.
They're a win now team who lost both of their QBs, and is an absolutely terrible position to draft one.
The Sanchez move had little to do with wanting him, and likely much much more with them willing to take whatever they could get.
Theres a reason that the thought of Sanchez getting traded to San Fran for Kaep was floated out there.
If Fitz had signed with Denver, I would have absolutely been in favor of getting Sanchez in a trade from Philly for minimal cost.
Post by: Johnny English on March 18, 2016, 02:18:28 PM
Maccagnan says Geno Smith is "definitely a possibility" to be #Jets' QB next season if Fitzpatrick signs elsewhere.
Post by: Johnny English on March 18, 2016, 02:19:37 PM
Maccagnan: Our focus is ideally to get Ryan back & continue forward with him... We're actively trying to facilitate a contract with him.
Post by: ukilledkenny on March 18, 2016, 06:36:49 PM
Dennis Waszak Jr. @DWAZ73 7m7 minutes ago
Maccagnan says Geno Smith is "definitely a possibility" to be #Jets' QB next season if Fitzpatrick signs elsewhere.
We need someone shadowing heismanberg and badger 24/7 to prevent self harm.
Post by: dcm1602 on March 18, 2016, 06:49:30 PM
I don't necessarily agree. They did move quickly to get SOMEONE in the building, but Sanchez doesn't make a lot of money, he's young enough where he could still have upside, and he cost little draft compensation. It was a very smart move.
If Fitz had signed with Denver, I would have absolutely been in favor of getting Sanchez in a trade from Philly for minimal cost.
Yeah its a smart move, because of their situation.
If they decide to sign Fitz for a decent chunk of change, and then draft a QB with an early pick suddenly Sanchez is completely expendable and an unnecessary waste of cash
Sanchez is essentially insurance if they dont get Fitz or Kaep or whoever else theyre targeting (is there really even anybody else?)
Post by: Badger on March 18, 2016, 07:44:48 PM
We need someone shadowing heismanberg and badger 24/7 to prevent self harm.
If we start Geno Smith I'm voting for Trump.
YOU'RE ALL GOING DOWN WITH ME
Post by: MBGreen on March 18, 2016, 07:51:44 PM
If we start Geno Smith I'm voting for Trump.*lights a cigar up in Canada*
YOU'RE ALL GOING DOWN WITH ME
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 18, 2016, 07:56:06 PM
*lights a cigar up in Canada**eats a mcmuffin at 8pm in America.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: MBGreen on March 18, 2016, 07:57:33 PM
*eats a mcmuffin at 8pm in America.Trump will have you shot at 7:55pm
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: MBGreen on March 19, 2016, 11:42:07 AM
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 19, 2016, 11:50:53 AM
Bold prediction: jets don't start smunt this year and draft the 12 gauge for this year
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Fyp
Post by: MBGreen on March 19, 2016, 11:51:30 AM
That is a "preferred prediction" not a bold one.
Fyp
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 21, 2016, 09:21:11 AM
-Les Snead, Rams GM on @nflnetwork
No Fitz there
Post by: Heismanberg on March 21, 2016, 11:02:12 AM
Post by: Johnny English on March 21, 2016, 11:50:53 AM
Why do they think that Case Keenum is good?Do they think he's good or just that there's no one available who represents better value? It's a pretty crappy market for QBs this year.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 21, 2016, 11:54:37 AM
Do they think he's good or just that there's no one available who represents better value? It's a pretty crappy market for QBs this year.
It's pretty crappy every year, except when a young Drew Brees somehow becomes available, you know like once every 25 years. Even then he didn't come without question marks.
Post by: Johnny English on March 21, 2016, 07:18:34 PM
It's pretty crappy every year, except when a young Drew Brees somehow becomes available, you know like once every 25 years. Even then he didn't come without question marks.
It's four years since the greatest quarterback of all time was a free agent, who then went on to have the greatest season of any QB in history, and win another Super Bowl.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 21, 2016, 07:31:00 PM
It's four years since the greatest quarterback of all time was a free agent, who then went on to have the greatest season of any QB in history, and win another Super Bowl.
Yeah there was how many teams in the running to get him? Geno Smith would have won a super bowl with that defense big freaking deal.
Post by: Johnny English on March 21, 2016, 07:32:21 PM
Yeah there was how many teams in the running to get him? Geno Smith would have won a super bowl with that defense big freaking deal.
Sure. I'm just saying, good QBs do come up in FA from time to time. They just haven't this year.
Post by: Miamipuck on March 21, 2016, 07:51:35 PM
Sure. I'm just saying, good QBs do come up in FA from time to time. They just haven't this year.
Difference makers, long term solutions at the position are exceedingly rare but I must be honest, I completely blanked on Manning. His was a very limited market, the Jets made overtures and I think the reply from Manning's camp was "phuck yourself", he hated Rex, which didn't mean there was a lack of respect.
I think stop gaps like Fitz obviously can be had but that was a trade and he certainly isn't long term.
Post by: Johnny English on March 22, 2016, 11:20:27 PM
Post by: Badger on March 23, 2016, 06:43:27 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on March 23, 2016, 08:11:36 AM
Somebody find yesterday's NYDN back page.
Here you go:
(http://images1.villagevoice.com/imager/u/original/6685771/nypost_weiner_resigns_560.jpg)
Post by: Miamipuck on March 23, 2016, 08:11:48 AM
(https://cbsboston.files.wordpress.com/2016/01/untitled-1-copy11.jpg)
Post by: Miamipuck on March 23, 2016, 08:11:56 AM
(http://thenypost.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/backpage102756-415x415.jpg?w=322&quality=100&strip=all&h=215)
Post by: Miamipuck on March 23, 2016, 08:14:39 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 23, 2016, 01:35:11 PM
(https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/enhanced/terminal05/2012/10/25/8/enhanced-buzz-27059-1351169658-4.jpg)I think that empty chair next to Romney would win this year's race. I'd vote for him. #chair2016
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 23, 2016, 01:47:08 PM
I think that empty chair next to Romney would win this year's race. I'd vote for him. #chair2016
Chair is a known racist and doesn't pay his taxes. #NeverChair
Post by: Badger on March 23, 2016, 09:13:14 PM
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160324/b78361c53b358d1c531669e56aff535f.jpg)
Post by: Heismanberg on March 23, 2016, 09:14:15 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on March 23, 2016, 09:44:46 PM
Post by: Koz on March 24, 2016, 11:54:38 AM
https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/713045010854359041
Post by: bojanglesman on March 24, 2016, 11:55:48 AM
Browns just signed RG3- Shefter.Dude.
https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/713045010854359041
Post by: Koz on March 24, 2016, 11:56:29 AM
Post by: Badger on March 24, 2016, 12:00:18 PM
Hah didn't see that but I guess it's somewhat relevant here as well.
Certainly is. Come home, Fitz.
Post by: Koz on March 24, 2016, 12:26:36 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on March 24, 2016, 12:27:35 PM
Given the RG3 signing, what are the remaining realistic options for Fitz in terms of interested teams? Denver and SF?
His best option has been and will always be the Jets.
Post by: Koz on March 24, 2016, 12:28:59 PM
His best option has been and will always be the Jets.
I know that, but who else is still kicking the tires?
Post by: Heismanberg on March 24, 2016, 12:29:39 PM
I know that, but who else is still kicking the tires?
Nobody
Post by: Libero_2 on March 24, 2016, 12:30:57 PM
I know that, but who else is still kicking the tires?
By all accounts, Denver laughed in his face. So SF would be his only other potential option, if they trade Kaepernick. If not, it might be us or the couch
Post by: Pope on March 24, 2016, 01:07:51 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on March 24, 2016, 01:13:17 PM
Now we need Denver to trade for Kaepershithead and for the Rams to proclaim they're not interested. 49ers could be in the running but I don't think Fitz fitz in Kelly's fitzstem
If the Niners trade Kaepernick to Denver, Sanchez will probably be part of that deal. SF would still probably take a QB in the first round after that move.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 24, 2016, 01:20:38 PM
Or they could just be trying to get Fitz back as cheap as possible and using the other QBs as leverage. I still think Denver is in play for Fitz as long as they don't sign Kaepernick. SF is too, but they are in prime striking distance for a blue chip QB in the draft. Denver isn't.
Post by: AlioTheFool on March 24, 2016, 02:01:16 PM
What if the Jets already have a gentleman's agreement with Fitz to sign him once the dust settles? Right now they can't sign him for practically any price because there's no room against the cap. It may be a situation where they're hoping they'll be able to keep Brick while trading Wilk, but if they can't trade Mo then Brick has to go. But you don't want to dump Brick now just to clear the space if you don't have to.
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 24, 2016, 02:03:02 PM
...or the couch
Vinny! Get him.
Post by: Heismanberg on March 24, 2016, 02:03:35 PM
He's a hack. Not sure why Cimini is giving him any kind of publicity.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 24, 2016, 02:05:50 PM
Here's a crazy theory inspired by Cimini's report that Tony Pauline (yeah, I know) is reporting that the Jets are actively trying to trade Wilkerson.
What if the Jets already have a gentleman's agreement with Fitz to sign him once the dust settles? Right now they can't sign him for practically any price because there's no room against the cap. It may be a situation where they're hoping they'll be able to keep Brick while trading Wilk, but if they can't trade Mo then Brick has to go. But you don't want to dump Brick now just to clear the space if you don't have to.
If that were the case, Fitz's agent wouldn't be spewing excrement all over the media.
Post by: AlioTheFool on March 24, 2016, 02:17:06 PM
If I had the time, I go back over the JI and give Pauline another swift e-kick in the nuts.
He's a hack. Not sure why Cimini is giving him any kind of publicity.
I know, that's why I made sure I noted it was him. Still, it's not hard to believe the Jets might be shopping Wilkerson.
If that were the case, Fitz's agent wouldn't be spewing excrement all over the media.
I'd spew if I were the agent too. Fitz still has every right to look elsewhere and if he is guaranteed more than he feels he can get from the Jets, he should go regardless of any other circumstances.
Again, it's a theory based off regurgitated info from a guy no one here listens to. But it doesn't seem out of the realm of possibility. The fact is, Fitz could say "I'll take $7MM per right now" and the deal still wouldn't get done because there's no cap room.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 24, 2016, 02:22:33 PM
I know, that's why I made sure I noted it was him. Still, it's not hard to believe the Jets might be shopping Wilkerson.
I'd spew if I were the agent too. Fitz still has every right to look elsewhere and if he is guaranteed more than he feels he can get from the Jets, he should go regardless of any other circumstances.
Again, it's a theory based off regurgitated info from a guy no one here listens to. But it doesn't seem out of the realm of possibility. The fact is, Fitz could say "I'll take $7MM per right now" and the deal still wouldn't get done because there's no cap room.
If Fitz said he'd take $7 million, moves and restructures would be made within the hour to get cap space.
Regarding your wild theory, if they had this "gentleman's agreement", why would his agent be throwing crap around the media about being lowballed and given backup money? It is out of the realm of possibility.
Post by: AlioTheFool on March 24, 2016, 02:52:29 PM
If Fitz said he'd take $7 million, moves and restructures would be made within the hour to get cap space.
Regarding your wild theory, if they had this "gentleman's agreement", why would his agent be throwing crap around the media about being lowballed and given backup money? It is out of the realm of possibility.
That's a good point.
Post by: Coach K on March 25, 2016, 07:38:25 AM
Browns and Jets withdraw from Kaepernick trade talks.
so its a Bronco's- Jet's staredown where the shoe drops on the 31st
gayyyyyy
Post by: bojanglesman on March 25, 2016, 08:04:56 AM
RG3 to Browns.
Browns and Jets withdraw from Kaepernick trade talks.
so its a Bronco's- 49ers staredown where the shoe drops on the 31st.
gayyyyyy
Fyp
Post by: Libero_2 on March 25, 2016, 08:21:29 AM
RG3 to Browns.
Browns and Jets withdraw from Kaepernick trade talks.
so its a Bronco's- Jet's staredown where the shoe drops on the 31st
gayyyyyy
I disagree. This is basically a good thing for us. We now have a reasonable end date for this mess.
Post by: Coach K on March 25, 2016, 08:29:57 AM
I disagree. This is basically a good thing for us. We now have a reasonable end date for this mess.
i agree. im not saying its horrible. just funny we have to wait for this domino to fall.
I think he comes back to the Jets to be honest. His agent is just maximizing what he can get. but I think he overplayed peoples willingness to pay a 33 year old who had a career year under the only OC to make him look like he deserves a deal throwing to a top 5 WR tandem lol
Post by: Coach K on March 25, 2016, 08:32:06 AM
if it goes up again at this rate 20m/yr will be a bargain when guys like Andrew Luck get 35 per in a few years lol
Post by: bojanglesman on March 26, 2016, 07:27:42 AM
Quote
Bleacher Report's Jason Cole reports the Jets have offered free agent Ryan Fitzpatrick a $7 annual salary but are willing to go up to $9 million a year.
Fitzpatrick is asking for $16 million a year. The two sides are miles apart and both seem willing to wait it out. Cole reports there is "little or no faith within the organization" that Geno Smith is capable of taking over the starting job, which means the Jets will have to look elsewhere if Fitzpatrick doesn't agree to their terms. One replacement option Cole mentioned was Mike Glennon, who is entering the last year of his deal with Tampa Bay.
(http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/agree-nod.gif)
Post by: Fenwyr on March 27, 2016, 12:35:11 PM
Post by: MBGreen on March 27, 2016, 01:03:58 PM
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: ukilledkenny on March 27, 2016, 02:57:10 PM
Post by: Pope on March 27, 2016, 03:22:56 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on March 27, 2016, 03:36:08 PM
Post by: MBGreen on March 27, 2016, 06:15:55 PM
He'll be back. There's plenty of ways to find a middle ground. It won't happen soon though.
Even middle ground is too pricey. Fitz needs to come back down to earth.
Post by: Coach K on March 27, 2016, 06:35:44 PM
Essentially guarantee the first 2 years.
Post by: dcm1602 on March 27, 2016, 06:49:52 PM
I told my friend couple days ago I think 3 yrs 36 mil 24 guaranteed gets it done
Essentially guarantee the first 2 years.
Fitz can go kill himself for that kind of money.
We have a ton of good players we cant afford to pay. No reason to throw wads of cash at a guy who is most famous for being a Bills QB
Post by: Johnny English on March 28, 2016, 09:20:47 AM
freak off, fat man. There's literally no point to you commenting on this other than the fact that you can't keep your trap shut. Go worry about how you're going to save your own shitty job this season.
Post by: dcm1602 on March 28, 2016, 02:53:12 PM
http://www.thescore.com/nfl/news/993014
freak off, fat man. There's literally no point to you commenting on this other than the fact that you can't keep your trap shut. Go worry about how you're going to save your own shitty job this season.
Well with how bad the Bills QBs are I cant blame him for wanting the Jets to not sign Fitz. They might need to sign him
Post by: bojanglesman on March 28, 2016, 02:56:40 PM
Well with how bad the Bills QBs are I cant blame him for wanting the Jets to not sign Fitz. They might need to sign himTyrod Taylor was pretty good for them.
Post by: Coach K on March 30, 2016, 04:34:34 AM
Fitz can go kill himself for that kind of money.
We have a ton of good players we cant afford to pay. No reason to throw wads of cash at a guy who is most famous for being a Bills QB
Thats 12 mil per . It's literally the middle ground between the 8 we've offered and 16 hes asking for .
No way he signs for less than 10 per.
12 per for 2 years isn't bad at all. I just wouldn't pay a penny more .
"Tons of good players we cant pay" Mo? Richardson can be kept by exercising an option next yr .
Everyone else is arguably expendable . David Harris likely gone, Breno, And a few others .
Post by: Italian Seafood on March 30, 2016, 11:21:26 AM
Thats 12 mil per . It's literally the middle ground between the 8 we've offered and 16 hes asking for .
No way he signs for less than 10 per.
12 per for 2 years isn't bad at all. I just wouldn't pay a penny more .
That's not crazy, especially for a year or two. He is the QB, is $12 million worth having a good season and competing for the playoffs vs a miserable 6-10 with Geno? I'd say so.
Post by: Johnny English on March 30, 2016, 11:29:27 AM
That's not crazy, especially for a year or two. He is the QB, is $12 million worth having a good season and competing for the playoffs vs a miserable 6-10 with Geno? I'd say so.
In principle I agree, but if you haven't got the $12M in the first place it's kind of moot.
Post by: bojanglesman on March 30, 2016, 11:40:43 AM
No urgency in freeing up cap space because there isn't a deadline on those decisions anytime soon.
I still think it's funny that the Darryl Morris contract still isn't official.
Post by: Coach K on March 30, 2016, 12:22:39 PM
I think agreeing to a deal with Fitz will set a lot of other changes in motion. Once they have an agreement in place verbally, they'll free up the needed cap space however they choose (restructure Skrine, Gilchrist, cut/pay cut on Brick, etc.) No point in doing that until you know there's a reason to even do it. Fitz is the domino that must fall first.
No urgency in freeing up cap space because there isn't a deadline on those decisions anytime soon.
I still think it's funny that the Darryl Morris contract still isn't official.
skrine and gilchrist can be asked to come off some money down the line or restructure bonus.
but i agree. the room will be made, but first the deal has to be in place. his agent is playing hardball as if the Kaep trade forces their hand but I dont think they intended on trading for him if it cost more than a 3rd anyways.
this is all moot, just two guys bluffing eachother until the middle ground is met. pretty sure the reports are Denver is going for McCown or someone else at this point and Fitz is no longer a prime target.
probably because everyone knows hes coming back, theyre just playing chicken.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on March 30, 2016, 09:59:04 PM
Post by: Tommy on March 30, 2016, 09:59:41 PM
Chris Russo screaming "Sign The Contact" at Fitz at the Mike and the Mad Dog reunion show and Fitz mugs for the camera
I just came here to post this. Fitz looked embarrassed. Hilarious.
Post by: bojanglesman on April 06, 2016, 06:57:59 PM
The Jets have talked to D’Brickashaw Ferguson about taking a paycut to clear cap space in hopes of signing Ryan Fitzpatrick, per source #nyj
Post by: Libero_2 on April 06, 2016, 07:00:26 PM
Brian Costello (@BrianCoz) tweeted at 7:36 PM on Wed, Apr 06, 2016:
The Jets have talked to D’Brickashaw Ferguson about taking a paycut to clear cap space in hopes of signing Ryan Fitzpatrick, per source #nyj
I have to assume this is not the first time we tried to have this chat with Brick.
Post by: bojanglesman on April 06, 2016, 07:00:56 PM
I have to assume this is not the first time we tried to have this chat with Brick.First reported time, but who knows what happened behind closed doors.
Post by: reuben on April 06, 2016, 07:11:41 PM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CfXHYwZUMAAKtSd.jpg:large)
Post by: bojanglesman on April 06, 2016, 07:14:27 PM
Quote
Ferguson, 32, could decline the Jets’ request to take a paycut, and the team could cut him, but sources indicated he is open to a reasonable cut in pay.
Post by: Heismanberg on April 06, 2016, 07:17:08 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on April 06, 2016, 07:17:31 PM
WHAT IF RYAN FITZPATRICK WERE BLACK
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CfXHYwZUMAAKtSd.jpg:large)
Tommy would hate him
Coach K would love him
Post by: Miamipuck on April 06, 2016, 07:22:30 PM
WHAT IF RYAN FITZPATRICK WERE BLACK
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CfXHYwZUMAAKtSd.jpg:large)
That looks like Coach Dunbar.
Post by: Coach K on April 06, 2016, 07:25:48 PM
Tommy would hate him
Coach K would love him
you sounded like a freaking moron the first time you made this assertion. I guess a sequel was to be expected from a self serving douche like you .
Post by: Heismanberg on April 06, 2016, 07:28:12 PM
you sounded like a freaking moron the first time you made this assertion. I guess a sequel was to be expected from a self serving douche like you .
Let's be honest: Rashaun Fitzpatrick would be your favorite player.
Post by: Badger on April 06, 2016, 07:45:13 PM
Let's be honest: Rashaun Fitzpatrick would be your favorite player.
Did you know Rashaun Fitzpatrick went to Howard University?
Post by: Heismanberg on April 06, 2016, 07:47:02 PM
Did you know Rashaun Fitzpatrick went to Howard University?
The Harvard of the HBCs.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on April 06, 2016, 08:06:03 PM
Let's be honest: Rashaun Fitzpatrick would be your favorite player.i laughed
Post by: bojanglesman on April 10, 2016, 10:18:56 AM
The Jets' offer to Fitzpatrick isn't based on cap space; it's based on what they feel he's worth. Obviously, Fitzpatrick feels differently. From what I understand, the offer is better than the $7 million-to-$8 million that is being reported, which means the low-ball perception isn't quite accurate.
Post by: Johnny English on April 10, 2016, 10:21:56 AM
From a Cimini article:
The Jets' offer to Fitzpatrick isn't based on cap space; it's based on what they feel he's worth. Obviously, Fitzpatrick feels differently. From what I understand, the offer is better than the $7 million-to-$8 million that is being reported, which means the low-ball perception isn't quite accurate.
$7M plus Brick's parking spot.
Post by: Coach K on April 10, 2016, 11:02:38 AM
But who knows what he's been offered
Post by: AlioTheFool on April 11, 2016, 10:27:24 AM
Post by: MBGreen on April 11, 2016, 10:31:50 AM
I still think $10M is the number that is fair to both sides.
I think Fitz and his agent are waiting to sign after the draft.
They have no leverage...so i don't understand what the logic is behind that line of thinking. If the Jets draft a QB prospect in the upper rounds, I don't see that helping Fitz either. He should sign before draft, imo.
Post by: Johnny English on April 11, 2016, 10:43:24 AM
I think Fitz and his agent are waiting to sign after the draft.
They have no leverage...so i don't understand what the logic is behind that line of thinking. If the Jets draft a QB prospect in the upper rounds, I don't see that helping Fitz either. He should sign before draft, imo.
My guess would be that if the Jets trade Wilk to move up as seems to be a distinct possibility, it frees up a whole load of extra space for them to negotiate over. No QB that we draft this year is likely to be an immediate starter.
Post by: AlioTheFool on April 11, 2016, 11:08:04 AM
It just seems like Fitz is doing everything in his own power to overplay his hand. Even if the Jets don't trade for a Glennon or McCown, they could still go into 2016 with Geno Smith (as much as we'd all hate it) as the starter. Fitz has zero bargaining power apart from being the guy the fanbase would like to see return.
Post by: bojanglesman on April 11, 2016, 11:38:21 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on April 11, 2016, 12:21:26 PM
There is no hurry for Fitz to sign. No real deadline soon.
While there aren't any deadlines, like I said, the specter of Glennon or McCown is out there. If Duff were to decide he's made enough of a fair offer and that he's not going to wait any longer for Fitz to "come to his senses" he could trade for one of those guys and just move on. That leaves Fitz without a home.
It's a risky move on his part considering there's very little leverage on his side.
Post by: reuben on April 17, 2016, 04:34:20 PM
Post by: Badger on April 17, 2016, 04:54:23 PM
Texans just let go of Hoyer.
Fitz's asking price just went down another $2M.
Post by: bojanglesman on April 18, 2016, 08:23:31 AM
Barring a significant breakthrough, #Jets & Ryan Fitzpatrick are not expected to have a deal before the draft. Adds intrigue to their draft
Post by: MBGreen on April 18, 2016, 08:55:35 AM
Ian Rapoport (@RapSheet) tweeted at 9:07 AM on Mon, Apr 18, 2016:
Barring a significant breakthrough, #Jets & Ryan Fitzpatrick are not expected to have a deal before the draft. Adds intrigue to their draft
Fitz's agent is bending Fitz over.
Post by: bojanglesman on April 18, 2016, 09:17:36 AM
Post by: MBGreen on April 18, 2016, 09:20:06 AM
Can't blame Fitz at this point. Might as well wait around and see what happens. If someone else signs Hoyer and they don't draft a QB high, he might be able to squeeze the Jets for a few more dollars. It's a gamble.
Fitz HAS to know that he's not getting his asking price. The leverage was never there.
I think the longer this drags out, the worse it gets for him.
Post by: bojanglesman on April 18, 2016, 09:45:16 AM
Fitz HAS to know that he's not getting his asking price. The leverage was never there.His agent loves to wait it out. And he usually wins. I don't think he will this time though.
I think the longer this drags out, the worse it gets for him.
Post by: MBGreen on April 18, 2016, 09:45:56 AM
His agent loves to wait it out. And he usually wins. I don't think he will this time though.
Snuffed by Duff
Post by: bojanglesman on April 18, 2016, 09:59:32 AM
Snuffed by DuffDuffzoned
Post by: Johnny English on April 18, 2016, 11:12:53 AM
Post by: Tommy on April 19, 2016, 07:41:30 PM
Fitz sure looks like a guy who's still the QB of the Jets.
Post by: dcm1602 on April 19, 2016, 07:54:37 PM
He's waiting to see if we trade Wilk at the draft. It makes sense at this stage.
Why ?
If we trade Wilk at the draft I have to imagine the most probable scenario is were getting a QB
Post by: Johnny English on April 19, 2016, 08:01:31 PM
Why ?I think that there are a lot of potential trade scenarios involving Wilk at the draft, and even with the couple that are for a QB there are none which don't look better with them sitting behind Fitz for a year.
If we trade Wilk at the draft I have to imagine the most probable scenario is were getting a QB
Post by: dcm1602 on April 19, 2016, 08:07:52 PM
I think that there are a lot of potential trade scenarios involving Wilk at the draft, and even with the couple that are for a QB there are none which don't look better with them sitting behind Fitz for a year.
But Fitz's leverage does down substantially, as does as our "need" for him.
I cant imagine us giving Fitz a 3 year 30+ million dollar contract if we just traded up in the draft for a QB
I understand that having a QB learn behind him would no doubt be ideal, but it wouldnt make sense to give Fitz this big contract, only to have him being a backup for the final 2-3 years of it
Post by: Johnny English on April 19, 2016, 09:12:01 PM
But Fitz's leverage does down substantially, as does as our "need" for him.
I cant imagine us giving Fitz a 3 year 30+ million dollar contract if we just traded up in the draft for a QB
I understand that having a QB learn behind him would no doubt be ideal, but it wouldnt make sense to give Fitz this big contract, only to have him being a backup for the final 2-3 years of it
No one to my knowledge is arguing about the length of his contract, only the value. I think that a 2 year / $10M deal would probably get it done, and if we were to draft someone like Paxton Lynch while also trading Wilk (regardless of whether Lynch is the end point of that trade or not), that seems like a pretty much ideal scenario for everyone involved.
Post by: dcm1602 on April 19, 2016, 09:31:03 PM
No one to my knowledge is arguing about the length of his contract, only the value. I think that a 2 year / $10M deal would probably get it done, and if we were to draft someone like Paxton Lynch while also trading Wilk (regardless of whether Lynch is the end point of that trade or not), that seems like a pretty much ideal scenario for everyone involved.
Why wouldnt he argue about the length of his contract ?
Fitz just had one of the better seasons of his career, why would he accept a 2 year deal?
Players want guarenteed money, and longer contracts means more guaranteed cash
Post by: Johnny English on April 19, 2016, 09:38:20 PM
Why wouldnt he argue about the length of his contract ?
Fitz just had one of the better seasons of his career, why would he accept a 2 year deal?
Players want guarenteed money, and longer contracts means more guaranteed cash
Again, no one to my knowledge is arguing about the length of his contract, only the value of it. I'm willing to be proven wrong.
Post by: dcm1602 on April 19, 2016, 09:48:41 PM
Again, no one to my knowledge is arguing about the length of his contract, only the value of it. I'm willing to be proven wrong.
So barring the Jets offering him a stupid amount of money (ie 2 years 25 million) you think he would take a contract LESS than 3 years?
Post by: Johnny English on April 19, 2016, 09:49:57 PM
So barring the Jets offering him a stupid amount of money (ie 2 years 25 million) you think he would take a contract LESS than 3 years?
I think that 2/25 is on the high side, but depending on how the guarantees and bonuses work out I don't think it's a stupid amount. And yes, I do.
Post by: Heismanberg on April 20, 2016, 12:43:38 AM
Post by: Libero_2 on April 20, 2016, 05:10:21 AM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cgdl2N8WEAEQedc.jpg)This is why Jets fans love Mangold
Post by: MBGreen on April 20, 2016, 06:30:42 AM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cgdl2N8WEAEQedc.jpg)Yaaaassss!!
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Koz on April 20, 2016, 06:58:29 AM
Post by: insanity on April 20, 2016, 09:57:06 AM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cgdl2N8WEAEQedc.jpg)Who's the chick?
Post by: Koz on April 20, 2016, 10:05:03 AM
Who's the chick?Some model
Justin Tuck is right above her, sitting with his kid.
A couple of Giants were there as well, Pugh being one of them.
Steve Buscemi got the most applause of course.
Post by: Miamipuck on April 20, 2016, 10:37:00 AM
Who's the chick?
Ryan Quigley
Post by: Coach K on April 22, 2016, 01:44:26 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on April 28, 2016, 02:29:48 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on April 28, 2016, 02:31:14 PM
Schefter reports Fitz is saying he'd rather not play than accept the Jets current offer.
Retirement is his agent's only weapon left to get the salary up. Can't say I blame him for playing that card.
Post by: MBGreen on April 28, 2016, 02:32:24 PM
Schefter reports Fitz is saying he'd rather not play than accept the Jets current offer.
lmao
Fitz can freak off then. Money pride is clearly his top priority, and not the team.
Post by: AlioTheFool on April 28, 2016, 02:33:14 PM
Post by: MBGreen on April 28, 2016, 02:34:33 PM
That seems ridiculous. How "lowball" is the Jets' offer and how much does Fitz honestly believe he's worth?
Even if the Jets are offering 7-10 million, like early reports were saying....that isn't minimum wage. Fitz needs to get past the fact that Bradford got paid more than he did.
Post by: bojanglesman on April 28, 2016, 02:37:11 PM
Even if the Jets are offering 7-10 million, like early reports were saying....that isn't minimum wage. Fitz needs to get past the fact that Bradford got paid more than he did.
I think Fitz has likely handed all of this off to his agent, and his agent is who is spouting off all of this.
Post by: Miamipuck on April 28, 2016, 02:44:57 PM
I think Fitz has likely handed all of this off to his agent, and his agent is who is spouting off all of this.
Nahhhh
Post by: Tommy on April 28, 2016, 02:50:41 PM
Post by: Ignatius J Reilly on April 28, 2016, 03:02:12 PM
Post by: MBGreen on April 28, 2016, 03:03:53 PM
It's a business negotiation. I'm not going to tell Fitz to freak off for trying to get paid. If he's asking for too much, he'll have to decide whether it's best for his family to get less than he thinks he's worth or do without completely.
I get that, and i think he should be trying to get paid too. But if the rumors that he's holding out for Bradford money are true, he can enjoy his couch.
He made his fortune off Buffalo, and i'm pretty sure what the Jets are offering won't starve his family.
Post by: Miamipuck on April 28, 2016, 03:08:23 PM
I get that, and i think he should be trying to get paid too. But if the rumors that he's holding out for Bradford money are true, he can enjoy his couch.
He made his fortune off Buffalo, and i'm pretty sure what the Jets are offering won't starve his family.
Who are you to dictate who much can feed his family, you have been living off the gov't tit for too long.
Post by: dcm1602 on April 28, 2016, 03:11:12 PM
He is a UFA, if he's worth more there's 31 other teams he can appeal to.
It's not like he's under contract or tagged and we're lowballing him with a excrement contract extension.
The market has determined Fitz isnt worth dick, if he wants more money then he needs to get good
Fitz is really gambling waiting till after the draft. If we get a QB he loses all leverage and will get offered even less. If we don't, then maybe he can slightly increase his annual number
Post by: Derek Smalls on April 28, 2016, 03:12:28 PM
Did we lowball him? Not according to common sense and the QB market as of last season. But according to this year's QB market, we 100% lowballed him.
Post by: MBGreen on April 28, 2016, 03:12:36 PM
Who are you to dictate who much can feed his family, you have been living off the gov't tit for too long.
If Fitz shared the same affection for appetizers as you do, he may have to hold out for more.
Post by: MBGreen on April 28, 2016, 03:13:20 PM
Retirement is his best leverage against taking that salary.
Did we lowball him? Not according to common sense and the QB market as of last season. But according to this year's QB market, we 100% lowballed him.
I don't think we lowballed him. He's a 34 year old stopgap with no playoff experience, that nobody else had interest in signing.
The market dictated his worth.
Post by: AlioTheFool on April 28, 2016, 03:19:34 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on April 28, 2016, 03:22:32 PM
I don't think we lowballed him. He's a 34 year old stopgap that nobody else had interest in signing.I said back in December he'd make $10M this season. Backup QBs on the market this year have gotten similar contracts to what we're offering Fitz. Bradford and Osweiler got huge deals, and Fitz is probably better than either (with less long-term upside).
The market dictated his worth.
Post by: Miamipuck on April 28, 2016, 03:23:56 PM
If Fitz shared the same affection for appetizers as you do, he may have to hold out for more.
Just bring your wallet to the tailgate and shut your piehole.
Post by: ukilledkenny on April 28, 2016, 03:25:56 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on April 28, 2016, 03:42:13 PM
It's not like he has to choose whatever money the jets will give him or nothing. We all know what school he went to and he has plenty of cash in the bank to make a transition to something else. So, it's more like his choices are make more money while going through another year of hits or make decent money doing something away from the game.
Pretty sure he's not making 7 figures out of the nfl
Post by: bojanglesman on April 28, 2016, 03:44:16 PM
Quote
Brian Costello @BrianCoz
I spoke to a source who said the report about Fitzpatrick being willing to sit out is not true. Fitz wants to play. #nyj
Media wawr!
Post by: dcm1602 on April 28, 2016, 03:45:08 PM
Media wawr!
We should only offer him 5m/yr now
Post by: AlioTheFool on April 28, 2016, 04:11:58 PM
Media wawr!
Meanwhile his agent quietly weeps in a corner...
Post by: bojanglesman on April 28, 2016, 04:14:41 PM
Meanwhile his agent quietly weeps in a corner...(http://38.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m57rgaEIcp1qefkujo2_500.gif)
Post by: Pope on April 28, 2016, 04:18:30 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on April 28, 2016, 04:23:28 PM
I think Fitz will ultimately be a Jet, it's just going to happen later than we'd like.
I don't really care much as long as it's before minicamp in June.
Post by: Laxin on April 28, 2016, 05:59:13 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on April 28, 2016, 06:00:44 PM
I just dont understand where this extra money is supposed to come fromRestructures.
Post by: CatoTheElder on April 28, 2016, 06:02:45 PM
I just dont understand where this extra money is supposed to come from
Melisandre's vagina.
Post by: Laxin on April 28, 2016, 06:09:16 PM
Restructures.
Restructure 10M?
Post by: dcm1602 on April 28, 2016, 06:20:16 PM
Restructure 10M?We if we trade Wilk it easily frees up 10m +
Post by: Jumbo on April 28, 2016, 06:22:58 PM
We if we trade Wilk it easily frees up 10m +
It's just that easy!
Post by: Libero_2 on April 28, 2016, 06:30:18 PM
I just dont understand where this extra money is supposed to come from
They have some kinda plan to get him $7-8 million without moving Wilk, so I imagine if necessary we could get a signing bonus to stay under the cap and get him an extra million or two.
Post by: Laxin on April 28, 2016, 06:30:18 PM
It's just that easy!
Exactly lol.
It doesnt appear Wilk is being traded.
Post by: dcm1602 on April 28, 2016, 06:50:28 PM
Exactly lol.
It doesnt appear Wilk is being traded.
OK if we extend Wilk we can easily free up a huge chunk of change, and then the rest can be obtained through redoing Mangolds contract.
There's really several viable options
Post by: Laxin on April 29, 2016, 06:40:51 AM
OK if we extend Wilk we can easily free up a huge chunk of change, and then the rest can be obtained through redoing Mangolds contract.
There's really several viable options
If a long term deal with Wilk was that easy, wouldn't it be done already?
Post by: Dreamers on April 29, 2016, 06:58:17 AM
If a long term deal with Wilk was that easy, wouldn't it be done already?
Yeah I dont think you free up anything by restructuring him. He wants 100 mil so unless they are looking to give him 30 mil next year that tag number shouldnt change a lot. We have like 3 mil moving Breno will free up anther 4 mil. So that alone is enough to take Bradford on if Fitz doesnt come down on his demands. Question is will they look to move Mangold to free up room or extend Marshal if that ends up taking too much too happen? Or will they just suck it up this year and just draft a QB in the 2nd-3rd rounds? I have always been a fan of QB and OT in the 2-3. He doesnt have to be the long term QB just someone to compete vs Geno would be good.
Post by: bojanglesman on April 29, 2016, 07:00:05 AM
Post by: Koz on April 29, 2016, 07:09:14 AM
Yeah I dont think you free up anything by restructuring him. He wants 100 mil so unless they are looking to give him 30 mil next year that tag number shouldnt change a lot. We have like 3 mil moving Breno will free up anther 4 mil. So that alone is enough to take Bradford on if Fitz doesnt come down on his demands. Question is will they look to move Mangold to free up room or extend Marshal if that ends up taking too much too happen? Or will they just suck it up this year and just draft a QB in the 2nd-3rd rounds? I have always been a fan of QB and OT in the 2-3. He doesnt have to be the long term QB just someone to compete vs Geno would be good.
Did you just question whether the team would consider "moving" Mangold? Now?
Post by: Laxin on April 29, 2016, 07:31:05 AM
They have 3.3M in cap space. The draft picks should cost about 4.8M in cap space assuming they keep all of their picks. They need 1.5M to just sign all of their picks.
The Jets can cut Breno, but that would be contingent on drafting an OT like Spriggs. This could save 4.4M in cap space.
The Jets can potentially try and restructure Mangold's, Decker's or maybe Marshall's contract to free up some space.
Im not an expert on contract structures and how to minimize cap hits (I think through signing bonuses?), but I would think the Jets would need even a few million in cap space just to sign Fitz. Im sure they would also like about 1M for wiggle room during the season.
So at minimum, they will have to create about 3M for draft picks + wiggle room... and maybe an additional 3-4M for Fitz. Not sure on the Fitz number though, maybe someone with more knowledge on this can weigh in (Libero?)
Post by: bojanglesman on April 29, 2016, 07:42:08 AM
So looking at the Jets cap...
They have 3.3M in cap space. The draft picks should cost about 4.8M in cap space assuming they keep all of their picks. They need 1.5M to just sign all of their picks.
The Jets can cut Breno, but that would be contingent on drafting an OT like Spriggs. This could save 4.4M in cap space.
The Jets can potentially try and restructure Mangold's, Decker's or maybe Marshall's contract to free up some space.
Im not an expert on contract structures and how to minimize cap hits (I think through signing bonuses?), but I would think the Jets would need even a few million in cap space just to sign Fitz. Im sure they would also like about 1M for wiggle room during the season.
So at minimum, they will have to create about 3M for draft picks + wiggle room... and maybe an additional 3-4M for Fitz. Not sure on the Fitz number though, maybe someone with more knowledge on this can weigh in (Libero?)
I believe the draft picks won't cost that much because you have to drop a player from the roster to add them. The dropped player's salary offsets the draft pick's salary a little bit. Basically you'd drop a league minimum salary for each pick.
Post by: Koz on April 29, 2016, 07:55:48 AM
I believe the draft picks won't cost that much because you have to drop a player from the roster to add them. The dropped player's salary offsets the draft pick's salary a little bit. Basically you'd drop a league minimum salary for each pick.Have them all listed at Long Snappers and then sign them to 7 year max deals at league minimum.
Post by: Laxin on April 29, 2016, 07:57:28 AM
I believe the draft picks won't cost that much because you have to drop a player from the roster to add them. The dropped player's salary offsets the draft pick's salary a little bit. Basically you'd drop a league minimum salary for each pick.
Thats true, so then they can fit under the cap currently, just have to either restructure a contract or two or cut Breno to fit Fitz. Not as bad as I originally thought. Still cant sign him to what he wants though.
Post by: bojanglesman on April 29, 2016, 08:01:57 AM
Thats true, so then they can fit under the cap currently, just have to either restructure a contract or two or cut Breno to fit Fitz. Not as bad as I originally thought. Still cant sign him to what he wants though.
Now that they definitely aren't trading Mo, I think the Jets have to restructure someone to even sign Hoyer, let alone Fitz. Even if they cut Breno, I don't think it frees up enough cash to sign a QB unless it's a scrub minimum-salary QB, which would defeat the purpose. I guess they could backload a deal, but I don't think they would do that. I doubt it would take a huge restructure to get a QB signed unless they didn't cut Breno. I don't know if they are even considering cutting Breno.
I feel like the Jets are doing their best not to mess with next year's cap (unlike the Saints). They don't seem to want to touch any of these deals in place unless they have to. It's smart.
Post by: Miamipuck on April 29, 2016, 08:11:23 AM
Now that they definitely aren't trading Mo, I think the Jets have to restructure someone to even sign Hoyer, let alone Fitz. Even if they cut Breno, I don't think it frees up enough cash to sign a QB unless it's a scrub minimum-salary QB, which would defeat the purpose. I guess they could backload a deal, but I don't think they would do that. I doubt it would take a huge restructure to get a QB signed unless they didn't cut Breno. I don't know if they are even considering cutting Breno.
I feel like the Jets are doing their best not to mess with next year's cap (unlike the Saints). They don't seem to want to touch any of these deals in place unless they have to. It's smart.
How much is the cap projected to go up next year?
Post by: Badger on April 29, 2016, 08:35:48 AM
Move Mangold?
Dreamers mode engaged
Post by: Dreamers on April 29, 2016, 08:51:28 AM
How much is the cap projected to go up next year?
Depends on who we keep. Currently like 34 mil but reality is 50-55 mil after cuts but we do have a long list of guys hitting FA we will need to fill. So to say lets give him over 30 mil next year is just crippling. You will also have to back end in Fitz deal to so it is more like 40+ mil in next years cap on those 2 combined at least if you go that road. It doesnt give you a lot to work with next year just to keep Fitz. You make that move your signing up to be in cap hell again next year IMO.
Post by: Dreamers on April 29, 2016, 08:54:27 AM
Dreamers mode engaged
The BUs played outstanding last year and it opens up a lot of cap very quick. I get it he is a team leader and all but he isnt the future and it is unlikely we are winning a SB any time soon. If we can ship him to a true contender I think it is best for both parties. Lets see what Johnson can do.
Post by: Heismanberg on April 29, 2016, 09:02:57 AM
Lets see what Johnson can do.
no
Post by: Miamipuck on April 29, 2016, 09:40:05 AM
Depends on who we keep. Currently like 34 mil but reality is 50-55 mil after cuts but we do have a long list of guys hitting FA we will need to fill. So to say lets give him over 30 mil next year is just crippling. You will also have to back end in Fitz deal to so it is more like 40+ mil in next years cap on those 2 combined at least if you go that road. It doesnt give you a lot to work with next year just to keep Fitz. You make that move your signing up to be in cap hell again next year IMO.
Thank you but that's not what I meant, I meant the cap is 155.27, what's it projected to be the following year. I think it's supposed to go up significantly next year.
Post by: AlioTheFool on April 29, 2016, 09:53:47 AM
Thatn you but that's not what I meant, I meant the cap is 155.27, what's it projected to be the following year. I think it's supposed to go up significantly next year.
Yeah, the media has been talking about it a lot. The expectation is that the cap will skyrocket over the next few years, which is why teams were making it rain in FA this year. They're spending tomorrow's cash today.
Post by: Dreamers on April 29, 2016, 10:16:55 AM
Thank you but that's not what I meant, I meant the cap is 155.27, what's it projected to be the following year. I think it's supposed to go up significantly next year.
Cap page says 166 mil not sure if that is with out without carry over. Not that we have a lot of that
Post by: Heismanberg on April 30, 2016, 12:51:56 PM
Post by: casman02 on April 30, 2016, 12:54:06 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on April 30, 2016, 12:55:55 PM
Watching the press conference, it looked like someone from the media (did not recognize voice) tried to turn Bowles against Macc on the Fitzpatrick issue saying they were playing a dangerous game...Bowles handles it like a pro saying we aren't just sitting around and they have 3 guys doing work
It wasn't Cimini?
He was being super douchey last night about the Hackenberg pick.
Post by: casman02 on April 30, 2016, 01:11:20 PM
It wasn't Cimini?
He was being super douchey last night about the Hackenberg pick.
That was my guess. B Cos asked another Fitz question right after and it did not sound like Manish.
Post by: Libero_2 on April 30, 2016, 01:42:24 PM
It wasn't Cimini?
He was being super douchey last night about the Hackenberg pick.
Cimini was super douchey just because
Post by: Miamipuck on April 30, 2016, 03:14:06 PM
Cimini was super douchey just because
Because he's super douchey?
Post by: Libero_2 on April 30, 2016, 04:08:29 PM
Because he's super douchey?
Just because he can be was where I was going, but yeah
Post by: Tommy on May 01, 2016, 05:53:19 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on May 01, 2016, 06:03:01 PM
So we have a little over $3 million in cap space, and have to sign all of our draft picks, including some UDFA. How in the hell are we going to pull off signing Fitz to anything close to what the Jets are even offering?
I would imagine that Mac had already talked to players about revamping their deals to clear up cap space, and is just waiting to the necessary time to execute them. Ot possibly wanted to see how the Wilkerson situation played out up to and through the draft
Post by: casman02 on May 01, 2016, 06:16:05 PM
So we have a little over $3 million in cap space, and have to sign all of our draft picks, including some UDFA. How in the hell are we going to pull off signing Fitz to anything close to what the Jets are even offering?
I imagine that 3 million all goes to draft picks so looking at who can be cut to get to about 8-10 million. Here are a few players and how much the Jets will save by letting them go
Geno Smith Savings 1 million. If the Jets re-sign Fitz, Geno is gone.
Kembrell Thompkins 1.6 million. Have Marshall, Decker, D Smith, Enunwa and Peake. I do not think Thompkins is that special.
Nick Folk 2.1 million. A lot of money for a kicker. He did miss a big chunk last year and the Jets survived
Breno Giacomini 4.375 million. Getting older. They have Qvale, Shell and Ijalana. I am not comfortable with that, but maybe the Jets are...
Some more fat can be trimmed, but that will get them to about 9 million. It is possible
Post by: dcm1602 on May 01, 2016, 06:23:12 PM
Would save 4 million in cap space I believe
Post by: casman02 on May 01, 2016, 06:38:19 PM
Is Milliner tradeable?
Would save 4 million in cap space I believe
It would, but I doubt it. No one is going to trade assets for a guy who they have not seen healthy. Might as well keep him and see if anything becomes of him.
Maybe Geno is tradeable for a 6th or 7th (I know am reaaaaaching). A team like Seattle has Wilson as the only QB on the roster and could use a cheap, backup with some experience. It would save an extra half million. Then again, they are not that dumb
Post by: bojanglesman on May 01, 2016, 06:43:13 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on May 01, 2016, 06:57:48 PM
It would, but I doubt it. No one is going to trade assets for a guy who they have not seen healthy. Might as well keep him and see if anything becomes of him.
Maybe Geno is tradeable for a 6th or 7th (I know am reaaaaaching). A team like Seattle has Wilson as the only QB on the roster and could use a cheap, backup with some experience. It would save an extra half million. Then again, they are not that dumb
Well nobody would give up assets of value for him, but if we did it as a salary dump why not?
. Low risk, high reward move for anyone. And it's not like his contract is absurd. He's shown flashes and his injuries have all been completely different.
If I was a team with a need at corner why not roll the dice spending 4 million for a one year deal on a young talented injury prone player
Post by: Libero_2 on May 01, 2016, 06:59:17 PM
It would, but I doubt it. No one is going to trade assets for a guy who they have not seen healthy. Might as well keep him and see if anything becomes of him.
Maybe Geno is tradeable for a 6th or 7th (I know am reaaaaaching). A team like Seattle has Wilson as the only QB on the roster and could use a cheap, backup with some experience. It would save an extra half million. Then again, they are not that dumb
If we could move milliner for a used tampon, we would probably do it in a heartbeat just to save the cap space.
And despite our hatred of the fuckhead, Geno has some value in the league. He has started 29 games and is capable of being an NFL backup. I think we could get something for him, even if it's just a conditional selection in 2018.
Post by: Pope on May 01, 2016, 07:10:49 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on May 01, 2016, 07:15:43 PM
Milliner and Geno are probably worth about the same, conditional 6th or 7th
Geno is probably an average or even above average 2nd string QB, under contract for just over a million.
If you ask me he's worth at least a 5th, if not a 4th.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on May 01, 2016, 07:46:25 PM
Geno is probably an average or even above average 2nd string QB, under contract for just over a million.
If you ask me he's worth at least a 5th, if not a 4th.
GTFO, if anyone offered even close to that for Geno he would have been gone a long time ago
Post by: dcm1602 on May 01, 2016, 07:59:03 PM
GTFO, if anyone offered even close to that for Geno he would have been gone a long time ago
Why?
Cassel got traded for a 5th round pick twice, and one of those times he was earning close to 5 million dollars.
I think a healthy Geno Smith for a million bucks is one of the better deals for a backup QB.
Post by: Tommy on May 01, 2016, 08:36:12 PM
Milliner and Geno are probably worth about the same, conditional 6th or 7th
I can't see anyone trading for Milliner's shitty contract. We just have to bear one more year with him and he's gone. Along with more than $4 million in cap space.
Post by: Badger on May 01, 2016, 08:45:19 PM
I can't see anyone trading for Milliner's shitty contract. We just have to bear one more year with him and he's gone. Along with more than $4 million in cap space.
He's in the last year of his contract with a cap hit of $4M. It's not that shitty. It's just not great.
But if there's a team out there with a lot of remaining cap space and a need for CB that's willing to gamble, it could happen.
Post by: Badger on May 06, 2016, 08:08:15 AM
Post by: casman02 on May 07, 2016, 09:29:39 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on May 07, 2016, 10:27:18 AM
Watching nfl network, it is fun seeing how many people claim we need Fitz back, but then call him Fitzgerald. So important that they can't even get his name right.
The Jets can't win without Fitzsimmons.
Post by: dcm1602 on May 07, 2016, 11:46:37 AM
Honestly at that point I think we tell him to go freak himself and just ride with our merry band of rejects, and dont even give Fitz a second look after that unless someone gets injured
Post by: Tommy on May 07, 2016, 11:52:20 AM
Cimini projects that this Fitz-Jets standoff goes into at least July
Honestly at that point I think we tell him to go freak himself and just ride with our merry band of rejects, and dont even give Fitz a second look after that unless someone gets injured
Why does it matter how long it takes at this point? As long as the Jets make a decision before training camp.
Post by: dcm1602 on May 07, 2016, 11:58:27 AM
Why does it matter how long it takes at this point? As long as the Jets make a decision before training camp.
All that excrement the team does from now-July contributes to a teams success. If Fitz isnt participating in any of it because hes upset nobody wants to pay him 20 million a year then freak him. Skipping all the OTAs doesnt help him, and it doesnt help the success of the team and organization.
He could be going over the plays building a timing/chemistry with other offensive players, mentoring our young brand new QBs. Instead hes being a whiney delusional bitch who thinks he should be making as much money as Tony Romo
Post by: Pope on May 07, 2016, 11:59:56 AM
Post by: Tommy on May 07, 2016, 12:01:01 PM
All that excrement the team does from now-July contributes to a teams success. If Fitz isnt participating in any of it because hes upset nobody wants to pay him 20 million a year then freak him. Skipping all the OTAs doesnt help him, and it doesnt help the success of the team and organization.
He could be going over the plays building a timing/chemistry with other offensive players, mentoring our young brand new QBs. Instead hes being a whiney delusional bitch who thinks he should be making as much money as Tony Romo
From what I can see he's definitely still keeping in touch with his buddies on the offense. Also he's a seasoned veteran and knows the playbook. I'm sure he's conditioning on his own as well. I don't really think having him around the facility helps the team before training camp.
Post by: dcm1602 on May 07, 2016, 12:05:21 PM
From what I can see he's definitely still keeping in touch with his buddies on the offense. Also he's a seasoned veteran and knows the playbook. I'm sure he's conditioning on his own as well. I don't really think having him around the facility helps the team before training camp.
You dont think having Fitz around would help our brand new 2nd round QB we have, or Petty who is learning how to adapt to a prostyle offense ?
Or the rapport and timing with our runningbacks who basically got overhauled. Amaro who will be coming off IR and hasnt really played with him. If none of the offseason meant anything, it would all be optional
Post by: bojanglesman on May 07, 2016, 12:11:06 PM
You dont think having Fitz around would help our brand new 2nd round QB we have, or Petty who is learning how to adapt to a prostyle offense ?
Or the rapport and timing with our runningbacks who basically got overhauled. Amaro who will be coming off IR and hasnt really played with him. If none of the offseason meant anything, it would all be optional
It would help, but isn't 100% necessary. He wasn't around early last year rehabbing from injury and did just fine. Ideally the sooner the better, but if he can get in there before training camp it'll be fine. Hackenberg needs to learn the playbook and he'll have the camp and the season to learn what he will from Fitz. He will have coaches to learn from too.
The main concern I have will be the skill players that weren't here last year getting used to playing with Fitz. That is minor though. He'll be back before camp. Or retire. Whatever.
Post by: ukilledkenny on May 07, 2016, 01:58:48 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on May 07, 2016, 03:14:00 PM
Post by: Badger on May 07, 2016, 03:18:26 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on May 07, 2016, 03:23:35 PM
Fitz was rehabbing and wasn't considered the starter until Geno got punched last year but you think it's so important he be around for OTA's that we should tell him to freak off? No way. Let him have a few extra weeks of offseason to ease the pain of settling for 10 million less than his agent told him he would get.
Last year Fitz made next to nothing. If he comes back he's gonna be getting a 2-3 year 8-10million a year deal.
That's a substantial chunk of change for a guy whose not very good and would be missing essentially the offseason
Post by: ukilledkenny on May 07, 2016, 03:30:54 PM
Last year Fitz made next to nothing. If he comes back he's gonna be getting a 2-3 year 8-10million a year deal.
That's a substantial chunk of change for a guy whose not very good and would be missing essentially the offseason
You are making assumptions to support your argument. Nobody else is trying to sign him so if he wants to play it's a one year deal or a multi year deal that makes him cuttable after this season. Mac has 0 incentive to give him guaranteed money past this season.
Post by: dcm1602 on May 07, 2016, 03:51:10 PM
You are making assumptions to support your argument. Nobody else is trying to sign him so if he wants to play it's a one year deal or a multi year deal that makes him cuttable after this season. Mac has 0 incentive to give him guaranteed money past this season.
Yes im making the assumption that Fitz hasnt continued to hold out all this time for a 1 year 6 million dollar contract or something retarded.
I find it incredibly improbable that Fitz ends up with a contract with no guaranteed money whatsoever after this season .
I dont think hes going to get a monster payday or anything. But I imagine that any compromise will actually be a compromise that makes both sides happyish
Post by: ukilledkenny on May 07, 2016, 04:04:36 PM
Yes im making the assumption that Fitz hasnt continued to hold out all this time for a 1 year 6 million dollar contract or something retarded.
I find it incredibly improbable that Fitz ends up with a contract with no guaranteed money whatsoever after this season .
I dont think hes going to get a monster payday or anything. But I imagine that any compromise will actually be a compromise that makes both sides happyish
The thing in this negotiation that is going to make him happyish is not showing up at the facility until the end of July. There is no reason to give him guaranteed money past this year to make him happier.
Post by: Pope on May 07, 2016, 04:11:08 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on May 18, 2016, 06:33:39 PM
Quote
Unsigned free agent quarterback Ryan Fitzpatrick and the New York Jets are pinning OTA's as the "first legitimate deadline" for a deal, according to NFL Network's Ian Rapoport.
"Next Tuesday the Jets begin OTA's," Rapoport said. "From what I'm being told, that is the first legitimate deadline for when both sides would like a deal to be done if Fitzpatrick is to remain the starting quarterback of the Jets."
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-total-access/0ap3000000663362/Contract-deadline-approaching-for-Fitzpatrick-and-Jets
Post by: Johnny English on May 18, 2016, 06:40:29 PM
Post by: JFIF on May 18, 2016, 06:45:53 PM
OK. What happens if they don't get something done by that deadline? The Jets walk away? Fitz commits to a golf club membership?
I think it's just a timeline thing in terms of preparation. Not good to have your starting QB sidelined for OTAs.
I imagine if no deal is struck around then or soon after, the Jets will call his bluff and announce a QB competition or whatever. I imagine he'll sign before training camp.
Post by: dcm1602 on May 18, 2016, 06:51:13 PM
OK. What happens if they don't get something done by that deadline? The Jets walk away? Fitz commits to a golf club membership?
It's the "first" deadline of "when they would like to"
I recon thst doesn't mean a whole lot
Post by: bojanglesman on May 18, 2016, 07:11:17 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on May 19, 2016, 10:26:32 AM
It's the closest to a hardline stance I think we'll see in this thing. Personally, I don't like it. Both sides want this and they can't find any middle ground? It's ridiculous now.
Post by: Laxin on May 19, 2016, 11:58:09 AM
What it sounds like to me is that the Jets are (not so) subtly telling Fitz: "Hey, you know we want you back. We know you want to return. But we're running a business here and we've made our offers. If you're not back by the time we're on the field practicing, the three guys who are will get the reps. We'll still work with you, but there will be no guarantees that you're the starter anymore."
It's the closest to a hardline stance I think we'll see in this thing. Personally, I don't like it. Both sides want this and they can't find any middle ground? It's ridiculous now.
There isn't much of a middle ground when the Jets can only offer so much. Its not like they have 20M in cap space. Fitz has to realize that the Jets can't even afford 75% of what he wants. At some point it becomes a matter of what's realistic on both sides vs what he thinks he's worth. No one else is paying him more than what the Jets are offering/can afford. This is just becoming a nuisance and will only get worse as time passes. I wouldnt be surprised if he loses a lot of his fan support if he keeps this up through the course of the summer.
Post by: Italian Seafood on May 19, 2016, 12:40:36 PM
Post by: Johnny English on May 19, 2016, 01:12:08 PM
Interesting standoff--his plan B is retirement and ours is Geno. His might be better.
Maybe we should retire and he can have Geno.
Post by: bojanglesman on May 19, 2016, 01:25:43 PM
They can create cap space to pay him, that isn't an issue at all.
Post by: Derek Smalls on May 19, 2016, 01:49:03 PM
I think this comes down to early training camp. And it's possible it could set our team back as a result, but hopefully not.
Post by: Johnny English on May 19, 2016, 01:55:10 PM
They can create cap space to pay him, that isn't an issue at all.
Well, it is. It's easy to create cap space. It's much more difficult to create cap space without harming the team, because if there are players you can cut with zero impact on the team then they have no place being there to start with.
Fitz comes in, you cut Geno. That's easy. Who next? Everyone talks about cutting Breno, but we didn't draft a tackle. Who's stepping up to play RT? You're comfortable with Qvale as our starting tackle? Is Fitz comfortable with that? Who else are you thinking of cutting?
Alternatively we could try restructuring some players. That works. We have a few players we can restructure, but they're older vets and it could come to bite us in a couple of years. Revis and Marshall are obvious candidates, although I think Gilchrist and Skrine are also options who won't free up as much space but don't have as much risk down the line.
I don't think it's as easy as you seem to, if it was I think we'd have had the deal done by now. I'm convinced that the plan was to try and trade Wilk and with that now off the table, we're struggling a bit. A long term contract for Mo might be the best answer, but that still gives us problems next year.
Post by: Tommy on May 19, 2016, 02:03:30 PM
Well, it is. It's easy to create cap space. It's much more difficult to create cap space without harming the team, because if there are players you can cut with zero impact on the team then they have no place being there to start with.
Fitz comes in, you cut Geno. That's easy. Who next? Everyone talks about cutting Breno, but we didn't draft a tackle. Who's stepping up to play RT? You're comfortable with Qvale as our starting tackle? Is Fitz comfortable with that? Who else are you thinking of cutting?
Alternatively we could try restructuring some players. That works. We have a few players we can restructure, but they're older vets and it could come to bite us in a couple of years. Revis and Marshall are obvious candidates, although I think Gilchrist and Skrine are also options who won't free up as much space but don't have as much risk down the line.
I don't think it's as easy as you seem to, if it was I think we'd have had the deal done by now. I'm convinced that the plan was to try and trade Wilk and with that now off the table, we're struggling a bit. A long term contract for Mo might be the best answer, but that still gives us problems next year.
Pretty sure they worked out what they'd be able to open up when giving him his first offer. Especially since we barely have any at the moment.
Post by: AlioTheFool on May 19, 2016, 03:02:10 PM
If you're signing Fitz it's because you're making a real effort to compete this year. If you're making a real effort to compete, you should be doing everything you can to make sure it's not wasted.
Otherwise, tell him time's up, Geno's our guy this year, and let the cards fall where they may. (I don't want this scenario.)
Post by: bojanglesman on May 19, 2016, 03:28:29 PM
Well, it is. It's easy to create cap space. It's much more difficult to create cap space without harming the team, because if there are players you can cut with zero impact on the team then they have no place being there to start with.
Fitz comes in, you cut Geno. That's easy. Who next? Everyone talks about cutting Breno, but we didn't draft a tackle. Who's stepping up to play RT? You're comfortable with Qvale as our starting tackle? Is Fitz comfortable with that? Who else are you thinking of cutting?
Alternatively we could try restructuring some players. That works. We have a few players we can restructure, but they're older vets and it could come to bite us in a couple of years. Revis and Marshall are obvious candidates, although I think Gilchrist and Skrine are also options who won't free up as much space but don't have as much risk down the line.
I don't think it's as easy as you seem to, if it was I think we'd have had the deal done by now. I'm convinced that the plan was to try and trade Wilk and with that now off the table, we're struggling a bit. A long term contract for Mo might be the best answer, but that still gives us problems next year.
Cimini mentioned this subject a week ago, and covered a few ways to clear space with players we aren't likely to cut anyway.
http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york-jets/post/_/id/60367/how-the-jets-can-create-cap-space-for-ryan-fitzpatrick-if-he-returns
Basically, they can free up about $8 million by restructuring Decker and Skrine. I wouldn't cut Breno at this point. I wouldn't touch Revis' contract, and only Marshall if absolutely necessary.
I think the delay is just a staring contest over amount. I don't think the Jets would pay him what he wants even if they had it easily available.
Post by: AlioTheFool on May 19, 2016, 03:57:04 PM
I think the delay is just a staring contest over amount. I don't think the Jets would pay him what he wants even if they had it easily available.
I think you're right and it makes me mad. I certainly don't want to hurt the team by vastly overpaying him, but it feels like they're saying "Just take what we want to give you and be happy you're getting anything at all."
That ridiculous for a guy who led one of the best offensive efforts in franchise history.
Post by: bojanglesman on May 19, 2016, 03:59:51 PM
I think you're right and it makes me mad. I certainly don't want to hurt the team by vastly overpaying him, but it feels like they're saying "Just take what we want to give you and be happy you're getting anything at all."
That ridiculous for a guy who led one of the best offensive efforts in franchise history.
It's a business. You don't build a good team by grossly overpaying players. I don't think there would be this delay if the gap were a couple million $. It's obviously a lot bigger.
Post by: AlioTheFool on May 19, 2016, 04:07:55 PM
It's a business. You don't build a good team by grossly overpaying players. I don't think there would be this delay if the gap were a couple million $. It's obviously a lot bigger.
I certainly have no idea what's going on in these negotiations, but it always sounds to me when the writers discuss it that the Jets have a strict number that they've no intention of budging from.
Post by: bojanglesman on May 19, 2016, 04:50:57 PM
I certainly have no idea what's going on in these negotiations, but it always sounds to me when the writers discuss it that the Jets have a strict number that they've no intention of budging from.
As does Fitz apparently.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on May 24, 2016, 07:25:05 AM
Post by: Badger on May 24, 2016, 07:41:29 AM
Fitz says he wants to return to the Jets and isn't contemplating retirement
I'm wet
Post by: bojanglesman on May 24, 2016, 07:50:20 AM
I think he's our best option, but with our schedule we will be lucky to get 8 wins. Anything is possible though.
Post by: Pope on May 24, 2016, 09:22:50 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on May 24, 2016, 10:35:49 AM
Still wondering how exactly he is going to get paid
Restructure a couple of contracts and voila, cash appears in the Bank of Duff. If it's more than a one year contract, they can give him a signing bonus and defer some cash to next year to make it even easier.
Post by: JFIF on May 24, 2016, 10:36:39 AM
I'm wet
moist
Post by: Pope on May 24, 2016, 10:37:45 AM
Restructure a couple of contracts and voila, cash appears in the Bank of Duff. If it's more than a one year contract, they can give him a signing bonus and defer some cash to next year to make it even easier.That's true, I'm sure Duff has it all planned out considering he's had a few months to think about it. I imagine a long term deal for Mo is part of it but if not we can move money around with Mangold, Breno, Folk, etc
Post by: bojanglesman on May 24, 2016, 10:44:42 AM
That's true, I'm sure Duff has it all planned out considering he's had a few months to think about it. I imagine a long term deal for Mo is part of it but if not we can move money around with Mangold, Breno, Folk, etc
I really doubt a deal gets done with Wilkerson. I doubt they do anything with Breno's contract or Folk's. I think both are more likely to be cut than restructured, but I don't think either will get cut.
Skrine and Decker might be the most likely to get restructured. They are players worth keeping.
Post by: Koz on May 24, 2016, 01:43:27 PM
Post by: Tommy on May 24, 2016, 01:44:29 PM
My Uncle's stepson's girlfriend has a neighbor who delivers mail next to the home where Fitz's parents used to live, and he heard that a deal will be announced shortly.
We need INCARCERATED BOB back!
Post by: Miamipuck on May 24, 2016, 02:03:19 PM
Fitz says he wants to return to the Jets and isn't contemplating retirement
Fantastic news, thank you SFD, have a blessed day.
Post by: guinness77 on May 24, 2016, 10:42:21 PM
My Uncle's stepson's girlfriend has a neighbor who delivers mail next to the home where Fitz's parents used to live, and he heard that a deal will be announced shortly.I'm guessing it's pretty serious.
Post by: Badger on May 25, 2016, 10:54:03 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on May 25, 2016, 11:02:26 PM
Seeing that chart, I can see why Fitz wants $12 million a year. Dude would still be the third least paid starting QB on at least his second contract in the NFL.
Tyron Taylor is an absolute bargain for Buffalo. Their team really should be pretty good when they have $20 million more in cap space by not paying a QB huge money
Post by: Heismanberg on May 25, 2016, 11:39:23 PM
Nice work shitting on Geno.
Post by: Miamipuck on May 26, 2016, 12:23:41 AM
Decker is skipping OTAs because he's upset that Fitzpatrick isn't re-signed yet.
Nice work shitting on Geno.
They hate that piece of excrement.
Post by: Libero_2 on May 26, 2016, 06:03:54 AM
They hate that piece of excrement.
So do we. I don't think anybody really wanted him to be the guy last year. I doubt they thought Fitz was gonna be great either. But we were going to give him a shot until he got KOed and when Fitz played great, nobody ever wanted Geno under center again.
Post by: ukilledkenny on May 26, 2016, 07:00:37 AM
Post by: Koz on May 26, 2016, 07:33:19 AM
Decker is skipping OTAs because he's upset that Fitzpatrick isn't re-signed yet.
Nice work shitting on Geno.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BFwvJ_NlIeO/?taken-by=jessiejamesdecker&hl=en
And an awesome way to do it.
Post by: Johnny English on May 26, 2016, 07:34:52 AM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/05/26/brandon-marshall-also-appears-to-be-protesting-fitzpatrick-situation/
GFY Geno.
Post by: Badger on May 26, 2016, 07:48:24 AM
Brandon Marshall as well.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/05/26/brandon-marshall-also-appears-to-be-protesting-fitzpatrick-situation/
GFY Geno.
That's pure Manish speculation.
Post by: Johnny English on May 26, 2016, 07:49:03 AM
That's pure Manish speculation.
I'm willing to go with it.
Post by: Koz on May 26, 2016, 08:06:19 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on May 26, 2016, 08:33:23 AM
Post by: Johnny English on May 26, 2016, 08:53:51 AM
Mangold wasn't there either but his wife just had another kid.
Nick Mangold's wife hates Geno.
Post by: Koz on May 26, 2016, 09:18:12 AM
I don't understand why people hate Geno personally. I think plenty of players suck and don't want them here anymore, but I don't hate them. I'd like him to get released, don't get me wrong, but I don't wish ill will on him. You'd think he murdered someone based on some comments.
He's one of the few players I truly hate. I hate everything about the guy and wish that he was never drafted by the team. He is a shitty qb and has never done anything to distinguish himself as improving on any level.
Post by: Heismanberg on May 26, 2016, 09:40:59 AM
I don't understand why people hate Geno personally. I think plenty of players suck and don't want them here anymore, but I don't hate them. I'd like him to get released, don't get me wrong, but I don't wish ill will on him. You'd think he murdered someone based on some comments.
I hated that slouch before we drafted him.
He is cocky and entitled for no reason.
Post by: MBGreen on May 26, 2016, 09:53:49 AM
I hated that slouch before we drafted him.
He is cocky and entitled for no reason.
I wanted to give him a chance and root for him succeed. But the bolded line above made that very difficult. Now i just want him gone.
Post by: Johnny English on May 26, 2016, 09:56:25 AM
http://www.newyorkjets.com/news/article-randylangefb/3-Jets-QBs-Provide-Some-OTA-Assessments/699bcc38-4a13-4de8-904d-236b8030ad64
Post by: JFIF on May 26, 2016, 10:09:30 AM
The Jets are in damage limitation mode.
http://www.newyorkjets.com/news/article-randylangefb/3-Jets-QBs-Provide-Some-OTA-Assessments/699bcc38-4a13-4de8-904d-236b8030ad64
That is pretty funny.
They kind of have to do it though, considering the type of people that constitute the fanbase.
Post by: Jumbo on May 26, 2016, 10:49:11 AM
I hated that slouch before we drafted him.
He is cocky and entitled for no reason.
Fun story about Geno from the r/nfl thread about meeting players a couple days ago:
https://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/comments/4kldd0/stories_about_nfl_players_you_went_to_the_same/d3ft8zi
Quote
I was pretty good friends with Kevin White at WVU. Don't really have any hilarious stories really Kev was just a good dude. We went out for his 21st birthday to the driving range then to the bars. He was an awful golfer. He had practice at 6am the next day. We were all really drunk and went home at like 2 probably. Kev said he made it to practice no problem and felt fine that's when I knew he was just a different animal.
Geno tried to fight my friends one time. He was back after his rookie year along with Tavon, Stedman, and all of them. Tavon and Stedman were awesome down to earth and loving being back. They tweeted like where they were on campus for people to come say what up to them they were real cool I took a picture with them, told them good luck, and told Stedman how cute his son was lol. At the bars that weekend they were all around. Same thing where they have everybody's attention really. My friend goes up to Geno make small talk saying like good luck next year yadda yadda. Geno looks my in the face says "you have two seconds to get the freak out of my face." My other friend freaks out tells him he's a bum and Vick was gonna take his job. Bouncers had to step in cool tensions.
Pacman was at WVU last year out at the bars. I was chilling by him all night because it's freaking Pacman. He was popping bottles like no other and just passing out drinks. He was cool with me being there I guess because I got handed drinks every time, but I just kinda was in the vicinity I didn't wanna overextend my welcome. At one point some random kid came up and tried to grab a drink and Pacman caught him with like two quick punches and shoved him away and everybody just ignored what happened really. Also at one point he was taking pictures with people and I go up to him and ask him if it was cool if I got a picture with him. He looked me in the eyes and just said "nah". I've never been so intimidated
Post by: Jumbo on May 26, 2016, 10:49:59 AM
https://www.reddit.com/r/nyjets/comments/4kof91/crosspost_from_rnfl_stories_about_nfl_players_you/d3gk2fs
Quote
Am a WVU Alum, don't know about this incident but I know the weekend. Stedman and Tavon came back would stop for any student and sign anything they wanted signed. Geno on the other hand would only do it if the cash was right.
Heard a lot of negatives from WVU alums about Geno. Numerous people have said he just rubs people the wrong way and acts more-so stuck up than the other WVU players. Not really surprised by comments like these.
Post by: AlioTheFool on May 26, 2016, 11:22:18 AM
This dude got punched hard enough in the jaw to break it. By a teammate. In front of other teammates who did nothing to stop it.
I know the Jets are up against the cap, but it's time to figure it out. No one has made any effort to cover the fact that they've been in frequent contact with their favorite QB all offseason. Now guys are skipping camp. It may be speculation, but it's not hard to believe that our best offensive players are saying to themselves "freak no, I'm not running around in that heat for this dipshit."
Post by: bojanglesman on May 26, 2016, 11:38:55 AM
Post by: Badger on May 26, 2016, 11:43:47 AM
Fun story about Geno from the r/nfl thread about meeting players a couple days ago:
https://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/comments/4kldd0/stories_about_nfl_players_you_went_to_the_same/d3ft8zi
Oh and also
https://www.reddit.com/r/nyjets/comments/4kof91/crosspost_from_rnfl_stories_about_nfl_players_you/d3gk2fs
Ok, but here's an album of 50 gifs that show Geno isn't an poopchute.
Post by: ukilledkenny on May 26, 2016, 12:52:27 PM
The only people the Jets are fooling with their showing off of Geno as the "current starter" are themselves. And maybe a couple of people who continue to harp on the "If Geno had Fitz's weapons he'd be so much better" nonsense.
This dude got punched hard enough in the jaw to break it. By a teammate. In front of other teammates who did nothing to stop it.
I know the Jets are up against the cap, but it's time to figure it out. No one has made any effort to cover the fact that they've been in frequent contact with their favorite QB all offseason. Now guys are skipping camp. It may be speculation, but it's not hard to believe that our best offensive players are saying to themselves "freak no, I'm not running around in that heat for this dipshit."
Bringing back Fitz doesn't even solidify that the Jets will be in the playoff hunt this coming year. Figuring it out means letting a quality young player leave for one year of mediocre QB play instead of just bad QB play. If all the pieces besides a QB were in place for a deep playoff run I would be with you.
In my mind you are asking them to give up meaningful future production for the chance to win 9-10 games instead of 5-7. Just doesn't add up for me.
Post by: Johnny English on May 26, 2016, 01:54:44 PM
Figuring it out means letting a quality young player leave
Which one? Seems fairly obvious to me that Geno is the one out of the door in that scenario, and I wouldn't use that description for him.
Post by: ukilledkenny on May 26, 2016, 03:00:28 PM
Which one? Seems fairly obvious to me that Geno is the one out of the door in that scenario, and I wouldn't use that description for him.
Unless something changed we need to get rid of Wilkerson or someone with en equally big cap hit to give Fitz his 12 million. Geno being the odd QB out isn't an issue for anyone.
Post by: Johnny English on May 26, 2016, 03:38:20 PM
Unless something changed we need to get rid of Wilkerson or someone with en equally big cap hit to give Fitz his 12 million. Geno being the odd QB out isn't an issue for anyone.
I'm working on the assumption that at this stage we won't cut anyone of any value, we'll restructure and perhaps get a long term deal done with Wilk.
Post by: AlioTheFool on May 26, 2016, 03:44:32 PM
Yes, we've seen Fitz not live up to a contract before but simply assuming that's what will happen is at least as ridiculous as thinking this team has a legit shot at the playoffs.
This is also a year where the division's (league's?) best QB is going to miss a quarter of the season.
Many people felt that had the Jets simply made the playoffs last year, they'd have at least gone 2 rounds into it, possibly as far as the Super Bowl. Now everyone thinks this is a 5 win team?
This is a winning team with Ryan Fitzpatrick and a losing one without it. Clearly his teammates feel this way themselves.
Post by: ukilledkenny on May 26, 2016, 03:56:20 PM
Everything went really well last year and they didnt make it. A few extra roadblocks makes 8-8 seem pretty realistic to me.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on May 26, 2016, 06:25:12 PM
It's the schedule. No matter how green the glasses that schedule will be brutal. Then considering Fitz didn't play as well as his numbers say he did I factor in a regression to the mean there. Clady won't play 16 games so blindside will be a problem at least a few games. If Mangold misses any time the whole offense is fucked for those games.
Everything went really well last year and they didnt make it. A few extra roadblocks makes 8-8 seem pretty realistic to me.
This is a very solid, very realistic post.
Post by: Johnny English on May 26, 2016, 10:12:51 PM
It's the schedule. No matter how green the glasses that schedule will be brutal. Then considering Fitz didn't play as well as his numbers say he did I factor in a regression to the mean there. Clady won't play 16 games so blindside will be a problem at least a few games. If Mangold misses any time the whole offense is fucked for those games.
Everything went really well last year and they didnt make it. A few extra roadblocks makes 8-8 seem pretty realistic to me.
You're right, but before the start of last season we could reasonably have expected the Cowboys, Colts, Dolphins and Giants to have been at least reasonably good, and they weren't. It's entirely likely that the same will happen with this year's schedule - teams that we expect to be good will suck, and vice versa.
Post by: ukilledkenny on May 27, 2016, 05:09:44 AM
You're right, but before the start of last season we could reasonably have expected the Cowboys, Colts, Dolphins and Giants to have been at least reasonably good, and they weren't. It's entirely likely that the same will happen with this year's schedule - teams that we expect to be good will suck, and vice versa.
Very true which is why I do want Fitz back because at least we have a chance. I just want him back without sacrificing the future.
Post by: Pope on May 27, 2016, 08:28:06 AM
Post by: Tommy on May 27, 2016, 08:55:15 AM
Post by: Badger on May 27, 2016, 10:13:54 AM
This time last year who would've thought that we'd be stressing over re-signing Fitz.
I would have imagined we'd have him under contract by now.
Post by: AlioTheFool on May 27, 2016, 10:38:46 AM
I would have imagined we'd have him under contract by now.
This.
As for the schedule, it's impossible to predict how tough it is in May. Didn't the Bengals have a couple of losses in FA, plus injuries?
Every year there are teams that surprise in both directions. The only team you can consistently count on to be a playoff contender is the Patriots.
Obviously we're just as much a question mark as anyone else, but I'll take my chances with Fitz. I know everyone is worried about the future, but we're talking about 2-3 years of development for a young QB while Marshall approaches the end of his career anyway. Mangold too.
This team has a decent balance of veteran leadership and young blood. Sure, things need to fall well for this to be a contender, but that's true of any team that doesn't cheat their way in every year.
Post by: Tommy on May 27, 2016, 11:52:29 AM
This.
As for the schedule, it's impossible to predict how tough it is in May. Didn't the Bengals have a couple of losses in FA, plus injuries?
Every year there are teams that surprise in both directions. The only team you can consistently count on to be a playoff contender is the Patriots.
Obviously we're just as much a question mark as anyone else, but I'll take my chances with Fitz. I know everyone is worried about the future, but we're talking about 2-3 years of development for a young QB while Marshall approaches the end of his career anyway. Mangold too.
This team has a decent balance of veteran leadership and young blood. Sure, things need to fall well for this to be a contender, but that's true of any team that doesn't cheat their way in every year.
Yeah, there's no reason this team can't make a Cinderella run. On paper and by looking at the schedule, a reasonable prediction would be 8-8, but this is the NFL. excrement happens.
Post by: Pope on May 27, 2016, 12:38:03 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on May 27, 2016, 04:57:26 PM
Quote
NYPost_Cannizzaro @MarkCannizzaro 23 minutes ago
Contrary to reports of low-ball #Jets offer to #Fitz, #NFL sources tell The Post offer on table is 3-yr w/ $12 million for first year ...
Quote
NYPost_Cannizzaro @MarkCannizzaro 22 minutes ago
If this #Jets offer per sources is true, makes you wonder what Fitz + his agent are waiting for. Am told offer has sat on table for 4 mnths
Quote
NYPost_Cannizzaro @MarkCannizzaro 22 minutes ago
This does not make Fitz and agent Jimmy Sexton look very smart based on fact that no one else is offering him similar $$ or starting job
Post by: dcm1602 on May 27, 2016, 04:59:13 PM
Guess the Jets are leaking some numbers after players like Decker boycotted OTAs or whatever
Post by: ukilledkenny on May 27, 2016, 05:48:00 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on May 27, 2016, 05:56:38 PM
I wonder what the plan is to get the space the day Fitz accepts.
Pay him in Tostitos.
Post by: Miamipuck on May 27, 2016, 06:12:22 PM
Pay him in Tostitos.
Thank you for serving.
Post by: Johnny English on May 27, 2016, 07:34:17 PM
I wonder what the plan is to get the space the day Fitz accepts.
$12M in year one might be low salary, high bonus. $6M per with a $6M signing bonus is a $24M contract with $12M in year one and an $8M cap hit per year. I like that deal for the Jets.
Post by: guinness77 on May 27, 2016, 08:20:01 PM
Thank you for serving.Haha, Memorial Day weekend, to boot.
Post by: Tommy on May 27, 2016, 08:53:32 PM
$12M in year one might be low salary, high bonus. $6M per with a $6M signing bonus is a $24M contract with $12M in year one and an $8M cap hit per year. I like that deal for the Jets.
What does this even mean?
Post by: Johnny English on May 27, 2016, 08:55:05 PM
What does this even mean?
Do you even math, bro?
Post by: bojanglesman on May 27, 2016, 09:06:49 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on May 27, 2016, 09:09:43 PM
I wonder if he's balking at it being a 3 year deal because maybe the second and third years are crappy and could potentially have him underpaid with no options if he plays well again. No one has said anything about the total amount. Only the first year.
The second and third years are probably packed with performance escalators
Post by: Johnny English on May 27, 2016, 09:11:25 PM
I wonder if he's balking at it being a 3 year deal because maybe the second and third years are crappy and could potentially have him underpaid with no options if he plays well again. No one has said anything about the total amount. Only the first year.
I'm only conjecturing the contract offer, but if I'm close then that would seem like a reasonable objection for him - except that I imagine the Jets are hoping/expecting year 2 and definitely year 3 of that contract to see Fitz as the backup to whichever of our young QB prospects is ready to step up and become the franchise. $6M for a vet backup is pretty healthy money, but he might not be ready for that role in his own head.
Post by: Pope on May 27, 2016, 09:14:39 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on May 28, 2016, 06:06:45 AM
All I know is that JE is a bundle of sticks
Yeah it looks like Schefter is confirming this report
Post by: dcm1602 on May 28, 2016, 11:19:20 AM
$12M in year one might be low salary, high bonus. $6M per with a $6M signing bonus is a $24M contract with $12M in year one and an $8M cap hit per year. I like that deal for the Jets.
Not gonna pretend to be a cap expert but I imagine that is rather unlikely
The Jets are cap strapped this year, so theres very little reason for us to offer Fitz a contract with a front loaded first year (even if we wanted to have the option to only keep him for one year, it would likely be easier to just spread out Fitz's cap hit over the contract, instead of front loading it and having someone else restructure to facilitate this)
I would think that if the first years number is 12 million the next two would almost certainly be in the 12-14 range as well (possibly slightly lower with escalators and what not). I think the biggest issue could be not much guaranteed with tons of escalators and stuff like that to protect the franchise.
Post by: bojanglesman on May 28, 2016, 11:32:22 AM
Not gonna pretend to be a cap expert but I imagine that is rather unlikelyThe first year number isn't $12 million in his statement. The $6 million bonus is spread over the three years.
The Jets are cap strapped this year, so theres very little reason for us to offer Fitz a contract with a front loaded first year (even if we wanted to have the option to only keep him for one year, it would likely be easier to just spread out Fitz's cap hit over the contract, instead of front loading it and having someone else restructure to facilitate this)
I would think that if the first years number is 12 million the next two would almost certainly be in the 12-14 range as well (possibly slightly lower with escalators and what not). I think the biggest issue could be not much guaranteed with tons of escalators and stuff like that to protect the franchise.
Post by: dcm1602 on May 28, 2016, 11:45:57 AM
The first year number isn't $12 million in his statement. The $6 million bonus is spread over the three years.
I thought signing bonuses were prorated but didn't know if there was something else (like a roster bonus or whatever) in which the bonus would only apply to a single year.
Eitherway trying to force the largest cap hit in year one is illogical
Post by: Johnny English on May 28, 2016, 06:24:47 PM
I thought signing bonuses were prorated but didn't know if there was something else (like a roster bonus or whatever) in which the bonus would only apply to a single year.
Eitherway trying to force the largest cap hit in year one is illogical
I think you've misunderstood. Giving Fitz a $6M base salary every year for three years and a single $6M signing bonus would mean that he would receive $12M in year one, but the Jets would carry an $8M cap hit.
Post by: Heismanberg on May 29, 2016, 03:23:52 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on May 29, 2016, 04:00:25 PM
Yahoo's Charles Robinson reports the Jets' contract proposal to free agent Ryan Fitzpatrick is worth $24 million over three years.Who knows if that is true, but let's say it is....... the Jets have him over a barrel. His only other options would be to retire, take a one year deal as a backup somewhere, or wait/hope for a starter to get hurt somewhere. All are terrible options for someone who says they want to play this year.
Maybe that's why this has dragged out. His agent is trying to find any way not to have him on a cheap leash for 2 extra years.
BTW, Cimini said it, you know Fitz's agent staged that whole thing with Decker no-showing. Same agent. Kinda smart actually. By any means necessary.....
It's a test of wills. How long can he stay home before the Jets give in. How much is Fitz willing to risk being a backup for excrement money again instead or getting $12 million for this year.
Whenever they talk again, I'm sure either the Jets will make the last year an option year or they will up the money a little for year 2 just to get him in camp. The good thing for the Jets is that he has proven he can come in late and play fine. They don't need him right now. They really are bidding against themselves.
I wonder if the Jets will be ok with this excrement pushing a few weeks into training camp. I wonder what the real deadline is where the Jets feel it isn't worth paying him $12 million to come in that late.
Would you give Fitz $12 million if he didn't decide to sign until a few days before the first preseason game? Would he still be a more reasonable option than Geno for $1 million at that point?
Post by: Johnny English on May 29, 2016, 04:15:47 PM
Yahoo's Charles Robinson reports the Jets' contract proposal to free agent Ryan Fitzpatrick is worth $24 million over three years.Charles Robinson is my bitch.
Post by: bojanglesman on May 29, 2016, 04:18:49 PM
Charles Robinson is my bitch.Are you clairvoyant?
Post by: Johnny English on May 29, 2016, 04:21:31 PM
Are you clairvoyant?I am Incarcerated Bob.
Post by: Dreamers on May 29, 2016, 06:49:28 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on May 29, 2016, 07:06:13 PM
God I hope not. I like Fitz but this is not what is best for him or the team.
Nadler 2016
Post by: Libero_2 on May 29, 2016, 07:20:04 PM
I wonder if the Jets will be ok with this excrement pushing a few weeks into training camp. I wonder what the real deadline is where the Jets feel it isn't worth paying him $12 million to come in that late.
Would you give Fitz $12 million if he didn't decide to sign until a few days before the first preseason game? Would he still be a more reasonable option than Geno for $1 million at that point?
I would say the real 'deadline' for a last ditch Fitz reunion with the expectation he starts day 1 is Monday August 15th. It's after preseason week 1 and if he isn't in house by then, we have to assume he isn't coming back, and we are in serious trouble at the QB slot.
Post by: Heismanberg on May 29, 2016, 07:22:49 PM
Post by: Badger on May 29, 2016, 07:44:36 PM
God I hope not. I like Fitz but this is not what is best for him or the team.
$24M over 3 years is the best realistic scenario.
Post by: Cane on May 30, 2016, 11:00:54 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on May 30, 2016, 11:04:46 AM
Post by: Johnny English on May 30, 2016, 11:09:24 AM
If his issue is with being a backup in years 2 and 3, he probably needs to accept that he can't be our planned long term starter. The team and the process are bigger than him and he's smart enough to know that. I think a middle ground to that might be giving him bonuses in years 2 and 3 based upon games started, and the right to seek a trade if he doesn't feel like he'll be the week 1 starter - assuming that those clauses would be allowable under the CBA.
Post by: Derek Smalls on May 30, 2016, 11:36:18 AM
The question is how far is Fitz willing to go to try to get the Jets to offer him more money? Will he miss the start of training camp? What about preseason games? If it gets past the first preseason game, the Jets may have less incentive to offer him a lot of money since he will have missed so much of camp. OR they might have more incentive if Geno/Petty/Hack are looking terrible in camp.
There's also the matter of other quarterbacks getting hurt. If a QB gets hurt in camp/preseason and their backup isn't any good, someone may offer Fitz $10M for this year to play. In that case, he may bolt.
I still think the odds of him coming back are about 95%. But I don't think any deal happens until mid-July right around the start of training camp.
I made a joke in early December that we'd have to pay Fitz $10M a year on his new deal. But I certainly didn't expect this stalemate.
Post by: Johnny English on May 30, 2016, 11:39:49 AM
There's also the matter of other quarterbacks getting hurt. If a QB gets hurt in camp/preseason and their backup isn't any good, someone may offer Fitz $10M for this year to play. In that case, he may bolt.
Why would he go to another team for $10M when we're offering him $12M? He's the one that wants the long term deal, I'm pretty sure if he said "just give me the one year at $12M and we'll get back round the table again next Spring" we'd take that deal. It would be a bit more of a cap challenge but we could presumably resolve that by giving him a three year deal with an exit clause at the end of year one.
Post by: Derek Smalls on May 30, 2016, 01:01:12 PM
Why would he go to another team for $10M when we're offering him $12M? He's the one that wants the long term deal, I'm pretty sure if he said "just give me the one year at $12M and we'll get back round the table again next Spring" we'd take that deal. It would be a bit more of a cap challenge but we could presumably resolve that by giving him a three year deal with an exit clause at the end of year one.I just threw a number out there.
I'm a little surprised the Jets haven't offered a deal with bigger numbers but more fake money. The right deal could give Fitz $12M in year 1, and more in years 2 and 3, and then just cut him after the 1st year and reevaluate. That may be how the deal ends up getting made. If I'm Fitz, I want more than $6M in year 2.
Post by: Johnny English on May 30, 2016, 01:03:48 PM
I just threw a number out there.
I'm a little surprised the Jets haven't offered a deal with bigger numbers but more fake money. The right deal could give Fitz $12M in year 1, and more in years 2 and 3, and then just cut him after the 1st year and reevaluate. That may be how the deal ends up getting made. If I'm Fitz, I want more than $6M in year 2.
Agreed. They could make years 2 and 3 good numbers but team option, thus telling Fitz that he can have his big long term contract but he has to prove himself worth it.
Post by: bojanglesman on May 31, 2016, 06:47:19 AM
Post by: Pope on May 31, 2016, 07:56:20 AM
Post by: Johnny English on May 31, 2016, 08:10:49 AM
Next step should be the platitudes. "Part of the business..... just a process..... never any doubt we'd get a deal done..... looking forward to joining up with my team mates and focusing on next season."
Post by: SixFeetDeep on May 31, 2016, 09:16:10 AM
Post by: Koz on May 31, 2016, 11:16:42 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on May 31, 2016, 11:18:25 AM
Quote
Ryan Fitzpatrick
AP
Ryan Fitzpatrick’s friends and co-workers have registered their protests and returned to work, in what has seemed just another chapter toward an inevitable conclusion.
But it might be more evitable than many are willing to consider.
According to Manish Mehta of the New York Daily News, several Jets sources, including players, now think Fitzpatrick would be willing to take less somewhere else on principle rather than sign the Jets’ low-ball offer.
Considering some of the other deals quarterbacks have signed this offseason, it’s obvious the three-year, $24 million offer the Jets have on the table is sub-par. But they’ve made it because the other inescapable conclusion is that there’s not exactly a land rush for the 33-year-old Fitzpatrick.
Until another team suffers a quarterback injury, or gets to camp and realizes all their guys stink, there might not be a market for Fitzpatrick, despite a 31-touchdown, 10-win season.
But until then, all Fitzpatrick’s side can do is wait or make threats, and let the Jets ponder a future with Geno Smith and Christian Hackenberg.
Have fun
Post by: SixFeetDeep on May 31, 2016, 11:21:30 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on May 31, 2016, 11:23:59 AM
Post by: Johnny English on May 31, 2016, 11:24:22 AM
Still trying to comprehend how the Jets offer is "low-ball" when Fitz doesn't have a single other offer on the table, and he would have to take less to even get someone to sign him.
I think the problem is one of perception. Fitz and his agent say that he's a starter and should get starter money. The Jets say that he's a stopgap, albeit a very good one, until one of draftees is ready to take over and become the franchise. The Jets' offer, assuming that Rapoport's report is correct, would seem to reflect the Jets' view pretty well, but not Fitz's.
Post by: Tommy on May 31, 2016, 01:06:56 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/1999/03/02/sports/pro-football-for-testaverde-a-guaranteed-jets-pact.html
Post by: Miamipuck on May 31, 2016, 01:20:18 PM
What does this have to do with Puck being an poopchute?
Haven't you been paying attention? Everything!
Post by: Pope on May 31, 2016, 01:29:55 PM
Manish needs to be shot and killed like that Gorilla in Cincinatti
Post by: AlioTheFool on May 31, 2016, 04:27:17 PM
1) I'm thinking Manish's "sources" are Decker and Marshall--who are campaigning "anonymously" for Fitz to get back in uniform.
2) If Fitz has the balls to take a lower offer just to spite the Jets, happy trails pal! Only an idiot takes less money unless he's assured that he'll be a starter for a title contender--and that's not happening to Fitz.
Post by: Tommy on May 31, 2016, 04:29:14 PM
Post by: Badger on May 31, 2016, 04:38:53 PM
"Heard you guys signed Fitzpatrick!"
"...when? This afternoon?"
"No, over the weekend."
"Oh. No we didn't."
"Huh. Must've misread it."
Post by: Tommy on May 31, 2016, 04:44:07 PM
A coworker almost gave me a stroke.
"Heard you guys signed Fitzpatrick!"
"...when? This afternoon?"
"No, over the weekend."
"Oh. No we didn't."
"Huh. Must've misread it."
I hate those casual fans who seem to always been on a serious news lag. The maintenance guy on my floor was so excited to bring up the Jets going after Vick I didn't feel like correcting him or saying he's an idiot. I just said "hey anything is possible."
"Yo, dey should go after Mike Vick. You know you can't stop him running da ball!"
Post by: JFIF on May 31, 2016, 05:33:57 PM
A coworker almost gave me a stroke.
"Heard you guys signed Fitzpatrick!"
"...when? This afternoon?"
"No, over the weekend."
"Oh. No we didn't."
"Huh. Must've misread it."
Was that person just trying to be chummy by breaking fake news and pretending to know about sports?
Post by: JFIF on May 31, 2016, 05:34:33 PM
I hate those casual fans who seem to always been on a serious news lag. The maintenance guy on my floor was so excited to bring up the Jets going after Vick I didn't feel like correcting him or saying he's an idiot. I just said "hey anything is possible."
"Yo, dey should go after Mike Vick. You know you can't stop him running da ball!"
Why isn't your follow up question, have you watched a football game in the last 11 years?
Post by: Tommy on May 31, 2016, 05:36:25 PM
Why isn't your follow up question, have you watched a football game in the last 11 years?
Meh. I don't like embarrassing people like that unless we're on equal footing it they're above me. No satisfaction.
Post by: JFIF on May 31, 2016, 05:37:58 PM
Meh. I don't like embarrassing people like that unless we're on equal footing it they're above me. No satisfaction.
Agreed. Just make fun of them on a message board
Post by: Badger on May 31, 2016, 08:29:14 PM
Was that person just trying to be chummy by breaking fake news and pretending to know about sports?
He sincerely misread the headlines. He's a solid sports fan (Falcons).
Post by: Derek Smalls on May 31, 2016, 11:27:25 PM
Post by: Tommy on May 31, 2016, 11:32:22 PM
Fitz isn't dumb enough to torpedo his career by signing elsewhere out of spite. Who is to say he'll ever get a starting job again if he leaves?
Yeah but the Jets aren't rolling with Geno, and he knows that. Even if it's for an extra million this may be his last payday. No harm in haggling for another few million guaranteed. That's a lot of money.
Post by: bojanglesman on June 01, 2016, 04:31:44 AM
Yeah but the Jets aren't rolling with Geno, and he knows that. Even if it's for an extra million this may be his last payday. No harm in haggling for another few million guaranteed. That's a lot of money.
This is true.
Post by: Pope on June 01, 2016, 07:41:02 AM
Fitz isn't dumb enough to torpedo his career by signing elsewhere out of spite. Who is to say he'll ever get a starting job again if he leaves?I don't think that matters much. He only has a couple years left in the tank.
Post by: ukilledkenny on June 01, 2016, 08:06:21 AM
Post by: Dreamers on June 01, 2016, 08:17:03 AM
I don't think that matters much. He only has a couple years left in the tank.
Some fans over estimate how much players actually want to play. It seems that the smarter BUs are perfectly content with sitting on a bench collecting a pay check. Fitz can make 6-7 mil as a BU anywhere. What is the incentive to offer up his body to be a starter here? I remember when Matt Moore was the top FA coming out of Miami. Could have signed anywhere and he signed back with Miami knowing he would sit behind a young Tannehille. If I where him Id take less money to not play too. Getting hit by 250lb linebackers all day just isnt worth it. Id much rather sit behind Luck or contend in Denver then just be a starter on a team that has very little shot. Not like we are going to build around him either. He could easy just sign 1 year deals every year and still make his money.
Post by: Pope on June 01, 2016, 08:41:45 AM
Some fans over estimate how much players actually want to play. It seems that the smarter BUs are perfectly content with sitting on a bench collecting a pay check. Fitz can make 6-7 mil as a BU anywhere. What is the incentive to offer up his body to be a starter here? I remember when Matt Moore was the top FA coming out of Miami. Could have signed anywhere and he signed back with Miami knowing he would sit behind a young Tannehille. If I where him Id take less money to not play too. Getting hit by 250lb linebackers all day just isnt worth it. Id much rather sit behind Luck or contend in Denver then just be a starter on a team that has very little shot. Not like we are going to build around him either. He could easy just sign 1 year deals every year and still make his money.I agree with you but I think Fitz wants to start. Backup QB in the NFL is one of the greatest jobs in the world.
Post by: AlioTheFool on June 01, 2016, 11:24:10 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on June 01, 2016, 11:25:54 AM
Post by: CatoTheElder on June 01, 2016, 02:08:25 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on June 01, 2016, 02:15:50 PM
Fitzpatrick sends Brandon Marshall texts in the middle of the night...
Three hours and no homo joke from Puck. Odd.
Post by: AlioTheFool on June 01, 2016, 03:52:00 PM
Somewhere* Fitz is smiling.
*Somewhere being, according to Decker, in New Jersey where Fitz's kids are currently going to school.
Post by: Miamipuck on June 01, 2016, 06:13:24 PM
Three hours and no homo joke from Puck. Odd.
Correction, 8 hours you bundle of sticks.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on June 02, 2016, 05:44:18 AM
Quote
The New York Daily News reports free agent Ryan Fitzpatrick is "prepared" to sign a one-year, $12 million deal with the Jets.
The Jets' three-year proposal to Fitzpatrick is worth $24 million over three years, with $12 million in the first season. If the Jets offer him just a one-year contract worth $12 million guaranteed, the Daily News' Gary Myers reports Fitzpatrick would sign on the dotted line, ending his contract stalemate. The Jets are "being stubborn," however, and have not yet made him a one-year, $12 million offer. Myers' report is a way for Fitzpatrick's camp to get the word out. Myers reports Fitzpatrick has "given up on getting multi-year security from the Jets" and is "ready to take his chances in the free agent market again in 2017."
Post by: Libero_2 on June 02, 2016, 05:54:09 AM
Since it worked so well this time, let's go it again next year!
But seriously one more year of Fitz as the starter, then a transition year to Petty or Hackenberg with hopefully Fitz as the #2 guy would be ideal for us.
Post by: bojanglesman on June 02, 2016, 06:17:49 AM
Post by: Johnny English on June 02, 2016, 07:36:48 AM
Since it worked so well this time, let's go it again next year!
But seriously one more year of Fitz as the starter, then a transition year to Petty or Hackenberg with hopefully Fitz as the #2 guy would be ideal for us.
The problem with a 1 year / $12M deal is that we have to take a $12M cap hit, rather than $8M per year. Maybe we could do something like Revis got in NE but with a $4M player option for next year, allowing the cap hit to be spread with no real likelihood of the second year being taken up. It would give us dead money in year 2 but that was going to happen anyway.
Post by: Badger on June 02, 2016, 07:45:09 AM
Gary Myers is a turd though.
Post by: Mantana Soss on June 02, 2016, 08:17:32 AM
I would have preferred a 2 year deal, just there's one more reason to keep a clipboard in Hackenberg's hands until 2018, but 1 year is better than no years.
Post by: Heismanberg on June 02, 2016, 08:24:45 AM
Post by: Mantana Soss on June 02, 2016, 08:37:54 AM
He isn't signing a one year, $12M deal.
Because he won't take it, or because it won't be offered?
Post by: Heismanberg on June 02, 2016, 08:53:43 AM
Because he won't take it, or because it won't be offered?
The "report" was shot down late last night. It won't be offered.
Post by: Mantana Soss on June 02, 2016, 09:08:34 AM
The "report" was shot down late last night. It won't be offered.
Oh, I didn't see it refuted anywhere. I thought it was just a feeler thrown out to a beat writer by the Fitz camp that he'd accept 12M/1.
I do think he'd take that before the 3 year incentive-laden lockdown that is/was on the table.
Post by: Tommy on June 02, 2016, 09:42:06 AM
Post by: Pope on June 02, 2016, 09:58:48 AM
Post by: Tommy on June 02, 2016, 10:26:52 AM
Hypothetically, I don't know that we can even afford to do a 1 year 12M deal.. unless we restructure and cut a bunch of guys. The cap hit is gonna have to leak into 2017 and maybe even 2018
That's probably the purpose of a multi-year offer. Makes sense on the Jets part, but I'm sure Fitz knows our cap situation as well.
Post by: bojanglesman on June 02, 2016, 10:39:27 AM
Because he won't take it, or because it won't be offered?
It won't be offered. Fitz would take that in a second. The Jets have zero motivation to do that deal. Gary Myers knows nothing. If the Jets would be fine with a $12 million one year deal, this would be done a while back.
I think you're right about it being crap spewed by the Fitz camp.
BTW, I don't think much of this difficulty in getting a deal done is by Fitzpatrick personally. I think it's all his agent. He is just letting him handle it and getting out of the way.
Post by: Italian Seafood on June 02, 2016, 11:11:43 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on June 02, 2016, 11:21:18 AM
I really don't get this team. GMs come and go and we still can't ever sign our own good players. Ever. Keyshawn, Abraham, Revis, Mo, now a journeyman QB with no other options. You can even go back to John Riggins long before free agency, it's uncanny.
We signed Revis twice (opens can of worms.....). We signed Ferguson, Mangold, Harris............
Post by: Miamipuck on June 02, 2016, 11:23:05 AM
I really don't get this team. GMs come and go and we still can't ever sign our own good players. Ever. Keyshawn, Abraham, Revis, Mo, now a journeyman QB with no other options. You can even go back to John Riggins long before free agency, it's uncanny.
I am happy they're playing hardball, two words Matt Schaub.
Post by: Italian Seafood on June 02, 2016, 11:34:38 AM
We signed Revis twice (opens can of worms.....). We signed Ferguson, Mangold, Harris............
We bungled the Revis thing badly and he won a ring with the Pats before correcting the error, but credit for that at least. Yes, we kept a couple of decent players over time, but the ones who really make a difference we somehow never have the money for.
Post by: Tommy on June 02, 2016, 11:42:46 AM
We bungled the Revis thing badly and he won a ring with the Pats before correcting the error, but credit for that at least. Yes, we kept a couple of decent players over time, but the ones who really make a difference we somehow never have the money for.
I'm not disagreeing with you, but I really wouldn't consider Fitz "one of our own". Not like we drafted him, or signed him to be a starter. He came in as a backup on a one-year contract. I don't think anyone really expected him to do so well on this team.
Post by: Pope on June 02, 2016, 11:56:13 AM
I'm not disagreeing with you, but I really wouldn't consider Fitz "one of our own". Not like we drafted him, or signed him to be a starter. He came in as a backup on a one-year contract. I don't think anyone really expected him to do so well on this team.Yeah he's one of our own as much as Revis could be considered a Buccaneer or a Patriot
Post by: Tommy on June 02, 2016, 12:39:02 PM
Yeah he's one of our own as much as Revis could be considered a Buccaneer or a Patriot
Also it's not like the FO was blindsided by our current cap situation. From a financial standpoint they were probably hoping Geno would work.
Post by: Italian Seafood on June 02, 2016, 12:39:45 PM
I'm not disagreeing with you, but I really wouldn't consider Fitz "one of our own". Not like we drafted him, or signed him to be a starter. He came in as a backup on a one-year contract. I don't think anyone really expected him to do so well on this team.
That's true, but as of now he's our starting QB and the key to being a contender or another bullsh*t season with Geno. Not putting him in the class with Hall of Famers like Riggins or Revis but a starting QB is kind of a big deal.
Post by: dcm1602 on June 02, 2016, 09:55:55 PM
Like the only reason I could see the FO being adamant about not giving Fitz guaranteed money past year one. Is because they want one of these guys to be the starter next year. And maybe taking it a step further because they want the other one to be his backup.
Or it could just simply be cutthroat business where they know Fitz isnt worth x amount, so theyre sticking to their guns.
Post by: Miamipuck on June 02, 2016, 10:19:58 PM
I have to wonder if this whole thing with Fitz goes to show how much faith the front office has in Hack or Petty.
Like the only reason I could see the FO being adamant about not giving Fitz guaranteed money past year one. Is because they want one of these guys to be the starter next year. And maybe taking it a step further because they want the other one to be his backup.
Or it could just simply be cutthroat business where they know Fitz isnt worth x amount, so theyre sticking to their guns.
Yes
Post by: Andrew Ryan on June 02, 2016, 10:53:31 PM
Post by: Johnny English on June 13, 2016, 10:25:02 AM
Update on the #Jets situation with Ryan Fitzpatrick: Nothing. … Just nothing. Doesn't seem like things will change heading into minicamp.
I'm starting to think that it just isn't going to happen.
Post by: MBGreen on June 13, 2016, 10:40:55 AM
Ian Rapoport @RapSheet
Update on the #Jets situation with Ryan Fitzpatrick: Nothing. … Just nothing. Doesn't seem like things will change heading into minicamp.
I'm starting to think that it just isn't going to happen.
6 weeks away from TC. I'll worry about it then.
Post by: Johnny English on June 13, 2016, 10:48:35 AM
6 weeks away from TC. I'll worry about it then.
Maybe Fitz is just a really big soccer fan and doesn't want to have to worry about going to work when there's Euro 2016 football to watch all day.
Post by: AlioTheFool on June 13, 2016, 11:45:48 AM
Everyone can say "I'll worry when he's not there for camp" but what is the difference between now and then? The money is the same on the Jets' books either way. So the only difference is that he's missing valuable practice time right now.
Post by: bojanglesman on June 13, 2016, 12:08:49 PM
I don't understand how there is no movement at all. I'm with you JE, I think this isn't happening.
Everyone can say "I'll worry when he's not there for camp" but what is the difference between now and then? The money is the same on the Jets' books either way. So the only difference is that he's missing valuable practice time right now.
What do you think Fitz will do if he doesn't sign with the Jets?
Post by: Johnny English on June 13, 2016, 12:10:36 PM
What do you think Fitz will do if he doesn't sign with the Jets?
Take his kids to school, go play golf, pick them up again, spend time watching his family grow up and enjoy not getting his head caved in by 280lb armoured gorillas.
Post by: bojanglesman on June 13, 2016, 12:11:51 PM
Take his kids to school, go play golf, pick them up again, spend time watching his family grow up and enjoy not getting his head caved in by 280lb armoured gorillas.
nfl.com
Quote
On Monday, Fitzpatrick resurfaced at a charity golf outing hosted by former Jets teammate Willie Colon. Fitzpatrick told SiriusXM NFL Radio that he couldn't put a percentage on his chances of returning to the Jets, but made it clear he fully intends on continuing his career coming off his best season.
"I'm playing," Fitzpatrick said, via ESPN.com. "I'm playing football next year."
Retirement would be a very reasonable option. This doesn't sound like someone retiring.
Post by: Johnny English on June 13, 2016, 12:13:38 PM
nfl.com
In that case, probably sit tight until week four when someone's starter goes down and they need a vet who gives them a chance at making the postseason.
Post by: bojanglesman on June 13, 2016, 12:20:14 PM
In that case, probably sit tight until week four when someone's starter goes down and they need a vet who gives them a chance at making the postseason.
What will they pay him? Even if his goal is to take a excrement salary this year so he isn't tied into a 3 year deal, what chance does he have of coming in to a new team after the starter goes down, actually playing well with new players, repeating last year's success, and then getting a team to invest big in a then-34 year old journeyman?
Post by: Johnny English on June 13, 2016, 12:27:24 PM
What will they pay him? Even if his goal is to take a excrement salary this year so he isn't tied into a 3 year deal, what chance does he have of coming in to a new team after the starter goes down, actually playing well with new players, repeating last year's success, and then getting a team to invest big in a then-34 year old journeyman?
I dunno. Why are you trying to convince me? Maybe you should tell Fitz this.
Post by: AlioTheFool on June 13, 2016, 12:31:55 PM
What do you think Fitz will do if he doesn't sign with the Jets?
I honestly don't know. He can say he won't retire, but that doesn't mean anyone is going to hire him. Maybe he gets job in October when a team loses their starter? Who knows?
Again, my big problem is that it still seems like a no-brainer for both the Jets and Fitz for him to come back. The money is going to be what it is no matter when he signs the contract. So why are both sides dragging their feet when he could be in-house, on the field, practicing and building off last year's success?
If he's coming back at all, he should be back now. We're not talking about a Tom Brady who could skip OTAs, minicamp, July, and everything up to the third preseason game and it wouldn't make a difference.
Post by: MBGreen on June 13, 2016, 01:00:08 PM
Obviously the Jets aren't concerned with needing him in the building right away.
Conventional wisdom says he'll be here, it's just a matter of when.
Post by: AlioTheFool on June 13, 2016, 02:21:34 PM
He'll be back with the Jets...this is a pissing contest between the FO and his agent. If he wants to start, he'll sign here. If he wants to wait out injuries, he'll get significantly less money from the team that signs him...and if money wasn't an issue, he would've lowered his asking price in the spring and signed elsewhere.
Obviously the Jets aren't concerned with needing him in the building right away.
Conventional wisdom says he'll be here, it's just a matter of when.
I'm not necessarily disagreeing with most of this. Except I have a real problem with the team being unconcerned with him not being in the building. Practice, especially in the offseason, sucks. But it also matters.
How often does Tom Brady skip camp? Not only does he not skip camp, he habitually arrives days before it starts. If one of the best QBs to ever play the sport can show up early, I'd like to think a journeyman QB in his second year with a team can show up to get on the same page with his teammates. If either side thinks that's unnecessary I think it says a lot about that person or people.
Post by: MBGreen on June 13, 2016, 02:40:24 PM
I'm not necessarily disagreeing with most of this. Except I have a real problem with the team being unconcerned with him not being in the building. Practice, especially in the offseason, sucks. But it also matters.
How often does Tom Brady skip camp? Not only does he not skip camp, he habitually arrives days before it starts. If one of the best QBs to ever play the sport can show up early, I'd like to think a journeyman QB in his second year with a team can show up to get on the same page with his teammates. If either side thinks that's unnecessary I think it says a lot about that person or people.
I understand your point. In a perfect world, the FO would want him on the field and under contract. But they're not going to meet his price just for the sake of getting extra reps in.
I'm also sure Fitz is chomping at the bit to get back on the field....but he pays his agent good money to do the best for him at the bargaining table. Unfortunately, this has turned into one long-winded negotiation tactic. Someone is going to blink. My money is on Fitz, only because he's made it well known he wants to play and wants to play HERE. Sadly, it doesn't look like it's going to happen any time soon.
We already know he has chemistry with his receivers, so lack of reps shouldn't be a huge concern yet. It WILL become an issue if this stalemate extends into TC.
The new running backs (Forte, Robinson) and Amaro need reps with Fitz. I'm not really worried about the rest of the offense
Post by: Badger on June 13, 2016, 03:09:57 PM
I'm also sure Fitz is chomping at the bit to get back on the field....
*champing
Post by: Badger on June 14, 2016, 11:02:47 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on June 15, 2016, 04:46:52 AM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/06/14/add-darrelle-revis-to-the-bring-back-ryan-fitzpatrick-camp/
So if we can't get him back, the team may revolts because they are stuck with Geno. Excellent
Post by: Johnny English on June 15, 2016, 07:12:58 AM
So if we can't get him back, the team may revolts because they are stuck with Geno. Excellent
Revis remembers what it was like to be returning to the field every four downs because the quarterback couldn't buy ten yards. Still, if he feels that strongly about getting Fitz back and giving the team the best chance to win, maybe he can give up some of his colossal salary to help the team resolve it.
Post by: MBGreen on June 15, 2016, 08:29:50 AM
Joe Namath said at NYC luncheon Tuesday, "I think Geno's going to be the starting quarterback no matter if Fitzpatrick comes back or not."
Must've been an open bar at that luncheon.
Post by: Ornstein on June 15, 2016, 08:40:16 AM
Post by: guinness77 on June 15, 2016, 10:02:19 AM
Post by: MBGreen on June 15, 2016, 10:17:33 AM
I love how he put the franchise on the map, but why does anyone listen to this guy anymore? It's pretty much nonsense 99% of the time.
AbdulSalam and BigBlocker will burn your house down for making such inflammatory comments against their god.
Post by: Koz on June 15, 2016, 10:19:07 AM
I love how he put the franchise on the map, but why does anyone listen to this guy anymore? It's pretty much nonsense 99% of the time.
He's the guy in the room that just talks endlessly, where the only thing everyone else is thinking is SHUT THE freak UP!!!!
Post by: Miamipuck on June 15, 2016, 10:56:45 AM
Post by: dcm1602 on June 15, 2016, 12:22:22 PM
Adam Schefter @AdamSchefter 3h3 hours ago
Joe Namath said at NYC luncheon Tuesday, "I think Geno's going to be the starting quarterback no matter if Fitzpatrick comes back or not."
Must've been an open bar at that luncheon.
Not that it means anything as its surely posturing, but Bowles said Geno is light years ahead thus year of he was last year
Post by: Pope on June 15, 2016, 12:41:18 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on June 15, 2016, 03:36:56 PM
Neither side has any reason to budge. Fitzpatrick keeps hearing the Jets saying they want Fitz as their starter, so why would he lower his demands? Meanwhile, nobody else is giving Fitz what he wants, so why do the Jets lower his demands?
I really think this might last into the first week or two of training camp. That's when things get interesting.
Plus, I think the Jets also want to see if Hackenberg, Geno or Petty can step up and make Fitzpatrick's presence less necessary. Fitz is a solid replacement QB, but he is what he is. We have 3 QBs 25 or younger on the roster, and all of them were drafted in the first 4 rounds. I think the Jets might want to make sure they don't have the guy already on their roster before signing Fitz.
I also wouldn't be surprised if the Jets leak to the media that they would be comfortable with Hack or Geno as the guy, just to add more pressure to Fitz.
Post by: Johnny English on June 15, 2016, 03:40:20 PM
Bowles: #Jets would "entertain" idea of bringing in a veteran QB if Fitzpatrick doesn't return.
Post by: dcm1602 on June 15, 2016, 06:28:36 PM
Dennis Waszak Jr. @DWAZ73 1m1 minute ago
Bowles: #Jets would "entertain" idea of bringing in a veteran QB if Fitzpatrick doesn't return.
If we bring in a vet other than Fitz I'd bet he's Genos backup
Post by: Johnny English on June 15, 2016, 07:00:41 PM
If we bring in a vet other than Fitz I'd bet he's Genos backup
For three games, maybe.
Post by: Libero_2 on June 15, 2016, 07:09:40 PM
Let's be honest with ourselves here, Joe was wasted long before he even got to that luncheon.
Let's be real that fucker has a series of hidden flasks everywhere.
Post by: dcm1602 on June 15, 2016, 08:05:06 PM
For three games, maybe.
If they roll with Geno as starter it's quite unlikely they pull the plug after 3 games
Post by: Johnny English on June 15, 2016, 08:10:15 PM
If they roll with Geno as starter it's quite unlikely they pull the plug after 3 games
Have you seen Geno play quarterback before?
Post by: bojanglesman on June 15, 2016, 08:22:55 PM
Have you seen Geno play quarterback before?Has anyone really?
Post by: dcm1602 on June 15, 2016, 09:39:01 PM
Have you seen Geno play quarterback before?
If the front office doesn't bring back Fitz and signs some old dude to be Genos backup that means they think he's capable of being a servicable starter.
Post by: Johnny English on June 15, 2016, 11:01:38 PM
If the front office doesn't bring back Fitz and signs some old dude to be Genos backup that means they think he's capable of being a servicable starter.
If the front office doesn't bring back Fitz and signs some old dude to be Geno's backup, that means they've run out of options.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on June 16, 2016, 09:30:58 AM
Has anyone really?
This made me laugh
Post by: SixFeetDeep on June 16, 2016, 09:32:31 AM
Post by: MBGreen on June 16, 2016, 09:39:12 AM
If the front office doesn't bring back Fitz and signs some old dude to be Geno's backup, I'm praying for David Garrard
my money is on Mark Brunell and his cowboy hat.
Post by: Koz on June 16, 2016, 09:44:13 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on June 16, 2016, 03:50:59 PM
Is Vinny still worth a look?
Compared to Geno, Yes!
Post by: Italian Seafood on June 16, 2016, 04:05:08 PM
Post by: Johnny English on July 18, 2016, 05:05:01 PM
Brandon Marshall on @MichaelRapaport podcast says Ryan Fitzpatrick hasn't returned his texts in 2 weeks. They normally speak almost daily.
Post by: Ignatius J Reilly on July 18, 2016, 05:32:04 PM
mike freeman @mikefreemanNFL
Brandon Marshall on @MichaelRapaport podcast says Ryan Fitzpatrick hasn't returned his texts in 2 weeks. They normally speak almost daily.
I told you, my sources said he's not coming back. Period.
Post by: MBGreen on July 18, 2016, 05:45:54 PM
mike freeman @mikefreemanNFL#TeamSmunt2016
Brandon Marshall on @MichaelRapaport podcast says Ryan Fitzpatrick hasn't returned his texts in 2 weeks. They normally speak almost daily.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Johnny English on July 18, 2016, 05:46:51 PM
I told you, my sources said he's not coming back. Period.
Maybe your sources should tell our #1 receiver as well, because he appears to be unaware.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 18, 2016, 06:20:43 PM
mike freeman @mikefreemanNFLWell, the more he shows he's keeping up with his buddies, the less leverage he has. I'd cut off all ties too if I were holding out for all it's worth. Might as well give the appearance you can leave. The Jets are trying to give off the appearance they are ok with Geno as a backup plan.
Brandon Marshall on @MichaelRapaport podcast says Ryan Fitzpatrick hasn't returned his texts in 2 weeks. They normally speak almost daily.
Post by: Koz on July 19, 2016, 07:13:59 AM
mike freeman @mikefreemanNFL
Brandon Marshall on @MichaelRapaport podcast says Ryan Fitzpatrick hasn't returned his texts in 2 weeks. They normally speak almost daily.
Anyone else ready to move on?
Post by: Johnny English on July 19, 2016, 07:16:04 AM
Anyone else ready to move on?
I'm totally ready to move on from Fitz, just as soon as plan B isn't Geno Smith.
Post by: Koz on July 19, 2016, 07:21:56 AM
I'm totally ready to move on from Fitz, just as soon as plan B isn't Geno Smith.
I really hope that there is a "Plan D" available at this point, or maybe we get lucky and have someone like a Pete Kendall shake loose from a team early in TC. I realize of course that it's not ideal to land a qb then, but essentially it looks as though that's about the time we'd expect to see Fitz if he ever came back anyway.
Problems with Geno in my eyes:
1) He sucks
2) He has no talent.
3) He's an poopchute.
4) Nobody on the team respects him.
5) Nobody on the team wants to play with him.
6) Geno will do absolutely nothing to foster the development of our 2 younger QB's. What exactly would you hope that either of them would learn from Geno, on any level?
7) Geno is a dick and deserved more than one shot to the jaw.
8) I hate Geno.
Post by: ukilledkenny on July 19, 2016, 07:59:20 AM
On a more serious note I think Marshall would start talking about Geno like he did Fitz last year and other guys would follow his lead.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 19, 2016, 08:32:08 AM
Anyone else ready to move on?No. Time heals all wounds. I'm quite sure all this waiting will benefit him in the end. I highly doubt the Jets are really on board the Geno train, nor do I think they have the balls to set a hard date by which Fitz has to sign or they move on. If Fitz wanted to sign the deal the day after the hard date, they'd welcome him back.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on July 19, 2016, 09:13:03 AM
Post by: Koz on July 19, 2016, 10:09:44 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on July 19, 2016, 10:40:18 AM
If you were in the middle of the North Atlantic, floating after an ill-fated wintertime passage, and had enough room to spare on your door as you hung on for dear life, would you slide over and give Geno some precious space?Why not, he'd miss anyway.
Post by: Derek Smalls on July 19, 2016, 11:03:55 AM
Geno could be good for the young QB's. Someone just needs to talk to them the first day of camp about doing the opposite of what Geno does.That's the thing. If Fitz doesn't sign, I expect Marshall to be talking up Geno again, just like he was last year. And hopefully Geno learned something from Fitz last season, whether it's how to lead a team, or how to make better decisions.
On a more serious note I think Marshall would start talking about Geno like he did Fitz last year and other guys would follow his lead.
Post by: Badger on July 19, 2016, 12:17:54 PM
That's the thing. If Fitz doesn't sign, I expect Marshall to be talking up Geno again, just like he was last year. And hopefully Geno learned something from Fitz last season, whether it's how to lead a team, or how to make better decisions.
https://youtu.be/Xa9Eof8ApeE
Post by: Libero_2 on July 19, 2016, 12:26:07 PM
No. Time heals all wounds. I'm quite sure all this waiting will benefit him in the end. I highly doubt the Jets are really on board the Geno train, nor do I think they have the balls to set a hard date by which Fitz has to sign or they move on. If Fitz wanted to sign the deal the day after the hard date, they'd welcome him back.
That depends. If the Hard Date is training camp eve, and he passes then we go sign somebody to compete with Geno, we might be done. But until we bring somebody else in, I won't believe we have set a firm date to move on from Fitz
Post by: Koz on July 20, 2016, 07:16:15 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on July 20, 2016, 07:46:47 AM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on July 25, 2016, 04:39:21 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on July 25, 2016, 04:55:17 PM
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/jets/jets-fitzpatrick-multiple-contract-offers-pick-article-1.2725186
I hate Mehta. freak him, talking about Fitz not doing the Carlton at a charity golf event as a reason we should up our offer. I man seriously freak that dick cheese weasel.
Post by: Heismanberg on July 25, 2016, 05:58:07 PM
I hate Mehta. freak him, talking about Fitz not doing the Carlton at a charity golf event as a reason we should up our offer. I man seriously freak that dick cheese weasel.
He wasn't being serious.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 25, 2016, 06:17:52 PM
He wasn't being serious.
IK But that's still a few minutes of my life I'm not getting back
Post by: Badger on July 25, 2016, 06:22:15 PM
IK
May he live forever.
Sent from my VS500 using Tapatalk
Post by: Miamipuck on July 25, 2016, 08:54:09 PM
May he live forever.
Sent from my VS500 using Tapatalk
If a video of that ever got out it would be the first non hot lesbo porn video I ever spanked to.
Post by: Tommy on July 25, 2016, 10:03:07 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on July 25, 2016, 10:10:52 PM
/tgg
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 05:55:48 PM
Quote
Rapoport: Talks are heating up for the #Jets and QB Ryan Fitzpatrick, and they are negotiating back-and-forth. Jets trying to get it done.
Boner!?
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 05:58:43 PM
Finally: Ryan Fitzpatrick and Jets reach agreement on 1-year, $12 million, fully-guaranteed contract, sources tell ESPN.
Post by: Miamipuck on July 27, 2016, 06:00:48 PM
Deal is done! 1 year $ 12 million per Schefter
Finally: Ryan Fitzpatrick and Jets reach agreement on 1-year, $12 million, fully-guaranteed contract, sources tell ESPN.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 06:02:02 PM
Thank God, now get your nerdy derriere out there and lob the ball to Marshall 20 times a game.
Post by: Miamipuck on July 27, 2016, 06:03:49 PM
Bowles probably demanded it to avoid press questions.
Thank God, now get your nerdy derriere out there and lob the ball to Marshall 20 times a game.
Makes the tailgate way better. Who the freak wants to watch Geno?
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 06:04:26 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 06:06:13 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on July 27, 2016, 06:06:13 PM
Deal is done! 1 year $ 12 million per Schefter
Finally: Ryan Fitzpatrick and Jets reach agreement on 1-year, $12 million, fully-guaranteed contract, sources tell ESPN.
Fitz betting on himself... Here's hoping it works out the same way it did for Joe Flacco.
freaking finally it's done. Hallelujah
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 06:07:25 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on July 27, 2016, 06:08:02 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on July 27, 2016, 06:09:04 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on July 27, 2016, 06:09:48 PM
Somebody will need to get a contract reworked to make room
We have what 15 hours until the first practice? Duff needs to get rolling.
I'd guess it's Breno that gets reworked (Unless Marshall wants to give up coin to his boi Fitz)
Post by: JFIF on July 27, 2016, 06:13:33 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 06:13:58 PM
We have what 15 hours until the first practice? Duff needs to get rolling.Not Breno unless it's a pay cut.
I'd guess it's Breno that gets reworked (Unless Marshall wants to give up coin to his boi Fitz)
Post by: Johnny English on July 27, 2016, 06:15:22 PM
Somebody will need to get a contract reworked to make room
They could start by cutting Geno Smith and giving Fitz his $1.1M for this year.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 06:16:40 PM
He didn't get $18 million per year, but I don't think he truly expected that. The goal was milk time for as much cash as possible.
Post by: Jumbo on July 27, 2016, 06:20:23 PM
Post by: MBGreen on July 27, 2016, 06:22:28 PM
Deal is done! 1 year $ 12 million per SchefterPerfect stopgap deal.....that should've been completed months ago.
Finally: Ryan Fitzpatrick and Jets reach agreement on 1-year, $12 million, fully-guaranteed contract, sources tell ESPN.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Johnny English on July 27, 2016, 06:23:17 PM
All the reddit Jets fans are committing seppuku, they all wanted Geno. I guess Jets fans truly are masochists.
I saw you on the thread. For some reason, led by some basement dweller (Nanigar Cire or something like that) who spends endless hours cherry picking plays to demonstrate why Fitz is the devil incarnate and Geno the Chosen One, the posters on /r/nyjets are absolutely freaking in love with Geno, and have convinced themselves that they are the voice of all Jets fans without realising that their little echo chamber is the one that's out of step with reality.
Post by: Badger on July 27, 2016, 06:24:51 PM
freak YEAH
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 06:27:57 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 06:30:20 PM
Quote
Jets increased their offer Wed from $8M to $12M and gave Fitz until 7 p.m. ET to take deal or team would be "moving on," per @AdamSchefter
Duff was done freaking around.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 27, 2016, 06:30:24 PM
I wouldn't be shocked if Petty goes to the practice squad eventually. I'm not sure any team would take up a roster spot with him. It would be best for our roster not to have 4 QBs on it. They aren't cutting Geno, despite what we hope. He is a reasonable, cheap backup.
Petty was a two year project that was a 4th round pick a year ago. Somebody will put him on their roster if we don't.
I expect us to keep 4 QBs unless Petty is absolute trash that is worse than Tahj Boyd, or we shitcan Geno to get the stench off our roster, even if it means we have a weak backup option if Fitz goes down.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on July 27, 2016, 06:31:15 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on July 27, 2016, 06:31:41 PM
[quite]Jets increased their offer Wed from $8M to $12M and gave Fitz until 7 p.m. ET to take deal or team would be "moving on," per @AdamSchefter
AKA Foles hit the market, so he would be better than Geno. So sign on the line or gtfo
Post by: Tommy on July 27, 2016, 06:33:56 PM
Post by: ukilledkenny on July 27, 2016, 06:36:50 PM
Post by: MBGreen on July 27, 2016, 06:37:38 PM
Duff was done freaking around.Media is criticizing Duff on twitter for giving in to Fitz
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: ukilledkenny on July 27, 2016, 06:38:58 PM
Media is criticizing Duff on twitter for giving in to Fitz
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
lol, in what world did the Jets give in? Because of the incentives?
Post by: Jumbo on July 27, 2016, 06:39:49 PM
lol, in what world did the Jets give in? Because of the incentives?
Well Duff initially wanted the 3-year deal with Fitz making backup money the final 2 years, so agreeing to this is in a sense a cave from what the FO initially wanted
Post by: ukilledkenny on July 27, 2016, 06:41:29 PM
Well Duff initially wanted the 3-year deal with Fitz making backup money the final 2 years, so agreeing to this is in a sense a cave from what the FO initially wanted
That's pretty lame to criticize for. He was only really wanted for this year either way.
Post by: MBGreen on July 27, 2016, 06:41:38 PM
Its Manish stirring the pot. Nothing to see here.
lol, in what world did the Jets give in? Because of the incentives?
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Johnny English on July 27, 2016, 06:48:43 PM
Petty was a two year project that was a 4th round pick a year ago. Somebody will put him on their roster if we don't.
I expect us to keep 4 QBs unless Petty is absolute trash that is worse than Tahj Boyd, or we shitcan Geno to get the stench off our roster, even if it means we have a weak backup option if Fitz goes down.
Agree with all of that. I don't think Petty would survive the PS, we'd lose him to someone.
I know it has been discussed before but I'd like to see PS rules changed slightly to allow a development QB to be protected.
Post by: Pope on July 27, 2016, 06:58:46 PM
Post by: Johnny English on July 27, 2016, 07:02:14 PM
Who are the restructure/cut candidates? I'm pretty sure we need to make cap room
Cut Geno, restructure Marshall, Revis, Harris or Gilchrist.
Post by: Badger on July 27, 2016, 07:02:35 PM
All the reddit Jets fans are committing seppuku, they all wanted Geno. I guess Jets fans truly are masochists.
I saw you on the thread. For some reason, led by some basement dweller (Nanigar Cire or something like that) who spends endless hours cherry picking plays to demonstrate why Fitz is the devil incarnate and Geno the Chosen One, the posters on /r/nyjets are absolutely freaking in love with Geno, and have convinced themselves that they are the voice of all Jets fans without realising that their little echo chamber is the one that's out of step with reality.
http://www.reddit.com/r/nyjets/comments/4uxim9/schefter_ryan_fitzpatrick_and_jets_reach/d5to04g
DIAF
Post by: Johnny English on July 27, 2016, 07:04:49 PM
http://www.reddit.com/r/nyjets/comments/4uxim9/schefter_ryan_fitzpatrick_and_jets_reach/d5to04g
DIAF
That's the guy, he really needs to go play on the turnpike. Hopefully he'll throw his toys out of his pram now and go find another team to follow.
Post by: Derek Smalls on July 27, 2016, 07:04:55 PM
Now they're criticizing the Jets for giving into Fitz.
It's all noise.
So in the end, he got deals done with Wilkerson and Fitzpatrick. Those were the two biggest question marks this offseason, and after waiting a long time for both deals, he got them done.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 27, 2016, 07:05:39 PM
Who are the restructure/cut candidates? I'm pretty sure we need to make cap room
Cut Geno, restructure Marshall, Revis, Harris or Gilchrist.
To add to your list, Breno is a potential casualty, who could be resigned cheaper, especially if they really believe Qvale is the new Austin Howard.
I think Decker or Mangold could also be restructured. Most likely restructure candidates are Marshall and Gilchrist IMO.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 07:06:15 PM
Media is criticizing Duff on twitter for giving in to FitzThey would do the same if they didn't give in. Easy to criticize with no repercussions.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 07:08:34 PM
Post by: Johnny English on July 27, 2016, 07:08:49 PM
To add to your list, Breno is a potential casualty, who could be resigned cheaper, especially if they really believe Qvale is the new Austin Howard.
I think Decker or Mangold could also be restructured. Most likely restructure candidates are Marshall and Gilchrist IMO.
I know there has been talk about cutting Breno but I just don't see it. Qvale hasn't got enough work done in the NFL for them to cut a solid if unspectacular performer at a crucial position.
Decker is already carrying a bunch of prorated bonus and Mangold's contract expires after next season, so he doesn't have enough money left to clear space for Fitz. Agree that Marshall and Gilchrist are the likeliest candidates.
Post by: MBGreen on July 27, 2016, 07:12:10 PM
They would do the same if they didn't give in. Easy to criticize with no repercussions.Im just happy fitz signed
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Badger on July 27, 2016, 07:13:16 PM
Someone please link that gif of that crazy Turkish fan celebrating.
(http://www.totalprosports.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/yTG0R.gif)
Post by: Johnny English on July 27, 2016, 07:14:10 PM
Quote
Be thankful you got Fitz. Because right about now the fans of every team on your schedule are pretty pissed they got robbed of the chance to go up against Geno.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 27, 2016, 07:14:20 PM
Im just happy fitz signed
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
So is basically any real Jets fan anywhere
Post by: Libero_2 on July 27, 2016, 07:15:20 PM
This comment from a Bills fan sums it up perfectly for the Geno apologists (of which we seem to have none on here, thankfully):
That's brilliant. And sums up this scenario perfectly.
Post that in what's a niggers sub Reddit and see what he has to say to defend that.
Post by: Johnny English on July 27, 2016, 07:16:26 PM
That's brilliant. And sums up this scenario perfectly.
Post that in what's a niggers sub Reddit and see what he has to say to defend that.
In the what now?
Post by: MBGreen on July 27, 2016, 07:16:38 PM
So is basically any real Jets fan anywhere...but reddit
FYP
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Johnny English on July 27, 2016, 07:17:25 PM
So is basically any real Jets fan anywhere
I think plenty of Geno apologists are real Jets fans, they're just not very bright ones.
Post by: Miamipuck on July 27, 2016, 07:18:35 PM
All the reddit Jets fans are committing seppuku, they all wanted Geno. I guess Jets fans truly are masochists.
Give them my number, I have some Japanese knives/swords I would be more than happy to lend them.
Post by: Badger on July 27, 2016, 07:25:46 PM
In the what now?
My best guess is that was an attempt at dismissively not remembering NannigarCire's username.
Post by: Badger on July 27, 2016, 07:26:37 PM
Give them my number, I have some Japanese knives/swords I would be more than happy to lend them.
I also have a decent knife collection, also I can gather up some scrap metal, broken glass, or pointy sticks, whatever they need. I'm here to help.
Post by: Johnny English on July 27, 2016, 07:27:31 PM
My best guess is that was an attempt at dismissively not remembering NannigarCire's username.
Ha, I assumed he was typing on Pope's phone and auto correct just did its thing.
Post by: Miamipuck on July 27, 2016, 07:28:36 PM
I also have a decent knife collection, also I can gather up some scrap metal, broken glass, or pointy sticks, whatever they need. I'm here to help.
As am I, we can get them to till the fields.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 07:29:45 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on July 27, 2016, 07:31:06 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on July 27, 2016, 07:33:42 PM
Post that in what's a niggers sub Reddit and see what he has to say to defend that.
hahahahahahahahahahahaha
wat
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 07:43:30 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on July 27, 2016, 07:52:21 PM
Post by: Heismanberg on July 27, 2016, 07:55:54 PM
Quote
Edwerderespn: The starting QB market established at $15-$23 million and @AdamSchefter reports incentives give Fitz chance to hit $15M with #Jets
Quote
Edwerderespn: Fitz decision: Nick Foles on market, #Jets increased offer Wed. from $8M to $12M, imposed 7 p.m. ET deadline or team would be "moving on.
Even if he struggles, it's a great deal for both sides. We aren't tied to the aging QB if he comes back down to earth, but he's most likely a Jet for the rest of his career if he carries this team to the postseason.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 08:40:10 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 08:48:50 PM
Post by: Badger on July 27, 2016, 08:53:06 PM
https://twitter.com/joedagzz/status/758469849471414276?s=09I love this.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 27, 2016, 08:55:29 PM
I love this.I don't 100% know that's Geno, but I'm 100% gonna assume it is.
Post by: Heismanberg on July 27, 2016, 09:04:12 PM
I don't 100% know that's Geno, but I'm 100% gonna assume it is.
It's him
Post by: Libero_2 on July 27, 2016, 10:30:40 PM
Dick: About the $3M in incentives for Fitzpatrick: The Jets would have to make a long playoff run for him to collect any of it. #nyj
So SB and Fitz gets a $3 million dollar bonus? I think we could consider him worth it at that point.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 27, 2016, 10:31:48 PM
My best guess is that was an attempt at dismissively not remembering NannigarCire's username.
I knew it had nigar in there somewhere, so I just went with it, and autocorrect changed it to person of color whatcha gonna do?
Post by: Libero_2 on July 27, 2016, 10:32:34 PM
Maccagnan 2016
Leading candidate for my vote after the past couple offseasons
Post by: Heismanberg on July 27, 2016, 11:52:48 PM
Matt Forte will do damage on dump off passes because of this
Post by: MoreCharacters on July 28, 2016, 05:26:15 AM
Fair deal.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 28, 2016, 07:06:21 AM
Quote
Ian Rapoport @RapSheet 8m8 minutes ago
What does the Fitzpatrick signing mean for Geno Smith? I'm told Smith is intent on building on his solid offseason & fighting for #Jets job
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh91/sportspope/laughing-02.gif)
Post by: Libero_2 on July 28, 2016, 07:13:06 AM
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh91/sportspope/laughing-02.gif)Dude is confident, but his days as the Jets starting QB is over. Thank the gods for that
Post by: Badger on July 28, 2016, 07:15:42 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on July 28, 2016, 07:16:50 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on July 28, 2016, 07:19:04 AM
Post by: Badger on July 28, 2016, 07:27:46 AM
Post by: bojanglesman on July 28, 2016, 07:42:45 AM
Quote
Rich Cimini @RichCimini
Fitzpatrick said he arrived "1 second" before start of 7:00 team mtg last night. Told Bowles: "Sorry I'm late." Said some players "shocked"
Like when Bobby Boucher came back at halftime in Waterboy.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 28, 2016, 07:49:27 AM
Like when Bobby Boucher came back at halftime in Waterboy.
Love it.
Post by: Pope on July 28, 2016, 08:16:33 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on July 28, 2016, 08:45:09 AM
Post by: Johnny English on July 28, 2016, 08:45:38 AM
Post by: Miamipuck on July 28, 2016, 09:00:50 AM
There's no way that Geno gets a sniff of the starting job unless Fitz is injured, we didn't pay him $12M to compete for his job.
That and the fact he sucks but thank you:
(http://static1.squarespace.com/static/5048e660e4b0bd178ab35a57/50f1c974e4b07e77c465685a/5636a00be4b088f9f336258e/1446465972741/?format=1000w)
Post by: AlioTheFool on July 28, 2016, 12:23:33 PM
It was pretty clear Marshall and Decker weren't enthusiastic about Geno being the QB. When two great receivers are pining for a QB who is sitting home with only a single offer on the table, that tells you a whole lot about the presumed starter at the time.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 28, 2016, 12:46:16 PM
I read that Skrine would be a likely candidate for restructure to make the room. I'm all for cutting Geno though. If Fitz goes down the season is sunk anyway, so play Petty or Hackenberg. Send Geno packing.
It was pretty clear Marshall and Decker weren't enthusiastic about Geno being the QB. When two great receivers are pining for a QB who is sitting home with only a single offer on the table, that tells you a whole lot about the presumed starter at the time.
Given he is a young QB with starting experience on a rookie deal, i think we could trade him for something. But I would much rather remove him from our roster post haste than get a 6th. But in the best interest of the future, if Petty or Hack looks ready enough to be a backup (or surpasses Geno in showcased skill level) then kick his derriere to the curb.
As to Skrine, we aren't really financially committed to him after this year. Do we want to be committed to him for another year or two? He is being paid a good chunk of change to be a nickel CB, granted in another year it's probably not too high for his position. He was good, but penalty prone last year.
Post by: AlioTheFool on July 28, 2016, 01:23:18 PM
Given he is a young QB with starting experience on a rookie deal, i think we could trade him for something. But I would much rather remove him from our roster post haste than get a 6th. But in the best interest of the future, if Petty or Hack looks ready enough to be a backup (or surpasses Geno in showcased skill level) then kick his derriere to the curb.
As to Skrine, we aren't really financially committed to him after this year. Do we want to be committed to him for another year or two? He is being paid a good chunk of change to be a nickel CB, granted in another year it's probably not too high for his position. He was good, but penalty prone last year.
I want Geno gone this week. When he was our only option I was able to convince myself that he was worth a shot. He's not. They likely won't send him anywhere but I'd be really happy if they did.
As for the money, I think the amount that is guaranteed to Skrine would make it possible, so it's not extending him, just changing when he'll receive the check. At least that's how I understood it. As for Skrine himself, even if "only" a nickle corner, he'll be on the field all the time, and he's really good at the position. I wouldn't have a problem committing longer to him if need be.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 28, 2016, 01:25:29 PM
If one of the other 2 show miraculous improvement in the preseason, which is hard to evaluate as a backup, then we'll talk.
Post by: Johnny English on July 28, 2016, 01:28:10 PM
Post by: bojanglesman on July 28, 2016, 01:30:02 PM
Post by: Johnny English on July 28, 2016, 01:30:18 PM
Ask yourself this. Jets are 1 win from the playoffs with 2 games left. Fitz breaks his leg, out for the year. Who do you want playing the last 2 games? Geno, Petty, or Hack? As much as I think Geno sucks, I'd take him out of those 3. I'm not going to let my hatred of him as a starter cloud my judgment that he's probably an OK backup QB, especially at his salary.
If one of the other 2 show miraculous improvement in the preseason, which is hard to evaluate as a backup, then we'll talk.
I haven't seen anything like enough of Petty to answer that question. I have seen enough of Geno to know that he would almost certainly be awful, so right now my answer would be Petty as the possibility of him being decent is currently greater than the possibility of Geno being decent.
The devil you know is not always better.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 28, 2016, 01:30:33 PM
Ask yourself this. Jets are 1 win from the playoffs with 2 games left. Fitz breaks his leg, out for the year. Who do you want playing the last 2 games? Geno, Petty, or Hack? As much as I think Geno sucks, I'd take him out of those 3. I'm not going to let my hatred of him as a starter cloud my judgment that he's probably an OK backup QB, especially at his salary.
If one of the other 2 show miraculous improvement in the preseason, which is hard to evaluate as a backup, then we'll talk.
Anybody but Geno. And frankly if we lose Fitz it barely matters if we make the playoffs before we get obliterated in the wildcard round. We aren't making a real run without Fitz.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 28, 2016, 01:31:49 PM
Didn't we have to release someone to sign Fitz from a roster # standpoint? Not that it makes much difference $-wise, but some scrub gots ta go.
Cimini said it was Tom Hackett the P from Utah.
So no punting competition after all.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 28, 2016, 01:32:43 PM
I haven't seen anything like enough of Petty to answer that question. I have seen enough of Geno to know that he would almost certainly be awful, so right now my answer would be Petty as the possibility of him being decent is currently greater than the possibility of Geno being decent.
The devil you know is not always better.
I guess I'd trust the coaching staff that sees them everyday over my own opinion and they weren't ready to start Petty or Hackenberg before Fitz signed. Obviously they didn't want to start Geno at all, but he was their best choice of the 3.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 28, 2016, 01:32:50 PM
I haven't seen anything like enough of Petty to answer that question. I have seen enough of Geno to know that he would almost certainly be awful, so right now my answer would be Petty as the possibility of him being decent is currently greater than the possibility of Geno being decent.
The devil you know is not always better.
Especially when it's such a terrible devil in Geno Smith
Post by: bojanglesman on July 28, 2016, 01:35:08 PM
Dude just grows hair from every direction.
Post by: Tommy on July 28, 2016, 01:35:13 PM
Like when Bobby Boucher came back at halftime in Waterboy.
I can just imagine Geno's reaction as Fitz walked through that door.
Post by: Tommy on July 28, 2016, 01:36:07 PM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CodgazYXEAEPBBE.jpg)
#shithair
He's using a generic Jets logo pen they give out at events. Humble guy.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 28, 2016, 01:36:19 PM
I guess I'd trust the coaching staff that sees them everyday over my own opinion and they weren't ready to start Petty or Hackenberg before Fitz signed. Obviously they didn't want to start Geno at all, but he was their best choice of the 3.
It's one thing to play a guy for a week or two as a fill in, and another entirely to play him all year. Playing a guy for a short time won't "ruin him" and it gives him some PT to make some plays and some mistakes. Starting the guy and giving him the keys to the franchise long term isn't the right choice for either guy yet. But the hope is it will be soon. At least with Geno if you send him out there and he still sucks balls and you "ruin him" it doesn't freak up your long term plans.
Post by: Miamipuck on July 28, 2016, 02:02:17 PM
He's using a generic Jets logo pen they give out at events. Humble guy.
He should have used the gold pen and gloves that he used in the pic I posted.
Post by: MBGreen on July 28, 2016, 02:12:39 PM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CodgazYXEAEPBBE.jpg)Tormund Fitzgiantsbane
Dude just grows hair from every direction.
There's nothing I love more than the taste of cum.
Post by: Johnny English on July 28, 2016, 02:15:46 PM
Jets QB Ryan Fitzpatrick's deal is for 2 yrs, with voidable (see: phony) 2017. $10M to sign, $2M base. Cap hit = $7M; $5M in dead $ for '17.
No restructuring required. Well played, Mac.
Post by: Libero_2 on July 28, 2016, 02:18:33 PM
Albert Breer @AlbertBreer 2m2 minutes ago
Jets QB Ryan Fitzpatrick's deal is for 2 yrs, with voidable (see: phony) 2017. $10M to sign, $2M base. Cap hit = $7M; $5M in dead $ for '17.
No restructuring required. Well played, Mac.
So if I'm reading that right, he will count $5 million on next years cap, to not be here?
It says us any restructuring now, but an interesting choice by Duff.
Post by: Pope on July 28, 2016, 02:20:02 PM
Albert Breer @AlbertBreer 2m2 minutes agoNice, that's what I was hoping for. 5M dead money next year isn't ideal but it was going to have to come this way or via a restructure elsewhere.
Jets QB Ryan Fitzpatrick's deal is for 2 yrs, with voidable (see: phony) 2017. $10M to sign, $2M base. Cap hit = $7M; $5M in dead $ for '17.
No restructuring required. Well played, Mac.
Post by: Johnny English on July 28, 2016, 02:23:56 PM
So if I'm reading that right, he will count $5 million on next years cap, to not be here?
It says us any restructuring now, but an interesting choice by Duff.
Correct. We don't have much in the way of FA next year either, but there's loads of cuttable stuff. Clady has a $10M hit, Mangold has $9.5M, Marshall has $7.5M, Harris has $6.5M and none of them have any dead money if they're cut. Obviously we're not going to cut all or perhaps any of them, but they'll all be prime candidates for new contracts that lower their hits as they'll be on the downswing of their careers.
Post by: bojanglesman on July 28, 2016, 02:42:05 PM
Albert Breer @AlbertBreer 2m2 minutes ago
Jets QB Ryan Fitzpatrick's deal is for 2 yrs, with voidable (see: phony) 2017. $10M to sign, $2M base. Cap hit = $7M; $5M in dead $ for '17.
No restructuring required. Well played, Mac.
I heard this would be a possibility. I guess this just shaves a little off the cap next year to avoid being forced into a decision on any one player.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on July 28, 2016, 03:27:19 PM
Post by: Libero_2 on July 28, 2016, 04:18:59 PM
Duff playing chess
Initially I preferred to pay a player $5 million who might be here. But if you know all your choices are on the downswing of your career and don't want to risk being forced to keep an asset that you might need to get rid of if you guess poorly, this is the way to do that.
And playing chess is a heck of a way to refer to this shrewd move
Post by: SixFeetDeep on July 29, 2016, 07:00:30 AM
Quote
The new storyline in camp will be Fitzpatrick's battle against his off-season rust. Understandably, he was off his game on the first day, throwing two interceptions in team drills. Let's just say he didn't spend a lot of time partaking in football activities during his contract dispute. He said he stayed in shape by chasing his five kids and playing golf, walking hilly New Jersey courses instead of taking a cart. This will be a process for Fitzpatrick, but he has time.
Fitz Spieth
Post by: Tommy on July 29, 2016, 07:20:03 AM
Fitz Spieth
He's a seasoned veteran. He'll shake off the rust.
Post by: AlioTheFool on July 29, 2016, 08:50:55 AM
Post by: Badger on July 29, 2016, 01:19:12 PM
Post by: Badger on July 29, 2016, 01:28:58 PM
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 01, 2016, 12:55:03 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on August 01, 2016, 12:57:35 PM
Kudos to Duff for getting Mo and Fitz signed. I need to go away more often, good sh*t seems to happen.
Buh bye
Post by: Italian Seafood on August 01, 2016, 01:46:03 PM
Buh bye
Jets are on MNF the week I'm down there this year. Or did you move up here yet?
Post by: Miamipuck on August 01, 2016, 03:36:56 PM
Jets are on MNF the week I'm down there this year. Or did you move up here yet?
I am moving, I honestly don't know when, I am jobless and don't want to add homeless to that list. lol I was hoping mid to late September.
Post by: MBGreen on August 01, 2016, 03:38:47 PM
I am moving, I honestly don't know when, I am jobless and don't want to add homeless to that list. lol I was hoping mid to late September.
Suggestion: get a job at Chick Fil A...and bring some to the tailgate
#bamProfit
Post by: bojanglesman on August 01, 2016, 04:04:00 PM
I am moving, I honestly don't know when, I am jobless and don't want to add homeless to that list. lol I was hoping mid to late September.
Suggestion: get a job at Chick Fil A...and bring some to the tailgateI know he's joking........but.........ummmm.......do it.
#bamProfit
Post by: Badger on August 01, 2016, 07:22:38 PM
http://yi.nzc.am/cH9jE3
Post by: Heismanberg on August 04, 2016, 06:08:10 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on August 09, 2016, 08:41:45 PM
Post by: Badger on August 09, 2016, 09:07:02 PM
Fitz trimmed his beard.
Dead to me
Post by: Miamipuck on August 10, 2016, 02:02:25 PM
Dead to me
If only he was as dreamy as Rex. #iluvrex
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 03, 2016, 03:21:13 PM
Post by: Johnny English on October 03, 2016, 03:22:07 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 03, 2016, 03:38:14 PM
SBTG
You still going to the tailgate when Geno is starting in week 7?
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 04, 2016, 09:06:22 AM
SBTG
I was at a family gathering during the game, and after one of the interceptions my brother was like "Are you ready to give up on Fitz yet?" And I responded "SBTG." He asked "WTF does that mean?" When I answered, everyone laughed. I cried a little inside.
Post by: Johnny English on October 04, 2016, 09:09:27 AM
You still going to the tailgate when Geno is starting in week 7?
Just more incentive to drink.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 04, 2016, 10:09:23 AM
Just more incentive to drink.
I can't argue with this
Post by: Johnny English on October 04, 2016, 10:14:48 AM
I can't argue with this
FWIW, I'm not anything like as down on Fitz as most seem to be and I think he'll be just fine. KC was an absolute horror show, but the whole "9 picks in two games" narrative that has taken hold doesn't stand scrutiny. Of his three picks on Sunday only one was really bad (the throw where Sherman jumped the entirely predictable route); the other two had a pass bouncing off a receiver's hands and into the DB's, and a garbage time pick where the game was already gone and he was throwing desperate low percentage passes to try and get big yards in short time.
I don't think that Fitz will beat himself up too much over Sunday's game and I don't think the coaching staff will either. Seattle are a really good team with an outstanding defense, and Wilson didn't do a single thing wrong. On another day we could have won that game.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 04, 2016, 11:27:16 AM
FWIW, I'm not anything like as down on Fitz as most seem to be and I think he'll be just fine. KC was an absolute horror show, but the whole "9 picks in two games" narrative that has taken hold doesn't stand scrutiny. Of his three picks on Sunday only one was really bad (the throw where Sherman jumped the entirely predictable route); the other two had a pass bouncing off a receiver's hands and into the DB's, and a garbage time pick where the game was already gone and he was throwing desperate low percentage passes to try and get big yards in short time.I actually don't totally disagree. Most of his interceptions have come when the game is already out of hand.
I don't think that Fitz will beat himself up too much over Sunday's game and I don't think the coaching staff will either. Seattle are a really good team with an outstanding defense, and Wilson didn't do a single thing wrong. On another day we could have won that game.
However, if the Jets fall behind, I currently have no confidence in Fitz to make plays when the defense knows Fitz has to throw it down the field. T
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 04, 2016, 11:39:02 AM
There are some good (bad) Fitz GIFs from the Seahawks game in this Twitter chain.
Post by: JFIF on October 04, 2016, 11:54:55 AM
No matter how you slice it 9 interceptions in 2 games is a terrible number and hasn't been done in over 30 years. There have been thousands of trailing quarterbacks in that time span and none of them have managed that feat. Not even the worst of Sanchez. You can make all the excuses you want. It's awful.
Maybe it's just me, but I'm noticing even the little arm strength Fitz had doesn't seem to be there on certain routes anymore. Basically stuff like out routes, where he's torquing his entire body into those throws. I haven't studied it to closely, just a casual observation.
The overarching explanation is "It's Ryan Fitzpatrick and for extended periods of time people forget he's Ryan Fitzpatrick"
Post by: Johnny English on October 04, 2016, 12:09:53 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 04, 2016, 12:19:34 PM
A guy making $12M isn't afforded the luxury of "Well, he is who he is" or "The INTs aren't as bad as they're being made out to be." It's the same thing I've been saying about the $16M corner who is playing like a backup.
That said, both Fitz and Revis do have excuses. We know Revis isn't Revis Island anymore. That he's not getting the help he should is a product of poor coaching. Yes, he should be making plays, given his salary, but you can't pull blood from a stone.
By the same token, Fitz isn't going to win games for you. When you're down by a couple of scores late, he's going to throw risky passes trying to make something happen. More often than not, he's going to fail. That's who he is: a game manager who won't lose a game that they're legitimately in at the end.
Again, the problem with this team right now starts with coaching. Unless it gets better, neither Fitz nor the defense is going to perform to any expectations.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 04, 2016, 12:25:02 PM
The playcalling was atrocious apart from the opening drive. I feel like Hackett is the OC again, where the scripted first drive looks pretty good, then everything else is garbage.
Post by: Johnny English on October 04, 2016, 12:43:43 PM
The postgame team talked about the Sherman INT. It was the same exact playcall as they had just run. Ray Lucas looked like he was going to flip a desk. Basically they were saying "Of course he jumped the route, he had just seen it."
The playcalling was atrocious apart from the opening drive. I feel like Hackett is the OC again, where the scripted first drive looks pretty good, then everything else is garbage.
That would be my main criticism of Fitz from Sunday. It was good that he and Marshall managed to get some early success against Sherman, but you don't get to just abuse a DB that talented for 60 minutes. Take what you can reasonably get, but mix it up. Shead looks like the real deal, but Fitz barely attacked him. The centre of the field is scary with Chancellor, Thomas and Wright all there, but he has to try and find openings.
Again, our lack of a power running game is a huge problem.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 04, 2016, 01:16:52 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on October 04, 2016, 01:24:13 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 04, 2016, 02:05:36 PM
That would be my main criticism of Fitz from Sunday. It was good that he and Marshall managed to get some early success against Sherman, but you don't get to just abuse a DB that talented for 60 minutes. Take what you can reasonably get, but mix it up. Shead looks like the real deal, but Fitz barely attacked him. The centre of the field is scary with Chancellor, Thomas and Wright all there, but he has to try and find openings.
Again, our lack of a power running game is a huge problem.
We also don't really have a safety valve option in the passing attack. When Marshall and Decker are on the field, either one of them, or Enuwa is open.
I read someone say Sherman looked the most physically overmatched of his career Sunday. Even if that's true, it was one-on-one coverage all day. Yet there was no second option for Fitzpatrick. Enuwa disappeared by mid 2nd quarter.
If Decker doesn't return we need ASJ to work out. Really, we need him to work out either way.
Maybe that was Fitz and but the coaches on that particular play. It's not like he stares down receivers and makes dumb plays all by himself. Nah
That's valid criticism, for sure. Still, you're talking about one of the best corners in the sport. If you run the same play against him twice in a row, you're going to pay for it--and deservedly so. We're not even talking about a pass designed to be "only the receiver has a chance", we're talking about a tight window, back-shoulder pass.
I'm going with the consensus of Ray Lucas, Chad Cascadden, and Mike Westhoff--all of whom have been a part of the game since I was a kid--that the problem there was coaching.
You have to think Marshall/Deckers health as well as our retarded QB's holdout have to be key factors in his garbage play
I wouldn't call Fitz retarded. He did right by himself. I do think his holdout, resulting in missed OTAs, is making a difference, but I blame the front office completely for it. Geno Smith can't get on the field after 9 interceptions in 8 quarters. This team was Fitz-or-bust 10 minutes after Buffalo eliminated us from contention but chose to play chicken.
Post by: Johnny English on October 04, 2016, 02:10:13 PM
That's valid criticism, for sure. Still, you're talking about one of the best corners in the sport. If you run the same play against him twice in a row, you're going to pay for it--and deservedly so. We're not even talking about a pass designed to be "only the receiver has a chance", we're talking about a tight window, back-shoulder pass.
I'm going with the consensus of Ray Lucas, Chad Cascadden, and Mike Westhoff--all of whom have been a part of the game since I was a kid--that the problem there was coaching.
Nah, I don't buy that. This isn't a rookie starting his third game we're talking about, where he's under explicit instructions. Fitz is an experienced vet with full control of the field, and it's on him to look off his first read if it's not on. Sherman had tight coverage there and the only reason it worked the previous play was because Marshall got away with an OPI call which was actually called defensive (no call would probably have been fairest given the amount of physical battling between the two of them).
Fitz has to make that read and go to his next option. It's his offense and he has to run it in live action situations.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 04, 2016, 02:25:58 PM
Nah, I don't buy that. This isn't a rookie starting his third game we're talking about, where he's under explicit instructions. Fitz is an experienced vet with full control of the field, and it's on him to look off his first read if it's not on. Sherman had tight coverage there and the only reason it worked the previous play was because Marshall got away with an OPI call which was actually called defensive (no call would probably have been fairest given the amount of physical battling between the two of them).
Fitz has to make that read and go to his next option. It's his offense and he has to run it in live action situations.
But that goes back to what I said about Fitz earlier. You're asking a game manager to make big plays in crunch time, and that's not who he is. When under the gun to make something happen, he's a mess and he tries to make passes he shouldn't.
But he's doing what he's told to do and that's on coaching. Again, I'm not excusing the poor play of a guy collecting 12 million dollars, but you can't ask a guy to do something he's never shown a capability for and expect it to work out.
Post by: Pope on October 04, 2016, 02:30:46 PM
But that goes back to what I said about Fitz earlier. You're asking a game manager to make big plays in crunch time, and that's not who he is. When under the gun to make something happen, he's a mess and he tries to make passes he shouldn't.So we're not supposed to expect our $12M QB to make plays throwing the ball to our excellent group of receivers?
But he's doing what he's told to do and that's on coaching. Again, I'm not excusing the poor play of a guy collecting 12 million dollars, but you can't ask a guy to do something he's never shown a capability for and expect it to work out.
Post by: Johnny English on October 04, 2016, 02:31:29 PM
But that goes back to what I said about Fitz earlier. You're asking a game manager to make big plays in crunch time, and that's not who he is. When under the gun to make something happen, he's a mess and he tries to make passes he shouldn't.
But he's doing what he's told to do and that's on coaching. Again, I'm not excusing the poor play of a guy collecting 12 million dollars, but you can't ask a guy to do something he's never shown a capability for and expect it to work out.
This is exactly what a "game manager" is supposed to do - read the field and take what's on offer, don't try and force things. It wasn't exactly crunch time, we were down by one score with an entire quarter left.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 04, 2016, 03:02:59 PM
So we're not supposed to expect our $12M QB to make plays throwing the ball to our excellent group of receivers?
Does anyone here honestly believe Fitzpatrick is worth $12M on the open market? He cost the Jets $12M because the franchise is inept at selecting a QB in the draft.
This is exactly what a "game manager" is supposed to do - read the field and take what's on offer, don't try and force things. It wasn't exactly crunch time, we were down by one score with an entire quarter left.
The game manager can run plays mistake-free when the team is up two scores. He shouldn't be expected to put the team on his back in the fourth quarter down two or three scores.
We all know what Fitz is: a vastly overpaid backup QB starting for a team that hasn't had a long-term answer at the position in 40 years. Why does everyone conveniently forget?
He's nothing more than SBTG.
Post by: Pope on October 04, 2016, 03:07:46 PM
Post by: Johnny English on October 04, 2016, 03:10:07 PM
Let's drop the stupid SBTG because this stretch is probably as bad or worse than Geno, Sanchez, Tebow, etc
I don't know about that. Fitz makes bad decisions and gets punished. Sanchez panics and loses mental and mechanical control. Geno can't see the field and has no touch, so he ends up over- and underthrowing receivers. They all have their failings, but I have more faith in Fitz to get his yips under control because he has a good mindset.
Post by: MBGreen on October 04, 2016, 03:19:24 PM
Let's drop the stupid SBTG because this stretch is probably as bad or worse than Geno, Sanchez, Tebow, etc
Seconded.
Our QB depth chart is a turd.
Post by: MBGreen on October 04, 2016, 03:20:49 PM
I don't know about that. Fitz makes bad decisions and gets punished. Sanchez panics and loses mental and mechanical control. Geno can't see the field and has no touch, so he ends up over- and underthrowing receivers. They all have their failings, but I have more faith in Fitz to get his yips under control because he has a good mindset.
Fitz was staring down receivers on Sunday. He's an 11 year vet.
Post by: Pope on October 04, 2016, 03:31:39 PM
Edit: Fitz has provided us the best QB play we've had in that time span but we're talking average to below average at best compared to the rest of the league.
Post by: Johnny English on October 04, 2016, 03:56:28 PM
Regardless of their pluses and minuses, every time our QB throws the ball I'm nervous it's an interception. Outside of a few stretches I've felt the same way for a decade now. Our QB inspires no confidence ever.
Edit: Fitz has provided us the best QB play we've had in that time span but we're talking average to below average at best compared to the rest of the league.
That's fair, although most of last season he was pretty good. He was the first Jets QB to have a 2:1 or better TD:INT ratio since Pennington in 2002. It's only the last couple of games he's had a wobble, and we always knew this was going to be a really tough start to the season.
I don't want to think what the Seattle defense would have done to Geno, but I suspect it would have made Fitz's meltdown in KC pale in comparison.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 04, 2016, 04:26:07 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 04, 2016, 04:47:57 PM
Post by: Miamipuck on October 04, 2016, 05:21:09 PM
Let's drop the stupid SBTG because this stretch is probably as bad or worse than Geno, Sanchez, Tebow, etc
I was going to say veto, but I agree completely.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 04, 2016, 05:23:53 PM
Geno Smith is freaking horrendous. Saying Fitz is better than him isn't really saying anything at all
Yes no doubt, I can walk down my block to a horse barn, walk right up to a pile of horseshit and say sbtg and be correct.
Post by: Badger on October 04, 2016, 06:08:09 PM
This is exactly what a "game manager" is supposed to do - read the field and take what's on offer, don't try and force things. It wasn't exactly crunch time, we were down by one score with an entire quarter left.
Even if he did exactly this we could easily still be 1-3.
Post by: Badger on October 04, 2016, 06:08:49 PM
Let's drop the stupid SBTG because this stretch is probably as bad or worse than Geno, Sanchez, Tebow, etc
Cool sample size bro
Post by: Johnny English on October 04, 2016, 06:10:38 PM
Even if he did exactly this we could easily still be 1-3.Absolutely. I think that this play was his one egregious error on Sunday, but the fact is that Seattle are a better team than us (and most of the other teams in the league) and Wilson was outstanding.
Post by: Tommy on October 04, 2016, 06:16:41 PM
Post by: Badger on October 04, 2016, 06:20:26 PM
Wtf is SBTG?
Sheldon Richardson
Post by: Miamipuck on October 04, 2016, 06:23:26 PM
Wtf is SBTG?
Subterranean Ginny
Post by: Johnny English on October 04, 2016, 06:23:58 PM
Wtf is SBTG?Sheldon, Bentley, Teenager, Gun
Post by: Pope on October 04, 2016, 06:29:09 PM
Cool sample size broI'm not extrapolating his stats on the season. I'm saying that Fitz was given the money to make smart decisions with the football. He's been awful outside of Buffalo and as a result the Jets have the worst turnover margin in the league.
I'm not advocating Geno or Petty start. It's just that Fitz's play is unacceptable considering the win-now state of our roster.
Post by: Badger on October 04, 2016, 08:08:48 PM
I'm not extrapolating his stats on the season. I'm saying that Fitz was given the money to make smart decisions with the football. He's been awful outside of Buffalo and as a result the Jets have the worst turnover margin in the league.
I'm not advocating Geno or Petty start. It's just that Fitz's play is unacceptable considering the win-now state of our roster.
If we do extrapolate his stats over the whole season, he would break the Jets single season INT record. So he's got that going for him.
Post by: Fenwyr on October 05, 2016, 11:18:44 AM
Even with the Sherman pick, Fitz did enough to win against Seattle. Wilson was just better, and our D made him look like the GOAT.
Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 05, 2016, 11:28:45 AM
Wait... Fitz was awful against Cincy?He completed 54% of his passes and averaged 5.4 yards per attempt. He wasn't terrible, but you called his performance great, when it was far from great. He also had several inaccurate throws.
Even with the Sherman pick, Fitz did enough to win against Seattle. Wilson was just better, and our D made him look like the GOAT.
Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
Post by: Andrew Ryan on October 05, 2016, 02:02:19 PM
Post by: JFIF on October 05, 2016, 02:14:07 PM
Wtf is SBTG?
I don't know what it is either.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 05, 2016, 02:15:02 PM
Did someone actually describe his performance against the Bengals as great?http://www.jetoffensive.com/index.php/topic,3254.msg233635.html#msg233635
Quote from: fenwyr
Fitz has had 2 great game, 1 good game, and 1 really bad game. Talking about benching him is freaking stupid at this point.
I'm assuming that the Chiefs and Seahawks games weren't considered great...
Post by: Pope on October 05, 2016, 02:53:47 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on October 05, 2016, 03:36:53 PM
Did someone actually describe his performance against the Bengals as great?
Compared to his recent body of work it was great
Post by: Coach K on October 06, 2016, 11:20:34 AM
SBTG = Still Better Than Geno
Lololol
Post by: Andrew Ryan on October 07, 2016, 11:20:56 AM
http://www.jetoffensive.com/index.php/topic,3254.msg233635.html#msg233635
I'm assuming that the Chiefs and Seahawks games weren't considered great...
I don't know which is worse, referring to his Bengals performance as great or his Seahawks performance as good...
Post by: Miamipuck on October 07, 2016, 12:13:54 PM
I don't know which is worse, referring to his Bengals performance as great or his Seahawks performance as good...
Yes
Post by: nyjunc on October 18, 2016, 09:36:26 AM
(https://media.giphy.com/media/10JhviFuU2gWD6/giphy.gif)
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 18, 2016, 09:39:50 AM
Post by: Tommy on October 18, 2016, 09:48:18 AM
Where's that pee wee coach that told me how fitz was on his way to becoming the next rich Gannon?
(https://media.giphy.com/media/10JhviFuU2gWD6/giphy.gif)
Where were you all last season when he consistently proved you wrong and broke Jets QB records?
Post by: Miamipuck on October 18, 2016, 09:49:56 AM
Post by: MBGreen on October 18, 2016, 11:42:39 AM
Post by: Laxin on October 18, 2016, 03:11:00 PM
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 18, 2016, 03:13:12 PM
Can Fitzpatrick hold out now?
Not if we extend him first
Post by: Jumbo on October 18, 2016, 05:01:27 PM
Post by: Pope on October 18, 2016, 05:09:47 PM
Where's that pee wee coach that told me how fitz was on his way to becoming the next rich Gannon?Lmao
(https://media.giphy.com/media/10JhviFuU2gWD6/giphy.gif)
Post by: Johnny English on October 18, 2016, 10:13:13 PM
http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2016/10/a_day_later_jets_todd_bowles_leaves_open_possibili.html
At this point I'm ready to see Geno start. He's excrement and I know he's excrement, but apparently there are a lot of Jets fans who think that he should be starting. I'm ready for him to prove it once and for all, so we can all move the freak on.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 18, 2016, 10:58:54 PM
At this point I'm ready to see Geno start. He's excrement and I know he's excrement, but apparently there are a lot of Jets fans who think that he should be starting. I'm ready for him to prove it once and for all, so we can all move the freak on.I think everyone here knows Geno is excrement. The thing is, Fitz has the worst QB rating in the NFL out of every starter. Worse than Blaine Gabbert, too. Don't like that stat, find one that shows he should retain his job. Last in completion %. He's arguably looked worse via the eye test.
Yes, Geno is excrement, but we literally have the worst QB play out of every team in the NFL through 6 games.
Post by: Pope on October 18, 2016, 11:31:22 PM
Post by: Coach K on October 19, 2016, 05:56:09 AM
I don't mind giving Geno a game or two but after that we absolutely must see what we have in Petty
Barring Geno playing for his life, petty should be prepped to start put of the bye week
Post by: dcm1602 on October 19, 2016, 09:02:01 AM
Quote
Jets coach Todd Bowles admitted aggravation with Geno Smith's pre-game comments to ESPN's Lisa Salters on Monday.
Smith intimated he was unhappy to be riding the bench, and that he should get a shot over struggling starter Ryan Fitzpatrick, something that indeed happened against the Cardinals. "I don't have any thoughts on backup players saying anything," Bowles said. "They're backups for a reason. If they get a chance to play, they'd better prove themselves to be worthy of playing regardless of who they are." Yikes. Smith's words combined with his mini-sideline temper tantrums — not to mention his awful play — mean Fitz will probably get one more chance under center.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 19, 2016, 09:55:23 AM
Barring Geno playing for his life, petty should be prepped to start put of the bye week
While I'd generally agree with starting a new QB out of a bye, sending a young project out there for a nationally televised game against the Pats in his first appearance is a recipe for disaster.
Post by: Coach K on October 19, 2016, 11:08:08 AM
While I'd generally agree with starting a new QB out of a bye, sending a young project out there for a nationally televised game against the Pats in his first appearance is a recipe for disaster.
We don't have time to kid glove a 4th Rd project . He's either going to show enough promise to stay away from QB in the draft, prove he can compete with Hack next yr , or prove he belongs as a 2nd string guy .
Unless we're going to nosedive with geno then start hack or petty blindly next yr, which I don't like
Post by: dcm1602 on October 19, 2016, 11:27:33 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 19, 2016, 11:55:19 AM
We don't have time to kid glove a 4th Rd project . He's either going to show enough promise to stay away from QB in the draft, prove he can compete with Hack next yr , or prove he belongs as a 2nd string guy .
Unless we're going to nosedive with geno then start hack or petty blindly next yr, which I don't like
I'd much rather start him before the bye. Preferably against, say, Cleveland. Give him a fighting chance at least.
Barring injuries, what are the odds Fitzpatrick starts another game this year?
I'd say none unless Geno is a colossal failure on Sunday and they don't feel Petty is ready.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 20, 2016, 12:47:48 AM
My guess is the Jets won't release Fitz until the playoffs are a mathematical impossibility (or if they could trade him for a late pick). But it doesn't make much sense to keep him if he isn't going to play.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 20, 2016, 10:18:37 AM
I don't really foresee them releasing Fitz until after the season either way. Is there any financial benefit to cutting him now as opposed to in February? Thinking about it, cutting him would push some of next year's money forward and send us over the cap, wouldn't it?
Looking at spotrac, his "cap hit" this year is $7M. His hit in 2017 is $5M. His "dead cap" in 2016 is $12M. So has the whole $12M already counted or is the extra $5M of that against next year unless he gets cut before the end of the season?
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 20, 2016, 10:25:19 AM
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 20, 2016, 10:29:04 AM
I thought the Jets handled the Fitz contract negotiations pretty well this offseason. Should have known the fact that the other 31 teams didn't want anything to do with him at his asking price tag was a telltale sign that it wasn't a great signing. He was still by far our best option to win this season, but he might have forced us into overdrafting Hackenburg and delaying the inevitable of us still having to find a long term solution. Plus we have to deal with his cap hit for next year.
I feel the opposite.
It was a foregone conclusion that Fitz was who the Jets wanted, and no one else wanted Fitz. Rather than have OTAs to work together, Fitz was sitting home ignoring messages from his two closest friends on the team.
Financially, it was brilliant by Fitzpatrick's team. In every other way it was terrible for both sides.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on October 20, 2016, 10:33:36 AM
I feel the opposite.
It was a foregone conclusion that Fitz was who the Jets wanted, and no one else wanted Fitz. Rather than have OTAs to work together, Fitz was sitting home ignoring messages from his two closest friends on the team.
Financially, it was brilliant by Fitzpatrick's team. In every other way it was terrible for both sides.
So we should have given him $16 mill to get him into camp? He was really the only option ever for the Jets unless you wanted to ride with Geno.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 20, 2016, 10:40:21 AM
So we should have given him $16 mill to get him into camp? He was really the only option ever for the Jets unless you wanted to ride with Geno.
Long before the 11th hour deal, Fitz flat out said he'd be willing to come in on a one year deal. Maccagnan didn't even want to entertain the discussion.
In the end, they gave him a "one year" deal.
I agree he was the only option. Which is why they should have negotiated something a lot sooner. Instead, both sides dug in and played chicken. And everyone lost. Except Fitz still pockets $12M.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 20, 2016, 01:49:28 PM
I doubt they'll release Fitz before Petty is absolutely ready for meaningful snaps. Imagine the shitstorm if Geno gets hurt and they have to put in Petty before he practices?I'm not talking about the financial benefit. Fitzpatrick is a sunk cost. I'm talking about the problem of carrying 4 quarterbacks. If we are 2-8, what's the point of having Ryan Fitzpatrick on the team? I'd rather have a developmental player that could potentially help us in 2017.
I don't really foresee them releasing Fitz until after the season either way. Is there any financial benefit to cutting him now as opposed to in February? Thinking about it, cutting him would push some of next year's money forward and send us over the cap, wouldn't it?
Looking at spotrac, his "cap hit" this year is $7M. His hit in 2017 is $5M. His "dead cap" in 2016 is $12M. So has the whole $12M already counted or is the extra $5M of that against next year unless he gets cut before the end of the season?
I agree they can't really do anything until Petty is ready, but once Petty is ready, I don't see a reason to keep Fitz around.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 20, 2016, 02:13:33 PM
I'm not talking about the financial benefit. Fitzpatrick is a sunk cost. I'm talking about the problem of carrying 4 quarterbacks. If we are 2-8, what's the point of having Ryan Fitzpatrick on the team? I'd rather have a developmental player that could potentially help us in 2017.
I agree they can't really do anything until Petty is ready, but once Petty is ready, I don't see a reason to keep Fitz around.
Again, I really don't understand how the cap works, but thinking about it now that $5M is dead money against next year's total whether we cut him now or not, right? In that case, you're right, we should cut him whenever we have two viable QBs to play.
My thinking was that his cap total would balloon from $7M to $12M against this year's cap if we were to cut him, but his number is $7M guaranteed this year, and $5M guaranteed next year I guess.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 23, 2016, 10:01:39 PM
Maybe people stopped believing in you because you were the worst quarterback in the NFL for the last 4 games?
Stupid, whiny comment.
Post by: ons on October 23, 2016, 10:04:07 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on October 23, 2016, 10:37:39 PM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CvgEAMYWEAAaAAG.jpg)
Maybe people stopped believing in you because you were the worst quarterback in the NFL for the last 4 games?
Stupid, whiny comment.
He wasnt even good today
Post by: mj2sexay on October 23, 2016, 11:45:22 PM
Post by: MBGreen on October 24, 2016, 04:59:21 AM
Post by: Badger on October 24, 2016, 07:08:09 AM
Post by: Hemi on October 24, 2016, 09:01:28 AM
Post by: dcm1602 on October 24, 2016, 10:15:39 AM
SBTG
I'm not convinced thus applies to Fitz
Post by: Jumbo on October 24, 2016, 10:16:40 AM
Post by: Badger on October 24, 2016, 10:19:28 AM
I'm not convinced thus applies to Fitz
It will never not apply.
Post by: ukilledkenny on October 24, 2016, 10:21:38 AM
Post by: Badger on October 24, 2016, 10:23:07 AM
He's even better at whining than Geno.
Recency bias
Post by: Koz on October 24, 2016, 10:27:44 AM
Post by: steves850 on October 24, 2016, 10:46:36 AM
This team hates white men.
#whiteqbsmatter
Post by: Tommy on October 24, 2016, 11:09:54 AM
Post by: MBGreen on October 24, 2016, 11:39:09 AM
Lining up in the freaking shotgun on the 3 yrd line in the red zone to hand it off is some dcm level stupidity.
Post by: ukilledkenny on October 24, 2016, 12:14:55 PM
Recency bias
Haha I just like it when you can't pretend to be above it all which is mainly in Geno and rex discussions.
Post by: Badger on October 24, 2016, 12:31:36 PM
Haha I just like it when you can't pretend to be above it all which is mainly in Geno and rex discussions.
Then you'll love my next post.
Post by: Jumbo on October 24, 2016, 01:56:03 PM
i think Gailey's retarded spread offense and zone blocking scheme is the root of the problem.
Lining up in the freaking shotgun on the 3 yrd line in the red zone to hand it off is some dcm level stupidity.
I wouldn't be so quick to complain about Gailey considering how awful our previous basically every offensive coordinators have been. Overall he's been above average, IMO
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 24, 2016, 03:10:38 PM
I wouldn't be so quick to complain about Gailey considering how awful our previous basically every offensive coordinators have been. Overall he's been above average, IMOAgreed. Gailey is far from perfect, and I make fun of his playcalling at times. But in general, I like him and want him around next year.
Post by: MBGreen on October 24, 2016, 04:24:07 PM
Post by: Johnny English on October 24, 2016, 06:01:35 PM
Post by: dcm1602 on October 24, 2016, 06:12:38 PM
I'm with MB on this. The scheme is very one dimensional, it's very predictable and it's easy for DCs to plan for. When it succeeds it does so not because the defense doesn't know what's coming or how to deal with it, but because our skill players win matchups. Gailey isn't putting us into a position to win.
The scheme isn't great.
But we also have holes all over on offense
Our offensive line, running back, and te all aren't special
It's hard to be multidimensional when your entire offense is a past due Brandon Marshall
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 24, 2016, 06:15:35 PM
Post by: Johnny English on October 24, 2016, 06:22:48 PM
The scheme isn't great.
But we also have holes all over on offense
Our offensive line, running back, and te all aren't special
It's hard to be multidimensional when your entire offense is a past due Brandon Marshall
I don't completely agree with your assessment of the players, but if you're right then that's all the more reason to actually mix it up. If you've only got one good weapon then you need to use the scheme to do different things and make sure they don't load up against your one outlet, and disguise it when you do want to use that weapon.
Post by: Johnny English on October 24, 2016, 06:26:19 PM
So how long is Fitz out there before we go to Petty? I'd rather see Petty out there, but Fitz probably gives us a better chance to win right now. But we know that a Fitz team could implode at any moment.
If you pull Fitz for Petty at this stage you can never go back to him. The next three weeks are the Browns, Dolphins and Rams, then we have a bye followed by the Patriots. If Fitz wins at least two of those three, which he really should, then he's locked in as the starter for the rest of the season. If he doesn't, then do you give Petty his first NFL start against probably the best team in the league? Doesn't seem like a great idea.
I don't see Petty starting for any reason other than injury before week 13, which is home to Indy.
Post by: dcm1602 on October 24, 2016, 07:47:49 PM
So how long is Fitz out there before we go to Petty? I'd rather see Petty out there, but Fitz probably gives us a better chance to win right now. But we know that a Fitz team could implode at any moment.
It's absolutely gotta be right after the bye week
Petty has been hurt a while, hasn't practiced. It's gonna take a few weeks to get him in the mix
Even immediately following the bye is no guarantee
Post by: dcm1602 on October 24, 2016, 07:49:58 PM
If you pull Fitz for Petty at this stage you can never go back to him. The next three weeks are the Browns, Dolphins and Rams, then we have a bye followed by the Patriots. If Fitz wins at least two of those three, which he really should, then he's locked in as the starter for the rest of the season. If he doesn't, then do you give Petty his first NFL start against probably the best team in the league? Doesn't seem like a great idea.
I don't see Petty starting for any reason other than injury before week 13, which is home to Indy.
It makes no sense to lock in Fitz.
He's 100% gone after this year. So it makes sense we spend some time evaluating Petty. Maybe we just say freak it and throw in hack week 17
Post by: Johnny English on October 24, 2016, 07:54:47 PM
It makes no sense to lock in Fitz.
He's 100% gone after this year. So it makes sense we spend some time evaluating Petty. Maybe we just say freak it and throw in hack week 17
Except that if you start Petty for the next two games and he's dreadful, you're fucked. There's nowhere to go. You've lost Fitz and you've lost the locker room.
Bowles probably isn't coaching for his job, but a 4 win season puts an awful lot of pressure on him next year. We're about to go into what should be an easier run of games, and Bowles has to go with what he thinks gives us the best chance of winning. Based on Fitz's performances so far this season you could have made an argument for Geno, although I'd still disagree with it, but I don't think you can make a sensible argument that Petty gives us a better chance of beating Cleveland, Miami and LA than Fitz.
Post by: dcm1602 on October 24, 2016, 07:58:47 PM
Except that if you start Petty for the next two games and he's dreadful, you're fucked. There's nowhere to go. You've lost Fitz and you've lost the locker room.
Bowles probably isn't coaching for his job, but a 4 win season puts an awful lot of pressure on him next year. We're about to go into what should be an easier run of games, and Bowles has to go with what he thinks gives us the best chance of winning. Based on Fitz's performances so far this season you could have made an argument for Geno, although I'd still disagree with it, but I don't think you can make a sensible argument that Petty gives us a better chance of beating Cleveland, Miami and LA than Fitz.
You don't put Petty in soon
You said if he wins 2 of 3 he should start the rest of the season.
I'm saying Petty should play at the absolute minimum the last 4 weeks of the season
Post by: Johnny English on October 24, 2016, 08:08:25 PM
You don't put Petty in soon
You said if he wins 2 of 3 he should start the rest of the season.
I'm saying Petty should play at the absolute minimum the last 4 weeks of the season
Why? That seems to be somewhat arbitrary with no real thought process other than "I want to have a look at Petty". The last four games are @ 49ers, home to Miami, @ New England and home to Buffalo. What if Fitz has won four of the previous five (not entirely unfeasible given the schedule)? We'd be 6-6 with the season on the line and a good roll going, and you'd put in a rookie just because you want to see how he looks?
Post by: Badger on October 24, 2016, 08:17:07 PM
Why? That seems to be somewhat arbitrary with no real thought process
dcm mode engaged
Post by: Laxin on October 24, 2016, 08:38:41 PM
Except that if you start Petty for the next two games and he's dreadful, you're fucked. There's nowhere to go. You've lost Fitz and you've lost the locker room.
Bowles probably isn't coaching for his job, but a 4 win season puts an awful lot of pressure on him next year. We're about to go into what should be an easier run of games, and Bowles has to go with what he thinks gives us the best chance of winning. Based on Fitz's performances so far this season you could have made an argument for Geno, although I'd still disagree with it, but I don't think you can make a sensible argument that Petty gives us a better chance of beating Cleveland, Miami and LA than Fitz.
We're fucked regardless. This season is shot anyway. The only way to save it is to have one of the young QBs play decently well to where they can be pencilled in as the starter next year. Other than that, nothing can save this season. Who cares if you "lose" Fitz by starting Petty? He's already whining like a little bitch and seems lost already, I dont think starting Petty is going to really change anything.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 24, 2016, 08:44:21 PM
we can do better than Gailey...you guys need to stop settling for mediocrity
Nah we need more tackle eligible for 1 yard.
Post by: dcm1602 on October 24, 2016, 08:58:19 PM
Why? That seems to be somewhat arbitrary with no real thought process other than "I want to have a look at Petty". The last four games are @ 49ers, home to Miami, @ New England and home to Buffalo. What if Fitz has won four of the previous five (not entirely unfeasible given the schedule)? We'd be 6-6 with the season on the line and a good roll going, and you'd put in a rookie just because you want to see how he looks?
Considering that we only have like a 6% chance of making the playoffs, I think its highly probable were out of playoff contention by week 12.
Also the thought of the Jets (a 2-5 team) going 4-1 in our next 5 games is absolutely laughable.
If were in the playoff race of course you let Fitz ride it out , but thats extremely unlikely.
And if youre out of the playoffs you let Petty go out there for a few games.
Fitz has been the worst QB in the league, and Geno is fucked. Which means we gotta start figuring out who the freak is going to play QB next year. Letting Petty audition for the final 4 weeks is a really damn good idea.
Post by: Johnny English on October 24, 2016, 09:02:32 PM
Considering that we only have like a 6% chance of making the playoffs, I think its highly probable were out of playoff contention by week 12.
Also the thought of the Jets (a 2-5 team) going 4-1 in our next 5 games is absolutely laughable.
Why is it? Have you watched any of the teams that we're playing in the next 5 games? With the exception of the Patriots they're none of them very good. Teams go on runs all the time.
Quote
If were in the playoff race of course you let Fitz ride it out , but thats extremely unlikely.
And if youre out of the playoffs you let Petty go out there for a few games.
So in other words, you agree that it's a decision based on context and therefore impossible to take right now.
Quote
Fitz has been the worst QB in the league, and Geno is fucked. Which means we gotta start figuring out who the freak is going to play QB next year. Letting Petty audition for the final 4 weeks is a really damn good idea.
But you've just agreed that it depends on context, and now you're saying it doesn't. Do you have the first clue what you actually think or not?
Post by: dcm1602 on October 24, 2016, 09:14:39 PM
Why is it? Have you watched any of the teams that we're playing in the next 5 games? With the exception of the Patriots they're none of them very good. Teams go on runs all the time.
So in other words, you agree that it's a decision based on context and therefore impossible to take right now.
But you've just agreed that it depends on context, and now you're saying it doesn't. Do you have the first clue what you actually think or not?
Your context was if we win 2/3 hes locked in for the rest of the season
I guess were both clueless for not waiting for context
At least my assumption is based on probability
To MAYBE make the playoffs we have to finish 8-1
7-2 gives us a low % chance of making it
Which teams that start 1-5 do all the time right
Post by: Johnny English on October 24, 2016, 09:23:15 PM
Your context was if we win 2/3 hes locked in for the rest of the season
I guess were both clueless for not waiting for context
At least my assumption is based on probability
To MAYBE make the playoffs we have to finish 8-1
7-2 gives us a low % chance of making it
Which teams that start 1-5 do all the time right
And I explained why Fitz is likely the starting QB for the rest of the season if he gets at least a couple of wins from the next three games.
I don't think it's all that likely that we make the playoffs, but you do know the last time a team finished in the playoffs after a 1-5 start, don't you? (Clue: it was last year.)
Post by: dcm1602 on October 25, 2016, 09:00:36 AM
Post by: Johnny English on October 25, 2016, 09:18:12 AM
Post by: dcm1602 on October 25, 2016, 10:33:27 AM
Even without the playoffs, it's Bowles' job to win as many as possible. 8-8 after a 1-5 start against a schedule that everyone knew was extremely difficult wouldn't be a bad return for him at all.
Is it also not his and our GMs job to manage our roster and talent? To figure out who is going to play the most important position on our team
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 25, 2016, 01:02:22 PM
That said, Fitz should start until the team is out of contention. There's nothing to go back to if Petty fails now. You're stuck with Petty the rest of the way whenever they finally go to him. And the locker room will be a mess because the vets will then be certain that the organization has given up on the year.
I'm of two minds on Gailey. On the one hand, his scheme won games last year with a QB that isn't that good. On the other, it either gets too cute when it shouldn't or is completely predictable. I also didn't like seeing the comment that they didn't use blocking TEs against Arizona because "they didn't practice that during the week." Your tight ends that are only good at blocking didn't practice the only thing they're actually good at, and so you can't use them for that during a game?
Post by: Johnny English on October 25, 2016, 01:09:52 PM
Is it also not his and our GMs job to manage our roster and talent? To figure out who is going to play the most important position on our team
Sure, with the aim of winning the most games possible. Right now that means Fitz, because Petty will have barely had any reps with the first team. So now we go to Fitz with Petty as backup, and if Fitz shits the bed again you pick the right time to introduce Petty, and if he doesn't excrement the bed too badly you roll with him until you're out of contention for anything, and then you maybe think about giving Petty some starts.
You don't arbitarily decide in week 8 that your starting QB from week 14 on will be the rookie.
Post by: Johnny English on October 25, 2016, 01:11:14 PM
What Fitz said the other day was dickish (and I'm pretty sure that even though he included Bowles and Duff in it that the comment was directed mostly at Woody). It was as bad as anything Geno has said in the past.
I'll be honest, I don't quite understand why people are so upset about what he said. I think it's fairly obvious that when you pull your starting QB it's because you've lost faith in him. He didn't seem to me to be complaining too much about it, just saying that he still believed in himself.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 25, 2016, 01:15:49 PM
I'll be honest, I don't quite understand why people are so upset about what he said. I think it's fairly obvious that when you pull your starting QB it's because you've lost faith in him. He didn't seem to me to be complaining too much about it, just saying that he still believed in himself.
In fairness, I didn't hear it myself, I only saw it in print.
It just appeared petulant. I expect speeches like that from Geno, but not Fitz. I don't care a lot, but it still wasn't the right way to handle the issue, and far from what I expect from Ryan Fitzpatrick.
Post by: dcm1602 on October 25, 2016, 03:00:38 PM
Sure, with the aim of winning the most games possible. Right now that means Fitz, because Petty will have barely had any reps with the first team. So now we go to Fitz with Petty as backup, and if Fitz shits the bed again you pick the right time to introduce Petty, and if he doesn't excrement the bed too badly you roll with him until you're out of contention for anything, and then you maybe think about giving Petty some starts.
You don't arbitarily decide in week 8 that your starting QB from week 14 on will be the rookie.
Bad teams mix up their roster just to evaluate talent the time when the season is lost
This season is lost.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 25, 2016, 03:16:25 PM
Bad teams mix up their roster just to evaluate talent the time when the season is lostThe season won't be mathematically lost for a few more games, considering we have an easy schedule in our next 3 games. Combine that with the fact that Petty has barely been practicing, and Fitzpatrick is pretty much the only option to go to right now. However, once it's clear the Jets have no chance at the playoffs (i.e. 7-8 losses), or if Fitz plays like he did in Weeks 1-6, you pretty much need to pull the plug on him and play the young guys.
This season is lost.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 25, 2016, 03:18:30 PM
Bad teams mix up their roster just to evaluate talent the time when the season is lost
This season is lost.
To us it might be. The organization can't say the same thing though. Veteran players will be in full-on mutiny if they stop trying to win games now. They're coming off a win, and "only" have 5 losses. If they run the table they're in the playoffs, and that's how they have to view the season.
We'll see the young players soon enough, but it won't be for a while.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 25, 2016, 03:58:56 PM
I'll be honest, I don't quite understand why people are so upset about what he said. I think it's fairly obvious that when you pull your starting QB it's because you've lost faith in him. He didn't seem to me to be complaining too much about it, just saying that he still believed in himself.
Bro he threw 11 picks in 4 weeks and sucked so bad that Geno was brought in for him. He had the worst stats of any starting Qb in the NFL. He was monumentally bad and he shows no freaking balls with that gripe to the media about being pulled.
Here's an idea, man up and own your putrid play rather than whine like a bitch. That whining session to the media was as insulting to the fans as it was a pity party. I don't know how that bitch had any kids, he showed no balls that bullshit, freak him he can't get away from this franchise soon enough.
oh and JE,......... gfy, no niceties till we meet again. Lmao
Post by: Johnny English on October 25, 2016, 04:01:35 PM
Bro he threw 11 picks in 4 weeks and sucked so bad that Geno was brought in for him. He had the worst stats of any starting Qb in the NFL. He was monumentally bad and he had the freaking balls to gripe to the media about being pulled. Here's an idea, man up and own your putrid play rather than whine like a bitch. That whining session to the media was as insulting to the fans as it was a pity party. I don't know how that bitch had any kids, he showed no balls that bullshit, freak him he can't get away from this franchise soon enough.
oh and JE,......... gfy, no niceties till we meet again. Lmao
See, I didn't see that as a pity party or as griping about being pulled. I believe he was saying that he still had faith in his own ability even if everyone else had lost theirs, not that they were wrong for having done so. I'll have to dig up the interview and watch it again.
Post by: Miamipuck on October 25, 2016, 04:03:10 PM
See, I didn't see that as a pity party or as griping about being pulled. I believe he was saying that he still had faith in his own ability even if everyone else had lost theirs, not that they were wrong for having done so. I'll have to dig up the interview and watch it again.
I saw it as something he should tell his wife and not us, the fans.
Post by: Badger on October 25, 2016, 07:42:47 PM
I'll be honest, I don't quite understand why people are so upset about what he said.
Because Jets fans create drama and then complain about the circus.
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 26, 2016, 03:25:44 PM
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 26, 2016, 03:57:11 PM
Post by: Derek Smalls on October 26, 2016, 04:22:04 PM
Brandon Marshall is awesome. I don't care how you feel about Fitz, the loyalty he has towards him is just amazing. Marshall has come a long way since he entered the league. I hope even after he retires he continues to speak out about mental illness.Gotta love B-Marsh. One of my favorite Jets players in a while.
And this team really loves making custom t-shirts...
Post by: dcm1602 on October 27, 2016, 11:37:59 AM
Brandon Marshall is awesome. I don't care how you feel about Fitz, the loyalty he has towards him is just amazing. Marshall has come a long way since he entered the league. I hope even after he retires he continues to speak out about mental illness.
Wasn't Marshall saying good things about Geno too though?
Post by: Tommy on October 27, 2016, 12:16:16 PM
Wasn't Marshall saying good things about Geno too though?
He's just being a good teammate. Gotta respect that.
Post by: AlioTheFool on October 27, 2016, 12:43:44 PM
He's just being a good teammate. Gotta respect that.
Yeah, he was clearly just being a good teammate. Besides, he also made the "punching adversity in the face" quip.
Post by: Badger on September 25, 2020, 10:21:32 AM
Post by: Heismanberg on September 25, 2020, 10:58:59 AM
Post by: Derek Smalls on September 25, 2020, 12:17:21 PM
Fitz is one of my favorite NFL players ever.I hated him at the end of his last season here. But I love him for the first 1.5 years. Someone shared the video clip of him getting snuck up on by Mangold and I loved it.
Post by: Libero_2 on September 25, 2020, 12:18:20 PM
He's always fun to watch.
Post by: MBGreen on September 25, 2020, 12:25:33 PM
The guy builds up your hopes and then shits on them. He's probably the worst offender of this in the league.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 25, 2020, 12:31:23 PM
Fitz is a bum.
The guy builds up your hopes and then shits on them. He's probably the worst offender of this in the league.
I think the only people he fooled were you and dcm
Post by: MBGreen on September 25, 2020, 12:33:55 PM
I think the only people he fooled were you and dcm
just like you were fooled by Bowles.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 25, 2020, 12:47:59 PM
just like you were fooled by Bowles.
Actually I was right In predicting that Bowles was a better coach than whoever would succeed him
Post by: Laxin on September 25, 2020, 01:08:19 PM
Actually I was right In predicting that Bowles was a better coach than whoever would succeed him
This is sad because that bar was quite low.
Post by: MBGreen on September 25, 2020, 01:26:49 PM
Actually I was right In predicting that Bowles was a better coach than whoever would succeed him
So it's your fault then....noted.
Post by: SixFeetDeep on September 25, 2020, 01:29:54 PM
So it's your fault then....noted.
I was cool with hiring anyone else besides Gase. Even Mike McCarthy
Post by: MBGreen on September 25, 2020, 02:07:48 PM
I was cool with hiring anyone else besides Gase. Even Mike McCarthy
I wanted Chuck Noll