Jet Offensive
Collegiate Football => The NFL Draft => Topic started by: Heismanberg on October 27, 2018, 04:57:34 PM
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Defensive Ends:
Nick Bosa – Ohio State
Brian Burns – Florida State
Montez Sweat – Mississippi State
Clelin Ferrell - Clemson
Charles Omenihu - Texas
Defensive Tackles:
Ed Oliver – Houston
Quinnen Williams - Alabama
Dexter Lawrence - Clemson
Christian Wilkins - Clemson
Jeffrey Simmons – Mississippi State
Hybrids:
Nick Bosa – Ohio State
Josh Allen – Kentucky
Brian Burns - Florida State
Clelin Ferrell – Clemson
Montez Sweat - Mississippi State
Linebackers:
Devin White – LSU
Devin Bush - Michigan
Mack Wilson - Alabama
Vosean Joseph - Florida
Blake Cashman - Minnesota
Corners:
Greedy Williams – LSU
Amani Oruwariye - Penn State
Byron Murphy - Washington
Trayvon Mullen - Clemson
Justin Layne - Michigan State
Safeties:
Darnell Savage - Maryland
Nasir Adderley - Delaware
Taylor Rapp - Washington
Deionte Thompson – Alabama
Chauncey Gardner-Johnson - Florida
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4.6.19
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Devin White is the best player in college football, in my opinion. He should be a Heisman finalist.
Freakish talent at linebacker.
If the majority of the underclassmen declare, this will be the best defensive draft class I've ever seen. There's an elite prospect at every position. Defensive Line is absolutely loaded.
This is the year we could finally get our pass rusher.
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How do you not have Rashan Gary on there?
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How do you not have Rashan Gary on there?
Because the other guys are better. That's how good this group is.
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Because the other guys are better. That's how good this group is.
Ferrell's the guy I've seen most as I seem to get every Clemson game, and he's terrific.
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Ferrell's the guy I've seen most as I seem to get every Clemson game, and he's terrific.
Every player on Clemson's defensive line could go in the first round, but they won't.
I never thought I'd have a top five list without Christian Wilkins and Dexter Lawrence, but it's such a great class.
Alabama and Clemson have unreal DL talent.
There's a mid-major EDGE prospect named Sutton Smith that plays at Northern Illinois. He's amazing and will probably be an All-American, but he is not even top ten prospect as a pass rusher on paper because of his measurables. Someone will get a good one with him as well.
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Every player on Clemson's defensive line could go in the first round, but they won't.
I never thought I'd have a top five list without Christian Wilkins and Dexter Lawrence, but it's such a great class.
Alabama and Clemson have unreal DL talent.
There's a mid-major EDGE prospect named Sutton Smith that plays at Northern Illinois. He's amazing and will probably be an All-American, but he is not even top ten prospect as a pass rusher on paper because of his measurables. Someone will get a good one with him as well.
Let me go the other way and tell you who I think is criminally overrated - Chase Winovich. The pundits seem to be in love with him and I've seen him projected as a potential first round pick, but I don't see it. A good motor and a smiley post game interview style does not make for a first round pick, IMO. Someone's going to freak up on him.
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Let me go the other way and tell you who I think is criminally overrated - Chase Winovich. The pundits seem to be in love with him and I've seen him projected as a potential first round pick, but I don't see it. A good motor and a smiley post game interview style does not make for a first round pick, IMO. Someone's going to freak up on him.
I don't like him. He's not athletic and he's slow. Hopefully the Pats* draft him.
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Give me Farrell or Burns
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Quinnen Williams was absolutely dominant against LSU
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Quinnen Williams was absolutely dominant against LSU
Top 5 pick, probably a top 3 pick, and is coming for Ed Oliver’s derriere
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Started watching some highlights of the top edge rushers yesterday. No real takeaways (other than Josh Allen and Jachai Polite are fast as hell, and Clelin Ferrell is really, really good).
However, Polite's Twitter handle is @RetireMoms which would be the best Twitter handle for a Jets draft pick since Sheldon Richardson's @GodForShort.
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Started watching some highlights of the top edge rushers yesterday. No real takeaways (other than Josh Allen and Jachai Polite are fast as hell, and Clelin Ferrell is really, really good).
However, Polite's Twitter handle is @RetireMoms which would be the best Twitter handle for a Jets draft pick since Sheldon Richardson's @GodForShort.
I think we're going to end up with Josh Allen.
Josh Allen sacking Josh Allen for the next few years?
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I think we're going to end up with Josh Allen.
Josh Allen sacking Josh Allen for the next few years?
In theory, I love the idea of Josh Allen. Closest thing we've had to John Abraham since we traded him. And every time I saw Kentucky this season, he was making huge plays in key spots, which is always good to see.
Watching the highlight film, I was a little less impressed because on several of the so-called highlights, he literally wasn't touched. But it was a highlight film, so it certainly wasn't any deep dive. And it's easy to create a highlight when you aren't blocked. Looking forward to watching some of the "all plays" breakdowns over the next few months.
Last year, I pretty much only watched QB films. This year, I look forward to watching the edge rushers and some of the OL like Williams, Edwards and Cajuste.
That said, there are some decent WRs in this draft, too. Not sure any are worthy of top-5 picks, but I like N'Keal Harry a lot.
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In theory, I love the idea of Josh Allen. Closest thing we've had to John Abraham since we traded him. And every time I saw Kentucky this season, he was making huge plays in key spots, which is always good to see.
What's starting to separate Allen from guys like Ferrell, Polite, Sweat, and Burns is his ability to drop and move around in the open field. For a dude his size, he has some insane closing speed and coverage ability.
Last year, I pretty much only watched QB films. This year, I look forward to watching the edge rushers and some of the OL like Williams, Edwards and Cajuste.
OT is cloudy for me. I need to see if Jawaan Taylor is the real deal. That kid is the top tackle in this class if he can move at all.
That said, there are some decent WRs in this draft, too. Not sure any are worthy of top-5 picks, but I like N'Keal Harry a lot.
I like Harry a lot, but I prefer DK Metcalf and Hakeem Butler right now. Antoine Wesley is really intriguing too.
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I really want Hakeem Butler on this team. I just don't see any way that happens unless we trade down in the 1st to recoup a 2nd.
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I've watched a lot of OT and OLB cut-ups tonight. I want Josh Allen on this team over every player in this draft besides Nick Bosa.
Difference maker. He creates havoc. He can defend the run, drop into coverage, and generate a ton of pressure off the edge.
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I love Jachai Polite as a pass rushing prospect, but Josh Allen has more production and way better measurables.
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I love Jachai Polite as a pass rushing prospect, but Josh Allen has more production and way better measurables.
Watched a little bit of Polite today. Looks like a freakish athlete, but there have been several times where he's failed to hold up on the edge. Allen is a much safer every-down OLB. He drops back in coverage and holds his own. Polite seems to be more of a one-trick pony in that if he's not pinning his ears back and going after the QB, he's not nearly as good. He's great at pass rushing, but Allen is better at everything else.
Really curious how the NFL combine goes for these guys. Edge rusher is a spot where I think the combine matters more than most positions.
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My dude Sutton Smith declared
Mid-round gold
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I've watched a lot of OT and OLB cut-ups tonight. I want Josh Allen on this team over every player in this draft besides Nick Bosa.
Difference maker. He creates havoc. He can defend the run, drop into coverage, and generate a ton of pressure off the edge.
I've also been on board with this for a few weeks (admittedly way too early, and will likely change a dozen times).
For the Jets, and assuming we have a top 5 pick, Bosa right now is my #1 target on his own tier.
He's followed in a little tier consisting of JAllen and best OT who perhaps rises to level of top-5-pick during draft process/combine (Jonah or GLittle).
That's followed by a tier consisting of best available edge rusher (Polite, maybe Ferrell) and Greedy Williams.
Gun to my head, and I have to bet right now on who we get....Josh Allen or OT. Any DC will drool over Allen's versatility and skillset.
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Honest question, say the Jets sign Jadeveon Clowney in free agency pre-draft. Then Bosa and/or Allen are on the board whenever the Jets pick in the draft. Do you guys still take one of them, trade down, or go with a player on the offensive side of the ball?
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Honest question, say the Jets sign Jadeveon Clowney in free agency pre-draft. Then Bosa and/or Allen are on the board whenever the Jets pick in the draft. Do you guys still take one of them, trade down, or go with a player on the offensive side of the ball?
I think trade down should be the option no matter what happens in FA.....we don't have a 2019 2nd rd pick
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Honest question, say the Jets sign Jadeveon Clowney in free agency pre-draft. Then Bosa and/or Allen are on the board whenever the Jets pick in the draft. Do you guys still take one of them, trade down, or go with a player on the offensive side of the ball?
There is next to zero chance that Clowney doesn't sign a long term deal or get tagged by Houston.
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There is next to zero chance that Clowney doesn't sign a long term deal or get tagged by Houston.
I should have been a little more clear. I only mentioned Clowney because he's fresh in my mind from this past week.
There are a number of pass-rushing threats that will become available when free agency starts, assuming the Jets get one of them--Clowney or otherwise--what should the Jets do?
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I should have been a little more clear. I only mentioned Clowney because he's fresh in my mind from this past week.
There are a number of pass-rushing threats that will become available when free agency starts, assuming the Jets get one of them--Clowney or otherwise--what should the Jets do?
Trade down depends upon what's on offer. I still don't think I'd want us to pass up a blue chip defensive player to overreach for a tackle though.
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Honest question, say the Jets sign Jadeveon Clowney in free agency pre-draft. Then Bosa and/or Allen are on the board whenever the Jets pick in the draft. Do you guys still take one of them, trade down, or go with a player on the offensive side of the ball?
You can never have enough pass rushers in today's NFL, but trading down is going to always be my top pick as long as we get adequate compensation for it since we're missing that 2nd rounder. We have too many holes to not want as many chances to fill them as possible.
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Starting to put way more focus into watching 4-3 defenders now that Gregg Williams is our DC.
Texas DE Charles Omenihu is outstanding. He has elite size and pass rushing traits. I think we could see him sneak into the backend of the first round if he has a solid combine.
Florida LB Vosean Joseph would be a good fit here. New Mexico State S/LB Terrill Hanks is another Cover 2 type backer that I really like.
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Starting to put way more focus into watching 4-3 defenders now that Gregg Williams is our DC.
Texas DE Charles Omenihu is outstanding. He has elite size and pass rushing traits. I think we could see him sneak into the backend of the first round if he has a solid combine.
Florida LB Vosean Joseph would be a good fit here. New Mexico State S/LB Terrill Hanks is another Cover 2 type backer that I really like.
Does Josh Allen fit into a 4-3 scheme? There's a chance Q.Williams and Bosa could be taken ahead of our pick.
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Does Josh Allen fit into a 4-3 scheme? There's a chance Q.Williams and Bosa could be taken ahead of our pick.
In a 4-3, I’d prefer Clelin Ferrell over Josh Allen.
Ed Oliver is also intriguing.
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In a 4-3, I’d prefer Clelin Ferrell over Josh Allen.
Ed Oliver is also intriguing.
As much as Q.Williams would be a good pick for us, i'd like to get a DE that can rush the passer.
I'll beat this drum right up until the end of april, i really hope we can trade back.
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As much as Q.Williams would be a good pick for us, i'd like to get a DE that can rush the passer.
I'll beat this drum right up until the end of april, i really hope we can trade back.
After Bosa (an elite 4-3 DE prospect), Ferrell is probably the best pure 4-3 end.
Strictly as a pass-rusher, Polite would be a great fit too, and he’s likely a better athlete than Clelin. He’s basically Cujo let loose on the qb...that’s his main function.
Ferrell is more well-rounded, and had top consistent production. Always gets the job done, rushing the passer and setting the edge. Probably my favorite target if we trade down to 7-10 area.
I still prefer Quinnen over Ferrell or Polite, though, as he looks like such a special, game-wrecking prospect.
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So prospect question
Chris Slayton DT Syracuse
I watch every Cuse game and I have watched this guy dominate week in and week out. He does the dirty work on the inside taking on constant double teams so that the DEs can get 1 on 1 chances and rack up the sacks. He is capable of pushing the pocket at times. He’s a 4-3 only guy in my eyes.
My question is where does he fall as a prospect in this class that’s loaded on the DL? I think he will end up as a 4th rounder, but I’m biased towards him. What do other people think? I would be plenty happy bypassing a top DT and filling another slot at the top and adding a guy like Slayton later on.
The last Cuse DT that was drafted, Jay Bromley, was a 3rd rounder by the Giants. I thought he was over drafted at the time, and I firmly believe that Slayton is much better than Bromley was.
What do people think about him?
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There’s 3 elite prospects in this draft:
Bosa
Quinnen
Josh Allen
We should take 1 of those 3
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https://mobile.twitter.com/marcus_mosher/status/1093170044115259398
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There’s 3 elite prospects in this draft:
Bosa
Quinnen
Josh Allen
We should take 1 of those 3
I’m not so sure Josh Allen is an elite prospect
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I’m not so sure Josh Allen is an elite prospect
I think he’s behind Bosa/Quinnen, but in terms of EDGE prospects to come out in the last 5 or so years, I would put him at the bottom of that elite tier. Not many guys I can think of that I would put over Allen after Von Miller, Clowney, Bosa, Mack, etc. Combine will be huge for him to cement his status.
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Right now Nick Bosa is the only player in the draft that I would be mad that we passed on (unless it’s for a monster trade down). There are reasons/arguments to be made against Quinnen/Allen, but I don’t think there are any against Bosa.
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I’m not so sure Josh Allen is an elite prospect
Is the Citrus Bowl really that long ago?
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I think he’s behind Bosa/Quinnen, but in terms of EDGE prospects to come out in the last 5 or so years, I would put him at the bottom of that elite tier. Not many guys I can think of that I would put over Allen after Von Miller, Clowney, Bosa, Mack, etc. Combine will be huge for him to cement his status.
Clelin Ferrell might be a better EDGE prospect than Josh Allen.
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Clelin Ferrell might be a better EDGE prospect than Josh Allen.
I can see an argument for Ferrell as a better traditional 4-3 DE, but I think Allen has elite player type upside and I would rather have him at 3. I do think Allen is a better fit for the 3-4, and a lot of my strong opinion of him was formed while watching him while we still ran a 3-4.
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McShay has Josh Allen going 2 to 49ers in his 2.0 mock release today. Has him listed as an OLB, but comments on his position below.
“The Niners really want an edge rusher after only DeForest Buckner cracked six sacks for them in 2018 (Buckner had 12). Allen blew up offensive linemen all season en route to 17 sacks and 21.5 tackles for loss (TFL) for the Wildcats. With his big 6-foot-5, 260-pound frame, Allen could line up as a defensive end in the 49ers' 4-3 scheme if he tacks on some more weight.”
I don’t see any reason why whichever team drafts Allen can’t use him the same way that OAK used Khalil Mack in his All Pro DE/OLB season. Allen might be better at dropping into coverage.
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I can see an argument for Ferrell as a better traditional 4-3 DE, but I think Allen has elite player type upside and I would rather have him at 3. I do think Allen is a better fit for the 3-4, and a lot of my strong opinion of him was formed while watching him while we still ran a 3-4.
This is my thinking as well.
Allen has fantastic upside and versatility, while Ferrell has a high, safe floor as a plug-an-play professional 4-3 end.
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Random observation:
When looking at EDGE players, once you get past the first 3 rounds and the premium prospects, it looks like a lot of the best mid round guys are in the 240-260 lb range and appear likely to be best suited to 3-4 OLB roles.
For example: Maxx Crosby, Jalen Jelks, DAndre Walker, Shareef Miller, Brailford, Granderson
I have Austin Bryant and Anthony Nelson as solid 4-3 DE prospects, but they could could go in rounds 3/4 if there’s a big run on EDGE guys. Conversely we might be able to score a guy like Joe Jackson/Zach Allen/Omenihu in round 3 if they get pushed down due to the depth of the class.
TLDR- Can any of the guys I mentioned “for example” play DE in our scheme? Help me out with some 4-3 defensive end prospects that can be had in rounds 3-5.
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Omenihu is a serious sleeper to rise up into the first two rounds.
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Thoughts on Brian Burns? Idk if I should be worried about his weight, but the dude can rush the passer. He'll probably light up the combine.
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Thoughts on Brian Burns? Idk if I should be worried about his weight, but the dude can rush the passer. He'll probably light up the combine.
I’m concerned about his weight as well but we do have to take into account that he’s a freak. His frame should allow for him to get up into the 240s+ with a year or 2 in an NFL weight training program. Some guys just have that inherent skill to get to the QB and Burns is absolutley one of those guys. He might have the best bend out of any EDGE rusher in this class.
I’ve struggled to find a comp for him so far, the two I have- Von Miller and Vic Beasley- don’t really feel like they fit his game too well. Anyways, both of those guys weighed in at the combine at 246.
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I’m concerned about his weight as well but we do have to take into account that he’s a freak. His frame should allow for him to get up into the 240s+ with a year or 2 in an NFL weight training program. Some guys just have that inherent skill to get to the QB and Burns is absolutley one of those guys. He might have the best bend out of any EDGE rusher in this class.
I’ve struggled to find a comp for him so far, the two I have- Von Miller and Vic Beasley- don’t really feel like they fit his game too well. Anyways, both of those guys weighed in at the combine at 246.
I agree he might have the best bend out of the group. Might be the most athletic as well, and he's crazy long. If he played around 250+ I think he might be in the discussion for our pick.
I can't really think of a comp... maybe Randy Gregory?
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I agree he might have the best bend out of the group. Might be the most athletic as well, and he's crazy long. If he played around 250+ I think he might be in the discussion for out pick.
I can't really think of a comp... maybe Randy Gregory?
Gregory is a great comp, body type wise.
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Aaron Maybin
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Aaron Maybin
Maybin was the Gholston of speed rushers. Guy had no athleticism or instincts. He had 1 move that he wasn’t even good at
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Maybin was the Gholston of speed rushers. Guy had no athleticism or instincts. He had 1 move that he wasn’t even good at
No athleticism?
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No athleticism?
He was very fast in a straight line. So was gholston for his size. Both were allergic to getting blocked
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https://twitter.com/nfl/status/1100561605098500097
Jamal on LSU Campus with Greedy Williams. Tiger pit is dope, First Round Board is dope
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I’m concerned about his weight as well but we do have to take into account that he’s a freak. His frame should allow for him to get up into the 240s+ with a year or 2 in an NFL weight training program. Some guys just have that inherent skill to get to the QB and Burns is absolutley one of those guys. He might have the best bend out of any EDGE rusher in this class.
I’ve struggled to find a comp for him so far, the two I have- Von Miller and Vic Beasley- don’t really feel like they fit his game too well. Anyways, both of those guys weighed in at the combine at 246.
• Brian Burns
HT: 6-4 6/8
WT: 249
Hand: 10
Arm: 33 7/8
I was not expecting this
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• Brian Burns
HT: 6-4 6/8
WT: 249
Hand: 10
Arm: 33 7/8
I was not expecting this
If he performs well, we could see him slide into the Top 10.
His biggest competition is probably Polite.
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I’m concerned about his weight as well but we do have to take into account that he’s a freak. His frame should allow for him to get up into the 240s+ with a year or 2 in an NFL weight training program. Some guys just have that inherent skill to get to the QB and Burns is absolutley one of those guys. He might have the best bend out of any EDGE rusher in this class.
I’ve struggled to find a comp for him so far, the two I have- Von Miller and Vic Beasley- don’t really feel like they fit his game too well. Anyways, both of those guys weighed in at the combine at 246.
https://mobile.twitter.com/movethesticks/status/1102239958000033793
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Nick Bosa 29 reps 4.79 33.5" VJ 9'8" BJ 7.10 3cone 4.14 SS
Joey Bosa 24 reps 4.86 32" VJ 10' BJ 6.89 3cone 4.21 SS
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Nick Bosa 29 reps 4.79 33.5" VJ 9'8" BJ 7.10 3cone 4.14 SS
Joey Bosa 24 reps 4.86 32" VJ 10' BJ 6.89 3cone 4.21 SS
So what you are saying is that Nick is stronger, slightly faster but not quite as agile as Joey was when he came out?
Sign me up man. We would all take that cornerstone if he was available to us
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I'm getting nervous about Josh Allen knowing that he's kind of a one trick pony from a pass rush perspective. Did guys like Khalil Mack and Von Miller have inside/counter moves coming out of college?
I'm starting to feel like the better comp is Dante Fowler, Vic Beasley, Aaron Maybin, Bud Dupree, Dee Ford
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From @gmfb: #Michigan DL Rashan Gary’s labrum tear has teams doing extra homework on his shoulder. Most believe he can put off surgery for a year.
Hopefully this take him off our board
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From @gmfb: #Michigan DL Rashan Gary’s labrum tear has teams doing extra homework on his shoulder. Most believe he can put off surgery for a year.
Hopefully this take him off our board
I wouldn't count on it, considering Gary is the Christian hackenberg of d-line prospects.
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I'm getting nervous about Josh Allen knowing that he's kind of a one trick pony from a pass rush perspective. Did guys like Khalil Mack and Von Miller have inside/counter moves coming out of college?
I'm starting to feel like the better comp is Dante Fowler, Vic Beasley, Aaron Maybin, Bud Dupree, Dee Ford
I think Aldon Smith is a pretty fair comparison, with a little Akeem Ayers sprinkled in, off ball. Smith had a raw rush repertoire coming into the league.
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...
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Akeem Ayers is a great comparison
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Akeem Ayers is a great comparison
You're not really selling him as a prospect for the #3 pick with that. If you want Akeem Ayers you can have him, he's a free agent who has already had more clubs than Jack Nicklaus and he isn't even 30 yet.
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You're not really selling him as a prospect for the #3 pick with that. If you want Akeem Ayers you can have him, he's a free agent who has already had more clubs than Jack Nicklaus and he isn't even 30 yet.
I’m not trying to sell him as a prospect.
I prefer Williams, Oliver, Metcalf, Burns, and Taylor over Allen.
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I’m not trying to sell him as a prospect.
I prefer Williams, Oliver, Metcalf, Burns, and Taylor over Allen.
I know. I was saying that I think you're being a little harsh on Allen - Ayers was never really that much of a pass rushing threat. Allen had more sacks last year than Ayers had in his entire college career.
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I know. I was saying that I think you're being a little harsh on Allen - Ayers was never really that much of a pass rushing threat. Allen had more sacks last year than Ayers had in his entire college career.
I don’t care very much about production in college.
Neither player is a true pass rusher. They are do-it-all off ball LBs.