Jet Offensive
The Rest Of The Sports World => You Don't Know Football => Topic started by: Heismanberg on September 15, 2014, 07:53:05 PM
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(http://i.imgur.com/PoHhKHq.png)
This is beyond terrible
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Every game. Every player. Every play. No actual play calls. No relevance.
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I couldn't even try to understand this.
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I couldn't even try to understand this.
They have Eli Manning ranked as the #7 QB in the NFL, ahead of his brother and Russell Wilson.
That's all you really have to understand to see how stupid those rankings are.
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They have Eli Manning ranked as the #7 QB in the NFL, ahead of his brother and Russell Wilson.
That's all you really have to understand to see how stupid those rankings are.
Funny you mention Eli specifically because he was the one I looked at and said to myself, how the freak is he number 7 at anything right now? I hate Romo, but 31st or whatever? Christ. Tannehill second? C'mon
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(http://i.imgur.com/PhjSY5g.png)
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Good thing these guys aren't picking stocks.
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I don't care, I love them. They beat sitting Andrew Luck against Jacksonville.
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Ryan Quigley earned the highest grade for a punter in any game so far this season. GOAT grading system
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Ryan Quigley earned the highest grade for a punter in any game so far this season. GOAT grading system
Quigley was uncharacteristically awesome yesterday.
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Quigley was uncharacteristically awesome yesterday.
Yes Quigley was quite believably the best punting game in the league yesterday.
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Ryan Quigley earned the highest grade for a punter in any game so far this season. GOAT grading system
Lol he was a freaking beast in that game. Now if he did that every week he could keep the job till he dies lol
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It's really sad how much we're talking about the punter's performance this week.
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(http://i.imgur.com/EkVGGkg.png)
Aaron Rodgers: 19/22 for 255 yards, 3 TD, 0 INT, 154.5 passer rating.
Pass grade: -0.1.
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(http://i.imgur.com/EkVGGkg.png)
Aaron Rodgers: 19/22 for 255 yards, 3 TD, 0 INT, 154.5 passer rating.
Pass grade: -0.1.
You don't understand just how bad those 3 incompletions were man
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Considering that all the other players with pass ratings are guards and tackles and excrement.
I assume that they're following/calculating something different
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Bowman led the NFL with 154 tackles this season despite receiving a negative grade from Pro Football Focus.
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I think tackles are a bit of an overrated stat. If you have a shitty d-line, your second level guys are going to get more shots at tackles. Doesn't make them better. I think they mean something, but how much is anyone's guess. Maybe missed tackles or some sort of ratio of tackles to total chances would mean more.
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PFF sucks
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I think tackles are a bit of an overrated stat. If you have a shitty d-line, your second level guys are going to get more shots at tackles. Doesn't make them better. I think they mean something, but how much is anyone's guess. Maybe missed tackles or some sort of ratio of tackles to total chances would mean more.
All I know is bowman is a good linebacker and should at least have a positive grade. Maybe he was slowed down this year coming back from injury but the tackles were there and he made the pro bowl.
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All I know is bowman is a good linebacker and should at least have a positive grade. Maybe he was slowed down this year coming back from injury but the tackles were there and he made the pro bowl.
Yeah but still.
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http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/feature/25577288/in-the-line-of-fire
Article about O-lineman being bashed by outsiders. Here's a good blurb from o-linemen about why PFF isn't a good barometer for rating them. I didn't know Cris Collinsworth was an owner of PFF.
Let's talk about Pro Football Focus since it is a group that grades players -- and you guys -- and it is featured on Sunday Night Football in large part because Cris Collinsworth is an owner. Assignment-wise, can they possibly know what your assignment is on each play?
Massie: No. They don't know the play. They don't know what each lineman has to do.
Long: If you turn on the film, you can see it's a zone concept. But there may be a Bob concept in there. There may be a wham concept in there. There may be we're booking this guy. We're not going to block him. But on film, it might look like Bobby Massie didn't even touch the guy. When in reality, Bobby went and got the linebacker and put him on the safety. And Cris Collinsworth doesn't know that.
Richburg: We were talking about when a running back gives up a sack that it's automatically our fault because nobody knows what the assignment is. If the quarterback is down, it's our fault.
Could you watch each other's tape and know what the assignments should be?
Long: Probably not because I am not in their O-line room.
Warmack: People come across as very knowledgeable about things they don't know to make their jobs more important in value. Nobody wants to ask questions anymore to try and learn from somebody who actually does the job themselves. I feel like there's a lot of arrogance in the field like they come across as they know when they've never played the position at all. If somebody asked them if they played the position at all, they would be offended by it.
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Wasn't there a time when PFF was actually taken seriously? I just never understood how you could apply sabemetrics-style ratings for football players when there are an insane number of factors that affect even the simplest of plays.
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Wasn't there a time when PFF was actually taken seriously? I just never understood how you could apply sabemetrics-style ratings for football players when there are an insane number of factors that affect even the simplest of plays.
It was. It was the first to apply #'s to performances and such and I think in the beginning the graders were better. Now their ratings are all over the place and tough to gauge what the freak they're looking at.
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http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/feature/25577288/in-the-line-of-fire
Article about O-lineman being bashed by outsiders. Here's a good blurb from o-linemen about why PFF isn't a good barometer for rating them. I didn't know Cris Collinsworth was an owner of PFF.
I have been saying this stuff for years. There's no possible way they can accurately grade performances because they do not know the plays, the assignments, or the game.
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I have been saying this stuff for years. There's no possible way they can accurately grade performances because they do not know the plays, the assignments, or the game.
And the speed that they produce their results just doesn't make sense. Like, how many people do you need watching each film to produce legit, comprehensive reports in 3 days? Especially when they say that everything is "triple checked by the experts on staff."
A single play in a single game takes how long to break down? Let's do some unnecessary math.
You have 22 players, each being evaluated on every snap, so that means you have to watch each guy probably what, three times minimum? Let's say two guys in the room, one O and one D, so 33 views per play. BUT, before one could even do that he needs to get the offensive and defensive formations, the coverage, stunts, the blocking scheme, the routes, and the players on the field. To get all of that we're probably talking watching the plays an additional 4 or so times if you have multiple people in the room. So we're now looking at a very conservative estimate of 35 views per snap. Factor in that each offense runs an average of about 65 plays per game, times two teams, and we need 4550 views per game. Not a bad day's work, especially when each play probably takes about seven seconds, so each game takes about nine hours to review for two people (factoring in a short pee break).
GTFO with all of that.
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And the speed that they produce their results just doesn't make sense. Like, how many people do you need watching each film to produce legit, comprehensive reports in 3 days? Especially when they say that everything is "triple checked by the experts on staff."
A single play in a single game takes how long to break down? Let's do some unnecessary math.
You have 22 players, each being evaluated on every snap, so that means you have to watch each guy probably what, three times minimum? Let's say two guys in the room, one O and one D, so 33 views per play. BUT, before one could even do that he needs to get the offensive and defensive formations, the coverage, stunts, the blocking scheme, the routes, and the players on the field. To get all of that we're probably talking watching the plays an additional 4 or so times if you have multiple people in the room. So we're now looking at a very conservative estimate of 35 views per snap. Factor in that each offense runs an average of about 65 plays per game, times two teams, and we need 4550 views per game. Not a bad day's work, especially when each play probably takes about seven seconds, so each game takes about nine hours to review for two people (factoring in a short pee break).
GTFO with all of that.
At this point, I imagine those PFF people do that full time.
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Even if they are doing it full time, there's no way they can accurately grade the positions.
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And even if they have multiple experts working full time, and had a good knowledge of the schemes, 10 different people will grade the same play ten different ways for each position - professional scouts are sure to pick up on different things that each player does and grade them differently. Detailed scouting reports without number grades attached would actually be useful - the number grades make PFF worse than worthless.
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The Jets have PFF's 18th best group of corners.
https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-ranking-all-32-nfl-cornerback-groups/
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The Jets have PFF's 18th best group of corners.
https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-ranking-all-32-nfl-cornerback-groups/
That's fair, I guess.
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I think we're better than that honestly but I'm not bothered by it. Figure Revis is top 5 at the position and Skrine is a top 10 slot corner. Just that alone should put is in the top third but PFF tends to dislike our players
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That's fair, I guess.
We're in the bottom half of the league?
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The problem is the gaping hole we have at CB2. Revis is still an elite corner, but Skrine is far better as a nickle than outside. I know a lot people love Marcus Williams, but to me he's another in a long line of corners that look good in limited action but will be exposed with a higher number of snaps. After that we just have question marks who don't stay healthy.
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I don't think improving on Cromarties CB2 play from last season is outlandish
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I don't think improving on Cromarties CB2 play from last season is outlandish
Apart from Revis, who is definitely better than Cromartie (regardless of whatever you feel about his play last year)?
Williams maybe but I'm leery of him after exposure. Skrine may do well outside under Bowles but his history says he's better as a nickle. After that, we have a group that struggles just to get on the field, never mind how they play once out there.
In a perfect world, Williams excels with the opportunity outside and Skrine can continue in his role from last year. But that's far from a sure thing. That's why we don't deserve to be ranked in the top half of the league at the position, no matter how good Revis is.
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Apart from Revis, who is definitely better than Cromartie (regardless of whatever you feel about his play last year)?
Williams maybe but I'm leery of him after exposure. Skrine may do well outside under Bowles but his history says he's better as a nickle. After that, we have a group that struggles just to get on the field, never mind how they play once out there.
In a perfect world, Williams excels with the opportunity outside and Skrine can continue in his role from last year. But that's far from a sure thing. That's why we don't deserve to be ranked in the top half of the league at the position, no matter how good Revis is.
Cro's problem was that he took too many chances and tried to make up for it with athleticism. Basically he was trying to make the big play and suffered in short/intermediate coverage because of it. Last year he couldn't make up for it anymore and still didn't make the big plays.
My hope is that between Williams and Skrine, they can be better in short/intermediate coverage than Cro. They may not get a ton of interceptions, but Cro didn't do that last year anyway. I do think Williams may not do as well as last year because he won't be facing 3rd WRs anymore.
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Cro's problem was that he took too many chances and tried to make up for it with athleticism. Basically he was trying to make the big play and suffered in short/intermediate coverage because of it. Last year he couldn't make up for it anymore and still didn't make the big plays.
My hope is that between Williams and Skrine, they can be better in short/intermediate coverage than Cro. They may not get a ton of interceptions, but Cro didn't do that last year anyway. I do think Williams may not do as well as last year because he won't be facing 3rd WRs anymore.
Cro was playing hurt last year too. I'm not saying his play can't be replaced, I'm just leery. I like Williams, but we've seen more than our fair share of guys who look great in limited play then get blown away when asked to start.
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Cro was playing hurt last year too. I'm not saying his play can't be replaced, I'm just leery. I like Williams, but we've seen more than our fair share of guys who look great in limited play then get blown away when asked to start.
Isn't there still a chance we bring him back on a vet minimum?
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Isn't there still a chance we bring him back on a vet minimum?
Yes. Not likely though. Probably would have to have injuries, poor performance in camp, etc. Bringing him back delays the youth movement.
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https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-5-worst-nfl-quarterback-contracts/
Eli Manning has the worst contract of any QB in the NFL, apparently. Despite having a cap hit of less than $20M a year and playing probably as well as he has ever played.
I think that PFF genuinely hates New York teams. The idea that Eli's contract is worse than, say, Kaepernick's is insane.
Edit: Eli's cap hit is actually a little over $22M a year. In context though that's still decent value relative to a number of others in the league.
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That website sure took a nosedive in respectability the last few years.
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In a surprising example of PFF being actually not excrement, they have produced their team of the last ten years and the Jets are well represented with two obvious candidates and one pretty surprising one:
https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-pff-all-decade-team/
QB is amusing, obvious saltiness is ensuing in the comments, on Twatter and on /r/nfl.
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In a surprising example of PFF being actually not excrement, they have produced their team of the last ten years and the Jets are well represented with two obvious candidates and one pretty surprising one:
https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-pff-all-decade-team/
QB is amusing, obvious saltiness is ensuing in the comments, on Twatter and on /r/nfl.
That's a pretty well done list.
Mangold's selection reminds me of excrement I took a few years back (here or YDKF) for saying Mangold was a future HoFer. He'll make Canton someday.
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That's a pretty well done list.
Mangold's selection reminds me of excrement I took a few years back (here or YDKF) for saying Mangold was a future HoFer. He'll make Canton someday.
I feel like that didn't happen.
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I feel like that didn't happen.
It definitely did.
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It definitely did.
Not to my knowledge.
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Not to my knowledge.
Okay.
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I feel like that didn't happen.
Not with this group, anyways
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Not with this group, anyways
Oh it most certainly did. I'm not going to blow people up though. The story just reminded me and was amusing so I posted about it.
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Oh it most certainly did. I'm not going to blow people up though. The story just reminded me and was amusing so I posted about it.
are you sure it didn't happen on TGG or JI?
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are you sure it didn't happen on TGG or JI?
It was probably on Jetshuddle.com
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are you sure it didn't happen on TGG or JI?
He was just telling his son about it the other day on Twitter.
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It didn't happen here. I can't find anything.
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are you sure it didn't happen on TGG or JI?
Absolutely certain. It was likely YDKF. It was a while back. I've never even been to JI.
He was just telling his son about it the other day on Twitter.
Cute.
It didn't happen here. I can't find anything.
Is this really that big a deal? Why would I waste time making up something like this? If I were going to tell stories, I'd make Hornet's look pale by comparison.
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Is this really that big a deal? Why would I waste time making up something like this? If I were going to tell stories, I'd make Hornet's look pale by comparison.
whoa hey...that's holy ground.
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Is this really that big a deal? Why would I waste time making up something like this? If I were going to tell stories, I'd make Hornet's look pale by comparison.
If there's a chance to embarrass one of the dickheads here, including you, then freak yes it's a very very big freaking deal.
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If there's a chance to embarrass one of the dickheads here, including you, then freak yes it's a very very big freaking deal.
Hahahaha, fair enough.
I don't have anything to be embarrassed about. I said he was a HoFer years ago.
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Hahahaha, fair enough.
I don't have anything to be embarrassed about. I said he was a HoFer years ago.
I love the fact you more worried about the embarrassed part and don't deny the Dickhead part. It's a perfect example why this place is so fun.
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Hahahaha, fair enough.
I don't have anything to be embarrassed about. I said he was a HoFer years ago.
I'm sure you did. It's just hard to imagine anyone disagreeing with you, except maybe dcm because he's nothing if not a contrarian. I feel like you might have imagined having this argument, because I can't think that anyone on here would have been interested in taking the other side.
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I'm sure you did. It's just hard to imagine anyone disagreeing with you, except maybe dcm because he's nothing if not a contrarian. I feel like you might have imagined having this argument, because I can't think that anyone on here would have been interested in taking the other side.
On the outside chance one of us did, let's find the idiot.
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I love the fact you more worried about the embarrassed part and don't deny the Dickhead part. It's a perfect example why this place is so fun.
If I claimed to not be a dick it would make me a liar.
I'm sure you did. It's just hard to imagine anyone disagreeing with you, except maybe dcm because he's nothing if not a contrarian. I feel like you might have imagined having this argument, because I can't think that anyone on here would have been interested in taking the other side.
It wasn't specifically a thread about his Canton eligibility. It was an offhand comment related to something else (it may have been regarding Sanchez and the protection he'd been receiving but I can't recall that clearly at this point).
The only reasons I even remember it were:
1) who one of the people that said something was (and no I'm not saying who)
2) I couldn't believe anyone, much less a fellow Jets fan, was making a case that he wasn't a sure thing
On the outside chance one of us did, let's find the idiot.
I'm figuring that if you can't find it here it must have been YDKF. I'm almost certain it was during Sanchez's tenure.
I realize I'm setting off the bullshitometer here, but it is what it is. It would be the most ridiculous thing I've ever bothered to fabricate and I fooled a woman into marrying me.
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Nick Mangold sucks.
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I suggest that unless Alio gives us a name we just assume it was dcm.
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https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-how-all-31-first-rounders-have-played-this-preseason/
20. Darron Lee, OLB, Jets (Ohio State)
Snaps: 65
Key stat: Two missed tackles in each game
Running with: Second team
Lee has played extensive snaps in both preseason games; so far, his grading profile matches his college marks, with a positive coverage grade but below-average run defense grade. He has a sack and hurry on seven pass-rushing snaps, but has also missed two tackles in each game.
So he's getting to the QB at a rate of around 30% (small sample size accepted) but your key stat is that he missed tackles on 6% of snaps? Go freak yourselves.
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https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-how-all-31-first-rounders-have-played-this-preseason/
So he's getting to the QB at a rate of around 30% (small sample size accepted) but your key stat is that he missed tackles on 6% of snaps? Go freak yourselves.
Wasn't his sack basically one of our DL mauling the QB, the QB barely escaping and basically falling down where Lee barely touched him and got credit for the sack though
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Wasn't his sack basically one of our DL mauling the QB, the QB barely escaping and basically falling down where Lee barely touched him and got credit for the sack though
Quite possibly. The point is that PFF, and especially Sam freaking Monson, rarely pass up an opportunity to take a negative view of the Jets. Hence the existence of this thread.
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https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-how-all-31-first-rounders-have-played-this-preseason/
So he's getting to the QB at a rate of around 30% (small sample size accepted) but your key stat is that he missed tackles on 6% of snaps? Go freak yourselves.
Also worth pointing out he missed 4 tackles on 65 SNAPS not 65 tackle attempts. A player isn't involved with a tackle every play.
How many tackles can he have I'd imagine it's somewhere between 7-10, so that would mean be missed around, 30-40% of his tackles?
Obviously the sample size is tiny and this probably is irrelevant and doesn't mean excrement. But that 6% number is completely meaningless regardless.
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Also worth pointing out he missed 4 tackles on 65 SNAPS not 65 tackle attempts. A player isn't involved with a tackle every play.
How many tackles can he have I'd imagine it's somewhere between 7-10, so that would mean be missed around, 30-40% of his tackles?
Obviously the sample size is tiny and this probably is irrelevant and doesn't mean excrement. But that 6% number is completely meaningless regardless.
As is "missed two tackles per game". If he attempted ten tackles per game and made eight then that's not a bad hit rate, if he attempted three per game and made one then it's pretty awful. Without context it's a pointless stat designed to take a negative view, which is the point.
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Also, it's the preseason.
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As is "missed two tackles per game". If he attempted ten tackles per game and made eight then that's not a bad hit rate, if he attempted three per game and made one then it's pretty awful. Without context it's a pointless stat designed to take a negative view, which is the point.
You also have to go back to what Heismanberg is always saying too. We have no idea what Lee's assignment was on those "missed tackle" plays. We also don't know what PFF considers a missed tackle. Is it when a player gets two hands on a ballcarrier and doesn't bring him down? Or is it "well, the defender was within 12 feet of the ballcarrier when he passed him so that's a missed opportunity"?
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PFF's team of the week (never mind the fact that there are still two games to go):
https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-pffs-team-of-the-week-for-nfl-week-1/
Save yourself the effort. No Jets. Apparently Leonard Williams' three sacks and McLendon's two were nothing like as good as the two Titans linemen who made the cut with their combined 0 sacks.
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PFF's receiver of the year: David Johnson.
I am a Johnson cheerleader but this is a new level of ridiculous, even for PFF. Clickbait garbage that I refuse to link to.
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lol
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Very edgy of them
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PFF's receiver of the year: David Johnson.
I am a Johnson cheerleader but this is a new level of ridiculous, even for PFF. Clickbait garbage that I refuse to link to.
"PFF releases their receiver of the year, and their pick may surprise you!"
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pff.buzzfeed.com
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They recently posted something about how we have the 5th best blocking efficiency or some made up stat like that and then proceeded to list a bunch of our backups as the highest ranked.
And idiots are now using it to argue that our OL is fine and the only problem is QB.
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http://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/comments/705pje/pff_rated_savage_better_than_wentz_week_1/dn0ly0j
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“Jamal Adams just continues to impress. 54 snaps, 2 targets, 0 receptions allowed, 1 PD, 1 TFL, 1 sack, 1 hurry, 0 missed tackles. Wow.”
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“Jamal Adams just continues to impress. 54 snaps, 2 targets, 0 receptions allowed, 1 PD, 1 TFL, 1 sack, 1 hurry, 0 missed tackles. Wow.”
Rankings:
1. Brandon Shell
4. Jamal Adams
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“Jamal Adams just continues to impress. 54 snaps, 2 targets, 0 receptions allowed, 1 PD, 1 TFL, 1 sack, 1 hurry, 0 missed tackles. Wow.”
But what's his adjusted efficiency clutch rating?
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“Jamal Adams just continues to impress. 54 snaps, 2 targets, 0 receptions allowed, 1 PD, 1 TFL, 1 sack, 1 hurry, 0 missed tackles. Wow.”
I mean that was only through 3 games, 2 of which we got annihilated in, and the 3rd of which the opposing QB didnt attempt to play football.
The guy looks great and we should be excited, but those were all horrible games to judge a player off of.
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Per PFF, Jamal Adams spent 21 snaps at LB, 17 snaps as an edge defender, 16 snaps as a safety, and three snaps as a CB. Grade of 84.0.
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Per PFF, Jamal Adams spent 21 snaps at LB, 17 snaps as an edge defender, 16 snaps as a safety, and three snaps as a CB. Grade of 84.0.
Will be interesting to see how hes used once Bowles is gone after this season, have to imagine not a ton of coaches will have all that hybrid stuff going on
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Will be interesting to see how hes used once Bowles is gone after this season, have to imagine not a ton of coaches will have all that hybrid stuff going on
Serious question: do you actually watch any football that isn't the Jets?
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Serious question: do you actually watch any football that isn't the Jets?
Yes I know other coaches do it, hell Rex did it quite a bit with our safeties. But Rex and Bowles were extremely aggressive blitz heavy defensive coaches who blitz their defensive backs much more than most. The stats above legit listed Adams playing linebacker and edge defender more than they did safety. Surely you wouldnt expect that to be the norm with a more standard coach
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Yes I know other coaches do it, hell Rex did it quite a bit with our safeties. But Rex and Bowles were extremely aggressive blitz heavy defensive coaches who blitz their defensive backs much more than most. The stats above legit listed Adams playing linebacker and edge defender more than they did safety. Surely you wouldnt expect that to be the norm with a more standard coach
There are a couple of issues there. Firstly, as per normal I have issue with PFF's numbers; how do they know what role he was playing? Where he lined up doesn't dictate his assignment, and the plays that the offense called dictated some or much of what he did post-snap, so for them to create arbitrary numbers like that is at the very, very best educated guesswork, and likely closer to just plain wrong.
Secondly, I disagree entirely with your view that somehow Rex and Bowles are different to other coaches. Very few things are different in the NFL. No one is radical, at least for long. They're all variations on the same theme, and if you watch any other team in the current day NFL you'll see a huge amount of scheme flexibility on both sides of the ball. Base D is a nominal exercise for league-mandated depth charts but bears little or no relevance to scheme, and LB/SS is such a fluid hybrid and has been for a number of years that I don't really understand why you'd think that this is anything unusual. Brian Urlacher, Derrick Brooks, Troy Polamalu, Ronnie Lott head a huge list of names who could do it all - the hybrid defender is not a new thing.
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Well I agree it's subjective, but you figure they would be consistent across the board with their analysis.
And Rex and Bowles maybe not radical but they're far more aggressive than most coaches, which is why we were always among the most frequent blitzing teams under them
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Only trolling a little bit with this post, but their stupid grades support what we said about yesterday’s performances about Demario, Terrence Brooks and Daryl Roberts. Jamal Adams is Jamal Adams. Also, ShellKing!!!
PFF Jets-Dolphins analysis
Top 5 Grades:
LB Demario Davis, 92.3 overall grade
S Terrence Brooks, 85.4 overall grade
CB Darryl Roberts, 84.0 overall grade
S Jamal Adams, 84.0 overall grade
QB Josh McCown, 82.2 overall grade
Performances of Note:
QB Josh McCown, 82.2 overall grade
McCown had an incredibly accurate day. He went 18-of-23 with two dropped passes for an adjusted completion percentage of 87.0. He also did a great job of keeping the ball out of dangerous situations with no turnover-worthy throws.
RT Brandon Shell, 28.9 overall grade
Going up against Cameron Wake is still one of the toughest tasks in the NFL and Shell found out first hand on Sunday. He allowed a sack and three hurries as well as numerous other poor blocks in the run game.
LB Demario Davis, 92.3 overall grade
Davis was everywhere for the Jets defense, racking up a ridiculous nine stops. He was key to stopping the Dolphins underneath passing game where seven of his stops occured.
S Jamal Adams, 84.0 overall grade
The rookie first-rounder continues to impress. Adams was targeted twice on the day and didn’t allow a single catch. He also added a pass breakup and a sack for good measure.
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PFF labeled Adams as an edge defender and a linebacker during some plays this week which leads me to believe these assholes don't know that safeties can be walked down into the box.
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PFF labeled Adams as an edge defender and a linebacker during some plays this week which leads me to believe these assholes don't know that safeties can be walked down into the box.
Jamal Adams was head coach for 5 snaps because he was on the sideline.
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Jamal Adams + Marcus Maye in Week 10
66 snaps in coverage
2 targets
1 reception
10 yards
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Jamal Adams + Marcus Maye in Week 10
66 snaps in coverage
2 targets
1 reception
10 yards
Brandon Shell: ++ eleventy zillion heart heart kisses
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@PFF_JohnGatta:In Teddy Bridgewater's last healthy season (2015), he ranked first among NFL QBs in adjusted completion percentage.
He'll be just 26 years old in 2018. High potential with major injury concerns. #Jets need to pair him with a top draft QB
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You know what they always say; adjusted completion percentage wins championships!
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Jet’s OL ranked 30th in NFL according to PFF’s unquestionably flawless metrics
30. New York Jets
Total pressures surrendered: 177
Best player: Kelvin Beachum
Combinations used: 11
The Jets are this low on the list despite the fact that they remained relatively healthy throughout the season and had only five offensive linemen play more than 400 snaps. However, each of them allowed at least two sacks and all graded poorly in run-blocking as well. As a result, the Jets’ offensive line allowed a total of 25 sacks, which was tied for the sixth-most in the NFL. Interestingly however, they were among the better teams running the outside zone concept as their backs averaged 2.07 yards before contact on these runs, the third-most in the league.
But seriously, does anyone want to argue that we aren’t ranked somewhere in that tier? Using their made up stats is stupid, but we all said that the Jets had a terrible run-blocking OL, and PFF seems to agree.
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This year we came to the consensus that Wesley Johnson is probably the worst Center in football. PFF agrees.
“Wesley Johnson, who earned lowest overall grade in 2017 among 35 qualified centers”
Apparently we weren’t harsh enough.
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Jet’s OL ranked 30th in NFL according to PFF’s unquestionably flawless metrics
30. New York Jets
Total pressures surrendered: 177
Best player: Kelvin Beachum
Combinations used: 11
The Jets are this low on the list despite the fact that they remained relatively healthy throughout the season and had only five offensive linemen play more than 400 snaps. However, each of them allowed at least two sacks and all graded poorly in run-blocking as well. As a result, the Jets’ offensive line allowed a total of 25 sacks, which was tied for the sixth-most in the NFL. Interestingly however, they were among the better teams running the outside zone concept as their backs averaged 2.07 yards before contact on these runs, the third-most in the league.
But seriously, does anyone want to argue that we aren’t ranked somewhere in that tier? Using their made up stats is stupid, but we all said that the Jets had a terrible run-blocking OL, and PFF seems to agree.
The question is how much of that was Wesley Johnson and a Brian Winters injury? We'll find out.
Also I can't believe there is no mention of Brandon Shell and his +++5674 pff grades
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https://twitter.com/pff_sam/status/999276572824756224
I <3 PFF
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https://mobile.twitter.com/theadamsera/status/1001905208086204419
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Jets have their 31st ranked OL going into the season.
https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-nfl-offensive-line-rankings-all-32-teams-units-entering-2018
They note that Wesley Johnson was horrific last year, but seem to not be willing to acknowledge that the terrible scores they give our starting guards are inextricably linked with the center's performance.
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Jets have their 31st ranked OL going into the season.
https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-nfl-offensive-line-rankings-all-32-teams-units-entering-2018
They note that Wesley Johnson was horrific last year, but seem to not be willing to acknowledge that the terrible scores they give our starting guards are inextricably linked with the center's performance.
Regardless its hard to argue we had one of the worst offensive lines in the league last year, and we didn't do a good job at improving it
Odds are fairly strong that it'll be improved, but that's also pretty easy to do when you're one of the absolute worst around
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Wesley Johnson is gone. Brian Winters won't have a torn abdominal muscle all year this year. Better.
The only issue will be the fit of these guys in a new blocking scheme.
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Wesley Johnson is gone. Brian Winters won't have a torn abdominal muscle all year this year. Better.
The only issue will be the fit of these guys in a new blocking scheme.
It helps for sure.
But does anyone see us having a top 20 offensive with those changes? Honestly not having the worst center in the league is a significant improvement, but we're still one of the worser lines in the league
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The loss of ASJ could hurt our tackles. We'll probably just have to use White Trash TE a lot more than we should though.
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The loss of ASJ could hurt our tackles. We'll probably just have to use White Trash TE a lot more than we should though.
Good
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The loss of ASJ could hurt our tackles. We'll probably just have to use White Trash TE a lot more than we should though.
White trash is good for 47 yards per catch this year. On 7 catches.
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Sam Darnold received a grade of 91.2 from @PFF, the best among QBs this week.
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Sam Darnold received a grade of 91.2 from @PFF, the best among QBs this week.
PFF still sucks but I'll accept them bending the knee.
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#Jets rookie Chris Herndon earned an elite 90.5 offense grade this week, ranking first among all qualified tight ends!
Oh
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They also said Beachum was the #1 OT this week, so take that for what it’s worth
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Herndon is the guy I'm crediting with my change of stance on Maccagnan. Hopefully, Leggett will continue to progress as well.
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Herndon is the guy I'm crediting with my change of stance on Maccagnan. Hopefully, Leggett will continue to progress as well.
I think that all four of our tight ends show some promise and/or use. Leggett is the one I'm least sure about, but Sterling and Herndon can both catch and are reasonable blockers. I'm not convinced that Tomlinson is as good a blocker as the coaching staff appear to think, but it's funny watching him run with the ball and he's a useful checkdown at times.
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I think that all four of our tight ends show some promise and/or use. Leggett is the one I'm least sure about, but Sterling and Herndon can both catch and are reasonable blockers. I'm not convinced that Tomlinson is as good a blocker as the coaching staff appear to think, but it's funny watching him run with the ball and he's a useful checkdown at times.
Yeah, I have to admit that I'm pretty happy with the tight-end situation on this team right now. I really didn't expect that coming into the year. I really like Herndon so far.
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Sam Darnold’s 81.4 grade outside the pocket ranks second among NFL QBs
Ranked 32nd on throws from within the pocket
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Jets ranked 29th in overall offense, 29th in passing, 25th in receiving, 29th in run blocking, 15th in pass blocking
7th in overall defense, 4th in coverage, 4th in tackling (due to Bowles superior coaching technique)
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Darnold rated #13 overall on “open” throws, 32nd overall on “tight window/covered” throws
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Robbie Anderson 4th in NFL in Average Depth of Target (19.4 yards) and Quincy Enunwa 2nd in average YAC (9.1 yards)
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"Over the last four weeks, Brandon Shell has allowed one sack, no hits and three hurries. His 2.94% allowed pressure rate is the second-best rate among right tackles in that span."
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so darnold sucks?
How is Darnold the worst pocket passer in the league?
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so darnold sucks?
How is Darnold the worst pocket passer in the league?
I wonder how much of that is a reflection of the instantly collapsing pocket he's constantly in. Bad snaps probably haven't helped either. All those empty backfields earlier in the year certainly didn't help either.
Imagine how easy it must be for DCs this year. "Guys, just pin your ears back and go full steam ahead on this kid. Nobody's gonna stop you."
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https://twitter.com/pff/status/1058301698597421056
Jojo Natson SZN
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so darnold sucks?
How is Darnold the worst pocket passer in the league?
I’m assuming PFF puts a big emphasis on Comp %. They probably have checkdown artists rated way higher. The high INT total probably kills him too.
I’ve always said that you should never use the actual #’s the PFF spits out for the basis of anything, but they’re relatively useful for directional comparison.
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Aaron donald has 54 pressures through 8 weeks...
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Aaron donald has 54 pressures through 8 weeks...
One of the best interior pass rushers ever. Pairing him with Suh was brilliant.
Fowler should go off with those guys up front.
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One of the best interior pass rushers ever. Pairing him with Suh was brilliant.
Fowler should go off with those guys up front.
Suh donald brockers is a crazy front 3 line
But, I'm interested in seeing how the lions defense improves. The front 4, between Robinson, snacks, hand, Ansah averages over 300lbs per player.
Jarrad Davis is about to have a hell of a second half
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https://twitter.com/pff_jets/status/1184163331650838531?s=21
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What was the other category then if he’s first and third in each but 4th overall? Fuckin team win percentage or something?
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What was the other category then if he’s first and third in each but 4th overall? Fuckin team win percentage or something?
I was wondering this
I was thinking maybe there's some nonsense stats in there
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https://twitter.com/arifhasannfl/status/1248058467048456193?s=21
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https://twitter.com/durhamthelegend/status/1254853241537363971?s=21
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https://twitter.com/durhamthelegend/status/1254853241537363971?s=21
Someone read this plz
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Someone read this plz
I mean Sam isn't great. But he's likely the best QB in our division
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Someone read this plz
why read it? is that guy a writer? look how poorly it's written
'denzel mims is a loser' comma, followed by 'i love denzel mims', and if he is using 'abstract' the way it sounds like he's using it, it makes zero sense. is he saying that his system of evaluating players (with regards to mims) has abstract components to it? and he follows the 'in abstract terms' comment by hedging and saying 'he might be' the 3rd best WR in the draft. this guy is completely unsure of himself
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Someone read this plz
Stop trying to convince everyone to make the same mistakes you made.
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why read it? is that guy a writer? look how poorly it's written
'denzel mims is a loser' comma, followed by 'i love denzel mims', and if he is using 'abstract' the way it sounds like he's using it, it makes zero sense. is he saying that his system of evaluating players (with regards to mims) has abstract components to it? and he follows the 'in abstract terms' comment by hedging and saying 'he might be' the 3rd best WR in the draft. this guy is completely unsure of himself
He’s one of the lead propagandists for PFF. Tons of bozos out there form their opinion off what he says because he has PFF in his username
This wasn’t an article, someone transcribed his podcast or something like that
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https://twitter.com/rajpc1/status/1254870876434112512?s=21
https://twitter.com/garythenyer/status/1254952875601641474?s=21
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that whole website is a joke. bro im a pro analyst i watch football all the timeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee #bradydagoat #guzzlecum #samchugsit
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Stop trying to convince everyone to make the same mistakes you made.
"I saw this, now you have to see it too" is a fundamental tenet of being online.
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"I saw this, now you have to see it too" is a fundamental tenet of being online.
I saw it 2x before deciding to subject everyone to that
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https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-bet-surprise-playoff-contenders-2020-nfl-season
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i like how they cite their own baseless opinion article as a source for discontent.
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PFF is a joke
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PFF is a joke
Get up get get get down
PFF is a joke in your town
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Get up get get get down
PFF is a joke in your town
Jonhi Flav, word.
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If you set the sample size low enough, Jamal Adams is a top-10 pass-rusher in the NFL over the past two seasons in terms of PFF grade.
The dude has the same pass-rush win rate as Dee Ford.
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I really wanted him to get the DB sack record for the team.
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I want him to play for the team first.
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https://twitter.com/nyjmike/status/1282710826416254981?s=21
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https://twitter.com/nyjmike/status/1282710826416254981?s=21
it was genuinely depressing losing that last game/not to have made the playoffs that year
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https://twitter.com/pff/status/1308092174656040961?s=21
That loser Sam Monson getting dragged in the comments
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https://twitter.com/pff/status/1335988726468661249?s=21
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PFF is pro tank.
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https://twitter.com/pff_sam/status/1372162447273029635?s=21
The answer to Mr Electric’s age old question
Would be curious to see how often they have to leave out plays
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https://twitter.com/pff_sam/status/1372162447273029635?s=21
The answer to Mr Electric’s age old question
Would be curious to see how often they have to leave out plays
He blocked me because I excrement on his haircut and the other PFF guys made fun of him.
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https://twitter.com/buddabaker32/status/1382716304369487873?s=20
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Pain
https://twitter.com/PFF/status/1384673241348849670?s=19
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Pain
https://twitter.com/PFF/status/1384673241348849670?s=19
Not Jamal Adams?
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Traaaaaaash
https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-wide-receiver-rankings-32-best-wrs-entering-2021-nfl-season (https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-wide-receiver-rankings-32-best-wrs-entering-2021-nfl-season)
Not that I'm a Seahawks stan, but Metcalf at 15? Tyler Lockett in between Corey Davis and Cole Beasley? PFFft.
"[AJ] Brown is the leader of the next generation of star wide receivers." Bro have you even seen DK Metcalf play football
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It's Nuk. The answer is Nuk. He's currently in my top 3 "players I would pay money to watch" list.
Metcalf is excellent though and I was wildly wrong on him.
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It's Nuk. The answer is Nuk. He's currently in my top 3 "players I would pay money to watch" list.
Metcalf is excellent though and I was wildly wrong on him.
Yeah but Nuk is going into his age 29 season. Not really "next generation."
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PFF had Fant as the worst tackle in the NFL last year. You can't tell me that is true. I'm not saying he's great, but I hardly ever heard him mentioned after games as having fucked up royally. I would say he's wholly average or a little below average. But worst in the league? GTFO.
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PFF had Fant as the worst tackle in the NFL last year. You can't tell me that is true. I'm not saying he's great, but I hardly ever heard him mentioned after games as having fucked up royally. I would say he's wholly average or a little below average. But worst in the league? GTFO.
That’s definitely not the case.
Worst starter? Ok, I can at least see that as an opinion even i disagree. But there’s no way he was the worst tackle that took a snap last season, he wasn’t even the worst tackle on his own team that took snaps with McDermott and Edoga on it
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(https://i.ibb.co/8BSkDfn/C43-A75-B2-E4-AB-4650-BD69-22-DB12-B89952.jpg) (https://imgbb.com/)
(https://imgbb.com/)
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Behold, the worst PFF take I've seen so far
https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-ranking-all-32-nfl-offensive-line-units-entering-2021-season
The Jets have tried to improve their offensive line with volume over the past few years, but they still finished with a 29th ranking after the 2020 season.
There’s reason for more optimism, starting with left tackle Mekhi Becton, who graded out at 74.4 overall as a rookie, good for 32nd in the NFL. Becton can maul defenders at the point of attack and ranked fifth in positively graded plays in the run game while showing well in pass protection with a 65th-percentile grade on true pass sets.
Right tackle is still an issue for New York, with George Fant returning as the starter after a 61.6 overall grade last season that ranked 69th among 89 tackles. That’s almost identical to his 2019 grade in Seattle, and while he’s made great strides since a disastrous rookie season in 2016, Fant is still a below-average tackle.
Dan Feeney comes over to play center, though his 48.2 overall grade was the second-worst mark among centers last season. His highest grade through four full NFL seasons came (60.8) came in his rookie 2017 campaign.
First-rounder Alijah Vera-Tucker will likely start at left guard, though there’s a chance he could compete with Fant at right tackle. Vera-Tucker had success at both guard and tackle in college, and he projects as an excellent pass protector with some stickiness to his blocks in the run game. Greg Van Roten returns at right guard after finishing with the 44th-ranked grade (63.0) among guards last season. Alex Lewis produced a career-high 66.6 grade last season, so he’ll also be in the mix while providing good depth.
The Jets continue to make moves to get their line back on track, but they must improve at right tackle and Vera-Tucker needs to hit the ground running for this to become a middle-of-the-pack unit.
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Feeney starting at center. LOL.
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Feeney starting at center. LOL.
McGovern stopped existing
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Feeney starting at center. LOL.
starting positions are determined by beer chugging ability
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Starting RG Corey Levin
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https://thejetpress.com/posts/ny-jets-draft-mark-sanchez-worst-pick-2006/
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https://thejetpress.com/posts/ny-jets-draft-mark-sanchez-worst-pick-2006/
Well that's just stupid.
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Well that's just stupid.
Very true. We have a ton of worse picks in that time. Sure we traded up for him. But I will maintain despite him not becoming the guy, we gave up a 2nd and 3 jags for him. That is absolutely nothing in the NFL and worth the shot at a Franchise QB every time. I’m fact given we got 2 AFCCG out of him make that 2nd worth it.
We have up more for Sam and got less out of him (even if we did trade him for assets) and while we put significantly less value into Hackenberg, he gave us so little that he is a far worse pick than either Sam or Mark. Don’t even get me started on Geno or heaven forvid Gholston
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gotta be hackenburg or gholston
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gotta be hackenburg or gholston
It’s Dewayne Robertson
(But also Geno Smith)
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2014 alone: Pryor/Amaro/McDougle/Saunders whiff/whiff/whiff/whiff
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It’s Dewayne Robertson
(But also Geno Smith)
you wont find much contention from me about how much robertson sucked, but if my memory serves correctly he at least had one somewhat serviceable year for us as a DT with donnie henderson
i think the most horrible thing(s) about his pick was the fact that we traded 2 first round picks to get him, and signed him to the money we wouldn't give coles after he came off an absolutely amazing year having shown great chemistry with chad. i swear we seemingly do the same excrement over and over and over. santana then stepped up nicely in a lost year(s) but the end result of that is we end up trading him anyways to get coles back.
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i think the most horrible thing(s) about his pick was the fact that we traded 2 first round picks to get him
1. We traded up to four and chose him over Kevin Williams and Terrell Suggs (perennial All-Pro defensive linemen)
2. We could've just stayed at 13 and landed Troy Polamalu
3. In the same draft, we chose Victor Hobson over Anquan Boldin
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1. We traded up to four and chose him over Kevin Williams and Terrell Suggs (perennial All-Pro defensive linemen)
2. We could've just stayed at 13 and landed Troy Polamalu
3. In the same draft, we chose Victor Hobson over Anquan Boldin
This is painful to read.
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This is painful to read.
Yes...it hurt my genitals.
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1. We traded up to four and chose him over Kevin Williams and Terrell Suggs (perennial All-Pro defensive linemen)
2. We could've just stayed at 13 and landed Troy Polamalu
3. In the same draft, we chose Victor Hobson over Anquan Boldin
Herm really wanted his Warren Sapp, bone-on-bone knee condition be damned.
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Terry Bradway was ALMOST as bad as Mike Maccagnan.
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Terry Bradway was ALMOST as bad as Mike Maccagnan.
That's a great debate topic....
Bradway vs Duff. Who's worse?
There's compelling arguments on both sides.
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Maccagnan is responsible for the Darnold trade up, the Trumaine Johnson contract, the Leveon Bell contract, and the CJ Mosley contract.
He also drafted like excrement. He's worse.
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Maccagnan is responsible for the Darnold trade up, the Trumaine Johnson contract, the Leveon Bell contract, and the CJ Mosley contract.
He also drafted like excrement. He's worse.
I don't think the Darnold trade up was inherently bad.
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Maccagnan is responsible for the Darnold trade up, the Trumaine Johnson contract, the Leveon Bell contract, and the CJ Mosley contract.
He also drafted like excrement. He's worse.
Duff's wounds are still fresh. So they sting a little more.
Bradway's rap sheet on the other hand:
-Dewayne Robertson trade up
-Doug Jolley trade
-Drafting Mike Nugent in the 2nd round
-somehow survived 2 regimes #MadeOfTeflon
-lost Coles to the Skins
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https://twitter.com/PFF/status/1435347188549312514?s=19
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https://twitter.com/uSTADIUM/status/1445006672552996867?s=19
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https://twitter.com/uSTADIUM/status/1445006672552996867?s=19
I love the way Quincy hits people, but I'm not convinced his positioning us always great. Obviously not passing comment on his performance yesterday as I would need to rewatch the game to have a sensible view on any individual players.
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He hit dude hard, I likey.
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https://twitter.com/pff_jarad/status/1455207727748235269?s=21
This might be the worst PFF grade ive ever seen
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https://twitter.com/pff_jarad/status/1455207727748235269?s=21
This might be the worst PFF grade ive ever seen
People's view of PFF grades is directly proportional to how closely they mirror their preconceived opinions.
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People's view of PFF grades is directly proportional to how closely they mirror their preconceived opinions.
Totally agree but that Darnold grade is baffling
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Totally agree but that Darnold grade is baffling
Yeah, it is. He didn't turn it over or get sacked, but he didn't really do much of anything.
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https://twitter.com/galexander21/status/1483419952786911237?s=21
I’ve been saying this for years
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https://twitter.com/pff_george/status/1520939145803313152?s=21&t=ZjdoH3lLcsZoI2A3BJkXDw
lol
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https://twitter.com/pff_george/status/1520939145803313152?s=21&t=ZjdoH3lLcsZoI2A3BJkXDw
lol
you can't give us credit for a good draft because we had high picks is his rationale?
meanwhile if we made poor selections with those picks he'd be talking all the excrement in the world
i swear to god sports media is so fvcking annoyingly abhorrnet nowadays.
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To an extent I get the logic.
But you also have to figure in jj2 and hall weren't us being blessed with great picks. It was making moves to get highly talented players that were great value/difference makers.
Plus you also have to factor in different permutations of how else it could have gone for us (ie if we didn't take Gardener at 4, we likely would have gotten lesser value at other picks simply because of the way the board fell.
Plus we also just got quite frankly lucky about guys other teams took ahead of us.
Idk it's a stupid argument 🤷
FWIW I think JJ2 and to a less extent hall is the difference between us having a pretty good draft and a great draft.
We were able navigate the late first/early second to get two extremely talented immediate impact players at huge needs for us for solid value.
Most of the draft picks between 1-10 all basically got A grades, so I understand not jerking us off for freaking up those two picks. But we did get lucky with those picks hitting big needs allowing us to get the value we did with JJ and Hall
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https://twitter.com/pff_george/status/1520939145803313152?s=21&t=ZjdoH3lLcsZoI2A3BJkXDw
lol
PFF turns into even worse brainlets than normal when it comes to drafting RBs. If you take one before pick like 65 even if it's the next Adrian Peterson they think it's terrible value
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In one of the shallowest drafts in years they're upset that the Jets traded away day 3 picks...k.
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In one of the shallowest drafts in years they're upset that the Jets traded away day 3 picks...k.
We could've drafted Snoop Conner with that fifth round pick!
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In one of the shallowest drafts in years they're upset that the Jets traded away day 3 picks...k.
Are we sure it was one of the shallowest drafts in years? Ravens didn't really think so. DeCosta said the talent was deeper than normal and they wanted as many 3rd and 4th-round picks as possible. Maybe the 6th and 7th round talent wasn't as strong, but if the mid rounds are deeper because of COVID year, you would think the late rounds would be as well.
https://twitter.com/KevinColePFF/status/1521088124453019648
That said, when you break down the Jets' potential 53-man roster, there aren't that many spots where we necessarily needed late-round guys to add to the mix. 4th-string RB, WR5, developmental IOL, and maybe an LB or a safety are really the only spots on paper where the team isn't deep.
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There were 2 punters and a kicker taken halfway through rnd 4. That doesn't fit my definition of deep.
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There were 2 punters and a kicker taken halfway through rnd 4. That doesn't fit my definition of deep.
Maybe it was an elite year for punters and kickers.
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Trading up just puts a much higher premium on hitting the guy you trade up for.
If you are right on your evaluation, and the guy you target in a trade-up works out, it's fine.
In general, it's a bad idea because more often than not, GMs aren't good enough at knowing who the best possible players are.
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https://twitter.com/jacklich10/status/1521511604264882178?s=21&t=cE7HoewwqnqhbWsr2oRqWw
How does this guy get paid to talk about football?
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"Take Malik Willis" what a freaking clown.
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https://twitter.com/jacklich10/status/1521511604264882178?s=21&t=cE7HoewwqnqhbWsr2oRqWw
How does this guy get paid to talk about football?
The more I think about the RBs aren't valuable if you take them before the 3rd round thing that PFF "analysts" are programmed to say before they are allowed on air, the more I've realized that basically every single good team has used a 1st or 2nd round pick on a RB within the last decade. Think of any successful team and they've done it.
Also, imagine thinking that the Jets would get more value out of drafting another project QB than someone who will actually take a majority of snaps next year. If you want to argue insurance policy for Zach at least say like Ridder
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The more I think about the RBs aren't valuable if you take them before the 3rd round thing that PFF "analysts" are programmed to say before they are allowed on air, the more I've realized that basically every single good team has used a 1st or 2nd round pick on a RB within the last decade. Think of any successful team and they've done it.
Also, imagine thinking that the Jets would get more value out of drafting another project QB than someone who will actually take a majority of snaps next year. If you want to argue insurance policy for Zach at least say like Ridder
These guys are just clueless.
"They used a premium pick on a running back!"
"They used a high pick on a running back last year!"
Why is he suggesting that we take another EDGE, WR, or CB? How is Andrew Booth more valuable than Breece Hall?
Does anyone question Tennessee or Indianapolis for taking a top running back in the second round? It's a position with limited shelf life but great RBs are some of the best offensive players in football. Taylor and Henry carry their teams.
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The more I think about the RBs aren't valuable if you take them before the 3rd round thing that PFF "analysts" are programmed to say before they are allowed on air, the more I've realized that basically every single good team has used a 1st or 2nd round pick on a RB within the last decade. Think of any successful team and they've done it.
Also, imagine thinking that the Jets would get more value out of drafting another project QB than someone who will actually take a majority of snaps next year. If you want to argue insurance policy for Zach at least say like Ridder
When did they take those running backs? Usually, running backs are the last piece for a contending team. The Chiefs drafted CEH when they were already elite.
Quite frankly, most other examples I think of teams taking running backs early weren't good teams. I think running back is one of the last pieces you add for a contending team, especially since running backs can hit the ground running more than most positions. There are a lot of horrible teams that have drafted running backs in the first 2 rounds as well.
As I've said in other threads, the bar for success for an early-round running back is much higher. If you're taken in the top 40, it's probably not good enough to be just a regular starting running back. You need to be special to be worth that pick. You can find running backs everywhere, and they aren't all that valuable.
Hall looks like the best RB in the draft, and he looks like he can be a great player. If he's a great player, it's a good pick. If he's not, then it's not a good pick.
I haven't watched the clip, but apparently they talk about it as "bad process." If they value Hall as a top-20 prospect in the draft, and he ends up being the guy they think he is, then the process is fine because you scouted him correctly.
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https://twitter.com/jacklich10/status/1521511604264882178?s=21&t=cE7HoewwqnqhbWsr2oRqWw
How does this guy get paid to talk about football?
I don't get it
He talks about Zach Wilson being a huge problem then complains we spent 3 premium picks addressing everyone of the key offensive skill positions to help Zach Wilson
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PFF seems smug.
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When did they take those running backs? Usually, running backs are the last piece for a contending team. The Chiefs drafted CEH when they were already elite.
I was a proud member of the Running Backs Don't Matter group after we took Shonn Greene. I think since then, the position has become undervalued.
Barkley and Richardson are historically bad picks. Jacobs, Etienne, and CEH look like bad picks too. I don't agree with taking one in the first round unless it's the next Reggie Bush or Adrian Peterson. Round 2 is the sweet spot for great RBs.
Look at this list of recent second round backs:
Javonte Williams
D'Andre Swift
Jonathan Taylor
Cam Akers
JK Dobbins
AJ Dillon
Miles Sanders
I don't think any of those players are regrettable draft choices. Dobbins, Akers, and Sanders have injuries but that happens. It's an uncontrollable thing. Nick Chubb basically has no knees and he's been perfectly healthy in the NFL for the most part.
Dalvin Cook, Derrick Henry, and Joe Mixon are all great players too.
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We didn't pick Breece Hall because we need a running back.
We picked Breece Hall because we want our QB to succeed.
How else were we going to help our qb in this draft? Taking a center?
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How else were we going to help our qb in this draft? Taking a center?
According to this guy, we needed to draft another corner or edge rusher AFTER selecting both of those positions in the first round.
He also apparently values safety over running back which is wholeheartedly disagree with.
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I haven't watched the clip, but apparently they talk about it as "bad process."
It's significantly worse than that
"The Jets suck. They should've spent the pick on Malik Willis cuz Wilson sucks. The Jets suck and they traded UP for a running back when they could've drafted Andrew Booth or Arnold Ebiketie! What a bunch of idiots! This is why they suck! Anybody with that many high picks can have a good draft!"
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We didn't pick Breece Hall because we need a running back.
We picked Breece Hall because we want our QB to succeed.
How else were we going to help our qb in this draft? Taking a center?
Exactly. The addition of Hall, particularly with his pass catching ability, helps Zach. If we picked up some bruiser with stone hands the criticism would hold up a bit better.
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I haven't watched the clip, but
Watch it and freak up your blood pressure like the rest of us.
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It's significantly worse than that
"The Jets suck. They should've spent the pick on Malik Willis cuz Wilson sucks. The Jets suck and they traded UP for a running back when they could've drafted Andrew Booth or Arnold Ebiketie! What a bunch of idiots! This is why they suck! Anybody with that many high picks can have a good draft!"
I had no interest in watching the clip until I saw the other post referencing Willis and then I had to hear how goddamn stupid it was.
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It was more like the Jets overvalued a running back by drafting him with a second rounder, they should've drafted a late 3rd round QB with the pick instead
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Exactly. The addition of Hall, particularly with his pass catching ability, helps Zach. If we picked up some bruiser with stone hands the criticism would hold up a bit better.
Imagine two back gun with Hall and Carter on the field at the same time. Let's go.
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It was more like the Jets overvalued a running back by drafting him with a second rounder, they should've drafted a late 3rd round QB with the pick instead
"The Colts have Darius Leonard. Why did they draft Jonathan Taylor when they could've drafted another good linebacker with that pick?"
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I don't get it
He talks about Zach Wilson being a huge problem then complains we spent 3 premium picks addressing everyone of the key offensive skill positions to help Zach Wilson
Especially since he loved Zach Wilson pre-draft apparently.
https://twitter.com/search?q=zach%20wilson%20from%3A%40pff_george&src=typed_query&f=live
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I was a proud member of the Running Backs Don't Matter group after we took Shonn Greene. I think since then, the position has become undervalued.
Barkley and Richardson are historically bad picks. Jacobs, Etienne, and CEH look like bad picks too. I don't agree with taking one in the first round unless it's the next Reggie Bush or Adrian Peterson. Round 2 is the sweet spot for great RBs.
Look at this list of recent second round backs:
Javonte Williams
D'Andre Swift
Jonathan Taylor
Cam Akers
JK Dobbins
AJ Dillon
Miles Sanders
I don't think any of those players are regrettable draft choices. Dobbins, Akers, and Sanders have injuries but that happens. It's an uncontrollable thing. Nick Chubb basically has no knees and he's been perfectly healthy in the NFL for the most part.
Dalvin Cook, Derrick Henry, and Joe Mixon are all great players too.
People always talk about how many guys have "1st-round grades" with the answer usually being in the 20-25 range in most drafts.
Once you get after those players, I think running backs are OK, but just like with safety and guard and center and some of the other less important positions, the bar for the pick being quality becomes higher. There's a reason elite running backs get paid less than elite players at other positions.
I also think it's important that a RB taken in the top 40 can help in the passing game. And it seems like Hall can.
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And it seems like Hall can.
https://twitter.com/KevinColePFF/status/1497205128935448583?s=20&t=wfcDxd-1VKj1auoJQpq0fw
yes
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Plus, there aren't that many glaring needs at premium positions on the Jets right now. What premium position did the Jets badly need to take in round 2?
If you want to say the Jets should take a safety or a linebacker, sure, we need those positions. Same with interior offensive line. None of those are premium positions. Just like running back. And running back was probably a bigger need on paper, and it helps out our offense and our QB more than any of the other positions besides interior OL. And McGovern is fine - it's not like a 2nd-round C/G is a lock to be an upgrade. Especially when the best IOL had largely been taken.
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Short completions that can turn into first downs and touchdowns help a young QB more than just about anything
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I was a proud member of the Running Backs Don't Matter group after we took Shonn Greene. I think since then, the position has become undervalued.
Barkley and Richardson are historically bad picks. Jacobs, Etienne, and CEH look like bad picks too. I don't agree with taking one in the first round unless it's the next Reggie Bush or Adrian Peterson. Round 2 is the sweet spot for great RBs.
Look at this list of recent second round backs:
Javonte Williams
D'Andre Swift
Jonathan Taylor
Cam Akers
JK Dobbins
AJ Dillon
Miles Sanders
I don't think any of those players are regrettable draft choices. Dobbins, Akers, and Sanders have injuries but that happens. It's an uncontrollable thing. Nick Chubb basically has no knees and he's been perfectly healthy in the NFL for the most part.
Dalvin Cook, Derrick Henry, and Joe Mixon are all great players too.
Let me also offer you Sony Michel for your list of excrement recent first round running backs.
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Let me also offer you Sony Michel for your list of excrement recent first round running backs.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DSgAxWhVQAAN6eP.jpg:large)
elite vision
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When did they take those running backs? Usually, running backs are the last piece for a contending team. The Chiefs drafted CEH when they were already elite.
Quite frankly, most other examples I think of teams taking running backs early weren't good teams. I think running back is one of the last pieces you add for a contending team, especially since running backs can hit the ground running more than most positions. There are a lot of horrible teams that have drafted running backs in the first 2 rounds as well.
As I've said in other threads, the bar for success for an early-round running back is much higher. If you're taken in the top 40, it's probably not good enough to be just a regular starting running back. You need to be special to be worth that pick. You can find running backs everywhere, and they aren't all that valuable.
Hall looks like the best RB in the draft, and he looks like he can be a great player. If he's a great player, it's a good pick. If he's not, then it's not a good pick.
I haven't watched the clip, but apparently they talk about it as "bad process." If they value Hall as a top-20 prospect in the draft, and he ends up being the guy they think he is, then the process is fine because you scouted him correctly.
I mean yeah, if a team is taking a RB high it's because they were bad, which led to them having a high pick. I'm not arguing for taking Hall at 10.
I realize that in general RB draft placement doesn't correlate well with production, because RBs taken later can produce more than at other positions - but elite RBs now are generally taken in the 1st or 2nd round with barely an exceptions as those are where you can find the athletes like Hall. And that's when it's worth a swing, even if you're bad right now.
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People always talk about how many guys have "1st-round grades" with the answer usually being in the 20-25 range in most drafts.
Once you get after those players, I think running backs are OK, but just like with safety and guard and center and some of the other less important positions, the bar for the pick being quality becomes higher. There's a reason elite running backs get paid less than elite players at other positions.
I also think it's important that a RB taken in the top 40 can help in the passing game. And it seems like Hall can.
I think one of the biggest things with drafting a running back in the 1st is 5th year options.
With the majority of positions being able to 5th year option and or franchise tag them after that is huge.
With a back you can franchise tag them twice and they'll still cost less than most positions.
For example of JJ turns into the player we dream of he can easily be asking for 30 million a year (especially factoring in how many years in the future he is)
So having that 5th year option on him is such a tremendous value when it comes to extensions/team control etc etc
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https://twitter.com/jacklich10/status/1521511604264882178?s=21&t=cE7HoewwqnqhbWsr2oRqWw
How does this guy get paid to talk about football?
There were a couple players I would've preferred over Hall at 38. I'm still firmly anti-early-running-back. But this kind of hyperbolic reaction is absurd; at worst, it's a B- move and he's dropping F-bombs. I don't know who he is but he sucks.
I think I said a couple months ago that if we knocked our first three picks out of the park, I'd be good with Hall at 38. We did and I am.
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Dude also said this:
https://twitter.com/PFF_George/status/1251623720986304512?s=20&t=vLAFN6kGfdkvHXk3vUIFaQ (https://twitter.com/PFF_George/status/1251623720986304512?s=20&t=vLAFN6kGfdkvHXk3vUIFaQ)
EDIT: And this:
https://twitter.com/OffensiveLyman/status/1521628306981986305?s=20&t=vLAFN6kGfdkvHXk3vUIFaQ (https://twitter.com/OffensiveLyman/status/1521628306981986305?s=20&t=vLAFN6kGfdkvHXk3vUIFaQ)
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There were a couple players I would've preferred over Hall at 38. I'm still firmly anti-early-running-back. But this kind of hyperbolic reaction is absurd; at worst, it's a B- move and he's dropping F-bombs. I don't know who he is but he sucks.
I think I said a couple months ago that if we knocked our first three picks out of the park, I'd be good with Hall at 38. We did and I am.
I'm anti early RB unless you have a extremely young struggling QB that your franchise is completely dependent on, in which case you get him literally any freaking player that'll help.
And I think for the next 2 to 3 years nothing will help more than a talented back.
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https://twitter.com/KevinColePFF/status/1497205128935448583?s=20&t=wfcDxd-1VKj1auoJQpq0fw
yes
I watched a different angle of the Baylor clip at 10 seconds. What he does to that Baylor defender is just disrespectful. I hope he does the same thing to the Patriots in October
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https://twitter.com/MikeFerrari13_/status/1521849243748769793?t=eB3ny7M3V6fAbbFU32g6lQ&s=19
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https://twitter.com/MikeFerrari13_/status/1521849243748769793?t=eB3ny7M3V6fAbbFU32g6lQ&s=19
LMAO
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Keeping it a bean
https://mobile.twitter.com/Djbienaime/status/1521556220456456192
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"Hey guys, clicks are down a bit this month and we need to keep the advertisers happy, can someone go onto a shitty podcast and say something rude about the Jets to get all the internet idiots quacking about us?"
"No problem boss, try giving me a difficult job next time...."
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"Hey guys, clicks are down a bit this month and we need to keep the advertisers happy, can someone go onto a shitty podcast and say something rude about the Jets to get all the internet idiots quacking about us?"
"No problem boss, try giving me a difficult job next time...."
I don't think it's that. I think he believes what he's saying.
Some people just take analytics too far in some cases. I love NFL analytics, but the NFL is probably the sport where it matters least.
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I don't think it's that. I think he believes what he's saying.
Some people just take analytics too far in some cases. I love NFL analytics, but the NFL is probably the sport where it matters least.
Nah, it's the same as the last two weeks before the draft where they're all coming up with increasingly stupid mocks because all the sensible permutations have been used and discussed to death so they come up with "Malik Willis should go first overall" in the hope of getting people telling them why he won't.
You can use statistics in sport to support all sorts of competing arguments, which is one of the reasons why I have so little use for them the vast majority of the time. That's all that's happening here; general concensus is that the Jets' draft was excellent so there's no value in repeating the same message, because it has already been discussed extensively elsewhere. Just determine what position you can argue that will get the most people paying attention, come up with the set of stats that can be used to support that argument, and go get yourself some more exposure.
If you want people to stop saying stupid things, stop paying attention to them when they do.
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I thought this PFF podcast was pretty fair about the Jets. Even ended by saying "the Jets are very analytically sound."
https://youtu.be/hkdqUHVxtQE?t=2740
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I thought this PFF podcast was pretty fair about the Jets.
https://youtu.be/hkdqUHVxtQE?t=2740
p sure Kenny Powers loved our draft
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Here's a pleasant nothing
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fa4YjF8WAAA5S9Z?format=jpg&name=large)
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So mind boggling. Sauce hasn’t even been thrown at yet, and Wilson has like 40 yard receiving on 6 grabs.
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Here's a pleasant nothing
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fa4YjF8WAAA5S9Z?format=jpg&name=large)
I'll take it
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^ and curiously topping that list is the guy who was earlier thrown out of practice for his TC fights
https://twitter.com/NFL_DovKleiman/status/1554880461633212416
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https://mobile.twitter.com/Michael_Nania/status/1582004140426727430?s=20&t=kPbqUOTSEsG-0puO3ejimw
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Not trying to defend PFF since they've had some weird grades this year, but Echols played 12 snaps, while Quinnen played a lot more. Having a slightly worse grade on a lot more snaps isn't necessarily worse than having a better grade with fewer snaps. If Echols played 50 snaps, his rating probably falls since he probably has more bad plays.
Echols allowed a TD, so it's a little more strange there, but he didn't have bad coverage.
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No one really cares about Echols in this instance.
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Not trying to defend PFF since they've had some weird grades this year, but Echols played 12 snaps, while Quinnen played a lot more. Having a slightly worse grade on a lot more snaps isn't necessarily worse than having a better grade with fewer snaps. If Echols played 50 snaps, his rating probably falls since he probably has more bad plays.
Echols allowed a TD, so it's a little more strange there, but he didn't have bad coverage.
Take Echols out of the equation, everyone saw Quinnen had a stellar game. The grade doesn't reflect that in the least. freak PFF.
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I wonder how PFF graded CJ Mosley's greatest half game of defense ever in 2019.
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Having watched the All 22 PFF has now upgraded Q's rating vs GB to 75.2. Which is still nowhere near the top defensive performances of the weekend.
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Up to 81 now, and they're sorry they got it wrong.
https://twitter.com/JoeRiveraSN/status/1582790164774260737
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Up to 81 now, and they're sorry they got it wrong.
https://twitter.com/JoeRiveraSN/status/1582790164774260737
I’d still say an 81 is too low a grade for Q. But whatever
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All our other ratings are spot on though, we promise!
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The right way to do what PFF does would be to publish the grade for each play with an explanation for why the grade was given. But then they wouldn't have magic numbers for Cris Collinsworth to quote in time for next week's game, and their whole business model would collapse.
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All our other ratings are spot on though, we promise!
"We discounted this one silly ol' goofball, don't worry! The rest of our magic numbers are definitely maybe not subjective, nor pulled out of the rectums of cross-eyed, biased, pasty-faced espn rejects! Subscribe today with coupon code YDKF!"
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PFF is mostly fine, but just like every other rating system, it should never be the ONLY way to grade how a player is.
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PFF is mostly fine, but just like every other rating system, it should never be the ONLY way to grade how a player is.
Exactly.
I actually don't mind their content honestly haha, but I take it as seriously as warranted, as you indicate.
At least they try, unlike espn and whomever employs Bayless and Brady Quinn, etc. It's why I also enjoy Jets X Factor content.
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Exactly.
I actually don't mind their content honestly haha, but I take it as seriously as warranted, as you indicate.
At least they try, unlike espn and whomever employs Bayless and Brady Quinn, etc. It's why I also enjoy Jets X Factor content.
I wish JetsXFactor came around now instead of a few years ago, when they would cherrypick stats so hard to make our guys look good. Makes them less credible now.
But just like PFF and every other resource, they're mostly good, but it can never be the only way to grade a player.
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https://twitter.com/thestevenruiz/status/1597301343777345536?s=46&t=4jsgWPP3KeOWoMiYoeA04w
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https://twitter.com/thestevenruiz/status/1597301343777345536?s=46&t=4jsgWPP3KeOWoMiYoeA04w
https://twitter.com/StoolieAccount/status/1597310977443528705 (https://twitter.com/StoolieAccount/status/1597310977443528705)
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(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240428/ce5399377a83bd5181a025b4deb8a8b7.jpg)
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Shocked they gave us an A after we drafted two RBs
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Shocked they gave us an A after we drafted two RBs
Didn’t they try to cut our balls off after using a late 5th to trade up for Breece Hall 2 drafts ago?
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Didn’t they try to cut our balls off after using a late 5th to trade up for Breece Hall 2 drafts ago?
Yes and that piece of excrement celebrated his injury too